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Massachusetts Universities To Require Laptops
karmma writes: "The Boston Globe has published this article that says that Massachusetts will become one of the first states to require the purchase and use of laptop computers. While several private universities have already adopted this practice, this program will be among the first at publicly funding such a program. Full and partial vouchers will be provided to low income students, and educational programs and infrastructure will be established." Actually, Northern Michigan University, a public university in Marquette, Mich., started doing this with laptops a couple of years back. Having spent some time there, it's pretty cool how it works -- it means a lot more integration of electronic material in the classroom, from what I saw.
East Carolina University and the even-more-(in)famous University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill (both public-funded universities) have both started requiring Laptops for undergrads... possibly a whole year back already, in fact.
Personally, I think it's a cop-out by the universities. If they want every student to have a computer, they should provide every student a computer, or make them available at a REAL discount through the university system. Making students buy laptops with their own money or financial aid, in addition to tuition, board, beer, etc, can be a hefty financial hit for lots of students.
NCSU doesn't require students to buy computers -- yet, at least. It still has enough lab machines to meet the demand. Of course, lots of students buy computers on their own, and that helps alleviate the demand. But requiring machines for everyone? Waste of the student's money, in my humble opinion. Are they next going to require them to purchase Visual Studio for programming classes, or Photoshop for art classes? These are resources the school (and the students' tuition) should be providing up-front.
Xentax
You shouldn't verb words.
And the number one thing UMass Lowell needs before taking on such a lavish venture: To stop phoning in bomb threats to Merrimack College!
This is interesting, tell me more about it.
I'd be surprised if the Amherst campus had much say in proposing this one. Most students here already have a computer, I don't see the need for a school to require everyone to adopt some standard. Why do schools always require laptops? They're more expensive and harder to type on. Also, our connection is saturated with Napster traffic all the time. They'd better buy a bigger pipe if they're going to make everyone get a computer.
This just doesn't seem to fit in with what the school has done traditionally. UMass is a very cheap school, with cheap students. The state has been cutting funding to UMass lately.. I don't know if they'd pay a lot more for a new program such as this.
Just my two cents, as a bitter old student.. one thing's for sure, they'd better not require me to get a laptop.
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No, it's probably a Dell conspiracy. What planet do you come from, where no one makes money off government funding? Ever heard of Perot? Peru? Singapore? I'm too disgusted to give a real list.
Boss of nothin. Big deal.
Son, go get daddy's hard plastic eyes.
Expanding a vast wasteland since 1996.
Thanks for the info regarding the network specifics, i've not been keeping track of that.
I agree with you about increased familiarity with computers benefitting non-science majors, this is definitely a fact, and i thought about it in writing my original post, but gave up, as i was beginning to meander as it was. It seems that this is the greatest benefit they will receive. Usage in the classroom seems marginal on average and forced at best. Kinda like the professors thought to themselves during the summer months "damn, i have all these kids with laptops, now, what in the hell am i going to do to make use of them in class". Many of them (even in the science disciplines don't bother). To be fair to the profs, it's a work in progress, and continues to be a pilot project in many ways. To be fair to arts majors, i can think of 6 or 8 cs majors in my time that could code like the dickens, but didn't know how to use a mouse till second year (i kid you not!!!). Like i said in my post, i don't see any problem with laptops in the classroom, but PLEASE, let's make them tools, not hinderances, nor wastes of money & time.
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I love cats... they taste like chicken.
Thats a lot of RAM for a 386. My first 486 had 4 megs. I was shocked when one of my friends told me he had 16 Megs.
I only said text mode since I know that just about any 386 will deal with that. Even a really crappy one.
This isn't going to save the universities any money at all. It'll likely cost more than upgrading and expanding the labs. They'll need more support and instructors for the laptops than they would need lab supervisors. I think the ideal computer policy for universities is to put a computer lab in every dorm and staff it with the local residents that can get a discount on their room and board if they work in the lab. The best way for students to learn to use computers is from other more technically inclined students that wouldn't mind sitting in a lab a couple of hours a day playing diablo or whatever. If you put the lab in the dorm you have restricted access and can therefore allow it to stay open more often, even 24hours a day if you so chose. I think the biggest problem with campus labs are that they are only open at certain times and they aren't really consistent (at least where i went). If you have a small lab in each dorm the support will come easily from other students that are much more willing to walk down the hall to oversee a lab than going half way across campus to sit in a large lab. Its all about personal attention =) This laptop plan is just flawed from every angle i can see. From Money, Effectiveness, to Utility. Costs more and doesn't work for most students, what Art history major _needs_ a laptop let alone a cs major. woo hoo now i can program in the park. yeah right. whats the point ??
Wow, they are still arguing that line? I've heard it before:
"Og, if we use speech, then others may hear what we are saying! In my day, hand signals were better."
"If we teach all the kids how to write, they will never develop their memory! It was a lot better when I was younger, and we could remember whole epics."
"If the people stop believing in the gods, then everyone will be immoral! It was a lot better in my day, when people had proper respect for the religion of their elders!"
"If we have a democracy, then people will loose their responsibility, and just vote themselves benefits! It was a lot better when we had a king, who could act in the state's best interests."
"If we teach that we came from animals, then people will act like animals! It was a lot better in my day, when it was something special to be a human..."
"Slide rules are cheating! In my day, we did long division by hand, and quickly!"
"Calculators are cheating! If a kid doesn't learn the slide rule, then he'll never get a good grasp on logarithms!!!"
Anyway, you can probably come up with your own list. I've heard it so many times, I'd like to give it a name, like "Flibbert", so, when I hear it, I can just say, "Oh, you're just being a Flibbert!", and they can say, "Well, you're just being a knee-jerk AntiFlibbert!", and someone else would say, "You know, you are both right...", and me and the Flibbert can just say "Syntha-Flibbert!" And so on...
(Sorry, drifted off into Marxist Thesis-Antithesis-Synthethis for a second there...)
(the wonderful people behind technogenesis) have always required computer for its students, but after my class, it was mandatory for those computers to be school-issue laptops. now, most of the classes that the freshmen and sophomores take DO require the use of their laptops and alot of their curriculum is web-based, but that doesn't stop just about everyone from playing quake, ut, minesweeper, solitaire, etc. i feel that's highly disrespectful, and hey, maybe i'm just annoyed that i take all my notes by hand, but i feel that having to take care of a laptop distracts me from class... i hate being in a humanities class where i'm trying to pay attention but the people around me are jiggling and clicking like mad. some professors do something about it, others think they're just being eager in their note-taking. erf.
computers in the classroom aren't a panacea [sp].
--
Peace,
Lord Omlette
ICQ# 77863057
[o]_O
Why don't you just try X-Win32? It's not as full-featured as exceed, but it'll let you open XDMCP sessions to other unix boxen on campus.
To keep this on-topic, my University (University of Vermont) requires computers for all Engineering and Math students, but they haven't had the balls to require laptops only. I know that the School of Business here required all of their students to have laptops because the entire building is wired to allow access in all of the classrooms, etc. Personally, I don't see what this really adds, but administrators aren't reknowned for their good sense and practical ideas.
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"To hope's end I rode and to heart's breaking: Now for wrath, now for ruin and a red nightfall!"
RPI required the purchase of a wintel laptop. For what I spent on my dual booting Linux/Win98 P3-500 with 256Mb ram, cd burner and dvd player, I would have ended up with a difficult to upgrade p3-400 (or slower), 64Mb ram with a 40x cd-rom. It was a major influence in my choice.
I am definitly all about computers, but it is still much easier to take notes on paper.
Another issue is that there exists a large number of people who can afford a state school and do very well using school labs for their computing needs; but the mandatory cost of a computer would push the school out of financial reach. Isn't that why they have computer labs?
stephen byrne
Go green: turn off your refrigerator.
This line from the article says a lot:
"State officials have been in talks with computer makers IBM, Compaq, Gateway, and Dell."
Macs will be marginalized; the existence of OS'es such as Linux, BSD, and Be will simply be ignored. If they go with Dell, there will probably be some ani-AMD propaganda involved too.
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
Seriously, though, this is a good thing, if only because it gives me an excuse to buy a laptop. Now I'm going to unabashedly troll and ask for opinions here: Windows laptop or Mac laptop? Windows laptop hardware tends to be kind of crappy, but a Mac laptop is, well, a Mac at the core... But it does have OS X, which I have seen and really looks pretty nice. Suggestions?
My roommate has an older (maybe 2 years) G3 Powerbook - it's 292mhz or something wierd like that. I installed LinuxPPC on it and it kicks ass. With the two included batteries you can get 8-10 hours of constant usage on in, and LinuxPPC is pretty nice. Everything is completely supported - sound, modem, ethernet, video, power management, etc...
If you want to run Linux on a laptop, I suggest a Powerbook.
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When I was in college I was expected to write form the very few books available locally and maybe one or two foreign editions, but now I am sure the expectation of the examiner would be higher since my refernce field would increase immensly. Even if the examiner were complacent works of co-students (the serious ones) would lead to it. And ofcourse the examiners life isn't any easier for he may not be sure whether the student is speaking in terms of the latest developments unless he too puts in more effort. So its going to make everyone work more and yet doubt whether it is sufficient.
There's always sufficient, but not always at the right place nor for the right folks.
After the story, one of the "reporters" hosting the show made this brilliant comment: "I'm all for them as long as they don't replace learning".
I don't advise that you watch this show unless you have had a lobotomy. I think I lost brain cells.
Ok People, I realize that MSU isn't the largest school in michigan... Oh wait, it is.
Then I guess it doesn't have any sports teams to make you remember it... Oh wait. it does& lt;/a>
Look... MSU instituted this policy for all incomming freshman at the start of this school year..... well shoot me with a stick
The only article I found on the net was this one.
Anyhow.. just trying to give my alma mater it's Due Props.
From what I see here on campus where it isn't required, doing other homework, chatting, and games. People IM me to say they are in class and bored... Also most places that have laptop type campuses have wireless so connections aren't a hassle.
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It's OK to be social, just don't tell anyone about it.
I also feel sorry for your students hearing that your math students use Maple. Maple and Matlab are far more useful to non-mathematicians. Most universities I know of treat math students to Mathematica. The standard software package for pure mathematics. Maple and Matlab are incredibly useful and should be required in the Physics as well as Engineering programs. It's too bad your school is so far behind.
I use vi and xemacs. One is faster, one has better features. You obviously have chosen your camp.
I keep hearing reports of shortages of LCD's that are keeping the prices of laptop and PDA's up and keeping supply low. Would 18,000 new laptop users every year be enough to exacerbate this situation>
I'd use it to take notes on. My tendonitis flares up when I write, but I can type for hours without any trouble.
dude, I go to RPI too
and frankly, I don't WANT a laptop...
they suck next to a desktop...are more expesnive, harder to easily upgrade, crappy screen, crappy keyboard, crappy mouse button/pad, battery that runs out if u forget to plug it in
i hate everything about laptops...I'm glad I wasn't part of the freshman year that made laptops required. I have two computers, but you'll _never_ see me with a laptop. And I'm disgusted to think they would force such crap upon those of us that prefer desktops (caus frankly, some people can't afford both)
and very much like the napster issue, I think classroom laptops would be used more for leisure/gaming/fun/diverting purposes than real useful ones (not to say some ppl wouldn't actually use them for work purposes)
The shool should require all students to have a computer. Not a laptop. It really isn't needed in a educational fasility. Even as a Computer Science Major. The typing would be distractive (by noise) compared to just written notes. God help you if you start if you have to draw a diagram with the the little nobby thing between the "G" & "H" key. Or use the touchpad. A full day of classes can reach around 8 hours. I dought the battery can last that long. Or having to change bateries in the middle of class dosent help too. How about theft? Student A has 400mhz laptop. Student B had a 700mhz laptop. Same brand and model. Just to the old switch-a-roo and bang instand upgrade. And most importantly with the money I spend on a laptop how can a student gather enough money to buy themself a Sun Ultra sparc!
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
I apologize, I gave you my 2 minute debate answer and not my 10 minute essay answer, because I only had the two minutes to spare. I agree with your criticism and PK's , and I think moderation was working in this case - your comment got a 5, mine just has a 2. Anyway, I've got some more time, so here's the longer version:
Your experience is the experience of several other Slashdotters, including myself. I, too, was in the high-school classes that drilled actual knowledge and understanding instead of rote memorization and relying on developed tools. Often, however, the path to understanding was through memorization, and we were required for the math classes to have advanced calculator models (TI-82, though many opted for the more advanced versions). As I understand it, the best classes haven't changed - The teacher goes through the theory, creating the proofs along the way, and tries to determine if he or she explained it adequately. We then test this theoretical knowledge through problems, working from trivial problems to the advanced ones. The tests came in two flavors - endurance tests where we had to prove we could solve average problems in a timely manner, and brain twisters, that tested our knowledge of the theory.
Although this seems to describe a math class, it was the method used in other classes as well. In Chorus, we practiced the scales and learned harmonies for songs we already knew, but also had to practice reading sheet music cold, trying out for a part, and doing solo work. In English classes, we had to comment on classic works (often enlightened by the best of the critical essays), but also try our own hands at writing short stories. In history, we proved we had memorized the facts, but also that we understood the arguments, by trying to argue from their perspective (it was interesting to write a fictional letter from a papist official who agreed with the condemning of Galileo, and it was certainly enlightening). Those of us who recognize that we received a good education treasure these memories, and pity those whose memories of school were just trying to get through the day, either because the work was not challenging or incomprehensible.
Perhaps you had the same experience I had going to college - disappointment. I expected that only the best and brightest from high schools would make it, that it would be a place that, for once, learning would be the highest goal, and the lesser considerations - social life, athletics, and trouble-making were low on my personal list - would be put in their place. I found that college, in many respects, was worse than high school - at least in my freshman opinion.
I was appalled by the reliance on calculators and computers in my first few math classes (I retook calculus, because I thought it would be harder and/or purer in college - I should had known better after the first day). It seems there has been a "revolution" in higher math education, where the old theory-based style has been replaced with a greater reliance on graphs and computers, which are supposed to complement the material. In my opinion, your worst fear comes true - most students approach problems as a data-entry exercise, to try to get the tools to come up with the correct answer.
Now, I used the tools and the calculators, but I believe I was using them in the spirit first intended. For difficult problems, I could manipulate the tools to give me the right answer, then, secure in knowing my destination, I could work toward it, using the theory. If I had an intuitive insight, I could back it up by calculating several important points across the domain with relative ease. Finally, I could turn that math into pretty pictures, which is what the real world wants, anyway.
I've come to the realization that the same technology can be used as a crutch for the average guy, a tool for the above-average person, and a stepping stone for the gifted. In any engineering class, 75% of the people will be using those laptops to do the work for them, 20% will be using them in the spirit intended, and 5% will be writing the next generation of tools. If we went back to slide rulers, it would be the same way. (Feel free to play with those numbers to fit your own beliefs)
What the new tools does do is allow the average student to access much more difficult problems, the above average student to do the harder problems even more efficiently, and the gifted ones to create better tools and abstractions. And I believe this is a Good Thing, even if it causes the ranks of the average to swell. With the world the way it is, we need all those average folks, and, if we can give them better tools to make their data entry easier and more efficient, more power to them.
Further, I think it is unrealistic for us to expect that everyone has to be some sort of renaissance man or philosopher king. I'm very happy that I can program away without really understanding set theory or number theory, beyond what I need so that binary math makes sense. Someday, I may go back to school and pick up those missing pieces in Math and Physics, so that I really understand my tool of choice inside and out. But for now, I'm happy in state of partial ignorance, using computers I understand more than most but less than some. I'll leave it to the kernel programmers and the materials engineers at AMD for now, and pick up what I need when I need it.
At the same time, I understand that the true innovations come from vertical knowledge, and that most of my knowledge is in the horizontal dimension, and that some day I may change that (sorry if that made no sense).
Re-reading your initial comment, I realize I wasn't aiming my comment at you, but the extremist who thinks new tech is Bad because the users don't even understand what they are doing, because it gets results without work. I have to think that our opinions are a lot closer than I first thought.
Do you see why sometimes I go for the short answers?
I don't think it's blind technophilia . . . laptops can be rather useful in the classroom . . . ask any Rose-Hulman student . . . of course, Rose-Hulman was one of the first schools that required all students to have laptops, and they're a small enough school that they were able to put network jacks in at every seat and projectors in every room . . . I have a hard time thinking that most public schools have the resources to do this . . .
My school, the University of Cincinnati, is currently "requiring" that all engineering freshman have a laptop . . . not a truly enforceable policy though . . . and unlike Rose-Hulman, my school doesn't have the infrastructure for this . . . yeah, they've started wireless networking but it's not available in all the engineering buildings . . . and I've seen some of my professors try to use computers . . . I shudder to imagine some of them trying to integrate computers into their lesson plans . . .
Rose-Hulman also has a wondreful support program, where you can basically swap laptops if anything goes wrong with yours . . . At Rose this is important since the laptops are integral . . . perhaps support won't be such an issue when the laptops aren't really integrated into the classroom . . . though if they're not integrated into the classroom, why bother?
Another reason my school is currently pushing for laptops is that some people want to eliminate computer labs in general. Computer labs are horribly expensive to maintain, and if every student had a laptop, then there would be no need for them . . . though this logic seems slightly flawed . . . I'd much rather work at a full size keyboard and desktop than a laptop . . .
Another problem with requiring laptops is that laptops are behind the technology curve to begin. My school's engineering program is a five year program. Now how many of you think these laptops will be worth anything by the time an incoming freshman graduates? Especially for engineering students who are going to be running demanding applications . . .
I'm getting quite interested in the answer to this question as the whole story never mentions the price of software. This would mean only free software could be installed on them.
Ok, in reality at least part of the laptop will probably have some sort of windows install. A quick browse of the umass LAN support pages suggest it's a Novell shop. But with their own local redhat mirror so they promote 'choice' in operating systems.
All I am getting interested in is, are they going to support wireless LAN ?
I used to work in a university and one of our 'very far future' ideas was to support wireless lan for students who brought their own laptops and wireless nics to save on computer rooms.
The Virtual Bookcase: book reviews
Backpacks with padded sections for laptops are readily available. And my current laptop (which I got for free, but probably is worth $150 -- it's an old K5-133 with 32MB ram and a 2 gig HD) is no heavier than two or three spiral bound notebooks, and is significantly lighter than my three ring binder fully loaded with paper (mostly used for archiving printed stuff)
:P
I suppose, if you retain information better if you write it down (I can't write and listen at the same time. And I write slowly enough that if I try to write one bit, I miss the next four bits of lecture) then writing it down is probably better for you for notetaking (I have an amazing grasp of the obvious, eh?) but there's still advantages of having a laptop.
And just wait until we get real useful handwriting recognition
I'm a UMass student. They would most likely support either Windows or MacOS. They allow you to use almost anything you want (there are many linux people here) but there is a very limited set of applications the helpdesk supports (Netscape or IE for web, Eudora, Netscape, OE or PINE for e-mail, etc)
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The University of Mississippi has been doing this for years in their graduate program. I know there were plans for undergraduate requirements up to two years ago...not sure if they've been implemented.
I think reqired laptops and more motion toward the integration of technology and education is a great step. Having taught and been taught in classrooms where computers are used heavily, there is much that technology can do in the way of making learning easier and bringing examples directly to you.
I am somewhat concerned, however, that this sort of thing could become bogged down in bureacracy, with idiotic requirements like trying to restrict the laptop make to a single manufacturer or specific model. It would also be important to take steps to ensure that this technology will be used, as many may profs and students may see the technology as a toy and of no practical value.
Hey there Mister. Yes. You in the 4th row. Is that a headset you're wearing? It sure looks like one.
Take off those sunglasses please. Bring them up to the front so that I can see them. Just what I thought. Another game of Quake during differential equations.
There were plusses though - his history survey course had no textbook, only a syllabus with links to web pages/projects (mainly hosted/funded by other universities). Groups in the class were assigned projects that they had to collaborate on during the course of the week - either face-to-face or electronically.
As for the need for laptops (vs. desktops), consider collaborative work or *gasp* studying in the library - you might want to have your computer handy when engaged in these activities.
it was 1984, and laptops were the size of todays desktops, and they were known as portables, but weighed alot, I suppose. The Mac was the new rage. Ethernet.. huh? Internet... wha???? I love Marquette, MI (lived there for a few years- still have hippy friends there....I'll be back..'der, eh?..) the University was best in the summer, when the students went back across the bridge, and the pathways were clear to bike as fast as I could.....except for an occasional goose. and the Lake... ahhhhh.. nothing better.....
-- "Perceptions create reality. By changing your perceptions you change your reality."
The operating system is the least that concerns me. I am much more worried about the students that are at the mercy of the "educators" who decided that laptops are beneficial to students. I doubt the study you were in was the only one of it's kind and I doubt the research found a benefit to having laptops. I think these studies are very important. I sure as hell wouldn't lug it around to my classes and worry about taking notes on it. I went to a very good university for undergrad and grad school (it was a top engineering school) and never once had to bring a textbook to class except for one of my humanities classes. Digital books I could do without. Give me a paper and a pencil and a good teacher.
The writer didn't claim that Mass was the first school to do so, he claimed that they were the first major public institution to do so - Acadia hardly fits that criteria...
As a Canadian I'm all for the pride thing but I can't agree with your misguided criticism here.
When my brother went to UVM he had to buy a computer. It was $3000 dollar IBM microchannel 386 which he paid for over his 4 years there. When he graduated it was so slow it was next to useless.
When I was at UMass we could use the Engineering computer lab which was chock full of fine 486s and dot matrix printers..We could use them 24x7 by getting a key from the dept.
I don't see how requiring computers helps anything.
"He estimated that the state could cut the price of a good laptop computer to about $1,200, which students would pay directly to the vendor. State officials have been in talks with computer makers IBM, Compaq, Gateway, and Dell."
A very nice example of computer industry lobbying masquerading as a "for the public good" law... and everyone will be running Windows.
If one could bring UMass into sync with the rest of the world by requiring laptops, it would have been done already. They have other priorities right now that they need to fix. For them, it is all a matter of getting subsidies from the state... and helping out their public image.
Lucas
Cambridge, MA
As a Mississippi State student with a laptop, I often use it to take notes in class. This works best when the teacher posts a .pdf of the notes, and I use Acrobat to type notes on theirs. In addition, I have been in class MANY times and a teacher gives out a URL... I can go see that page right then and see what they are talking about rather than waiting until I get home and probably forgetting to go to the site. Another use is to do my labs, as I can never get a computer in the labs. When I do get a lab computer, they are slow and I often can't do what I need to because of the restrictions on it. I have sat in our Student Union many times working on my labs while eating lunch, something that no computer lab on campus would even consider.
"The ships hung in the sky in much the same way that bricks don't." --Douglas Adams
This seems to me like a giant step backwards. The idea of physically carting around your data in a bulky laptop from dorm to class to lab is ridiculous... Data like this should be accessible from anywhere from any machine as long as the correct security credentials are supplied...
This also means that all students will have to purchase licenses for each software package they ever want to learn. What if I want to go to a lab and try my hand at AutoCAD 2000? In a typical university, just go to the CAD lab and try it out. Now you'd have to go out and buy a copy for your own laptop.
The support logistics also seem like a nightmare. For example, where will a student turn when they attempt to install a parallel-port zip drive to their laptop and it blue-screens during the next boot, making all of their data inaccessible? (We had a real problem where I work with that. For some reason, external parallel-port zip drives and NT 4 just don't get along very well... Loads of BSOD problems after a reboot after an install. We finally had to ban the things...)
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sigh... why do i never catch typos until after I hit submit and never during preview? s/imformed/informed/
See subj:
Baker's Law: Misery no longer loves company. Nowadays it insists on it
http://www.sigsegv.cx/
The OU College of Engineering has required laptops for its students for several years. We actually have a (growing) wireless network spreading across campus, where students can access all of our servers and their data files, as well as the WWW. On a nice day, you can walk by Engineers' Court and see students sitting outside by the fountains or under the trees working on projects or just surfing the web.
We use the system for more than e-mail, however. Several courses use a BlackBoard collabaration website to work on projects, turn in and grade daily grades, and supplement the classroom lectures.
If you are interested in learning more, check out The Engineering Computer Network's Website, or our laptop requirements for the past year at this page from the FAQ.
Go Sooners!
--
Mike Hollinger
Michael C. Hollinger
Obviously, Hemos skipped English classes at NMU.
Best Slashdot Co
I've seen this done in a small private institution, and the students there loved it. Rose-Hulman is a college of about 2500 students, and it's tech-majors only (engineering, computer science, etc.). All students are required to buy the same laptop. At first, this turned me off, and then they told me that they had an on-campus repair center with plenty of spare parts, so they could replace whatever broke on the spot.
Of course, never believe the hype. So I talked with students. One student told me her screen or something got damaged, she took it in to the repair center, and they swapped out her hard drive and put it in a spare and she was out in no time. And since the college knew that students would make use of it, a lot of the classrooms have power and ethernet jacks in the desks (so no hunting for that).
To address the teaching issues: I sat in on a Calculus class, and at the time, the teacher was covering three-dimensional integrals. It's fairly difficult to draw those on the board (shading is a _pain_), but Mathematica can do decent renderings fairly quickly. Now I can hear all of you saying, "Great, so now they only know what it looks like if the computer shows them!". No, it doesn't have to be that way. My HS calculus teacher would let us use calculators during lecture, but no calculators could be used on the exams. So we could use the calculators to "play" with ideas and test them, and get a deeper understanding of the theories. But come test time, it was us against the test, with only a #2 pencil to help us.
That's how teaching should be handled. Use all of the tools available to help students understand the material. But once it's time to test the student, make sure you're testing they're abilities to comprehend, not they're abilities to use the tools (unless teaching the tools are explicitly part of the course, which should be rare).
And actually, I've just recently decided that my next computer is going to be a laptop. I go to Virginia Tech, and I end up with a lot of small blocks of spare time. If I had my work with me, I could get something accomplished, but the blocks aren't big enough for me to make it back to my room, get work done, and then get to where I need to be next.
...that I could've had a sponsored laptop when I went to univiersity...
:)
Life would have been much easier then...
...or I would've just played more video games.
BlackNova Traders
Okay, so they need computers. Why do they need to be laptops?
-Laptops are expensive to purchase
-expensive to upgrade (if possible)
-Are easily Stolen
-have keyboards that suck.
-suck for taking notes when math symbols are needed. (which is damn near any class of mine)
-Don't run most of the 'hard core' applications I would need as a Mechanical Engineer. I doubt I'll ever run a fininte element analysis on a laptop with only 128 megs of Ram when our school has Dual Processor Sparcstations available with 1 gig+ of RAM
Why not just have a few computer labs available for students (like the current system). Sparcstation labs for me, Linux labs for the Hardcore C.S. students, Macs for the hippies, and Windoze labs for the losers.
I would argue that computer labs (with regular computers) would be a much cheaper way to run a school. Backups are run nightly, SysAdmins can fix a zillion computers at a time, and you don't have to worry as much about a computer problem right before exam time.
And what software will I be required to purchase? Wouldn't it make more sense to have 100 computers available for every 300 or so students. I Doubt all 300 students will need the computers at any given time.
I say make the laptops recommended, but optional. Maybe make everybody buy palm pilots with those full size keyboards. Palm Pilots are truely portable, and would more than likely be used for work and not goofing off.
Recall the time limited textbook issue?
Seriously, if I were an undergrad again, (Lord have mercy), I would not like being required to obtain two grand's worth of easily stolen gear when there are other, better ways to use comptuer technology in education.
Not every topic requires computing, let alone mobile computing, shakedowns like this open the path for time limited textbooks, and desk top computers are not as easily stolen.
Blind technophilia is not leading edge.
i think that the more important aspect is the fact that more material will go online therefore allowing the students to pay attention in class rather than wasting an hour attempting to write down what the prof is saying.
this is my situation at school, all my cs courses have the notes online, so rather than take notes, we dicuss.
on the other hand my religious studies courses (required) nothing is online, so i write like a bastard trying to get the ideas down.
I recently went to a DELL meeting that said that everyone at UT will eventually have to buy 1 particular model of their DELL laptop or 1 model of their desktop. It's part of their tuition according to DELL. The reasoning is that the tech guys will know exactly what is wrong with them and they could fix them when there is a complaint. This is the best part, they all link up to DELL's portal to buy College Supplies. I believe this is in plans for next year.
"as well as everything humanity is doing right now, " Now that's a bit rich......
I go to a Massachusetts public college..where is my laptop? =) Oh and I'd rather eat nails than use a PC so look for a cheap laptop on Ebay soon....
Damn sheep....
A good friend of mine has been going to NMU for the last 2 years, majoring in Art. He was required to get one of the IBM Thinkpads. He's quite pissed about it. Both his parents work at NMU, so he gets free tuition, but he has to pay extra for the laptop that he never uses. And to top it off, in the art department they use Macs, so for almost all of his classes, the laptop is totally useless. Even if he did get a Mac laptop, one that would be great for his art classes, he'd still be required to get the Thinkpad. At the beginning of this year, there was a big hoop-tee-do when the Thinkpads were delievered. A big parade of IBM trucks pulled into town, and from what I heard (I wasn't in town at the time), and there was a big party of some sort. For laptops. Wooo.
I have a writing problem caused by joint and motor control wierdness, and use a laptop for all my lectures. And it is nightmarish. Having to make sure the batteries are charged, switching batteries in the middle of lectures, having to work out how on earth to get greek stuff out of the keyboard, etc. etc. etc.
And have you ever tried doing matrices outside of TeX? *shiver*
Desktop computers are a _much_ better idea. I also like the idea of lectures by video conferencing, although you may find a lot of students just spool morning lectures onto HD to delete^H^H^H^H^H^Hread later :)
I am actually a student here so I am somewhat informed about the laptops. For the most part non-CS majors use them to play solitaire in the back of the lecture halls.
In the end what this turned out to be, or such it is perceived as, is a hidden tuition hike to pay for their new science building. They're charging $385 a semester for an almost year old laptop. Thankfully they improved upon it this year. This is the first year they're actually requiring all students (juniors the previous year had the option of waiving out) to acquire these. After two years you can trade it in to get a new one.
One of the big problems I have with this is that there are no options to purchase your own laptop. You are required to receive one from the University. I became a junior a month or two after the deadline and I was not given the waiver. I argued for quite a while and finally got a pseudo-waiver. I was waived $85. The other $300 was infrastructure fee, of which I was not entitled to waived from. They tried to tell me this was like the $150 we pay for the health center whether we use it or not. It seems like at least the health center doesn't make me buy a $35 toothbrush.
Personally I use the laptop quite frequently, it's nice to be able to carry around Mathematica and Systran among other things. You can hop on the network just about anywhere on campus. Heck the practice rooms in the music building are decked out. But I'm irritated that I'm essentially paying the full cost for a laptop I can't keep.
I'm enrolled in 23.5 credits of classes, *none* of which require the use of a laptop. I'd say maybe one of my professors barely knows to turn it on, the rest?
Anyway, this is probably rambled together as I have class in 20 minutes.
Toodles,
Seron/Oink
----------------- Oink. Moo. rarr! -----------------
Heh... Well, will you look at that... The article does say that. Well, yay for you guys... So your government can tell you to embed laptops in your classes... Shouldn't that be a decision left to the individual universities?
:) So, the fact that we aren't using Mathematica isn't really that important. We're an undergraduate only school anyway for the most part... Perhaps Maple and Matlab are sufficient for our Math Majors... (I wouldn't know being in Comp Sci...)
And most of the content of the comments has been on how revolutionary this all is... Which it really isn't.
And to the best of my knowledge Acadia is one of the first if not the first well recognized university (not just college) to FULLY integrate laptops into the classroom and completely rewire the campus to reflect this.
Moreover, no one ever claimed our administrators were that bright... As I say, we use Novell.
--Flame On--
And now that I've fully read your post maybe YOU should wake up. Insiginificant and unknown?? PRIVATE? Next time read a book or something before you post - Acadia is not private at all. That's why people who don't have their daddy's give them corvette's are able to attend. Not only that, but Acadia is consistently rated highly by Maclean's magazine and is easily one of the best universities in Candada. And get this, since in Canada we don't give out ridiculous sports scholarships, most of the people who graduate from Acadia actually have brains in their heads! Woot!
--Flame Off--
But yeah, you're right... We don't have our government telling us we have to use laptops. That would be just plain wacky.
And I spelled Canada Candada... That's beautiful. :)
Now we'll have some people sitting there staring at their beautiful new active matrix LCD going, "How do I click the mouse?" and "Why did my screen turn blue with pretty white text?" Not everyone is computer savvy, I don't think it's a good idea to require someone to own a laptop if they don't know how to use it.
_______
"With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine." -- RFC 1925
That I'm sure the administration does think this will save money--they don't invest in labs now, and this way they can avoid ever doing so. Further, while $1200-2000 is not so bad for a laptop, it's still a lot for and undergrad putting themself through school working 40hrs/week at a minimum wage job, or a grad student living on a TA's stipend and trying to support a family. I'd also like to point out that we've lost over 200 tenured faculty in the last 10 years that departments have not been allowed to replace. A number of classroom and studio buildings are in danger of being condemned (for real!). if the Board of higher ed wants to give us money, great; computers could be helpful to many students; but we have more pressing needs at the moment.
Great. Now professors/educators have expensive toys to fiddle with as one more excuse to avoid the hard work of organizing/teaching meaningful courses.
We've been doing it for about 3 years now (I've been in it since the beginning). It's really cool what is possible when everyone has a computer that they can take home and wherever they go - no fighting for lab time is a big plus.
;)
My brother went through a non-laptop program and I went through a laptop program. The main difference was that I was always able to do my work whenever I felt like it, and he had to fight for lab time. Now, we had/have a good computer at home, better than the ones at school, but we didn't have the software (actually, we had the software, but it wasn't compatable with what the school had...). Even if you have the same versions, there are multiple portions, dll's, etc that make each installation unique. Sigh
Price, Quality, Time. Pick none. What, you thought you had a choice?
This is absolute, and utter shit. I can't tell you how angry & upset I get every time that I hear this sort of disgusting rot coming from the mouths of the leaders of our institutions of (so-called) higher learning. Why is this? Allow me to give the reasons: (1) this is simply yet another way of blocking off access to the university for poor students. Since the founding of public universities, it seems, it has been a gradual closing off of all the avenues by which people without money might attend. (2) this is obviously a corrupt and criminal agreement between computer manufacturers and a public school system in order to increase sales of overpriced laptops. (3) this sort of plan helps to reinforce a uniformity of computing software which is unnecessary and hurtful. I doubt that my 486 laptop, which runs Linux, would qualify under their plan. (4) what the fuck is the point, anyhow, of forcing people to use computers? There are simply many, many tasks where not using a computer is better than using one. Okay, I'm running our of steam, but I can't tell you how horrible I think these plans are. They disgust me, & they make me ever more upset with the computer industry than I usually am. Erik
I have to question how far vouchers and public funding will go. Even crappy laptops are far more expensive than their desktop counterparts.
Somehow, this feels like yet another nail in the coffin for education of the monetarily-challenged.
Tuition is stupidly expensive, books are stupidly expensive, and these prices go up more and more each year, faster than inflation...
This sort of thing is not new, at all. The architecture department at Mississippi State University has been requiring laptops since the early '90s. The engineering departments all followed suit back in the late '90s. Although it may not have been a campus wide requirement at the time, this sort of thing has been brewing for quite some time.....
allow me to expand upon "friggin luddites"...
1) we offer training courses and accomidate them at every corner. We don't have the budget to convert them right away, so it HAS to be done gradually.
2) they REFUSE to use the simplest of newer technologies. We have to find a tv/vcr cart instead of them using the VCR/projector in the room (the difference is that the projector projects the TV image onto a large (40") screen whereas the TV/VCR cart just has the standard 21" screen. As a student, which one would you prefer? both being the same ease-of-use (exact same VCR), but they just need to push "source" on the remote control.. hrmm..
3) They are the biggest bunch of assholes on this planet. I'm all "yes sir, right away sir, whatever I can do to help sir." and all they do is yell and bitch about how I'm not jumping high enough or through enough hoops for them. Then they lie about things to their deen and threaten my job - all because of my suggesting that they try the new document camera (which can project even solid state documents) instead of the overhead projector which was broken (and we did not have a replacement available). It's too much to care about.
4) The worst thing is that they are from the school of science and technology. More like, old-science and obsolete-technology if you ask me.
Verbatim
Price, Quality, Time. Pick none. What, you thought you had a choice?
If you can't convince 'em, regulate 'em.
Greetings,
Intro :
I am an art student at the "thinkpad" university - Northern Michigan University. As was stated earlier the art department uses apple macintosh computers, of course.
Requirement :
However, all students who have not attained junior status are required to lease a laptop computer from NMU unless they already own a laptop. Even with already owning a laptop it is difficult to get past the requirement. All transfer students, I included, are also required to lease a laptop from the university.
Waiver :
Those students who have already attained junior status can apply for a waiver from the university and then pay 60 dollars a semester in order to use the computer labs on campus, which ironically use ibm thinkpad computers. the main problem with the labs is that they are constantly in use and backed up with requests for use.
Printing :
for students who managed to get out of the requirement, there are no printers available for public use, technically. if one is smart and knows someone in a lab it is possible to use the printers, but those who are timid and/or do not know anyone in an important place, have troubles merely making hard copies of their work.
Laptops in class :
Virtually no one uses their laptop in class from my experience (word of mouth and 12 credits here so far). And, when they do it is for taking notes. From what I have heard, it is a proven fact that the vast majority of people take better notes with pen and paper than with a computer.
Also, very few classes are equipped with the power outlets and ethernet ports to accomodate the laptops. Hence, many students have complained that they are not able to use their laptops the whole time through their busy schedule because their batteries run out.
Freedom of choice :
It is required that a student lease an IBM Thinkpad computer - no other choices are available. There are IBooks and the like on campus, but these are few and far between and all owned by individuals who were able to attain a waiver.
Windows 98 (and possibly ME by now) are the only OS's distributed with the computers. MS Office suite is also distro'd w/ the laptops (along w/ more software).
Cost :
I cannot recollect the cost of the laptop, it is, however, leased by the semester. But, the cost to lease a laptop for four years is far greater than the cost to purchase a very similarly equipped IBM Thinkpad.
My Thoughts :
If you couldn't already tell, as a student at Northern Michigan University, I am not in support of the laptop requirement. I strongly advise anyone who will possibly come into contact w/ a similar requirement to attempt to make their voice heard in the matter.
And for those who are wondering - I was granted a one-year waiver from the requiment. I just transferred this fall. I was granted the waiver because of misinformation when transferring.
help out.
For UCLA's Arthur Anderson Buisness school, you are also required to have a labtop. Integration is the same. If you go there expect to shell out at least $3,000 for your required laptop. Did I mention you shouldbuy them through the UCLA store.
Of course, since they shut down access to Napster, people are pretty pissed about having to depend on off-campus friends with DSL lines...
--
--
It's not the rambling I object to, so much as the mumbled incoherancies...
However, there are just too many choices taken away from the users (students). I know damn-well that I wouldn't ever want someone to choose my computer and its components for me! And most importantly: Not everyone wants a laptop! If you like the mobility, fine, but it you don't feel you need it, there still just isn't the hardware comparison with a desktop. At least not for anywhere near the same price, and even if the prices were the same laptops are still just finicky.
How can you make that decision for thousands of students across so many schools. It would be like telling them all how to dress or what to eat or what classes to take.
I recently graduated from Acadia and am old enough to remember before and after AA (make up your own joke, i've had a long weekend -- Dave Lettermen) was started. As i see it, this isn't about the fact that they brought in AA, but about its relevence. Physics, Math and CS students could certainly benefit from the program (and they do, immensely). The problem i see with it is that students from all disciplines are forced to rent a laptop that some find little or no use for in class. My girlfriend is a history major at Acadia and she doesn't bother to bring the thing to class as it is never used and is not required. Certainly, she finds sources for her research on the net, but her professors tend to discourage Internet sources in her papers, as they are liable to change or be removed without notice. On top of that, the money they pay to rent the bloody things in four years could buy two very nifty laptops per student. Don't get me wrong, i'm a geek, and i love gadgets, but i'm frugal, and this seems like a waste of money for quite a few of the students there. Application is as important as the technology.
As for the network, they did do upgrades to the pipe and infrastructure the first year of implementation of the program, but it has proven quite insufficient. This year, in what appears to be a continuing round of ineptitude on the part of the network admins, Acadia has erected a firewall, and has limited access to the network to certain users at certain times of the day (i don't know enough about the restrictions they've placed on students this year, as i'm not there, so please forgive if i'm slightly off here). On top of that, the university has failed to upgrade dialin lines in all the years i've been around. The best they could offer is a reduced rate with a public dialup internet service. Students off campus (about half of the student body) are forced to pay even more for alternate net access if they wish to use their laptops on the internet, AND they don't get access to Acadia's novell network on which professors prefer to place help materials for their students.
Overall, i'd say acadia has done a good job considering governments in this region have cut funding to universities drastically. Acadia, in turn has raised tuition and is among the most expensive post-secondary institution in Canada, but that's a topic for another day.
Moral: you can't please everybody all of the time, but you sure can please the geeks.
Alt. Moral: Make sure that the technology fits the application or you could end up screwing the non-geeks.
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If you wish to email me, please remove the anti-spam thingie.
I love cats... they taste like chicken.
Right from the webpage:
500 Mhz Celeron
64 MB RAM
6 GB Hard Drive
12.1" display
CD ROM
External USB Floppy Drive
Built in Ethernet and Modem
Typical MTU student..(snicker)
--knick
There are several high-quality computer labs on campus, open to all hours of the night, and located all over the place. There are some in dorms, every engineering building has at least one, and each department has at least one of their own. Here, students without their own computer can go to do computer related work. I don't see the need to subsidize student laptops. As it becomes harder and harder to get classes, I do however see a need for the state to spend this money on more teachers.
I still remember the look the techs here (St. Andrews university) gave me when I said I had an Amiga hooked up to the LAN. However, while unwilling to support it, they had no problems with me connecting it (as long as I didn't blow anything up).
Making this a law sort of scares me. Aren't PDA's coming to the point of being highly useful as a laptop replacement? Also, do you have a choice on which laptop you get and who you buy it from? There is a technical institute where I live in Calgary, Canada where some engineering students have to buy a laptop through the school. This of course bloated the price rather extensively from what I have heard. So, how long would it take before some of the universities started doing the same thing? Or even worse, what happens if they do that but only allow you to sign a high priced lease agreement on the laptop? And to add paranoia to that last part, who owns the rights to the laptop then? Who would decide what you are and are not allowed to do with the laptop then? You or them? -----
I'm not so sure it's a stupid idea.
There are most likely quite a few people at the university who are shareholders in tech stocks, particularly those dealing with OSes and hardware. In that context, it's actually quite a clever move--for them.
The students? They're just meat to be ground into the system. Might as well shake them down (or, in the case of the subsidized boxes, the Public) for more cash as they're processed through the system.
"The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws."--Tacitus, The Histories
Meanwhile, this has not turned their help desk into an oracle of sage advice. The morons distribute buggy, proprietary dialup software to access the modem pool, which uses standard PPP.
A friend of mine is at a technical college where most people have a laptop, since there are Ethernet plugs everywhere in the lecture rooms.
While there are advantages to this, most students only use the permanent Internet connection for extended ICQ chats during lectures, and for trading MP3s.
The advantage of being able to try out example applications "life" (i. e. during the lecture) does not outweigh all the distractions that a laptop offers...
The University of North Dakota's John D. Odegard School of Aerospace Sciences, the best in the nation at a public university and preferred by many students over any at a private university, actually requires laptops for all of its students.
However, they charge $1,000 per year and give students very nicely configured Gateway laptops which get updated throughout the students' undergraduate years. The laptops also include both Ethernet and wireless LAN hookups, so that students can access class-related material from the residence halls or, using the wireless card, from the state-of-the-art classrooms in the aviation school's buildings.
This is one place where such technology is nice for students to have. From accessing the real weather reports to viewing navigational charts to viewing PowerPoint slides that demonstrate the dynamics of flight, laptops are beneficial to the aviation students.
However, I can't see an entire university requiring laptops, especially without heavily subsidizing them. Some philosophy majors might even find it reason to protest. Many english majors are content with writing their papers on University computers and not having to deal with breakdowns. Maybe computer science majors could be required to have laptops, but they'd just use them to ssh to the university's servers to run their programs, anyhow.
Well, I attend UMass, so I have a bit of info for you. The school is heterogenous(?) in regard to their computing setup. They have a large Tru64 UNIX installed base, some VAXen, a few Sun boxes, a bunch of NT and Win9x boxes, and Mac boxes also. The point is, i doubt there would be any OS requirment whatsoever, and ( for CS students at least ) *nix would be encouraged even. But, I also do not see this laptop deal goin through at all, most students have a desktop at home/dorm, and would not need a laptop. Plus, UMass caters to _many_ degrees, with a whole campus dedicated mostly to Liberal Arts. Many of the degrees available would not make use of the students all having laptops. So, overall, it's a bad idea, though if they're givin out 85% off student discounts for a shiny new laptop I'll be there in a second!
System possessed? # grep deamon
I go to UMASS Amherst right now and I think this is an interesting plan. I don't necessarily think that everyone should have a laptop because there are some people that would have almost no need for one. However I have taken many classes that require computer interaction (no, not just comp-sci.) In class sometimes the lights go out and we have to watch the professor working at a computer on the projector. It is good to see how things are done but it is nothing like having the hands on experience that you can't get until you leave the classroom. We also have computer labs but definitely not enough computers to go around. Being able to work along with the professor would be a great advantage.
A lot of people are complaining about the deals that the university is going to make with software companies, specifically Microsoft but the fact is, the university already buys site licenses for a lot of the software that we use, so the students are already covered. The programs I use are Mathmatica, which we have a site license for; PSpice, which is already free to students; and Matlab, which I have to buy anyways.
I just think that we should keep our minds open on this issue because there are both positive and negative sides.
Rose-Hulman, in Terra Haute, Indiana, has been doing something like this for a number of years now. They have just included the cost of a laptop with your tuition, if I remember correctly. There were options for upgrading it as the years went by.
.... are they finally going to get us some desks in the lecture halls that aren't BROKEN so we have somewhere on which to rest them during class?
Seriously, though, this is a good thing, if only because it gives me an excuse to buy a laptop. Now I'm going to unabashedly troll and ask for opinions here: Windows laptop or Mac laptop? Windows laptop hardware tends to be kind of crappy, but a Mac laptop is, well, a Mac at the core... But it does have OS X, which I have seen and really looks pretty nice. Suggestions?
Incoming freshmen at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill are required to own a laptop beginning this year. Known as the Carolina Computing Initiative, the idea is to get laptops into the classroom and promote a greater "intellectual climate" (their words, not mine). However, there are a number of flaws with the program and I'm not so sure I agree with it. First of all, the program specifically states that students have PC's running Windows and certain other software, such as MS Office.
I'm not even going to start on why this is a bad idea. Another sore spot is that the university partnered with IBM to give students a "great deal" on a pretty well loaded thinkpad, which have been having problems since just about day one.
My biggest problem with the whole thing is that they are forcing a computer platform on students. Sure, the 10% of businees/econ kiddies we have here may love their stinkpad with Excel. But what about graphic design students? Of course we want our macs, with big huge monitors and optical mice. What about CS students? Is windows the best platform to learn programming? When I took CS classes, I did all my development on a my linux machine. The point of my little epistle here is that forcing a single scheme on students is a very bad idea, especially in public universities that are supported by your taxes.
My other computer is your Windows box
I would imagine for things like quizes at the beginning of class, possibly even tests. I have a friend who went to a med school where they required laptops, and there it was quite useful. They had network/power connections at each seat, and for things like anatomy tests it was very helpful to be able to show the students full color photos (and have them go at their own paces).
Of course, that sort of stuff requires lots of work and infrastructure, but even here at Cal they are doing online prelabs over the web. This means that Chem 1 students who don't have access to computers need to come into a computer lab each week which must be a pain.
If 70 percent of the students already have a computer why in the hell are they being required to shell out an additional $1200 - $2000 to purchase another one?????????
The only benefit of a laptop over a desktop is being able to tote it to class. Is this what the Universities are requiring? A $2000 note-taking device?
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We want some answers and all that we get
Some kind of shit about a terrorist threat
- Ministry
"Use any language you like" the prof said.
Naturally I wrote it in C, which was a "fringe" language at the time (1982). Later I discovered I was the only one who used C. 90% of the class used Fortran, while the other 10% used Pascal.
Next week I got my program back. "F - did not run"
W. T. F. ???
So I'm in the prof's office immediately after section got out demanding an explanation. He pulled up my code and proceeded to compile it in front of me:
voltaire$ f77 sapprox.c f77: FATAL line 1: Unrecognized keyword: #include
I wanted to grab him by the collar and go *SMACK* *SMACK* *SMACK* *SMACK* and beat him silly.
This was at UCLA, by the way.
I'm part of a group that is testing laptops w/ wireless access at UC Berkeley... and I almost never use mine. I think it's often more trouble than it's worth...
willis/
there is no thing
what else could you want?
In the 1995-1996 school year, I was one of 20 students that was given a PowerBook 520c for a year. I didn't actually see the results of the study, but my expieriences were that most of the students left them in their dorm rooms, except for the one english class that required the laptop.
This may be very different now, since battery life is much improved and weight has been reduced, although I doubt it, unless digital books become the norm. I doubt that that will happen either. There is something about sitting in a comfy chair with a text and a highlighter that is lost when reading on a computer. Often times, I'll print something out just so that I can mark it up better than I can on a computer.
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Does it scare anyone that they (obviously) are requiring Windows based machines? As a Mac user this scares the sh*t out of me, and it should scare linux users too, since they will most likely expect users to have MS Office, and other non-linux apps. Whether you think that Windows sucks, Macs suck, Linux suck, ect., you should agree that Universities mandating hardware and software choices is terrible, and goes against everything that a university is about.
Wow! Imagine how they might use the money in colonizing Mars instead!
Human extinction is on the way.
So agreed!
My sister (who is three years younger than I am) was required to have a graphing calculator (preferably a TI-85 -- but TI-82s were allowed, as I recall) for *algebra* (that would be first year, middle school/high school x + 5 = 6 sort of stuff)
I wasn't required to have such a beast until I took Calc 1 (for which I bought a TI-82)(which was a year after she took algebra) -- and even then, I used my little TI-30 STAT much more often. Heck, even now I rarely turn on the beast -- it's easier to fire up gnuplot than to find 4 AAA batteries that will die in five hours anyway. My TI-30, however -- well, I just sent in five bucks to get a new battery door because the old one broke when I dropped it down 3 flights of stairs. Other than that, it's still my favorite calculator, even if I have to hold the battery door down by hand to keep the thing on right now (oh, please UPS, hurry up with that package!)
Result: She has significantly less deep understanding than I do on mathematics -- this isn't a controlled experiment, but most of the other variables are pretty close (raised in the same household, same gender, same parents, similar IQ scores, same schools, etc)
It seriously makes me wonder.
So what happens to those of us who would like to run Linux on our laptops, but are forced to use Windoze so we can run school-mandated software? Those of us at Northern Illinois University are FORCED to log into a UNIX system to do our Computer Science homework, because they use an incompatible protocol (works with Windoze) for their DSL servers. We could just as easily use Linux and GCC, but are forced to run Windoze and login (Translate: slow) and compile on their Sun servers (which, BTW, don't run the network) because the DSL servers use a DHCP protocol which doesn't like Linux. I fear for those who will be forced to buy Windoze and have to deal with crashes and viruses because their school requires them to use it.
The society for a thought-free internet welcomes you.
Tution goes up a LITTLE? Try over $1000 dollars when it was first implemented. Slackware is great but the template they use is complete crap. Acadia is now the most expensive university in Canada because of this program! And worse yet we don't even get full internet access! Everything but http, ftp, and ICQ is banned. I can't even use CVS! The program is a good idea, with a very very very bad implementation.
At what point, exactly, did education of an individual at the expense of the masses become a right? Why, pray tell, is it suddenly my responsibilty as a taxpayer to fund the yahoo who dicks off playing Starcraft LAN games on the campus network?
If you work your ass off to go to school, then I commend and respect that. Good job. If you expect me to gleefully turn over my hard-earned bucks so that slackers I don't even know can spend their wonder years slapboxing the one-eyed champ in the dorm room that *I* unwillingly put them in... That, my friend, your proverbial slap in the face.
A college education is not a right. It isn't a "privilege of the rich white classes," either. If you want an education, then beg, borrow, or steal, but don't you dare tell me that it is my responsiblity to provide you with it.
You have no rights at the expense of others.
wamph
Well, this is obvious, but they are. I imagine a room full of 10 of them running might be a little annoying, even without much typing. Add typing and things really get noisy. Personally, I'm used to sleeping in a room with 2-3 workstations running (yes, my life is that exciting), so I can tolerate a bit of a hum, but for many people, and sometimes myself at times, it makes it hard to concentrate.
Is it a software problem?
Yes, image software partition and return to student.
No, image student's laptop to hot swap laptop on shelf; return defective laptop to OEM.
Not sure? Perform yes branch and if problem persists perform no branch.
One thing to keep in mind is that if set up right the system will have only a few different hardware platforms. And you've got a captive group; afterall is a student going to switch schools because their video driver is flaky? And they can't even complain to their boss.
I've seen my sister's school sponsored (and supposedly cheaper) laptop from Northern, and frankly, I was disgusted. It's something ridiculous, like a Pentium II 300, with a 2GB HDD... If you're going to make me dish out money for a computer, at least let me get something good!
Beyond that, I've heard that they've had no end of problems finding techs to support these things. As opposed to my university (Michigan Tech forever!!), the students don't know anything about their computers, and call up tech support when the screen saver won't turn off. If anybody out there likes snow, apply for a tech position at Northern...
I work and go to school at a College in southern Ontario (Canada that is... ) and anyhow, we have a laptop program where students pay a small fee in their tuition and get the use of a laptop for their term. Advantage of the loan: the hardware is upgraded frequently and, in case of damages, students don't have to wait weeks for replacements from the company. The downside would be that the students (including myself) don't get to own/keep the laptops - but in 3-4 years, that laptop is gonna suck-ass at best.
The colleges two main campuses both have "mobile" rooms. At first glance, they seem like cheap classrooms (no computers), but what they have is awesome - each table has network connections and power, the podium at the front has a built in vcr, port replicator, document camera, etc, all connected to a data projector. We're talking capable of full multimedia presentations / lessons / etc, with web-based courses so you need not even show up for class (I used shoutcast once to stream a lesson for some ppl who didn't come one day).
HOWEVER, and this is the intelluctual side of things, it's not the sudents that are the biggest problem. The problem is that faculty - teachers - for the most part have not adjusted well to it. Some oppose it outright and refuse to use any of this 'modern technology'. friggin luddites. We have rooms with whiteboards and really whiz-bang stuff that can make an instructors life easier, and they insist on using blackboards with ancient overhead projectors. Thier students miss out because the teacher is unable or unwilling to upgrade to modern teaching methods. It's their right, but the students have the right to learn in a modern environment too.
Verbatim
Price, Quality, Time. Pick none. What, you thought you had a choice?
So they "standardised" on an email package despite the fact that email uses standards that all email packages on all systems support Thjey did the same for PPP.
On the other hand, they haven't yet decided to standardise an office package even though it would make sense since they all use different formats.
I'm surprised no one has mentioned Clifford Scholl, the high tech heretic. His thesis is that computers don't belong in the classroom. Students learn better when not distracted by computers.
I think Stoll has a point. Learning is not a click-and-drool experience, it's hard work. There are still many things that are better learned with pencil, paper, and attention focussed on the teacher than with mousepad and screen.
One of the problems with computer-based education is that everyone accepts that it's a good idea to bring computers into the classroom, but there is no review or analysis to actually gauge the effectiveness of such instruction methods.
"Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens." - Schiller
I don't know...
When I was at UT and living in the dorms, UT had just started allowing SLIP dialup connections. I also remember running coax through the false ceilings so that we could setup a 20 room network for games. Warcraft II nearly cost my roomate his degree :)
The next year, UT administration ran ethernet through the entire dorm and each room had a mad internet connection. Unfortunately, I had already moved off campus and was still stuck at 14.4.
--mando
Thinking about it - almost 2 miles, 35 mins. Hell, WALK. For the love of God, get some exercise
Correct, walking is faster. But if I'm waiting around for the bus I can sneak in some studying. Plenty of other people also walk to save time, I just use the time for something else.
Technology is the worst investment you can make hands down. I should have bought some land...
I can't help thinking the university would be far better off just investing in a decent amount of networked PCs around campus, and some dedicated staff to look after them. It'll almost certainly be cheaper, and you won't be forcing students to buy a laptop (which I think is a really bad idea anyway - raise the hurdle a little higher, go on!).
It's got to be cheaper, and as many other posters have pointed out, a computer itself isn't really useful for many degrees, let alone taking laptops to lectures.
Was my first linux box... and it kicked for the time... It had a MACH32 video card - and X just seemed to love it.
All in all it was a solid Slackware system...
BlackNova Traders
The point is that the University of Massachusetts system is going to do this, not just one campus.
I don't know about Mass, but in NC, there is one university called The University of North Carolina (the one in Chapel Hill), several others that go by The University of North Carolina - City X (Wilmington, Charlotte, Greensboro, etc.) and others that do not bow to the wishes of UNC-CH (NCSU, ECU, etc.)
OTOH, there is a University of North Carolina system of 16 campuses, of which UNC-CH is but one campus.
There's the difference... statewide school system vs. one college.
Eric
Winona State University, a public univeristy in the Minnesota State University System has also done this already. Two very cool benefits from the program:
1: Ethernet ports everywhere on campus now. Sure this would be good if I wasn't grandfathered out of the program.
2: They fix the laptops under the lease agrement for damn near anything you do to the machine. Great for all those english majors who don't know an OS from a Hard Drive.
Downsides:
1) 500 dollars a semester. This racks up to an extra $1,000 a year, a hefty increase in the price to a university that has been rated as one of the 100 Best College Buys five years in a row.
2) 3 year lease with over a $1,000 buy out clause. This means you pay $4,000 for a pile IBM thinkpad. Good thing you can use your own machine if you want.
I mod down any one who says "I'm sure I will get modded down for this"
The best learning I have ever done is when I have sat down with colleagues with a pad of paper and a pizza and just got down to fundamentals.
I think universities would find their results rocketed if they taped every lecture on video, and provided a library facility for people to watch them as and when needed.
I don't see how a laptop is realistically going to help a great deal. For most things like lectures, etc., the average person couldn't take notes fast enough on a computer.
Learning isn't something that magically happens when you distribute computers to lots of people.
thenerd
The camels are coming. I'm in love.
I also go to Acadia and I cant see why all these americans think that getting laptops is such a new thing.. just like Darrell said, we have been doing it for 4 years... btw..I use vi, not emacs
...well, my 486 laptop plays an excellent game of Scorched earth running DR Dos... which would run just as well on a 286...
What a game... we still have scorched earth group games... I just wish Xscorch was half the game that scorched earth was.
BlackNova Traders
I don't know. Speaking from the viewpoint of someone who used a laptop from high school (and who had to *fight* in several cases to use it -- say what you will about the ADA, without it I might not have graduated from high school at all)
I think this could very well be a good thing. It depends on how they approach it.
Physically carting a laptop is significantly less difficult than physically carting a bunch of notebooks, plus floppies or other storage media. Notes can be taken on the laptop (pico is your friend) and printed out if necessary. It's good to teach people (geeks and non-geeks alike) to be responsible for their own backups and general data protection. You can write papers whilst eating in the cafeteria or out on the lawn on nice days. In general, if you view a laptop as a replacement for handwritten work it's a plus, not a minus, in most respects.
It would definetly be cheaper for the university to have infrastructure support for a bunch of laptop-workstations (network drops, print, mail and other servers for stuff that workstations don't do well) than have (as my college did) a bunch of five-to-ten year old workstations running outdated software riddled with viruses because the IT folks knew nothing..and when I complained, accused me of putting the virii there.
(I won't even start on learning C programming in 1996 on an antiquated alpha running VMS -- my laptop was probably the most advanced computer there, and I wasn't running linux yet!)
Software licensing *is* a valid concern -- one that is partially answered by the various educational licensing options offered by most major software houses, but it's also a place where open source advocates could really put their foot in the door. Hopefully people are in college to learn concepts, and not specific software (if you want to learn architecture, or design, go to college, if you want to learn AutoCAD, go to your local tech school!) and insofar as that goes, for *most* (not all, and I'm aware of that) applications that a college student would need (word processing is the big one) there are open source or otherwise free solutions.
Anyway, if they choose to use those laptops wisely, I see good things here. whether they will remains to be seen.
The University of Oklahoma's College of Engineering has required all newly-enrolling students to purchase laptop computers since the fall 1998 semester. I was part of a small test group at OU when I was a freshman in the fall of 1997. At that time, a few classes were offered in "laptop" versions that attempted to make use of the laptops. Several buildings were outfitted with wireless networks so that you could connect to the campus network and the Internet in many places in and around those buildings. I believe this network has been expanding to more buildings across the campus, but I don't know to what degree. The program initially met with a varying degree of success; it was cool to have class materials online and deliverable to your web browser, but it was also too easy (and tempting) to goof off. This was, in fact, how I discovered Slashdot. Adoption of the laptop program has been somewhat slow from my point of view; the College of Engineering has not introduced laptop sections of upper-level CS classes fast enough for me to benefit.
Washington, DC: It's like Hollywood for ugly people.
It's important to note that a lot of good things can be done with the notebooks. Before i graduated from dear old RPI, i helped out in one CAD course that is now able to streamline clunky overhead-projector based lectures into something that can be viewed before class at the student's leisure. But that took years to put together, and is the exception to the rule. The rest of the classes either have half-assed Web-based watered-down tutorials, rife with animated GIFs and Java programs (although the lack of relevant content is more important than the poor presentation thereof), or they have a old curmudgeon of a professor who says to put them away. The second choice is actually the best, trust me. During my brief stint as an instructor, i was tempted to go look up the IM screen names of all the students and send them messages saying "pay attention!".
The notebooks, at least at RPI, have great potential, but to actually learn something, there needs to be a bit of restraint. All they've succeeded in so far, in six years in changing a mostly UNIX-based school to 98% Windows. Great. A bunch more people who just don't know any better, coming out of a place where they should be learning.
However, I would like to point out that Arts and Business students benefit Immensely from AA. Why? Think back before AA. How many students were even vaguely computer literate. And quite frankly, how many jobs are there out there (making more than min. wage I mean) where you do not use a computer?
While I see AA as not being only marginally to not benefitial at all in the class room, the real life familiarity that students develop with the computers gives them a leg up in job interviews in the real world. The non-geeks are the last people being screwed by it. Think of it from the CS prospective: what CS student wouldn't have the skills gleaned from owning a laptop anyways? How many CS Students don't own their own computers in addition to the laptops already?
BTW, as to the firewall restrictions: users cannot use high numbered ports (ie napster) during peak school hours because it sucks bandwidth like a pig... mostly from people in res who leave napster turned on allowing John Q Public to download mp3s and hog the bandwidth. Acadia actually has upgraded it's bandwidth every year, but demand increased exponentially with the creation of hogs that take up too much space.
College is already expensive enough without saddling an additional burden on students. There's so much theft already in dorms, this will onloy makeit worse. And for what? So the school doesn't have to provide computer labs? More likely just to impress people that massachusetts has a gud education system. Well hey, its not all that bad, I mean, we're not kentucky. Maine wants to do this for high school students and I think its an equally dumb idea.
Good education comes from commitment from students, professors, and administration - not arbitrary political requirements smoothed over with assistance from public funds.
Microsoft must love this..I am sure that each of these laptops has paid the appropriate microsoft tax. I wonder if Umass students are also required to run winders. It wouldn't surprise me.
Governor Celluci is terrible. I voted for Weld, even though he pissed me off at times I thought he had a good head on his shoulders - Celluci does not. I wish Weld would come back.
Is by requiring that some classed be taken online.h tm
Sure, this article:
http://www.usatoday.com/life/cyber/tech/cti667.
mentions just one class, but what's to stop them
from adding more mandatory online-only courses?
One would really have to stretch the limits
of your naivete to really believe that this is
only done for convenience. I just wonder if they will reduce college fees (all the stuff thats
wrapped in; computer lab fees, misc building fees, etc) when these sort of things go into effect.
I HIGHLY DOUBT IT. I kind of see a parallel between these college adminstrators and insurance salesmen. They both want the $$$ to keep flowing
in, but are constantly thinking of ways to limit
what services they have to give in return for that money.
In the IT University , part of KTH (Royal Technical University) in Stockholm, Sweden, students pay a low motnhly fee for their laptops that they use all over the university buildings with their integrated wireless LANs. Of course, like most universities in Europe, this is a public university, meaning that you don't need to pay for the courses. To be accurate, in some EU countries students pay a little annual fee for their studies in public universities (ex. Spain: about 500 $ a year), but in Sweden that is completely free. In fact, the Swedish government pays the students about 250 $/month for beeing students.
Not everyone is involved in a technical field. How much can theater and philosophy students bennefit from this? English and history?
The biggest problem here is the instructors, they won't know how to use these laptops effectively. Either the machines will be ignored, or you'll end up having to computerize everything, and your Lit essays' will be graded as much on your HTML skills or ability to use powerpoint as you are on your reasoning and language.
Not to mention that the time the instructors spend figuring out the new technology, and how to apply it will come out of time that should be spent doing things that directly bennefit the students.
Yes, being able to use a computer is an important skill to have and having them arround is immensely useful, but blindly sticking a computer everywhere is not going to make things better until you have a generation of teachers understand what can be done with them. Until the teachers know what to do with technology, at best, it will be little more than a costly distraction.
my sig's at the bottom of the page.
I'm a CS major at the University Of Massachusetts Lowell. I don't want a laptop. Cheap models are heavy, slow, and heat up too much to be used safely on my lap. Expensive models aren't much lighter and still aren't as powerful my desktop machines. Battery life sucks. All but the tough-to-come-by Transmeta laptops will still burn my lap if I do something CPU intensive like a compile or DSP simulation.
Not only do I not want a laptop - I don't need one. Notetaking works just fine on a hundred dollar handheld or five dollar notebook. A good calculator like the TI-89 or HP-48g covers most of the mathmatic stuff, costs only around a hundred bucks, and is small and light enough to keep in my backpack at all time. I can't think of any tasks I can't do on the handheld or calculator that can't wait until I get back to my desktop PC or a computer lab.
Furthermore, the availability of portable computers in the classroom will make it possible for professors to assign proprietary e-textbooks that can't be loaned out or resold. I'll pass on those, thank you very much.
Yeah. I was never required to have a graphing calculator in college (thank God), and I used my trusty $20 TI-34 that I bought for high school. I still use it. It's held up well, probably because it actually had a metal front plate. :)
Who wants to bet that...
A) The operating system used by such machines will be mandated by the university authorities?
and
B) That operating system won't be your favourite Linux distro?
I use a Windows NT network at this University (Ecole de Chimie de Clermont-Ferrand) because I have to - my laptop is Debian. With loads of useful little things to play with like Perl, MySQL and an internal CERN-HTTPD webserver. I guess I just wouldn't like to be TOLD what to use - education is abuot giving people the ability and information to make bettr choices, right?
Elgon
I agree that having a laptop is not optimal for everyone. For some, it makes more sense to have a handheld or Palm w/ keyboard, plus a desktop. I don't generally do compiles on the go, nor do I need Powerpoint. If the purpose is to read documents, they should be in html rather than word. And if it's for taking notes, a Palm with a keyboard should be okay.
What about all the people who live and die by using Macs? Are they going to be fully supported by the software in the classroom? And that doesn't even touch upon Linux and FreeBSD... I'd bet if you had that running in class, the teacher wouldn't even allow it. I'm having problems right now with reading documents teachers send out, because they're all in .doc and .xls. Why do people assume everyone has Microsoft Office? I doubt that 1 in 100 people on campus actually bought MS Office, the rest just pirated it. It just ticks me off-how much work would it take to save in .rtf or something so the rest of the world can see the files?
Colin Winters
Hey how can this be news... I am currently a 2nd year student at the HEC (Ecole des Hautes Etudes Commerciales, in other words a business school) and they've been requiring laptops for 3 years now. I chose to go there partly because of that. Sadly, after a few months I began to realise that the idea of sticking a PC in front of students in class is somewhat dangerous. Anyone heard of ICQ and multiplayer gaming?? LAN games (quake, delta force, etc...) have all made pasing courses somewhat harder. In addition, being as dependant on technology as we now are, a PC breakdown becomes pretty much catastrophic. Hell sometimes I would just want to throw the thing out the window! On and on a side note, this is probably the most dangerous thing to do if you're a linux advocate. It basically forces Windows, MS Office, etc down the throats of influencable students! The good news is that IE makes the school LAN crash so NS lives! ;o)
"Welcome to the real world"
School-sponsered laptops? I wonder if this is going to work like textbooks...
"Buy a "school-sponsered" laptop, a blazing pentium 166 w/32MB of RAM for only $3000! But don't worry, the school will buy it back from you for a whopping $50 when you graduate. No, you can't bring your own, because the SCHOOL only supports Windows 95, and of course you'll need to buy a school copy of Microsoft Visual Basic for $1,300 for the advanced programming course, but again, you can sell it back at the end of the year. Provided you can return the shrinkwrapped package. For $50."
End of lesson. You may press the button.
Why do college kids?
Being a Computer Science major at a particular school I could tell you that having a laptop (at least in my case) would have helped out a LOT.
Nearly everything I do involves a computer...from writing up my Operating Systems projects to writ ing up papers.. And using the campus's WaveLan, I could be doing it in a class I don't care nearly as much about.
Plus, the ability to take notes in class and have them readable (my handwriting is shit...) would be a nice bonus.
Why haven't I got one now? I'm pretty much broke...
Of course, if it were mandated that I have a laptop, I may be even deeper in the red than I am now...
--------------------------
Over the last two years, our school (Ohio University) has put some nice desktops in every dorm room for the students. Most are 500MHz celerons with 128M RAM and beefy hard drives. Unfortunately, people like me who live off campus are left out in the cold :(.
If you read the article, you would see that (in the third paragraph) it claims that 30-some *private* universities including Dartmouth already have this requirement. RTLinkL.
Eric
Locally, we have a high school and junior high that both issue laptops to students to use in their studies. I remember when we couldn't use calculators in school, and now laptops are becoming standard issue...
Like so many other things with technology, this is a double-edged sword. It's great that more people are becoming comfortable with computers, but there are several problems as well. The biggest problem I see is that the curriculum will probably be OS centric, and the OS will likely be Windoze. This gives Microsoft an unfair advantage and headstart. I wish I had the time to develop a linux distro that was education-centric. Something that would allow for easy encrytped distribution/sending of homework assignments (128-bit encrytped wireless NICS, ex.), basic firewalling when the laptop is in a classroom (handled by the local basestation for the RF NICS), and software that was tailored to a learning environment. At the very least the curriculum should support Windows, Linux and Mac OS's so that the students can use what they feel most comfortable with.
I also worry that this may make the students lazy. If you've got spell checkers, thesauruses, and other tools handy on the laptop that might encourage more of a reliance on the technology and less reliance on independant thought. Also, if the laptops are provided by the school, or partially funded by the school, does this mean that the information stored on them is the schools property as well? Will this make it easier to invade students' rights?
-This sig intentionally left blank
Here at Miami University, there's not an actual "admissions requirement" of a desktop/laptop, let alone a particular OS.
However, I've found that I can't really get rid of my MS Windows partition simply because the classes use so much Microsoft centric software.
My programming classes require Visual Studio, my communications class needs Power Point, etc, etc.
While there is no "required" OS, I find that I still have to use the products the school chooses, or face inconveniences and incompatibilites. Ack.
Things UMass Lowell needs before taking on such a lavish venture:
UMass Lowell doesn't even run the campus network in an ethical and sane manner (pulling connections for groundless abuse complaints before conferring with the alleged abuser), I sure as hell won't trust them with any computer I use. This is all gee-whiz stuff; they hope that this laptop computer craze will mask all the other problems.
In addition, in woodshop they teach you to insert nails with a hammer, not with your fist. What's wrong with using a tool if it's designed to solve the problem you're attacking?
Instructors are encouraged to integrate laptops into their courses, regardless of whether this integration actually benefits the student, or complements the material of the class. This leads to having online tests, simply to use the laptop. This would be fine, if the online test software functioned properly, which it doesn't. I have seen far more examples of poorly planned integration than I have seen of anything else.
On another rant: With workstations, the school is able to provide support for computing, instead of computers. Everything must be functioning properly on a campus workstation, because it is maintained by campus personell, and it must be available for coursework. Sadly, this doesn't work with laptops. If you have last year's model laptop, and your course demands software preloaded only on this year's model, it is your responsibility to get that software. You become your own sysadmin. This is fine for most computer-oriented people, but the majority of the students in most schools do not need to learn to be system administrators in order to benefit from classes. If your laptop is broken or is stolen (like 10% of last year's laptops), you fight your way through a 5-week backlog to get a repair or replacement.
I'm really sad to hear of the decision in this article. Politicians should not be deciding these things. If you want to see more rants about RPI's laptop program, These Folks do it better than I can.
...These aren't the droids you're looking for....Move along....
Can't let them okies get a jump on ya (like OU's done for the past 4 years)
Chaos maximizes locally around me.
My daughters go to Trinity College School (a boarding school)in Port Hope, Ontario and they are expected to have laptops in Grade 8. The school is very well networked, (eg 2 connections per dorm room, many connections in each classroom, etc.) but I am a bit disappointed in how well the school makes use of the potential. No tutorials for review of teachers' lectures, no possibility of extra courses taken as "distance learning" during study periods. My gess is that most schools miss the same boat, and students learn that their notebooks are nothing but anchors to be toted from class to class.
Like Hemos mentioned, other schools are doing this.. a year or two ago, University of Minnesota Duluth tried to start this up.. (with little success, and a protest by the local ACM chapter)
the problem was they put a bunch of stupid requirements on it. it didn't fly very well, maybe it would work out better today.. but they started with NON-IT courses. I think that was a mistake.
Only a handful of large public campuses, such as the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, require students to use laptops.
Since when? My wife just graduated this year and had no such requirement.
Screw Micro$oft.
Indeed. I was one of the lucky ones to get a terminal port in my room when I was at University (UKC), and I connected up my Amiga. They were quite happy for me to do that, but they wouldn't support it. Of course, that was in days gone by, and the Amiga was effectively being used as a dumb terminal, eventually connected to the LAN via some proprietary hardware. I don't know if they'd allow a direct TCP/IP connection to their LAN (which these days is much bigger).
"The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
No shit someone's getting a kickback. That's probably how my school got Time's "School of the Year 2000" award, but that's how the world works.
Almost every school gets something like this. I go to the University of Southern California, and we have at least four well-stocked 24 hour computer labs. Even at $34,000/year, there isn't enough money to pay the sticker price for all these machines. We have plenty of Dells, Sonys and Suns. I'm guessing that USC was involved in a "kickback" [otherwise known as educational pricing]. I would love to have that Dell Inspiron 4000 added into my tuition. but, then again I don't "refuse to [accept reality] on principle."
-bZj
.sig
-Pencils
-Notebooks
-Dry erase board
-fun tac
-Intel® Pentium® III Processor 700MHz with Intel® SpeedStep(TM) Technology,64MB SDRAM,10GB,2x AGP ATI Mobility-M1 w/8MB SGRAM
The article fails to mention it, but the real idea behind making laptops mandatory is to make relatively expensive licensing of several software packages of Microsoft - and no other company - mandatory.
-cjr
Nova Scotia, Canada, Acadia University, Wolfville.
The Acadia Advantage. Tuition goes up a bit, but every student gets a school laptop loaded with the stuff they need. Classes use the network, and the computer, for various activities. For example:
Math: There's a program called Maple which is an excellent problem solver for nearly every type of math.
Physics: Course information, and lab software is on the network.
Computer Science: Take a wild guess.
Also, CS students get Slackware put on the lap top as well... apparently our C classes will be in Linux.
----
ADVENTURERS! - ANTIHERO FOR HIRE - CARDMASTER CONFLICT
Oh I dunno. I never carried more than a couple notebooks with me, and I didn't have to worry about breaking them in my backpack.
Also, I find (personally!) that writing stuff down by hand allows me to retain the information better than if I'm typing it. Similarly with writing papers, at least the shorter ones. I always prefer to write it out by hand first, scribbling in changes as I go before I type it in. Maybe I'm just a weirdo. :)
Plus I liked to doodle and write disparaging remarks about the prof in the corners in the pages. :)
Sadly, I think they're far more likely to go with the first option.
"The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
at Simon's Rock College, we had ethernet jacks in the lecture halls. The professors usually collected homework at the end of class, and instead of listening to the lecture, I would type my homework and print it to a network printer. The professors all loved me=)
-j
-sigs of the world unite
I can try to use different words to describe it, but I'm poor. I just am. I've never starved, but that's only b/c my mother was awesome.
But, now I go to USC, and it's b/c I busted my ass in school, and got an [almost] full ride. And I went to a crappy high school too, b/c it was the only one in town [not that i could have paid for a better one].
When i graduate and get a job, I plan on donating to my school, so that people who make the grade, but don't have the cash can still go, but I don't want to pay for everybody to go just b/c they think they deserve to.
-bZj
.sig
'Get 'em while they're young,' relatively, will help to speed along the process of making technology common place and mainstream, something good for all of us. Having a girl IR her number from her laptop to yours, mmmm I can see it now.
Regards
I think that program starts this year, if I'm not mistaken.
It starts with incoming freshmen for the 2001-2002 school year. Also, you are correct in that the policy just requires A computer, not a laptop. I still wonder why this is needed. MSU has plenty of computer labs (both PC/Windows and Sun/UNIX). Some of these labs are even open 24 hours a day. Probably just a way for the Computer Store to make money.
Twas written...
"The only conceivable reason to use dlaptops is so they can lug them to classes-"
Cue first lawsuit for back trouble caused by hauling around a 'puter.
Elgon
They dont have any mandate, but what good would it be to give everyone a Linux laptop? Only a very small amount of the students would even know how to use the OS, and I suspect that almost no teachers would be able to use it. If more technically minded people wish to use Linux, then they can install it themselves.
I attend NMU--and the laptop program bites. It's $400 a semester, $2000 if you do the minimum: 2 yrs. lease + 500 purchase, and about $3000 if you just let the lease continue for 4 years (in which case you give it back). (Over-paying.) You get no choice in the laptop--it's a NMU supplied IBM 1200. If you remove Windows, or Office, etc.... that's $500 to put it back. You CAN NOT opt out. You can not purchase another in it's place. Two students in the same home must each get their own. If you return it unopened and unused, you still pay. I'm a CS major--who hasn't used my laptop yet!! I have no use for it, but I'm paying my $2000. And nevermind the price! What about not letting us choose our own laptops? Why can't I just buy my own VIAO? Or use my perfectly fine desktop, which I'm still using for all my schoolwork.
Didn't MIT just ban laptops last year?
I heard they required them once and could't take it anymore--too much trouble.
Public officials want to do anything that appears to be a magic bullet. I'd much rather subsidize teacher salaries than forced laptop purchases. Sounds like some nice deals were made under the table with some laptop manufacturers, who will now make out big time.
</rant>
Not to mention a certain company in Redmond. After all, teachers will no doubt insist that everybody have the same software. Will that software be Mathematica or Excel?
Something is rotten in the state of Massachusetts.
Actually, I probably shouldn't have said 'fad' since it is unlikely this regrettable trend will abate soon. Dell Stock (recalls notwithstanding) anybody?
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You were a moderator with 5 points. You should have read the moderator guidelines before you did any moderating
That's not entirely true. The Boston Globe published an article that said the state colleges of Massachusetts (including UMass) will be requiring laptops for all students. This is not a piece of legislature that affects private colleges. I feel that this is timed wrong because Framingham State students will be required to buy laptops. The buildings there are a dump, and more parking lots desperately need to be built closer to the buildings (currently, it can be up to a mile walk to your assigned parking lot). Good thing my sister is graduating this year; otherwise I'd have to help her with her laptop! Her 486 is enough toil for both of us.
"Ancillary does not mean you get to rule the world." --U.S. Circuit Judge Harry Edwards, speaking to the FCC's lawyer
I think it's total overkill if you are into wearable gear. I'm picturing some dude, wearing a linux-based computer with voice recognition while typing on a mandatory Windows laptop. Maybe the two would be networked, streaming audio from one to the other, while also running mojonation on one of those classroom jacks.
OT: Anyone ever wonder why the hell the secretaries in Ghost in the Shell would need to have 25 fingers on each hand just so that they could type super fast? If they had neural-controlled prosthetics, couldn't they have wired the impulses directly into the computer without that ridiculous nerve-to-motor, motor-to-keyboard, keyboard-to-signal translation?
The thing is that an ancient 286 can still do what it could when it was new. This includes running a rather good word processor (e.g. MS Works or WordPerfect), run sophisticated mathematical simulations (A 12MHz 286 still give a few MIPS).
If you're lucky enough to have a whopping 386, then you can run Linux in text mode. This gives full internet support, and the ability to run a lot of programmes. If a graphical output is needed then you might need a more powerful machine, but really you can get Windows 3.11 for it. It will even run a web browser.
ROTFL! But I completely agree with what you are saying. I also had this experience with my colleagues, and it's really amazing how these LIDs actually manage to graduate. And it's frightening, too
EagerEyes.org: Visualization and Visual Communication
Just thought I'd mention the University of Oklahoma has had this program going for incoming freshman engineering students for two years now (next year it will be required for all undergraduate engineering students). They have also implemented an ever-growing campus wire-less network, which I think is pretty cool.
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This is nothing new nor a new idea. Mass. Universities may be the first in the USA, but this has been going on for at least 3 years at a University here in canada. Acadia University is a school semi close to where I live where all of the students get laptops. Unlike in Mass, they each get one of these laptops as part of their student fess. Therefore eliminating the stolen gear problem.
This allows the students to have a unique learning environment. Instead of computer labs on campus there are ethernet jacks in hallways and in various other places. Also, professors assume that you have access to a computer and this is always a correct assumption. It is much easier to assign assignments by email and know for sure that the computer labs won't be too busy for students to get them.
I don't go to acadia U, because their CS program isn't as good (they are really an artsy school for those who may be interested). But the idea I think is great. As for Mass. U. They may be first in the US, BUT they are not first at all.
If anything, more purvesive laptop use will encourage students to lock there doors more readily and instead of being a great theft threat they will instead INCREASE security.
These are Canadian dollars, BTW.
Yesterday on National Public Radio I heard a report about the cost of an education continuing to rise faster than inflation. It increased 4.5 percent this year. I look at requiring laptops as a way of passing more of the expense on to the student. So if tuition increases and students are required to buy more of their supplies then where is all of the money that the schools are saving and making going?
If I were a student today, I would be protesting the artificially high cost of required texts. This is one of the single biggest costs of education today.
If schools are going to start requiring the use of laptops, I think they can offset the cost of textbooks by also funding the development of electronic textbooks that are owned by the school and don't require a license fee if you are a student.
Better yet, release the textbook under an open source license and encourage other universities to embrace and extend the texts under a compatible license.
I think this would be an excellent use of state monies (paying grad students to write the texts, and professors to edit & review). It would have the effect of reducing the continuing costs of education, and make the $2,000 laptop a much easier pill to swallow.
Screw Micro$oft.
When are we going to get the paradigm shift towards cheaper higher education. I remember hearing about an Arsdigita online university or something that would be free. When are we going to get widespread cheap education? All these universities just make it more and more expensive to go to school and it doesn't make any sense. Imagine being able to take classes online whenever you want for a modest fee. The might not even need to be degree bearing programs, but as long as you learn the info that's all that matters.
I'm at SHU here in sunny old Sheffield, England. Notebooks aren't officially allowed on the network here yet, they were supposed to be this year but the powers that be never got their act together. They were going to implement some scheme where you register your MAC address and get your own IP. This year myself and loads of others at the uni have been acquiring some rather competitvely priced (half price) Dell Inspirons. Of course, we wanted to use them on the network so we just unplug a few of their crappy NT4 / Zennith / Netware f**k ups of desktop nastiness and steal the IPs. It then becomes apparent that the network actually is fairly fast and usable and its just Netware and Zennith etc. which makes it crawl (20 minute logins anyone?). Now we happily surf with near complete anonymity and oodles of speed (all the redhat 7 ISOs in about 20 mins). Now I just wish they'd upgrade to an OC-3 or maybe even 2 ala Manchester. I think we've got an E-3 at the moment. Oh yeah, if you're at Hallam by any chance (god help you) have a browse through the network for a load of win2000 boxes all named after pornstars (mines called Jenna!)
The University of Minnesota, Crookston claims to be "the first campus in the nation to issue laptop computers to all full-time students" according to this site.
Also, I think Winona State University also requires laptops.
The University of Denver, where I am currently an undergrad, is into its second yearlaptop requirenment. So far, the results have been rather mixed. While their Laptops and Learning page gives some examples of how laptops are used in class, the vast majority of students have never had to take their laptop from their dorm rooms. As a response to the "laptop initiative," DU has started modifying a majority of their classrooms to be what they call "smart classrooms." These are basicly classrooms with a network jack and plug for every student. Half the network jacks don't work, and neither do half the plugs, however. And one of these smart classrooms has only 10MBPS ethernet. Good thing the CS class I have in that room doesn't even require that you bring your laptops. For online components, DU is using a system called Blackboard, which is an outsourced system that to me at least still feels like its getting some of the bugs worked out of it. I only have one class that does anything with it, and that professor doesn't do much with it. I also know there were quite a few instances of theft last year, and a lot of student's broke their laptops when they got unknowingly too rough with them. Fortunately, I brought a desktop in adition to my laptop, and that's where I do most of my work.
What are they going to use the laptop FOR?
If the answer is things like "Internet access" or "word processing" or "programming homework" they could just as well (and more cheaply) use desktops. The only conceivable reason to use dlaptops is so they can lug them to classes--but why would you need (or even want) a laptop in class? Imagine the shuffling around as everyone tries to find a (working) power/network outlet. The beeping and "you've got mail!" sounds around the room. The time it takes to do a shutdown when the class is over. The compatibility problems (student/student, student/teacher, student/administration, student/self).
If they want to be "interactive" why even attend classes? Just do video conferencing right to the dorms on desktops. Attendence would skyrocket.
--
An abstained vote is a vote for Bush and Gore.
Non-meta-modded "Overrated" mods are killing Slashdot
(Hey Ryan! Here's your proof!)
This is truly a stupid idea. What's the point, exactly? To boost Dell's sales? Hell, I'm a computer professional (a damn successful one, if I do say so myself), and I don't have a laptop. Why? I don't need one! Why do college kids? What is the possible benefit of typing notes as opposed to writing them? Is it so that they can be entertained with porn while they're in class? This seems like a totally brainless decision on the part of the University's administration.
Here at NMU, the computer labs were ripped out, laptops where forced down our throats for $400 a month, and the college saves by not having labs while making a hefty profit on the over-priced laptops.
The NMU President just got a 45,000(?) bonus for her "good work." Yeah, she's doing this for us...
This might not be a good thing, IFF the students stop thinking and just become LIDs (Living Input Devices).
A case study: when I was in undergraduate engineering school (1983-1987), many if not most of the students had HP-CV calculators with the engineering formula add-on pack. I had a TI-35. During one test in Circuits II, I dropped my calculator, and the keyboard came apart, scattering the keys over the floor. I re-assembled my calculator, and still managed to complete the test before anybody else in the class (and get one of the highest scores on the test.)
Why was I able to complete the test? Because I had the good fortune to have had a high school teacher who beat it into my brain to solve the equations first, then crunch the numbers. Most of my classmates just started plugging the numbers into the equations, then taking the resulting numbers and plugging them into the next set of equations, et cetera.
By actually doing the algebra, I was able to reduce out all the pi's, root-2's, and so forth, and come up with simple equations that were far more accurate than the results of the other students. And since I had to type far fewer numbers into my calculator, I was far faster than they were. Finally, since I actually saw what happened in the circuit ("Ah! so that resistor doesn't effect the output voltage, because I just cancelled it out of the equation!"), I had a deeper understanding of the theory.
My point is, that while a computer is a great tool for many things (I shan't tell you about taking my Atari 800 and monitor into my Linear algebra class to run my Gaussian Elimination program on the final....) it must not become a substitute for thinking. I fear that the students in this school won't learn to do algebra (rather they will just use Mathcad student's edition), won't learn to spel korrecktly, and not will grammer learn ("It looks like you are writing a term paper. Would you like to cut and paste some text from Encarta?").
www.eFax.com are spammers
I was meaning they wouldn't steal one in order to do their school work. Of course there will always be those trying to make a grand here and there.
This program has merit but this is a lot of money on something that could backfire. Here are some ways:
Actually, University of Minnesota, Crookston has been doing this since 1993, with quite a bit of success. Being a former student/help desk guy from there, it's great. Check them out at http://www.crk.umn.edu
But who's gonna pay for the repairs? Betcha it ain't gonna be the good 'ol university.
managers...why god invented purgatory
Mandatory laptops is a bad policy all around, and is used as a fund-raiser and a way to offload work from professors.
At my friend's med school, they instituted a mandatory laptop policy. Lucky for my friend, it only applies to students who are enrolling after my friend's year.
Students get to pay $1000 a year for a 600mhz laptop, for 4 years. After the 4 years is up, they have the option to pay another $200 and keep the laptop. The upside is that during the 4 years, if the school decides to upgrade the laptops, the students get upgraded to a newer, faster, laptop for free. Also, they get tech support with the $1000/year.
$4200 is too damn much for a laptop.
The medical school is trying to raise money for expansion. Instead of taking it out of tuition money, they decide on this laptop policy to raise funds.
They're also trying to move the lessons online, so that profs don't have to tire themselves out with the students as much.
WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY THINKING? Do you want a doctor who learned his stuff in an online course?
I bought a Dell Inspiron 3700 in August, and I've been using it in my course for all lectures this year. I know it's not THE nicest one on the market (or actually off the market and this stage), but it was all that I could afford allowing it to have a DVD movie player ;)
In all my university, I am among the very few who are doing this - the only one in my class. I find it convenient. I'm doing an Electronic Engineering course and there's a good bit of text which I'm better off using the computer for because I write real slow and can type fast. The diagrams are easy to get down with Microsoft Word's built in tools. I've also got a quick way of getting mathematical formulaes and symbols down. Unfortunately, it has crashed 3 times this year already. I get some I told you so looks from other students, and had to use a pen and paper until class was over! My University (UCD - Dublin) did not let me connect the computer to the college network (only staff and post graduates get to do it), so I have to use the campus computers for internet - everything including e-mail gets saved to Zip disk for transfer to Laptop. Overall I'm sticking with it. I'll have to study on the computer screen because the reason I'm doing this is to have no paper cluttering up my place (I won't print them out near the end). It's heavy for a laptop, but I get it into class alright. Although, the carrier bag Dell gave me is far from ideal to use when cycling - it cuts off the blood circulation to the side of the body it's leaning on!
If anyone is about to do the same thing, I'd like to help them out. I've got a website I'll be making for a few weeks on laptop use in lectures, url below. I searched the net and didn't find anything relevant - I'm sure that there must be, so is anybody aware of sites that have already done this? I'd welcome any suggestions(and comments) to add to the site.
Cheers,
Benny
benny@irishstudent.com
http://www.netsoc.ucd.ie/~benny/index.htm (Under construction)
Several public universities in Canada have been requiring laptops from as far back as 1996. Entire campuses have been fitted out with places for students to plug in, view class notes, homework assignments, and email in completed assignments.
A prime example would be Acadia University. The laptops have become an integral part of how the university operates.
All laptops are fully insured in case they get stolen, and the cost (a leasing fee, with option to buy out after graduation and NOT a full-cost upfront buy) is tax-deductible because its included with the tuition. In addition, there are many bursery programs for students who need financial aid.
All in all, the results for Acadia have been incredible. It went from being just a 'party school' to having some of the top undergraduate programs in the country within a few years of introducing the laptop requirements.
For more information, check out the Acadia Advantage site.
If the universities in the States follow the example set by Acadia, the laptops will be a serious edge for their students. And god knows that in today's economy, we can use any edge we can get.
Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo - H. G. Wells
I know that here at CMU there are at least two classes which give out a computer for the semester...
One of these is a Multimedia Information Processing class where every student is given a laptop which they use during class and for their projects. The class is taught in a room with power and ethernet at every seat and it is therefore not a logistical nightmare. The laptops are returned at the end of the semester and given to the next class...
Other classes have started to utilize our wireless network by giving out Jornada's for the semester... again, its something that is easy (preconfigured wireless settings usually) and is returned at the end of the semester...
It seems to me that these more "need-based" programs make a lot more sense than just giving EVERYBODY a laptop.
Josh
Incoming students for this year and last year have been required to purchase laptops. The laptop required has been some flavor of IBM ThinkPad. Last year it was a 600e. This year it was a T20. Since the school was buying ~1500 at a time, they got a good deal on them. But there's a lot of infrastructure that has to be in place first.
:)
RPI's repair group is on anywhere from a 3-5 week backlog and although there are loaners, the loaners are generally all in use. They've been expanding the staff, but remember: we're only 1/2 way done with every student getting a laptop. If they double the repair staff and the loaners in the next two years, it's a holding action - they'll still be on the same backlog.
There's been precious little actual curriculum reform at RPI. Maple is state-of-the-art in math classes and concerns about actually knowing the material have been raised and stomped on here. They've actually started offering courses over streaming video that were taped a year and a half ago and being replayed. Progress? I don't think so but they didn't ask me.
The UNIX workstations in the labs (O2s, RS6000s, Suns) have been taken out and replaced by tables with power and network jacks. Yes, they've got a uniform computing environment, but at what cost? It's Microsoft Campus 2000 here with some notable exceptions (the recent FreeBSD and Linux installfests). The school has basically pushed the cost of maintaining labs on to the students.
We were supposed to have software parity - but the student who purchased the 600es last year got Maple 5. The students who got the T20s got Maple 6. Now, the students with Maple 5 are being "given" the opportunity to upgrade to Maple 6 for $50 apiece. This problem with software licensing has wound up kicking RPI in the butt more times than they can count conveniently.
The biggest problem with all of this is that none of the faculty or schools decided to start a laptop program: their Admissions offices did. It's a bullet point on a brochure. "We're better preparing your kid for the 21st century because we're requiring that they buy a laptop to come here." Unfortunately all the important stuff like curriculum reform, infrastructure upgrades, and new support staff hiring comes way after the fact - and it's too little too late.
"the university is implementing a laptop program that will ensure students and faculty have a standard set of tools (hardware and software) that meet a majority of their computing and telecommunications needs"
You know that this means they are going to be using M$ products.. if it were *nix, it'd say "ALL of their computing and telecommunications needs"
I have a question, though.. will this result in lowered tuition? A recent article talked about how in a few years, PC sales in the US will drop to practically 0.. do you think that programs like this will make an impact on that, in a way that the distributors and OEMs are willing to.. uh.. reward the state's government?
No offense to you people out there that actually use them to their full extent, but I would be pretty irked to be told that I had to buy a laptop. In essense, a laptop will always be a few steps below a desktop in terms of features and always a few steps higher than a desktop in price. Forcing your average student to buy one is silly. We all know how many friends and co-workers own a laptop and never use them on the road for anything more than email and solitaire. What a waste of money...
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Let me give you the lowdown
I am in the process of getting a daughter through CMU's computer science program. She was advised NOT to buy a computer until she had been there for awhile. The school has numerous large clusters and the students hang-out in the clusters doing homework and socializing. She did but an Apple laptop that is setup to dual boot in MacOS 9 or Linux. This matches here interest in art and computer science. My point was CMU computer support group had no problem with her setup. So here was one major school saying wait awhile, and saying the choice it yours. I would be interested in the policies at MIT.
I just graduated from Umass-Amherst without the support of either of my parents, paying for school mainly with government loans and working my ass off during the summers...and just barely being able to make tution and fees each year. i couldn't fathom having to find $2k more to buy myself a non-upgradible computing device, especially if i already owned a desktop.
what requiring the ownership of a laptop does is prevent educational access to underprivledged poorer familes who already have enough of a problem gaining educational access.
the article does state that the school would provide vouchers and assistance, but once again, when school is being paid for entirely through loans, having to take another $2k in loans out to buy a comptuer is a slap in the face.
Massachusetts' public education system is already underfunded thanks to the large population of private schools and due to decisions in the leadership of the state university systems, affirmative action has already been dismantled.
AN EDUCATION IS NOT A PRIVLEDGE OF THE RICH WHITE CLASSES, BUT A RIGHT FOR EVERYONE.
ey. isn't this very old? in sweden there is a school that "gives" out laptops to the students. and they have to use it :)
Here at MSU, laptops are required for engineering students in certain classes (the first of which is thermodynamics, usually taken sophomore year). And if I'm not mistaken, I think next year entering freshman engineering students will be required to have a laptop.
Some of the stuff teachers do with the machines is pretty neat. And I suppose for the non-computer literate engineering students - particularly those who have never owned a computer - they probably learn a good bit. But most of the time people are on Napster, playing video games, or talking to people.
I never really did think the integration of computers in the educational process was done the right way. It might work in mid to upper-level college courses (e.g. using Maple for calculus), but my former high school once considered requiring students to have laptops. Bad idea, I'm glad it never became a reality. We need to emphasize the traditional way of doing things now and let students explore other ways of doing them on their own (perhaps by a trip to the school computer lab).
-- "Complacency is a far more dangerous attitude than outrage." -Naomi Littlebear
During my time at Michigan State, they adopted a policy similar to this one. At first they required laptops for all incoming students, but then they decided that was probably inconvenient for many people, and instead just required a computer of some sort. I think that program starts this year, if I'm not mistaken.
If everybody had the time and the desire to learn how to use one properly (not to mention the money to buy one), it could be great. But, in reality, a lot of people are going to be wasting a lot of money. There are still just too many people that are either incapable or consider themselves incapable of learning how to use a computer even close to it's full potential. I think for now they (universities) should worry about replacing the old 486's they still have in many of their computer labs. That way students can use them as they need them, and don't have to worry about upkeep. And seriously, what would an astro-turf major, or a hotel & restaurant management major *really* need a computer for??
"It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it."
Time is fun when you're having flies.
-Kermit the Frog
I have a feeling that universities are battling over each other for being the most technologically advanced.
I'm a student at a big name university (or thats what my friends say)where laptops are recommended and I think the idea of required laptops for students is a big hassle.
First, there is theft. It will happen and it will lead to consequences that both, the university and students don't want to see.
Secondly, it's not easy carrying it around...even if concealed in a bookbag, you instantly become a $2000+ moving object.
Third, laptops are a big distraction when utilized in classes since students will be tempted to use Napster, messenger, play games, etc.
And finally, laptops aren't so durable and I can't imagine how many TFT screen replacements would be made.
not a wise move people
Masta G
------sorry for grammer/spelling, english is my 2nd language
IIRC, Dartmouth's been requiring students to purchase computers for at least 7 years now.
The Nizkor Project"The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person's actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position..... This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because attacking a distorted version of a position simply does not constitute an attack on the position itself. One might as well expect an attack on a poor drawing of a person to hurt the person."
Stephen's Guide"The author attacks an argument which is different from, and usually weaker than, the opposition's best argument. "
and finally, A Prof's Website"Straw Man occurs when an opponent takes the original argument of his/her adversary and then offers a close imitation, or straw man, version of the original argument; "knocks down" the straw man version of the argument (because the straw man, as its name implies, is a much easier target to hit, undermine, etc.) -- and thereby gives the appearance of having successfully countered/overcome/answered the original argument."
How I do love strawmen, but I'm off to find the wizard, the wonderful wizard of OZ, a wonderful wiz, if ever there iz, the wonderful wizard of Oz.
USA-Democracy is 270 million YESes and NOes a day, not one every four years.
I wonder what tasks require them to have normal laptops. For all of my studies, a PDA (with a keyboard, so it's a "palmtop") and a desktop machine are more than enough.
Having worked at one of the UMass campuses for a number of years, they are yet again forgetting an important factor:
Who is going to support all these people with laptops?
They don't have the staff to handle the network needs. They don't have the staff to handle all the problem reports. They don't have the staff to train the less-technically-inclined.
Glad to be out in the real world now where there is at least a budget...
rm
Sci-Fi Storm
Hmmm...I was required to purchase a PC when I entered the EE program in 1987.
Your monitor is staring at you.