Slashdot Mirror
Nick Cancelling Invader Zim
orn writes "Lots of my slashdotting friends turned me on to Invader Zim not so long ago. Well, aintitcool.com is reporting that the show is being cancelled." Now that really sucks. Zim was absolute genius in terms of art, use of CG, and just flat out hilarious writing. I'll miss this one a lot.
Greg is going to be pissed. He really likes the guy who draws it. It's the same guy who does the homicidal maniac apparently.
The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
Don't get me wrong, I absolutely loved the show, but I always felt uncomfortable about its placement on Nickelodeon, a kid's network if there ever was one. The show's content, much like the class "Ren and Stimpy" episodes back from when Jim K. still had control of the show, is just too subversive for little kids. The show is more akin to things like "Family Guy" and "South Park" than it is to "Wild Thornberries" or whatever inane kiddie trash Klasky-Csupo is barfing over Nickelodeon these days. Hopefully the show will find a new, better home on Comedy Central or another such station where it would be a much better fit.
Loneliness is a power that we possess to give or take away forever
You guys sound like a bunch of kids. Grow up!
* - dismal
** - extremely shitty
*** - drawn-out, redundant, no good, very bad
Nickelodeon is quickly becoming a channel that shows exactly four different shows: Rugrats, SpongeBob, that one show that had Burger King toys a while back, and another new show that takes everything TO THE EXTREME!! I'd rather they showed stuff like Zim, but then I remembered - that's what Cartoon Network is for! Fuck Nick. Show Zim on the channel that actually has quality TV like Cowboy Bebop!
It also seems that Nick is cancelling other shows as well, such as Spongebob Squarepants and Hey Arnold. At that site you can petition for the show not to be canceled. There are 1797 Signatures right now. Help out now!
The http://slashdot.org/aintitcool.com link in the article is wrong. Use this instead.
--Metrollica
According to the article, it isn't being axed immediately--next season there will be only six episodes instead of 20, which means there will still be 16 more new episodes to wait for.
However, it is still disappointing. I've only seen Invader Zim a couple times (my cable company doesn't carry that channel) but it was one of the best shows I've seen in a long time. Unfortunately, I believe Nickelodeon marketed it to the wrong audience: it should have been aimed at teenagers and adults. Most young children don't appreciate it enough.
Perhaps if Invader Zim had been on another network, one that doesn't focus on children's entertainment, it would have fared better.
Hopefully somebody else will pick it up. If not it's too bad, because I just started watching the show.
Am I the only one here who has never heard of any of the animes the /. editors keep talking about?
Repeal the DMCA!
Haha, hilarious
NoItAint.com!
Free Java games for your phone: Tontie, Sokoban
Time to write Nick and your cable company- remember, if you want them to give a damn, send a paper letter, not just a quick email. Companies that totally ignore email will usually at least read a nicely typed non-form-letter via US Mail. If you're lucky, you'll get a form letter in reply...
I'd go so far as to say that Invader Zim is one of the best new shows in years, and by far the most original animated show on the air (only because Simpsons and Futurama have been pretty sucky lately).
No Zim, no more reason for me to watch any of the rest Nicks' sanitized freak show of a network.
I do not deploy Linux. Ever.
(No GIR, that's a bad thing...)
Heard about this a while ago...
If you're pissed off, check out this online petition and send lots of e-mails to the execs at Nickelodeon.
The one nice thing about this, though, is that now Jhonen can concentrate on possibly releasing a second series of Johnny the Homicidal Maniac. Ooooooo.... It almost makes me go head-explodey just thinking about it. =)
*Runs off to his poprocks and Cherry Slushies*
Karma: Non-Heinous
Here is another petition to keep Invader Zim to stay on the air.
--Metrollica
disclaimer: I work at nickelodeon, but not in programming.
disclaimer2: Zim is my favorite animated show.
I can't say much for our programming department, I don't even really know who they are being as I don't work with them, but I sure would love to give them a swift kick in the ass.
Firstly Zim premiered and showe Friday nights at 9:30.. no wonder the ratings weren't that high, they barely gave it a chance in that slot. Reruns during the week were scarse and oddly timeslotted as well.
Secondly, its too good for Nick. Its quite simple, as Ren and Stimpy was too good. Its offbeat, its different, its interesting.. that means its scary to network executives who would rather contract another cookie-cutter piece of crap show from Klasky Csupo than take a risk on something exciting such as Zim.
Thirdly, they did very little in the way of promotion. I can't tell you how many people tell me that they've never heard of Zim, despite either watching Nick themselves, or having children that do. What do you do with the bastard child? Ignore it and hope he goes away.. good job.
Fourthly, Zim appeals to a very odd demographic which makes it hard to target. Its too dark for kids, its too weird for older parents, its almost right for the teenage crowd, but they're usually doing something else friday nights. It REALLY appeals to most 18-27 year old I've talked to, which unfortunately is not Nick's market. We've become the MTV of the pre-teeners, since MTV is now filled with teenagers.
Fifthly.. wait is that a word? Ok nevermind, I've gone on too long. I'm just quite upset at the news and I hang onto hope that someone here will get their head straight and give Zim another chance, its one of the most original, refreshing, and fun cartoons to come out of any network in a long time. No more rugrats, no more Arnold, Spongebob can stay, but he must OBEY THE FIST.
-ride the pig, -nA
^nA! Creatures in my Head
It's a simple cartoon. It's not from Japan.
Translation: "I watch only Invader Zim on Nick. Cancel IZ and I won't watch any other of Nick's shows even though I don't watch them anyway."
Huh?
A slight update to the post I made a bit ago. Here's an online petition:
http://www.gopetition.com/info.php?petid=536
And here's the nickelodeon "write to nick" website:
http://www.nick.com/blab/write_nick/
But the best would be to write a pen and paper letter to them. Here's a snail mail address:
Nickelodeon / MTV Networks
1515 Broadway
New York, NY 10036
Rudy
1. 2.
Zim was the only good show on their entire network! Have they noticed that people are downloading divx versions of the whole series on P2P networks?
It's because the show never seemed to be on TV!
I would gladly sit through all those damn commercials if I was able to actually watch Zim at a nice TV resolution..
I guess now I'll have to get my Vasquez fix via JTHM and Squee.
For the love of God, Invader Zim is the best new show since The Simpsons. I agree that it may have been targeted to the wrong audience, but that doesnt seem to have been its only problem. I watched nick all the time to try to find Zim, but they would never tell you when it would be on. How are you supposed to find a show they never advertise? Let's all hope that somehow the show lives on.
The article suggests that Nick is pulling Zim due to poor ratings- yet how can they expect good ratings when they randomly move the show to a new time slot every week? When they randomly show 'Wild Thornberries' in the slot Invader Zim was scheduled for, causing my Tivo to waste valuable recoding time? When they fail to supply episode descriptions 90% of the time?
In my opinion, the worst sin of Nicktoons is the 'splitting' of episodes, where they take the individual segments that make up a 30-minute episode of Zim, CatDog, etc and package it with some live action slime game or other filler into a fifteen minute slot.
Worse than that, they tend to start shows early and end them late, especially with these 15-minute half-episodes, so TiVo misses large portions of the cartoon.
With the cancellation of Zim, I have one less reason to bother turning on the TV anymore.
I do not deploy Linux. Ever.
But the parents pay for them. Don't forget to complain to your local cable franchise. I would suspect more will be done if enough cable companies ask about why the shows are disappearing.
Excuse me, but why is Nickelodeon going to get rid of its best shows? (OK, so Hey Arnold is mush, but Spongebob is an excellent kids' show, and Invader Zim can be compared to anime.) They'd better have something REALLY BIG coming in for them to deprive kids of their favorite cartoons.
Think of the CHILDREN, people, of the CHILDREN!
Hopefully the show will find a new, better home on Comedy Central or another such station where it would be a much better fit.
How about FOX? They host great shows.
--Metrollica
Someone was kind enough to start a petition in favor of keeping the show, and losing some of the obvious censorship that has happened since 9/11. Please stop by and sign! Even if this doesn't "convince Nick" to keep the show, it should show the other stations how much of a following Grr (oh yeah, and Zim) have gathered. :-) Please sign it!
one, two, one two like a duck
Most die-hard Zim fans probably know this, but if you're a fan of a show but not familiar with Jhonen Vasque's other work, you owe it to yourself to get ahold of a copy of Squee and Johnny the Homicidal Maniac. The first is the more accessable and Zim-like; the second is Jhonen's quintisential work, but it is much darker and more philosophical. All his work is available from Slave Labor Graphics. (Avoid Fillerbunny and especially the Bad Art Collection; these are for die-hard fans only.)
More info:
Link
Link
Link
Link
Animaniacs,
Tom And Jerry,
Bugs Bunny,
We miss you.
I never understood how Jhonen Vasquez sold this show to Nick in the first place. I mean, it was probably my favorite piece of animation on tv, but the humor was definitely above kids' heads. I just hope he keeps doing animation and doesn't go back to comic books.
The reason Invader Zim, Spongebob, and 2 other shows are being dropped has everything to do with 16 out of 19 writers signing union cards.
There is no unionization in the animation industry, and Nickelodeon means to keep it that way.
Nick staffers demand union representation
There was a story on yahoo! news last week that made the link clearer, but I can no longer find it.
--
Industrial Workers of the World
I'll admit. I have no clue who or what Zim is. I don't get cable (by choice), so Nick's a choice. That said, I did see in this discussion statements to the effect that "it's the best thing since the Simpsons."
... if Zim is as good, then is there a possibility that it would be picked-up by another network, cable or otherwise ?
Now I do know who/what the Simpons are, and am wondering
healyourchurchwebsite.com - WWJB?
So. Who buys the ratings bullshit?
Honestly. There's a lot more shows that pull in worse ratings than Invader Zim and that don't have the same cult following that Zim has behind it.
I think Nickelodeon didn't think when they gave a man who happened to author a comic called "Johnny The Homicidal Maniac" a Children's TV Show.
Go watch Dark Harvest. What kind of Kid wouldn't get nightmares from watching that episode? Honestly... just whenever he opens his mouth and you see all the guts inside.
Not to mention the unaired FBI Warning episode, which is as such simply because it was apparently too controversial (Anybody care to shed some light behind why? I think it had something to do with Sept11...).
This is a Viacom move, I'm guessing... and thusly political. Nickelodeon is Viacom's Kids Network, and being that Zim, much like Undergrads, The Oblongs, The Simpsons (so far the only one out of that list that was actually promoted _right_) and a pantheon of other cartoons aren't geared towards kids, were promoted as kids' shows, of course it's going to get pulled...
The problem is the only more recent controversial cartoon that actually managed to survive through all of it got worn out in the first year (*coughSouthParkcough*) and after that it wasn't really funny anymore...
So it's not a kids show. I honestly think Viacom should look around at its other channels (MTV?) for support of Zim.
And while they're at it, they should push someone in Canada to pick it up. I hate having to watch all the episodes on my computer.
Karma: Non-Heinous
Read this
--Metrollica
Zim was absolute genius in terms of art, use of CG, and just flat out hilarious writing. I'll miss this one a lot.
So why didn't you guys ever talk about it on here and let us know about the show, and maybe turn some more fans onto it?
Apparently, Invader ZIM won an Emmy for animation work. (Specifically, Kyle Menke got the Emmy for his storyboarding work.) Too bad it's being cancelled--it really is a quality show.
That you all can take the time to petition for stupid TV shows to keep them from being cancelled, yet most of you can't seem to be arsed to write your representatives whenever terrible bills such as the PATRIOT act, DMCA, and SSSCA are in the process of being made into law. I would say our freedom is a bit more important than a stupid television show.
Loneliness is a power that we possess to give or take away forever
Ahh!! I just watched something like 2 minutes of Invader ZIM, and loved it. I read a few pages of Johnny The Homicidal Maniac (Disturbing) and got hooked on it. My friend has the graphic novel of JTHM, so i guess i will have to borrow it. But when are Invader ZIM DVDs coming out? That'd be great to add to my DVDs.
A friend of mine who is a big fan of the show has started a petition on this topic already. He's gotten around 1200 signatures already. If you like the show, and want it back, please sign it. Click For copy and pasters: http://www.petitiononline.com/zq1010/
First the tick...then the x-files...then invader zim! What do these shows have in common? Several slashdotters enjoyed them, but they were cancelled. Instead of insulting the networks, perhaps there was a reason why?
These shows had low ratings! That's right! TV is not an area for art to shine through! It is a commercialized and mechanized zoo that automatically produces animals that the public in general will want to see for entertainment. Without people seeing them, they are not as valued, and who are we to say that our shows are better than anyone else's?
If you want to see some maverick but potentially good art, go watch independent films, or better yet, make your own! But don't look to TV for an art form, all it is is an area where they can broadcast 30 second advertisements to drones watching them, in hope that they can coerce them into buying something!
"I have not failed. I've simply found 10,000 ways that won't work." --Thomas Edison
For those of you to lazy to write a real letter try this:http://www.nick.com/blab/write_nick/index.jht ml. It is a web-based comment submission form from nick.com. If possible, however, write with real paper, neatly typed and signed. (Primary tablet and crayon would also be good, but make sure, if you do sign it "love" instead of sincerly hehe)
Little Brother, watching the watchers
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Exhibit A: http://slashdot.org/aintitcool.com
Until there's at least some basic proofreading, who would pay for this?
In a perfect world, Zim would be picked up and added to Cartoon Network, who would then play an Adult Swim block every night.
In an even more perfect world they would also pick up and renew The Critic, then steal Family Guy and Futurama from Fox and give them slots where they have a chance at getting eyeballs and ratings.
In a perfect world...
------
Today's Top Deals
so the Cartoon Network can keep buying them and playing them during the stoner^H^H^Hdaytime hours.
Goat sex free since 2001
If the creators and producers of Spongebob Squarepants quit, Nickelodeon would kill them and bring them back as mind-altered gholas to continue the show. This is an extremely hot property for Nick and they'd do anything under heaven and earth to keep it (so long as it stays this popular).
Invader Zim, on the other hand, does a lot to miss Nick's target audience and so has declining ratings, and... well, just isn't that impressive (IMHO).
Get off my lawn.
check this out http://www.cooltoons.com/shows/mcdonalds/Ron.gif
Isn't that the scariest clown you've ever seen?
To say I'm disappointed would be true. To say I'm surprised, would not be. Anyone who didn't see this coming needs to be hit in the head with a large bat. This show definitely had, as someone earlier noted, some hella subversive material in it.
I was watching one particular episode and noticed that there were a lot of signs in the background containing all sorts of little messages. "Stop making babies!" "The Goat wants you!" and "Love or DIE!" were all some of them. It's hilarious, but definitely pretty messed up.
It probably cost a lot to make, judging from the quality of the animation. Damn it was good.
I wonder how much we're directly responsible for, though. I only watched three or four episodes on TV, then began to download them, only to never tune in again. I wonder how many other people opted to download episodes instead of watch them when they were broadcast. Only in hindsight do I realize that I was cheating the show of the ratings it so desperately needed to stay on the air. So I can't help but feel somewhat responsible for its death. After all, you get what you give.
---------
Sometimes there's no other way to win, except by falling.
great now we'll start having flamewars over petion sites
gopetition vs. petiononline
when will the madness end?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Nick kept on screwing around with the timeslot which made it kinda hard to watch. It seemed that it changed every week.
I doubt anyone will pick up this show because
1) its a very small audience who can understand zim and jhonen vasquez's work
2) the show is expensive with all the cgi they do. i read an interview with vasquez and nick was the only place that had the capital to support the technology they use to animate
The only good part about this is that jhonen will be able to work on johnny the homicidal maniac. The only thing that was stopping him was all the time he had to dedicate to zim.
Unfortunately I doubt that nick will release the series in DVD form because they never do that with any of their shows. Stupid humans
How is ZIM any worse than, say, MAD Magazine?
Having ZIM around would have made my school years far more endurable. "My GOD! It's not just me! Somebody else out there also sees that nearly all the people populating this school are dangerous, immature, socially retarded, materialist, petty morons! Whew! I was beginning to think there really WAS something wrong with me like everybody keeps saying!"
I guess the only thing that bothers me about ZIM is that it utterly condemns humanity; while ZIM does actively attempt to expose the everyday bullshit we must live with in this world, watching would lead one to think that there isn't anything good or worthwhile out there at all, which is completely false.
Rather than cancel ZIM, I'd prefer to see it stay on while infusing Nick's programming with shows which carry underlying messages which promote honor and noble living. I seem to recall things like, "G-Force" having a positive effect on me as a kid. I'd suggest the promotion of stuff like "Sailor Moon" if it wasn't for the weird sexuality of it, and the whole bit about girls being tough and capable, but only so long as the strong male lead can rescue them on a regular basis. What shit.
And "Pokemon" is basically just, "Cock-Fighting for Kids."
Now THAT'S creepy.
-Fantastic Lad
First of all I have seen a small number of Zim episodes and was not impressed. While it does have it's moments (I enjoy GIR), most of the material in it was loud-obnoxious-gross-out stuff, kinda like Ren and Stimpy in their bad episodes. I just don't know how people call this inspired. Again, I could be missing something. Please enlighten me.
Secondly, all the posts about Zim being the best cartoon in years must not realize that Adult Swim exits and in particular the hour from 11-12p.m EST that they show "Williams Street" productions.
I highly recommend checkin it out Sunday and Thursday nights on the Cartoon Network. That's not to mention that they play Cowboy Bepop for you anime fans.
just my opinion, ignore it or mod it down at will
impto
-------------
If they'd mete out the series at a sane pace, leaving people looking forward to each new episode and hanging about to see what's on afterward, they'd get a lot more bang for their animation dollar.
A few other networks have taken to doing this same thing. Somebody needs to up and shoot whoever the program managers are that covered Invader Zim, and The Tick, which enjoyed the very same problem.
Hey All. :) ). Jimmy Neutron did well, at about $75mil (on a $25mil investment). Final Fantasy lost $100mil on a $130mil investment. Sucks, dat.
:) ). But we're cheap to make and can get by with smaller numbers on the viewer side, and so our exiztenz makes sense in accountant-think. And nobody's fighting for our 10pm time slot.
Agreed, this bites pretty hard, but lets face it. These shows cost on the order of half a mil per to produce and that ain't chump change. The studios, dens of penny-pinching evil that they are, aren't into this for art or charity (unless one of those happens to pay well at the time).
From a business perspective 2001 was a big year for animation. Between Shrek and Monsters Inc. alone the film side pulled down over $700mil (forgive my Reaganic dollar stats, I'll do the research later
The differences between these? Neutron was for kids only, but did well there. Fantasy was for its director only, and nobody else gave a rat's arse. (Sad, that - a lot of good people put their souls into FF.) The big money was made on the crossover films, those that got the kids and 'rents into the theaters.
So, in TV land, that's what Nick's after. At least get the kids. Get the parents in if you can. (There's a gazillion cheap-as-Enron-stock 60's sitcoms to cover the adult-only demographic on Nick, so no toonz for the 14+ crowd). You got a crossover, you got da bitchin' dinero. Zim nabbed a piece of the older crowd but failed with the kids. Shelf space (air time) ain't cheap tho, so a mild success counts as a failure. At'sa why Zim was in strange, unpredictable slots - you give the prime space to the known good quantities, and it's sink or swim for the second string. So the green guy's gotta find another planet what to stomp on 'cause Arnold swiped his life vest.
I spend my days at South Park. Yeah, we still make it, and we're still CC's best show ( IMHO
I'd love to see Zim live on in another viewer-space. Comedy Central could always stand another less than abysmal show. We'd just need to convince that Johnen boyo to take off the kid gloves and bring to Zim some o' that indulgently evil goodnes he shows us in JTHM and 'I Feel Sick' and whatnot.
Well, that's how it might work in a more tasty world. If the Zimsters need a new production system set up, they can swing by South Park and we'll get 'em set up (cheap? we do cheap good). We'll just have to talk bout that Lightwave - artistically adequate, but a logistics headache. I just wonder if any of them would want to swap an XLg South Park film crew jacket for a Zim crew jacket. Thos're pretty k3w1. %P
-- AC
It's too bad so many good shows are being and have been cancelled over the past several years.
I don't know about the rest of the slashdot crowd, but when I was a child,I would not have been shocked / upset by any of the topics shown in Invader Zim.
It was a strange day that I didn't imagine being a space invader, seeing/conquering strange new worlds, being "LORD OF ALL HUMANS!!!", etc... This sort of creative imagination is what enabled me to get THROUGH childhood.
Zim's complete inability to circumvent authority coupled with his dogged determination to do just that, all while having to report to the the Tallest (which in my universe as a child would have been Mom and Dad) make this show identifiable to children. This sort of television isn't shocking to them, so why should we worry about it as adults?
I know when I was that age, I absolutely LOVED Ren and Stimpy, for some of the same reasons (it wasn't syrupy sweet intelligence insulting blatant pacifism intended cartooning like most of the other cartoons on TV at the time; for example one of the other original nicktoons, Doug.)
Eschew Obfuscation
You must be a real hit at parties.
Like hm, Friday nights are a good time for it? Like hm, two scheduled Invader Zim marathons (which can help to BUILD fanbase) were cancelled with no notice? Like hm, moving the show half an hour without any real prior notice (oh say, like announcing it on the previous week's show)? Like hm, merchandice promised to be for sale from Hot Topic by Christmas STILL isn't available (where's my damn Gir Plushie?!?!)? (And BTW, while I don't have great respect for Hot Topic, as it's Goth Lite in most cases, who the HELL thought it would be a good idea to sell SPONGEBOB DORKPANTS there? Tell me how SBSP meets the Hot Topic demographic....).
Rest assured, Nick has done everything they can to destroy the show.
7 November 2006: The day Americans realized corruption and incompetence weren't addressing 11 September 2001
A lot of stuff on there is NOT quality, especially their DBZ crap and stuff like Zoids (they killed Reboot for THAT?!?).
Remember, there were no nuclear weapons before women were allowed to vote.
Hey..that number is local to me. I think I will give him a call tonight.
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=26315&cid=285
I personally think since the "MTV-ising" of Nickelodean started they sorta went downhill (then again, I AM an adult -- perhaps I should stop watching cartoons as well?) The only cartoon I truely care about nowadays is Dexter's Laboratory, because even though I've seen some episodes a number of times they continue to surprise me. Plus, a great majority of episodes were funny. If either it or SpongeBob were to leave the airwaves permenantly I would probably be a little upset.
I throw Invader Zim into the same pool I throw Rocko's Modern Life, Ren & Stimpy, Sheep in the Big City and the Grim and Evil show in -- supposedly "adult" cartoons that just come off like college students' art projects.
Parties are for the sheep. I'm sure he hangs out in his basement Saturday nights, crying because no one on Earth is as intelligent, mature, or insightful as he is.
I work at Nickelodeon too... in the programming department. I'm a Assistant for Mark Christianesen, Junior VP of programming.
napalm, are you that slightly obese, greasy looking, geeky guy? I think I've seen you in the halls. Could you please leave some doughnuts in the break room for the rest of us? Thanks, some of us don't take our breaks 15 minutes after we get to the office.
By the way, you're so fucking fired.
+ Donald Gunth
+ Email: dgunth@quicktek.net
"Caffeine is the greatest lubricant ever created." -ESR
CmdrTaco, have you ever notice how often shows are taken off the air when *you* like them? Once a month we are treated on Slashdot with "Gee, I liked this show and now they are taking it off the air!!!". I don't think the shows are the problem, its you. Do us all a favor and stop watching television! That way these cool shows will stay on the air. You are a TV Show Jinx.
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
As for "socially retarded": let me guess, you were the outsider who couldn't get along with others, whereas all these people had huge social networks of friends, right? You make me laugh, dweeb.
word
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=26315&cid=285
Heres an interview with Jhonen Vasquez. Its kinda old but its a great read. It has info on the censorship that nick imposed and plenty of fan boy questions. Its very sad to see the show go. I have been a fan of vasquez since the days of Johnny and SQUEE. For all those who doubt the greatness of ZIM download the episodes. ZIM IMO is the best american cartoon out there, and yes I do watch adult swim. Vasquez has a really unique art style and a unique sense of humor. Hes one of the few comic book artists who doesnt draw every woman with double D's
Never heard of it or seen it. Doesn't sound like I missed very much either....
That would be logically impossible as things now stand. The Brak show always comes on BEFORE Sealab does.
That show was crap. The same absolute gross crap that the supposed 'Kids Network' has been pumping down my kids throats for the several years.
You can add it to the atomic dustbin with such pieces of shit as Buck Naked, Butt Ugly Martians, Spongebob, the Fairly Oddparents, etc.... It is all garbage. If there absolutely needs to be programming such as this - make a new teen channel - because thats where such swill should is directed anyway - NOT at my 4 and 7 year olds.
Maybe I am just not 'in' enough to chug a big glass of stupid gross idiocy everynight.
It does not matter what you do, it's wrong.
I don't like the fact that a Nicktoon is being cancelled overall. All of these cartoons are worth viewing and saving, no matter who the intended audience is. To this end, on April 2001, I had started a petition to get all of the Nicktoons episodes released on DVD, uncut and uncensored (especially Ren & Stimpy, and Rocko!). The web site for the petition is at: this link I have collected nearly 1500 signatures so far, and can always use more. Spongebob Squarepants is going to be on DVD soon, so it looks like Viacom is headed toward putting the Nicktoons on DVD in some capacity. Spread the word about this petition. We could even get Invader Zim on DVD!
RedHat/7.2 is a fucking piece of shit! First, something explodes which causes all the man pages to segfault! "groff: troff: Segmentation fault" each time! Oh, what a wonderful OS! Then, it crashes when I try to upgrade the groff RPMs! The fucking process got stuck in "D" uninterruptable-sleep status, not even kill-9'able! What a flaming piece of shit!
Now, all of this happens after a 10-day ordeal trying to just get it (and 7.1) to install without problems there! (FTP errors, can't get the fucking network card module loaded, disk errors, vmlinuz crashing on boot, etc.)! Oh, what a wonderfully stable OS! Definitely ready for the desktop! Can you imagine your grandmother trying to figure out what the installer meant by "Error -2147483630 reading header: cpio: failed - Success" !?!?
RedHat/7.2: Perfect for AOL! What a flaming heap of monkey shit!
"I guess the only thing that bothers me about ZIM is that it utterly condemns humanity; while ZIM does actively attempt to expose the everyday bullshit we must live with in this world, watching would lead one to think that there isn't anything good or worthwhile out there at all, which is completely false." --- dude it's just a really funny show stop reading too much into it -- you go around do that with every show sooner or later your head will explode. Just accept it for what it is --- a crazy show full of funny as f#$k moments.
Maybe it's nothing, and the show was cancelled simply because they didn't know how to handle it, just like the John K. days of Ren & Stimpy. Funny how whenever I would tell someone about Zim, I would always say, "...and for some reason Nicklodeon is airing it." Zim is so subversive and dark-I think all of us knew this day would come, at least those of us who remember what happened to Ren & Stimpy...at least they didn't fire Vasquez and re-edit the show in horrible horrible ways. Well, at least HOPEFULLY they won't...
***
-Unfortunately, I believe Nickelodeon marketed it to the wrong audience: it
-should have been aimed at teenagers and adults.
The real stumper is that Nick approached Jhonen about doing an animated series for them. Considering the previous work he was known for at the time, a la JTHM and Squee, you have to wonder what their ulterior motive was giving Jhonen a series on a childrens' network.
Slashdot is getting around to reporting this story just now, when the news broke about two days ago.... I've come to know Slashdot as usually being ahead of the mainstream media, but this time it seems they've fallen way behind. Or is this another instance of submitted news only being posted now because a particular screener caught the story and deemed it fit to print?
You think that a mere cancelation will stop Zim!!??? You have no idea, you worthless, weak . . .
.......
grr! grr! Stop that! What are you doing!!?? No! Don touch that
It wasn't offtopic.
you can go to here to read the whole story: http://www.tavicat.com/updates.html this is the voice of Gir and one of the colorists' websites. good info I will not comment too much on the whole reason behind it. Ratings, shmatings, the only reason it didn't do better was because it was IMPOSSIBLE to catch. I had a heck of a time finding a schedule for it, I never saw ads for it, I went to Nicks site and couldn't even find the ZIM website! I had to use Google to find all my info. Nick is full of mindless garbage and when zim is gone, I will never watch it, and the kids in the house aren't gonna either.
Yes, Zim is a pretty funny show, but does everyone know why?
Because TV's Frank is the head writer!
Frank Conniff was the head writer for the first sevem episodes. He also played Dr. Forrester's assistant on Mystery Science Theatre 3000. For more details about Frank and other MST3K cast members, go to http://www.mst3kinfo.com. The cast info page is here:
http://www.mst3kinfo.com/scan.html
What makes this really frustrating is that there's more real creativity in the TV industry than there's ever been. I still don't care for most of the result, but there's no denying that most of the real writers and actors and other creative people are really trying hard.
What the heck. TV networks are an obsolete concept anyway. Eventually we'll all have fat pipes into hour homes, and we'll just download what we want to watch. We'll probably have to pay for almost everything, but at least we'll never see that stupid EverReady Bunny again!
I strongly recommend that people go there and voice their support and desire for this series to be continued. To me, Invader Zim is cutting-edge humor on the level of other cult classics like "Space Ghost Coast to Coast." It would be a shame to see it die this young. If enough people speak out Nick might realize the risk they took with this show paid off and that they've gotten the attention of some very choice demographics (eg you and I).
As for "socially retarded": let me guess, you were the outsider who couldn't get along with others, whereas all these people had huge social networks of friends, right? You make me laugh, dweeb.
Ooh. Touched a nerve there, did we?
"You make me laugh, dweeb"? Goodness! That even sounds like a line from one of the pig-children in ZIM. Ahh. Snif. That takes me back!
Though, I'm sorry. In highschool I was actually one of the popular kids. (Shiver. That word.) Though, I made efforts to distance myself from the Cordellia/Heathers and their fashion-clone ilk. With marginal success. -Gad. I'm actually serious. Highschool was bloody strange! Back then I really was an arrogant dick; I wasn't just blowing steam on Slashdot! Why are teenagers drawn to smarmy jerks? I mean, you learn posture, strength of mind, amicability, how to kick the shit out of a bully, how to listen to and sort of care about the pathetic nonsense which passes for the average teenager's life, --and people won't leave you the fuck alone. Everybody wants to be your best friend or your girlfriend or whatever, when it takes every atom of patience you have just to stay in the same room with them!
And yeah, I'm sorry, but most kids I went to school with were fucked up losers with a host of personality problems of one kind or another. Cruel, Boring, Shallow and Spineless seemed to be the factory setting. It was exhausting!
I especially hated the dorks who enjoyed bullying other kids. Especially dorks who bullied the geeks. --The geeks, despite their problems, were the only truly interesting people in the whole freeking school! They liked to think! (Well, the organized crime kids were also pretty interesting; the ones who would cut class and spend the day ripping off anime and expensive art supplies from the shops downtown. . . One guy even lifted an airbrush compressor! What balls! Guerilla artists who refused to work with anything but stolen supplies. How out-there is that?)
In any case, I guess this is why I spend so much time scratching my head here at Slashdot. The people I knew who were into tech knowledge and anime and all things geek were also incredibly smart in dozens of other areas; they were open-minded to levels that Timothy Leary would appreciate, without the chemicals!
They didn't suck up propaganda. They didn't champion Western science as the be-all end-all.
I guess I just assume too much. . . Based on my highschool experience, I naturally assume that if you have a knack for maths and physics, you must also be enlightened.
Of course, I've run into a few individuals like that around here, but holy shit! I must have lucked out while growing up, cuz the bell curves from then and now do not match.
My periodic outbursts around here only reflect my continued disappointment. . , and my bafflement at the high number of guys who use the word 'dweeb' and actually mean it.
-Fantastic Lad
I have to have more ZIM or I'll explode!
...that happens sometimes
That goes to you, sir. Though you really need to write your posts in all caps, bolded and italics like Harry used to do to make his "news" seem all the more special.
All I can say is GOOD FUCKING GOD , they let him write a book!!!
The world has ended, we are just waiting for the ratings to kick in. *shudder*
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
The first time I saw Invader Zim I instantly recognized it as Vasquezian artwork and humor. I loved JTHM way back when and liked every episode of Zim I managed to catch. I think to really like Zim you need to have liked JTHM as well. Both have a crazy protagonist at odds with absolutely everything around them. The fact Nick feels the need to cancel it goes to show how inept their fucking program managers are. They're trying to grab the 12-16 audience between the hours of 8-10pm. The problem is their shows appeal to the 18-24 audience who have other things to do besides sit at home watching TV reverently on a Friday night. Then to make it worse they don't reair it on Sundays with any sort of consistancy so you can only possibly catch a couple episodes if you have ANYTHING in life you life to do besides wait for the damn show to air.
I watch cartoons more now than I did when I was 10 but I don't have the luxery to sit around with one thumb up my ass and the other on a remote control flipping back and forth between Nickeodeon and the TV Guide channel hoping to maybe catch an episode of Invader Zim. If Nickelodeon wanted an audience for their shows they wouldn't have a website which insulted the intelligence of people over the age of 10 using it trying to find when a fucking cartoon aired. Nick's website is worse than a majority of the tripe they air. If the website says the show is on on Sunday I shouldn't need to drop candle wax into a bucket of water to predict whether or not it actually WILL be on on Sunday or not. I really liked Zim and it blows that I thought it already had been canceled because I couldn't find out when the hell it was airing on a-day-other-then-Friday to catch what I missed. Fuck them, fuck them up their stupid asses. Oh yeah, Scifi.com had a little piece about Invader Zim and how nobody would miss it when it's gone. I always missed it when it was airing, I'm going to miss it alot more once it isn't aired. Guess I need to download Real Player now.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
Nickelodeon / NickToons
231 W Olive Ave
Burbank, CA 91502
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It's too bad Hollywood's trying to prevent these shows from living forever by existing on the internet. Yep... all that talent wasted. I hope that when Eisner dies, the DMCA prevents anybody from visiting his grave.
"Derp de derp."
The ultimate in subversive humor, a true classic now, is "You Can't Do That On Television", which Nick also shitcanned. It brought disgusting food jokes to their prime, fart jokes, toilet jokes, jokes about how sick adults can be. You name it. It was the best. Now you can only enjoy it via this great web site. A must watch.
> How is ZIM any worse than, say, MAD Magazine?
I haven't seen ZIM, but Mad, in its original form, was a Harvey Kurtzman showcase. The content back then was largely too complex for kids.
The Kurtzman/Elder/Krigstein parody of George McManus' Bringing Up Father in Mad #17 is a good example -- it's a dark take on McManus' use of domesic violence as comedy.
Kurtzman was pushed out of Mad after a couple of years, and his later magazine Help! was also Not For Kids; R. Crumb's Fritz the Cat pseudo-rape comic was published there, some of the first non-greeting-card stuff Crumb published. (Terry Gilliam also worked for Help.)
And EC in general was really an adult comics line back then (Tales from the Crypt, etc.); the Comics Code Authority killed off all EC comics but Mad (which was billed as a magazine, and thus not for kids, because only kids read comics, right?), and Mad was steadily dumbed-down over the years to increase sales to kids. But back before the CCA dark times, EC almost a low-brow Fantagraphics, a tiny niche for grown-ups' comics.
[sigh...]
> The whole point of subversiveness is to open
> eyes.
Yeah, but it still needs to be aimed at kids to be really subversive. Otherwise it will just be disturbing; they won't understand what's being subverted. Crumb's How Snoids are Born (Snoid Comics, Kitchen Sink Press) is a glorious treatise on how dysfunction is passed down through generations, but I sure wouldn't give that comic to a kid (in the comic, the Snoid masturbates to thoughts of dismembered women; the droplets of jizz turn into little Snoids; the Snoid then shoos the offspring out the door with a broom, saying "Scoot! 'An don't let me see yer ugly faces around this neighborhood!"). A kid wouldn't get that comic; hell, I'm expecting some AC flames from folks who don't get it. The target audience matters.
"Whatever happened to fair use?"
-- Duff-Man
Used to work for Nickelodeon, and from what I understand, SpongeBob is not making any more episodes, either. They wrapped after the third season for a number of reasons. The current shows will continue to air.
I can't wait until we get the real reason... I've heard a number of things. I've heard that the staff was fired, that Johen V. is tired of the project, and a few other speculations.
Supposedly Roman Dirge knew but couldn't say (see forum at spookyland.com)
If Jhonen V. really wants more free time I suppose I could bring myself to leave him well enough alone. As of Saturday, Nick has yet to give an official press release.
*But...* if it's something lame like corporate bastards or even worse, censorship, than I'd like to know so I can email my friends at the EFF etc. and perhaps start some sort of multi-faceted campaign to save the show. I'm more suspicious of censorship, especially with the episode that was banned in the US.
And the obligatory Zim references...
1. I'm pissed off on so many levels... prepare for some DOOM!!!
2. Nick thinks they own all the good cartoons, but they don't, they just don't!
3. I hate Nickelodeon Executives, I hate them so much! Can I go back in time and make it so they were never invented?
Perhaps I'll give it another try.
I do not deploy Linux. Ever.
If anyone out there can tell me how to track down the e-mails for the following Nickelodeon executives, you would have my undying thanks. I'm working on an e-mail list for ZIM complaints.
Tom Freston - Chairman & CEO of MTV Networks
Albie Hecht - President of Film & TV Entertainment for Nickelodeon
Alison Dexter - Production VP at Nickelodeon
Magie Cohen - Nickelodeon Executive
Eric Coleman - Nickelodeon Executive
Leigh Ann Brodsky - VP of Nickelodeon Consumer products (to tell her all the ZIM stuff I'm buying)
And... on a different tack:
Danielle Greene - VP of comedy at UPN. UPN's another Viacom network. Bigger chance that ZIM'd end up there than Cartoon Network.
If you don't want to post it here, send it to:
agentdisembodiedhead@yahoo.com
TIA!
(then again, I AM an adult -- perhaps I should stop watching cartoons as well?)
I couldn't agree more. You ARE an adult, and thus should stop watching anything animated whatsoever. Don't worry, it's all just kids stuff and weird Japanese crap anyway! You are now a Man, and should give away all of your childish possesions to the younger generation.
... or better yet, give them to me.
[PowerPoint] is a tool for capitalist presentation
404 not found funny how the link pointing to the site is bad.. editors! you should at least put a http:// before the adderess.
a lot of posters here are assuming that zim was canceled because it was too "subversive" for children, or something along those lines... actually, i have a friend who worked at nickelodeon for invader zim, and she said that the show was canceled because of the sept. 11 attacks: since the whole show is about taking over the world, it was viewed by nickelodeon big wigs/idiots as being "in bad taste" after sept. 11... they tried first to lobotomize the show, changing its entire premise, but the show's creators balked, and the rest is history (so to speak)
i thought, therefore i was...
Excepting, of course, that Sheep in the Big City is already on CN. Heat of the moment absentmindedness. They should still change the time slot, though.
I think liking to think really is a good defining characteristic of a geek. If you think that's hard to do though, try getting other people, the so-called normal, to think. Now that will give you some headaches. To stray back to the topic at hand, I think that Zim, or what little I've seen of it at least, was trying to get children to think. I'd contend that saying "Zim is too subversive for children" would be severely underestimating children.
...and so the comment ended.
The thing about Cartoon Network is that their budget is too low to actually make any sort of complicated animated show (at the moment anyway). The only moderate exception to this is Justice League. For blocks like Adult Swim the budget is even tighter. But their budget is not so small that they can't pick up canceled/finished series from other networks/countries and reshow them. Baby Blues, for instance, is clearly too expensive per episode for them to make the show, but they can still show the existing ones however long they want to. And in the case of anime, virtually all of the shows out there are self-contained series of 26 episodes or less. We don't expect season after season of these, we expect new material - which is the better policy, IMHO. All that matters is that it's new to you.
---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?
...while listening to The Cure, no less...
I'm so glad I got my shirts before Zim (maybe) goes away. You can get Zim merchandise at Hot Topic. Looks like they're being hit with people ordering in wake of the news but keep trying.
No, I'm not connected with them in any way. I'm just someone who found out about the Zim shirts recently and quickly ordered four of them. Doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, doom...
I live ze unknown. I love ze unknown. I am ze unknown.
However, in your sentence I'd replace "subversive" with "scary". My four year old got nightmares after watching IZ. He didn't have a problem with any other cartoon on Nick.
Zim may be a cartoon, but it really isn't for the daytime/early-evening crowd.
why are moderators so dumb sometimes? what's trollish about what this apreche said?
May you be touched by His Noodly Appendage. RAmen.
As I was saying, Nick will eventually implode in upon itself. Nick is just DOOMED! Doom, dooom, doooooomm! And it is due to their OWN INSOLENCE! I heard that they are not only cancelling ZIM, but also the SPONGE SHOW! Spongebob is their singel MOST-POPULAR show overall! It brings in the most money through t-shirts, dolls, ect. also. It just makes me want to retrive my scythe from my room and.......
Bah. This site has nothing about everquest....*sigh*
http://www.petitiononline.com/izlovers/petition.ht ml
That is the original petition, which is at 8500 instead of 1500.
Nick really managed this badly. I hated the way they screwed up every time abnd dropped episodes all the time to make way for spongebobn of fairly oddparents ofr soem other shit. I hate nick.
The Hot Topic/ZIM problem wasn't Nick's fault. HT bought the 6-month exclusive license to the franchise almost as soon as the show hit the air (it's Jhonen, after all). It took them forever to get any merch out, though. My "Doom!" T-shirt wasn't available until right before Xmas. They've bungled stuff like that before.
----
"I used to listen to Null Device before they sold out."
I would sign it if it didn't mention Zim in the same petition as ZIM, seeing how Zim is in no way geared toward Nicks demographic.
Don't get me wrong, I enjoy Zim, I just don't think a show that is that hostile towards children is appropriet for children under 12.
I mean come on, he rips some childs eyes out in one episode.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
His children will grow up to be mindless idiots with no sense of humor, just like dad.
Just passing through to let all know about the Save Invader Zim Petition. It can be found at http://www.petitiononline.com/izlovers/petition.ht ml
Sorry if it's been posted here before. Please tell all you know about it. Save Invader Zim!
As a kid I can say that:
a) all the kids I know love Grr and Zim
b) it not flying over our heads
c) this is the only show that DOESN'T scare me
i regards to comment C, all the other shows on TV are so predictable and shallow they scare me.