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TheOpenCD Launches First Edition

Emil fra Loeneberg writes with welcome news from TheOpenCD. "This article on NewsForge describes a project which plans to distribute Open Source Software (OSS) widely to Windows users. You can download a CD image from a mirror site and start spreading the OSS message. It's basically an OSS distro for Windows. This project was also mentioned on Slashdot back in April and now they are ready with a first release. Any first reviews?"

201 comments

  1. KNOPPIX by fazil · · Score: 1


    After using knoppix, why bother with anything else :)

    --
    -=-Ze End-=-
    1. Re:KNOPPIX by bahamat · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I've found that it's much easier to say to people 'hey, check out this software that runs on windows' than it is to say 'hey, ditch windows and use linux'. People are generally more responsive if they don't have to leave their comfort zone, then once they have a chance to use Free Software, see that they like it, that it's better, have used OpenOffice in windows, then say oh yea, Linux can do that, and more, and with more freedom. It's especially easy to nab programmers that way, because they get to see the source of what they're using.

      I've been doing this for a while, building my own CDs and passing them out. First with Win32 software then a Linux distro. Knoppix was rad because it let me add another step to the conversion process. It's a step to change mindshare and for a lot of people OpenCD will be their first step towards computing freedom.

      I leave a trail of little Linux users everywhere I go and this is the tactic I've been using for a long time. Now they've made my job easier.

    2. Re:KNOPPIX by Russellkhan · · Score: 4, Informative
      Well, If you'd read the first couple of paragraphs of the article, you would have seen this:

      The idea was to make a compilation of mature open source software (OSS) for windows users as an easy introduction to OSS. The project was inspired by a question which is frequently asked in Linux forums: "Given that we now have this fast, secure, desktop-ready, free OS, why doesn't everyone switch?"

      Well, the answer is complex, but includes elements like:

      1. It is a major hurdle for an intermediate user to scrap their entire OS to try an unknown system, filled with strangely named applications like "grep."
      2. Most people do not care which OS they use, but rather what their programs can do, and there is a perception that Linux apps are not as capable as those in Windows.
      3. Microsoft's OS bundling has been extremely successful encourages people to regard their current OS as free (as in beer).
      4. Software piracy, while apparently depriving proprietary software makers of profits, in fact simply serves to cement the commercial products as "the standard," by making home users familiar with these packages, and by locking everyone into proprietary file formats.

      These cover the largest and most commonly cited reasons. The first two of these points are the most serious: the perception of Linux applications as difficult to use, hard to learn, and inadequate to their tasks encourages people to continue buying (or pirating) Microsoft products, not just Windows, but also Office.


      And there's lots more good stuff that directly answers your question. If you ever get ten minutes or so to spare, I recommend giving the article a read.
      --
      Information doesn't want to be anthropomorphized anymore.
    3. Re:KNOPPIX by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      - After using knoppix, why bother with anything else :)

      Because some users technical knowledge is too limited even for Knoppix.
      On a personal note, Knoppix has one major flaw in its -awful- looking desktop: it looks like a k3w1 h4x0r's screen capture; not the most appealing thing to the casual Joe User.

      Besides that, kudos to Knoppix' author for his grat work.

    4. Re:KNOPPIX by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      - It's especially easy to nab programmers that way, because they get to see the source of what they're using.

      This might put a good point when trying to convince other professionals too.
      Many known non free/closed source programs often hide spyware/adware routines. If you were working on sensitive data, would you trust any program that silently collects information about who you are and what you do, sending it to somebody else?

      Open Source is the only way to go if one wants to be 100% sure of what his/her software is doing.

    5. Re:KNOPPIX by ted_the_canuck · · Score: 1

      Often there is a mind set that you have to pay money for software that's good. For some people, the discovery that they can get free(as in beer) software that is useful warms them up to the idea of using free software. The "open source" part appeals more to knowledgable people who are capable of building the program from sources. If the box came with windows and some prepackaged software, that has already been paid for, so there may be no perceived cost advantage of changing to linux or one of the BSD distributions. The other operating systems hold some fascination for people with a tinkering nature, but for those who are less knowledgable and want to use their computer in a limited way (browsing, email) there is little motivation to change anything.

      --
      ==
  2. gnu/Windows by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    I don't think microsoft will be very happy with stallman for trying to call it gnu/Windows

    1. Re:gnu/Windows by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think he calls it GNUW: Gnuw's Not ... Uhm ... Windows

    2. Re:gnu/Windows by jc42 · · Score: 1, Offtopic

      Maybe this is why, when I try to download the latest release of mozilla to my Win98 machine, it tells me "This program has performed an illegal operation ...."

      --

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    3. Re:gnu/Windows by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Did you hear that Kevin Bacon has been linked to al Qaeda?

      No, but I hear that "Lamb Chop" is bin Laden's right-hand man. :) (And you thought Bert was evil...)

    4. Re:gnu/Windows by kenthorvath · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Could we actually succeed in seperating the windows kernel from the rest of the applications? What would it take to make GNU versions of Explorer (the shell) and other such programs. Could GNOME be ported to windows without Cygwin? And should GNU be changed to GNW in this case or GNMS?

  3. I have an idea by Ezubaric · · Score: 5, Funny


    Let's call it America's Open Library (AOL) and send it out in bulk mailings on cheap blue CDs. This has gotta be effective, right?

    --

    ----------
    I am an expert in electricity. My father held the chair of applied electricity at the state prision.
    1. Re:I have an idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      then there are those of us canadians that understand acronyms and wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole.

    2. Re:I have an idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is not a troll, even partly true.

  4. Who cares by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I use oss on windows sometimes (bzip2, moz, ooo), but they just dont feel right. Im only confortable when my desktop has a k on it.

  5. nozilla! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    It dosent have mozilla, this is crap (oh wait, mozilla is so bloated it needs to be released on the openDVD)

    1. Re:nozilla! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I can see why you went AC for that one, troll. Take a look at the extended list of programs available on the CD once again, you'll note that Mozilla -is- available on the CD.

    2. Re:nozilla! by Monoman · · Score: 5, Informative

      Read their FAQ ... or just the appropriate text pasted below.

      Q. Why didn't you include Mozilla?
      A. We were contacted by a developer in the Mozilla project, who asked us not to include Mozilla. The Mozilla.org project provides binaries for testing purposes only, as anyone who has read this page knows -- scroll down to the very bottom, and you will find a notice to that effect. In short, they do not want to wind up providing end-user support to people, and so they ask people not to re-distribute Mozilla unless it has been customized to make it clear that Mozilla.org did not provide the binary and will not support it.

      Unfortunately, it is not at all clear what requirements we need to meet in order to be able to re-distribute Mozilla, or what level of customization would be needed to do so. Also, we didn't have anybody willing to take on that task. If you want to help us out with this, get in touch! Beonex is a fine product, but we tend to think that Mozilla is better, especially since it is updated much more often.


      --
      Keep the Classic Slashdot.
    3. Re:nozilla! by jasonditz · · Score: 2

      Umm... can they do that?

      I mean, since Mozilla is "free" can they place distribution conditions on it and deny people the ability to distribute it?

      Knoppix has it, how does Klaus manage it?

    4. Re:nozilla! by Hewligan · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I mean, since Mozilla is "free" can they place distribution conditions on it and deny people the ability to distribute it?

      Well, no. They can't force people not to distriute Mozilla, but they can ask you nicely not to, since that's not what the binaries are intended for. I suppose the OpenCD people could have told mozilla.org to get lost, but since there are plenty of alternatives, and it's not like they don't have a good reason for the request, why not play nicely?

      --

      "If God created us in his own image, we have more than reciprocated"

    5. Re:nozilla! by sfe_software · · Score: 2

      That is unfortunate. Mozilla is one of the best open source examples available in my opinion. It's something anyone can identify with, and (if installed and configured properly) can run Java, Flash, and everything the typical MSIE user needs (or thinks they need).

      OpenOffice is another great example, and I'm glad to see it on the list. But Mozilla is usually the first real-world example I give people when discussing open source. It's really easy to name reasons Mozilla is better than IE, and they are things the user understands (disabling popups for example). I can't think of many reasons to support OpenOffice aside from open standards, which the typical Win user won't care about...

      Though the price difference between MS Office and OpenOffice is enough of a clincher in many cases :)

      --
      NGWave - Fast Sound Editor for Windows
    6. Re:nozilla! by fucksl4shd0t · · Score: 1
      How about just building a skin (or use the freely available IE lookalike skin), compile it from source (rather than using their binaries), rename it slightly (OpenCD's Mozilla, or OpenMozilla, or something like that), tell them if they need end-user support to get it from a certain mailing-list (OpenCD mailing list, assuming there is one) with a disclaimer that says "This binary is NOT provided by Mozilla.org, please do not attempt to get end-user support from them. However, if you find any bugs, report them to blahblahblah".

      Also, I'd point out that I was going to check out this CD to distribute with christmas presents this year, but since I don't have a windows box I can't actually check it out. Heh.

      --
      Like what I said? You might like my music
    7. Re:nozilla! by kraksmoka · · Score: 1
      seriously, mozilla's bloat is reaching critical mass. if aol took a linux distro, threw mozilla onto it as the sole tool and gui. wrote a quick mozilla wrapper to openoffice and swallowed that package, put it onto cds and shipped it out. m$ might fall off the desktop in a jiffy.

      in fact. who wants to help me with my new distro? AOHeLinux

      --
      "You never want a serious crisis to go to waste." - Rahm Emanuel
    8. Re:nozilla! by frostman · · Score: 1

      just off the top of my head, it seems to me that it would be sufficient to just replace the word "mozilla" with something else, say "openbrowser," in the entire source code except for the license... ...and then swap out the dragon and navigator etc icons. doesn't seem so hard, and it could be automated so you don't have to re-hack each release.

      on the other hand, i haven't actually read the license. just an idea.

      --

      This Like That - fun with words!

    9. Re:nozilla! by thumperward · · Score: 1

      Nor have you read the reasons why it wasn't included. Slashdot really needs a -1, MyReallyDumbTwoCentsIANAL mod.

      - Chris

    10. Re:nozilla! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I find the reason for not including Mozilla a little strange. It's already included in each and every Linux distribution so it really is a widely used piece of free software no matter what it's developers say. Have they asked Mandrake or Red Hat not to include it? Do they consider them to be so niche that it does not matter?

      I can see why they might not want people to use Mozilla, many of them being employed by Nescape but still this doesn't make any sense and I'm somewhat disappointed by it's omission.

    11. Re:nozilla! by frostman · · Score: 1

      How about a "-1, IHaveALotOfPentUpAggressionAndNoPlaceElseToLetItOu t" mod?

      Or maybe a "-1, AlmostAllMyPostsAreNegative" mod?

      Or simply a "-1, GetALife" mod?

      --

      This Like That - fun with words!

  6. This is great by Bluesman · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I've been using Open Office on Windows for a few weeks, and it's just fantastic.

    I think too many people focus on Linux when they talk about open-source software, when the beauty of this software is that it's portable and usable on so many platforms. When I have to use Windows, I love to be able to use The Gimp and OpenOffice, since I'm not locked into proprietary formats.

    Microsoft's monopoly exists in their applications, which have always been much better than the easily available alternatives, until now.

    --
    If moderation could change anything, it would be illegal.
    1. Re:This is great by Bluesman · · Score: 1

      And before I get flamed, when I say MS apps are better than alternatives, I'm talking about standard desktop apps that Joe User knows about, not IIS, etc.

      --
      If moderation could change anything, it would be illegal.
    2. Re:This is great by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "I think too many prople focus on Linux when they talk about open-souce software"



      No matter how much I struggle, I cannot call it a "beauty"
      to run Free Software under Microsoft platforms.

      How is it possible to have
      freedom with a kernel that is black box and proprietory?
      No matter what, you cannot have freedom this way. Never.

    3. Re:This is great by hammarlund · · Score: 1

      People should focus on GNU/Linux when they are talking about "free software", and "who-cares" when they are talking about "open-source" software.

      There are fundamental differences in the licensing between "free software" and "open source" software.

    4. Re:This is great by MonTemplar · · Score: 1

      No matter how much I struggle, I cannot call it a "beauty"
      to run Free Software under Microsoft platforms.


      Well, they say beauty is in the eye of the beholder, no?
      I see it differently, as I'll explain below...

      How is it possible to have
      freedom with a kernel that is black box and proprietory?
      No matter what, you cannot have freedom this way. Never.


      But you do have freedom, potentially - the freedom that comes from using applications that aren't tied to one operating system, and that comes from being able to create and share information with other people that isn't tied to one operating system. That's how I (as a Windows user) see it, anyway.

      Saying that free software and proprietary software must never, ever co-exist on the same machine is like saying that your stove can only cook fish dishes, not meat - not practical at all!

      --
      -MT.
    5. Re:This is great by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Saying that free software and proprietary software must never, ever co-exist on the same machine is like saying that your stove can only cook fish dishes, not meat

      Yeah it's called JEWISH.

    6. Re:This is great by MonTemplar · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yeah it's called JEWISH.

      You know what, you're right! D'oh!

      I shall resist the urge to any religion / OS comparisons...

      --
      -MT.
  7. OpenOffice? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No one who actually uses an office suite for real work uses OpenOffice.

    1. Re:OpenOffice? by Dave2+Wickham · · Score: 1

      Yes, I know, it's a troll...but... at least one of the reviewers for PC Gamer UK uses OOo to do their work.

  8. Overkill? by 5lash · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Seems to me like there's gonna be a lot of unnecessary downloading of files you'll never use. How about just a floppy with the Program Browser on it, but links to download the file from the internet? Along with a comprehensive description of the program, users would only have to download what they want. And i don't think i'm being harsh in saying that anyone without an internet connection really needs to shape-up!

    1. Re:Overkill? by sydneyfong · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't have a broadband connection, you insensitive clod.

      Well, actually I do, but many don't.

      Besides, URLs change over time, and if people were so inclined to download the software, a simple google search would do the job, why bother getting it from a CD?

      --
      Don't quote me on this.
    2. Re:Overkill? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not everyone has broadband, and downloading 20 MB or larger files using a modem takes a long time. Having to spend hours downloading files might put people off.

      If you want to go down this road, why not publish a paper brochure with URIs of all the important files?

    3. Re:Overkill? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yet another troll. What, exactly, would be the point in making the process of trying out all this open-source software more difficult by forcing a potential user to download all of it? That's what they're trying to do by creating the CD, you see. Make it MORE CONVENIENT, so that people less knowledgable about their computers, or OSS, will consider using it. I mean imagine how impressed someone would be if you gave them a CD of fully functional software that fulfilled most of the needs they'd ever have with their computer, without having to download a thing, with the added bonus that they can let any of their friends have it..legally.

      As for the Internet connection part, well..I more or less have come to respect ignorant remarks such as that from people like you. If you really have lost your perspective, try working out on a calculator how long it would take someone to download 650MB of programs on a 56k modem, which many people are still using for their Internet connections.

    4. Re:Overkill? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Not everybody has a fast connection. CD's are cheap and hold tons of data. Why I bet this OpenCD project could put at least 15 major software pojects on a CD. Then someone could just, now get this, install off of the CD. No lengthy downloads. Huh! Huh! Howabout that? This isn't for people like us to use...this is for people like us to download and hand out to friends and family to see what we're talking about.

    5. Re:Overkill? by AndersM · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I think the power of this CD with a load of goodies on it is that it can be downloaded by a LUG or similar activist group and duplicated (with a burner, or perhaps at a CD factory if the group has the financial resources).

      Then they can distribute it to all those people who don't necessarily have the connection or the patience to wait for the big downloads to finish.

      Remember, the target group here aren't the power users who have dsl or cable, but the home users who might still be happily downloading their mail with a 56k modem.

      Put yourself in the position of a computer user without particular interest in how the computer works. When your computer-savvy friend hands you a CD and says "This disc contains a lot of good, free software, and no, it isn't pirated! Just pop it in and try!" - you'd be a lot more inclined to actually trying it out than if the same computer-savvy friend told you to check out an URL, and wait for long, long downloads, wouldn't you?

      I certainly think the OpenCD is an excellent way of pulling people onto the bandwagon. It's already moving, we just need to give it more mass and more momentum.

      --
      My opinions may have changed, but not the fact that I am right! =)
    6. Re:Overkill? by stwrtpj · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Seems to me like there's gonna be a lot of unnecessary downloading of files you'll never use. How about just a floppy with the Program Browser on it, but links to download the file from the internet? Along with a comprehensive description of the program, users would only have to download what they want. And i don't think i'm being harsh in saying that anyone without an internet connection really needs to shape-up!

      The reason this is a bad idea is because this is NOT how most Windows apps are shipped. Most Windows apps do not force you to go to a website to download the software, they come on an easy-to-install CD. The idea is to have users believe that OSS apps are just as easy to install and use as Windows apps. You don't want to point people to a URL to download, only to have it change, or to suddenly have what was once a stable production-ready release replaced with the next beta.

      Also, recall that some of these apps are going to be GPL, which means they come with the source. Not everyone has broadband, and those source bundles can be HUGE.

      --
      Karma: Frotzed (mostly due to the Frobozz Magic Karma Company)
    7. Re:Overkill? by Darnit · · Score: 1

      As a member of the OpenCD project, I think this is a good idea. Hopefully our next release will have an html interface. The download will consist of a bunch of html files that link to the software on the web.

      There hopefully won't be unnecessary downloading if people with broadband connections make a few copies of the CD for their family and friends that want to try it out.

      I'll copy your suggestion to the forum though.

    8. Re:Overkill? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If people have to download that adds another, however slight, inconvenience/barrier.
      Bad Idea.

  9. Mozilla by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful
    It's really too bad Mozilla won't be included on the CD.

    It deserves as much press time and attention as possible.

    Also, the inclusion of Celestia is a great move to demonstrate the possibilities of OSS.

    1. Re:Mozilla by stwrtpj · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It's really too bad Mozilla won't be included on the CD.

      It deserves as much press time and attention as possible.

      I thought this at first also, but then I realized that Mozilla still has a little ways to go to be usable for the Windows masses. This is not a troll about Mozilla; I use it myself all the time on my Linux box. But I have spoken to a few people that I had try out Mozilla on Windows, and they all reported little quirks here and there that people like me might ignore, since I'm used to that sort of thing in some OSS products, but for a windows user used to more or less smooth running of their apps, it is unacceptable.

      Also, not to put too fine a point on it, but Mozilla's newsgroup reader is atrocious (random hangs, no way to mark all read without clicking on article first, no yEnc decoding, etc etc etc) I just barely tolerate it myself.

      --
      Karma: Frotzed (mostly due to the Frobozz Magic Karma Company)
    2. Re:Mozilla by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Did you tell any of these friends that they can merely mention all of their problems on Bugzilla, and in the future those problems will likely be fixed? Did you report any of your own problems, being that you're more of a "power-user" and would likely know to do these things already? Did you do anything to fix any of this? Of course not. You just complain.

      I love it how trolls think they can stick "this is not a troll" in their message as a disclaimer, and think that it actually fools ANYONE. Personally, I've never had Mozilla hang once, -or- it's mail/news reader. But if I did, I'd actually contribute to its development and report said problems, should they ever come about.

      One wonders why you still use it "all the time" on your "Linux box," and yet you "barely tolerate it." Kind of a contradiction there, don't you think? Doesn't suprise me a whole lot, trolls never did make much sense to me.

    3. Re:Mozilla by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Funny. I'm the only Linux user in my department, but I've switched everyone else (10 people) over to Mozilla... Once I showed them the popup blocker, tabbed browsing, and the multiple email options they were hooked.

    4. Re:Mozilla by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Did you tell any of these friends that they can merely mention all of their problems on Bugzilla, and in the future those problems will likely be fixed?

      You're right -- a lot of problems could be fixed in a hurry if mozilla users just reported on Bugzilla. Who knows, maybe some of them might even be impressed with the speed of OSS development.

      Did you do anything to fix any of this? Of course not. You just complain.

      Again, a great observation. We all have something to contribute. For all of the regular users out there, could you list all of the steps necessary (in order) to report a problem on bugzilla? Be sure to include _every_ step, even stuff like checking if your bug is a duplicate. Extra bonus points of you can squeeze it into one post without having a "Read More" link.

  10. How About The Games? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    They should make an OpenGames CD with FreeCraft, FreeCiv, Doom, Quake, Quake 2, Tux Racer, etc. etc. Kids would love it.

    1. Re:How About The Games? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Informative

      Actually, it does include quite a few games, including FreeCIV and TuxRacer. Sadly, ClanBomber is not included.

    2. Re:How About The Games? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How about games that don't suck? Wait, there aren't any!

    3. Re:How About The Games? by bryanp · · Score: 2, Informative

      Look around on the web page. At the page where you can see a list of what programs are on the CD -

      http://www.theopencd.org/programs/index.html

      You'll see a link to the right called "More Programs"

      http://www.theopencd.org/programs/MorePrograms.h tm l

      Lots 'o games shown there.

      (sorry, I'm feeling too lazy to make real links today, cut & paste)

      --
      "An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." Col. Jeff Cooper
    4. Re:How About The Games? by dzym · · Score: 4, Informative
      Just making a CD with Doom, Quake, or Quake 2 executables isn't going to work. You still need to distribute the data files--and the shareware or demo versions of each won't cut it because they're released under a proprietary license.

      You may contribute to a project such as Freedoom, however. I'm fairly certain there's an analog for Freedoom for each of the currently big-name open-sourced id software games.

    5. Re:How About The Games? by paradesign · · Score: 2
      "This is because the list below is simply a list of all the programs that were nominated for inclusion in this, the first volume of the OpenCD, which is intended to cover mainly desktop software."

      no those are just links to projects and are not on the CD, note that Mozilla is on that list. if all of this was on the cd id be dling it right now.

      --
      I want 2D games back.
    6. Re:How About The Games? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Back in April this issue was raised. I think a nice suggestion was to start With the OpenCD containing just the "standard end-user" apps and later to follow it up with other OpenCD geared towards development ( next to cygwin, just think of all the Python, PHP, Eiffel, etc etc development tools available) and one geared toward Entertainment (Games, 2D & 3D creation, Music tools, media players...)
      UglyMike

    7. Re:How About The Games? by dotgod · · Score: 1

      (sorry, I'm feeling too lazy to make real links today, cut & paste) You know, in the time it took you to write that apology, you could have made them into links ;-)

    8. Re:How About The Games? by abiogenesis · · Score: 1

      Actually Mozilla is there, but within a different distribution (Beonex Communicator)...

      --

      Donate free food to the hungry at The Hunger site.
    9. Re:How About The Games? by tshak · · Score: 1

      The only problem would be this little concept known as PIRACY.

      --

      There is no longer anything that can be done with computers that is nontrivial and clearly legal. -- Paul Phillips
  11. Value difference with free OSes lowers... by CaVi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Free OSes (Linux, BSDs,...) have a lot of values, _one_ of which is their large library of free applications.

    By bundling those for windows, people will have less reasons to switch to one of those free OSes. Of course, there are still reasons, but there is one less.

    People who don't matter for ideology behind free OSes won't bother switching. ANd I'm afraid this means a lot of users...

    There is some momentum which is needed with free OSes to have the attention span of big companies, and convince them to throw resources at supporting their products under those OSes. Having less people switch to those means less momentum, and therefore less attention.

    On the other end, using those tools under Windows will at least render much easier data exchanges, and is therefore a first step in breaking the dependency on those proprietary and more or less closed formats.

    I'm not sure if this is ideologically good or not. It will for sure be usefull for those who have no possiblity to switch of OS (because of job requirements, or games,...).

    My 2 cents...

    --
    -- No signature yet.
    1. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by concord · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I agree with you. I don't know the answer to that either but it's not going to succeed or fail based upon what you or I do.

      Let's not forget the fact that free software _is_ free and that includes the fact that people will _always_ want to port it to unstable but popular platforms - we can't (thank you GPL) stop it. We don't want to anyway, right? If software is free but only to people who want to use it or port it to particular "approved" platforms, is it really free?

      Let's not lose sight of the fact that we aren't here to hurt Microsoft. We're here to help people enjoy better software and to give them the freedom to enjoy it secure in the knowledge that it'll always be there for them, their children and their children's children. The GPL ensures that it always will be.

      In the long run I hope you're right about the fact that it'll make popular free OSS windows programs which can save in formats compatible for _all_ users of the program, regardless of their OS.

      My 2

      --
      MFG: "The system supports both the LAMP (Linux, Apache, MySQL, PHP) and WIMP (Windows, IIS, MySQL, PHP) platforms."
    2. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by Peter_Pork · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, let's make OSS look like M$... This is about free software, that you can use in any platform, in any way you want. As people use OSS more and more, the OS will matter less and less, that is the only way to get rid of monopolies (call them M$ or Linux, they can be as bad).

    3. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by rickymoz · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Maybe you have one reason less to switch, as you say, but you will have one reason less NOT to switch. Think of all the people who say: hu? OpenOffice? I don't know that, I'll stick with MS Word, at least I'm comfortable with it.

      So basically their reason not to switch is that they are not familiar with OSS. With this CD, they will be and this kills this reason which keeps them hooked on proprietary software.

    4. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hey! Want to switch to my cool new OS? It's got all these awesome applications yours doesn't! What's that? You don't want to install it over your current OS without seeing what's so great about them first hand? What a surprise...

    5. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by bryanp · · Score: 1

      Yes, let's make OSS look like M$... This is about free software, that you can use in any platform, in any way you want. As people use OSS more and more, the OS will matter less and less, that is the only way to get rid of monopolies (call them M$ or Linux, they can be as bad).

      Damn skippy.

      Dammit, and I used up the last of my mod points last night. Somebody him up, quick!

      --
      "An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." Col. Jeff Cooper
    6. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by Eskarel · · Score: 1
      I don't really agree with this idea, yes it is possible that if more people are able to use OSS on their existing operating systems, they will be less likely to switch over to OSS operating systems(though given the target audience of this CD, that's essentially reducing a very small number to an even smaller number which makes no real difference), but I don't really think that this will change which platforms companies develop their software for.

      So long as linux requires serious modification to an exisiting code base, and so long as its focus is primarily anti-commercial software, it is unlikely most companies will cross-develop if only because many of they can't afford it. While OSS operating systems have some popularity, the number of people who are running a one and are not running Windows or a Macintosh OS(which has a much higher market share and is still predominantly screwed over by developers), is relatively small.

      At the moment, linux is not ready for desktop adaptation on a scale large enough to cause companies to develop for it. Most peoples needs are satisfied by Windows, and while I think that Microsoft's Office Suites(and particularly Works which I think is grounds for its creator to burn in eternal hell fire) are annoying and somewhat evil products, which should be replaced by alternatives, windows isn't all that bad sometimes. I reformat my pc every couple of months(which with a dual partition system and a fast enough inet connection takes about three hours and which I almost enjoy), and Windows runs relatively stable. Admitedly it takes reformat to do this, but I screw up my system much more than most people do, what with development, trying beta software, using OSS, etc.

      To sum up, the group at which this CD is aimed are inredibly unlikely to shift away from Windows in general(just as most people who seriously use OSS operating systems are unlikely to switch back because of it). OSS operating systems are unlikely to be treated seriously by most development studios till one of them has a sufficiently large number of people who use it and no commercial OS, which is going to take an change in usage of a much larger magnitude than this could ever cause.

    7. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by kavau · · Score: 2, Insightful
      By bundling those for windows, people will have less reasons to switch to one of those free OSes. Of course, there are still reasons, but there is one less.

      I disagree. The widespread availability of open source software in the Windows world can attract people to open source operating systems in the long run, but it's a two-step process:

      Step 1: "Why do I have to dish out hundreds of dollars for Microsoft Office and its countless upgrades if OpenOffice.org works just as well? I'm gonna work exclusively with OpenOffice.org from now on!"

      Step 2: "Wait a minute - all the applications I am using have been originally developed for Linux. This means on Linux they are supported at least as well as on Windows, and may be even better. I won't lose anything by switching to Linux completely, but I will save an additional few hundred dollars!"

      The advantage is that such a two-step switchover to Linux can be performed without any (perceived) risk. The would-be windows converts can take their time getting used to open source applications without immediately giving up the (perceived) safety of their familiar Windows environment. Altogether, this is probably a Good Thing.

    8. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by Mr_Silver · · Score: 3, Insightful
      By bundling those for windows, people will have less reasons to switch to one of those free OSes. Of course, there are still reasons, but there is one less.

      Whilst this is a valid point and true, one of the biggest problems with the Slashdot mentality (and I'm not suggesting that you have this, because I don't know you and your comment seemed well balanced) is that there is this misguided belief that everyone on the planet is unhappy with Windows and would change it at the drop of the hat.

      This isn't really the case. There are plenty of people (millions) who are just fine and happy about Windows and don't really care about moving. They see Windows as an enabler to other productivity applications and as long as it's enabling (which it does pretty well) then they have no reason to move.

      So the question ultimately is:

      Do you want to show these people the alternatives out there and accept they possibly aren't going to move from their closed OS?

      Or do you want to avoid doing such a thing and accept that they may never ever see any open alternatives?

      --
      Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
    9. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by gidds · · Score: 1
      True. But conversely, it also lowers the barrier to switching!

      Part of the problem is unfamiliarity; the thought of having to relearn all your favourite apps and habits. If people are already using open-source apps on Windows, then switching will be that much less painful. If it can be made desirable in other ways, then this could be a big win.

      --

      Ceterum censeo subscriptionem esse delendam.

    10. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by RAMMS+EIN · · Score: 2

      Somebody may have mentioned this already, but I'm on a really slow link and can't read all replies right now. All I want to say is that _not_ porting Free software to Windows would basically amount to locking people into free OSen. Think about it.

      --
      Please correct me if I got my facts wrong.
    11. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by g4dget · · Score: 2
      People who don't matter for ideology behind free OSes won't bother switching. ANd I'm afraid this means a lot of users...

      Windows running GNU software is still Windows, with all its warts, usability problems,and inefficiencies. End-users notice, believe me. They notice when their shiny new 2GHz machine crawls through problems slowly. They notice even more when their Windows machines fail, as they are prone to after running for a few months, and people stop giving them free technical support and suggest installing a more reliable OS instead.

      Overall, I think bringing some open source software to Windows is good, namely software that workes like entrenched Microsoft products but costs less: Mozilla, OpenOffice, lots of utilities and games. When a Linux program does something that isn't easily available under Windows otherwise, it should not get ported: those programs provide additional motivation to switch.

    12. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      By bundling those for windows, people will have less reasons to switch to one of those free OSes. Of course, there are still reasons, but there is one less.
      Well, in such case I assume you'd very much see to see the cease of the Cygwin development as well? Where I work (IBM) most of the people involved with enterprise development (I've met) use Cygwin on W2K. The reasons are varied, but for me, I see W2K as a better desktop than any *nix equivalent and I can run the corporate apps which still are Win32 only. Adding Putty, Cygwin and an X-Server to MS Windows allows me to solve 99% of my unix needs. As one only interact with a unix system via a console or X, that can as well be accomplished from a non *nix OS supporting these methods. Personally I still feel *nix OSes in their current shape are for servers with the exception of MacOS X.
    13. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... by andrewski · · Score: 1

      Let's not lose sight of the fact that we aren't here to hurt Microsoft.

      Actually, one of my goals is to hurt Microsoft. We don't owe them any favors. Microsoft is out to make a profit, and if they hurt us in the process, they don't care. That much has been proven. MS is nothing less than a danger to the country and the future of the world. If allowed to continue their campaign of dominance and bribery of public officials, we'll all be staring down the barrel of trusted computing within a decade.

  12. NT, as in Not Today by OtisSnerd · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This is an admirable idea. Unfortunately, it will suffer the same fate that Linux suffers in most businesses; no drop-in replacement for MS-Access. I'd love to see an 'Open Office' product replace that bloated hog MS Office, but my employer lives on Access. It's used as both a front end, and as stand alone single user databases. --- Is it possible for Newsforge to use an even smaller font? I can barely read it now...

    1. Re:NT, as in Not Today by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      But openoffice already HAS Access functionality, and it's relatively painless to setup.

      it requires an external database, anything that can be used via odbc, basically. unfortunately, i don't think it handles access files themselves *yet*.
      see here: on linuxmafia for more information on this topic.

      ashridah

    2. Re:NT, as in Not Today by Graspee_Leemoor · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      " no drop-in replacement for MS-Access"

      I think hitting yourself in the head with a hammer is a good replacement for MS-Access.

      Well, it's what I'd choose anyway.

      Flamebait, you say? Can't handle the truth?

      Anyway, I wouldn't diss SQL-Server (much), but I sure can diss Access. Even used by just one person, an Access db is a joke.

      graspee

    3. Re:NT, as in Not Today by kilonad · · Score: 1

      The original poster was commenting that there currently is no drop-in replacement for Access. You go on to say that it already has the functionality... and then say it requires an external database, and can't yet handle Access files. If you're starting from scratch, sure, that might be an okay solution. If you're already set-up, on the other hand, it isn't. I don't know about you, but to me, requiring an external database and not being able to read files created by the software you're replacing doesn't exactly qualify as a drop-in replacement.

    4. Re:NT, as in Not Today by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      iirc, access dbm file support is being worked on, although i'm not fantastically sure of the details, since i haven't ever actually used access. but the point is, that it's closer than everyone thinks (admittedly, because it's hard to tell that openoffice/staroffice HAS the functionality at all)

      ashridah

  13. Does anyone really care? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Serious question: Does anyone care about this? Surely anyone who is aware or interested in OSS would download this stuff themselves to get the latest version? Anyone who doesn't know how to do that is probably also incapable of installing these programs.
    And that open office is just a poor man's version of MS office. But if I was poor I would just get the warez version of Office XP. Why use a second rate tool?

    1. Re:Does anyone really care? by concord · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Many businesses are too smart to download and install warez versions of anything. It is illegal. Most businesses are too worried about liability issues arising from disgruntled ex-employees blowing the whistle on them for stealing software.

      OSS versions make it possible for these companies to save money, not suffer lock-in, and not worry about being eaten by their own young. :-)

      --
      MFG: "The system supports both the LAMP (Linux, Apache, MySQL, PHP) and WIMP (Windows, IIS, MySQL, PHP) platforms."
    2. Re:Does anyone really care? by stwrtpj · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Does anyone care about this? Surely anyone who is aware or interested in OSS would download this stuff themselves to get the latest version? Anyone who doesn't know how to do that is probably also incapable of installing these programs.

      Did you read the article? Seriously, I'm not trying to troll here. The article states that they took a long, hard look at which apps to include. From the list that they picked, it appears that they chose ones that are easy to install. Remember that this is specifically targeted towards non-OSS users.

      Case and point: try installing OpenOffice some time. I did it recently on my older RH 7.1 box after my wife got a brand new RH 8.0 laptop with it pre-installed so we'd have the same software on both machines. Took about 30 seconds to install. The experience was akin to installing a Windows app. If its this easy to install on Linux, I can't imagine it being much harder on Windows.

      Naturally, if someone out there has had a negative experience, please correct me on this.

      --
      Karma: Frotzed (mostly due to the Frobozz Magic Karma Company)
    3. Re:Does anyone really care? by Graspee_Leemoor · · Score: 1

      " Many businesses are too smart to download and install warez versions of anything. It is illegal."

      But there are a hell of a lot of small to medium businesses who have 100 workstations and one office CD.

      graspee

  14. Ripped For The Headlines by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Given that we now have this fast, secure, desktop-ready, free OS, why doesn't everyone switch?"

    Well, the answer is complex, but includes elements like

    1) The casual users doesn't care and won't switch
    II) The semi-competent user won't change cause he's already "in the zone"
    c) The true geek has already made his choice, right or wrong and ain't gonna switch

  15. This really has potential... by b0ycheese · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Blank cd's are cheap, so using them to distribute free software is a wonderful idea. If you can burn this, and give it to a few friends, co-workers, or family members who use windows, if they like it, most likely they'll burn it and pass it on (the probably already do this with other software anyway). This being legal, they'll actually feel good about redistributing it. The wider this gets spread, the less money goes into the pockets of people who head greedy corporations, and more money goes to the actual programmers. In my mind, if i'm getting all my software free, i'm more likely to be able to donate directly to the programmer(s) to keep the projects going, because i'm not wasting money on pretty boxes, or supporting company bureaucracy. Send copies of this or knoppix out with your christmas cards this year. Give people the gift of freedom. :)

  16. Beonex by Russellkhan · · Score: 2

    "As you might expect, the headline acts on the CD are OpenOffice.org, AbiWord and Beonex"

    Actually, I'm a bit surprised by Beonex's presence. I would have expected Mozilla and/or Phoenix in its place. Can someone fill me in what (if anything) makes Beonex a better choice? I've tried it out briefly, but don't remmeber any significant improvements over Mozilla itself and it seems to get updated much less frequently.

    And yes, I do realize that Mozilla isn't intended to be for end users, but it works well for me so I'm hoping for answers that will actually help me to understand the difference in practical terms rather than based on intent.

    --
    Information doesn't want to be anthropomorphized anymore.
    1. Re:Beonex by Rhinobird · · Score: 3, Redundant
      From thier FAQ:

      Q. Why didn't you include Mozilla?
      A. We were contacted by a developer in the Mozilla project, who asked us not to include Mozilla. The Mozilla.org project provides binaries for testing purposes only, as anyone who has read this page knows -- scroll down to the very bottom, and you will find a notice to that effect. In short, they do not want to wind up providing end-user support to people, and so they ask people not to re-distribute Mozilla unless it has been customized to make it clear that Mozilla.org did not provide the binary and will not support it.

      Unfortunately, it is not at all clear what requirements we need to meet in order to be able to re-distribute Mozilla, or what level of customization would be needed to do so. Also, we didn't have anybody willing to take on that task. If you want to help us out with this, get in touch! Beonex is a fine product, but we tend to think that Mozilla is better, especially since it is updated much more often.

      --
      If Mr. Edison had thought smarter he wouldn't sweat as much. --Nikola Tesla
    2. Re:Beonex by 5lash · · Score: 1, Informative

      ARGH! Mozilla is included! Why dont people properly read the web pages?

    3. Re:Beonex by zachusaf · · Score: 1

      Yes, why don't you read the web pages...it says that the list below "is simply a list of all the programs that were nominated for inclusion in this." Nominated. That dosen't mean that it was on the CD...... Nothing to see here, move along.....

    4. Re:Beonex by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think you need to go back and read it again. Mozilla is NOT on the CD. The link is basically a list of links to open source windows projects

    5. Re:Beonex by 5lash · · Score: 1

      Oops, i was wrong, Mozilla is just in the list of Nominated programs, its not on the cd :s. funny that i got moderated up for being a dumbass though!

    6. Re:Beonex by Aanallein · · Score: 5, Informative
      Can someone fill me in what (if anything) makes Beonex a better choice?
      Although like any other distribution based on Mozilla (like Netscape), Beonex is running behind in features on the regular Mozilla releases, it does actually have a few things that it does better than Mozilla.
      If I'm not mistaken (*actually bothers to check the website - ...I'm not) Beonex 0.8.1 is still based on Mozilla 1.0.1, so it's got all that stability, yet it does offer a few features from the trunk, such as the option to view HTML mail as plain text.
      Another feature from Beonex which isn't found in Mozilla at all (yet?) are options to set the HTTP_REFERER; I think you can opt to never send it, to only send it within the same domain, to always fake it to somethign else (not sure about this one), or to just send it always.
      Where Mozilla preferences are set in such a way that they don't provide optimal security and/or privacy, Beonex has changed those defaults so they do. (Improved privacy & security are the main focus of Beonex as I see it.)
      Beonex also comes with a spell checker by default, something which the latest version of Mozilla is still lacking. (Yes, the Netscape 7 spellchecker is currently once more working on linux builds, but not on windows.)

      Of course, now I'm comparing Beonex with Mozilla, while what I should do is compare Beonex with Netscape 7. There you trade in integrated AIM/ICQ for popup blocking (though that's finally coming in Netscape 7.01 - even with whitelisting options), image blocking, better default preferences, and general lack of AOL clutter.

      Basically, Beonex would be the ideal distribution for any geek if it wasn't for Mozilla itself appealing more.
    7. Re:Beonex by Al+Al+Cool+J · · Score: 1
      the option to view HTML mail as plain text
      That is a must-have feature in my book. I am so sick of waiting for programs like Evolution and Balsa to render HTML spam. A new message in my preview window has approximately 0.2 seconds to impress me before I hit delete. Having to wait any amount of time for it to render is unacceptable. I don't give a rats ass what RFC 2046 says about proper mail client behavior when it comes to this.

      I want an email client that will display the plaintext part above all else, and if there is no plaintext part, will convert the html part to text and display that!

  17. Some Cynicism by Anik315 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This needs to be done in conjunction with a robust support system (that corporations would pay for). The software can be free, but for businesses to adopt this kind of thing, there will need people who provide the operational support and integration sevices which can not be effecively done without money. The prime candidate for this job is IBM. Once people use this at work, they'll use it at home.

    1. Re:Some Cynicism by BreakWindows · · Score: 2

      2 things:

      1) "robust" support system? Wait a minute; Inappropriate use of the word robust...that's marketing-geek-speak! He's a secret Microsoft spy, seize him!!

      2) Businesses have in-house support. Yes, some small businesses just hire reboot-monkeys to call Microsoft tech support and wait on hold for a few hours, but most places would prefer to write one check instead of two.

      Enter the power of Free software...with more of an understanding of how the software actually works, the in-house support folk won't need to ask anyone as often. If they do, they can email the guy who wrote it. ;)

  18. Target audience faux pas? by JessLeah · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The faux pas isn't the target audience itself-- it's a bad misjudgment of how far "market penetration" (if I must wax Corporate for the moment) will go among said target audience.

    Or, to put it more clearly-- this CD is targeted at bringing open-source software to people who otherwise would not use it, or maybe even have heard of it.

    But how many of those people are going to have heard of OpenCD.org? Joe Beer and his wife Martha surely aren't reading SlashDot. Or Kuro5hin. Or $OTHER_GEEK_HANGOUT_SITE.

    Not to be a fatalist, but I don't think this CD (which is an EXCELLENT idea in concept) will get very many users. Sure, here and there a rabid OSS person will show it to all of their friends, and that's a Good Thing. But one thing SlashDot readers (and posters) tend to underestimate is the colossal "mindshare" Windows and Microsoft products in general hold. People, realize-- to many people in this country, Bill Gates is a "great business leader", to some almost a hero. Many people aspire to be like him, and hardly anyone (excepting geeks) has anything against what he's doing. We at SlashDot aren't quite so complacent-- but the great masses of people in this country ARE!

    Going against the MS monopoly with this nice OSS CD is like... well... To make an analogy to Star Control 2, it would be rather like going up against a fully-loaded Ur-Quan Dreadnought in a Shofixti Scout. With the Glory Device broken...

    1. Re:Target audience faux pas? by Sirius25 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, while i agree with most everthing you just said, that doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

      I'm going to distribute this CD to everybody i can, & tell them, if they like it, to copy it for others!

      Even if it never gets a fraction of the market, more users are always good, even if it is just a few.
      Isn't that what keeps OSS going?

    2. Re:Target audience faux pas? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      yea thats what keeps it going.... NOWHERE! zing!

    3. Re:Target audience faux pas? by Gyorg_Lavode · · Score: 1

      All my relatives are getting a copy of this along w/ their christmas pressents. I think the idea is that those of us who know spread it to those who might use it. A few find it interesting, a few don't.

      --
      I do security
    4. Re:Target audience faux pas? by Teach · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Sure, here and there a rabid OSS person will show it to all of their friends, and that's a Good Thing.

      Exactly. And it all depends on how many "friends" you have. I teach computer science and webmastering at a largish high school near the "Silicon Hills" of Austin, TX. I've got over 100 students in my classes. And there are over 2000 in the school.

      You can bet as soon as I get the ISO downloaded ("ETA: 14:27") I'm going to burn a dozen copies or so and make them available to my students. Especially if I encourage them to burn copies for their friends, too. There's a "healthy" warez scene at my school, so they know how to do that, at least.

      My students influence their less-technical friends, influence their less-technical parents who will then influence their coworkers, and will soon influence their classmates when they go to college. It all starts somewhere.

      This is the same reason I keep copies of the latest RedHat on hand which I loan out for students to copy/install. I collect a $5 "ransom", which they get back if they return the CD.

      And as Apple learned in the 80s and Microsoft knows right now, making cheap products available to computer students can grow up a generation of people who may pirate now, but will probably pay for your product when they grow up and start getting paid.

      --
      Graham "Teach" Mitchell, computer science teacher, Leander HS
    5. Re:Target audience faux pas? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      OK, I can agree with most of that. Some PR seems to be required. Back when Linux was hot,hot,hot, all PC mags at some time included base distributions to try out. Probably not all that many people tried it out for the exact reasons the OpenCD was created. However, the OpenCD on CoverCD seems a natural! Just pop it in your Win98/ME/XP box and away you go! No need to go the whole hog, just try out whatever tickles your fancy!! If we get on some Magazines, we might get the required exposure.

    6. Re:Target audience faux pas? by MisterFancypants · · Score: 1

      This is the same reason I keep copies of the latest RedHat on hand which I loan out for students to copy/install. I collect a $5 "ransom", which they get back if they return the CD.


      The GPL doesn't ALLOW for a ransom cost, you fucking capitalistic pig!! Give it away for FREE!
      You're NO BETTER than Bill Gates!

    7. Re:Target audience faux pas? by radiotalent · · Score: 1
      But how many of those people are going to have heard of OpenCD.org?

      Well, now you have. The idea is for YOU to burn it and give to your Joe Beer friends (come-on, admit it, you have a few). This isn't a mutli-million dollar movie release, it needs your support to help it succeed. And success isn't going to mean it will be on every PC in your town, but having it on a few is a great start. And maybe, just maybe, something will click and Open Source will start to make sense.
      You've watched Star Trek, you want to assimilate your friends to Open Source. This is a much safer (from their standpoint) way to do it than telling them to reformat and drop Red Hat on their Dell.
    8. Re:Target audience faux pas? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I fix PCs for plenty of people who don't have war3z copies of Office and can't afford to buy legit editions. I am going to throw in a copy of the CD when I work on their machines, or install the apps if they wish. Not everyone has been assimilated, and as neighborhood geeks we have considerable influence.
      Use it.

    9. Re:Target audience faux pas? by jtev · · Score: 1

      What the hell are you talking about? the GPL allows for him to chage $5 to copy the damned CD, as long as he provides the source for any binary programs on the CD. All he's doing is encouraging the students to return the disks. and $5 isn't that much for the hassle of copying a CD to replace one a student doesn't bring back. Oh, and sorry for feeding the troll

      --
      That which is done from love exists beyond good and evil
  19. How about GNUWin??? by Artemis3 · · Score: 5, Informative
    This looks like yet another GNUWin...

    They really have to catch up :) Go GNUWin team go!

    --
    Artix
    Your Linux, your init.
    1. Re:How about GNUWin??? by Emil+fra+Loeneberg · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It is similar to GNUWin, but it's more critical when including programs, focusing only on the best. That's also why the ISO is only 300MB.

  20. What a good idea by skinfitz · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I like this. Easy to use software that is genuinely useful in a well presented form. Well done.

    1. Re:What a good idea by concord · · Score: 1

      My friend was trying to install Gimp on Windows because she saw me using it with linux. She sent me the following:

      which one do I choooose! overchoice!!

      help.

      http://www.gimp.org/~tml/gimp/win32/downloads.html

      I think this will help solve her problem! I can give her the CD!

      --
      MFG: "The system supports both the LAMP (Linux, Apache, MySQL, PHP) and WIMP (Windows, IIS, MySQL, PHP) platforms."
    2. Re:What a good idea by bfree · · Score: 4, Interesting
      One small problem, the Gimp is NOT included. According to their faq this is because
      • The installer is unreliable and complex
      • It depends on GTK+
      • The interface is clunky
      • The program is very complex
      • It doesn't support gifs out of the box
      • Windows port lags behind the Linux version
      Now they say they could handle a few of these problems, but combine them all and they think it's a no no. Personally I think the Gimp for windows is closer to the killer Free app than anything else (though openoffice.org is in with a shout) but I can understand why they think it would be problematic. I hope that someone will address some of these issues (installer could take care of GTK+ and be stablised, gif support could be simplified with a check box in the installer to download and install it and finally maybe someone could help get the windows version into step with the linux one).
      --

      Never underestimate the dark side of the Source

    3. Re:What a good idea by armchairlinguist · · Score: 1

      GIMP is a very difficult program to set up and use on Windows. Also, like Mozilla, it suffers from a lot of inconsistencies with the standard Win32-type interface.

      I do agree that it's a great program and one of the things that hooked me on Linux was the fact that I could, legitimately and for free, have a great graphics editor to work with. (I used to use MS Paint to do graphics. *gag*)

      I didn't really have any contact with Photoshop until after I'd used GIMP, which I think was part of the reason I didn't mind the weird interface, Linux being the other part, since most of its interfaces are a little weird.

      They have a specific WinGIMP project to work on it, so maybe they'll be able to include it in the future. But right now I think they're right not to include it, because most people trying to use GIMP on Windows would just get frustrated and go pirate a copy of Photoshop. :P

    4. Re:What a good idea by bfree · · Score: 2

      While I generally agree with the opinions of OpenCD, I would have to disagree with you that "GIMP is a very difficult program to set up .. on Windows". Have you tried? I did (about four months ago" and it was increidly easy to do, all you have to do is follow the instructions . A few downloads and a couple of installs later and you have The Gimp in a pretty indistiguisable form from the Linux version (though behind). The wingimp.org site suggests that this is now even easier! I would agree that The Gimp is not the simplest of programs to use however as it is a powerful complex program with a non-standard interface (if their is such a thing as a really standard interface for any specific type of program).

      --

      Never underestimate the dark side of the Source

  21. 293 Megabytes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's enough room for more stuff.
    What else can we put in there.
    I say Mozilla, at least.

    1. Re:293 Megabytes by MonTemplar · · Score: 1

      RTFA!

      They've been asked by the Mozilla team not do, due to the pace at which new build come out, they don't want people getting out-of-date builds...

      --
      -MT.
  22. PC Gamer? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I said real work.

    1. Re:PC Gamer? by Enahs · · Score: 2

      Again, as others have pointed out, it's just a troll, but the last time I checked one of the reasons people use Word in MS Office is as a glorified text editor. Writers write reviews in glorified text editors such as Word. Writers make money for what they do, therefore it's work. Writing is real work. Writing with Open Office is still real work.

      --
      Stating on Slashdot that I like cheese since 1997.
  23. what the heck is knoppix? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    KNOPPIX is a bootable CD with a collection of GNU/Linux software, automatic hardware detection, and support for many graphics cards, sound cards, SCSI and USB devices and other peripherals. KNOPPIX can be used as a Linux demo, educational CD, rescue system, or adapted and used as a platform for commercial software product demos. It is not necessary to install anything on a hard disk. Due to on-the-fly decompression, the CD can have up to 2 GB of executable software installed on it.

  24. Where is Gnucleus/Miranda ICQ damned? by Ilgaz · · Score: 1, Offtopic

    Guys, I apreciate your work but you are truely amazing.

    Why didn't you give away

  25. Where is Gnucleus/Miranda ICQ by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

    Guys, I appreciate your work but you are truely amazing.

    Why didn't you give away gnucleus, miranda ICQ?

    Miranda ICQ is the most lightweight GUI and GNU ICQ you can find on windows. Even my most fanatical MS developer friends use it. miranda-icq.sourceforge.net

    and Gnucleus even has auto-update code... gnucleus.sourceforge.net

    The most funny is those 2 are your "domain neighbours"

    Oh as you don't know for sure, gnucleus is the gnutella client which was stolen by morpheus. Used by THOUSANDS of windows users, check download.com.

    This post will get +5 so, I post AC

  26. From someone in the trenches by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Could they please be asked to remove Amaya. It's for testing web concepts, not browsing...
    The Windows port of Amaya is sub-alpha quality and horrendiously unstable. It has a nasty tendency to frequently lock the computer up hard... I wouldn't even consider recommending someone to install it on a Windows box. It will not leave a good impression.
    If you think this is a troll, then try it for yourself from w3.org

    1. Re:From someone in the trenches by Emil+fra+Loeneberg · · Score: 1

      Amaya isn't on the CD. Probably for that reason. It's listed as 'other OSS', ie. one of the candidates that didn't make it.

    2. Re:From someone in the trenches by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They must've cut it then... it is listed on their site as being included, I suppose they had a change of heart. Btw Amaya can be used for browsing, it just isn't very good at it.

  27. Biznet begs to differ by SoSueMe · · Score: 2, Informative

    CBCran a little feature on OpenOffice.org on Thursday in which columnist Jim Brey discissed, briefly, Open Source generally and Open Office specifically. You can listen to it here.
    Given that this is MainStream media, this is a solid endorsement for Open Office.

    In a ZDNet interview Microsoft's Jeff Raikes stated"We can say there's only about 10 percent or 20 percent of the features that we'll use, but your 10 percent is going to be different from my 10 percent."

    With the majority of the "Real Work" being done with 10 percent (+/-) of the features, I'd say OOo has a good chance to make serious inroads into the market. I still use Star Office on one of my laptops but will be looking at Open Office very soon.

  28. Is it not better... by SuperKendall · · Score: 3, Interesting

    to have some people use Free software and see some of the benefits, than to have those people only use Free software if they switch away from Windows altogether?

    A CD like this is helping users down a path, where you want them to climb a wall.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  29. This is awsome. by Lokist · · Score: 5, Interesting

    How many times have you Windows users had to download a shareware program that expires after 30 days? or have the program throw annoying popup windows after using it?

    This is awsome for the Windows community. It brings a little bit of open source to a closed sourced world. Maybe we can convert a few?

    Recently I sold someone a system that came with Windows XP. After debating if I should throw Linux on I decided that since the owner already paid for XP, they might as well use it... The problem was that they didn't have a word processor, they couldn't do graphics editing...they couldn't do anything... Whats the point of Windows without something to run on it?

    I ended up downloading Mozilla (because as we know... we can't trust Microsoft), Gimp, and Open Office... Wouldn't it be great if someone kept things organized and put out one handy dandy ISO for it all?

    If anything... This shows that the open source
    world is not selfish... We are bringing our software to a system that wants nothing to do with open source.

    See ya Bill Gates...

    --
    An active Open Source Advocate.

  30. But it is on the CD by vondo · · Score: 4, Informative

    Beonex communicator is on the CD, which is a rebranded mozilla. I've never used it, but it looks pretty much the same as stock mozilla 1.0.1, but rebranded and maybe missing the debuggers, and chatzilla. It has mail, news, composer, and of course, the browser parts of mozilla.

    1. Re:But it is on the CD by GuruJ · · Score: 1

      And as TheOpenCD points out in their FAQ, Mozilla contacted them and specifically requested that they *not* include Mozilla on the CD ...

      Remember, Mozilla is provided for testing only, not for commercial distribution. I find that hard to swallow because I personally think Mozilla is fantastic, but, well, they're right!

      REMEMBER:
      Mozilla is *not* an end-user product.
      Beonex and Netscape ARE.

      --
      -- Askari: Give JavaScript the bird.
  31. WHAT??? by SuperDuG · · Score: 3, Insightful

    you slashdot the website the cd images are stored on and you want us to review them? Basically you've set the project back almost 2 days until the story leaves the front page.

    --
    Ignore the "p2p is theft" trolls, they're just uninformed
    1. Re:WHAT??? by MonTemplar · · Score: 1

      Actually, the CD images are on several other web and FTP sites worldwide, linked from the Download page, so not much danger of slashdotting...

      Downloading the ISO (plus the GNUwin II ISO) as I type. Now I really appreciate have a broadband connection...

      --
      -MT.
    2. Re:WHAT??? by bstadil · · Score: 1
      Basically you've set the project back almost 2 days

      The project only has value if its existence is known . It's called advertising, you might have heard of it. The point is not to review the stuff but get it onto the machines of windows users.

      --
      Help fight continental drift.
    3. Re:WHAT??? by Darnit · · Score: 1

      Theopencd.org is not one of the download sites.

    4. Re:WHAT??? by sconeu · · Score: 2

      All 3 US mirrors are slashdotted. I was getting 6KB/second and I have a broadband connection. Heck, I couldn't even connect to Penn State!

      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
    5. Re:WHAT??? by MonTemplar · · Score: 1

      Sorry, can't help you there. I'm in the UK, and downloaded from Belgium, steady 60K/s whilst I had my dinner...

      --
      -MT.
    6. Re:WHAT??? by sconeu · · Score: 2

      Thanks. I'm tried the Belgian download. I'm now getting 72KB/s. 1 hour is a heck of a lot different than 16 hours (yes, I know the times don't match up -- but that's what my browser told me).

      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
  32. Open Source Coasters by MeanMF · · Score: 3, Funny

    Is there somebody out there who is going to collect 1,000,000 of these and deliver them to Richard Stallman? If so, sign me up!!

  33. Re: And to think it almost didn't make it! by MarkWPiper · · Score: 1
    A month or so ago, I really wanted to join this project, but it (seemed like it?) was dead. I checked all the forums, checked the mailing lists, checked the newsletters... but there had not been any post in weeks.

    Needless to say, I'm quite happy this has made it. One of the real problems with open source, especially on young projects, is communication. How can this be fixed? (Granted, hackers don't always have the best communication skills.) To think that a project with so much potential almost was lost!

  34. This might be good by Jedbro · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I completly understand mozila.org's stance on this. Contrary to what most people believe, MOZILLA is NOT a end user product. it is the base code for people to use to supply their own product (hence Netscape 7, phoenix (5), K-meleon, Gnome, ghostzilla, etc.)

    The worst thing that could happen is newcomers using bugzilla as their "discusion forum". I do agree though that some kind of gecko based browser should be added to the CD. What about phoenix? their is a HUGE user support group and lot's of related pages.

    (phoenix forum )
    (phoenix help/themes/extensions/etc. )

    As the developer's say;

    1.- What can I do to help?
    We need all the distribution we can get. Tell your family. Tell your friends. Tell your coworkers. If you're a student, get it distributed at your college. Submit a story to Slashdot and other news sites about the release. Make some noise on your blog. Spread the word!

    Why not include it?
    In the next month or so, I plan to build my own mozilla and phoenix and re-distribute it. Would anyone be interested?
  35. The installer by browser_war_pow · · Score: 1, Flamebait

    Is the installer a typical OSS POS or is actually quality? Flame me all you want, juxtapose Debian with Mandrake. Debian's installer is nothing compared to Mandrake's for the average user. If the installer isn't as good as the usual installer for Windows then this project is next to worthless. The only people that you'll get from this are those ABMers who are too lazy or cheap to put their money where their mouths are and switch to Linux or OSX. Open source developers just about don't have a track record, let alone a bad one, on making newbie friendly installers.

    1. Re:The installer by ctid · · Score: 3, Informative

      One of the criteria they have is that each application should have a professional-looking install process. Some applications have been rejected on the grounds that their installation processes weren't up to scratch. From what I read, it seems that the programs are installed individually, not as a group.

      --
      Reality is defined by the maddest person in the room
    2. Re:The installer by Theom · · Score: 1

      AFAIK The Mandrake installer is under the GNU GPL...

      --

      mp3: l33t term for empty.
  36. Open source philosophy?! by Christopher+Doopov · · Score: 5, Insightful

    From the What is TheOpenCD website:

    "It also includes a selection of essays about Open Source philosophy, and links to other programs that might be of interest."

    I'm sorry, but what is exactly open source philosophy? Open source is about technical and economical advantages. Free software is about philosophy. Please do not flame me for saying the obvious. When Eric Raymond took Debian Free Software Guidelines and published them as Open Source Definition in 1998 he did it exactly because he wanted free software without the strong philosophy associated with the "free software" term since at least the announcement of the GNU Project in 1983.

    I think that TheOpenCD project should not talk about philosophy if they want to promote the open source movement. But if they think that the philosophy is important, then they should promote the free software movement and change their name to TheFreeCD. Because the philosophy is exactly the difference between free software and open source movements. If they talk about "open source philosophy" they are being against the main priciples of both movements.

    TheOpenCD project people should read these books:

    Those books are not very long, but they provide enough background to let avoid using such unfortunate oxymorons like "open source philosophy." I strongly respect both free software and open source movements and I can not stay ignorant when people insult any of them, while the term "open source philosophy" insults both.

    --

    ~Christopher Doopov

    1. Re:Open source philosophy?! by Emil+fra+Loeneberg · · Score: 2, Informative

      You'er right, "Open Source Philosophy" is an oxymoron; "Open Source Ideas" or "Open Source Thinking" might be better. The two books you mention are quite good, and are both included on the CD in full (plus some essays).

    2. Re:Open source philosophy?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      > You'er right, "Open Source Philosophy" is an
      > oxymoron; "Open Source Ideas" or "Open Source
      > Thinking" might be better.

      No dude, I think that's not his point.
      Do you really think that calling Richard Stallman's essays 'open source ideas' or 'open source thinking' is any less insulting to the Free Software movement, Free Software Foundation or Richard Stallman himself, than calling it 'open source philosophy' would be?
      If so, then you totally missed the point of almost 20 years of Free Software movement existence and you should reeducate yourself as soon as possible. You can start from: FSF.org/philosophy It should give you all info you need to find out why all of those terms you are trying to propagate are unacceptable.
      But please, for the love of God, DON'T PUBLISH FREE SOFTWARE FOUNDATION ESSAYS CALLING THEM OPEN SOURCE PHILOSOPHY/IDEAS/THINKING/WHATEVER! IT DOES MORE HARM THAN GOOD, FOR GOD'S SAKE!
      Read FSF Philosophy: Terminology and Definitions, especially Confusing Words which You Might Want to Avoid, Why "Free Software" is better than "Open Source" and Letter to the Editor of Dr. Dobb's Journal. Let me quote Confusing Words: Open for you, just in case you don't think it's important to follow the links I provided:
      Please avoid using the word "open" as a substitute for "free software". A different group, whose values are less idealistic than ours, uses "open source" as its slogan. If you are referring to them, it is proper to use their name, but please don't lump us in with them or describe our work by their label---that leads people to think we are their supporters.

      Please, I'm sick of people still being ignorant about these issues.
      For the love of God, FSF has been telling about it for almost 20 years, how long does it need to take for all you people to finally stop being so fucking ignorant?! 50 years? 100? 200?
      I'm sorry but it sickens me. It's like calling Pope a lutheran, no more, no less.
      Do you really think that it wouldn't be an insult to the whole Church?
  37. I care... by MonTemplar · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I think it's a good idea, because in one download I've got a whole bunch of Open Source software to check out, along with source code and docs.

    Magazines have known about this for a long time - cover CDs can shift a lot of dead-tree publications if they've got good software on them. OK, so I got to burn my own CD, but that's not costing me much. Then I can find out what all the fuss is about - are The Gimp, OpenOffice, et al. really all that? - without having to tramp around the Internet.

    As for 'but it's not the latest version!', well this is always a dilemma when compiling 'sampler' CDs, whether it's Open Source or not. Provided the version included on the CD is not really ancient, and is stable, then I see no problem.

    And as for 'just get a warez copy', I'd rather take the free sample and stay honest, than be a thief, thank you very much...

    --
    -MT.
  38. The "Gateway Drug" by The+Monster · · Score: 3, Funny
    Linux can do that, and more, and with more freedom
    For the Kansas City Linux User Group booth at ITEC a few months ago, we threw together our own Free (at least as in speech - mostly GPL but some other licenses too) Software for Windows CD, and handed it out alongside our Linux offerings (inxluding Demo Linux, which allowed people to get used ). I called this the 'gateway drug', explaining to people that once they got a taste of what free software could do on a closed-source OS, the next step is to see what it could do when it's completely free. Our collection included a lot of things the Open CD people didn't - we had things like Apache and Ethereal on ours, but Open Office and the GIMP were probably the ones that most people would find helpful.
    --

    [100% ISO 646 Compliant]
    SVM, ERGO MONSTRO.

  39. Nothing new here ... by jc42 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I have a number of friends who are stuck with using NT at work. They say they have an approach that works pretty well. They note that Microsoft claims that NT is POSIX compliant. They take this at face value, and start downloading the source for all the usual POSIX-based tools from the online linux archives. They compile them, and they mostly work quite well.

    There are problems with the things that just don't work right, of course. But a friend put this in an interesting perspective. Back in the early days of POSIX, the committee sent out requests for specs for a system called WEIRDNIX. This was defined as a system that was technically in compliance with the POSIX specs, but took advantage of every loophole and ambiguity to do things in the worst possible way. This was a technique of pre-emptively adjusting the wording so that vendors would have difficulty violating the spirit of POSIX.

    The Microsoft version of the POSIX libraries can be viewed as an implementation of WEIRDNIX. This should give you a good idea of them problems that you will encounter.

    But in general, the gnu and linux tools are widely reported to work pretty well on NT. Better than the NT tools, anyway.

    --

    --
    Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
  40. back to the future by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sure makes me miss Walnut Creek CDROM.

  41. AOL cds by spazoid12 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Does this mean some rich person is going to fund the mailing out of billions of Debian CDs to every person in the US on a weekly schedule competing with AOL? Instead of "1000 Hours Free!" it could read "Your Life: Free!".

    All kidding aside, some kind of grassroots movement for that might be cool even without some rich person to fund it all. You'd go to a website and grab a copy of a standard CD label graphic, burn 20 CDs of some distro, package it up, and then send them out (maybe to a list of addresses provided by the website). A distributed effort to mimic the AOL campaign for OSS benefit, coordinated by some volunteer website.

    Although CD-R blanks are practically free, where can you get empty DVD cases for super cheap?

    1. Re:AOL cds by spazoid12 · · Score: 1

      BTW, sorry if this isn't an original idea. In fact, I barely skimmed the original post...which is what made me think of this. For all I know the original post is saying this exact thing, in probably a better way. I should go re-read it. I'm curious how a scenario like this would deal with security. What's to stop a covert MS operation (or any anti-OSS) from distributing virus-laden CDs under the guise of such a program in order to discredit it?

  42. Re: And to think it almost didn't make it! by Darnit · · Score: 3, Informative

    Sorry about that. All the main hubbub happened during the summer when people weren't as busy with school. Selanit busted some major ass to get this out before finals came up and bit him.

    Progress was very slow though at the start of the fall semester of school.

    But we are still here.

  43. popup blocking by b17bmbr · · Score: 1

    i sold someone last night on moz, when i said all you do is go into edit->preferences->advanced->scripts&plugins->open unrequested windows (uncheck). viola, no popups. that is worth its weight in gold. try that in ie.

    --
    My problem? I was perfectly gruntled, until some numbnuts came by and dissed me.
  44. This is great! Software SHOULD be cross platform! by Mustang+Matt · · Score: 3, Insightful

    A lot of these programs are cross platform.

    A lot of linux users don't understand why anyone should spend the time to write/port windows software. The reason is that this sort of thing helps users transition at their own pace.

    They have the ability to run open source software under the OS that their familiar and comfortable wth and the next time the license renewall comes up they can say, "hey, I can run this same software under a free OS instead of paying license fees!"

    I've gotten a lot of Windows users to start using PuTTY, WinSCP2 and OpenOffice. I really think this is the first step to becoming comfortable with linux on a daily basis.

    --
    The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
  45. hmm by zapfie · · Score: 3, Interesting

    From the article..

    "Given that we now have this fast, secure, desktop-ready, free OS, why doesn't everyone switch?"

    Hate to argue the third point, but until Linux has a single, consistant, easily understandable set of user interface guidelines that most people follow, I don't think we are there yet. One of the main rules of UI design is consistancy, but a user's experiences will differ vastly from one program to the next, often not allowing them to take what they've learned in one program and apply it to another. (for example, toolbars get located in different places, menu layouts work differently, widgets don't behave the same way, buttons on standard dialog boxes are placed differently, some support context menus, some don't, etc etc.) I'm not saying it's any better or worse on the Windows side, but in my eyes, that really is a major hurdle we need to work on as a community before we proclaim Linux a "desktop-ready" OS.

    --
    slashdot!=valid HTML
    1. Re:hmm by tempfile · · Score: 2

      The argument is getting tired. There is no such thing as a "Linux desktop". There's numerous different desktop environments that run on Linux, such as KDE, GNOME, *Step, you name it. If a user only uses one of those environments, he has a perfect consistent UI.

      Thanks to openness, a user can use applications based on different toolkits and environments in parallel, but this has nothing to do with missing inconsistency in the "Linux Desktop", a thing that doesn't exist and, Thank God, will never exist.

    2. Re:hmm by zapfie · · Score: 2

      Uh, no shit. Hence why I carefully avoided mentioning toolkits, desktop environments and the like. What I suggested was a single UI specification, not windowing environment. Also, realize what a programmer and a power user wants out of a computer is not what a typical user needs. You are not a typical computer user. Nor am I. We'd probably both make lousy interface designers. For my needs, Linux on the desktop is already where it needs to be, but for the common user, I don't feel that is the case. Drink some coffee, and try reading my previous post again.

      --
      slashdot!=valid HTML
    3. Re:hmm by tempfile · · Score: 2

      Looks like I really misunderstood that. I read your text more like "everything should be one architecture".

      You're right about the UI design issue. But on the other hand - I consider many Windows interfaces just as horrible as a rushed-together Linux interface.

    4. Re:hmm by zapfie · · Score: 1

      Yeah, Windows most certainly has its share of completely bizarre interfaces (I think WinMX wins the award from me.). I was going to give you a link to the Interface Hall of Shame, which is an interesting collection of them (mostly Windows), but it appears to be down..

      --
      slashdot!=valid HTML
  46. free==bad by bcrowell · · Score: 2

    There's a real perception among most users that free==bad. For instance, I'm switching my college physics lab courses from Excel to OpenOffice for graphing. When I mentioned this to a colleague, his response was "yeah, it's probably good enough for a lot of stuff." The only way to dispel this misconception is to let people see for themselves some concrete examples of how OSS can be higher in quality.

  47. I disagree. I have proof. by Mustang+Matt · · Score: 2

    For me personally, these programs have helped me become more and more comfortable with the idea of using linux on the desktop. I haven't switched yet, but I'm close enough to actually be dual booting now thanks to all the developers that released my favorite programs cross platform.

    --
    The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
  48. Mozilla Spellchecker by bstadil · · Score: 1
    (Yes, the Netscape 7 spellchecker is currently once more working on linux builds, but not on windows.)

    There is a working windows spellchecker for Mozilla 1.21. It's based on the OpenOffice spellchecker I believe. It works for me, but someone on the mailing list has reported problems, but try it.

    --
    Help fight continental drift.
  49. Well, the usual solution isn't OSS by Kjella · · Score: 2

    How many times have you Windows users had to download a shareware program that expires after 30 days? or have the program throw annoying popup windows after using it?

    Well, what I see happens is this:

    1. www.google.com
    2. serial "Program name"
    3. enter serial

    Maybe your grandma doesn't do that. But when her 15 grandson comes visit, poof goes the nags/expire dates. This has been around slashdot a few times, it's much more common than downloading huge warez or cracks. No "unknown" software downloaded from various sites, just copy-paste a key. Not trying to defend it, but it sure happens a lot.

    Kjella

    --
    Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    1. Re:Well, the usual solution isn't OSS by Lokist · · Score: 1

      I think the point here is to do things legally... Downloading warez is just as easy as downloading a shareware program sometimes...

      See your point though.

  50. you seem to have the answers - get busy by DrSkwid · · Score: 2

    Also, we didn't have anybody willing to take on that task. If you want to help us out with this, get in touch!

    --
    There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
    1. Re:you seem to have the answers - get busy by fucksl4shd0t · · Score: 1

      Time is an issue for me, since I'm already working on other projects. :( I will see what I can do, however, since I have already had to deal with compiling mozilla. One more problem, and this is significant, is that I do not have a windows box for the job. I run only GNU/Linux. if I remove the spam stuff from your posted email address on slashdot, is it still a real email address? (cuntbubble.com?)

      --
      Like what I said? You might like my music
  51. I do. by Mustang+Matt · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This means that I can download the CD and when I work on computers for people and they say, "dang it! Word is crashing every 12 minutes and giving me a blue screen of death!" I can say, "Hey, check out this free software I have that is compatible with word."

    --
    The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
  52. How I will use this project... by snilloc · · Score: 3, Interesting
    I won't use this project exactly as it stands, but I wasn't previously aware of some of the programs, and I will incorporate some of them into my own shareware/OSS/cracked CD.

    As somebody who (like many /.-ers) provides cheap and/or free tech support to family and friends, I make my own "distro" of software for Windows that gets installed as needed. Being a pragmatist, some of the software I have used is less than legally pure. I try to find free (beer) and free (GNU) software wherever I can, but sometimes a few serial numbers come in handy.

    As has been pointed out, nobody is going to install Beonix on somebody else's computer. You're either going to update their IE and leave it at that, or you're going to give 'em Mozilla at best.

    Also, I'm going to keep giving people WinAmp. No, it isn't free in the GNU sense, but lots of people use it... It's not some wierd product that nobody has ever heard of and can't figure out how to use. And I always keep an installer of Adobe Acrobat around. Sure, I'm probably violating the EULA, but what the hell? I hate going to somebody else's house and waiting for a dialup download and then charge these good people by the hour when I have already spent a lot of time ridding their computer of viruses and I have better things to do.

    Probably, the biggest question I am asked about the super-anal-free-GNU software I install on other people's computers is "why?". Why, when Winamp exists and is supported, would I install FreeAmp or anything else? People don't want to hear about RMS and the GNU philosophy, they just want their shit to work, and as cheaply and easily as possible.

    To summarize, my personal softare collection will

    • Try to minimize the amount of legally questionable software on it, while not being anal about certain things like re-distribution of a free (beer) product.
    • Give people software I think they are capable of using - if this means occasionally using a serial-ized shareware program, so be it.
    • Not leave a computer unable to read common file formants (acrobat, zip), thus minimizing the amount of time I have to deal with these people.

    My biggest wish from the OSS community (and I am not a programmer, and I don't have the time to learn), is for a good Windows virus scanner. I have used (and still use) free (beer) virus scanners because people don't want to pay a ton of cash to make their computer usable. I more-or-less like the one I am using now (grisoft), but I have been burnt by "discontinued programs" before. Bait and switch. I suspect that the scanner itself wouldn't be too hard to write, but updating virus sigs on a regular basis would be.

    What would probably be more useful to people like myself is a "virtual" CD.... A list of freely available (but not anally or unnecessarily GNU-ized) collection of download links to software ... and the total download size magically adds up to 650 MB or less.

  53. ***SOURCE*** by The+Pi-Guy · · Score: 2

    I can't find the source on the page. Am I just another stupid Slashdotter, or are they missing something??

    --j

    1. Re:***SOURCE*** by Emil+fra+Loeneberg · · Score: 1

      It's on the CD itself.

  54. What do you disagree with? (was: I disagree.) by rickymoz · · Score: 1

    Sorry, but I don't get your point. You are going to dual-boot because you've discovered the OSS on Windows and now you are convinced OSS is a great thing. So actually, you are showing a proof that you agree with what I said: OSS on Windows makes the switch from Win to Linux easier.

  55. Clarification by Mustang+Matt · · Score: 2

    Sorry if I was confusing.

    What I'm saying is without programs like openoffice and putty and winscp and mozilla (all running on win) I wouldn't even consider running an open OS like linux on the desktop.

    --
    The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
  56. What I can't figure out is who is the target? by circusnews · · Score: 1

    This is a nice general OSS CD, but I have to ask, who is this really targeted at?

    My first thought was that it is targeted at college students. Thats a very good place to start, as its a group that will pop a CD into the drive and play with the new toys, and this contains a nice selection suitable for most college kids. But then why not the P2P apps and a programming suite?

    My second thought was that it was targeted at the buisness world. Some nice buisness applications (OOo, ABI, FileZilla), but no flow chart app, no contact management, etc.

    I guess I just can't figure out what group in the general non-geek population this is targeting, and and how it is showing them a better way to do what they are doing.

    I guess marketing what we have avalible for the larger community really is the one thing that we in OSS will never be able to get right.

  57. distributing CDs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Here's a thought: can somebody out there with bucks left over from the 90s print & mass-mail the CDs to homes everywhere just like AOL does with their CDs?

  58. how to view html mail as text by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    some (most?) mail programs use .mailcap. try this,
    text/html; lynx -force_html -dump %s |less

    works great for mail from hotmail/msn users.

  59. Distro? Distro of WHAT?!! by swordgeek · · Score: 2

    OK, I go to the site and I find that it's a 'distro' of assorted open source windows software.

    That doesn't matter though. OSS is the only thing that matters. What it is, what it does, how well it does it, NONE of this seems to matter any more--the dividing lines between any two sides of the coin have all faded, and now we're left looking at exactly one question: Is it OpenSource(tm), or EvilProprietary?

    Open source as a methodology and a scheme for distributing software is excellent. OpenSource as a cult is exactly as bad as any other cult, and that seems to be the way the OSS world is going--straight to cult status. "You're either with US, or you're with the TERR'RISTS!!!" "My 'puter is L33t--I don't have any proprietary software on it!!!"

    Honestly, tell us about new software projects. Tell us how they're licensed. But don't base the QUALITY or VALIDITY of a project on its license, and whether it's OSS.

    --

    "People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
  60. Not to toot my own horn... by cos(0) · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ...but I offer my own Open Source Software CD to people at my school and recently on eBay. I used Slashdot's story a few months ago about what software for Windows to include on a CD-ROM to get about 666 MB worth of software.

    First I gave out a few for free to friends. Then others that are in our computer science classes -- people I barely know -- started asking me for my "open" CD for the DJGPP compiler that's on it. My school uses the ancient Borland Turbo C++ 3.0, and DJGPP's IDE, RHIDE, emulates it very well -- a great alternative to paying $70 for the suite. So far a few tens of CDs were sold at my school and two online.

    These CDs are quite popular.

    1. Re:Not to toot my own horn... by mzo23 · · Score: 1

      666mb eh? so they get a cd full of "free" software in exchange for their...soul?

      --
      I don't have a sig, can I borrow yours?
  61. Re:Value difference with free OSes lowers... NOT. by dwheeler · · Score: 3, Insightful
    I think you're looking too short-range. Look at what happened with gcc. Once gcc became a powerful C compiler, available on non-free platforms, it became extremely widespread, and eventually a massive amount of code became dependent on _gcc_ instead of a proprietary alternative. Then, once the Free operating systems became more mature, people MUCH more easily ported to them.

    The same can occur here, too. It's very difficult to get Word users to switch to Linux! But if the majority of word processor users (for example) used Open Office (or Abiword or KWord), then they'd find it essentially trivial to switch.

    People don't buy operating systems. They buy applications, and then get the operating system to run it. If you want people to use your operating system, you need to get them to use the applications that run on your operating system.

    --
    - David A. Wheeler (see my Secure Programming HOWTO)
  62. The Moral Issue by rinkjustice · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I think open source software is not so much an alternative to proprietary software but rather an alternative to stolen proprietary software, aka warez. I personally use GPL software because I can't afford the proprietary "versions" and I'd rather not steal it. Linux tends to be the perfect platform to run software of this ilk so I use Caldera OpenLinux as my main and only os.

    Open source is a lawful and creative answer to warez! Perhaps it's an angle distributers like OpenCD should look at.

  63. Why? by Moderation+abuser · · Score: 2

    Because installing one is theft and installing the other is not. You can rationalize it all you like.

    --
    Government of the people, by corporate executives, for corporate profits.
    1. Re:Why? by snilloc · · Score: 2
      1. As to the specific "why" question I addressed in my previous post... Winamp and some other free (beer) programs can be downloaded free of charge and free of any registration of any kind. Using a GNU alternative is dumb from my perspective when no money is involved and the end-user is satisfied. This is what I mean by being GNU-anal. Another great example of the "why" question is alternative browsers. Some people think I am insane for using Mozilla. "What's wrong with IE?". I tell them, and they don't care. NO THEFT INVOLVED.
      2. Installing "free" Acrobat reader on more than one computer may or may not actually violate the EULA. It probably does, but then again, there are copies of the AcroReader installer on all kinds of CDs that never ever get "registered" for free or whatever the hell Adobe does nowadays. I'm not losing any sleep over this, and neither should anybody else.
      3. I have explicitly stated that I install serialed software. No rationalization necessary. I fucking stole it. And not to "justify" or "rationalize" my actions, but I'm not the only person who does this. The reality is that people steal software. Projects like this one are a good place to start. Being overly GNU is probably holding back the project's popularity at this point, but it ain't my project.
      4. Some of the choices on the CD aren't choices that I would personally make. But it ain't my project, so they can do whatever the hell they want. I only offer my suggestions.
      5. My suggestion to somebody with a lot of free time is to make a virtual CD. From the project's perspective, doing this would eliminate issues of software registration for free stuff, and eliminate the whole "Mozilla not being an end-user item and we don't want outdated software being shipped" thing. Basically, a list of BEST TOOLS FOR THE JOB, gratis. The GPL-license sufficient but not necessary. Having such a collection of legal but not necessarily GPL software will bring down the amount of total software piracy, and I think we can all agree that would be a good thing.
  64. Try Win/Mozilla first before you open your mouth! by aquarian · · Score: 2

    I use Mozilla every day as my main browser on Windows. This is not to make a statement or because I feel sorrty for the Mozilla organization, but because it's a better browser, and I like it better. Just the popup control alone makes it worth switching. The only problems it ever has is when hitting pages designed exclusively for IE. I'll admit the Mail/News section isn't as elegant as OE, but it works fine, and even has some neat features that OE lacks (folder flexibility, Bayesian spam filtering). Unless you're a dedicated smut surfer, the News section works fine too. And the text editor in Mail/News actually works all the time, unlike OE's which is really buggy.

  65. TheOpenCD is half empty -- fill it with music by alfaiomega · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The ISO image is only 300MB, so more than half of the CD is empty. I would suggest filling it with some music. The empty space should be filled with about 100 songs. Free software is not the only Free data out there, there is also Free music.

    --

    root@aio:~# nmap -sX -iR -p1- # Ho, ho, ho! Merry Xmas, everyone!

  66. Too harsh dude... by Penguinoflight · · Score: 2

    The project needs hits... they probably don't really mind getting some. They're not getting setback 2 days, they're getting ahead a couple months by Slashdot users actually using it and giving them a good foundation.

    So yeah, they should post mirrors, but this is better than no story at all, by a lot.

    --
    "And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the World"
    1 John 4:14
  67. Irony by jvt · · Score: 1

    Does anyone else find it ironic that they used Visual Basic to develop their CD browser?

    1. Re:Irony by perotbot · · Score: 1

      I find find it more ironic that everything in the distro works, correctly and the first time....

      --
      ~corporate tool, but employed~
  68. Phat Linux by nstrom · · Score: 2

    Sounds kind of like Phat Linux to me.

  69. yup, cuntbubble.com by DrSkwid · · Score: 1

    and yeah, i have an xp box round here

    want to get busy?

    --
    There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
  70. Re:0th post ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In America maybe. In Soviet Russia, first post is INT_MAX!

  71. GNU Win II by Bill+Kendrick · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Somehow I hadn't heard of (or forgot about) TheOpenCD.

    I'm vaguely familiar (as in, two of my apps are included in, and I just submitted many more to) the GNUWin II CD. It's the same idea. A CD of Open Source software we all use and love; just Windows versions of them.

    I guess I'm going to have to find someone who runs Windows and have them nominate some of my ported games to TheOpenCD. :^)

  72. Last Post! by alpg · · Score: 1

    They seem to have learned the habit of cowering before authority even when
    not actually threatened. How very nice for authority. I decided not to
    learn this particular lesson.
    -- Richard Stallman

    - this post brought to you by the Automated Last Post Generator...