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SCO DOS Harming Innocent Bystanders
An anonymous reader writes "The SCO-IBM-Linux controversy has certainly caused quite a stir. Unfortunately the vigilantes conducting the DOS attacks against SCO are harming innocent by-standers as described in this e-Week story. " Choice conspiracy theory quote: 'Given SCO's behavior recently, it's just as likely that they're attacking themselves in their continued attempt to pump up their stock price'
I'm just curious to know where they are launching the supposed DOS from.....Redmond?
No more Micro$oft bashing from me. Its like bashing at the special olympics.
Maybe we should all test it. Right now.
I like their poll. I wonder how SCO's PR department would spin the fact that 96% of people think SCO are smoking crack.
Oh, as if the UNIX scandal wasn't bad enough... now they are after DOS as well!!!
This is why script kiddies are annoying. They find exploits and other scripts/tools and then randomly use them thinking they know what they're doing.
This is why armchair slashdot readers typically shouldn't be lawyers [myself included], doctors, etc...
I hope they catch the people doing the DoS attack [probably as they brag how cool the attack is over some l33t IRC channelz] and beat their heads into the ground.
SCO maybe "evil" but you gotta think before you act!
Tom
Someday, I'll have a real sig.
Yeah, well tough shit. If they don't like it, they can complain to their ISP to get those SCO criminals booted off their network.
</sarcasm>
Sorry, I was just trying to imitate the SPEWS guys ;-)
I highly doubt that SCO is peforming this attack themselves. There are simply too many others willing to do it for them.
If a SCO executive ordered the self-attack, and a loyal SCO IT person (I want a shot of what he's drinking) carried it out, when the FBI comes calling, how far up the tree would the IT person point when he was arrested?
If a SCO executive was pinpointed in ordering a DOS (unlikely, but hey, Enron being publicly exposed was unlikely), how would that affect the Linux lawsuit? IANAL, but it seems like SCO execs would have nothing to gain from DOSing theirselves and only fines or Jail-time to face.
The next Slashdot story will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and slashdot the links early!
I thought ESR asked the DoSer(s) to kindly stop DoSing, and they did.
Who's DoSing now?
www.sco.com seems to work for me.
Are we sure that Darl's not making shit up to put on the "we is poor, oppressed SCO being singled out and picked on..." face?
do() || do_not();
http://news.netcraft.com/
The SCO site has been up during business hours in Utah, but has since failed again. Many news sites carried the story that Eric Raymond had spoken to agroup responsible for a Distributed Denial of Service attack on the www.sco.com site and that they agreed to stop. However it appears that this may have been a hoax, or they subsequently changed their minds, or another person decided to continue the attack, or that the timeout on the attack has not yet been reached.
In a similar situation 10 days ago Microsoft chose to deploy Akamai's caching service, which has successfully averted any outages.
Akamai would be more dependable at warding off Distributed Denial of Service attacks than favours from Eric Raymond, but concievably SCO may have difficulty swallowing its pride and buying a service that uses tens of thousands of Linux servers, for which Akamai presumably has not purchased a SCO licence.
I don't think so, this is a PR war, and has been from the instant SCO started the FUD campaign. Linux users cannot be seen as a group of geeks with no respect for the law and proper buisness procedures. The very thing SCO needs right now is something to feed to the FUD machine, and the last thing geeks need to give SCO is ammunition.
If every website hosting company shuns SCO due to the attacks then they won't have a website.
They'll have nowhere to post their FUD.
Perhaps SCO placed the alleged IP infringing code into the linux kernel themselves. Maybe the code contains a timebomb so as to cause a distributed denial of service attack against SCO, giving them more publicity. I wonder when the Underpants Gnomes are going to sue SCO for patent infringement for their unique business model...
So much for trying to be funny...
Not that I want to endorce vigialantism, but DOS attacks on SCO and its partners could be used to stop other corporations from doing business with them. Perhaps that is the DOS attackers' goal. However, I do not think that the DOS attacks are productive to the goal of getting rid of SCO's attacks on Linux.
IMO, a much better strategy would be for everyone using Linux to start buying SCO stock, and then, as a stock holder action, vote all of SCO's patents and copyrights into the public domain (and then disolve the company).
Galium Arsenide is the material of the future, and always will be.
Well, if their server had been running proper licensed SCO code then it would not only have survived the continual DoS, but would have shot down the attacking machines in droves...
...but no, they just want to demonstrate how crap Apache & Linux is, especially since it is stolen perversion of all of SCO's IP. And what an effective demonstaration it is, why that must be propping up the stock value by about 99%
;-)
That the concept of DOS attacks is owned by SCO! SCO developed this technology very early on.
All those running worms/shell scripts used in DOS attacks can license the IP behind it now! Only $799! (Special Introductory Price).
Easy guys, I put my pants on one leg at a time. The difference is after I put on my pants I make gold records!
Smoking Crack Operation
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
Yes, MS-DOS was created in Redmond.
Yes, I am a pedantic geek.
Please use DoS for Denial of Service, and DOS for Disk Operating System. "of" shouldn't be capitalized.
Too bad the Deptartment of Transportation had to screw up my little world with DOT. Quit shouting "dot!"
Since when was there conclusive proof that SCO were actually being hit by DoS/DDoS?
I remember reading elsewhere that it's entirely possible that they've just taken down there site of their own accord.
Another US$100k to the senior VP on Tuesday last week.
Makes it One Million Dollarsin two months.
Reginald C. Broughton...come on down!
(so it's OT, but keep watching these bastards).
-- Free software on every PC on every desk
Eventually SCO will go broke trying to win its laughable lawsuit. IBM has the resources to fight the case and the Open Source Community shouldn't worry about a few lost revenues in the meantime. One of the reasons why Linux has been able to take on Microsoft is the fact the M$ can't undermine the open source revenue stream when it is practically non-existant.
In the meantime, is there any reason why we should stoop to SCO's level?
Looking for a job?
Want your resume written professionally?
DON'T USE TUNAREZ!!!
Article: " 'Given SCO's behavior recently, it's just as likely that they're attacking themselves in their continued attempt to pump up their stock price"
You: "it's just as likely that they're attacking themselves in their continued attempt to pump up their stock price Given their past behaviour, I would not doubt it."
Umm... You're just repeating the quote from the article...
Oh, and I'd just like to point out that I think that SCO may be attacking themselves just to raise their stock price, given that they have not been behaving very ethically recently...
Who exactly isn't an innocent bystander here, besides SCO and IBM? SCO has been harming a massive number of innocent bystanders throughout this whole process (for example, the 1,500 Linux-using companies that they sent letters to, costing them legal time at the very least). No, two wrongs don't make a right and it sucks that the DOS attacks are harming innocent bystanders, but why is eWeek focusing on that when SCO is harming so many more innocents?
I think we can live with a few friendly casualities... ;)
I think that's in rather poor taste. At least it seems that way from an 'ally' on this side of Atlantic.
There is just as much reason to believe that SCO set this whole thing up as that FS/OSS advocates DoS'ed them. Even if FS/OSS advocate did DoS them, that's not "us". That is specific individuals taking part in a certain activity. There is no "us" about it, so stop defaming the FS/OSS community.
social sciences can never use experience to verify their statemen
Next McBribe will be showing off a server stats chart to stock holders as proof of sco's growing relevance in the high tech world.
some days...
No more Micro$oft bashing from me. Its like bashing at the special olympics.
Can that run Linux?
I think SCO is behind this, just like IBM is behind all the backlash to SCO.
Publicity saying how bad the other side hurting the "nonparticipants" always validates your cause.
I've noticed that the net seems to have been particularly slow recently. Checking on Xaffire Inc.'s Internet Average it's obvious that there are a few problems. Could this be a combination of the various DDoS's occuring at the moment and the recent worms?
sorry but http://www.caldera.com/company/drdos.html
says: "EMBEDDED LINUX MOVED TO TOP PRIORITY AT LINEO, INC., FORMERLY KNOWN AS CALDERA THIN CLIENTS, INC.
Lineo's Embedded Linux, Based on Caldera Systems' OpenLinux, is Natural Evolution for Companies With Years of Success in Both Linux and Embedded DOS"
ah well couldn't find much more under 1 minute.
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
YOu also have to realize that what SCO is doing is hurting a lot of innocent bystanders also. Even if SCO is somehow proven right, they are taking this to people who never put any code into the Linux kernel by using baseless threats that their IP is in it and therefor theirs!
Maybe it is SCO DOS. That could be their new OS. Their most powerful OS to date. That would explain a lot.
Karma: Sucks (Mostly due to the fact that you suck)
LSD more often sparks insight or provides a novel point of view rather than causing outright delusions. Cocaine and amphetamines on the other hand can cause outright schizophreniform psychosis if taken for too long. This and the correlation between D2 receptor antagonism and antipsychotic potency is why schizophrenia is thought to be a largely dopaminergic disorder. Though it's becoming clear that glutaminergic and cholinergic systems play a significant role.
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
There is absolutley no justification for DOS'ing SCO.
DOS attacks are the internet equivalent of standing outside someones home playing heavy metal at 140 dB.
I'm puzzled as to what the guys making the attack hoped to accomplish.
To punish them for lying about linux? Their reputations are already in the toilet. Only ignorant fools are buying into their claims anyway.
To protect Linux? If one thinks about it, SCO has not harmed Linux in any meaningful way! The free distro's are there, and will be there for a long time. All they've done is slowed down adoption by the more clueless managers, which is really no big deal. Their legal claims about the GPL being invalid are such arrant nonsense: they won't stand in court. No matter what happens there will always be a GPLed kernel we can use.
To let them know we think they suck? Well, considering the increasingly defensive and irrational stances that they are taking, I think they already know that. The rest of the world is not buying into their claims. Even if their claims of hundreds of "licenses" sold are not wildly exagerated, that would mean 1% adoption rate.
To prevent people from doing business with SCO? I think that's pretty unethical. If people want to do business with SCO, let them. It's their choice if they want to throw good money away on vapor-ware of bad product. Would you prevent a stranger from buying cigarettes with his own money?
I know alot of people think using force to shut people up who say things you don't like is OK. But those people should take a look at the impression this gives to the non-geek world. They just reinforced the impression that OSS proponents are whiny immature people.
I think the guys behind the attacks scored an own goal.
It doesn't appear to me that centershift has been down at all, based on the netcraft pages...
Do I smell a rat?
thad
I love Mondays. On a Monday, anything is possible.
The SCO's hosting facility (formerly known as Center7, later spun off as via west) is owned and operated by the Canopy Group. So if the attack is effecting the hosting company, then it is causing harm to SCO indirectly. CenterShift should choose a hosting company that isn't owned by SCO's parent company. If you click on the canopy group link you will see a few other choice companies you might want to choose NOT to do business with: Linux Networx, shame on you - But TrollTech, on the same page as SCO??? All you KDE guys out there might want to think about switching to Gnome, otherwise you are giving a SCO your support.
Are people really naive enough to think that DOS attacks don't almost always harm innocent bystanders?
http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=www.sco. com
Sco hosts their site on linux, and not OpenServer.
Our corporate e-mail was out for a couple of days earlier this week.
I'm blaming SCO for it.
"Sir, looks like a friendly fire incident"
http://jesus.everdense.com/
This site seems to be working fine as well.
The same way the customers in Israeli cafes are a legit target of suicide attacks?
If they don't want to be blown up, they should just stop supporting Israeli occupation of Palestine! It doesn't matter what their personal opinions are, they are guilty by association!
Don't be a psychopath. It is not okay to blackmail or extort or terrorize people in order to force them to see things your way. Damaging innocent third parties in an effort to get those parties to put pressure on your enemy, is basically what terrorism is all about.
It true, the DOS (denial-of-service) attacks against SCO may adversly affect companies on the same infastructure, but this may also be a desireable (from an anti-SCO perspective) circumstance. The companies that provide SCO with valuble services will soon find that the heat SCO is attracting is not worth the trouble. I wouldn't be surprised if their service is terminated simply because whoever is hosting them does not want to lose its other customers. If the quality of service delivered to other clients is significantly affect by the SCO debacle, those clients may abandon their (and SCO's) service provider. In this way, the DOS attacks further the anti-SCO cause.
//radiotakeover.
Sounds a lot like what Arafat did with Hamas... hmm... has anybody ever seen Eric Raymond & Yasser Arafat in the same place at the same time?
"I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey
Come on. With all the expossure SCO has had, its probably all those linux clients trying to buy their licence....
DDOS attack...pfhe!
NO SIG
Well, sort of anyway. Center 7 is actually their hosting company, but Center 7 is one of Canopy's main companies, in fact it may be one of the only ones that really makes money which Canopy then uses to fund all the other ones.
So while Centershift may want to change ISPs, Canopy will probably sue them if they do. Hell, they may even sue them if they don't. That's what seems to happen to anyone that has a contract with a Canopy company.
infested with jello like fishes no melotron wishes
We all heard the story here before fo a certain talk/chat servie cut off from ISP service becuase they were DDoS attacked repeatedly..
..SCO Group woudl have been kicked off their network already for the maount of DDoS attacks..they will probably have given back the amount paid but voided the contract..most ISP contracts have an out for this set of circumstances..
Given that this is a startup iSP
So where is the real truth here?
Don't Tread on OpenSource
lameness filter encountered: don't use so many bolds, it is like bullshitting.
and all I got was this lousy T-Shirt.
Slashdot.. Land of nerds, trolls, and FlameBait..
Does Slashdot count as DoS?
Meet new people, and kill them.
Huh? ... wha?
My company hosts at the same Data Center. That center is a professional setup. They have good redundant internet pipes from multiple providers. A DoS attack based on flooding would be quite difficult. Some other big players are there as well. No one has recieved this collateral damage. I believe CenterShift is having trouble with poor server administration, maybe even some problems with Sobig or variants and are trying to blame someone else for their down time. We keep a close eye on things and if something is happening to SCO it is not hitting other customers.
On another note, the center is also owned by the Canopy Group and is very Linux friendly. Many of thier comercial offerings involve Linux and their monitoring is based on Cricket. I wonder how they (and other Canopy Group companies) are feeling about this whole mess.
(Larry, Moe, and Curly appear from behind a group of doctors.)
All Three: We will!
Larry: Hello Doc, how are ya? Glad to see ya again.
(Moe pulls Larry's hair.)
Moe: Spread out.
Dr.Graves: Do you hereby solemnly swear to devote the rest of your life to the cause of duty and humanity?
All Three: For duty and humanity!! (Moe, Larry, and Curly gather in a huddle.)
Dr.Graves: And remember. When you hear your call over the Loud Speaker, rush immediately to answer, as seconds mean life!
All Three: Yes sir.
L.Speaker: Calling Dr. Howard, Dr. Fine, Dr. Howard. Calling Dr. Howard, Dr. Fine, Dr. Howard.
Curly: Woo-woo-woo-woo-woo-woo-woo!
(Moe, Larry, and Curly rush out of the office, slamming the door behind them breaking the glass.)
"LSD more often sparks insight or provides a novel point of view rather than causing outright delusions. Cocaine and amphetamines on the other hand can cause outright schizophreniform psychosis if taken for too long. This and the correlation between D2 receptor antagonism and antipsychotic potency is why schizophrenia is thought to be a largely dopaminergic disorder. Though it's becoming clear that glutaminergic and cholinergic systems play a significant role."
Could you please translate this for those of us that smoke crack?
Unless of course you are claiming that SCO taking down their website of their own accord would magically make other peoples websites at the same location disappear.....
Boffoonery - downloadable Comedy Benefit for Bletchley Park
That's exactly what I was telling Timothy Leary when I spoke to him the other day, and he agreed completely.
It would seem that you haven't done too much of either.
i'll admit that you lost me after the second sentance - but i assume what follows them is supporting bable in erudite form.
truth of the matter is that your first sentance (and thus the second) are difficult to prove, they can only be generalized,.. approximated (because of the difficulty of assembling an uncontaminated set of test "subjects").
the first sentance is a real hoot tho - i gotta give you that.
" LSD more often sparks insight or provides a novel point of view rather than causing outright delusions."
problem (humor) with it being that ones "novel insight" would often be based on delusional concepts.(and thats not including the hallucinations)
furthermore, the second sentance adds another "variable" - time.. ever pyramid window panes for 4 days?
-v
(p.s. im not *really* attacking your tongue-in-cheek responce to the other post - i just couldnt help saying somthing! =)
I knew we could do it if we put http://www.sco.com/ as start page!
If DoS attacking Center7 is blowing up a cafe, then SCO has been carpet bombing us for months. So yes, it would be a fitting response.
But wait, nobody's getting blown up. SCO is trying to destroy the future of software development, and the network is responding unfavorably. Boohoo for SCO.
Wouldn`t removing or blocking the SCO pages from cache servers result in a slightly bigger load on the original servers ?
IANAL, and this is slightly off topic, (mod me down if you must, but it is interesting SCO related material I haven't seen here) but I found this little gem, which could could spike SCO's guns even if they won:
>>For instance, did you know that, because SCO filed its initial Complaint before it registered its copyright, it's therefore limited by statute to recovering merely $150,000 for any infringements? There are several such Aha! moments awaiting an assiduous reader of this analysis.
Anybody know if this is true?
My rights don't need management.
How much you want to bet it's niether SCO nor Script kiddies attacking, but a good ol' slashdotting?!?
/.)
I mean, if they are hiring "pattern recognition" experts to determine if code has been copied or changed, a good and proper slashdotting sure has a lot of similarity to a DDoS attack.
I figure, just by reading what those SCO people release to the press, they not only have trouble distinguishing truth from bull shit, but couldn't tell a slashdotting from a real DDoS attack. Soon, we'll get a press release that there must be IBM spies inside SCO, because everytime they have a press release, their website starts being "attacked" within hours of the release (about the time the story hits
For those who describe their systems as 'boxen', do you order multiple 'boxen' of corn flakes also?
uh, SCO is probably their biggest client
Nah - just made me paranoid.
oh brave new world, that has such people in it!
Caldera actually owned DR-DOS for awhile, after buying it from Novell, before they merged with SCO. They all lost their way a while ago.
BTW, Taco got it "wrong" first in the title... which is wierd, because 2 articles down it says DoS.
Translation:
Encountering Police while zooted on cocaine is: Scary
Obvious responce: run like hell
Encountering Police while looped on stamps is: Scary
Obvious responce: wet pants laughing
If I shoot my neighbor because he sues me claiming my garage crosses the property line on my property, that doesn't make me a vigilante. It's not illegal to sue someone, and responding with an illegal act is therefore stupid, not vigilantism. Let the courts sort it out. If you think the case has no merit, let them waste their capital on lawyers until they bankrupt themselves.
DEAR SIR/MADAM:
I AM MR DARL MCBRIDE CURRENTLY SERVING AS THE PRESIDENT AND CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER OF THE SCO GROUP, FORMERLY KNOWN AS CALDERA SYSTEMS INTERNATIONAL, IN LINDON, UTAH, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. I KNOW THIS LETTER MIGHT SURPRISE YOU BECAUSE WE HAVE HAD NO PREVIOUS COMMUNICATIONS OR BUSINESS DEALINGS BEFORE NOW.
MY ASSOCIATES HAVE RECENTLY MADE CLAIM TO COMPUTER SOFTWARES WORTH AN ESTIMATED $1 BILLION U.S. DOLLARS. I AM WRITING TO YOU IN CONFIDENCE BECAUSE WE URGENTLY REQUIRE YOUR ASSISTANCE TO OBTAIN THESE FUNDS.
IN THE EARLY 1970S THE AMERICAN TELEPHONE AND TELEGRAPH CORPORATION DEVELOPED AT GREAT EXPENSE THE COMPUTER OPERATING SYSTEM SOFTWARE KNOWN AS UNIX. UNFORTUNATELY THE LAWS OF MY COUNTRY PROHIBITED THEM FROM SELLING THESE SOFTWARES AND SO THEIR VALUABLE SOURCE CODES REMAINED PRIVATELY HELD. UNDER A SPECIAL ARRANGEMENT SOME PROGRAMMERS FROM THE CALIFORNIA UNIVERSITY OF BERKELEY DID ADD MORE CODES TO THIS OPERATING SYSTEM, INCREASING ITS VALUE, BUT NOT IN ANY WAY TO DILUTE OR DISPARAGE OUR FULL AND RIGHTFUL OWNERSHIP OF THESE CODES, DESPITE ANY AGREEMENT BETWEEN AMERICAN TELEPHONE AND TELEGRAPH AND THE CALIFORNIA UNIVERSITY OF BERKELEY, WHICH AGREEMENT WE DENY AND DISAVOW.
IN THE YEAR 1984 A CHANGE OF REGIME IN MY COUNTRY ALLOWED THE AMERICAN TELEPHONE AND TELEGRAPH CORPORATION TO MAKE PROFITS FROM THESE SOFTWARES. IN THE YEAR 1990 OWNERSHIP OF THESE SOFTWARES WAS TRANSFERRED TO THE CORPORATION UNIX SYSTEM LABORATORIES. IN THE YEAR 1993 THIS CORPORATION WAS SOLD TO THE CORPORATION NOVELL. IN THE YEAR 1994 SOME EMPLOYEES OF NOVELL FORMED THE CORPORATION CALDERA SYSTEMS INTERNATIONAL, WHICH BEGAN TO DISTRIBUTE AN UPSTART OPERATING SYSTEM KNOWN AS LINUX. IN THE YEAR 1995 NOVELL SOLD THE UNIX SOFTWARE CODES TO SCO. IN THE YEAR 2001 OCCURRED A SEPARATION OF SCO, AND THE SCO BRAND NAME AND UNIX CODES WERE ACQUIRED BY THE CALDERA SYSTEMS INTERNATIONAL, AND IN THE FOLLOWING YEAR THE CALDERA SYSTEMS INTERNATIONAL WAS RENAMED SCO GROUP, OF WHICH I CURRENTLY SERVE AS CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER.
MY ASSOCIATES AND I OF THE SCO GROUP ARE THEREFORE THE FULL AND RIGHTFUL OWNERS OF THE OPERATING SYSTEM SOFTWARES KNOWN AS UNIX. OUR ENGINEERS HAVE DISCOVERED THAT NO FEWER THAN SEVENTY (70) LINES OF OUR VALUABLE AND PROPRIETARY SOURCE CODES HAVE APPEARED IN THE UPSTART OPERATING SYSTEM LINUX. AS YOU CAN PLAINLY SEE, THIS GIVES US A CLAIM ON THE MILLIONS OF LINES OF VALUABLE SOFTWARE CODES WHICH COMPRISE THIS LINUX AND WHICH HAS BEEN SOLD AT GREAT PROFIT TO VERY MANY BUSINESS ENTERPRISES. OUR LEGAL EXPERTS HAVE ADVISED US THAT OUR CONTRIBUTION TO THESE CODES IS WORTH AN ESTIMATED ONE (1) BILLION U.S. DOLLARS.
UNFORTUNATELY WE ARE HAVING DIFFICULTY EXTRACTING OUR FUNDS FROM THESE COMPUTER SOFTWARES. TO THIS EFFECT I HAVE BEEN GIVEN THE MANDATE BY MY COLLEAGUES TO CONTACT YOU AND ASK FOR YOUR ASSISTANCE. WE ARE PREPARED TO SELL YOU A SHARE IN THIS ENTERPRISE, WHICH WILL SOON BE VERY PROFITABLE, THAT WILL GRANT YOU THE RIGHTS TO USE THESE VALUABLE SOFTWARES IN YOUR BUSINESS ENTERPRIS
E. UNFORTUNATELY WE ARE NOT ABLE AT THIS TIME TO SET A PRICE ON THESE RIGHTS. THEREFORE IT IS OUR RESPECTFUL SUGGESTION, THATYOU MAY BE IMMEDIATELY A PARTY TO THIS ENTERPRISE,BEFORE OTHERS ACCEPT THESE LUCRATIVE TERMS, THAT YOU SEND US THE NUMBER OF A BANKING ACCOUNT WHERE WE CAN WITHDRAW FUNDS OF A SUITABLE AMOUNT TO GUARANTEE YOUR PARTICIPATION IN THIS ENTERPRISE. AS AN ALTERNATIVE YOU MAY SEND US THE NUMBER AND EXPIRATION DATE OF YOUR MAJOR CREDIT CARD, OR YOU MAY SEND TO US A SIGNED CHECK FROM YOUR BANKING ACCOUNT PAYABLE TO "SCO GROUP" AND WITH THE AMOUNT LEFT BLANK FOR US TO CONVENIENTLY SUPPLY.
KINDLY TREAT THIS REQUEST AS VERY IMPORTANT AND STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL. I HONESTLY ASSURE YOU THAT THIS TRANSACTION IS 100% LEGAL AND RISK-FREE.
Could you please translate this for those of us that smoke crack?
Crack translation: May I mambo dog-face to the banana patch?
Have you seen Goodman's paper from last year?
"The serotonergic system and mysticism: could LSD and the nondrug-induced mystical experience share common neural mechanisms?" J Psychoactive Drugs. 2002 Jul-Sep;34(3):263-72.
A bit wacky, but a good read if you're into behavioral neurobiology...
1984 was supposed to be a warning, not an instruction manual.
This is not the way to fight back. If this is a set of GNU/Linux users, then please understand that they do not represent the majority of us.
GJC
Gregory Casamento
## Chief Maintainer for GNUstep
SCO's attempts to destroy software development are pretty pathetic. I mean, would you give your wallet a palsied 100lb mugger wielding a ripe banana?
I think any DoS attack launched against them would be extreemly counterproductive and unethical.
Let them live or die according to the merits of their actions. The DoS attacks accomplish nothing good or useful, and are absolutely unjustified.
Assuming, of course, that they are happening at all.
DOS attacks are the internet equivalent of standing outside someones home playing heavy metal at 140 dB.
Obviously you missed the whole heavy metal thing. Standing outside of someones home playing heavy metal would be about picking up chicks (most likely the daughter of the family who's house your serenading). The SCO/DDOS equivalent would be something like driving around in a drunken stupor taking mailboxes off their posts with a baseball bat (or something equally annoying).
Quack, quack.
After all the crap that has come out of the mouth's of SCO execs, I am willing to bet that Darl McBride tells the ladies that he has a 12 inch schlong but then never shows it to the ladies.
No trees were harmed in the composition of this; however, numerous electrons were inconvenienced.
We'd all be throwing our money away if we did this. Remember, SCOX has no real value behind it. There are no assets to justify the market cap.
SCO does not own any relevant intellectual property, and their hard assets are probably all quickly-depreciating computer equipment. People who are buying their stock now are completely ignorant of the fact that there's nothing tangible holding that price up. It's all wild speculation about whether they'll either win a judgement against or be bought out by IBM.
At this point, it would be cool to know if IBM people were buying SCO stock. That would probably be illegal insider trading, though, so chances are it isn't happening.
Buying SCOX for any reason is a bad idea. We'd spend all of our money, raising the price of the stock dramatically, and all end up holding a worthless company with mountains of debt and no tangible assets. Sure, the SCO/Linux war would be over, but the only winners would be whoever owns SCO stock now, and those people are the people we want to punish.
Babelfish translated this to... LSD = +5, Insightful Amphetamins = -1, Troll
I would not put it past the SCO folks, morally, to attack their own site to cause FUD... BUT...
We ARE talking about a company who actually thought that changing a font to symbol was enough to keep the rest of the world from seeing what a portion of code said... I honestly do not believe that taken as a whole they are intelligent enough to actually manage a sucessful DOS attack even on their own boxes!
Just one man's opinion.
The Matrix is real... but I'm only visiting!
... and just when I was saying to myself, "Gosh, finally a day without another SCO story."
I don't wether or not the damages they can claim are capped if they haven't formally filed for a copyright. I do know that damages are trebled if they have formally filed. However, it is a moot point. They haven't actually made any charges about copyright violation yet.
They have made many allegations in the media, but the only lawsuit they have filed alleges theft of trade secrets. In fact, they seem supiciously adverse to actually litigating the alleged copyright violations in GNU/Linux.
They had a great chance in Germany when SUSE sued them, and they chose not to fight.
They don't seem exactly eager to rumble with Red Hat either.
Obvioulsy the guys doing the attack weren't privy to the new low badnwidth DoS attack described on SCO. ;)
The tactic of associating peaceful populations with the antisocial or criminal acts of a few militant people is standard behavior in international politics. Politically, it plays really well to one's own crowd to say "the others are evil terrorists, therefore we are justified in 'protecting' ourselves by any means possible".
We don't assume that Microsoft endorses or orchestrates DOS attacks against Linux sites when attacks occur against Linux sites. Similarly, we shouldn't tie DOS attacks against SCO to the Linux community. People who are launching DOS attacks against anybody are just uncivilized script kiddies. If they happen to be Linux users as well, that's incidental.
DOS attacks on SCO have nothing to do with Linux or the Linux community. SCO's legal attacks on Linux are outrageous and unfounded, but the Linux community is responding to them with facts and will, if ever presented with a real legal challenge, respond in court.
I hope you were trying to be funny or sarcastic with that comment.
SCO may have made some wild claims in the lawsuit, but I do not seriously think they are dumb enough to perpetrate an attack on themselves in this manner. There is simply no evidence to support this, and to entertain conspiracy theories like this only clouds the issue.
And as for "IBM is behind all the backlash to SCO", this is not correct either. I and other members of the open source community can backlash all we want without IBM's help, thank-you-very-much. You sound like you've fallen for SCO's way of thinking, which is that if you're not part of a corporation, you can't organize, so there must be a major corporation behind every move.
Karma: Frotzed (mostly due to the Frobozz Magic Karma Company)
Sorry, it was just getting too silly on this thread.
Now, for something compleately different...
Never answer an anonymous letter. - Yogi Berra
If you were the target of a denial of service attack, I'm sure it would make your day to find that your service provider closed your account to "maintain the quality of service to their other customers".
Double standards are bad, mm-kay?
...SCO can't be seen as an IT company* without a functioning web site. ;)
Discalimer: yes, I know they're in the lawsuit business now. By reading this post, you acknoqledge that all joke replies are to at least be original.
-Looking for a job as a materials chemist or multivariat
ever pyramid window panes for 4 days?
Even if you have a bible, that is such a waste. It's much better to just wait a day (I used to wait two) and visit reality. The contrast can be startling. If you positively can not and will not wait a day, shrooms or great hydro can fill the gap nicely. It's not like it's a living hell.
For every annoying gentoo user, are three even more annoying anti-gentoo crybabies. Take Yosh from #Gimp for example.
I work for a small logo design and creative services shop in a Canopy Group office building (emphasis: we're not a Canopy company, we just rent office space here, because the combination of connectivity and nice space makes sense). A call to our ISP verified last Friday's attack was real; the effects were undeniable. We lost the ability to get in or out of the network for much of the day.
That might not seem too significant, until I mention the fact that all our sales happen through the web -- not to mention most of our project management interaction with our customers. Hence, we were paralyzed pretty well by the attack. If Friday was going to be a typical day, we lost $4000-$5000 is sales. Not to mention lost money due to lost productive time on projects.
I don't know how SCO's bottom line was hit, but that was ours, and because we don't have huge padded bank accounts or support of shell-game investors, we really can't afford that.
Not to mention that the bad publicity is real. Sure, some of us here understand the situation and understand the childish folks who undertook the attack only represent a small portion of open source contributors, users, and supporters. But our VP of tech had some negative things to say about them.
Moral of the story: yep, DoS attacks hurt innocent bystanders, even some slashdot fanboys who dislike SCO's tactics as much as the next guy but spent too much time unemployed last year and really don't want their current employer hurt. And transitively, DoS attacks hurt the rep of the Open Source community. Really. If you're one of the people inclined to do something like that, think twice.
Tweet, tweet.
But this begs the question: Uh... what have they been doing lately to prevent it? It seems every day that we keep hearing about DOS attacks on them... For crying out loud... If it's broken, FIX IT!
No wonder they weren't making any money on their UNIX sales.
Karma: Non-Heinous
yea, it is (was? hehe) a waste - that wasnt my point.
i was adding a time variable.. read it again.
- The hosting facility competently handles DDoS attacks, preventing them from affecting other customers.
- Or, the hosting facility recognizes that the community-at-large will not tolerate SCO or those who provide its infrastructure, and cancels its contract with SCO.
- Or, the hosting facility customers (Centershift) stop putting up with the hosting facility's constant service interruptions and go elsewhere.
In any case, the end result is that SCO suffers, and those providing its infrastructure suffer. What was the problem again?Sorry, I'll stop downloading P0rn, the net should speed back up in a minute.
You're right! Why a DDOS? Come on, if you shut them up, we won't be able to read their "oh so bright" allegations. They won't give us their information that help us to discover that they don't have a case...
My favorite ( from newsforge) is: What people don't understand, McBride insists, is that SCO's legal actions aren't just about SCO's IP, Unix, and the GPL anymore, it's a broader issue that includes music, video, and anything that can be digitized and distributed on the Net. To McBride, the real issue is "the future of IP rights in the 21st century."
Is that what we call an Ego-Trip?
Montreal - Best city to live in!
SCO's website appears to be working fine... in fact, there appears to be many sponsorship opportunities still available for SCO Forum 2003! Hmm... I wonder why the didn't sell them all?
"Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney
Yes, MS-DOS was created in Redmond.
This is way off-topic, but I'm fairly sure that DOS was created in a hotel room on Central Avenue in Albuquerque. I doubt the DoS is coming from Central Avenue, though. The only thing you'll find there is a bunch of wine-os.
SCO is the owner of the UNIX Operating System Intellectual Property that dates all the way back 1969, when the UNIX System was created at Bell Laboratories. Through a series of mergers and acquisitions, SCO has acquired ownership of the patents, copyrights and core technology associated with the UNIX System. The SCO source division will continue to offer traditional UNIX System licenses to preserve, protect and enhance shareholder value.
Darl, I can tell you're lying... your lips are moving! Care to list exactly which patents SCO owns?
"Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney
Go to sco.com and take a look at the employment section. It says "There are currently no job openings at SCO." I wonder why. Aren't they going to be focusing on updating their products soon? Shouldn't they at least be hiring some movers to help clean out their stuff after the big fire sale once they are crushed?
No trees were harmed in the composition of this; however, numerous electrons were inconvenienced.
See original BSD code.
Like there were people in Berkley in the 60's - 70's and not doing LSD?
Check out my life
Clear Window Panes, Jesus Chris man, you're taking me back some there (about 15 years actually).
:-)
Thanks for the memories
For a moment when I read the title of the story I thought SCO was claiming rights to good ol DOS :)
IOException - Can't Speak
The US was carpet bombing Iraq, I suppose that means you think a few terrorist attacks on a few American cafes would be a fitting response? The only difference between a politically motivated DoS, and terrorism, is a matter of degree. Both are unethical.
I hope you were trying to be funny or sarcastic with that comment.
Right on both counts.
Who would be stupid enough to try to pull off that stunt?
What IBM should do here is be absolutely ruthless.
Don't just go after The SCO Group, go after
Canopy. IBM has more patents than God has
shoestrings. They dug up four in short order that
were being violated by SCO. Don't stop there.
Find a patent for every product or service that
every Canopy backed company sells. Start filing
injunctions to stop them from selling all
products and services that they produce.
So come on, IBM:
Show them what you can do to threatening little
companies when you *really* get angry! I'll buy
a new Thinkpad if you do!
Can you say "non-sequitir"? I knew you could!
"Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney
In a very loose language, the substance reaches your brain and pushes the right buttons in order to make you lose touch with the reality if that substance is used on regular basis. Conclusion: take 7 different drugs on seven different days, then start again. The problem with SCO that they should take more breaks from smoking that stuff or the lawsuits will look even more ridiculous for those with normal* view of the reality.
** - Whatever your definition of "normal" is..
...proper business proceedures isn't so simple. Some OpenSource people need to pay attention to "proceedure," but some some FreeSoftware people would probably be better off giving that notion the shaft.
Climbing a little bit into bed with business is probably good for Linux, but I think one foot should stay firmly on the ground.
Big Brother Bush is doubleplus ungood.
That probably confused you just as much, but I hope that makes the gibberish make sense.
Info is from the Halloween 9, It Ain't Necessarily SCOdocument. Excellent read
Help fight continental drift.
Hey, that'd solve the "problem" of whether to use GNOME or KDE... ;-)
Actually, Microsoft, Gates Allen and a couple of students wrote a port of basic for the Altair 8800 in the hotel room in Albuquerque. They bought what became Dos from the Seattle computer company for $75,000 in 1980 I believe...
Could Jesus microwave a burrito so hot that he himself could not eat it?
+1, Interesting
:)
Thank you for that. Now that I understand dopamine a little better, perhaps you can explain the purpose of L Dopa? Its only taken me 16 years to understand this song from Big Black.
Intelligent Life on Earth
would be better.
Can't wait for Boise to wear one.
Help fight continental drift.
I know that a lot of people are pissed off at SCO for all of their rampant BS, but DOS attacks do not do jack squat to "help" Linux, Open Source, or otherwise because it makes Linux users look like a bunch of criminals, which is exactly what SCO wants people to think.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
Your point is unclear as it relates to the critical questions here. Are you saying that SCO's behavior is more consistent with using LSD? I really don't see much creativity in their rantings. However, neither to I detect see much of mental energy one is supposed to associate with coke or speed.
I think SCO's delusions seem to be more of the pink elephant variety. Is McBride an old alky? Certainly would explain a lot.
Freedom = (Meaningful - Coerced) Choice != (Speech | Beer^2), and sad sock puppets' bad mods avail them naught.
i didn't do this mod, but just for your information, someone who does a mod in a story cannot post in the same story.
mi save tingting long peles bilong mi long Niu Ailan.
L-Dopa is not dopamine, but a close relative, which gets turned into Dopamine by a couple of enzymes, one of which is in the brain. The reason that you give L-Dopa instead of dopamine is that you have to give high doses to get across what is known as the blood-brain barrier, so it can get into the brain tissue. Dopmaine in the doses you'd need to give, will make you incredibly sick, L-dopa doesn't do this to the same extent.
Therefore by giving L-Dopa to parkinson's patients, you can get the L-Dopa into the brain, get it converted to Dopamine, and let it work it's magic.
I guess we all know who the next variant of the Blaster virus will be targeting.... Wouldn't that be ironic, millions of infected Windows machines giving them the Mother of all Slashdot Effects.
This hot off the press today, from SCO in Australia. I think these guys have split personalities or something. I just submitted it as a separate story item, and I will be stunned if it is rejected, since this just now hit the presses. Was it all a protracted April Fools joke, or did it just get to hot for them to handle alongside the IBM lawsuit?
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/08/29/10620
Contents:
The SCO Group said today it had never planned to sue any Linux companies, had no concrete plans to sue anyone and also no current plans to take a commercial Linux customer to court.
The company was responding to questions routed through its PR people in Sydney.
As the Canopy Group, which has a stake in SCO, also has interests in several other Linux companies, SCO was asked whether it planned to sue all these companies. The answer was "No. SCO has never planned to sue Linux companies."
In June, SCO senior vice-president Chris Sontag was quoted as saying the company would either will file a new suit or amend its lawsuit against IBM to target other companies which SCO alleges are illegally appropriating its Unix source code.
Today SCO also said it had no current plans to take a commercial Linux customer to court.
Earlier this year the company issued a letter to commercial Linux users threatening them with legal action.
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Among the companies in which Canopy is involved is Linux Networx, which has supplied a supercomputer to the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory; asked whether SCO would sue the laboratory, the company spokesperson said: "No. SCO has never made concrete plans to sue anyone."
In a statement made on August 20, SCO chief executive officer Darl McBride said the company was identifying Linux users for possible litigation.
In March, SCO filed a billion-dollar lawsuit against IBM, for "misappropriation of trade secrets, tortious interference, unfair competition and breach of contract."
SCO also claimed that Linux was an unauthorised derivative of Unix and warned commercial Linux users that they could be legally liable for violation of intellectual copyright. SCO later expanded its claims against IBM to US$3 billion in June when it said it was withdrawing IBM's licence for its own Unix, AIX.
My rights don't need management.
They have their own domain name, so what's he problem?
Stock Cash Out ;-)
not flaming here, just telling it like it is...
if my company were suffering because another company in the same datacenter provider was getting DoS'd, that's when it's time to sue the datacenter provider.
this is why there is such a huge chasm between amateur cohosting facilities and the pros: the pros dont fuck around, they know how to stop a DoS either with their equipment or at the upstream provider.
if this innocent bystander company doesnt have an SLA with consequences for serious downtime like this, then said company is run by morons and doesnt deserve to be taken seriously anyways.
A year spent in artificial intelligence is enough to make one believe in God.
You've obviously been watching too much television. Back in the early 80's things were different. Bad boys got in fist fights and had liquor. We did things bad girls liked. Mostly it was about how incredibly horny we were and what kinds of lengths we'd got to. It still impresses girls if you go out of your way for them, only out of high school that would look more like buying flowers or taking her out to a fancy restaurant.
Maybe your should open up to your slightly more primitive side? Underneath were not nearly so civilized.
Quack, quack.
SCO's DoS attack on potential Linux users.
Given what McBride and company are doing, did they seriously think they wouldn't get attacked by the Black Hat community as well as everyone else? Morons.
OTOH they may have been counting on it.
The Gripping Hand is, if they were, it's not exactly the response they were looking for - came months late. Mayhaps they were figuring they'd get slammed like the RIAA does and could use it as PR FUD then? Whoops, guys, sorry that reality screwed your expectations.
realityshunt
Democracy is susceptible to being led astray by having scapegoats paraded in front of the electorate.
announced "SCO is under DoS attack", then
everyone on the Internet clicked on www.sco.com
to verify -- thus, this time causing a real DoS.
Perhaps McBride should offer proof before
he goes around blaming others. Oh, wait, this
is SCO. No proof is required.
Caldera International bought DR-DOS.
Then Caldera International sued Microsoft for $1.6 billion.
Microsoft settled.
The terms of the settlement for confidential, but estimated at $150 million.
Reference:
Microsoft, Caldera settle long-standing lawsuit
The hosting company is Center 7, which is partially or fully owned by Canopy Group. Canopy Group is the largest shareholder in SCO.
BTW, Center 7 and Canopy sued Computer Associates recently. They settled for $40 million. Those Canopy Group fuckers are sue-happy pricks. "Contracts are what you use against people you do business with", indeed.
CA says settles Canopy Group, Center 7 litigation
A comment in a recent article here pointed out that their upstream ISP seems to be IBM. I wouldn't want to be the IT guy at SCO who has to raise that issue.
"Uh, hi... is this IBM?"
Yes, it is; what can I do for you?"
"Uh, this is, uh, [edited] at SCO. Someone's DOSing us, and..."
[uproarious laughter from IBM rep]
[CLICK]
Using the holy grail of OSes...
1. Why did he proclaim himself a general against
SCO, when Linus and RMS (the Linux and GPL principals)
did not partake in such theatrics.
2. Why did ESR claimed responsibility on behalf
of Linux?
I know why: it is chance to play into the Linux
crowd to earn karma. Well, it is non of his business. The
target of SCO is IBM, Linux, and the GPL.
But ESR is not happy, apparently, he want the
target to be Open Source too, who else can
he gain karma? ESR wich his coup
agains Free Software a few years ago, is very similar to McBride.
--
If RMS is a "nutso prophet," ESR is the televangelist version. :-)
-- Henry Spencer
The old SCO versions used to come with a utility called "floodping" for doing network stress testing. I was always wary of this thing as it sounded kind of dangerous to me.
BTW If this DOS attack is being done by anyone reading this: cut it out. Linux is slowly gaining ground among even conservative IS leadership types. The WORST thing we can do now is let ourselves be perceived as a community of people who have no respect for other people's livelihoods.
Do we really know they're experiencing a DOS attack? Maybe they're using an operating system that cannot handle the amount of traffic they're getting? Maybe they should switch to Linux of FreeBSD?
those who don't know about ESR, did to read
more about the origins of Open Sourse and how
they ripped-off Free Sofware by claiming credit
for everything created by Free Software for the
last decaded. ESR is the linux version of
McBride, except that he has been successfull
with their stealing.
There is no need for a public apology from ESR,
it will mean nothing to me.
Unbelieveable... SCO is now backtracking on the whole Linux user lawsuit thing... SCO's PR people in Australia are now claiming that there was never any serious plans to sue Linux companies or commercial Linux companies! This in spite of Darl's statement quite to the contrary just a week ago!
Are they really so stupid as to think that nobody will remember what they've actually said up to this point?
Wanted: One witty yet thought provoking
They're DoS attacks, not DOS attacks!
Perhaps SCO knows their claims are rubbish, and they are in a sinking ship, and that they are trying to drive their stock high enough as possible so they can get out with a bit of a golden lining in their pockets before the ship goes down?
Just a thought...
Judging from the netcraft uptime stats, SCO are using a solar powered web server.
A remarkable technical achievement but it does mean that nobody outside the US can access the site during working hours...
DDoSing SCO and taking out others not owned by Canopy is bad form. It makes all Linux supporters look bad even if you don't buy into this DDoSing as I am plenty of others do. This is the kind of shit you would expect Darl Mcturd to pull. ESR is right this is bad.
As you can see I don't care about my karma.
No, it must be crack ... 'cause there's nothing that a crack addict won't do for money
siener's youtube channel
Why doesnt the hosting company just drop SCO for bringing all this pain to others being hosted? Problem solved.
I feel certain that M$ is funding this whole thing. It doesn't matter how ridiculous it is, it still comes out as bad press for Linux in the majority of the media coverage, building a level of uncertainty about the use of Linux in a business environment.
This means dollars (perhaps billions) for M$, which started pushing Windows Server 2003 just after "buying" a license from SCO and before SCO launched its assault on IBM and Linux. This is a massive FUD marketing assault by M$. SCO is the Trojan horse.
I know this sounds like conspiracy theory, and it is until the money or e-mail or memo trail is found, but it makes the most sense. M$ has easily gained the most from this. SCO certainly is not any stronger and they were a sinking ship when this started. IBM, as stong as they are, now has the cloud of an invalid AIX license hanging over their heads and a $3 billion lawsuit. HP sounds like they are playing up Unix and starting to downplay Linux (personal opinion based on last report saying HP was safe from lawsuit) and, YES, organizations that were considering Linux have chosen other options, most likely M$.
I sincerely hope someone finds the smoking gun Bill G. is holding on this topic so we can look straight into the face of the real culprit.
-PersonalOpinion
Yeah... like that you can fly. That's turned out to be an insightful, and quite a novel point of view for many of the people it's killed. Case in point - "I'm not a cat, YOUR delusional!" - That's actual quote from a friend of mine as he lept from the 2nd story deck. Not killed, quite funny, but how appropriate for this discussion. Yes, on LSD.
LSD is dangerous because it's unpredictable, even in experienced users. While you've obviously done more than a passing review of the effects, your implication ignors the fact that you're poking your brain with a chemical stick to see what it'll do next... knowing full well that you don't, in fact, know what it'll do next. That's just stupid.
...I'd get my Internet connection from a company that wasn't a SCO/Canopy Group owned ISP.
Just a suggestion.
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
Troll
ESR has never tried to take credit for anything the FSF has done. The OSI is simply a more
moderate version of the FSF (except that it
doesn't produce software).