Rhythms Flatlines

daveT sent us a notice that Rhythms couldn't find a way out of bankruptcy and thus is shutting down its network.

Comments

Hey! I'm gonna get you too!

[Robber Baron]

Hey! I'm gonna get you too...
Another one bites the dust!

I know, I'm heartless...but haven't ANY of these clowns heard of a thing called a business plan??? The infrastructure needed to engage in this type of business is expensive (duh!) and guess what... you'll be going head-to-head with a phone company that has had it's network in place for...hmm...how many years? Didn't think of that did you? I hear Anne Robinson has something to say to you...

Re:What is it about DSL and wireless companies?

[Rob Mac K]

Unless your provider blocks your port 80 to stop Code Red on you... then no inbound connection. the tragedy!

It's a sad day when you can't even get lucky with a web server...

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[blang]

Yes, and from now on people, please refer to "Intel, a microprocessor maunfacturer"; "Microsoft a software procucts company"; and "Cisco, a data networking concern"

Not enough buzzwords, you're missing important parts such as "largest", "leading". Here's how they descrieb themselves a tthe end of press releases:

"Intel, the world's largest chip maker, is also a leading manufacturer of computer, networking and communications products. "

"Founded in 1975, Microsoft is the worldwide leader in software, services and Internet technologies for personal and business computing. The company offers a wide range of products and services designed to empower people through great software -- any time, any place and on any device."

"Cisco Systems, Inc. is the worldwide leader in networking for the Internet"

But it seems, the smaller the company is, more verbiage is needed. For example Ariba:

"Ariba, Inc. is the leading business-to-business (B2B) eCommerce solutions provider. Ariba's open, end-to-end, interoperable software solutions and hosted Web-based commerce services enable efficient online trade, integration and collaboration between B2B marketplaces, buyers, suppliers and commerce service providers. The global reach and best-of-breed functionality of Ariba B2B eCommerce solutions create Internet-driven economies of scale and process efficiencies for leading companies around the world. "

Re:Does this effect Telocity/DirectTV customers

[KelsoLundeen]

Yep. Ameritech. Static IP. But without our SDSL connections. ADSL 768/128.

For nearly 3 years I've had Telocity/DTV (one of the first in Chicago I was told) and loved it -- 1024/1024 SDSL.

Sweet mother of god: what a deal for 49 bucks a month.

Re:Press Release

[mypalmike]

"There are approximately zero copywriters now employed at Rythms." Man, if yoo're gonna make fun of bad copy, at leest spel "Rhythms" corectly!

Re:Proof...

[Galvatron]

But it's the only method of birth control endorsed by the Pope, so it must be good :)

Re:This sucks!

[Skapare]

Some of these DSL providers, including Rhythms and North Point, had positioned their business plans in the direction of becoming a full CLEC and offering not only DSL, but everything else that a CLEC would offer, including voice and other data circuits. What they found is first there were too many of them fighting over the small market that would abandon the ILEC. Their DSL sales may have been going OK, but sales in other business plans were just not bearing fruit, yet they had invested lots of money overbuilding that structure. While DSL sales were happening, because of cut throat market posturing, profits from it were very small at best, and most likely negative anyway.

If a business plans to achieve 40% market share, can't be profitable with less than 25% share, and faces 9 competitors with the same plans, something's got to break. The smarter ones can live through it.

No Surprise

[ioman1]

I am not surprised that they went out of business. Covad just recently went our of business as well. The larger internet companies are creating a monopoly. Entry to this market is almost impossible.

Re:No Surprise

[paranoic]

Actually Covad went Chapter 11, which is reorganization, they did not go out of business. Well, as of now they haven't.

Not very funny

[laetus]

First, I don't really think the prospect of 700 people losing their jobs is particularly funny. That's a lot of families and children involved.

Second, I don't think it's very funny that DSL providers are being forced into bankruptcy by the Baby Bells (see this and this and this and do your own searches if you need more).

Laugh if you will, but in the long run, you're going to only have AOL-Time Warner cable (after they swallow most of the cable providers) vs. DSL from your local Baby Bell to choose from for broadband service. And like Coke and Pepsi, AOL and the Baby Bell aren't going to compete on price or quality.

Re:Not very funny

[Anonymous Coward]

as long as people reelect congresspersons like good ol boy Billy Tauzin (who works harder for Bellsouth than their entire PR and legal department), they deserve to be laid off, have lousy monopoly service, be satisfied with 28.8 or pay $175/mo (and wait 6 months for an install), etc.

in missouri, we've got a paid incumbant LEC hack scaring local citizens about the evils of wireless towers. the overused call to "save the children" from spooky radiowaves is being made, demanding towers be stopped (and wireline incumbants protected from competition).

but what chance does an educated segment of the population have against a majority that believes magic crystals and magnets will improve their car's gas mileage and personal karma? bring on the layoffs... perhaps another depression is the only way to build character in these fools.

Re:Not very funny

[aclute]

actualy, everything I have seen says that the Baby Bells *lose* money on residental service. The amount of money they can charge for it is highly regulated by the FCC, and does not cover the cost of maintanence nessecary (think all those lines of cooper infrastructure). That is why all the local's are trying to get into the Long Distance and Business markets to make money. If they could only do Residental, they would not be doing that well.

Re:Not very funny

[blang]

That's right. The RBOCS seems to be the only companies lft who can still set whatever price they like on their product, and still keep their customers. I don't know about you, but close to $30 for dial tone per month, just to have your dial tone is extortion. The Bells still have huge margins, which is proof that competition is non-existing.

As bandwidth gets cheaper at an impressive rate, I can garantee, that the RBOC DSL provider will keep raising prices for residential DSL access by $10 a year at least.

Re:Not very funny

[david duncan scott]

I've gotta' ask: what scientific method do you know for improving personal karma?

Re:Not very funny

[Detritus]

Traditionally, residential lines have been subsidized by business lines and toll charges on long distance calls. That has been changing with the split-up of AT&T and the partial deregulation of the telephone business. From what I have seen in my area (Verizon), the phone company has laid off most of the older, experienced, union workers and replaced them with a smaller number of cheaper contractors. Copper loops are being replaced with SLCs (subscriber line concentrators) in new construction. Inter-office trunks are on high-speed fiber optic cable instead of copper. They have replaced almost all of their old switches with modern digital switches. All of this should have substantially reduced their labor and maintenance costs on residential lines.

Re:Not very funny

[Xibby]

Well, at lease AOL-Time Warner cable seems to have their act together. Which is more than I can say for MediaOne, err, AT&T Broadband, err, AT&T@Home, ummm...whatever...who has the other side of the Minneapolis Metro. And good luck getting a DSL line from Qwest in a timely manner, but that won't stop them from ramming "DSL is great!" down your throat every chance they get.

Anyway, AOL-Time Warner's RoadRunner service routes better for AT&T (excelent pings to my co-lo box on TW, just OK from AT&T), lets me grab up to 5ips (AT&T limits you to 1 unless you pay $10 more a month for 3 ips.), and it's just been a good experience overall.

Of all the offerings in Minneapolis, AOLTW does seem to be the one that got it right. AT&T changes their routing and name every other mounth, and Qwest still has the US West legacy. AOLTW just merged and took RoadRunner away from AT&T.

Re:Not very funny

[Anonymous Coward]

You miss the point,

Less competition == higher prices.

You won't see it now, but remember 15 years ago basic cable cost under $9.00. I know of some places that basic cable cost them over $30.00. This price is from a couple of years ago to boot. Not a bad gig to double your prices every 4 years or so.

Lets see now; if history repeats, a cable modem will cost you around $100 a month in less than a decade. But you won't care because the service will be "ok" at best.

Sorry, my fault they went under

[the_rev_matt]

I seem to have a curse. Two of my last three employers are no longer (and the third is in critical condition).

Seriously tho', Rhythms was incredibly disorganized internally (at least in May-Nov 1999 they were). Poor communication, lack of clear goals, the usual internal politics etc. The development group was mostly overpriced/underskilled consultants who really did a lot of damage. About June of 99 they decided to hire the decent consultants (yours truly included) and drop-kick the rest, and that was certainly a good first step. Their Director of Development (Jamie Horgan) after about Nov of 99 was awesome but I don't think he could single handedly save the company from what ultimately killed them: Incumbent telcos. Going head to head with those monstrosities is begging to go out of business. You think MSFT is bad? Try dealing with Qworst, and it was only that much harder for Rhythms because the CEO defected from Qworst (it took a LONG time for Rhythms to be able to offer DSL service in their own town, because Qworst kept dragging their feet as punishment for her leaving to compete). I consider myself extremely lucky that I'm moving to a state that does not have Qworst.

Re:Sorry, my fault they went under

[Monkeyman334]

I don't like "Qworst". Before Qwest bought out US West, I had "US Worst", it sounds SO much better. Oh well, it's the price you pay.. But you're right about Qwest. Becoming a CLEC and going up against Qwest is hard work.

Re:Sorry, my fault they went under

[vtechpilot]

I seem to have a curse. Two of my last three employers are no longer (and the third is in critical condition).

Have you applied for a job at microsoft yet? From the people I know that work with them it doesn't seem to be that hard.

Do us all a favor and visit http://www.microsoft.com/jobs/

Should have seen it coming

[FrostyWheaton]

sorry, nix the free market crack.

I still think the DSL providers had it coming to them. Now be honest, who ever thought the Baby Bells, or other TelCo's were really going to play fair? Who expected them to act any differently than they did?

Now you may be able to sell better lemonade than the bully down the street. Or give better odds than the bookie at the bar, but you are also wise enough to know that you can't survive playing that game, and you are definately not going to win.

Everyone knows TelCo's suck, and they don't play fair, and they cheat whaa whaa whaa!!! But that's the current business climate unfortunately, and it definately needs a massive overhaul. But anyone that thought that some well intentioned third party people, and some deregulation talk from state capitals was going to change things really shouldn't be empowered to make major business descisions

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Anonymous Coward]

Andersen Consulting? Sorry, never heard of 'em.

But the point is made branding is damn important, which is another reason why some people wan't to brand Linux, as Linux/GNU.

surprising they even post it

[Lawrence_Bird]

it clearly wasnt of note last week:
2001-08-02 18:18:20 Rhythms CH 11 (articles,news) (rejected),
even though it was pretty well clear
they would be shutting it all down. For those
of us who actually use SDSL for work, it sucks
large. I was on NP, now Rhtyms, and there is
no COVAD here. And people who have COVAD are
kidding themself if they think their 'reorg' plan
is gonna do anymore than get them thru next March.
They claim if the bond holders swap for some equity they wont need money until then, and just
another $200 mio. Yeah right. I can just see
the VC's beating down their doors.

Re:DSL and WHY it will suck.

[cjsnell]

Why would AOL cable modem service suck? You don't *have* to use the AOL client. AOL's network backbone is fscking amazing. You can get from just about any point on it to any other point in less than 3ms. I've yet to see a DSL provider with a backbone that can even come close to this.

Re:Welcome to the Post-Internet Age

[bricriu]

Perhaps you mean "one less company --> more monopolistic power for the Baby Bells." They don't have to worry about remaining solvent, despite (as pointed out above) the ongoing (and insufficiently punitive) fines they face for not opening their networks.

Ya just can't ignore stuff like that :-(

Re: "anyone know roughly home many survivors there

[carlhirsch]

Covad is pretty much the last national data CLEC. New Edge Networks is still around but has a much smaller footprint.

Covad is expecting to go into Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection shortly, but the corporate line here is that it's for debt restructuring and continued survivability rather than liquidation.

I'm skeptical, personally. I give 70/30 odds against coming out of bankruptcy alive a year from now.

the sad truth about DSL

[FrostyWheaton]

It appears that most DSL providers are victims of the same business model that sunk so many .com's: "Sell at a loss, and make it up in volume." Now there is a chance that DSL could be provided for $39.99 a month, but the customer base would have to be huge in order to keep the price that low. They unfourtunately ran out of money before they could build up a large enough customer base to make the business profitable.

Personally, I'm somewhat saddened to see so many DSL providers dying an early death, but that's the free market economy for you.

Re:the sad truth about DSL

[the_rev_matt]

It is not free market. Once company was given a monopoly and now smaller companies are trying to compete and are being beaten to death by thugs who buy off the state legislators and the PUC's so they don't have to pay fines or play fair. A free market would mean everyone has an equal opportunity, definitely NOT the case here.

Re:the sad truth about DSL

[Anonymous Coward]

What a stupid business prospect. "Sell at a loss, and make up for it by volume". Doesn't that just translate into a large volume of loss?

Re:the sad truth about DSL

[blang]

Agreed. Mod down grand parent, and mod up parent, if you're gonna mod at all.

Re:the chicken or the egg

[Waffle Iron]

Access speeds need to increase to take Internet use tot he next level, yet at the same time, there has to be useful broadband content to merit the cost of increasing access speeds. But what will come first?

pr0n.

Re:I wonder

[Myco]

Perhaps you meant to say Verizon? Or is AT&T doing this as well?

It applies to non-commercial entities as well

[volpe]

But it seems, the smaller the company is, more verbiage is needed. For example Ariba: [...]

The converse is also true, and it is not restricted to companies. For example:

Earth: mostly harmless

The future of DSL?

[Ulwarth]

If I'm not mistaken, this leaves only ONE major DSL carrier: Covad. Given that there are tens thousands of businesses with money in hand for DSL, it hardly seems like an unsustainable market. Compare to all these dot-coms that have no revenue stream whatsoever; DSL companies have revenues of several million dollars (or more) per month. And they can't stay alive? What's the deal?

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[TheMidget]

Shouldn't that be "Intel, a microprocessor manufacturer"; "Microsquish, a crashware products company"; ...

Re:Does this effect Telocity/DirectTV customers

[mimbleton]

Well, I had 768/384 which was better than 128 but as long as I get to keep my static IP and Ameritech allows me to run my little farm of services ( Telocity had no problem with it) I am gonna be reasonably happy.

Re:This sucks!

[Mr. Slippery]

What they found is first there were too many of them fighting over the small market that would abandon the ILEC.

I don't understand that. Are the masses really that happy with their local phone service? I've hated Verizon since it was Bell Atlantic. I'd be first in line if there were a practical alternative.

Please, please, please, let Covad not have to follow Rhythms into oblivion and leave me with Verizon as my only DSL alternative...

Their web site

[jacobcaz]

I find it ironic that there is still a big graphic on their web site that says, "I want DSL now!"

Shouldn't they like, you know, take that off their page? Hmmmm....

Re:Their web site

[Skapare]

But who remains there that knows how to do it?

Re:Their web site

[sulli]

But they do want DSL now! Wouldn't you, if you just lost your free employee connection from RTHM?

Re:Their web site

[Chundra]

No. It's a pathetic cry from the upper management. Maybe if it said "We have DSL now!" they should take it off their page. But as it stands, it's pretty fitting.

Anybody left doing Copper Mountian DSL?

[hndrcks]

First Northpoint, now Rythyms. Are there any other national DSL providers using Copper Mountain frame-relay technology left?

I feel your pain.

[Mustang Matt]

Northpoint shut down in St. Louis not too long ago.

I highly recommend Savvis. They have some products that are more expensive but have superior quality and their network delay guarantees are the fastest in the world.

They have awesome uptime guarantees also. You dial the tech support number and you get a live person who usually isn't a tech support clown and actually has some knowledge about what is going on in this world.

I ended up going with a T1 from them. Had local loop fees from swbell been cheaper ($550) it would have been the cheapest T1 in existence ($995 full T1)

Disclaimer: Yes, I am a stockholder (ouch!), yes I am affiliated with the company as a customer, plus I used to work for Bridge before I went out on my own doing web development and hosting. However, in my honest opinion, I still think they have a superior service and pricing for what you get.

Re:I feel your pain.

[Anonymous Coward]

995 monthly, right?

Is this slashdot's new job?

[acroyear]

I'd think with sites out there like f*ckedcompany.com already doing this, you'd have better things to do than keep reporting on dying companies and services out there...

Are you dissing my Sig?

[hndrcks]

This kind of psycho-babble is required by the SEC for publicly traded companies.

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Anonymous Coward]

Without wishing to appear po-faced, at least i`ve actually heard of Intel and Microsoft...

Faceless lowprofile company #12082d hits the pan.

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[ct]

A regional DSL provider is just a TAD less "known" than the Global presence that the industry leaders you've mentioned.

-ct

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Anonymous Coward]

WTF are my moderator points, there is a big honking difference between a 10 billion $ branded company, and a Network service provider people have never heard of.

And for you Nerds out there, branding is everything, that's why companies like Enron and Accenture buy network television ads even though they have no consumer products.

And FYI branding means that even if your product is crap it will still sell, want an example, look at MS.

On the bright side, and uninformative top level post actually forces people to read the article in question before posting.

Re:This sucks!

[Unknown Bovine Group]

Yes, with the collapse of Covad, Ricochet, and now Rhythms, I wouldn't be surprised if the average bandwidth/user on the internet is going DOWN for the first time in the internet's history.

Well, the first time outside the Melissa virus and when AOHell changed over to unlimited monthly anyway.

DSL and WHY it will suck.

[xintelexx]

Eventually it will come to this folks :
1)AOL/Time Warner/ATT/Comcast/(insert another mega corporation, maybe Microsoft) Cable modems. (Then it will be un cool to have a cable modem through AOL cause AOL sucks(which is true) ).
2) Verizon/Name your Regional Telco will be the only DSL provider, it's there backbone anyway, it's only a matter of time).
3) MCI/Verizon/Sprint/Cable will be the only players left providing the Tier 1 back bones.
4)Satelitte, again controled by mega corp!
5) Dialup again. Verizon/AOL/Earthlink/Juno, I see Earthlink and Juno merger, then AOL buying them then it will be AOL/VERIZON.
6) Wirless, now even though with the recent Security flaw with wirless 802.11 WEP, This is the only viable solution I would like to see take off.
Let me Explain
We need to start a completely free net based on wireless where companies have no control. It would be for free information much like old BBS's. With wireless we dont need any Mega Merger greedy companies in the mix. Wirless net would be much easier to setup for the common folks, who has the money to run wire anyway. It would save millions of tree's from being cut down(telephone poles), easier to fix after a natural disaster, just set up a few replacment access points, it would be accessable from anywhere, and it would not be owned by anyone. Sounds like a dream .....
It's a sad day when the Corporations have more control and influence then the government.

Re:DSL and WHY it will suck.

[Phroggy]

I don't see an Earthlink/Juno merger at all. Juno and NetZero just merged to form United Online, and Earthlink's management expects them to go out of business before much longer. I used to work for Earthlink, and I'd say the chances of Earthlink merging with them are pretty much nil. Earthlink might try to acquire their customer base if they went under, but since Earthlink charges $21.95/month for dialup access, I don't know how well the customers would like that.

Re:DSL and WHY it will suck.

[oseng]

AOL's network backbone isn't the Internet's backbone. It is AOL's proprietary Network backbone.

Re:What is it about DSL and wireless companies?

[ethereal]

And if you and your S.O. abuse it enough, you might have a Broadband Baby! Born without even the possibility of ever going back to dialup - what a tragedy.

Or maybe not.

Re:No competition Higher prices

[CthulhuDragon]

Unless NetGear or Linksys comes up with a router that has a USB connection, I'd have to pay the ransom to get the Ethernet version of their modem to use the service. So I have telocity at the moment. I know linksys did:
Linksys Router

Reading a lost art

[Anonymous Coward]

This says that 85% of the 700 employees laid off, are in Colorado. This means that about 595 employees in Colorado are to be terminated. The 75% refers to their total workforce, which is not all in Colorado, you idiot. So that means that the company had about 930-950 employees.

Re:This sucks!

[ebh]

Yeah, but judging by how much of the time telco's right hand doesn't have a clue what its left hand is doing, they've squandered that time.

IMO this sucks

[DeadPrez]

Or maybe I am just the kiss of death. I have idsl from Megapath and this will be the second time I am switched. The first company I was with, Northpoint, was constantly going down and not resyncing when the line would come back up, thus forcing me to reset the router every time. Sometiems this would happen once a day, sometimes 10 times a day. I will not miss northpoint!

Megapath switched me to Rhythms and I couldn't have been happier. Not one problem with my dsl (same router) many months. I did get a couple wierd disconnects recently but the router re-synced...and for the love of god, didn't make me reset it. Praise the DSL gods!

If for one will sorely miss Rhythms unless somehow Covad steps up to the plate (but I hear Covad is more like Northpoint). Either way I am sure the marriage won't be long as Covad is going bankrupt as well. What happens then? =(

Re:IMO this sucks

[Anonymous Coward]

I had IDSL with megapath/northpoint. Cancelled it when northpoint went belly up, but I never had a problem with them back then.

Of course, the fact that megapath wont acknoledge the fact that I CANCELLED now 5 months ago is beside the point.

I leave message upon message to their billing dept, and no one ever calls me back. Its a damned good thing I refused to give them a credit card # when I initially signed up, and all they can do is send me bill after bill. At least I've got my proof that I've cancelled should they escalate the matter.. be cautious with them though if you ever decide to move to a different provider, they just can't seem to let go of customers.

(btw, no troubles with RR, my current ISP)

Re:IMO this sucks

[lone_gunman]

I agree with you. MegaPath/Rhythms made a great combination. In 6 months of service, I can't rememebr one period of downtime. Tech support was very fast. I'm heading to Qwest, with a 45 business day wait for an install. With their "Remote Terminal"s being deployed those of us out a long way from the CO do have a hope of DSL.

Re:Welcome to the Post-Internet Age

[Skapare]

There are regional ones that don't have (capital sucking) nationwide infrastructure, such as IP Communications, which has already been anticipating the fall of Rythyms.

Finally a Company Who Gets It

[Anonymous Coward]

I can't believe it has taken so long for these lame DSL compnaies to realize that if they don't charge enough for the bandwidth that they supply, to stop operating.

It is just so lame for these companys that impose bandwidth restrictions, trying to keep themselves afloat a little longer. When are all the broadband companies just going to get a clue, and close up shop.

We would all rather see these companies fail, then pay for the bandwidth our streaming servers, and ftp caches use. I am just so glad to see a company finally get a clue.

Re:Rhythms shut down St. Louis DSL yesterday

[Anonymous Coward]

Did you read the Rhythms website? They announced this a while back.

Lack of preparation on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part.

Re:Proof...

[Felix The Cat]

Unless it's a Neil Peart drum solo...

(Yes, that's what Rush call his drum solos on their live albums. Really.)

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[TheMidget]

> And FYI branding means that even if your product is crap it will still sell, want an example, look at MS.

And so does Accenture's. Oops, the Accenture brand is not really that well known, at least not as well as Andersen Consulting, hehe...

Re:What is it about DSL and wireless companies?

[Rob Mac K]

DSL (which I use at home) seems like a really good service, especially given that my cable company doesn't offer cable modem yet. But, of course, I'm a geek and I love having plenty of bandwidth and high transfer speeds. The average Joe still doesn't base his life around his PC, so selling Joe on a high-speed connection is still incredibly difficult.

This is a good point. My experience is, once someone tries it (if they're at all net-addicted, even if it's AOL), they're hooked. Thus, all the "free modem! first month free!" business. Once you try it, you can't go back.

Perhaps instead of a War on Drugs, we should have a War on Broadband, instead? It's equally addictive, and more expensive than most drug habits.

Amen

[CaptainSuperBoy]

Amen, brotha! I haven't seen any of their commercials in a while, but by god they sucked. It was a bunch of silhouettes dancing around and there was "data" flowing around the screen (you know, a bunch of numbers floating around). If i remember right, there were also people saying dumb things.

Re:What is it about DSL and wireless companies?

[baptiste]

But, back to the plight of the DSL companies...can these companies ever formulate a business plan that actually works and makes money? Are there independent (non-phone company) DSL providers that are making a profit?

Sure they can - the same day the telcos are actually forced to open up their networks and preform the requested work on tim einstead of delaying orders for months while they try to grab all DSL customers for themselves. I mean charging a DSL ISP $30 just for the freaking line is a juoke when you cna get DSL in many places for $35-$50.

So, alas - we're still where we were in the 70's Stuck with one company providing a communication service with no hope of competitors keeping prices low.

Cable you say? Maybe - but only for residential average users. I expect that most residential users will go to cable modems and telcos will jack up prices on DSL to the point only businesses can afford it - But businesses will pay the sky high DSL prices cause its more reliable and offers higher upstream bandwidth (without congestion slowdowns) than cable modems.

I consider myself very lucky to have a small Mom & Pop telco with DSL capability who have excellent service and charge a decent rate. I've been nothing but happy with my DSL and wish the technology wouldn't be driven into the ground by greedy telcos (can we say ISDN anyone?) It Still Does Nothing since telcos keep saying I See Dollars Now :)

So lets see here...

[arkham6]

Northpoint - Puked and dead.

Covad - Just Coughed up a death hairball.

Rhythms - Going down like the Titanic.

Verizon - Only had to pay 1.5 million dollars to put the competiton out of business.

Jeeze. Verizon sure got East Coast DSL domination cheep.

It's important to some of us.

[Mustang Matt]

This isn't just about a company dying, it's about SDSL dying because none of these companies can get their act together.

The difference may not be your ISP

[Anonymous Coward]

"The best part of this is that my ISP is on top of it. I just gave them a call because I know that I'm on Rhythms, and the last time my CLEC shut down (NorthPoint) my old ISP (Empire.net) simply dropped all their customers, and I was without a decent internet connection for a month."

I have been trying to reach a fellow all week who happens to run an ISP. When I got in touch he told me he was quite busy relocating Rhythms customers to other providers. He said Rhythms declared bankruptcy on August 1, and sent notices yesterday that service would end today. That, he said, was much better notice than ISPs got from Northpoint.

Isn't it amazing what passes for better notice ?

hmm, that's funny....

[room101]

I found it funny that on their homepage (www.rhythms.com), they still have "GET DSL NOW!!!" in big bold letters, they have links to click on to see if you can get DSL in your area, A link to see their fake demo of how much better DSL is than a 9600Baud modem, and right below, there is a tiny link about "chaper 11 update".

Think they are hedging, hoping for a buy-out or extra funding? That's my guess.

short, sweet and to the point.

[Anonymous Coward]

I wish more slashdot stories were like this. Micheal please help educate Katz on this style.

Re:Competition?

[topher71]

Well, Qwest is their biggest competitor.

Re:The irony...

[mach-5]

They should just add "from" to the end now.

This sucks!

[anothernobody]

All these providers shutting down, and I can't get any high speed connection outside of StarBand. Why is this happening? Too much regulation or just stupid business decisions?

Re:This sucks!

[kurowski]

Too much regulation or just stupid business decisions?

actually, they're shutting down due to being unable to compete with companies that don't face enough regulation and who are making smart business decisions. remember, what's good for the consumer is rarely what's good for the shareholder!

Re:This sucks!

[MeNeXT]

I'd say that it's more that the Telco monopolies are hindering the small ISP's by bundling their services. The Telco's had time to build their monopoly networks and therfore have better margins by conbining support, billing, customer care, and such.

I wonder

[Alien54]

I wonder how much of this is tied into the comtnuing fine that AT&T has been paying, and will continue to pay, for screwing up its lesser competitors.

Does this effect Telocity/DirectTV customers

[smccrory]

...who used to have Rhythms as their provider? Jeesh I hope not... :-/ Scott

Re:Does this effect Telocity/DirectTV customers

[Dman33]

Being one of those Telocity/DirecTV users that is on a Rhythms provider I must say... it does not look too good. I imagine that Telocity/DirecTV will just work us through a painful transition to Covad which may be around for a few more months...
Man, what is left besides cable? Perhaps I will just get a dry line to my office and SDSL to our T1.

Re:Does this effect Telocity/DirectTV customers

[mimbleton]

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,1258964;roo t=telocity;mode=flat

Check this out.
It looks like we gonna end up with Ameritech.

Re:If you surf without rhythms...

[Felix The Cat]

Ouch. That was pretty good. But then again, I like double-obscure references like that.

Thank You Rhythms Employees.

[Necron69]

I would just like to say thank you to the employees of Rhythms (including my now unemployed sister-in-law), who worked hard to make a decent company out of that mess. I've had my SDSL line for a year, and although I had four different ISPs in that time, my line was Rhythms all the way with very few problems.

Fuck Rhythms management, who made off with millions while the employees and customers get screwed.

I guess my only choice now is Qwest.

- Necron69

Re:Thank You Rhythms Employees.

[daviddennis]

I got Rhythms service through UUNET when Covad was unable to get a connection working for more than 24 consecutive hours without some kind of failure.

Rhythms has provided me with excellent service - so good as to be entirely invisible. I have a call in to UUNET to see where they can put me next; I'm scared to go with Covad again.

I may have to try a cable modem, but I really like being able to run a server at home. Anyone got ideas?

D

Re:Thank You Rhythms Employees.

[unitron]

"...Rhythms management, who made off with millions..."

From an article on The Register a couple of days ago--

"Execs at Rhythms NetConnections in the US awarded themselves $4 million in bonuses just three days before seeking bankruptcy."

Probably snuck their Aeron chairs out the back door while no onw was looking as well.

What is it about DSL and wireless companies?

[mystery_bowler]

DSL (which I use at home) seems like a really good service, especially given that my cable company doesn't offer cable modem yet. But, of course, I'm a geek and I love having plenty of bandwidth and high transfer speeds. The average Joe still doesn't base his life around his PC, so selling Joe on a high-speed connection is still incredibly difficult. Throw in competition from established names like all of the "Baby Bells" and it becomes evident that each and every independent DSL provider is fighting what appears to be a losing battle.

Wireless almost seems like it's going to be the same way. For the most part, it seems, wireless networking and 'net access is too expensive for the mid-to-small businesses and not useful enough to justify the cost for large businesses.

But, back to the plight of the DSL companies...can these companies ever formulate a business plan that actually works and makes money? Are there independent (non-phone company) DSL providers that are making a profit?

Re:What is it about DSL and wireless companies?

[CPT Carl]

"It Still Does Nothing since telcos keep saying I See Dollars Now"

...and while we're on the topic of catchy ISDN acronyms, lets not forget "It Sends Data Nowhere"

Re:What is it about DSL and wireless companies?

[Anonymous Coward]

I strongly suspect that most "drug habits" consist of average people who smoke a little pot now and then. Marijuana isn't expensive (not that I've priced the market lately, but unless prices have skyrocketed in the last 8 or 9 years, $50/month would go a looooong way), at least not where I've lived.

Re:What is it about DSL and wireless companies?

[Unknown Bovine Group]

Perhaps instead of a War on Drugs, we should have a War on Broadband, instead? It's equally addictive, and more expensive than most drug habits.

Dude, you GOTTA tell me where you're getting your drugs. Cuz if you can support a drug habit at $50/month your Sams Club must have a drug section.

Unless of course you're talking about your PORN addiction. God knows how much you can blow on pay-per-porno sites.

Press Release

[Reckless Visionary]

The Company is also reducing its workforce today by approximately 700 employees, or approximately 75 percent of its total workforce. Approximately 85 percent of the affected employees are in Colorado.

There are approximately zero copywriters now employed at Rythms.

Re:Press Release

[thejake316]

There are approximately zero copywriters now employed at Rythms.
Possibly more than have ever been employed by /. Oh, and I just noticed that according to how slashdot capsules the articles they link to, an infinate number of monkeys punching randomly at calculators would not only approximate pi, they'd get it right on the nose if the decimal place they were starting from was not arbitrary. It's also cute to read threads about the digits 1337 occur at position 199932, therefore an effective compression algorithm would be to tokenize something like 1337 with "position 199932 of pi." That's like saying putting a s p a c e b e t w e e n e v e r y l e t t e r y o u type is more effiecient than not because compression algorithms are very effective on text files with lots of whitespace.
viva la brain donors

The irony...

[Matrix12]

Where internet connections are moving! (TM) :)

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Some Dumbass...]

Perhaps he was a Rhythyms customer and had to post it quickly?

Shortest news item ever!

[MatrixManiac]

Is there a compo for the smallest news item?

Rhythms shut down St. Louis DSL yesterday

[phawley]

sad but true...thought we'd have 30 days to scramble!

You know what... You might be onto something!

[Mustang Matt]

Bridge Information also had free sodas and fruit snacks and also went under.

Reuters bought them.

Re:Free Markets, Public Works, and Monopolies

[TheSync]

To whit, why do "natural monopolies" exist, what makes them a "natural monopoly,"

"Natural Monopolies" exist because of local governments granting monopoly franchises. Period.

Areas with competiting telecom providers (such as multiple cable companies) generally have lower prices.

The whole "natural monopoly" BS happened in the early part of the century as power companies and the Bell System got monopoly franchises through their political influence.

What Is Rhythms?

[SEWilco]

An article really should mention what the company does. In this case, it is not a music-related company...

WOHOO - NO MORE "YOU'VE GOT RYTHIM" COMMERCIALS!

[eric2hill]

They're almost like Disney's "It's A Small World" song...

A monopoly is natural only if you narrow your view

[mr_death]

While w3woody makes some good points, I believe that he/she looks at the problem of natural monopoly only from a current technology perspective.

To take the telephone (Baby Bell) case; yes, only the RBOC (in my case, Qwest) has copper to my house. And if you restrict your view to "who owns the copper to my house", then Qwest does have a natural monopoly in telephony. If, however, you consider other modes of delivery (cellphone, voice over ip, etc.) then Qwest does not have a monopoly. In my case, I use my cellphone almost exclusively for personal comms, relegating the normal phone to 911 calls and telemarketers.

Similarly, there's only one cable wire coming to my house, which gives the cable company a monopoly on cable TV. But, I can erect a satellite dish, and go around the cable company.

I heartily agree that regulatory agencies seem to exist to protect and benefit the regulated. But for those limited cases (e.g., the one road on the optimal path from point A to B) where a natural monopoly exists (until we all have personal aircraft), then maybe a regulatory agency is the best of the available bad solutions.

Absent government interference in the market, a monopoly (natural or otherwise) can only exist in the short term. As w3woody pointed out, a monopoly is by definition inefficient, which makes it vulnerable to disruptive technology, which can destroy the chokehold held by the monopoly.

Re:Damn

[mimbleton]

Now I know it will be Ameritech ...
Looks like we gonna keep our static IP but no more SDSL.

Re:Welcome to the Post-Internet Age

[jwilloug]

I believe there's only one DSL provider left, the also-bankrupt Covad. Well, unless you count the Bells...

Proof...

[kirkb]

that the rhythm method does not work.

Re:Proof...

[andy@petdance.com]

Unless it's a Neil Peart drum solo...

(Yes, that's what Rush call his drum solos on their live albums. Really.)

Or rather, they did on one album.

Re:Proof...

[Tackhead]

> > Proof... that the rhythm method does not work.
>
> I've got news for them... Pulling out doesn't work either.

Hey, either way, as long as you're getting fucked ;-).

Re:Proof...

[chrysrobyn]

by kirkb on 10:44 Friday 10 August 2001 EST Proof... that the rhythm method does not work. I've got news for them... Pulling out doesn't work either.

Re:Proof...

[Felix The Cat]

Called it that on Different Stages, too. Exit...Stage Left had the drum solo embedded into the "YYZ" track. Dunno about All The World's A Stage, though.

Meow.

Help me out here....

[wholesomegrits]

Is this Slashdot, or FuckedCompany? An obscene amount of Page 1 news on /. is YADILB - Yet Another ISP Bankruptcy.

This is getting old, and with all the great, obscure stuff relegated to other Sections, and therefore never getting nearly the exposure they deserve, stuff is getting overlooked in favor of this type of pedantic shit.

Surprise, surprise, ISPs are going bankrupt. This isn't a matter which has a whole lot of avenues for discussion. We can talk and talk about the Shoulda, Woulda, Coulda game all day, but in the end, it's same old, same old.

A year ago, Taco finally began posting stories when the shit hit the fan for all the Linux businesses, but only did so after bitching that /. Wasn't a Financial News Site, so HERE IT IS, QUIT BITCHING. Now we're on the opposite end of this.

Rhetorical Questions mean anything to you

[Anonymous Coward]

That was obviously a rhetorical question, as he spends the bulk of the essay answering it.

Why didn't you make your post a little more intelligent by limiting you response to "ditto".

Re:Damn

[drsoran]

Most likely you'd probably transition to an SBC line with a dynamic IP. I doubt they'd go with Covad which should be going out of business any day now.

Re:Bellsouth charges Earthlink $33 per DSL line in

[Thing 1]

Here's the link, for the lazy. ;-)

And you thought the last few years have been fun..

[Bill the Cat]

...we may go through it all again if some baby bells are broken up.

http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-6818658.htm l? tag=tp_pr

Rest assured that your government is working on it (shudder).

Welcome to the Post-Internet Age

[number one duck]

No worries, one less company --> more customers for the surviving companies, and more chances of them becoming and remaining solvent. If this was the *last* dsl/cable company to fall, then maybe we'd have a problem.. anyone know roughly home many survivors there are?

(Cheerfully ignoring concepts like monopoly and trust in my definition of problem)

Re:Welcome to the Post-Internet Age

[drsoran]

Yes, but for the other 95% of the US the only alternative is the former Baby Bells. Thank GOD for the Telecommunications Act of 1996! If it weren't for that we wouldn't have these nice huge solvent companies like Verizon and SBC to provide us with services.

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Anonymous Coward]

This is what's known as good reporting. You will find that most real news sites will work even these bits of "no-shit" information into every story. They might not put it as simply as you say, but they'll usually say something like "Microsoft plans to release Windows XP, their next-generation operating system with support for 64-bit processors. A spokesman for the computer software company was quoted as saying..." This is a legitimate criticism. As Slashdot is pretty much the keystone of VALinux's business at this point, they need to start taking their job seriously if they expect to succeed. If the editor's response is "we're too busy to write a real article" or "this is news for nerds, if you don't like it, go somewhere else", that's not going to play very well with stockholders money on the line.

No competition Higher prices

[Anonymous Coward]

My bell company here in NC already sent me a notice about a month ago. Price went up for my ADSL $5 because competition went belly up.

Re:No competition Higher prices

[cbowland]

Speaking of no competition and higher prices, Telocity (now directtvdsl) raised my monthly fee $10. The monthly price was $39.95 and now it is $49.95. I got the letter yesterday. I really can't complain too much since they seemed to be $10 below everyone else before, but it just goes to show what happens when competition decreases - prices go up.

Re:No competition Higher prices

[scharkalvin]

Bell South also raised their price on DSL, but in this case they were making the discount smaller for those who also were getting their phone service package. IE: the price was $49.99/mo or $40/mo IF you got their phone service package. Now the price is $45/mo for those getting the phone package, the base price is STILL $49.99. Guess the tie in was too popular, or the phone package was selling well enough on it's own.

Unless NetGear or Linksys comes up with a router that has a USB connection, I'd have to pay the ransom to get the Ethernet version of their modem to use the service. So I have telocity at the moment.

Re:Free Markets, Public Works, and Monopolies

[w3woody]

IMHO, this is one of the more intelligent comments I've read on the Internet for a while.

I do think it's worth defining a "natural monopoly" here. A "natural monopoly" is any situation where, for all practical purposes, only a single solution may be implemented. For example, it would be impractical for every local phone carrier to install copper wire from the local switching box to my house--we have at least a dozen phone companies; a dozen separate wire pairs, one for each phone company would be rediculous. Or take the freeways--it would be nearly insane to have 10 private freeway toll companies build 10 parallel freeways along each freeway corridor--we would have to effectively pave the planet to allow each toll company to compete.

In situations where a common resource exists because of this sort of a "natural monopoly" is created, in my opinion it is best to place this "common resource" into the public trust--that is, to have the government run this public resource. That's because competition is impractical--the 10 freeways per freeway corridor, or the 12 cables per house makes head-to-head competition impractical.

In my opinion these common public resources must be placed in the hands of the government or, at least, in the hands of a not-for-profit organization heavily administered by the government (as the U.S. Post Office is, for all practical purposes). That's because any natural monopoly forming around a public resource which is motivated by profit, as the Bell companies are or the California Electrical companies are--this leads to corruption. It leads to corruption because the monopolies (such as the Bells), in an effort to increase profit, can only increase it by affecting the regulatory process. (And in the case of the Baby Bells or the California Electrical companies, "affecting the regulatory process" == "bribing local officials to turn the other way.") And sometimes (as in the case of the California Electrical companies) this sort of "regulatory lobbying" can lead to disasterous results.

I'm not a socialist. I'm a died-in-the-wool capitalist. But in natural monopoly situations where competition is impractical (such as the last mile of copper to the house, or in building freeways), "Capitalism" doesn't exist. Effective capitalism can only exist when competition exists, and when new players can enter the playing field and compete.

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[BilldaCat]

He's too busy censoring websites, give the guy a break.

If you surf without rhythms...

[dschuetz]

...you won't attract the worms.

Now we're all safe from Code Red!

(sorry...double-obscure OT...)

Re:Thank God.

[Kenyaman]

There are still plenty of horrible commercials. Just no more of *their* horrible commercials. :) Why doesn't the /. crowd scream about all our TV shows getting interrupted every few minutes for ads like they do about pop-up, banner, and pop-under ads?

CEO - $3.4 Million Bonus for CH. 11

[3333t00l]

The CEO signed a contract with a $3.4M bonus to guide Rhythm's through Bankruptcy. They called it a 'retention bonus' where he is paid $100K per month, to suffer the 'indignity' of working for a bankrupt company- I guess.
Contract
For that much money, I would have thought he would have had a better plan than 'fire everybody and turn off the network.'

Anyway, the future of Rythms is a lawsuit. They are suing Verizon for $4 BILLION in damages for obstructing competition. The lawsuit will continue through bankruptcy(they are even taking on new investors to help fund the suit in return for a cut of the award) Makes yesterday's slashdot post on the Verizon $1.5M a month fines a little more meaningful.

who?

[GC]

Never heard of this company.

Data Carrier companys are a pretty boring topic...

Not much money in pushing packets around...

Maybe indirectly...

[Mustang Matt]

Rhythms could have been providing the line and another ISP could have been providing the service.

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Anne_Nonymous]

Yes, and from now on people, please refer to "Intel, a microprocessor maunfacturer"; "Microsoft a software procucts company"; and "Cisco, a data networking concern".

Northpoint-Rhythms-??

[Saeger]

After Northpoint went bellyup, existing customers were transitioned to Rythms (at least in NYC) in March/April earlier this year. Just a few months later and now Rhythms goes down the tube too eh?

Makes me glad I dumped my northpoint SDSL for Cable rather than be transitioned to another loser.

Not necessarily

[Mustang Matt]

I don't think Rhythms and northpoint were in the consumer aDSL market as much as they were into the business SDSL market.

They had plans above and beyond small $40/month circuits.

It would seem to me that they should have been able to charge anything shfot of the price of a T1 and make money because it was the only "low-cost" high speed business internet connection available to my knowledge.

Execs will be OK, though

[Anonymous Coward]

Looks like the CEO and other executives lined their pockets just in time, see this story: http://jumpfn.123jump.com/story.htm?news_id=697705 2&sid=3

Porn.

[Anonymous Coward]

'Nuff said.

And the question is...

[Anonymous Coward]

How many Aeron chairs did they buy to get into this mess?

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Anonymous Coward]

Except that everyone here knows who Intel or Microsoft is. The only reason I know who Rythms is is that I watch WB on my Dish, and get ads from other corners of the states.

Not to mention the very contacorous overseas contingent.

Bellsouth charges Earthlink $33 per DSL line in

[Shivetya]

Bellsouth charges Earthlink 33.00 dollars per DSL line in Atlanta, and EL charges me 49.95. I submitted a story about an idea to break up the baby bells (but alas it was rejected) http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-6818658.html? tag=tp_pr

Your going to see more and more of these resellers fail simply because when the bell's do open their networks they jack the prices so high that they don't ever have to fear that their own services unit (read ISP+) will have a problem selling overpriced product.

I wonder how long before they justify raising the rates they charge to Earthlink (Bellsouth raising rates) because of needs to improve the network.

Ha, ha ha!

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, it is quite amusing to pretend that three giant companies are as well known as one moderately unknown company. Ha ha! You have made my day with this witticism.

the chicken or the egg

[canning]

Access speeds need to increase to take Internet use tot he next level, yet at the same time, there has to be useful broadband content to merit the cost of increasing access speeds. But what will come first?

Why work at Rhythms?

[andy@petdance.com]

Their bankruptcy problems undoubtedly trace back to their free sodas and fruit.

Fruit?

Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Giant Hairy Spider]

Really now, how hard would it be to refer to them as "Rhythyms, a DSL connection provider," instead of forcing you to read the story to figure out whether it's something you care about.

Re:Yet another uninformative top-level post.

[Anonymous Coward]

"Founded in 1975, Microsoft is the worldwide leader in software, services and Internet technologies for personal and business computing. The company offers a wide range of products and services designed to empower people through great software -- any time, any place and on any device." That's funny, Windows doesn't seem to want to run on my Sun Sparc. Any device my ***.

Monopolies continue to win

[Multics]

This continues to prove that there is little hope in the USA at the moment to fight the wireline carriers (the "baby bells" if you will). The Justice Departments inactivity in assuring that the FCC's open access rules are fairly applied will leave the US with a second-rate, anti-competitive, near third-world broadband data network with no hope of anything better to come.

The death of the 'new economy' broad band providers is likely to be a signal that the US's era of predominance in technology is slowly comeing to an end. Western Europe, though slower to get started, is still apt to come away a winner.

I hope the satalite based systems come on line, work smoothly and decide to make 'everyone' level prices. The wireline wars are over and the users all lost.

-- Multics.

Re:Monopolies continue to win

[Anonymous Coward]

Let's see... how about if western europe standardizes on one common currency first! Hey I got a great idea how about baseing it off of the American dollar! Yeah that sounds great! But we can't call it a dollar because the Frenchies hate America, so we will call it a Euro. That should only take us a few months or so to roll out....

What is this?

[delmoi]

Fucked company?

Really, could have given us a little more info....

Damn

[mimbleton]

I have very nice setup here in Chicago suburb with static IP and everything from Telocity.
I know Telocity here runs on Rhythm network I just hope they will resolve that issue without significant service interruption.

Competition?

[Anonymous Coward]

Do they operate in an area with intense competition?

Re:who?

[cnkeller]

Not much money in pushing packets around...

Tell that to Cisco.....Yeah, yeah, I know you meant from the ISP sense....

Northpoint... now Rhythms...

[tre]

It seems as though there's a trend brewing in the residential/small business broadband/*dsl markets. Maybe people are realizing real business requires frame relay, OC lines, etc...

Of course... it could all stem from the tactics used by monopolies to rub out competitors. who knows...

Their Website Is Down Already!

[robbyjo]

Hey! They should maintain their website for at least a couple of months to inform their user. Check out www.rhythms.net

A Fine Example of Booty-Covering...

[Halloween Jack]

The statements contained in these materials which are not historical facts may contain forward-looking statements with respect to events, the occurrence of which involve risks and uncertainties. Such statements are indicated by words or phrases such as "anticipate," "estimate," "projects," "believes," "intends," "expects" and similar words and phrases.

English translation: A note to the differently-clued: we cannot predict the future.

Re:A Fine Example of Booty-Covering...

[slykens]

This is more a SEC requirement than anything. I used to work for a public company and any press release that went out had to have a standard disclaimer at the bottom.

You got it right in the basic statement, but it also says, "If you invest all your money in us and lose it all because of what we said, then it's your own damn fault. We didn't lie to you."

well now...

[SGDarkKnight]

i guess thats one good way to get people to read the article (even if the article dosn't give very much information except for say "were done")

for anyone who really wants to read up on it, go here.

The best part of this...

[Outland Traveller]

... is that my ISP is on top of it. I just gave them a call because I know that I'm on Rhythms, and the last time my CLEC shut down (NorthPoint) my old ISP (Empire.net) simply dropped all their customers, and I was without a decent internet
connection for a month.

Anyway, I gave my current ISP (GalaxyDSL.net) a call because of the Rhythms news, and they have already started transitioning customers over to other providers. They said that they expected minimal, if any, downtime, and that I would be contacted shortly to make an appointment for a new router installation. Apparently they have dealt with this situation before from when HarvardNet closed down, and they are well prepared. The tech said that it was likely that I would be switched over sometime next week. Amazing!

I've lived in and around Boston for most of my life and have had accounts with almost every ISP in the area since ISP's existed. I've never seen such great technical support and customer service as with galaxydsl.net. They've been on top of the code red problems, the cisco router vulnerabilities, and now the Rhythms shutdown. When I call for support I get right through to an actual technician. They are a great alternative to Verizon/Time Warner if anyone's looking for one.

No, I am not affiliated with them in any way, just pleasantly surprised by the service.

-OT

Re:expect it to /.'ed

[Tackhead]

Don't you mean:

> Rhythms NetConnections Inc. (OTC Bulletin Board: RTHMQ), a provider of broadband communication services,

...will soon no longer be a provider of broadband communication services. We're not pining for the fjords, we've passed on, joined the choir invisible...

An ISP went under. BFD.

[Anonymous Coward]

This is news why? ISPs go out of business all the time, why is this one special enough to make it to /.? Are we going to hear about it every time a DSL provider fails? Better make a new category for ISP deaths so I can ignore it.

ip.net = bandwidth hog?

[Jim Efaw]

This is probably mostly ranting, but: I don't see why the average Slashdot user would choose an Internet company that (1) requires a couple minutes to load their web page on a modem (which is where the future DSL customers are coming from); and (2) forcing users to view, without asking, a full-motion Flash file that has no useful function at all, but makes the computer drag trying to view it anyway.

Maybe they have some web page "developers" to keep paid in a sagging market, or maybe some marketing consultants instead. Anyway, I think that, when you see that sort of thing (95% what looks pretty on their own 1.3GHz Pentiums over Ethernet, and 5% content the customers are looking for), it's often an omen of what kind of attitude to expect from a company once you subscribe.

(For what it's worth: I've worked at places where folks like like that got "cute" web pages put up despite the tech staff having common sense, so this might not reflect on the tech staff-- just the people who control how the company relates to customers. Maybe I'm just bitter.)

Wireless freenets...

[cr0sh]

For the "undernets" - this will be no problem - we are already seeing the beginning of them in many major cities - I am certain there are more in other cities, just unannounced at this point, for whatever reason.

For the "common man", though - highly unlikely, simply because they take more "technical" knowledge than the "common man" is willing to ante up to learning about.

Think of the cable companies - now, really - how hard would it be to set up a cheap, multi-channel, cable system in a neighborhood - a few cheap satellite dishes, some descramblers (heck, make 'em legal even), distribution amps, coax, etc - and a lot of labor, but it could be done. In fact, that is how cable companies originally got started - a bunch of neighbors got together to install a large antenna so they could all share it (instead of having individual, and less receptive, antennas on their roofs). Eventually, some of these "co-ops" got bought out, and the ball started rolling.

However, this was all at a time when people cared about "do-it-yourself" - the vast majority today would love an ass-wiping machine, if one existed - the lazy fucks.

Finally - insofar as wireless networking is concerned - the use of 802.11 is flawed. Sure, the frequency spectrum right now is unregulated, but it probably won't stay that way. Once the corps get wind that these undernets are either a) eating into profits (unlikely) or b) causeing other economic, social, or political problems - they will lobby to have the frequencies licensed, or in some way severely regulated.

These homebrew systems should be looking into some alternative form - light, or something else (because I wouldn't doubt that "they" will try to regulate light as a communications medium) - and move away from radio systems...

Unintentional Doublespeak

[bachelor3]

From their employee benefits page:

Holidays

You are provided with the following days off for these approved 2001 holidays:

• New Year's Day January 1, 2001
• Memorial Day May 28, 2001
• Independence Day July 4, 2001
• Labor Day September 3, 2001
• Thanksgiving Day November 22, 2001
• Day after Thanksgiving November 23, 2001
• Christmas Eve December 24, 2001
• Christmas December 25, 2001
• 1 Floating Holiday of your choice with manager's approval

Well, I suppose that's one way to describe it...

i'll tell ya why they failed...

[Anonymous Coward]

it was their annoying commercial that did them in.

This is news?

[fobbman]

White guys have been without rhythm for generations.

Free Markets, Public Works, and Monopolies

[FreeUser]

A colleague of mine and I were discussing this just this morning (he is a Ritym's subscriber).

Many of the DSL failures are a result, at least in part, of being jerked around by the provisioner of the last mile of wire. Here in Chicago that monopolist would be Ameritech -- notorious for deliberately delaying and mucking with the installation of competitor's DSL lines, despite a plethora of FCC regulations designed to prevent this sort of unfairness. I had personal experience with this, as did my colleague, when our DSL lines (from different providors) were provisioned.

When breaking up so-called "natural" monopolies with the intent of creating competition a very obvious oversight has been made, at least here in the United States, quite probably as a result of the rather radical anti-anything-that-remotely-smells-like-it-could-m aybe-be-considered-socialistic-by-anyone-to-the-ri ght-of-Gengis-Khan political atmosphere that has imbued the country since the early Reagan days. To whit, why do "natural monopolies" exist, what makes them a "natural monopoly," and why shouldn't the factor, or commonality, be treated as a public works project the way we do other "natural monopolies" such as roads and highways?

Take electricity, water, and telecommunications as examples. What made the electric company a natural monopoly? Not power generation, but delivery to your home ... i.e. the physical wire. What made telecommunications a natural monopoly? Once again, not the intervening network and its services so much as the last mile of wire to your house. Water? Not, in most places, the water acquisition (it can come from rivers, aquafers, lakes, even the air if you can figure out how to do that economically) but rather the physical pipe to your faucet.

Instead of even considering nationalizing the infrastructure (there's another word which has fallen victim to the anti-communism hysteria of the early 80's and has remained taboo since) we have chosen instead to impliment an absurdly byzantine set of regulations prohibiting this, requireing that, and hopefully resulting in a level playing field. An approach far more favorable to error or outright corruption, and far less conducive to a level playing field and the competition such would engender than simply treating the wire like a public road, with equal access to all, would have.

I would submit that bottlenecks which create so-called natural monopolies, such as highways, the last mile(s) of telephone wire, and perhaps even the entire power grid, should be treated the same as highways, paid for and administered by government via taxes or access fees and provided to all of the competing service providors under the same terms.

The disadvantes would be the same ones we have with highways: a certain amount of government bloat, a certain amount of corruption in contracting and subcontracting, and a certain amount of government ineffeciency.

Just as with highways the advantages would far outweigh this, however: a level playing field for all competing businesses, an elimination of byzantine FCC regulations designed (and failing) to counter the monopolistic advantages under the current, wholely private, approach, an administration that is open to public scruitiny and nominally accountable to the public via our democratic process, and quite possibly economies of scale that might well offset the added overhead inherent in government administration of any project.

Monopolies are ineffecient, whether they are government or private. Where they must exist, as with roads, it makes far more sense that they be in public hands, a part of the public commons, rather than in the hands of some private Robber Barron a la' the Rhein River of two centuries ago.

Finally, I would argue that a free, competetive market cannot exist when the underlying infrastructure for that market resides in the hands of a private monopoly. Indeed, it appears that a competetive market on top of such an infrastructure is difficult, perhaps impossible, to maintain even if it is highly regulated. However, as we've seen with the success of our transportation companies, airlines can compete very well with public airports and automobile companies as well as trucking companies compete very well on public highways.

Perhaps it is time we reevaluated our love affair with private ownership of nearly all our basic infrastructures and put aside our aversion to nationalization and consider the question from the point of view of how to we structure things to eliminate private monopolies and maximize competetive free markets while at the same time minimizing the need for intrusive government regulation.

Thank God.

[Count]

No more horrible comercials!

Re:expect it to /.'ed

[Myco]

Copying the article.

Cheapest. Mod points. Ever.

Re:WOHOO - NO MORE "YOU'VE GOT RYTHIM" COMMERCIALS

[Lotek]

Amen to that, brother. Those commercials were so annoying I would turn off my radio rather than listening to them. Funny once, annoying the next twelve billion times.

Probably went bust because...

[ackthpt]

...because few people can remember how to spell 'Rhythm', I know I have to look it up all the time... Then again, maybe people thought it was something for catholics only...