Slashdot Mirror
Sphere XP Makes GUI 3D
Cypherus writes "I came across a link for a 3d desktop environment. "The SphereXP is a 3D desktop replacement for Microsoft Windows XP. Taking the known concept of three-dimensional desktops to its own level. It offers a new way to organize objects on the desktop such a icons and applications. Check the videos and screenshots to get the idea.""
IMAGES & VIDEOS!!!
Let the melting begin...
Do people actually think these are EASIER to use than the traditional 2D/command line interfaces? Or is it just coolness?
Omnes stulti sunt.
Finally, the technology of the 1995 movie "Hackers" meets the present. ;-)
I am defenseless. Use your button. Mod me down with all of your hatred.
I can imagine using this and always turning my monitor or my head so I can see the ones that aren't exactly lined up straight. Sorta like an older laptop LCD that loses brilliance when the angle's off. Since the desktop's concave, I'd also expect my windows to "slide" around toward the middle.
Of course, it might just be a matter of adjustment.
I really don't think the 3d desktop will be feasable until we have some form of useful, cheap, and easy to use 3D input device. Anyone work with this sort of thing?
..two posts and it's slasdotted. Here is the Google Cache.
What I have yet to see on any sort of 3D gui, is a thought out plan. (If anyone has please link)
I would like to see some thought like a list of limitations that the 2D GUI paradigm currently has and how a 3D GUI could address these issues while not producing a huge long list of its own problems.
Until then, this looks cool, but is in no way a step forward, back, up or down. It's just kinda there.
-- taking over the world, we are.
3 Dimensional interfaces like these (especially Suns new project) are just annoying. They don't represent any signficant increase in productivity, they aren't going to make your system easier to use - they just look cool, and that's enough to grab attention.
The downside of these interfaces is the ridiculously high processor and memory requirements. All that extra graphic manipulation comes at a price, and I for one don't see any reason to waste processor cycles. What I'd much rather see is somebody developing a faster, more lightweight UI that is a nice combination of OSX and Windows XP. One that chews up LESS memory (instead of more, like this), one that speeds things up.
Then I'll be impressed.
I used it last week for a day and was quite impressed. It isn't perfect, some major bugs, some missing features and a slow memory leak that requires you to stop and start it every hour or so. But very usable.
What I thought was most cool about it was that it is very close to something I have been saying I wanted for a long time, except that I want to rotate the 'world' around me using a foot controller. In any case Sphere might just be pointing the way to a new GUI paradigm we can use for real work, something other than the 'desktop'.
- -
Are you an SF Fan? Are you a Tru-Fan?
Imagine if someone came up with a VR desktop for linux that would work with those 3d goggles...you would finally have something jaw dropping to talk about that would be really cool. Instead of a clunky mouse, use a goggle to grab your windows with get this ...handles...not some silly virtual hand like in the olden crappy vr days...combine that with a virtual keyboard and youve really got something.
Next comes Superstring XP, which works in 26 dimensions.
What about Sun's Project Looking Glass that's on their Java Desktop System?
Here's a link
This (SphereXP) is almost painful to use. Not that it's a bad design (it's very interesting), but I've seen the videos from a while back (I'm working on something that competes along these lines, have to keep tabs...). Two things I would say to the coder: 1.) CSGL is no longer being developed. Switch to Tao (http://www.randyridge.com). 2.) Try and keep the amount of effort (moving around, switching tasks) to a minimum. Download the videos, you will see what I mean. Lots of bad clicking and scraping while moving around the sphere.
The biggest problem I've run into (again, I'm working on something in the 3D Desktop arena), is that in windows, you cannot jack the Paint APIs (easily). So you can't just grab a window and throw it into OpenGL. Additionally, you can't modify the source (closed-source) to grab the windows...Which I am attempting to rectify with some assembly code, but it's still a pain.
The nice thing about Tao? Cross-platform (somewhat). As for my program? It will be released after I finish the assembly.
I am John Hurt.
You can use the mouse wheel to move windows closer/further, or to move the camera position in and out. It is in fact 3d.
My server
Why not investigate some of the alternatives while the site is ./ed.
http://desk3d.sourceforge.net/
Sun's attempt
http://www.cs.ucl.ac.uk/staff/A.Steed/3ddesktop/
If you're a fan of women, add me to your friends list.
Rooms3d is a very immense desktop environment that views each "room" as a folder, with clickable objects as the items in the folder.
For example, a cool-looking dungeon would be the Control Panel, and wooden crates would be display, hardware configuration, etc. Like I said it's very immense and thourough but extremely cool.
http://www.hamar.sk/sphere/
Overview: The SphereXP is a 3D desktop replacement for Microsoft Windows XP. Taking the known concept of three-dimensional desktops to its own level. It offers a new way to organize objects on the desktop such a icons and applications. Check the videos and screenshots to get the idea.
The project was under "heavy" construction, but now it is open for testing. Everybody is free to try it out. Every response (sphere@hamar.sk) is appreciated.
Please keep in mind that project is more of a vision. Due to the limitations of Windows I'm not able to do everything as I would like to. I know it is still not very usable, but I'll try to make it work as I can. I hope when there's time for it, this theory will have a satisfying implementation.
http://www.hamar.sk/sphere/info.htm
PROJECT INFO
IN THE BEGINNING THERE WAS THE COMMAND LINE....
The interaction human-computer has gone a long way since the invention of personal computers. In the beginning there was only a simple command-line interface (CLI), which was not a very intuitive interface. The only widely used device that you could use to interact with the computer was the keyboard. People needed a lot of skills to operate computers. New ways have been opened with the evolution of hardware and software. Inventions such as mouse or graphical user interface (GUI) changed the way we interact with the computer and allowed massive spread of computers. Working with the computer got easier, faster and more effective. The two-dimensional graphical user system is now established as the preferred interface for most users. It can be found in any of the major operating systems like Microsoft Windows, Mac OS and the X Window System. There has been made only a little progress since its invention. Declining hardware prices and increasing hardware capabilities allow us to make the next step and make interfaces more intuitive and more effective.
A core part in creating any new environment is to provide a metaphor for intergrating visual elements into a recognizable and copmprehensive framework. The name of the application is "The Sphere". This name encapsulates the main idea behind the project. I'm not trying to simulate reality. The main inspiration comes from the way we recognize reality. My design is based on the human perception of the world.
THE CONCEPT
The Sphere is theory of an 3D workspace. The SphereXP is an example of the theory. The environment is user-centered. It is represented by a sphere. The user is exactly in the middle of it. All objects are situated around the user. He can easily turn around and manipulate with the objects. All the objects that users are used to having on their regular desktop are now integrated in a three-dimensional environment. . There are icons and applications. They can be move around according to some rules. You can bring them closer to the view port or send them back.
THE APP
Too much freedom of movement may cause disorientation. Therefore I chose to apply strict rules for moving in the environment. The user cannot go outside the designated area - the sphere. I call this type of navigation spherical. The view port is always facing apart from the sphere center. Once the user sets the distance from the center, the view port can be only rotated around it. This makes the navigation easier and prevents the user to get to an angle where he cannot see anything. A simple tool is used to ensure effective navigation and to prevent the user to get lost. It is a minimized version of the sphere situated in the right bottom corner. It provides an overview of where the view port is pointing and where all the objects are.
Limited control of the layout
The only thing that the user is allowed to change is the background image. This ensures that this environment will have the same functionality and layout on every com
That says it all...
You're old school? I beta tested the motherf***ing abacus!
The site is pretty thoroughly slashdotted. I grabbed it a few days ago, so... mirror. You'll want one of the sphere zips and the cgsl library.
My server
In 3d rendering enviroments and cad programs, a sharp and tough learning curve is anticipated and acceptable. But in web and file browsers it is not. File and web browsers must be intuitive. Ittuitiveness is a myth however, there is no human instinct that associates double-clicking with running a 'program'. It is merely congruent with expected behavior. Same with volume controls where increasing volume is anticlockwise. If I made a volume dial where increasing volume was clockwise, people would be righteously pissed because it clashed with expected behavior.
And that, in a nutshell, is why it will fail.
Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
remember 3dwm anyone? looks like its dead now. 3dwm website
I tried this out last week, it relatively sucked. Framerate was about 0.5 per second, visual defects were everywhere, just seemed like an interesting concept wrapped in bare proof-of-concept code.
Austin is more fun than Dallas.
PC INpact Screenshots
...I wonder if the digital version has the same problem of all the piles of documents spilling to the floor now and again?
"Enjoy what you're doing! If it becomes drudgery, you're doing it wrong!" - Jim Butterfield
they all seem to be pushing the 2D paradigm into 3D. No one is really "using" 3D
i get what you mean and i agree
however:
it seems to me that what you describe probably wont be feasible until we are using something other than a flat screen as our display, donchathink?
(and i realize this is not necessarily the case but it would have to be a dramatically new paradigm and i cant imagine an alternative)
i suspect that the innovation is going to have to come from a hardware / input side of things to get that going. in the mean time though, im glad that theyre pushing things forward and trying it out (i only saw a brief glimpse cause of slashdotting but seems interesting from a research pov at least)
a
Although it's probably not needed anymore, there's a mirror of the software, movies and shots at PlanetMirror. Available via HTTP or FTP. They also have the .NET Framework available.
Not sure if anyone has seen this but... Linux 3d add on [sourceforge.net] This program allows a 3d environment to appear when you want to change between virtual desktops... Once again looks cool... But useful? Not really...
As soon as I saw this on slashdot, I thought I'd quick take a look at it before it got swamped - I actually got all the images and videos downloaded before the site went down due to /. effect.
.torrent of it up for download, but realized that I didn't have any tracker to post it to if I did make one...
I was thinking I could put a
Perhaps Shalsdot needs to look into providing a public tracker for backups of video/images/etc. from sites they link to.
--The Rizz
"The girl who swears no one has ever made love to her has a right to swear." --Sophia Loren
I don't want new WAYS to use the existing functionality of my computer. I want new TOOLS, new things I can do that I could not do before, or things which were complex now made simple. I want my computer to understand spoken instructions in sentence form. I want to tell my computer " Find all of the image files in the computer where the majority color is orange". I want to tell my computer "Show me a list of all of the files on my computer which have been modified or accessed by a user process in the last 15 minutes." and get no system and log files as a result. I want my computer to actually know the purpose of each file its OS is built from. I want to ask it if anything is different between this bootup and last. WHY is the industry looking to add superfluous eyecandy to the same functionality?
It's like being sold a 1930 Ford with a new, prettier body for 2004 but still having the old rattletrap engine.
Those apps that need 3d will HAVE it (Quake) Find ways I can do things FASTER with less effort!!
Much like anything else I've seen Microsoft make / do, this is NOT their original idea. I saw this feature demoed on a Linux machine at Comdex last winter.
Here's a link to a story about the linux feature.
Ah! Can't post!: "Database maintenance is currently taking place. Some items such as comment posting and moderation are currently unavailable."
Oh well, I'll keep trying.
"And the monkey flips the switch."
The power of Christ compiles you.
A Random Blog
I think research in this area is great. I do not believe that we have currently found the be-all, end-all of user interfaces. I mean the metaphor came about when display technology was far more primitive than today, which imposed limits to what could be done. Most of the enhancements to this metaphor have been making things prettier. We see higher resolution icons, with more colours, drop shadows, animations, etc. No real change to the fundimental way things work.
That's because, so far, we haven't found a better, more intutitve way to do things. That doesn't mean that there isn't a better way we haven't yet discovered. While this probably isn't it, that doesn't mean it isn't useful research along those lines. I really do believe that a better interface is possible by exploiting the 3d capabilities of modern systems. I, of course, don't know what it is or I'd be working to make it a reality, but experimental new interfaces like this is one way to work on finding out. Try it, see what's good, see what bad, try and revise, etc.
Oh, goodie, another "reinterpretation" of the UI involving '3-D'. This has been done before and this doesn't look any better than earlier efforts. Tell me why this is supposed to be revolutionary/fresh/insert meaningless buzzword here?
Of course, we'd have to use it awhile and study it, to make a real comparison. I can't actually see this site, because of the /. effect, so I'll ramble and speculate....
Visualizing this in my puny little brain, I "see" a problem -- 3D clutter. If you think your current 2D desktop is cluttered, because of hidden stuff sitting behind stuff, then wait for the 3D effect.... On the other hand, the holy grail of 3D interfaces -- hologram projection and the like -- might have the problem of seeing through the object....
If you do real/semi-real 3D with actual depth, there could be problems with users having headaches or blurred vision, or flicker, as well, possibly, depending on implementation, yada, yada.
I think alpha-blending, if done properly, is a better way to unhide relavent information. Dual monitors, wide-screens, or really large screens with a lot of resolution are others.
I think 3D would look cool, though.
some major bugs
:D
some missing features
a slow memory leak that requires you to stop and start it every hour or so
But very usable.
BAHAHAHHAHAHAHhahahahhahahahhahahaha
as a visual effects developer, i'd like to point out that there are some very nice (better?) effects that can be achieved with 2d effects. eye candy that would make you drool.
check out my burning dialog box movie.
K.
I got a chance to look at this program about a week ago when a friend installed it on my gaming PC I leave at his house.
To say the least the program has a long way to go before it can become a useful product. I admit that it has potential, but it has some issues.
Firstly, the images it produces are really choppy. It doesn't recreate the graphics of the apps in the background with enough detail. And I am not just talking about legability either. I had calc running in the background and the bottom of the application was cut off.
The next thing was the interaction in switching the applications from being into the foreground to the background. You have to click on the top of the app, just a pixel above the title bar. It, needless to say, took awhile to get the hang of it.
Another problem I had was applications that would disappear within the middle. You can zoom in and out of the 3d space, and its easy to lose an application that is in the middle. I managed to place a program in the middle of the desktop so that when I spun around you still could not find the application. One would assume I would eventually find it 180degrees around, but I didn't until I zoomed all the way out.
The last thing would have to be the fact that its not a true 3d environment. The desktop does not wrap around to the other side. When navigating all the way around, its not possible to come to a full loop.
Don't get me wrong though. I think this is quite an achievement for who designed it. And I think it deserves all the merit it can get.
"Imagination is the only weapon in the war against reality." -Jules de Gautier
This new interface reminds me of Minority Report!
*Starts making quick hand motions in front of screen*
Dammit, it doesn't work...
I do. Actually, it's a 4-D input device. I have two mice.
Sincerely,
Pan Tarhei Hosé, PhD.
"Homo sum et cogito ergo odi profanum vulgus et libido."
I once saw an UK Intel executive showing a video of a proposed OS, which was 3D and based around hexagons. In theory it looked like a nice idea, but five years later and I've heard nothing of it since. Users simply prefer working in 2D.
Of course the PC desktop (2D or 3D) is exactly the same. Hunting in the start menu (or whatever you call it) for the calculater. Hunting in the menu for the option attach image.
Ideally there would be no apps for me to start and stop. Rather the OS would "know" what I am trying to do and do it for me. Kinda like a real secretary does (a really good one). Real spellchecking, real document formatting, real dictation, real file retrieval, real fact finding.
Currently that seems impossible. Even a simple thing as spell checking is so complex most people don't even bother with it. Computers are not just dumb they are moronic.
The entire 2D desktop interface is just gludges to get around the moronicness of the OS. We got a HUGE taskbar taking up valuable space just because the OS has no clue as wich app we want to use and wich we don't, we add shortcuts constantly on screen just because noone has found a way to launch the right app at the right time.
I am not saying I got the answer or even that there is an answer. But just like drawers, putting things behind you, extra large desks, etc are in ways of getting around the limitations of a desk. All current desktop designs are just ways of getting around the limitations of the OS.
Ideally we want a star trek like computer. One wich "magically" can detect what we want to do and do it. Until then all we got is gludges.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
I've got 26 things open right now and between a multi-tabbed browser, taskbars over two monitors and a sidebar I don't have any problem getting to what I want. The Alt-Tab Replacement helps too.
Part of the problem with 3D GUIs is that monitors are 2D devices, not 3D. Give me a workable 3D display device and manipulation tools (hint: I'm thinking of 'give me the real world' here) with my 3D GUI and you might have something. Even in the 'real world' however, 2D is often a most useful abstraction. Jakob Nielsen has an interesting column (with rebuttals) on the problems of 3D interfaces.
The BSOD: Blue Sphere Of Death
because it is really no easier to switch between items in "3D" than with the other types of control features (taskbar, "virtual" desktops, etc.). They all require a physical action by the user to move the focus to the wanted item. Having a 3D desktop is just another take on the "virtual" desktop idea.
It really comes down to the question of how you want to deal with partitioning your work space when you have more items than can be effectively displayed at one time. Your best options are to:
Now a truly useful and cool interface would be to have the large thin panel display from "The Minority Report" with complete and accurate voice and gesture recognition.
--- Void where prohibited. Your mileage may vary. ---
Sun has a simmelar project in the works. Codenamed Project Looking Glass. They have a nifty Vid. Based on their Java Desktop.....
CubicEye is a 3d web browser. It lets you drill through every link from any given page in a tunnel-like structure.
It's a cool project, but the poor guy's server is getting killed. :(
Here is a mirror to the movies & screenshots.