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Mysteries Of The CDRW and Backups Revealed
Talinom writes "Tom's Hardware has a story that details information regarding some of the new (and old) copy protection schemes out there, as well as results from several different CDRW drives. There are a lot of sites devoted to this topic, but Tom's is usually rather thorough."
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end
It's the goatsex picture in base64!
Anyone who posts yEnc shit onto Usenet is an arsehole. Discuss.
And while we're at it, does anyone have any porn with Mae Ling Mak in it? I'm sure she's done something filthy.
There are so many different copy protection schemes out there. Some are really simple, like throwing some file in an obscure directory on the user's hard disk. Others are really complicated, involving the detection of various debuggers that might be present and working around them in such ways that the software can't be broken.
When it comes down to it, copy protection is just like system security. In system security, as we all know, the programmers have to find security holes before the 1337z h4x0rz do, and close those holes. (Remembering to enjoy a Negra Modelo after each security hole is closed.) Similarly, copy protection is a war between the implementer and the hacker. The only difference between copy protection and security is that the roles are reversed: In security, the implementer is the good guy and the h4x0r is the bad guy. In copy protection, the implementer is the evil force and the h4x0r who breaks it is the good guy. That's a fact, and breaking of copy protection should be rewarded with large sums of money by the implementer. Call it a sort of fine on copy protection that doesn't work. In other words, anybody who implements copy protection will eventually go bankrupt because it will get broken eventually.
Yes, I still remember with horror the "good old" copy protections some amiga games compaines made. Non-dos disks that made the entire amiga shake as the disk drive desperately tried to read the crypted disk. The sound resembled snoring and could be heard miles away.
I had a friend who couldn't play some games late at night because the drive woke up his parents! Some games could not even be loaded on older drives because of the "shaking". In addition the disks also came with a nonstandard bootblock making all anti-virus software go mad and easy for viruses to destroy the game.
My drive finally gave up the ghost after a few years playing with them copyprotected games. The same fate happened to all my amiga friends at one point. Some were lucky to still have the commodore warranty still valid. Others had to fork out a fair amount.I was one of the lucky.
I myself, being a flightsim nut, used to play Falcon. Unfortunately it came with such a nifty copy protection that not even X-copy could make a backup. As a result I lost the game one day when the disk, despite good care, became corrupted. Unable to find a pirate copy I was (and still am) without a good game I paid honest money for. Sadly, I also bought F16 Combat pilot and the same thing happend to that one. Backup could not be made. The disk became corrupted....
Fortunately a friend of mine had a cracked version... I have yet to see a pirate suffer from a protection that is impossible to crack. The only suffering has been done by the owners of originals ( I am refering strictly to the owners of amiga non-dos copy protected games that were so common in those days).
These problems persist into today. Another friend of mine lost a hard drive and blames SafeDisc copy protection on a recent game for it.
So, can anyone here, with hand on heart, really say those copy protections did more good than harm?
Just the idea of having something available easily, and fully usable- but not able to be copied is somewhat absurd. If something is readable, then it is copyable. I can't see any way to really stop people from copying things.
...
The most effective copy protections that I have seen, dealt having to be online to use the product effectively (Halflife) and having an individual serial # for it. Of course, it doesn't always work, but it's better than most.
The other good protections that I have seen dealt with having to enter in words from the pages of the instruction manual (which could be defeated by copying the whole manual...) but most people didn't go and copy a 100 page manual.
Overall, i think it's an uphill battle. Any protection will be cracked quickly. Perhaps they should try better (128 bit) encryption instead of weak ones, a la CSS. Who knows... perhaps it should just be open source
Tibbon
tibbon.com
Scientists are baffled by the seemingly improbable disappearance of Tom's Hardware from reality.
The RIAA is quoted as saying:"There is no spoon"
crazy dynamite monkey
keep copies protected is to not give them out.
Maybe these companies should stop selling the programs entirely. That would stop the piracy.
Linux is dead.
LU
astalavista.box.sk
Just beware the popups & viruses.
I agree that they should take off the protection in case we want to make back ups or the ability for the cd rom to read it in my box. But then again, lotsa people burn em and give em away to friends. Even my parents...(i trained em well, the never question why my 2400 baud apple modem burned out every 3 months or my collection of 500 f 1/4 floppies with software). I have been looking around alot and with all my computerphile colleagues and friends in and out of the industry(and it is a broad spectrun indeed) is one common scenario. phone rings" Dude, wazzzup?" "Wazzup?" "You got the new(insert music or software" "No man, been meaning to check it out." "Dont sweat it, I'll burn it bro" Happens all the time, and more frequently with everyone I know in our beloved industry. We all do it. We all vehemently deny it. Cuz I know after this post there will be ten posts vehemently denying it. What can we do?
The Revolution Will Not Be Televised
Especially the ones that you can defeat with Post-It (tm) or a permanent marker (German). Brings back memories of the Old Times when phreakers hacked phone lines by whistling connection tones...
Please correct me if I got my facts wrong.
The article was written without trying to promote illegal duplication. Dang it! I was going to copy my friend's CDs until I read that.
"Oh no, 3 horny women and only 2 condoms...Thank god I read slashdot"
I don't do that!
There are 7 days in a week.
One of those statements is true.
"Tom's is usually rather thorough."
:)
Yes, Tom's Hardware is usually thorough, but it is also usually thoroughly wrong--at least, the reviews written by other than Tom. Read through them. Look at the numbers shown on, say, the CPU articles and see if they have anything to do with the conclusion. I'm serious--not trolling (at least, not intentionally
Computer Science is no more about computers than astronomy is about telescopes. --E. W. Dijkstra
99% of the people who want copies of software don't have to worry about copy protection- someone else has broken it for them.
They merely need to use their P2P client of choice to download a cracked image of the CDs.
Remember last April when Andreessen said "If a computer can see it, display it and play it -- it can copy it,..."
Article found here.
As Dan Briklin says "With ever changing technology, in order to preserve many works we will need to constantly move them ahead, copying them to each new media form before the previous one becomes obsolete. Also, as we create new media, we need to preserve the knowledge of the methods of converting from one media to another, so we can still access the old works that have not yet been moved ahead. This is crucial. Without this information, even preserved works could be unreadable.
The most famous example of that type of translation information was an inscribed slab of rock from 196 BC found in 1799. It contained a decree written in Greek that was also written in two forms of Egyptian. It's called the Rosetta Stone. It let scholars finally read ancient works in hieroglyphics that they had physical possession of but whose language had been a mystery for 1,400 years (despite being common for the 3,500 years before being superseded). Cuneiform, a form of writing used by many ancient civilizations, was similarly opaque to scholars until they found a text in multiple languages carved into a cliff -- the Behistun inscription."
If we don't fight for ourselves no one will.
So you say, but I certainly haven't seen any evidence of this, not in the last 3 years.
Before then, THG was one of the better sites on the web (that I knew about at least). Now I will only go there if I'm really bored or looking for a laugh. www.tech-report.com, www.aceshardware.com or www.realworldtech.com are SO much more informed.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
You're talking about the gronk noise - its got its own entry in the jargon file.
gronk
I think it has more to do with the fact more Amiga's used Chinon floppy drives which are noisy as it is, but also most amigas don't have that sringly door flap on them - which just makes them noisier.
Is why companies even try these days... All "copy protection" even accomplishes these days is to punish the legitimate customers, preventing honest people from making personal backups.
Need to copy a game? GameCopy World to the rescue. Just use a modified executable, and presto, no problems with using a copy.
Those of us that do "pirate" (I want an eye-patch and a cutlass if I get this title) software easily find a way around the protections. Except my mother, who somehow manages to keep damaging her game cds, is unable to make a personal backup because of the crazy restrictions. I honestly want to know if these companies realize that they are only punishing honest customers, and no one else.
In tom's review, clonecd was not able to handle the safedisk 2.51 (the disk2 cd) copy protection. If you check the clone cd compatibility page ( http://elby.ch/english/products/clone_cd/writers/ L.html ), you'll notice a "correct efm encoding" heading. Any burner that has two stars (well actually sheep) under this heading can handle safedisk 2.51 with no problems WITHOUT the use of clonecd's amplify weak sector feature, as the burner itself handles this at a hardware level. I have personally tested this on my computer, backing up Medal of Honor, using a liteon 163-dvd drive as the source drive and a liteon 24102b as the writer. I used Clone Cd 4.013. Tom's also used a liteon 24102b and was unable to copy safedisk 2.51 . I am not sure what they did wrong, but i suspect the source drive might of been the problem.
Lawyers, MBA's, RIAA? A jedi fears not these things!
My Plextor CDRW drives coupled up with CloneCD has yet to fail me in making "personal backups" of any Audio of Game CD that I've purchased.
Duris MUD - The best pkill MUD. Ever.
But does it really *matter*, Commander Taco?
Please ask yourself this question before posting any more news stories today.
Hell yeah there should be a warning label. The gore family already decided that if there is "unacceptable" lanauage on an album then it should have a warning label. I think anyone who buys a copy-protected CD, when they find out it's protected will scream "SHIT!!" and that is worthy of a label of it's own.
It always cracks me up how everyone here takes the moral high ground and denies that they've ever Kazaa'd Photoshop for their own personal home use. It's kinda like the guys that used to take a couple of days off from work to go see a Dead or Phish show, then came back on Monday morning and tried to act like they didn't puff the magic dragon over the weekend. Riiiight...
The other difference is that once a hole is found in a system, it can be patched.
Once you've shipped some physical object and the security on it has been breached, you are up a creek!
One of the best scheme's I've heard of is one where there was a way of spoofing certain keys. The implementer knew this and when one of these hacked keys were entered it turned on the "RANDOM BUG" boolean, which would drop things mid process, panic your machine, etc. etc. He was quite smug when he thought of this.
I don't think he could get a patent on it. I think the BSOD is an example of prior art!
In the future, I would want to not be isolated from my friends in the Space Station.
Friends don't give friends proprietary software.
I only distribute Free Software to my friends.
http://people.freenet.de/Clony.eng/ClonyXLFinal_en g.zip
enjoy
::.. check out some Cell Phone Reviews
...what CD has TAGES on it.
werd to yo motha, muh nizzle.
Yeah, and its been happening for 30 years too.
Last time I used it, (and it may have changed) all you had to do was change your location to some other country in the same time zone. The weak sector amplification worked if you weren't in the USA.
I also managed to copy CD2 of MoHAA with no problems... Can't remember if I used my CD-ROM drive (some cheapy brand... maybe Delta) or my Plextor 8432T burner as the source, and obviously I used the Plextor to burn the image.
Forget which version of CloneCD I used, too... my system's been through a format & reinstall since then. Point is, I had no problems copying the CD either...
- Jester
I know this may seem just a tad off topic, but I've read a ton of articles at Tom's Hardware, and I think I must mention something about the format of his web site. I don't particularly like that articles are split into a number of pages, and you have to wait for each one to load. Why can't the whole article be on the same page. Download it once, and read the whole thing from beginning to end. I believe that is the better way to do it, as it reduces the number of requests to the web server, and allows you to save an entire article for later reading, when you're possibly disconnected from the network.
As far as this particular article is concerned, I think it's quite detailed, and I like that. It's all about reading about the old technologies that made the computing industry what it is today. Makes me want to have a Negra Modelo.
Anyone remember the original monkey island copy protection with the pirate wheel? of course i just copied each stage of the wheel, but at least it was creative.
i just climb trees, and look for rhythm everywhere.
disk #1: Safedisk 2, playstation logo showing...
anyone know what this is?
disk #2: Safedisk 2.51, game, no idea
disk #3: Tages, game, design reminds me of star wars
disk #4: cactus, audio cd, obviously the fast and
the furious sound track.
I suggest all trolls sign up and start posting 'amd sucks' threads on toms cpu message board.
The Slashdot Effect: A new for
how aer u? hehehehe!
Why would I put a cd in when the game is fully installed?
Do you really want to copy all 8 GB of full-motion-video cut scenes of a DVD-ROM game to your hard disk?
Will I retire or break 10K?
The Plextor and the Phillips drives seem to be caught in the duldrums; pirates hate duldrums.
Disk 1 is one of the NHL series from Electronic Arts. Probably NHL 2002. If you look closely, you can see the NHLPA logo.
The only known Tages-protected game is "Moto Racer 3". Does anyone have one to compare the artwork to Disk 3?
Consider:
Wellcome
Next Page-->
to Toms Harware where we
Next Page -->
Discuss the new anti copying
Next Page -->
schemes that affect your CD-R
VS
Spock I never (pause) wanted (pause) you to dress (pause) like a (pause) tribble (pause) and tracktor beam (pause) me from behind (pause) you burning hulk (pause) of Vulcan (pause) man meat
Moneyed corporations, non-working 'poor' and criminal prisoners are turning productive citizens into tax-slaves.
the animation people (ILM, Disney etc) all pirate software. lately that really high end stuff has been becoming affordable for the noncommercial user. But they had no option in the past. they needed to learn and become better, and not pay more than their car cost for a program. There companies obvisousely had legit copies
Remember "CIA", "Disk Assassin" and even "Copy II+".....wow, that cool new color copy program on Tom's sure takes me back....all those cool things...like modified TOC's....Half tracks....Modified sector headers....having to use the nibble editor.....
[salty sea pirate mode]
....there beeeen pirates in these waters since there was waters.....
[/salty sea pirate mode]
I completely agree. Somewhere out there is a 15 year old kid that could be a god at Maya or 3D Studio Max or Renderman but he obviously can't afford those programs, so he pirates them. And the thing is, and I've said it before, "A 15 year old kid with a net worth of 30 dollars that pirates a $5000 dollar software program has cost that company nothing."
Finally, math books without any of that base 6 crap in them.
I rarely find Tom's Hardware to be particularly thorough.
Although they mention there are many reviews of the Plextor drive, they neglect to mention that most of those review point out that the plextor sucks with 1.02 firmware and rocks with 1.03 firmware.
I can copy cloneCD with the new firmware, too bad Tom didn't even try...
To me it appears that disk 1 might be NHL 2003.
- Pimp
I like computers, women and computers... in that order...
Ever since I got an 80 gig hard drive. I just burn CloneCD images of games I buy and use Daemontools to create a near foolproof virtual CD drive with which to run the game. I don't look around for CDs anymore, I just select the image from the menu and off I go.
The downside is that it takes about twice the space because the install program usually installs the whole kit and kaboodle and then you've got the CD image.
It works over great over LANs too. We put images of commonly used network games(starcraft, red alert 2) on a simple fileserver(my old P-75 w/6 gig HD). Whenever my roommates and I want to play a game, we all point to the same CD image on a network drive and off we go. No digging up CDs or anything. Most times, the games just check the image on startup and never look at it again so the server doesn't get overworked or anything.
[...] Tom's is usually rather thorough.
Since when is "thorough" a synonym for "incompetent"...?
Deja vu.
When the headlines and the photos take up more space than the article itself, something is clearly not quite right.
When I go there I'm always half-expecting to see a half-naked girl holding a CPU (ATHLON 2300+ HOTTER THAN HOT - WE PROVE HOW AMD'S NEW CPU CAN SET FIRE TO YOUR HOUSE - DOWNLOAD OUR 745 MB VIDEO).
P.S. - To your list of reliable sites I'd add Anandtech. Yes, the articles are 20 pages long and each page only has about 5 sentences, but they are usually objective and well-written.
RMN
~~~
Using an Apple. Since Apple will not allow copy restricting software into their machines. Good or bad, you can at least make legit copies of your software with zero issues.
Looked like disc 4 was Fast and the Furious.
Anyone else remember the dark red code sheets that came with the original Simcity? They were dark red to prevent photocopying. You had to match the symbols with the population and give them the name of the city (I think).
My Grandfather had a copy of the game that we both wanted so my grandmother and I spend an afternoon copying the damn sheet out onto graph paper. It was like a game then (I was...12?). I wouldn't be caught dead doing that now.
I find it interesting that when Maxis rereleased the game on CD they killed the protection. I almost would've liked them to include it for the history of it. Almost.
Triv
Everyone knows that no form of protection is infallible (except abstinence).
r ot ections_tages.shtml which convieniently also gives a solution to the copy problem.
googlize and this appears
http://www.cdmediaworld.com/hardware/cdrom/cd_p
This looks like a case of the cathederal and the Bazzar again.
You have N people trying to protect stuff, and n +n^lots trying to unprotect it. Who do you think is statistically going to come out on top?
just as an aside, what happens if you write a program to read a CD so that you don't get the EULA that software companies are so fond of? What are your rights?
Frankly, I'm disappointed in the misleading title of this bit/article.
Making a bit copy, complete with the copy protection tracks, is NOT a problem. It NEVER has been. You don't even WANT a PC to do it. You just need one or more writing drives slaved to a read drive and the two are going in synch with each other and bits are flowing from source to destination.
This is a no brainer. This whole pirate off a PC crap is pointless. There's no fuckin' way you can get the volumes you need to do it for real and make a buck off of it. A dedicated device is much better suited to repro and would cost a lot less, like $200 + $cheap / CR-R drive.
I was hoping that somebody had a lead on some open-source software that would let me back-up my LAN multi-host multiple gigabytes of content off my systems' drives.
I KNOW Veritas NetBackup for Linux would do it but it's just my stuff. Its not industrial strength crap.
I was HOPING that somebody somebody out there had a solution for this CR-RW spanning, multi-system (1 linux box & 3 Macs, [2 OS-9 & OS X]) LAN-back up problem.
What a gyp.
MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
I purchased a product called the Opcode Sequencer (some early MIDI fans might recognize this). It had one of the most obnoxious schemes I've seen. First, it limited you to two installs. After that, either the master floppy had to be in the drive, or you weren't going to be using the software. I think Performer used something similar for a while (and it still may). I was never one for actively trying to circumvent copy protection for the purpose of using software without paying for it, but it really ticked me off that companies made it overly difficult to use the software that you HAD paid for. In this light, I was glad to see that someone had hacked thorugh this particular scheme. Legitimate owners should not have to worry about this kind of nonsense.
Same here (Plexwriter 10/12/32A).
The great thing about Plextors insn't the reading, though, it's the writing. I've never seen a CD burned in a Plextor fail anywhere. Which is more than I can say for a lot of other drives I've tried (Philips, HP, Sony, etc.), regardless of the CD-R brand.
Here's a table comparing the BLER (block error) ratio of several CD writers:
http://www.digit-life.com/articles/cdrw5/
RMN
~~~
don't forget Nibbles Away and Locksmith
and how about the days when you'd bag school entirely to continue tweaking the city until the wee hours of the *next* night? or mebbe that was just me....
relatively on-topic, i'm concerned about another maxis product called "the sims" which relies heavily on having the CD in the drive at all times, reading from it constantly, absolutely *killing* my drive. can't they just put the whole thing on my gigantic HD? c'mon, we're way past the days of having to run the OS from the 5.25" floppy. or mebbe that's just me again.
fred
Not much to say really, but if anyone is interested, here's the link to the article about Spyro - it's a great read. Here it is.
This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time.
Lest we forget: Advanced Demuffin.
Not to mention the reliable
*B943: 18
All your D5 AA 96 belong to us!
I personally call it copy prevention since it describes the technology in question and has the same acronym. Every time I read the term "copy protection", I cringe. Just count the number of times it's been used in the article...
___
If you think big enough, you'll never have to do it.
It's the principle of the thing. If a program wants to copy everything to my hard drive, it had damned well better earn that disk space it's taking up. There is no legitimate reason why software that does this should require the CD. If you want the CD to be in the drive, you'd better have a tiny HD footprint. If you want a big one, then you'd damned well better not demand a CD.
i am a soviet space shuttle
every stage of the wheel?
I just took it apart, made a copy of the disks and put the original back together.
Back in the early 90s alot of games used the 'look on page so-and-so in the manual and complete the phrase' method of protection.
-
while i generally subscribe to the "if you build it, they will crax0r it" school of thought, as far as i know bleemcast (bleem for dreamcast) was never successfully cracked. i don't know all the details of it's protection scheme (i haven't kept track of "the scene" in a while), but as i remember it involved tons and tons of bad sectors that rendered it practically impossible to copy.
i'm sure someone else knows/will correct me if i'm wrong...
--
Twinbee is lovely character. Perhaps you will enjoy with him?
From the article: If you have children...."
Now that deleterious effects on children have been introcuded, it ought to be possible to stop these harmful anti-copy problems!!!
Maybe slightly OT, but how well does dd measure up to apps like clonecd? Any one tried to copy these disks in linux?
/addons dir. In this way, 3 years from now when I want to play a game, I don't have to hunt down patches and the like. The only reason I have to put the crack in there is because the games won't play on my backup disks.
BTW, Even on disks I have purchaced, I have a habit of copying them to a custom cd I make along with the latest patches and game cracks under a
I'd rather you do it wrong, than for me to have to do it at all.
Does anyone know how good old mkisofs fares against these new copy _prevention_ schemes?
Don't you suppose all that jabber on Tom's Hardware is wolfbane to keep the werewolves and vampires away? Do you suppose for a minute they believe any of it? Can we allow that they are making the ritual incantation in, perhaps a vain, attempt to keep from getting a restraining order?
With regard to the review, it was ok, but really did little except sell the cheap sleeper drive over the more expensive ones....
:)
I think we need copy prevention for games. Not so much with online ones though because you can do things at the server that discourage casual copies. (Flame suit on
However, I also demand the ability to make backups, or take advantage of the hardware I own. (Putting several games onto DVD, or HardDisk really should be possible.)
So given the cost reductions in media production today, why not offer people a choice?
If you purchase the game through your standard shrink wrap vendor, then you get to live with the copy prevention methods. Same battle different day.
If you purchase from the publishing house directly, or better yet the game developers, you get unencumbered media with a catch:
Your name and address becomes part of the game as they burn a copy for you on demand. You get to make any copies you want, and they get to know if you start distributing them irresponsibly.
I did this long ago with a utility program I wrote for CADKEY. (Ez-Shapes BTW.) I did put a lot of time into the program and wanted my return, but also did not want to invest a lot more into something that had very little to do with my program just to get that return. Why? Lets just say that copy prevention schemes have caused me enough grief in the past that I did not want to be associated with them.
Each copy went out with the buyers name on it. I figured that the incentive to keep ones name clean was as good as any to prevent copies without undue restrictions on the buyer. I never did encounter how I was going to handle transfers because it never came up, but that could be a concern.
Maybe a worthy tradeoff though. What if your media was damaged? Since they *know* you are supposed to have it, maybe they can just make another for a small fee.
Something to think about anyway.
Blogging because I can...
I think that's
*B942: 18
That's the checksum SEC/CLC thingie.
disc 4 is the soundtrack to "the fast and the furious"
aka "rice wars"
s/copy protection/copy prevention/g
i'm concerned about another maxis product called "the sims" which relies heavily on having the CD in the drive at all times, reading from it constantly, absolutely *killing* my drive. can't they just put the whole thing on my gigantic HD?
haven't you looked? each install takes up ~700MB. it _does_ copy the whole cd to the freaking harddrive. it's annoying to those of us without gigantic harddrives, having to free up 1.5GB so the children can play EA's bloated cash cow. (each expansion adds considerably more. ) additionally, each neighborhood, empty, takes up nearly 12MB(not too evil, but still obscene for what it contains (nothing)). and the web templates garbage was another 30 or so. it's really pathetic, when you look at it. maxis has lost my interest with these pieces of crap lately =(
I've become a master with Numega/Compuware's Driver Studio. It goes for $2500. The weird part is that other than a couple simple USB drivers I wrote, most of my Driver Studio experience has been cracking with SoftIce. The only guilt I feel is that I didn't pay for Driver Studio 2.6 and it really has proved itself a valuable cracking tool...
If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
It amazes me that for all of our advances in technology over that past 20 years, we are still fighting some of the same battles with the same tactics.
//c, ...) were superceeded by Macs and PCs. I don't remember if the same issues appeared in software distributed on floppys for PCs; they may have learned something from the earlier apple ][ experience and tied their copy prevention system to something that was distributed in addition to the electronic media.
The tactics I am referring to are, of course, copy protecting the distribution media of the software. 20 years ago it was apple ][ software on floppy disks. The apple ][ disk controller didn't really process the data. It fed the raw flux transitions to the disk operating system. The software for the DOS was contained in the boot sector of each disk. To make a disk difficult to copy, you tweak how the DOS functioned to include things like positioning the heads between tracks or working around intentional imperfections in the disk media. These imperfections would cause errors for the standard DOS read routines, but the modified DOS would know to just skip around certain sectors.
To combat these and other copy protection schemes, many disk copying programs appear on various BBSs. Over time people built up a list of which copy programs to use against which type of protection scheme.
In the end, bit by bit copiers could copy most everything that was out there. Over time software publishers went the route of tying software to something that was less easily copyable like a word or number from the paper manual. Just like the licensing schemes of today.
As time went on, the apple ][ (][+,
From my point of view, we are repeating those same old steps. The difference is that users will probably accept some sort of copy protection scheme for software, such as software activation keys (the shareware world lives on this model). While this model is quite workable for software, it fails miserably when it is applied to pure data such as CDs. CD copying will continue, because it is data and not an executable program which can check for some sort of authentication or activation model.
Audio CDs are data. I repeat this because that is what sets them apart from software. That is also what sets them apart in the mind of the public.
-tpg.
Virtual CD is a much better program for things such as that, and in fact was made completely for that purpose. Although, it is demoware unless you buy it, but of course, you can just get a serial for it if you want. What, are they thinking people who pirate games will also be willing to buy the program. Seriously though, it is worth the money for those of you who actually do support programs you like. Buy it or not, your choice.
Actually, scan several of the pages of Elby's web site and notice how much text has found its way into Tom's article. Nice work, Tom.
Our intelligent designer has never created an animal that we couldn't improve by strapping a bomb to it.
Being Taught a Lesson
There can't be anything worse than being 18 and having your mother
catch you fucking your boyfriend right? Wrong. Mom caught us alright,
but she not only caught me, but she caught my cousin, Ann, too. We were
both in my bed, with my boyfriend. She walked in just after Jim came in
Ann's pussy, and Ann continued to suck my clit for about 10 seconds before
she was aware that, as she put it, "the jig was up".
[...]
I could hear other voices, moaning in a sexual way all around the
room. The man on my right pressed his penis to my mouth, and I let him
enter, tasting his rubbery cock and catching his musky scent. He moved in
and out of my mouth, slowly, letting me tounge the head and shaft. My
pussy was soaking wet, and whoever was eating me was enjoying it and
getting me really hot. The guys that were near me switched, with the
other man giving me his cock to suck. His was a nice cock, not too big,
not too small. It filled my mouth where I just had to stretch but not so
it was uncomfortably wide open. They went back and forth changing off,
and I was getting excited, thinking of them both coming. The girl sucking
my pussy (I'm sure it was a girl), reached up and squeezed my tits,
running her hand so sensually over me that I moaned out loud.
"Shoot your jism on her face." I told him, and he did a few seconds
later. Some of it splashed against my tits and Ann sucked his cock. We
kissed, and she had a thick glob of his cum in her mouth. We chased it
around and then she swallowed it, kissing me even harder.
Actually, they don't. I've sold into that market, and piracy hasn't been a problem with the major studios. Since animation houses tend to want features added to the big animation packages, there are often people on-site from the vendor. This keeps piracy down. Some of the smaller effects houses have trouble coming up with a credit card number that won't bounce, though.
A quick look on my favorite "Abandonware" sites shows no copy of the first Falcon game. Probably due to their method of intentional floppy corruption as copy protection...
However, take solace in your free copy of the third version of the series, Falcon 3.0:
http://www.the-underdogs.org/game.php?id=2128
Chasing Amy
(We all chase Amy...)
"The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws"-Tacitus
That article did not explain why none of the TAGES copies worked on his DVD-ROM drive.
A DVD-ROM drive typically supports MEDIA TYPE info code (in this case its CDR on the copies) thus trivial for TAGES (or any code) to detect that its not the original.
Also, unless spoofing ASPI calls to thwart that, you need to spoof the ATIP data. The ATIP information is typically found in CDR media and identifies the vendor of the media, its an agreed upon convention for the total sector duration.
Again if he avoided using that stupid DVD-ROM drive of his he could have hidden ATIP info which is not visible on a standard CD-ROm drive.
he should have tried a 9 dollar chinese cd-rom drive. It would have read the copies fine.
Also that crappy report on Toms Hardware site ignored facts about EFM 14 bit to 8 bit mapping and how C1+C2 data is employed in Macrovision SD technologies and how its TRIVIAL to defeat with a silly littel tool that repairs the static image file before burning.
No Lite-On drive Needed!!! (If you use the hacking tool to twiddle the bits in the CloneCD/Blind Read image file. It was old news in the fall : BetaBlocker. (Beta2Sd2_251_English.zip was the first non German version on the net).
Also his article neglects to mention that TAGES was kracked in less than a day on its first title : The wuro version of MotoRacer 3. It was a 100% perfect total absolute forensic hack. No secrets left in TAGES. TAGES was a fraudulent european non-challenging piece of junk code.
The new way to defeat all these anyways is with miniport driver level emulation tools.
I was sadly dissapointed that noboby knows this stuff. Worse, that crappy article REFUSES to list the names of the titles and neglects the critical points I raised and countless others. I stopped reading that site and its fractured-multi-page slop months ago. Now I know not to bother going there anymore. Its for newbies and lamers I guess.
Its more depressing that this post will not archive because slashdot hates AC posts, no matter how highly modded up. It will probably not get modded up anyways.
Thomson-CSF has a patent application on a copy prevention system, which may be the same they sell as TAGES. Check the US patent application 20010024411.
o ol.h tml, the direct URL is l o n g)
(enter that to "Document number" field at
http://appft1.uspto.gov/netahtml/PTO/search-b
Anyone remember ELITE, the space trading vector game. I bought the original for the old Commodore 64, it had an actual prism that you would have to hold up to the monitor (ok the 13" tv) to decipher the code you had to punch in in order to play the game, I seem to remember that it was generated on the fly so it was always different.
Needless to say I downloaded a "cracked" version off a local bbs and threw out the prism.
A.C.
You sing it to the masses, my man, I've been crusading for this nomenclature for years! It persists, yes, but only because people are sheep.
We need to re-establish "Copy Protection" as something you wrap your dink in before you boink.
I remember a clever copy-control mechanism the comapany making Zaxxon for the C-64 ("GCS" or something?) used:
You could copy the disk, and even play the game, but all the graphics were degraded and semi-transparent. I guess it was supposed to aminate the copier to go purchase an original. Guess it worked, too, at least on me.
yes, we have no bananas
Even after a few years nobody has been able to clone the bleemcast cd's with any hardware. I found a link to a pic of the cd's, and I kinda see why.
http://www.fraps.com/bleem/bleemprot.jpg
It doesn't come on CD does it?
Use virtual CD to make as virtual CD of virtual CD!
Oh, the *irony* !
:-)
You are in a twisty maze of processor lines, all alike.
There is a lot of hype here.
One thing that might be interesting when you have problems copying audio CDs is that most DVD players also have digital out channels. Also, most newer sound cards have digital in/out... I guess you don't need much more to make a 'copyable' copy (for yourself, of course :-)
Keeping the Pirates at Bay:
Implementing Crack Protection for Spyro: Year of the Dragon
Ah I remember the days. Playing X-Wing on my old (386? 486?)...
That game had very stupid copy protection. The game would start, and would ask you a question by giving you a symbol that you had to find in the manual and type in its name.
Of course, one young teenager with a hex-editor (remember Norton DiskEdit?) was easily able to find all of the 'names' in one of the game's data files, and it was rather trivial to replace all of them with a single space. At the time it was all I knew how to do, because it was before my programming days.
It was quicker to do this than to try to find a crack on the BBSs out there. And yes, I have my own purchased copy of that game - I just hated having to keep flipping through the manual.
You can accomplish anything you set your mind to. The impossible just takes a little longer.
If only Tom reviewed how well Linux cd recording software (cdrecord, et. al.) fared under the same circumstances...
Not everyone's primary box is a Windows machine, Taco...
They stole a lot of that information.
Almost every bit in that article was retrieved from other websites specially reviewing writers , software and methods to bypass the copy protection without being illegal and/or disobey the EULA of the software on that cd-rom. (For instance www.cdfreaks.com)
> Remember Copy II+"
;-)
:) (Dos3.3 started at 0x9600)
;-)
What, no mention of COPYA, Muffin, Disk Muncher or Locksmith ?
I still remember how Copy ][+ had 1 BIG sector on tracks 2 and 3. The thing loaded *FAST*.
"Cracking Techniques" was a bunch of text files describing how to break each game protection. It even had a 'tut on Copy ][+. Copy the ROM over to the language card. Modify the RAM so that reset would enter the "monitor" (built in disassembler on the Apple), and then finally make the 16K language read only. Copy ][+ never checked for the language card, so voila, you had a memory image. Moving the memory down so that DOS 3.3 wouldn't clobber it, and then BSAVE COPY ][+, A$800,L$8E00
> all those cool things...like modified TOC's....
Sad, that I still remember that the DOS3.3 TOC was on track 17 after all these years. I like how some games would embed control-chars in the filename.
{rant}
My 8-bit Apple had 20 character filenames. Who's the dumbass that limits filenames to 8.3 in CPM and MSDOS ?
{/rant}
> Half tracks....
The Apple drive was actually capable of 1/4 tracks. I believe Broderbund games made use of it. Write a small section on track 0. Increment to track 1/4, write another small section. Repeat. Normally, tracks were 4 quarter tracks apart, due to interference from data written on quarter tracks.
> Modified sector headers....
The thing that made Apple games disk so much fun to backup was that the drive couldn't write 2 consequetive zeros (aside from Sync Bytes, which was 0xFF, followed by two zero bits.) Ah, the days of 5+3 (13 sector tracks) and 6+2 encoding (16 sector tracks). For 6+2, you expand a sector of 256 bytes out to 384 bytes.)
Some interesting technical info here http://www.enteract.com/~enf/afc/apple2
Little bit of history here http://apple2history.org/history/ah15.html
Then someone figured out that you *could* write a few "illegal" bytes, such as C5.
> having to use the nibble editor
Copy ][+ had a ton of options for it's nibble editor. And if you still couldn't make a backup, there was always the option of boot tracing the program. Remember how the first sector had to be delimited by D5 AA 96 because thats what the Disk Prom checked for.
Some interesting cracking technique from yore:
Wildcard and Replay were 2 interesting products. They generated a NMI and let you enter the disassembler. I wanted one, but found out that I didn't really need one after I learnt about that language card trick.
The other trick to "stop" a game, was to search for 30 C0, since that was the address of the speaker! (I was *so* thankfull Copy ][+ ver 7 added a search bytes function!) Change a few bytes, and now the game will stop when it tries to play a sound.
Cheers
A lot of floppy were "protected" by many copy prevention scheme using bad sector or special sector. Guess what ? Ultima V using such a special sector with XORing the protection code was what bring me to learn assembly. And to crack it. Because I had spent my hard learned (I was 12) money on a software which afetr a while refused to work. So I did go into the code and elarnt what it meant (with debug), find a way to crack, and then saved my executable with the crack.
Btttom line : PC publisher did not learn from Apple II. And still did not learn as far as I can see the Laserlok copy rpevention schemes.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
So your not being able to afford it means it's OK to steal it? Quite a change in attitude from your posts in the WC3 story.
Call (206) 338-5780 COLLECT for information about a genuine BA, BS, MA, MS, MBA, or Ph.D.
No, no, no. This is not a sig.
Yes, he has cost the company nothing because he wouldn't have bought it anyway. But that 15 year old kid would be a god with a lesser tool as well. Maybe not a broadcast quality finished product at the same level as something done with 3DSMax or Maya, but up to the limits of the whatever tool s/he used.
Talent shows. His demo reel would display concepts like design, flow, use of color, etc. Not competence in a specific tool.
Just like a race car. Just because you're good at age 15 (even REALLY good), doesn't mean a high $ ride in NASCAR or F1. Show your stuff in gocarts and migets first. Then the boss will pick up the cost of the topline tool. Be it a Grand National car, or a $5000 software package.
Here's more info on dongles
http://linux20368.dn.net/crackz/Dongles.htm
There is one totaly legit way of doing the same thing without having to use a NoCD patch.
Juste install Daemon-Tools. It's a wonderfull little program that lets you mount an ISO file as if it was a standard CDDrive. It's free (as in beer), tiny ( ~400Kb), and works like a charme on Win2k/98/XP.
It can even emulate some form of copyprotection like Safedisc, SecureRom and LaserLock.
All you have to do to play your favorite game is create a RAW (1:1 image) copy of your original game CD, and then mount the image as a CD drive.
Really a brilliant little program.
Murphy
An old D&D game for the Commodore 64 had a code wheel. I just removed the rivet, copied the wheels, went 'round with an X-acto knife, and made a new code wheel.
Not that this wasn't entirely predictable.
Because of the current revenue models involved in software sales copying software you COULD afford and WOULD purchase does cost a company money. The distribution of a hundred copies of a piece of software to 8 year olds without computers doesn't hurt their company at all. Neither does 500,000 copies to the same category of 8 year olds. But if one of those 8 year olds happens to have a computer, and enough money to afford that piece of software AND the inclination to actually purchase it, there still isn't a guarantee that 8 year old would even KNOW about the product unless it was given to them. (read advertising->target audience) Maybe that 8 year old would actually purchase that software AFTER he had already used a pirated copy of it. If so any of the "projected" losses have just become REAL gains. So the REAL loss on 500,100 copies of software is actually a gain! But, if you ask that company (and they know of the 500,100 copies) they would say that they lost 500,100 units worth of revenue. Who knows how much that same company saved in marketing for that kind of distribution.
A shrinkwrap/clickwrap EULA is all but worthless, regardless of what one judge on the loony coast of the USA said. If I buy it in WalMart it is a SALE. Back when Tandy made you sign a five part form to purchase anything in the computer dept, that was a LICENSE.
When you buy a game at Best Buy you are the owner of a copy of an item that is SOLD, not LICENSED therefore you are regulated by the copyright laws of your country and nothing else.
Democrat delenda est
CIV3
:( They made a patch available but only to people in the us, not to mention you had to give your phone number and street address before you could donload the dame thing!
I had to crack civ3 because it didn't work well with my DVD-rom
Not that I play it anymore, not until the multiplayer/scenario patch is out. But I bet we'll have to pay for it.
He who defends everything, defends nothing. -- Fredrick The Great
I should have emphasised the employees more. At ILM its all 100% legit. but when those employees go home, that copy of Maya downloaded and installed from the internet is not legal.