Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft's New Spamming Technique
judges1617 writes: "Microsoft is now testing a beta version of their MSN Explorer that sends e-mails to everyone in your Outlook Address, informing them that your e-mail address has changed and invites them to to try MSN. Even the people who use MSN are complaining, but M$ refuses to acknowledge it is doing anything wrong. Read the whole story here" The best part of this article is the MS reps argument about why this isn't spam "The e-mail you
received was an
invitation from MSN
Explorer, sent on
behalf of an existing
user who changed their
e-mail address and
wants you to try MSN
Explorer." I guess we can add "Spamming" as another "Business" where Microsoft can use its monopoly status to its
advantage.
doesnt surprise me one bit . microsoft and their holier than thou phylosophy (sp?)
"sex on tv is bad, you might fall off..."
I lost my concept of community when my community lost all concept of me.
Tastes kind of like ham - add it to Kraft Dinner for a tasty treat!
Thanks Microsoft!
Really, if you can't memorize the email addresses of the hundred or so people and mailing lists with whom you regularly correspond, you shouldn't be using a computer.
Criminy, what next, complaining about Explorer's bookmark files? Really, if you can't memorize the thousand or so web addies your regularly surf to, you shouldn't be on the web.
Chapter U: It's not wrong if we do it. Chapter V: If it is indeed wrong, litigate, litigate and obfiscate then litigate some more.
BOSTON SUCKS!
I mean if you can be busted for writing Melissa, (which behaves in an identical manner) why not for this?
John
I have several email accounts, for different reasons. If they all spontaneously decided to tell everyone to use one account, where would I be?
/option/, but as the default it does seem a bit weird.
I don't see why this shouldn't be an
-
Meep meep
Maybe we should quit calling them Micro$oft and start calling them
Microspam!
Yes, yes, I know. Tacky. But I couldn't help myself.
Rani
Wow, what great innovation!
Now Microsoft has an official version of this great functionality usually only found in Macro Viruses. I guess they're just embracing-and-extending again, to bring their customers these great new features.
Why, in a few more versions of Outlook (once everyone on Windows is forced to use it), they should have the "Goodtimes" extensions finalized, and it will turn the world into mindless Microsoft drones.
Gentlemen, I think we have a plot for an xbill sequel on our hands.
Will the real Bruce Perens Please Stand Up
I got one in my mailbox today, talking about the Supreme Court decision. There's not a valid return address on those things or I'd reply "You bastards! Mark my words, we'll get you!" Too bad there's not a valid return address.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
MS reps argument about why this isn't spam "The e-mail you received was an invitation from MSN Explorer, sent on behalf of an existing user who changed their e-mail address and wants you to try MSN Explorer."
*sigh*
Could Microsoft possibly be more clueless? That's one of the most ridiculous statements I have ever heard.
-----
"People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them"
Higher Logics: where programming meets science.
So next we will have a worm which sends off mail to everybody in your Outlook Address Book Saying I love Microsoft Products ,Linux Sucks and Bill Gates was the best thing to happen to computers since Charles Babbage
The irony is it would serve everyone right for using MS Outlook in the first place
**Life is too short to be serious**
Jeez...this article is more about clueless newbies sending spam...the product specifically asks if you want to email ALL of your email contacts. Maybe a lot of people just didn't bother to read the message. The implementation is clearly bad, but that doesn't make the idea (allowing people who have just changed their address to send a mail to everyone they email regularly) bad.
Ok, so MS assumes that anyone who changes their Email addy wants all of their friends to try MSN Explorer, right?
Sure, that makes sense to me. I think I'll assume that anyone who visits my web site wants all of their friends to visit my website. Lesse, where did I put that virus kit...
Mythological Beast
Wake up - the future is arriving faster than you think.
Sounds to me like MS has put the techniques used by the ILOVEYOU virus to use in 'protecting consumers' from having bad (read: non-MS controlled) email services...
Hmm... freaky. What I want to know, is *how* did they do this, technically? Can other spammers use this same technique as well, or is it a Microsoft-only hidden technique? Because if it is, thats monopolistic.
Everyone should be able to use all the MS Outlook users out there to send spam, you know... not just Microsoft!
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
Microsoft is abusing its power to extend its reach. Users be damned.
This is new and different?
I don't know about everyone else (and IANAL), but this REEKS of a class-action suit. I don't use the program, but if I did, I certaintly wouldn't give them the right to do anything 'on my behalf'. Unless, of course, it's buried somewhere in the EULA... Better watch that bank account, too.
People always assume that the little boxes with next don't mean anything, just keep clicking next. They're stupid for not reading what they are doing. It isn't right that they can't modify the message, or that it pimps Microsoft's apps. For some people, it's great to be able to notify others instantly, they probably don't know how to check 2 mail accounts. They aren't uber-geeks, just casual users who are playing with the all-in-one apps that M$ is putting together. It really is nice for people who are just getting started. Yes, it is spam, because Microsoft forced commercialization into it.
Well, it's certainly going to write it easier for the macro virus programmers anyway.
Just call:
sendspamtoeveryoneinaddressbook();
And you're well on the way!
-
Meep meep
This seems like a phenomenally bad idea -- just think what happens if the secretary at a large company with thousands of employees (like the one where I work) inadvertantly allows the email to be sent.
---
---
"Go Metallica. Die RIAA." -- Linus Torvalds
...but I always thought that sending updates of e-mail addresses should be done by the person changing their account.
And while you can 'opt out', wouldn't it be better if the system popped up one of those annoying MS dialogs asking if you want everyone to be informed?
Or even better, allows you to pick and choose who you want informed, and allow you to enter your own text informing them, with the MS 'standard' being one of the options...
Or does that make too much sense?
NecroPuppy
---
This Monday is up to three days... And still going strong...
I like you, Stuart. You're not like everyone else, here, at Slashdot.
Everyone want's to receive JUNK MAIL on behalf of friends.
DRM? No thanks, I'll just get it somewhere else...
Translation courtesy of BabelFish.
--Jeff
"The e-mail you received was an invitation from MSN Explorer, sent on behalf of an existing user who changed their e-mail address and wants you to try MSN Explorer," said Microsoft customer support in a letter that appeared to be an official statement.
Let's see if their definition of non-spam holds up...
"The e-mail you received was an invitation from GetRichQuick, Inc., sent on behalf of an existing spammer who wants you to try his product."
Hmmm...nope, certainly not spam. Nosiree, nothing even remotely hamlike about it.
PR 101: When caught doing something wrong, immediately claim that you weren't actually doing anything wrong. Then define what you were doing so that it matches what is wrong in every sense of the definition...
________________
________________
Private Essayist
I thought there was actually a law against SPAM? Since this message section is sent without the consent of the user, it seems like you'd be able to establish that M$ actually sent it. Since it does not offer a way to avoid getting the same message in the future, didn't a law just pass making it illegal, litigatable spam?
Class-action lawsuit, anyone?
Looking for freelance Actionscript (Flash/Flex) or ColdFusion work and/or freelance developers. Email me, put Slashdot
Apple: has some home operating system market.
M$: monopolizes with its bosom buddy Intel. Boring hardware.
Apple: can't monopolize to save its life. Funky, powerful hardware.
M$: spams their users.
Apple: sues anyone trying to tell their users about new Apple stuff.
Sigh. It's stuff like this that makes me want to load up QNX and just hide in my basement...
Mr. Ska
What I'm hearing from the preliminaries is that no one is suprised, and I know I'm certainly not. We all knew that something like this was a possibility, and when the technology was ubiquitous enough, it would be exercised by the Microsoft Marketing Machine (Bob).
Not only do I not get why people are still using this, but why it's even being reported as news. Everyone is collectively smacking their heads and going 'Duh!' on this one. Just wait until they start redirecting IE to the Microsoft Propaganda Page every hour on the hour (for MSN users, of course!).
C'Mon folks. Real news please.
-- build a man a fire and he'll be warm all day. set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
No, no. That's right, the Mellissa virus wasn't this destructive. It only sent out emails to some of the people in your address list.
If I received that e-mail from one of my friends, I'd make a special trip over to their house and kick 'em squa in the balls simply based on the principle of the matter (they should know better than to use a crappy product like Outlook!)
'Nuff said.
- I'm making a page dedicated to procrastinators! I'll let you know when I get started.
First teh program asksk if you wna to import your address book. then it ASKS if you want to send a message to everyone in your address book tell them of your new address. then it even SHOWS you the message that will be send "spam" and all. you actually have to click the SEND button to send this message. Ther user of the software knows perfectly well whats going to happen, how can you say they don't know they are doing it? Microsoft isn't spamming anyone, they just stuck a little ad at the bottom of an email that you have a CHOICE to send or not.
These messages obviously are not spam. In the article, it clearly states that Hotmail, a completely free and useful service who protects your password and e-mail fervently, refuses to mark this as spam! Since Hotmail is the best web-based client around for free e-mail addresses, I would think that it would have the best filtering programs to weed out unwanted e-mails from unsolicited sources. Since the infalable Hotmail does not mark this as spam, saying "The e-mail you received was an invitation from MSN Explorer..." then clearly this was meant to be a beneficial and desired e-mail. Naysayers, begone! Hotmail would never lie to you!
------
"I recently began using a new product from Microsoft called MSN Explorer. With MSN Explorer, you can send and receive e-mail, exchange instant messages with me and the millions of other people who use MSN Explorer, browse the Web and much more. MSN Explorer even offers an exciting new look for using the Web and makes it easy to find and play music online. Want to try it out? It's FREE! Just click on the link below and follow the download instructions.
This reads like spam to me. I wonder how many people are actually fooled to thinking that this was really a letter from a friend raving about this new product.
What gets me is that this seems so low for microsft to stoop. I mean, underhanded buisness maneuvers are at least somthing that requires brains... spam is something that dumbasses trying to make a buck off the web resort too.
Just another example of lock-in techniques from the monopolist. I get an offer for a free month of MSN, so I say, "Heh, it's free. Let's see why everyone trashes MSN so much." I install it, then everyone get a notice to change how they reach me.
Once I discover why everyone has been dissing the service, I have to either manually inform everyone that the previous message was bogus spam generated by MS crapware, that I was only testing out their service to see how bad it was, that it was so bad that I'll never use it again and that they should send emails to my real address, or I keep the service since that is how everyone knows how to reach me.
It's a testament to my cynicism that I believe most people would opt for the second choice.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
What is an 'addy'? Not all here are born knowing English! Be more open for acceptance of Open-Source!
ok!
-Ashram
addy = address
I am sprinkling my posts with hip, with it slang, so that I will appear mad cool, and have my choice of Slashdot chicks.
props to Taco!
I don't know what you guys are talking about...Mine seems to work fine...
---
"I recently began using a new product from Microsoft called MSN Explorer. With MSN Explorer, you can send and receive e-mail, exchange instant messages with me and the millions of other people who use MSN Explorer, browse the Web and much more. MSN Explorer even offers an exciting new look for using the Web and makes it easy to find and play music online. Want to try it out? It's FREE! Just click on the link below and follow the download instructions."
--
Spindletop Blackbird, the GNU/Linux Cube.
* sigh *
Remember when people were polite on the net because they'd have several hundred magazine subscriptions to cancel if they didn't? Damn AOL!
It's just that simple. It appears that Microsoft construes the defeat of fast-track to be a victory, and an endorsement of their business techniques.
Look for more of this type of conduct.
The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
You mean some people actually WANT to tell others that their email address has changed? Changing addresses without telling anyone has significantly reduced the number of messages I get per day.
These people looked deep into my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined.
2 things really bother me
"I am writing to let you know that I have a new e-mail address: "(new e-mail)."
"users could not edit the wording."
So it is spamming , and not allowing you to change
change the wording to state that it is comming from Micros~1 and not you.
I'd almost call it a virus.
AdFuel
IMO, if you go through a few clicks and see something as blatant as that, you shouldn't click "OK" and complain about it afterward.
- I don't care if they globalize against free speech. All my best free thoughts are done in my head.
This is an automatic message from the new Windows Messaging software information you that _Bob Sagertion_ has change his desktop wall paper quickly and easily with only 2 clicks of the mouse. That sure is easy, please try using Microsoft Windows 98 with imbedded Windows Messaging Software to allow YOU to take advantage of this great new fearture.
This email would also like to information you that _Bob Sagertion_ has not only moved his mouse, but has also used 2 clicks in the last _12_ seconds. How do you know so much information about _Bob Sagertion_ ? With the new Microsoft Mouse Monitor Util imbeded with Microsoft's own Windows Messaging. If you would like these great feartures YOU TO can get Windows Messaging for the low price of $19.95.
The next time _Bob Sagertion_ has made any changes or has interacted with a peice of Microsoft's Windows Messaging software, you will receive notice of this. If you would like YOUR freind to take notice of any IMPORTANT things you do with your computer, like change email address, store your persoal private journal or even make a mouse click, then please check out Microsoft's Windows Message software for the low price of $19.95
--
Also on a side note, Microsoft is suing Norton Anti-virus software for detecting and delete any messages Windows Messager is sending out. Due to the lack of AI in Norton's software, it can't tell the differant between this GREAT NEW SOFTWARE and the hoard of outlook worms/virii out there.
On a related topic, Mr. Norton knew caps has been shattered by an unknown person(s).
Have a nice day,
Windows Messaging software and Paper clip harry
"`Ford, you're turning into a penguin. Stop it.'" -THHGTTG
It is bad enough that Microsoft is sending unsolicited commercial email. Yes, boys and girls, this is spam - unsolicited because neither the user or the people in his Outlook address book explicitly asked for it - the user just sent a change of address request, and it is commercial it nature.
Worse, Microsoft makes a statement in the email in the user's name ("I am using MSN and would like for you to try it!") without his permission. This is incredibly arrogant and possibly illegal. If Microsoft doesn't remove this "feature" it will have another lawsuit added to it's stack of legal troubles.
Meldroc, Waster of Electrons
Outlook syncs to my mobile phone, point me to another program that does that, and I'll use it.
Hm.
Point me to some specs, and I'll write you one:)
-rozzin.
It could grab all e-mail addresses from any incoming/outgoing messages in all your folders. Which is worse? Pissing off EVERYBODY or just those close enough to be in your address book?
These people looked deep into my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined.
As much as I hate to say it...
:)
First, the program does ASK you if it's ok to send messages to your contacts informing them of your address change. You actually have to press a button to get it to send the notifications. So is it really spam?
Spam is really unsolicited e-mail that provides no service whatsoever, and just bugs you. These messages actually inform you of one of your contact's new e-mail address. It's worthwile information.
Second, If they are providing this feature, why not let them include a little advertisement? People put up with the little ad at the bottom of every single hotmail message without complaining too much.
They have to make money somehow, since no one actually pays for their software
So this brings us to a real question: What can Microsoft do before the hoi polloi will even start to look at an alternative OS?
Obviously, a lot of this depends on the alternatives themselves. But let's say, for the sake of arguement, an OS (let's just call it Z) develops via open source and provides all the functionality that MS provides. I know I would switch in a heartbeat, but most non techies wouldn't bother. So what does Microsoft have to do to piss those people off so that they will begin to see alternatives?
Or do some of those people actually like this stuff?
It is distasteful, but it's not a Microsoft only thing.
License: By reading this you are agreeing that you agree with me.
In the news today Mcaffee warned users of a new email virus. It appears that someone going by the name of Bill Gates has written or coauthored a program which emails everyone in a users address book and then convinces them that this is good and then emails everyone in their address book. Mcaffee claims they will have a fix shortly and in the mean time they recomend everyone stay away from anything with the words microsoft in it.
I am 31337 or something.
Microsofts newest feature corrects inadvertently mistyped anti-microsoft comments.
I typed in the following message:
"Microsoft is a monopolist whose policies and procedures are written to one purpose: Maintain power and make money, users be damned."
I addressed it to my friends, family, and casual business associates and hit the "send" button.
The message that they recieved was thus:
"I love Microsoft. I love Bill Gates. Microsoft is my friend. Let's all use MSN and drink milk and eat warm toasty cookies.
The e-mail you received was an invitation from MSN Explorer, sent on behalf of an existing user who changed their e-mail address and wants you to try MSN Explorer."
"I recently began using a new product from Microsoft called MSN Explorer."
"With MSN Explorer, you can send and receive spam, exchange erotic messages with me and the millions of other teenagers who use MSN Explorer, browse for pornography and much more. MSN Explorer even offers an exciting new proprietary interface for using the Web and makes it 'easy' to preview and license music online. Want to try it out? It's FREE - just click on the link below, sign the waiver, and fill out several screens of detailed information."
--
Spindletop Blackbird, the GNU/Linux Cube.
Some people are overracting on this. The problem here isn't necessarily that people are unknowingly spamming people with e-mail(although it will happen because people often don't read what they click too). Its the fact that Microsoft has now "innovated" there way into Unsolicited E-mail. It would have been just as bad if Bill Gates they bought one of those CD sets full of e-mail and started to spam people to try their software.
You think this is bad, you should see what else they have on the way:
Internet Explorer: Automatically posts to slashdot announcing that you are now using Internet Explorer and that we will all be assimilated.
MS Word: Prints a letter and envelope, complete with Estamps, to everyone in your address book, then uses Orbital Mind Control Lasers to make you sign, seal and send them. MS charges the estamps to your credit card.
MS Money: An 'affiliate' program. They send spam announcing that you use MS Money, then offer five bucks to people who switch, also. The money comes from your bank account. (After all, they didn't get this rich writing big checks. Buy 'em out, boys!)
Though I foget her name, but any gal that know her way around BSD and goes to a BSD con is worth knowing in my book.
Yessir. That's what I've seen this practice referred to as.
Wansu, th' chinese sailor
The article says that there is a checkbox during installation that governs this behavior. Aside from the "Opt-in/Opt-out" argument, do we really want to make excuses for people not to pay attention to what they're allowing the computer to do on their behalf? Next, users who press the "return" key are asked if they would like to notify the people in their address book of a change in e-mail.
When I was a kid, we only had one Darth.
We can only hope .. sure would cut down on unsolicited email if every spammer had to pay patent royalties to Microsoft ..
And the best part is, it would be powered by Microsoft's legal department. If the PTO is going to grant stupid patents, the least they can do is make the spammers live under the constant threat of cease-and-desist orders from the Evil Empire.
73 de N5VB (ex-KD5BIV) AR SK
such wonderful entertainment value
"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." -- Goethe
There has to be something in the DMCA that would allow M$ to be sued for this. =)
73 de N5VB (ex-KD5BIV) AR SK
So how do I add all the MS employees to my Outlook Address Book? Maybe the Justice Department, the White House, Congress....
Wow, that's about as annoying as the:
.. why don't I switch to Outlook. Strangly enough everytime I start to think that, I come over to SlashDot in time to read about another Crappy feature or Macro Virus.
Today's Features...at Netscape.com
I am required to download, when I open Netscape messenger.
Every once in awhile, I think to myself
--
you are not what you own
it's a sig, wtf?
Its time to take some remedial reading courses people. From the comments I have read it appears that a number of so called Linux gurus have been a victim of this so-called "spam" scheme.
Its hard to believe you guys can use an OS like Linux (which involves alot of knowledge and know how) and cant seem to find the intellectual strength within your feeble FSF corrupted minds to read a messagebox placed upon your screen by MSN Explorer during installation. As you can imagine - this message box asks whether or not you want to inform your buddies of your new email address.
If you dont want to send the email - CLICK NO FOR THE LOVE OF GOD! Stop whining about it and trying to make a federal case out of it! If all of you anti-capitalists are using Linux anyway - how in the hell do you people even know what it is you are talking about in the first place?
The answer to that question is that you dont know what you are talking about - so shut the hell up.
And finally I would just like to say f*ck you to Commander Taco. I have never in my life spoken to or read the writings of somebody who just obviously doesn't have the slightest clue when it comes to the subject of reality other than Commander Taco.
Mr. Taco - get your hand out of your pants and start acting your age. Its time to get with it - or just get out.
Oh yeah - my email addy is darkgamorck@home for all you Slashdotters who feel the need to mailbomb me. Just be aware - I will ENJOY every second of it.
I love idealists not because I am one, but because they make life bearable for pragmatists such as myself.
Anybody have a address book containing only the Microsoft developement team they want to post? If everyone got a copy and notified the entire developement team a few times, they might get the hint. Please someone post a list of Microsoft software engineers. I would love to tell each and every one I changed address on one E-mail account!
The truth shall set you free!
...MSN Explorer automatically puts an entry in Microsoft Money and sends an e-payment of $100 to all the people who you send this too for wasting their time, I think this is ok.
ALG
This perfectly fits the definition of an e-mail virus. I subsrcibe to MSN and everybody in my address book gets an e-mail inviting them to subscribe. If one or more of them do subscribe then everybody in their address books gets an e-mail and so on and so on and so on ...
Maybe we should all put Bill Gates in our address lists?
-- Hob - Java Spectrum Emulator
You lose some friends who now think your a MS sellout, spammer or worse
Your email address will end up ORBS, RBL and several other blacklists, which means your (brand new!) email address is now useless
Several of you friends will succumb to the suggestion, try MSN explorer and fsck themselves up too; hating you twice as much.
I nominate this one for the stupid crocky losing misfeature award of the year.
---
You agreed to send a change of e-mail message to everyone in your address book, so you did initiate the message and it really isn't spam because it is a relivant personal correspondance. It however fraud in my eyes when you attach the uneditable remainder of the message to the change of address in first person thus seeming like it came from you.
So I don't think it is spam, but I beleive it is fraud.
IANAL
As x approaches total apathy I couldn't care less.
Micro$oft has been making money by bundling together other people's mistakes and calling it "development", "beta" or "Windows 95". Now their eyes have fallen on a whole new market: Viruses. How long will it be till the release of Micro$oft Antivirus: keep every spammer but us away?
People replying to my sig annoy me. That's why I change it all the time.
Quotes from A Man for All Seasons
Funny I can't seem to find mention of M$ in this article.... http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2632 102,00.html
And where does it say when notifying your friends that you are changing your addy that you will now be also spouting M$ praises.
I've had a look at the program. You have to to through several dialogues to send this e-mail. Sure, it does advertise Microsoft's service, but what do you expect? A lot of services do, this is no 'innovation'.
The way I see it, the problem is not Microsoft's actions but the ignorant, lazy, apathetic attitude of users. When I change my e-mail address (practically never), I write personal e-mails. If you can't be bothered with making the effort, the result isn't going to be as nice.
(Score: -2 (Disagreeing with collective slashdot view) )
Michael
...another comment from Michael Tandy.
"Goodness me, how unlike the FBI to abuse the trust of the American public." -- The Onion
This isn't spam, it a frickin' worm.
When will Windows be ready for the desktop?
This reminds me of Microsoft's response when I pointed out a problem with one of their C++ libraries: "It isn't a bug. It's a limitation." That slogan was my .sig for years.
"If I have seen further than other men, it is by stepping on their glasses." - Michael Swaine
First, this is beta software, and this "feature" may not survive to the production release, especially given the press it's getting them.
Second, this is not done without the users knowledge and acceptance. It is the default behavior, but it can be disabled with a couple of clicks. Of course, the average user for whom this product is targeted will probably accept the defaults without question...
http://drteknikal.blogspot.com/
MS Tech Support: Why do you think that?
Human: It e-mailed everyone in my Outlook address book, telling them I had a new e-mail and to try MSN.
MS Tech Support: Oh, that's not a virus, it's a feature.
Human: It's a feature of the OS to auto e-mail your friends?
MS Tech Support: That's correct.
Human: So the programs like "The Love Bug" are a feature of Windows.
MS Tech Support: No, they are virii.
Human: But doesn't this "feature" make the OS more likely to spread virii?
MS Tech Support: Virii spread is not a result of bad programming on MS's part, but because the user did something wrong.
Human: Things like this don't happen on my Mac or Linux bo...
MS Tech Support: *hangs up abruptly*
So there we have it folks, when MS spams your friends, its a feature, when a virii does it, its the users fault.
Burn Hollywood Burn
Why is this news? What does MS being a monopoly have anything to do with spamming? BTW, the program *asks* people if they want to send the updates to the people in their address book...so not only is this not spam, it's a horrible story.
Your mind looks a little cramped. Why don't you stretch it a little?
PS. My mom uses NetPliances' IOpener. :)
Locutus
"Anyone who stands out in the middle of a road looks like roadkill to me." --Linus
It looks like IBM's mainframe hardware registration. EVERYTHING is from Apple, or at least licensed.
If they were like M$, they could even forbid using other OSs (ie. Linux) to run on their hardware.
Repeat after me: "Apple sucks!".
The next big thing from M$ will be a chain letter scam similar to this, but instead, they'll say:
You have been chosen for the MSNExplorer beta challenge! Please install MSN and forward this e-mail to all your friends! If you do, Bill Gates will think about giving you $934,209,394,203 dollars each second that you are on MSN. Try it! I just got $398,209,209,408,109,390,409 in the mail yesterday! Bill is such a generous guy!
Microsoft! Microsoft! Microsoft!
This is utter bullcrap. I thought that MSN e-mail was supposed to be a service that you paid for. When I send a letter to a friend, the post office doesn't open it up and recommend to all of my recipeints that they never use FedEx or UPS. Free e-mail is a little different, like in the cases of hotmail and yahoo advertising themselves at the bottom of your messages. But MSN charges money, last time I checked.
end rant
I'm on a chair.
I wonder if they based their program on the widely available "ILOVEYOU" virus.
Do you have ESP?
The same article says that HotMail doesn't like it and has asked MSN to stop it, too!
General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
Let's just hack it so MS gets indignant e-mail for everyone in your mailing list when you change your address. Or just not use MSN, but I suppose that's a given.
I can imagine the same feeling of "just do it already" takes over here too. How many times do you have to click OK to do this? After digging deep enough to change that address, I can imagine the average user is already annoyed. Next they get a promissing note, "Wow, now I don't have to do this by hand." By the time they get to that subject line and don't see anyway to change it, and don't know that the message contains something that WAS NOT prommised... well, they push the button.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Next they will be ordering a case of Windows Me, a case of scotch with your credit card for all your freinds just because your a nice guy and all!
The problem is that microsoft did to things wrong. They worded thier ad to strong also they
They did not give people the choice to change it if they wanted to.
Okay, I forwarded the story to 50 of my friends, who are sure to send it on to their friends....when do I get my check?
"It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it."
Time is fun when you're having flies.
-Kermit the Frog
I used to be someone else. Now I'm someone better.
Real life is underrated.
this is so totally lame that ms must be getting their ideas from netpliance and clue-cat. talk about stupid...
THAT would be an excellent Open Source project...maintain an email hitlist of all M$ employees....spam them every time they do something stupid. Could be cool.
JoeLinux
The world is coming to an end. Please log off.
lol @ the pathetic clueless mac user. When was the last time you tried to upgrade that woderful hardware you wierdo? I hope you enjoyed being reemed up the ass for the price since apple has a monopoly on its hardware. Dumbass.
I wasn't talking about your mom, your cousin, your Grandma. I was talking about YOU. YOu are slamming Microsoft when YOU are too lazy to read the things that pop up in front of you. As a matter of fact, most of my friends who are "cluebies" tend to freak out and stop what they are doing when they don't understand a message, and immediately call me or another of their "geek" friends to explain it to them.
Got it?
So I ask again. Were you lying in your original post or are you just stupid?
Linux is free, in the same way that picking up a recipe leaflet in a supermarket is free. If you start assuming time is a cost, then nothing is free and virtually every company in the world will be open to lawsuits.
When someone prints a recipe leaflet, it costs them money. The cost of Linux is borne by the developers that chose to donate their time.
The cost of spam is borne by several people: the moron who runs an open relay, the owners of routers and gateways en route, the bandwidth, and the disk space the victim's mail server uses to store the message. All the spammer needs to do is send 1 message with the victims in the BCC: field. They pay little of the actual cost, if any---some spam from free trial accounts at their ISP.
So the point is that some commmunications are banned because of who pays. Junk faxes operate on the same principle as spam; the receiver pays for the toner and paper, and the sender only pays for the fax line. Junk snail mail and telephone salespeople are fine (legally) because the sender pays for the printing and postage or the long-distance call.
___ CmdrTHAC0 ___
__CmdrTHAC0__
In Soviet Russia, Spanish Inquisition doesn't expect YOU!!
http://www.foo.bar
becomes:
http://64.4.14.250/cgi-bin/linkrd?_lang=EN&lah=f74 234214fea43q52453245613&lat=9700 81359&hm ___action=http://www.foo.bar
What do you expect? This is how they get users..
They have to annoy the sh*t out of them until
they give in and use their product.
http://www.microsucks.com
Microsoft Sucks!
As I see it, the problem here is that the software is encouraging the ignorant to violate internet ethics. The end-user should get what they deserve, which is possible termination of their internet connection for spamming. I encourage everyone to report anyone using this feature to their ISP. But this is not the true problem here. While "my friend" might have technically sent me an unsolicited email, the message (i.e. content) is from Microsoft; given that the user cannot alter the message. It is a very slick twist on viral marketing which I find extremely distasteful. Where are all these Chief Privacy Officers I keep hearing about? Self-regulation at work.
--
was not a virus.
It was a public beta.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
With features like this, who needs bugs?
No-one does a proper job these days...
----
I hereby inform you that I have NOT been required to provide any decryption keys.
The "I have changed my address" function is a feature; the "why not use our shitty products" bit is spam.
I don't know why I even bother typing things like this to MS zealots.
TWW
"Encyclopedia" is to "Wikipedia" what "Library" is to "Some people at a bus stop"
Of course it is not spam; we all know what kind of program does that kind of action, this is a MS sponsored macro virus (or troyan horse given that it is put in the software).
"The obvious mathematical breakthrough would be development of an easy way to factor large prime numbers." Bill Gates,
It tags an ad on to the emails.
The recipient did not say they wanted ads for MS products (neither does the sender say they want to send them).
The advert is spam.
Read it over a few times until you understand.
"Encyclopedia" is to "Wikipedia" what "Library" is to "Some people at a bus stop"
Actually from what I understand they wanted to use One Click but as covered extensively on Slashdot that has been taken by Amazon. My sources at Microsoft say that they are looking into patenting Multiple Click.
kc.
kc.
"You'll have to speak up, I'm wearing a towel." - Homer J. Simpson
Given that you post regularly on /., does that make you a whiny idiot too? You certainly sound whiny to me...
--
Information wants to be beer, or something like that.
I'm surprised that no one mentioned this yet, but it reminds me of the MCI Friends and Family fiasco. Remember that one? People signed up for cheap long distance to certain numbers, but MCI conveniently neglected to mention that they would call each of these people at dinner time and say "well, your friend so-and-so gave us your number and said that you should switch to MCI".
My extended family has boycotted MCI ever since. Too bad none of us use MSN right now -- we can't get indignant and drop their service.
This sounds like they borrowed the code from the loveletter virus.
hee hee
Any excuse to bash MS, huh?
First off, the users who are complaining already hit a button that said it was going to do this. It's not like it did it automatically, the user had to take action for this to take place.
Secondly, why complain about this, and why now? How is this different from "Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://hotmail.com" or "Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com" that is at the bottom of every message sent from Hotmail, or the ad that Deja inserts at the bottom of every newsgroup post? Shouldn't you have been complaining about that before this?
Hide your email addresses!
-- Knowing too much can get you killed, but knowing who knows too much can make you rich.
Billy Boy is getting the butt end of the stick in his lawsuit slapped against him... of course Linux is coming out of nowhere according to the lusers that can't find an "any" key and are either too incompetent or lazy to get Netscape (Go Mozilla! :), so they use Internet Exploder, and of course, "Lookout!" Express (complete with virus support)... am I someone that thinks Micor$haft is just going to attempt to keep their market by trying signing up everyone to M$N? Of course. Look... of course they're going to spam; most lusers read it they would read junk mail! So Billy Boy, only being efficant in marketing, decides to kill two birds with one stone -- keep his market of Winblowz users, and start to make other companies such as AOHell start to worry.
I bet everyone here that M$N access will require Winblowz ME or Winblowz 2000 quickly ;)
Karma whorin' since 1999
This is just one more reason to leave JF_OPT_MSN=1!
Stop it! Stop sending the spam! Spamming is the one thing the Knights who LART spammers can not stand!
[one of the knights gets a new msn address]
Ah! I spammed us! Quick change our email address! Agh!! I spammed us again! Agh, ogh, egh [rolls around on the floor in agony]
Steven
-- I have marked myself unwilling to moderate-- I don't have other accounts to artificially inflate the karma of
...from Spyglass, were they not? However, I don't know where the current IE team went. Btw, I heard that Steve Capps (of Apple fame) was/is on the Macintosh IE team. Do you know any more of this?
C:\Program Files\MSN\MSNCoreFiles
(And do your self a favor and make get rid of it's hidden option)
There you will find a few .mar files. Don't be fooled, they are not short cuts to access databases as your windows may believe. Open em up in wordpad and take a looke. There is some junk in images and such, but there is also alot of VB. I wonder if the send program is in there?
Sorry dude, but 'virus' is latin and 'virii' is the plural. It was made up by idiots though... Romans, that is.
C:\Program Files\MSN\MSNCoreFiles\ui.mar
Do a search for 'recently'. It will take you to the message. Go ahead and edit it in wordpad to give yourself any email spam you would like to give.
My personal favorite is : Security through obscurity and bad press doesn't work very well. If I could do this, pray you have your VB scripting turned off.
Yeah, I noticed it said, "About to spam everyone you know. Continue? [Yes, I'm an idiot] [No]" I'm glad it warned me it was about to send spam, instead of just letting people know my new address.
The difference is this: Hotmail attaches their spam to the bottom of every message you send-- it doesn't automatically mass-mail everyone in your address book with that as the only content.
Plus, the Hotmail stuff is attached to something you wrote-- so it isn't all spam. It's more like a spam sandwich; or eggs, spam, bacon and spam; or spam, spam, beans, and spam. It's not the same thing at all.
Shouldn't you have been complaining about that before this?
Mister, I've been complaining about it since 19-aught-28, when Sears & Roebuck started sending out catalogs. And I've been complaining about the email spam since '89. So bite me.
Of course, I'm told I complain a lot, anyway. Whiner.
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
Nopes....let's turn it around. How about a script that informs everyone on your mailing list how crappy MS Software is everytime an MS App crashes? Now THAT would generate some traffic :) It'd be popular too....
Walkin' down the road,
tryin' to lighten my load,
not a very fine sight to see...
A fuckin' blue screen on my monitor,
Everytime I boot NT.
Takin it easy...I'm fuckin queasy.
Find a job you like and you will never work a day in your life.
Microsoft has been exploiting its user base for over 10 years. I don't see what's new here.
Someone you trust is one of us.
Microsoft slipped and did something everyone can understand. Most Internet users don't understand the absolute evil of "decommoditizing standards", but they do understand spam. Better yet, they understand loosing face with some or all of the people in their address book. Imagine people spamming bosses and coworkers with this. I hope Microsoft stands its ground and keeps this "service" just the way it is.
i'm sure you know this, but your sig file,
was said not by al gore, but by j. danforth quayle
</offtopic>
i thought, therefore i was...
Eudora forever!
For only $85.99, you get full featured spam, with all the trimmings and full internet access!!
So pre-order your Microsoft Spam right now!!
Microsoft is not responsible for any illness, physical malformation, or any other symptom that may be connected to MS Spam. There may be many revisions to MS Spam over the course if it's existance, which includes a Service Pack or 2. Please excuse my insanity. :)
-TimmyC, Tech Guru
>The funny thing about your post is that it's from a hotmail account. Everyone's a
>big fucking hypocrit when they denounce MS, because they all use MS products. If
>you want to hate MS, that's fine, but at least don't use their products doing it!
Dude just because somebody posted a hotmail email address *DOESN'T MEAN* he actually has an email account with HotMail. Think about it. I know a lot of people who use blah@HotMail.com instead of blah@NoSpam.com and they don't go through the hassle of actually creating a account with hotmail.
That was UBB code for inverted. Someone please kill me.
"virii" would be the plural of "virius", which doesn't exist. The only Latin plural of "virus" that makes sense in Latin is also "virus". If you don't want to be confusing, just say "viruses" like a halfway normal English speaker.
Not something I normally bother being pedantic about, but when people try to argue that it's right ...
Get McAfee and Norton to list it as a known Outlook virus and send an update out.
'sapientia potestas est'
This is an automatic message from Windows Messaging to let you know that _Bob Sagertion_ was able to access his favorite web site, _http://hotdudesinaction.com_, in only click with hot new version of Windows ME!
Windows Messaging thinks you would also like to know that _Bob Sagertion_ is available at MSN Instant Messaging address _hungry-for-c*ck_ at this very instant!
You can join _Bob Sagertion_ at _http://hotdudesinaction.com_, or his instant message handle _hungry-for-c*ck_, by downloading your FREE trial version of MSN at the address below. (Or you can join his wife, _Sue Sagertion_, as she searches for _Salt Lake City Divorce Lawyers_.) Remember, with Windows Messaging you are sure your friends can always join you at your favorite sites!
<i>Bob always thought that the 'paperclip' seemed a little <b>bent</b></i>
For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong. -- H L Mencken
It appears that the new ICQ 2000b uses a tactic similar to Microsoft's, where users on your contact list are by default are sent an e-mail from you to log back on to ICQ after 30 days of not being online. While this isn't nearly as intrusive as MSN's browser's feature, it still is sending messages by default without the user's knowledge (unless they look at their preferences).
Yet more useless and annoying "features" added to ICQ's new releases after AOL's purchase of Mirabilis...
- Slash
That would be sweet.
--
These aren't the droids you're looking for.
I wonder if M$ can be brought up on charges of fradulant behavior (i.e. impersonating ppl w/o their permission).
That's exactly why I refuse to update my ICQ and AIM until it no longer works on whatever system I currently have. The bloat put into so many of these current applications is sick, annoying and downright horrible. It seems that for every good new feature a program by the big corps. (M$, AOL, etc...), there are 10 others that you can't get rid of and are just plain obnoxious.
But I could just be exagerrating or paranoid.
> Your email address will end up ORBS, RBL and several other blacklists, which means your (brand new!) email address is
> now useless
No, IIRC, RBL applies to the domain, not the account on the domain. (A site gets black holed if it consistently proves itself unwilling to kick spammers & other abuse-types off of it's system.)
In other words, msn.com will get RBLed. AGAIN. After they made the minimum feeble attempts to crawl out of that space.
It's amazing that a company which prides itself for attracting so many ``smart people" has so many marketroids that get it in repeated trouble over so many issues that a couple minutes of applied commonsense would avoid.
Geoff
I think I see a trend here. Maybe for them it really would be easier to muzzle the entire internet than to produce p
To which supposed monopoly are you referring? If you're referring to the supposed OS monopoly then how is MSN Explorer leveraging that? It has nothing to do with Windows. If it's a monopoly of Internet client software you're referring to, then I'd defer to the numbers on that: AOL has 23 million members vs. MSN's 3 or so million (despite being on the desktop since Windows 95).
Further, Microsoft has agreed to rewrite the email message send: check out this story on C|Net.There was a decision from the circuit court of appeals a while back (some of you legal types might be able to find it) that sending email from your account is as good as signing it.
Mail sent on your behalf without marking it as such is FORGERY, and thus illegal.
Joan Cartwright?
hmm....
Nono wait, i think i got it....ummm
TomV
This is an outrage simply because the email sent out seems to imply that I am endorsing this product to folks in my address book. Since I am a computer professional, it will seem like I have reviewed this product for my business' consumption and am suggestion it.
Imagine a copy of it going out to my boss who thinks I actually wrote it! My opinion counts to my fellow employees and employers. I wouldn't want it tainted with the suggestion of this product.
Granted I probably wouldn't use MSN Explorer if I were a good computer professional, but still!
couldn't agree more ! but after all, do i care ? - NO. the only good about this is that we are witnessing the next nail in M$'s coffin (quite a bit they are...:)
Hmm, 23, I can't of anything to do with 23 except that it's prime.
1) Did you post, with your nick, in the keyboard contents topic?
2) Did your post, with your nick, in the Katz death of politics topic?
thank you
The message ended with:
And do I need to say it came from an "exploited" SMTP-server using a fake reply-to?
And how the F*CK can US law apply to me when I am a Swedish citizen living in Sweden?
Well, after notifying the owner of the sending SMTP-server he quickly fixed his problem.
English is not my first language, so cut me some slack -: Om du kan lasa det har sa kan du Svenska
You really ought to know Hotmail is NOT their product - it was the brain-child of young entrepeanur, who Microsoft offered millions to buy it off him. That, there, is the premise of pretty much ALL "their" products. If you can't copy it/steal it BUY it!
I bought my current Wintel box 3 years ago this October. For that purchase, I had decided to pay good money (lots of it) for near top-of-the-line hardware so that I would still have a viable upgrade path in the future. So I plunked down my hard-earned cash and bought a 233 MHz PII with 64 MB RAM, a 3 GB HDD, and a few expansion slots filled with various things.
Less than 6 months later, my computer was not upgradable. Why? Changed the bus speed - all my RAM is garbage now. Changed the socket for the CPU - I was now constrained to a max of 333 MHz, which I probably couldn't find to save my life. So my "upgradable" computer needs a new motherboard if I want to improve the speed at all.
Third party Mac hardware makers at least try to give you something worthy to upgrade to - new CPU daughterboards and the like - unlike the Wintel mafia which just fscks you up the cornhole and tells you to smile.
Mr. Ska
Then there are a few companies (Symantec/Norton being the best example) who don't allow them to play that shit.
An AC wrote:
> VC++ is targetted more at less experienced
> developers. There was an interview linked to
> from slashdot at some point where the project
> lead for VC++ said as much.
Never used VC++, have you? I have. I've also had a few years of experience with UNIX programming (before Linux was born), and Windows SDK programming with the Microsoft C compiler. Of the three, I would definitely say that VC++ Windows programming (not the DOS) is the hardest, most convoluted of all. To do anything as simple as a hello world window for MFC, you have to customize four big objects, one of which is a "document" class (where is the document in simply displaying "hello world"?). And what you get is a window complete with menus and stuff, not a simple window with "hello world" in it. I won't even get into COM or any of the other MS acronyms of the week. The entire mess is market driven, with new "technologies" invented at the drop of the hat, not to help the developer, but to achieve dominance for MS. It is no wonder most Windows developers who believe they have no other choices, go for Visual Basic. Linux developers have it easy with good tools, and libraries like qt that actually make some sense. Heck, you can do a "hello world" in only a few lines with gcc and qt!
Let's face it, Microsoft is a worst case scenario of a market driven company. The latest thing with the Explorer spam is just one symptom of that, the messed up developement environment is another. Now, ideally, market driven is supposed to mean that the marketing department is keeping the products on track with consumer wants. In this case, market driven means that every feature, every part of every product is designed with one thing in mind: Microsoft world domination. And of course it all crashes, fixing bugs only helps the user, and MS doesn't give a heck for the user. Even if that user is a developer.
Oh, like the plural of denarius wasn't 'denarii'? (Roman coinage, in case you were wondering). I'm sure there are plenty of other examples for the grammar nazis to add. How many bets that the original complainer about virii is a well-educated US citizen who still only speaks his own retarded-spelling version of English? color! donut! OH, how I tire (sic) of these Amoronicisms (tm). Shame on you, cjw44 - is that flatline thing the record of your brainwaves? Miles
Ooh, I'm dying for a sig...
In particular, it would be pretty nasty to not filter out of the To list addresses like 0.555.HER.PHONE@sms-gateway.her-network.com. It's unlikely that could be done programatically.
Receiving on my Nokia a suggestion to change my mail reader isn't something I'm really likely to find useful, and waking me up at 4am to suggest this would be - somewhat unendearing.
Please, O Win2k guru, please explain to me how to get to TCP/IP properties in one button. It took me fifteen minutes the first time I tried.
And though I was pleasantly surprised to find I didn't have to reboot to change IP address, I still rebooted once for each of a large number of changes to the default options under "services", and had to reboot *three* times to remove the default install of "Active Directory Services". Which then screwed up any number of other things but reduced my bootup time from somtething over ten minutes to 1:30.
Really, I'm not trying to troll; it's just that I recently got stuck with a Win2k server to admin (if you want to call it that) and I honestly didn't know there was a way to get to TCP/IP properties in a single click. Maybe you could publish a "Win2k shortcuts for Clueless Newbies" reference card?
The Web is like Usenet, but
the elephants are untrained.
You have a point, but in general it would only really stand if the majority of people were more well-educated than they currently are, and if the education system taught people how to think etc etc.
Unfortunately this is not the case, and the majority of Windows users, when presented with a message box, will immediately get frightened and confused, and will click on whatever the default selection for dialog box is.
It's kind of like MS in court saying "most people choose Internet Explorer over Netscape Navigator ... but if you dig deeper into their study you find a bit of extra detail: that 90% of people who "chose" IE gave "it came with my computer" as their reason for this "choice".
However unfortunate this may be, it is just the way things are - and Microsoft knows that very well, and they do stuff like this deliberately to take advantage of all these people. So I'm sorry, this does not excuse MS for doing this.
For some reason I once filled in my email address on a Microsoft web page, I can't remember why, but I know I must have had a good reason :), and I know I would not have consented to receiving anything from them.
From then on I received periodic spam from them. The spam gave clear instructions on how to remove oneself from their spam list. This could be done in two ways, by sending a message to a given email address, or by requesting on their web site that you be removed. I first tried the email option.
Soon afterwards I got some more spam from them.
So I tried the web page option, *and* the email option again.
Soon afterwards I got some more spam from them.
So I tried the web page option several more times.
Soon afterwards I got some more spam from them.
I gave up on this. The email address was one of my email aliases, so I deleted the alias.
Even though I have a lot of knowledge about MS's shady business practices, I at least expected a little bit of professionalism from them with this. But I guess that was too much to expect.
speaking of spam. wft is that?