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KDE 2.2 Tagged
ByTor-2112 writes "According to dot.kde.org, KDE 2.2 has been tagged out. Awesome." Plans were originally to release 2.2 today, but scheduled release is now next Monday, to allow some time for more stability/speed work. 2.2 rocks my world. Excellent work on the part of all the KDE developers. Other dates mentioned are 2.2.1 in September, and opening work up on 3.0, which will hopefully come out at the beginning of 2002.
or are they now "it"?
Nope, not me, I must be someone else...
All my karma are belong to your -1 Trolls!
--------
Bleah! Heh heh heh... BLEAH BLEAH!!! Ha ha ha ha...
I find Qt much prettier than Gtk+ in its default looks.. and it has wonderful styles.. Gtk+ has nice themes too, but it all looks very.. hmm.. dull, after moving to KDE/Qt :)
This is exactly why we have switched to Suse from RedHat. RedHat KDE packaging is very disappointing, so we decided to switch all our 4 Linux PCs to SuSe since we have decided to use KDE as desktop. We are frankly very satisfied with Suse 7.2 and I would not go back to RH.
Funny thing: you got blasted for what is essentially the truth.
/. into what many of its critics claim: a place where you are only respected for towing the company line.
I used to be able to rely on moderation. It used to work. Now the moderators seem to be turning
Anyway, screw it. I've had a +2, I've hit the karma cap. May as well have some fun on the way down.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
Qt is not. Check before assuming that just because some portions of the desktop are LGPL that the entire thing is.
You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
more installation packages should be set up in such a way that they can be installed as NON-ROOT, goddammit.
not only is this totally insecure, but all users without root access are utterly fucked when they want to install some custom software and
configure --prefix=${HOME}
does not happen to work.
check your speling
So you're saying that when I click on a Nautilus window, and I see something happening, that that's just fake because Nautilus actually didn't respond on that click? Ha ha ha, that's funny!
Nautilus is a *file manager*, not a menu editor, not a shortcut editor or whatever. And now you're complaining because Nautilus can't do more than what it's supposed to do?
If you don't like Nautilus, don't use it. You can just uninstall Nautilus while keeping GNOME 1.4, unlike what all the trolls claim.
Heck, you can even run Konqueror and all your KDE programs fine in GNOME, so what's your problem?
Stop bitching about things and either go use Konqueror or go help the Nautilus developers.
:-)
I'm updating my installs the day it is released, just like I did with GNOME.
Apologies to any GNOME entusiasts for the comment. I like GNOME. I like GTK+. I like puppies, but not as much as GTK+.
I love KDE, it's what inspired me to move away from Windows and start using Linux. The interface is very nice and stable, and it has a lot of style. Pretty funny how Windows XP seems to steal some of their features uh? Wonder what is in store for us in 3.0??? -Shade "The art of flying is to throw yourself at the ground and miss." -Douglas Adams
No, it's an easily verifiable fact. Check here for a discussion why.
KDE-2.2 is quite a lot (noticably) faster than KDE-2.1.1. Especially file management is a lot faster now, but also configuration dialogs and so on. Not as fast as Win95, but fast enough to feel snappy (on my P-ii-300).
If you are interested in startup speed, check out the objprelink hack for C++ projects, that was just recently done for KDE. It improves startup times of KDE apps by 30-50 % and might also be of use for OpenOffice, Mozilla and other large C++ applications. Of course it is just a hack until real (stable) prelinking in gcc is available. Note: This has not been included to KDE-2.2 by default, because it arrived during the feature freeze. Hopefully your packager will use this or just follow the step-by-step instructions yourself. It is easy and works like advertised. :-)
Have fun KDE folks!
Moritz
I'm a little unclear (despite the low UID): are a flamebaiter and a troll the same thing?
If so, call me a troll.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
Great. I'm very glad to see that KDE is making headway. (Now if they'd just fix the minor security hole in their screensavers...) I'll be upgrading my Linux desktop for 2.2 pretty soon.
I just wish installing KDE on Solaris was as simple. Non-Linux situations just don't receive as much attention as they need to if KDE is really going to live up to its cross-platform promise. I've converted some of my Solaris users to KDE on the strength of the 1.1.2 release alone; if I can give them 2.2 on the SPARCs as soon as it appears on the x86s, I'll have won them over, I think. :-)
(They really like browsing the contents of a tar file in Konqueror. But they still laugh when the "system information" screen complains that it can't find the IRQs in use, or the game controllers, or any of the other all-the-world's-a-PC things. Enh, it's a start...)
You cannot apply a technological solution to a sociological problem. (Edwards' Law)
Its very easy to demand things from a technology you seem to know nothing about. Maybe you should go and learn how difficult things are, and then come back and if you really dislike it go and program it yourself
You simply must spend time diggin through all that 2.2 offers before offering an opinion on it. The depth of available features are astounding.
:-)
For example, I *love* how finegrained Konqueror's support for cookie and javascript is. You can specify particular sites that allowed to run javascript, to the exculsion of all others.
Kasbar, the newly spiffed up task switcher, pop up a scaled down screenshot of the app whose icon your mouse is hovering over. This makes it WAY easier to pick the web browser windows you REALLY meant.
Konqueror's support for file-data-as-the-icon has truly matured. It renders text, html, pics, postscript and pdf, alphablending in the normal icon underneath the data. Sweet and really effective for me.
KMail gives surprising good control of mail. Some of the options make procmail unecessary, except for really advanced stuff. ANd it supports IMAP now.
Konsole may be a bit bulky for a shell, but I love having a menu listing all my nachines on the network, giving me one click ssh to them, all in one manageable window.
How many times have you seen a newbie click the icon to launch a program, get tired of waiting for it to come up, and click it again? Of course, two copies get launched, confusing the user. Well, KDE now "attaches" the 16x16 icon of th program you asked to launch to the mouse cursor, throbbing gently until the app comes up. this gives *useful* feedback to the user. Not only does it tell them that something is happening(which an hourglass can do), but it tells them what is being launched, boosting their confidence.
The kicker can now take up less than the full screen. The default is not to have a handle on the left, making good use of Fitt's law; slam the mouse to the lower left and you are *sure* to get the Start Menu when you click.
KDE is full of wonderful touches. Keep digging, you'll be pleasantly surprised, constantly
poor little dot server. it goes down for like a week or something, and now it's being slashdotted.
maybe they should switch to an IIS server
if you think that was anything other than a joke, kill yourself; you're stealing my oxygen
We dance to all the wrong songs.
--Refused.
KDE Libraries are released under LGPL. Check before making conclusions.
Eleknader
Shame on me :-)
It's a known issue and will be fixed for KDE 2.2.1. If you have a nice idea what a "find"-icon should look like then send your idea to icons@kde.org
Greetings,
Tackat
In AmigaOS you could set the program that opens an file on a per file basis.
I haven't used it for years, but if it still worked the way it did back then, HTML files would get a default browser, but you could bring up the File Info dialog and change it.
Don't worry, it will normally be there soon enough in unstable/testing which is actually as usable as any other Debian around, provided you remember to apt-get on a regular basis...
But, hey, are there still decent geeks using the "stable" Debian?
Trolling using another account since 2005.
Just out of curosity, why did you switch?
Admit nothing, deny everything and make counter-accusations.
I have programmed Gnome in Perl, and it was fun. I have not programmed KDE/QT, so I cannot comment there at all. Glade is a great GTK+ GUI creation tool which I have had fun with as well.
But the best thing for a developer is to not have to cut and paste hundreds of lines of C to emulate C++ classes. Also QT is cross platform, so developing in QT using KDevelop will have more benefits than developing in Glade + gIDE etc.
Still, each to his own. :)
All of these features are plugins to konqueror, except for the previews. Its also easy to add plugins to the editor, kate, in KDE, and takes suprisingly few lines of code to write a new plugin.
KDE has to turn around and chase Gnome till it tag's it? It Miquel's house "base?"
Just wanted to correct a couple minor factual errors. Gtk+ is very portable, with standard ports running on Windows, BeOS and I think MacOS (9 + X?). I would also strongly suggest everyone to look into GOB, which allows you to define gtk+ objects with a very java like syntax, its pretty slick.
got drum'n'bass?
http://mp3.com/vitriolix
I really really am. I use GNOME and have virtually ignored KDE with extreme prejudice. I know it is rather small-minded of me but at least I admit it.
I love the progress that KDE has been making. It has been steady and strong. I love the sane orderly and approach that KDE has taken from the beginning.
Originally, I hated KDE because of the non GPL issue. Now that is resolved. Next I hated it because it lacked nice eye candy. There have been terrific improvements in the theming department though there is more to go before it wins me over. I still don't like the lack of choice in window managers but I'm having second thoughts on that position since by only having one WM, more uniform configurability is possible.
I still hate that seemingly everything has an inappropriate use of "K" in there somewhere. Of course GNOME stuff is prone to the same problem, but you have to understand, I'm in the U.S. and it reminds us of K-Mart... bleah... white trash... too much associative crap associated with "K" words.
Just the other day I was wishing KDE and GNOME would just merge.
And where is GNOME's promised 2.0 release!?!? I'm getting seriously disillusioned. I think when I install this RedHat 7.2(beta) I'll give KDE a try... nothing new for me to see with the GNOME 1.4 there anyway.
Damnit Miguel?!?! What happened to the enthusiasm and momentum?! Put your marketting hat on!
He could move the find button to another position on the toolbar (not squarely beside the magnifying buttons). That should reduce the confusion quite a bit...
-adnans
"In short: just say NO TO DRUGS, and maybe you won't end up like the Hurd people." --Linus Torvalds
I also, for no particular reason, feel that GNOME is more lightweight than KDE. I have no evidence to back this up.
If anecdotal evidence is any indication, I do.
Under just X and Windowmaker on a 400MHz CPU and 384 MB RAM, under no other load at all, Pan 0.9.90 (Gnome-based Usenet client) takes about two seconds to start up. KNode from KDE 2.2 beta 1 (another Usenet client of similiar size and featureset) takes one and a half minutes to start up.
Take a wild guess which desktop environment I don't even keep around for the libraries anymore.
And yes, I know the reason for why KDE apps are slow to load under a non-KDE desktop, so nobody bother flaming me about it.
It's been a long, long time since I used my Amiga (I doubt I could even find all the bits now), so I'll trust you on that one.
:)
However, being able to open some files in one app and others in another wasn't what I was nay-saying. I interpreted the original point literally - ie that the poster wanted to be able to "say" to his computer "do this for me" as though speaking to a human. That's (probably) the Holy Grail of HCI - enabling people to literally say to their machine "reopen that letter I was working on last night, bring up Slashdot, oh and start an email to my brother...".
Rereading it, I probably did misread it, but s/he did say "I'd like to be able to say..."
Cheers,
Tim
It's official. Most of you are morons.
Damn! Just when I realized (thanks bero!) that there will be no 2.2 beta packages for Redhat and went ahead and installed the CVS snapshots from Roswell (and a long train of dependencies along with them), now they had to release the final. Aargh...
Yeah, it's great now, I use it full time!"
This sort of short update schedule, etc. is great. I've always like that about OpenBSD (new version every 6 months) and if I remember correctly, Linus had made comments about trying to get the Kernel on that type of track as well.
Fewer "massive" changes that take 2 years to complete and more "evolutionary" style.
Whatever happened to that idea? (Officially)
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
Of course. Even up by pressing the up arrow for a a while. /usr/*/*/*/*)
(nice if you are deep do2n in
Moritz
Well, that just proofs that more and more people are using Mozilla. If Mozilla were already useable for them 18 months ago, then Mozilla is perfect for them by now.
Funny? I obviously agree with that.
Flamebait? Okay, in retrospect, probably.
Overrated? Okay, now that is the moderation of a karma whore, afraid to get fucked in M2.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
Fewer lines of code != more logical, powerful, easy to use structure. Sorry.
Let me refine that : a language which lets you express the same logical pattern with fewer lines of code is more powerful. The bulk of the discussion was about derivation. The other guy claimed that it's just as easy to derive a class with GTK+ than with C++. Do you really think it's just as easy to cut'n paste a hundred lines than to just type "class Foo : public Bar" ?
For your needs QT is the best thing out there. For some people, C based OO systems like those used in Max/MSP, PD and Gtk+ are the best answer.
I'm not sure we are talking about the same thing here. I'm not taking specific requirements into consideration where for some reason you can't use Qt. I'm talking about how GTK+ and Qt compare in general. If for some reason you need to use GTK+, then fine. But that doesn't make it as easy to use as Qt. If you don't know or don't like C++ and Qt, and prefer to use GTK+, that still doesn't mean you're just as efficient as someone who uses C++ and Qt (unless he's a terrible programmer of course).
Sorry, counting lines of code is no proof for "ease" and power of a programming environment... if that were true visual basic would rain king.
I don't know VB so I can't talk too much about it, but given its usage rate and what you can do with just a couple hundred lines of code, yes, it seems that it's quite a powerful programming langage.
Ease of use is a subjective thing.
In some cases may be, where your own background warps your point of view (like you've been using the same language for so long that you can't learn anything else). But I fail to see how, needing 100 lines of code with language A and needing only 1 in language B to do the same thing can be "subjective".
it isn't gtk, and it starts with a J
OK, you're a Java programmer. Now suppose someone claims that it's just as easy to derive a class with GTK+ as with Java. Or that memory management is just as easy in C++ as in Java. Would you agree with those claims ?
Yes, any C++ application on Linux is slow to start up due to symbol relocation in linking, and the weak support for C++ in the GNU toolchain, from compiler to linker.
Strange that Mozilla, StarOffice / OpenOffice are all C++, all slow to start up.
Fwiw, I use Knode from CVS and it runs in ~8 seconds from a twm based X session, no other KDE desktop tools running. On a machine with twice the Mhz and half the RAM.
The excessive load time is probably misconfigured DNS, btw.
It is quite easy with kwin:
RMB on title bar, Save Settings. This saves geometry settings. AS for starting on a certain desktop, well most users would be confused if the app they just started appears on a different desktop, so apps always start on the desktop where you clicked.
Also session management restores all apps on the right desktop.
Have a look at kstart, you can customize the start behaviour of all applications with this command line tool.
e.g.:
kstart --desktop 4 --ontop xosview
Moritz
Recent RPMs available at ftp://ftp.redhat.com somewhere in the rawhide directory
Collapsing GNOME apps? There must be something wrong with your configuration, because most of us don't experience that problem.
Great timing with this release. I figure by the time my infant gets into college, this'll show up in Debian stable.
(Blah, blah, blah. I use Progeny. Now go away Debian flamers, it's a joke.)
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
You're asking for things to be changed (directory structure, command names, etc) that are absolutely nothing to do with, and therefore beyond the control of, the KDE team.
:) The only thing I'm aware of that uses it is Enlightenment 0.17 and it's file manager, but I've not yet managed to get that compiled and running (only tried briefly during a quiet period at work)
If you dislike that many fundamental things about Linux that much, then it simply isn't the right OS for you.
Point 4) simply isn't possible right now, on any platform I've ever heard of. Sorry, but you're at least a decade ahead of us there.
5) is actually being worked on - for more information, go to http://oss.sgi.com/projects/fam for more information. Note though that this project is in development, and requires you to patch and recompile your kernel - more unintuitive stuff, I'm afraid
Cheers,
Tim
It's official. Most of you are morons.
I just LOVE vladinator's site! Especially the "fash" section, where I learned to cut the bottom off of an old shirt to use as a hair enhancement! Oh, and the "dance party" photos!
Of course, don't forget to read vladinator's emails! Here you will discover how truly difficult it is to decide what to do on the weekends... have a pizza party? A fash party? Go to the mall with all of your friends? Have a sleepover and call boys on the phone?
In short, if you haven't checked out vladinator's site, you don't know what you're missing!
Actually, I can't remember, it was about 2 years ago I think. I don't think I switched from KDE to GNOME though, I think I switched to Afterstep, or E.
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
Everyone is talking about how good KDE is. Maybe I'll try it. I want to list a few of the biggest hangups I have with UI's that I hope KDE or someone else would address 1) bottom line everything should be fast and responsive. Wanna switch between many apps? Should be no problem. Apps should launch instantly 2) a directory system that makes sense. Everything should make should be in its place: apps shouldn't touch a "Windows" folder. A "bin" is where you put garbage-not files. Come on guys 3) I understand the idea of a commandline but what we have now is either inadequate (DOS) or completely unintuitive (bash). Come on like I'm supposed to figure out that 'ls' lists the directory? What the heck is 'grep' supposed to be? Please use or refer to real English words or even better-make it localizable so the rest of the world can be more productive. 4) I would like to be able to say "I want mozilla to open all my html files except pistachio.html and everything in the webwork folder. I want Go Live Pro to open those" 5) kill the refresh button/menu option. If something is updated I want to see it immediately
---
There is no one true tool. Different people think and organise logical structure in different ways, this is why there are always 20 answeres to a problem in the programming world. The number of lines it takes to express a concept is a really bad measure of the ease of expression, for every line of code you write, you should be spending an order of magnitude more time planning, thinking, designing. Therefore the most important feature of a development environment is how it's logical structures sync up with your own methods of organizing and thinking. Many people find C to be much more efficient and logical that C++. Many find Python, or SmallTalk to be the be-all-end-all ... personally, I find that Java and Gtk+ have moved me the most. The most important factor is how the environment connects with the individual programmer.
got drum'n'bass?
http://mp3.com/vitriolix
I love fighting with KDE/QT supporters ; )
Seriously, the main fight between KDE and Gnome users seems to be over look/feel despite the way people argue over technical issues. Personally, I think that's how it should be, a GUI is supposed to make things easier, and look/feel is(from a user perspecitve, which is the most important perspective) the biggest issue.
So, I'll say again, GTK is prettier! ; )
In all seriousness, ANYTHING is better than windows! ; )
Personally, I would love it if Gnome and KDE merged and were completely compatible and you could use either GTK or QT look/feel, but technically that would be quite difficult...
hmmm... time to STFU, I'm slightly inebriated...
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
I just LOVE vladinator's site! Especially the "fash" section, where I learned to cut the bottom off of an old shirt to use as a hair enhancement! Oh, and the "dance party" photos!
Of course, don't forget to read vladinator's emails! Here you will discover how truly difficult it is to decide what to do on the weekends... have a pizza party? A fash party? Go to the mall with all of your friends? Have a sleepover and call boys on the phone?
In short, if you haven't checked out vladinator's site, you don't know what you're missing!
KDE now follows the "tag-team" style of development.
GNU FOR LIFE!
this sig limit is too small to put anything good h
Does this finally mean KDE is stable? any x.0 release seems to be pretty beta in the KDE way of doing things.
(not meaning to troll, this was just a serious observation from my experiences with KDE)
I am runing 2.2 beta and here are some new things that I discovered in konqueror:
An interesting (and very usefull) feature is that Konqueror will show the HTML DOM Tree, therefore making much easier to study a document structure.
Another very important tool is the web archive (something I've been waiting for a long time) - it makes you a tar with a html and all the pictures, a complete web page (Opera had this also but it didn't compress). Web archives can be opened directly in konqueror.
You can validate html's directly from konqueror toolbar, and from the same toolbar you can use babelfish to translate pages.
In the file manager you can see thumbnails of ps and pdf pages now, (up to 2.2 you could see html, text and images).
Sorin M
hey...are admin macros patched for objprelink or must I do it by myself? objprelink really boosted application startup times and I _really_ like it.
There is no one true tool.
I don't claim that. I claim that for a given problem (here, desktop application programming), some tools are better than others.
Many people find C to be much more efficient and logical that C++.
Yes, I agree. But again : that doesn't make them as efficient as someone else who's using C++ efficiently. They still have to type more code and to pay attention to more details.
personally, I find that Java and Gtk+ have moved me the most.
You haven't answered my question about Java. Suppose I claim that any C programmer can achieve the same work as you in Java, in the same amount of time, and with the same level of quality. Would you agree ?
Um... thanks for that link to a a discussion of opinions... maybe you need to take a basic english coure to understand the complexity of that word. By definition, the simplicity of a method is based on subjective opinion, and unfortunately for your silly argument, thousands of coders disagree with you and think that gtk+ is a joy to work with. Deal with it.
got drum'n'bass?
http://mp3.com/vitriolix
For more information on KDE, the release and support for 2.2, please visit irc.openprojects.net #kde-users. For anyone interested in the development path that we'll be taking in the future, discussions about that will happen on the mailing lists (lists.kde.org) and #kde. Please do not fill #kde with support related questions... go to #kde-users for that if possible. Thanks, and enjoy the release. Troy Unrau troy@kde.org
why would that happen, and how could that happen? i just reviewed the feature list, and it didn't look like much to me.
-- Betting on the survival of the media industry is a serious risk. I advise investing elsewhere.
I can't find any. Can someone relpy with some links for all?
Thanks.
Anyone have screen shots? I'd like to know what my desktop would LOOK like. KDE doesn't seem to have any for 2.2, or even any information regarding it. Thanks.
Emacs: for people who just never know when to
Mandrake's distro is trailored for quite seamless use of KDE. RedHat is not and, frankly, I've been disappointed in RedHat's KDE offering to the point where I dropped it. Of course, now they're going to take it more seriously, but I'm still tired of RH and their crap.
I really was surprised at how KDE got to look with version 2.1. i usully used Gnome because the earlyer KDEs took up to much screen-space and was too slow. But the constant colapsing of Gnome apps got me so tired that i decided to give up the extra space for kde. I just like what i got going now and have been looking forward to this next release for a long time. I am really hoping for speed increesments and stabilityenhancements in koffice
There isn't much like the scent of a fresh harddisk
I agree with you. I too still cling to GNOME, mostly because I have contributed small amounts of code (The GNOME Stock Ticker.. whoopteedoo) and because I still have a bias for GNOME/GTK look and feel.
.GNU/Mono thing makes me sick to my stomach.
I also, for no particular reason, feel that GNOME is more lightweight than KDE. I have no evidence to back this up.
Honestly, at this point, the only reason I am still using GNOME is that I couldn't find Solaris Packages of KDE. (Oh, and that "One, Two, Three, Four" business on the KDE Panel reminds me too much of CDE. I like the GNOME pager better.
So... yeah. It's becoming increasingly difficult to ignore that KDE is miles ahead of GNOME - TODAY. Ximian was a great thing for GNOME, but the whole
A disillusioned, lightly battered, glazed and stir-fryed General Tao.
--- Tao
Just give me the libraries for KDE so I can continue to run the programs in their new and improved form on my AfterStep desktop.
Yes, even with 1.x Ghz CPU and 1 Gig RAM, KDE is still a pain and I don't particularly like the way it's set up. If I wanted to run Windows, I would. I LIKE my 18 desktops and low overhead of Afterstep and the automount thing is a pain in the neck when you're running VMWare. I'm sure you can turn it off, but is that not what Linux is good for, the choices?
But, the libraries are great, then you can run the programs without the KDE overhead.
DanH
Cav Pilot's Reference Page
UNIX - Not just for Vestal Virgins anymore
Python is also developed this way. It allows fairly large changes to be introduced in a short amount of time.
I can't spell or type, but that doesn't mean I'm unusually stupid.
...Imagine a Beowolf Cluster of THESE!!!
My desktop of choice is...
1. GNOME
2. KDE
3. Enlightenment
4. Window Maker
5. Blackbox
6. Other
We always have articles about KDE and GNOME, and there is always fighting about which is going to kill the other. Personally, I use GNOME, but I use some KDE apps and hope both projects continue well into the future as they draw ideas off each other. But, it sure would be interesting to see how much support both have.
The new features in KDE 2.2 sound really interesting, I will definately be checking it out just for fun. I've switched between KDE and GNOME a number of times, maybe this will be the release that gets me to change sides again ; )
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
I'm I the only one left on the planet still feels this way?
I used to be firmly in the GNOME camp but when KDE 2.2beta1 was introduced into Debian I thought what the hell and gave it a shot. Now I hate using GNOME. It was like.. What have I been using this unstable, ugly GNOME shit for when the whole time I could of been using this wonderful piece of software. In fact I uninstalled all my GNOME apps because they make me ill.
Hats off to the KDE team for continuing their outstanding work. I have used KDE since Redhat 5.2 and although I've tried Gnome now and then I always come back to KDE. I'm admittedly a Linux newbie and really enjoy the features that KDE has to offer. I'm looking forward to improvements in Konqueror which is already a great browser.
GStreamer and Gnumeric.
got drum'n'bass?
http://mp3.com/vitriolix
If anybody wonders what Fitt's law is, here ya go.
I like c++ alot. I just think the fsf version of it really sucks. I love tail-recursion and the way c++ does handles. I believe oop can really make gui development faster and more bug-free if its done right. I hate gnome's c++ like hack written in c.
Anyway the orignally arguement why c was the defacto standard in gnome and not c++ was that g++ was mediocre and sucked really bad on anything non-intel. The other one was that comprises in the core QT libraries had to be made so it could compile under g++. This slowed kde down quite alot. I know alot of c die hards like to blame c++ on this but I believe its due to limitation in the g++ compiler. I noticed some code really runs fast on Visual c++ and runs slower and is more bloated on linux with gcc. Anyway I would love to see faster load times on kde3.0.
Do any of you know if the new compiler can help make kde3.0 run better?
http://saveie6.com/
AAAHHHH!!!
That's the goddamn Windows 2K file selection dialog, with the same damned problems it has.
Has anyone at GNOME ever done task analysis about what the user is most likely going to be doing when trying to save a file? While the shortcut bar to the left is nice (and I truly hope there's some obvious way to add new shortcuts, via the dialog), the most common task is to find the folder where the file either is (on open) or should be (on save) - ie, a tree view of files, or a separate list of folders from the list of available files. The old Gnome dialog used to separate the folders from the files - the new one apparently doesn't (although that completion is nice) - although there is evidently a mode to set it to.
Given that the dialog is already so damned big, couldn't a tree view be placed somewhere? And I really hope the greyed-out Folder icon next to the file type drop-down is "Create New Folder," another very common task when saving files - all the examples are evidently showing a file being opened, so I suppose removing the option on open sorta makes sense - although disabling it on open is a bad idea, IMHO.
You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
So what announcement will GNOME make tomorrow or the next day to take away publicity from KDE? Remember: You read it here first from me, Anonymous Coward. :)
Uhhhh...I wouldn't touch Nautilus with a 10-foot pole. The instant I run it, it spawns about 7 children, then makes my HD thrash like crazy at a constant rate, until I kill it (and I have to kill it several times in order to keep it dead since it automatically respawns a new process).
Tagged!!! now you're IT!! :)
my blog
A moral about KDE as told by tree icons:
The konquerer webbrowser (at least in KDE 2.1.2, which I'm running now) has some magnifying glasses in the panel; with it you can quickly enlarge or shrink all fonts on the current webpage one notch, without going to the trouble of changing the font size in the browser configuration.
Given the number of hare-brained frontpagers out there that design pages that only look good if you have the exact fonts that once came with MS Office 97 beta 2 and never shipped since, this is a very useful little icon. This attention to the little things that matter is a major KDE strength.
And here's a KDE weakness. Right smack next to the 'font enlarge/shrink' icons is another magnifying glass, but this one is for searching in the webpage! Anyone who thinks for 2 minutes about this realizes it's a bad idea to have very similar icons with completely different functions next to each other, but somehow these sort of glitches appear in KDE.
But give me GUI design glitches over all-round crap [iyour own least favorite OS/WM here] any day of the week.
I use FVWM, I always have (about 6 years now). I've toyed with KDE and KDE2 and Gnome (whatever Gnome came with RH 7.1, I hated it), and found the experience far too windowsey for my liking. When I try to convert my mom from Macintosh to Linux, I'm gonna show her KDE and explain that if she's gotta learn OSX, she can learn KDE and probably be very happy with Linux, so I'm not dead-set against desktop environments, by any means.
My question is: For myself, is there any good reason to switch to Gnome/KDE? I like that I can configure FVWM by getting in and hacking at the rc file. I don't have any use at all for a file manager. I like that I have one rc file instead of the whole ~/Desktop tree. I LOVE FvwmButtons. The list goes on.
I'm willing to postulate that I like what I have because I'm used to it, so I'm wondering if there's something I'm missing, or something beyond the initial "discomfort curve" that I will grow to appreciate as an indespensible feature later on. (Maybe this is a better question for Ask Slashdot, but it was this thread that made me think of it).
But masters, remember that I am an ass: though it be not written down, yet forget not that I am an ass.
How is xinerama support in kde nowadays? I'd love to use it but since enlightenment seems to be the only window manager/desktop environment to reasonably support two or more monitors I think that I'm stuck with it..
How? I assume you used some weird ass characters in your name that we cant see?
Geekizoid: The Small Shiny Things Network ©
Gobble a dick!
The only thing that bugs me about these desktop environments is that they do not handle hidden/dot files very well. there can be a lot of dot files in your home directory but you don't nessisarily always want to see them. Especially with the way that all Gnome apps put their dot-directories in ~ and clutter things up. Some apps either show the dot files or don't and don't give you a choice.
It'd make it a little easier if dot files were displayed as if they were inside their own subdirectory, so you could expand it and see them if you need to, but otherwise they'll just be shown in a psuedo folder called maybe "Hidden files in this directory."
PS: It looks from your sig that multiple warheads would be necessary to destroy New York City. Would you care to join my research on the subject of nuclear warheads that detonate with an oblong blast pattern, instead of the standard circular pattern?
Geekizoid: The Small Shiny Things Network ©
Gobble a dick!
Once XP ships, Linux tanks for the last time.
Ok. I'll bite, Mr. Troll. Linuix and other GPL/BSD based operating-systems and programs have been 'tanking' for the last 15 years. And gaining more market share all the way.
On second though, maby you just confused the word 'tanking' with the word that means: gaining market share day by day and having fun doing it.
Moneyed corporations, non-working 'poor' and criminal prisoners are turning productive citizens into tax-slaves.
and say that this person doesn't write much code.
Where's the Mandrake 8.0 release of Ximian GNOME?
I really REALLY like Ximian GNOME, but have been waiting for the Mandrake 8.0 release to put it on my desktop.
Will the releases for Mandrake 7, 7.2 work?
If not, when are they planned?
Er...shit! This was supposed to be in response to another article. That's what I get for "power-browsing" with multiple Slashdot windows open. :)
Yeah, like everybody's favorite compiler... It stalled for a year or so due to political arguments, hence the EGCS fork. After the FSF formally handed control of GCC to EGCS, the team got the 2.95 series out the door... but it still took forever to get 3.0 released. Afterwards, everybody sat down and said, "Okay, now that that's done, what could be improved?" and the result is the new development plan. The 3.0.1 code should be freezing in another ten days or so.
I suspect that this is just part of the growth of projects. A massive growth spurt (fast development) followed by a slowing and ossifying, followed by a clean-out-the-crap cycle which leads to a growth spurt...
You realize that can mean anything you want it to mean, right? It's way too vague of a term.
You cannot apply a technological solution to a sociological problem. (Edwards' Law)
I used enlightenment for a long time, with just the gnome panel. I recently switched to using gnome with sawfish. I disable most everything but the panel, no file manager etc.. I miss E's iconbox, but I'm getting used to the task switch drop down menu on the panel.
KDE is cool, but to windowsy for me, and I find QT somewhat annoying.
I love GTK, it is the finest looking toolkit in existence.
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
dude, that is too sick. far too sick.
but aside from the fact that i'm floored by your hoopy voodoo hack, i have a fundamental objection to asking people to run a shell script (as root!) without having them look at it. true, you never said "don't read it, just run it." but shouldn't we be discouraging this "su and say" behavior? especially just having people run a shell script that's stored remotely. making things easy to install is good, but "configure && make && make install" is good enough for me. (although i don't even encourage that. do a "./configure --help" first and decide what you really want/need. and do a "make -n install" to try and figure out what's going where in case things break.) A lot of people prefer package management schemes like rpm or apt, but i always feel like i lack a degree of control when i use those. anything past installing rpms is going too far for ease of use. (note to those who think my grandma should be able to use linux: i never said there couldn't be a gui frontend to rpm.)
#define F(x) int main(){printf(#x,10,#x);}
F(#define F(x) int main(){printf(#x,10,#x);}%cF(%s))
I just wish installing KDE on Solaris was as simple.
PatriotSoft makes Solaris 8 KDE packages. Only catch is they replace Sun's dtgreet logo with their own but that is easily fixed. We have been using their KDE 1.x package in production where I work for 1.5 years now. The KDE 2.x stuff seems to have problems when you logon on graphically more than once but that might be fixed now (run the control panel while logged in twice but only on a box no one cares about).
You can get the packages at: ftp://ftp.patriots.net/pub/solaris_packages/8-Spar c/KDE/
-- Argel
Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he'll get hit by a nuclear submarine.
-- Argel
Secondly, your claim of "full CSS2 implementation" is a total lie. Your CSS2 support is way behind current KHTML, which has not a complete support either. Even Mozilla is missing some pieces, I think.
The feature list doesn't justify. Just simply use KDE2.2. You will feel how pleasant it is. MANY, MANY small tweaks here and there give an amazing (and suprising) ease of use. You don't love the KDE desktop, you fell in love with it. Just an opinion from a former GNOME user.
I'm running KDE 2.1.2 on Mandrake 8.0. Open up the View menu on the menubar and deselect "Show hidden files" Easy peasy.
Can you provide some proof of your assertions? I see no reference to this on the gtkhtml2 site. If they are removing the copyright notices (i highly doubt it) that would be really bad. But if they are merely porting a GPL'd codebase for their own uses, power to them, thats what the GPL is for.
got drum'n'bass?
http://mp3.com/vitriolix
I think that most companies would pay the $1500 and use software libraries that do not have GPL anywhere in them, just to be safe. Also if it takes 3 more days to develop in Gnome than KDE because KDE is easier (KDevelop, Kylix, etc) then that $1500 has been made back anyway.
What if, say, I launch Mozilla, and would like to write a device driver and design a new theme and do my taxes while it loads -- is that throbbing icon going to follow my mouse around and get in the way when I type? It seems like it could get annoying.
The reason buttons are a pixel away from the edge is to prevent war, the galaxy is... er, to prevent accidental clicking. Ever fidget with the mouse and click something on accident? Having a one pixel buffer is a security measure so you don't X your unsaved thesis. It's a tradeoff, just like the pop-ups and autosaves -- which bug me too. It really is based on usablity. That, and to facilitate re-sizing. The most infuriating thing in Gnome when I first started was being unable to grab a corner and resize the window.
Sorry for slashdotting you dude.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
You could launch one right off the coast, assuming you took care of the Navy first. Right now all their ships are reeling from SirCam and Code Red.
Geekizoid: The Small Shiny Things Network ©
Gobble a dick!
Briliant language parser exploit. I am now patched.
Geekizoid: The Small Shiny Things Network ©
Gobble a dick!
This is my opinion, but its shared by a lot of people. What the hell, its only karma...
I use three main PCs, each with 128MB or more of RAM, and one with 640MB. They're all PII 400 or better. I update GNOME to the latest stable Ximian every day. see lots of news on the GNOME lists about the new CC, and Bonobo vs GNOME flamewars, but I've yet to see a version of Nautilus with a useable UI, which responds to mouse clicks, can quickly show the contents of directories, can actually surf the web like it was goddamned supposed to, can edit launchers without a text editor, can edit menus without a text editor, and do other things that other desktops can. And if I can somehow do this, then why it is so damn obscure I can't find it, when GMC was entirely understandable, if featureless.
All GNOME 1.4 game me was antialiased fonts for the desktop and Nautilus which should have been introduced in GNOME 2 via XRender, a file manager that doesn't fucking work, and a better file open and save dialog box.
That said, the newfile open / save dialog and CC look OK. As in, they don everything they're supposed to and nothing else. But how long does it take?
Waldo Bastian's document demonstrates that the current g++ implementation generates lots of expensive run-time relocations. This translates into the slow startup of large C++ applications (KDE, StarOffice, etc.). The attached program "objprelink.c" is designed to reduce the problem. Expect startup times 30-50% faster.
:)
The Dot
/me smiles
I want to express my heartfelt thanks to the KDE team. KDE is amazing.
Bush's education improvements were
FVWM2 smokes once you pick up the config file structure. Use it for a while and switching back to Gnome or KDE feels as if you've traded that 1.3 gHz in for a P2 450. The only things I don't like are the limited control of minimized icons (some apps, ie. GIMP and Netscape, refuse to accept the icons specified in .fvwm2rc), and that Winlist's width can't be locked. Oh, and Xine won't run in my binary install.
"because kde is easier"
bollocks. it's all about personal taste. I find gnome to be easier and smoother to develop with.got drum'n'bass?
http://mp3.com/vitriolix
Can you submit an icon, instead of a bugreport? :)
The appearence of 2.1 sucked badly... 2.2 beta looks a lot nicer. The only problems I have found:
Java over https *still* doesn't work on Konqueror properly - you get an error on the console about SSL V2 not being supported, even though I have enabled V2 in the preferences.
Whatever fonts you select it always uses courier? I assume this is just a beta bug...
It doesn't crash nearly so much as the other versions I've tried. It crashes when scanning for netscape plugins (I guess that's fixed in the release) but It's been stable for a couple of hours now - which is a record IME. Definately worth a try when it's released.
Now with IBM's own "AIX Toolbox for Linux Applications" web page, it's trivial to download all the rpms necessary and just install KDE> You just need to use smitty to install rpm first !
Link at: www.ibm. om/servers/aix/products/aixos/linux/
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My only complaint is that there isn't a similar automatic feature for Javascript.
It works somewhat(very buggy) and is pretty neat, but it's simply not even close to the same...
Sorry, GTK is still 10x prettier than QT ; )
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
Any window manager should work with KDE. A window manager that supports KDE will work a bit better, but is not really necessary. WindowMaker has KDE support, and I think with the recent cooperation between KDE and GNOME, any WM with GNOME support should be fine as well.
I find Konqueror's built-in CD ripping support pretty impressive. Put a music CD into your CD-ROM drive, navigate to it in Konq, and you'll see WAV and Vorbis directories (Konq uses CDDB/FreeDB to get the filenames). You can drag files out of the directories, and they'll automatically be ripped using cdparanoia, and compressed with Vorbis (if you dragged the .ogg files). There's also support for mp3 files (using LAME), but it's not compiled by default because of the patent problems (that's Debian's reason, maybe other distros include mp3).
RedHat doesn't seem to take packaging too seriously, unlike Mandrake, Suse and Debian, which typically provide the packages in just a few days.
I'm not quite sure why I haven't yet switched from using RedHat. I guess there was some reason, I always seem to forget what.
Since you are completely off topic here I would like to ask ...
How in the world you can sleep well PROMOTING Ecstasy to kids knowing full well that there were many cases of people dying as a direct result of using it.
Notice, I do not support war on drugs and if some people decide to fuck themselves up with drugs then so be it ( as long as I am not forced to pay for their habit) but promoting this stuff ?
KDE 2.1's (included in RH 7.1) interface is far more refined than KDE 1.x. And the "One, Two, Three, Four" business is no more, replaced by a very nice pager in the panel. I really look forward to KDE 2.2 and 3.0 (I look forward to Gnome 2.0 as well, but the difference is KDE releases can be counted on).
Geez, don't these guys have real lives? ... wait a sec, I'm on /.
Once he does somthing like that, no one will complain when Open Source freaks are going door to door with red fedoras and pump shotguns forcibly installing Linux or OpenBSD on every computer they can find.
Geekizoid: The Small Shiny Things Network ©
Gobble a dick!
What happens then? I don't think I've ever been a zealot. I just got into Linux because I wanted to see what Unix was all about. Strange, eh?
Geekizoid: The Small Shiny Things Network ©
Gobble a dick!