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iTunes Europe Goes Live
Spad writes "The Register is reporting the launch of iTunes in the UK, France and Germany. "iTunes will carry 700,000 songs from the five major record labels and independents, and prices for the download service start at 79 pence or 99 euro cents per song." It's not ideal (99c is about 55p) but it's better pricing than expected. I for one will be signing up to use it."
I know there is a Windows client for I-Tunes, but this article made me wonder.
How many Apple users are there in Europe anyway?
(Not trying to belittle them in any way, I'm just curious)
This is the sig that says NI (again)
What about the rest of us!!!
Must we wallow forever in the sinful pleasures of bearshare and kazaa?
Save us oh Jobby one!
May the Maths Be with you!
What? Only UK, France and Germany?
Why not the whole of Europe? Did Apple also excluded one or more of the States of America?
Grmbl...
Well, kudos to them for not making us Britains pay 99p a track, like I'm sure some other companies would.
We still pay the highest price, but I'm getting used to being shafted out of every penny I own here anyway.
120 characters should be enough for anybody
What I want to know is when iTunes will be released for Windows 98? Something tells me its never going to happen but surely it wouldn't be that difficult for apple to release iTunes for win 98?
So I'm curious as to what sorts of predictions people have for when the market gets completely saturated with music services. Particularly with ones like OD2's which is a generic music store that they sell to lots of people which leads to a lot of the same stuff with different branding.
Will we start seeing buyouts? Which ones do you think will go out of business?
Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
Well it's launched but there's not much on there at the moment and there's an awful lot of "Partial albums" consiting of just one song. Hopefully they'll be adding more tracks over the coming weeks....
Well i think we're getting a shitty deal in the UK when 0.99 euro converts to 65p and UK users have to pay 79p a track!
I can't use it with my Apple operating system, and I'm expected to pay nearly 50% more than Americans?
Seems like a huge own-goal to me, and I'm a Mac fanatic.
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
...still not available for the 53rd state: Canada.
99 eurocents per song might seem expensive. But how many of you haven't bought a cd because you liked some songs, only to find out later you really don't like the rest of them? Then the option of legally owning the few songs you *do* like isn't so bad.
Btw, is it illegal to download the cdcover of the full cd if you bought only a couple of tracks?
Just spend your money on allofmp3.com! You'll get at least 20x the amount of music for your money than on itunes. Also, allofmp3 pays artist, but doesn't pay the RIAA. You can download legally, without worrying that you're paying for legal battles against your fellow music downloaders.
Screw that. Try allofmp3.com. I pay 1 to 2 cents per meg, don't have to deal with annoying DRM, and choose whether I want files in mp3, ogg, wma, aac, whatever, even lossless FLAC, and the bitrate I want. I haven't used filesharing since I found it.
It's not ideal (99c is about 55p) but it's better pricing than expected. I for one will be signing up to use it.
I can't understand why anybody would want to support price gouging. Unless a swift and painful message is delivered to them NOW, the price will not get any cheaper. And in 20 years time we will have another investigation into why our prices are so high compared to other places which will again (like CDs) do nothing about it.
I wonder to what extent Apple's business model anticipates a similar crackdown on this side of the pond?
When I am king, you will be first against the wall.
iTunes Europe might not be as successful as in the US since not all people listen to music in English. Until iTunes finds a way to customize the selection based on geography, I for one would not be willing to navigate through the site searching for my music.
Also, many artists have their recordings in multiple languages (like Eros/Laura in italian/spanish/portugese etc). Would be interesting to see how they unify or resolve the cultural differences
None of the independent labels are signing up for iTunes; and that means the vast bulk of their service will be made up by the commercial schlock the majors are trying to cram down peoples throats. (Unlike the US, non-major labels are a big chunk of the UK CD market).
No Franz Ferdinand? No White Stripes? No Dizzee Rascal?
No thanks, Steve.
Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
If any of you follow financial news, companies are reporting additional gains from exchange rates, and some years report losses...
Prices are set in local markets based upon localized demand and competition (limited monopoly pricing power from brand, even in a relatively competitive market), etc.
Right now, it is cheaper for Germans to buy German cars sold in America and reimport them, because even with the cost of shipping the car from the states, the Euro is so strong on the dollar that it results in the importing the American made German car is cheaper.
Companies set prices (usually with local subsidiaries because of assinine international tax laws) in each country. Many companies will engage in "hedging" with the currency derivative market, because they aren't in the business of currency speculation (although if it should work out in the long run, sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, then paying the commissions on those trades isn't economically intelligent, but it's important for hitting quarterly/annual numbers, joys of public accounting).
However, the price will be set in the European market based upon the prevailing price there. However, that is in part because of Apple's limited "monopoly" pricing power (note, this is NOT monopoly a la anti-trust, it's in a competitive market with highly similiar substitute goods, like CDs, pirated music, etc.), but only Apple sets the price for iTMS downloads.
One of the things that the Internet and digital transfers has the potential to do is destroy regionalized pricing, at least within the English (and then Spanish, etc.) speaking world. In that scenario, Apple could set prices in each store based upon local trends, but consumers could buy from whichever store TODAY's currency price makes most beneficial. That is great for consumers, but lousy for corporate profits (then they ALWAYS lose on the currency fluctuation, because the business goes to whatever is cheapest that day).
However, a Euro price that isn't identical to US pricing with TODAY'S rate of exchange makes sense. The Euro is up something like 30% on the Dollar in the past 12 months. If that trend reverses, and 1 $ = 1 E again, then a Euro price of 55 cents would devastate Apple. The Euro was established at a price level to make the nominal exchange of Euros to Dollars approx. 1:1, which would obviously fluctuate.
Consumers in general are more interested in pricing in their local currency then international pricing. Although the Internet has changed things SLIGHTLY, in general, most consumers don't engage in International trade, but rather buy from an organization that has imported the products for them. Hence Amazon has localized businesses, Apple set up local Apple AND now iTMS to price in the local currency. Cars are priced in each local market.
However, the free flow of information will reduce that ability over time, which is a good thing, but you shouldn't be shocked that it isn't instant.
Alex
Well i think we're getting a shitty deal in the UK when 0.99 euro converts to 65p and UK users have to pay 79p a track!
The pricing strategy is doubtless based on price point psychology rather than exchange rate parity.
Capitalism is like that. The product manager seeks to optimize revenue but his/her choices are constrained by a granularity imposed by price point psychology.
Of course, this phenomenon leads to an obvious argument in favor of common currency in geographically and commercially related regions. That is probably a whole other topic, but one which becomes increasingly relevant when considering sub 100 priced commodities.
Peace
I thought that the EU was dead against people being able to price people differently based on country. In other words, if you go to a site, that site can't give you a different price based on your country of origin. But, that having a UK site and a French site with different prices is OK.
Remember that it has taken time for independent labels in the States to sign up. Just because they haven't done so yet doesn't mean that they won't; You can bet that the indies have a high proportion of iPod-toting staff who'd be keen on iTMS and the bosses won't want to pass up the opportunity to make even more money. Patience!
Now here is a good example of using big words in titles that are not at all covering for the real thing. "iTunes Europe goes Live". I didn't know that Europe was only UK, France and Germany. This is the same thing as to say that USA is California and Florida.
...going to be before Apple becomes a media company who just happens to sell software and computers? Right now, there are definitely a hardware company that sells software. But with the iPod, and whatever next Big Thing that will follow, I have to wonder how much of the bottom line is going to be based on media content?
Don't be a looter...and yes, I know that it's spelled with an "A" instead of an "E".
Check out Magnatune.com - no DRM, just music and 50% goes to the musicians.
amazon can sell music cd's across europe, why can't apple sell music files across europe?
I suspect the difference is that Amazon.com just ships around pre-made physical goods, whereas iTunes Music Store offers digital downloading. It's essentially a completely new form of commerce.
Apple needs to convince the labels that they want to offer their product through iTMS, hence the need to negotiate deals. Apple has also said the labels make the actual music files, not Apple. So again, Apple has to convince the labels to put effort into encoding their products for iTMS.
Oh, the same tired tale. You know, if you want to get the record companies to stop promoting shitty bands, maybe you should first get people to stop buying shitty albums. It is a tragedy that Britney Spears has sold ten times as many records as Tom Waits with a quarter of the talent...but them's the breaks.
I mean, it's not like independent labels don't exist, don't sign bands and don't release albums to the mass market INCLUDING over iTunes. In fact, iTunes has more independent labels than any other online music store. You don't think SONY Connect is gonna court Asian Man Records, do you?
I've actually been quite surprised by the number of GOOD artists who get above-the-fold promotion on iTunes. Even the ones who don't are displayed RIGHT NEXT to their corporate shilling brethern. And the selection beats the crap out of the most ecclectic brick & mortars I've seen. I mean, iTunes has the friggin' Kind Geedorah record. I had to literally threaten violence at my local Newbury Comics to get them to even ORDER that shit, and even then it cost me $20.
Hey freaks: now you're ju
I just bought Franz Ferdinand last night from iTunes and I know they have the White Stripes. I think what you're seeing is the same thing as we saw in the US, it took a few months for the library to grow and become more inclusive.
So, I wouldn't say the independent labels are not signing up, they're there, it's just an issue of providing the same library we get in the US to you guys across the pond.
2a. I buy one or two standard format CDs from the large range on display for a reasonable price that is identical (in my own local currency) no matter what part of the world I am in or
2b. I buy separate tracks in an open format like MP3 or OGG and burn them to a standard CD either in the record store or at home.
3. I play, rip, burn my songs in whatever format I like on whatever application I like on whatever OS I like.
A revolutionary idea, I agree, but I think it might just work...
Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
You for one may decide to use it, but on the other hand, I for one will continue to purchase my CDs for 6.99 for CD-Wow (average of 11 tracks at 6.99 is 64pence a track) with the added bonuses of
a - Better sound quality
b - no restrictions on how many different devices I play it on
c - no restrictions on how many times I can rip it
d - the possibility of ripping it to the (superior) ogg format.
e - the artist getting a bigger cut of my money
f - casing, and cover art
So when you buy a CD, you get more for less. Hmmmmm so tell em again, exactly why is iTunes such a great deal?
Sunday you're Thinking Different, Monday you're a huge tool, paying too much and waiting to think like everyone else.
they also said the talks with the indies had just begun. same thing happened in the USA. i think it was mostly because of the legal issues. they need the big labels onboard to make the store look valid. the indies were offered "the same deal as the majors" and can choose if they want to sign on. it might also have had a little to do with keeping it under wraps till it was really ready. with so many indies, it would have been easy for info to leak out and we know how Apple hates that.
Is low. I couldn't find many artists I wanted, and the songs available for the others were quite limited.
Big business has been arguing (quite rightly) the case for a free flow of goods and services as a means of creating more efficient markets and thus lowering their production cost. Unfortunately, at the same time they appear very hesitant in extending these benefits to the consumer.
...
Region encoding on DVDs was only the most blatant example where markets were kept artifically separate, but it extends to many other areas, particularly cars (VW has been convicted under EU law for trying to stop Germans buying VWs abroad where they sell them cheaper), fashion (companies prosecuting anyone who dares to "re-import" produce that was to be sold cheaper abroad), CDs (CD-wow was prosecuted for importing CDs to the UK and selling them for US-prices)
It's a world of free trade, so if I want to source my products from the cheapest source I should be allowed to. I can see that some companies warrenties might not be valid abroad, or that I'd have to pay additional shipping, but creating artifically separated markets can only be bad for the consumer!
I'm particularly annoyed in the case of downloadable music. There are *no* shipping costs, yet i-tunes US won't sell music to a UK customer, presumably because they figured out they can extract more money from them...
This is even more galling when it happens internally in the EU where there are supposed to be *no* trade-barriers, yet i-tunes germany also won't sell to the UK.
Companies should not get away with having their cake and eating it. If they want globalisation they also have to face global competition for customers and can't be allowed to create artificial niches. If the Brits are prepared to pay a few pennies more in return for a more British service and not having to convert currencies, that's fine, but if I want to buy from the US (or Europe) I should definitely be allowed to do so!
Personally, I agree that it's not a good deal for purchasing an entire album, for the reasons you listed. Where it is a really good deal, is purchasing individual tracks. For example, there are all sorts of tracks by my favorite artists available only on compilation albums. I don't want any of the other tracks on the compilation album, just the one. So it's great that I can pay 99 cents and get the song I want, rather than $18.99 in a store for the entire album, which I wouldn't listen to. The same goes for many reissued albums--Sonic Youth have put out a "deluxe" version of "Dirty". I already own the cd, but would like to have some of the new extra tracks without repurchasing the whole thing.
....and as a bit of A Jazz fan, found the selections available quite good.
After a few clicks, I located some old Nina Simone stuff, that I've only seen on more expensive compilations.
One strange thing is that some of the albums are shown as "partial" on the UK Site, but "Full" on the US one? I have the ability to selct the US site, but haven't tried ordering from there?
Anyone know if that would work? It used to be that the iTunes Store Page wouldn't display at all,, but now it does, and I can select UK, France, Germany or the US sites - as has been noted previously, the prices are different, but 79 pence is less than originally mooted?
Personally, I don't think its too much per track - in the UK, everyone is used to "Rip-Off Britain" so 79 pence is cheap to us!
-- Seamus
You also choose
- NOT to support artists, who have no say in whether or not their music is on allofmp3 and get little to no money in return
- NOT to support change in the US by saying "hey, I am willing to buy music for a fair price," but instead demanding an impossibly low price.
- NOT to support the concept of copyright, which is all artists have to protect them from rampant piracy. It's not just there to make corporations money, you know...there are artists whose work is so heavily pirated they've basically become unviable (several hip-hop acts come to mind).
- CHOOSE to support a black market whose "legality" is based on a crooked organization who has assumed control over music it had no part in making and plays no part in supporting. You may think that it should be legal, but in my eyes it's no better than KaZaa.
Hey freaks: now you're ju
That the majority of users are not using windows XP. The majority of windows users are still at the win 98 stage. Apple is instead trying to make it work well on the newest platform available. People who spend mor eto upgrade thier computer are more afluent and therefore are a better demographic to have running their software. Plus, it probely wouldn't look as "good" as it does on XP. Thats most likely the real reason.
Well.. maybe. Or Maybe not. But Definitely not sort of.
Hey, if you don't like it, don't pay for it. One could make the argument that $5 is too much to pay for sugared water, a lump of plastic, fried potatoes and seared meat between bread. That doesn't lower the cost of a happy meal.
Plenty of people like iTunes. They've sold 70 million songs in a little over a year. Obviously these people think they're getting something worthwhile. I think it's great that people are willing to pay for what's essentially a bunch of bits. Seeing as I like computers and creating content for them, I'd like to eventually be able to sell some of my bits...and through iTMS, there's now a market for them.
Hey freaks: now you're ju
People are saying the selection is low. How is Apple providing two different store fronts? Are they keying on the IP address? I live in Europe but use a US credit card to buy from iTMS. Will this change if iTMS is offered in my country?
Devon
About time! What are the middlemen value-added services again?
dani++
Actually it is. RIAA is not a world wide organization (...of America will point you to this), it only has ANY relevance in the US, what gives them their 'legal' status is a Russian RIAA (you can read the legal international agreements from the 80's/90's, after USSR's fall, which do actually give them the right to represent western artists). So yes it is legal in Russia (else it would have been shut down THERE, no? - there are laws and even traces of civilization in other places than the US, as hard as that may be to believe).
RIAA only governs music in the US, if you buy the music elsewhere and then import it for personal use it's all ok as long as you acquired it legally (and you have, according to Russian law, which is what's relevant here).
Son, let me tell you about this thing called "Copyright law"...
--R.J.
Electric-Escape.net
Moreover, you would be suprised at how clear the 128kbps AAC is. Just for the sake of testing, I own a copy of a song (ATB - Don't Stop) on CD, and I bought another copy on ITMS and burned it onto a CD. I listened to both, and I honestly could not tell which was which.
Too bad some of us want music we've actually heard before.
Mod point free since 2001
The US iTunes site says "The Best Digital Jukebox."
The UK site says "A digital jukebox beyond compare."
I think they got a bit of a fright from that "the PowerMac G5 is the world's fastest computer" debacle.
Wasn't the original copyright period in the US something like 14 years (with a possible 14 year renewal)?
Seems like its been more than 28 years since 1973.
I did a little bit of digging on AllofMP3.com, but nowhere did I come across statistics on just how big a piece of the pie the artists are getting. Where are you getting your numbers from?