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Game Industry Derided For Mature Content
Steve Rock writes "To the surprise of no one, game manufacturers and resellers were again
taken
to task over the production and sales of games containing violent or
sexual themes. According to the National Institute on Media and
the Family's Ninth
Annual Mediawise Video Game Report Card even games with beneficial
or neutral content can be harmful to children because of the connection
between gameplay and our obesity epidemic. Interestingly, out of
fifty
surveys mailed out by the Institute to retailers and producers only
two were completed and returned. The industry was given a passing
grade for the ESRB rating system but the actual enforcement of the
system by the retailers was not -- it is worth noting, however, that
the Interactive Entertainment Merchants Association has stated that self-regulation
procedures were scheduled to be implemented by December 2004 and therefore
tests of retailer compliance to ESRB ratings was premature."
Back in 1954 Dr. Frederick Wertham wrote the infamous Seduction Of The Innocent, regarding the comics industry preying upon the youth of America.
Before you laugh off it off, recall the US Senate Subcommittee Investigation on Juvenile Delinquency in the United States. and all the recent stink about decency in television.
The comic industry, to placate the witch hunters offered self policing. Sound familiar? Wertham considered it a sham. Sound familiar, too?
For some background on Comics Code check this site and this site.
make way! make way! make way for the age of decency! 60,608,582 merkins can't be denied!
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Do video games affect culture or does culture affect video games?
With all these problems being pinned on video games the real question is it really video games causing all these problems. For obesity is it just because video games cause children to be obese causing them to stay at home with little activity to play games, or is it that children who have a tendency of being obese don't want to go outside and play (for reasons of security, lack of proper parental supervision, or just no one else in the area to interact with) So they will stay in side and play video games, where if there were no games then they would Watch TV all day. The same is with violence in games is it because games are violence causes kids to become violence, or is it that they see themselves in a culture of violence so they enjoy violent games. I am not a big game player and I really don't care for first person shoot-em-ups and having excessive gore. But I feel that these games reflect the culture more then culture reflects the games because the games will not sell if they didn't reflect the culture.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
What I don't understand is that, in spite of endless harping and railing by People With Nothing Better To Do (PWNBTD), has the gaming industry *EVER* been impacted by the complaints? Can someone provide a list of tangible side-effects of all of this criticism? It seems like the gaming industry just keeps chugging along.
Moo
In other news the movie industry and book industry just keep putting out their usual mature content crap.
"Power corrupts. PowerPoint corrupts absolutely."
Content aside, the amount of time kids spend playing games, even the good ones, is contributing to the obesity epidemic among American youth. For too many kids, the only parts of their body they are exercising are their thumbs. We are particularly concerned, therefore, about the launch of games this year aimed at children as young as two. We know that the industry wants to expand its customer base and that it is in their economic interest to hook babies on games. This trend, however, raises serious implications for our children's health.
What ever happened to parents kicking their kids out of the house to play ball outside? Turn off the TV, unplug their game console, log them off the computer and send them outside to play with their friends. This is nothing new and the "problem" is solved. This coming from someone who spends 10+ hours a day in front of a computer and still looks skiny.
Fly me to the moon Let me sing among those stars Let me see what spring is like On jupiter and mars
What about all of us old people (21+) that want content more adult.
I enjoyed GTA vice city, Postal 2, Quake and would not call them G rated.
I want them labeled for content, with good install/de-install programs.
And if you really insist a password/age checker.
This is my opinion based on what little I know and understand of the rumors and lies Thanks, Randal
Like being derided for poor, delayed, buggy content.
paintball
"even games with beneficial or neutral content can be harmful to children because of the connection between gameplay and our obesity epidemic."
I've played these games all of my life. I'm not a criminal. I'm not a sociopath. I'm not overweight.
When are people going to start taking responsibility for the things they and their children do, rather than blaming it upon "outside influences."
Kids become criminals because they aren't taught to NOT be criminals and because their parents are too soft/stupid/lazy to discipline them appropriately
Kids become fat because they eat to damn much.
Senator Lieberman is up for re-election in 2006, and he wants to make sure he's way ahead of any Moral Values his opponent will throw at him.
sulli
RTFJ.
Video games don't affect kids.. I mean if Pac Man effected us as kids, we'd all be running around in dark rooms, munching on magic pills, listening to repeditive electronic music.
heh heh...
If your kid plays a game with mature themes, or sexual content, instead of blaming the game manufacturers, blame yourself for being a shitty parent. And don't try that "what if he plays it at his friend Johnny's house" because good parents know what happens at their children's friends houses. Excuses are ruining your children. Do your job parents, stop blaming others.
Also, last year the average age of "video gamers" was 27. Not sure what the source was, but I remember it being reputable. Why would companies NOT make mature games? There are more adults buying (and playing) games, so it makes financial sense.
If parents did a better job, the current system would work fine.
Good thing we have the wholesome, trash-free alternative known as television to distract us from this video game smut.
Sweet informative mod.
We have movies that don't cater to kids, plays that don't cater to kids, why do the same thing with video games? The generation that grew up on video games are now adults and if we want adult content then give us adult contents.
ESRB did what it was meant to do. It gave parents a way to figure out what types of content are to be found in a given game title.
What next? Is Congress going to hold hearings on hentai next?
Video games cause obesity? Huh. That's curious. I sit around on my ass 90% of the time on a yearly basis, and yet I'm well within my ideal weight.
Oh! But I don't eat fast food. I eat vegetables and fruits and healthy food, and I can count the number of times I went to Micky D's last year on one hand.
And does anyone seriously believe sexual content hurts anyone anymore? We keep hearing this from the Bible thumpers, but year after year, there's no credible study that links sexual content with any deleterious behaviour.
Despite the obvious and known links between violence on television and in games, we say a little word here and there about it, but at the end of the day, the gov't wants violent children (pretty easy to get them to shoot defenseless Iraqis in a pile of dead guys, isn't it?), so no-one ever gets serious about that.
I'm beginning to wonder how enlightened we really are.
fifth sigma, inc.
Let's see, a thinktank orginized to combat the corruption of minors by video games and other media finds that video games corrupt minors...
Thanks slashdot. Maybe next you can post an article about greenpeace saying that everything isn't hunky dory with the environment...
They do not want things to change, they want the donations and funding to keep coming in and if they solved the 'problem' they would lose that money.
That is why the GOP never does much about abortion and why the DEMS never do much about race relations.
There isn't money in fixing the problem.
I'd try for a "First Post," but I'd like to include some actual content here.
For those of you not reading the attached article, it is a summary of a report that says that reading an hour's worth of fairy tales to your kids contains more violent imagery than an hour of evening television.
The difference is the medium - parents reading stories vs. children watching TV (usually without supervision). Parents who blame video games for violent behavior need to take a long hard look at themselves first, before making the leap that violence in games is tied to violence in the real world.
That being said, I am all for some additional coporate responsibility to not sell violent games to children under (insert arbitrary age between 10 and 14 here). Ultimately though, it's up to parents to help provide context for these things.
"What do you think?" "I think 'What, do you think?!'"
My local bar had a sign proclaiming the upcomign Halo 2 tournament. You know, a bar, in the US, where you'd need to be 21 to walk in the door (at most bars).
High School teachers I work with mention having played Grand Theft Auto.
Whatever statistic you believe, gaming is an extraorinarily succesful mass media, and it's not getting there on the backs of eight year-olds alone. An enormous amount of the success is driven by the kids that grew up with the Ataris, Colecos, and Nintendos, and they are perfectly comfortable playing these "mature" games.
Kids connect these M-rated games with maturity, rather than the fact that it takes maturity to logically understand these games. It's unfortunate, but the only people that can counter it are the parents and interested third parties. The store I work at throws a warning on the register when an "M" game is being checked out, and prompts us to ask for ID. Failure to follow through can result in termination. More and more stores are following this process, and we're going to be at a point very soon where we can't continue to simply foist the blame off on others. "M" games exist because there's an enormous market for them. 13 year-old kids shouldn't be playing them unless that child's parent is sure that the kid is capable of handling that game. In the meantime, let those of us who can legally drink, smoke, gamble, and be drafted buy Half-Life 2 if wish.
before augmented reality is mainstream. From the article:
even games with beneficial or neutral content can be harmful to children because of the connection between gameplay and our obesity epidemic
I think good games and physical conditioning are going to merge and really catch on--even with those who are not really in shape. Current barriers are miniaturization of equipment, battery improvements, and HUD improvements, but I think we are close.
BTM
That was the turning point of my life--I went from negative zero to positive zero.
Most evils were accepted into the culture after some toning down. Though as anyone should see there has been a segment of the population which resisted many of these things and has had some growth over the past decade. We're seeing more of it and I believe it's a natural thing. Progressive ideas have pressed some hard-headed folks so far that they're finally pushing back. Be vigilant.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Best quote
When will people learn that ignorance is not an excuse.
I want 2D games back.
Videodrome was a crazy Cronenberg movie (1983) about a guy (played by James Woods) who ran a cable company. The show opens with him sitting in a chair defending his network's hilariously sleazy content. "It gives our viewers a harmless outlet for their frustrations and fantasies." His character is so shady, even if you're desperate to believe him, you can't.
But then the movie turns dark. Woods uncovers a conspiracy to control people's minds using television. The videodrome is a metaphor for the combat of ideas in the media. The idea is, we only half-admit to ourselves that the media controls us. We hop up and down to censor it from violent or sexual content. This shows we kind of realize what appears on hundreds of millions of screens has consequences. But we haven't confronted the philosophical, or political dimensions of the fact.
We have a collective hissy fit when Janet Jackson shows a nipple. Meanwhile Fox News is on the air for years and we can't muster a coherent notion for fining them a dollar.
Great quote: "You know, in some countries, like Argentina, making subversive video is considered a criminal act. They execute people for it. In Pittsburgh... who knows?"
Tired of Political Trolls? Opt Out!
The industry has done a pretty good job self-regulating themselves. I'd agree with the ratings on most of the games I've played, and that it is quite clear what all the ratings mean. I've seen retailers tell kids who try to purchase "M" games to get their parents in a few locations as well.
On the other hand, I've seen parents completely ignore the ratings and description of the games time and time again. Yes, I've seen parents at retail locations buying their kids copies of GTA and other "M" games.
I know the ultimate goal for these groups that issue report cards is to get the Government to start regulating the industry. That won't do a thing. The #1 responsibility of if kids or not see "mature" games falls in the hands of parents.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
I would say that the 60's generation proves that theory wrong...
I'd also like to lay a thick layer of blame on all the moral and religious groups which feel that repressing feelings instead of openly discussing them is the proper way to handle them. I'd like to make a call to remove all children from churches until priests can stop molesting them. Please, think of the children. Further, the lessons in the bible are too graphic, depicting things like brothers slaying each other. What is this world coming to? How about reading Sesame Street books on Sunday instead, those are wholesome. I'd like to further blame religious figures who lambast the teaching of sexual education, though most parents will never bring up the topic until it's too late and their childrens' curiosity provides the lessons. How many children's lives must be ruined because adults are too embarassed to speak about sexuality? Can't we for once actually think of the children?
Finally, I'd like to thank the video game industry, for providing children with an outlet for excess energy that doesn't involve killing people. Sports games, platformers, puzzle games, there are all sorts of interactive outlets for children apart from just watching after school cartoons. I'd like to yell at parents that give overly young, impressionable children mature games. What's wrong with you? I'd like to thank all parents that have decided their 16 year olds are or are not mature enough to play GTA, and took the trouble to, you know, actually think about their child instead of blaming others for their poor parenting.
If not now, when?
I'm a fairly conservative Christian and even I have problems with chick.com. Among the more obvious problems, even the supposedly "accurate" portrayals of various events are inaccurate (for example, child molestation in Sodom & Gomorrah). I emailed their site several times to protest this, but they basically told me to shut up and never email them again.
Condemnant quod non intellegunt.
I for one am taking the high ground here and currently producing "Christian Cell" a first person action game that will teach children about the bible while they infiltrate godless liberal political organizations before they can put Hillary Clinton into Office and outlaw the bible.
After being air-dropped in the middle of the night your role as a member of Christian Cell will be to use your bible knowledge, high tech gadgetry and stealth skills to sneak up behind enemy targets, collect information and ultimately destroy the leaders of this terrorist organization.
This is exactly the kind of thing we all (not just /.ers) need to get worked up about! Video games do far greater harm to our kids than moldy old school buildings that should have been gutted decades ago.
Blasting fantasy aliens will shorten a child's life way more effectively than spending a year without health insurance.
Better we concentrate on ending the nervous twitch that excessive gamepading can cause, rather than the total ego destruction that occurs when a parent/teacher/priest molests the child.
Let's deal with children with the warped perception that Master Chief is 'cool', and we can get to the constant cramming of blipverts selling piece of crap aspirations that can never, ever be realized later.
Let's stop the mega-corporations poisoning the poor children's minds with comic ultra-violence, so that they can concentrate on poisoning their bodies with chemicals in the environment, in the water, in the sludge-matic pound 'o' lard flame-wiped shite burger at the local worker exploitation outlet that embodies their future.
OR
We might pick something that actually matters, but that might require the expenditure of actual effort, and change it instead.
It's a judgement call, I guess.
From the commentary: Perhaps the most telling moment of the entire call came when a reporter asked in essence, "Why is it that crime rates are falling just as videogame content is getting more violent?" Without irony, New York City councilman Eric Gioia replied, "I'll take a stab at that" You see Councilman Gioia, context is everything.
There is not nearly enough love in the world, but there is far too much trust.
Fuck the children. Seriously.
Everything's about protecting children, and it's POINTLESS.
You think you should censor movies with swear words? Well think again: they pick em up in the schoolyard regardless.
Afraid to show them boobs? Well, guess what they'll be seeing as a teenager anyway? I'm not saying show them some hardcore porn, but really, Janet Jackson's ugly tit won't fuck your child up.
Afraid to show them violence? Oh, hah, no. Violence is okay in movies, but not in interactive games!
Do your fucking job as a parent and there shouldn't be any issues. The end. Simple, really... unless you're a shitty parent.
Society is hypocritical. Thankfully, the smart ones ignore stupid complaints from the ignorant.
We have secretly replaced these Slashdot mods' sense of humor with a rusty nail. Let's see if they notice!!
And a few Christmas's ago, had the following conversation with a customer who walked in to buy a game:
(Me): Thank you for coming to [store]. Can I help you find anything.
(Her): Yes, I'm looking for that game.
[slight wait as I realize no more information is forthcoming]
(Me): What game would that be ma'am? We carry a lot of games.
(Her): It's a driving game. It's fairly new.
(Me): Ok. [I list off the more popular driving games, ending with..] and finally GTA:Vice City.
(Her): That's it. Do you have it?
(Me): Yes we do. Here it is right here. Do you want to get the strategy guide with that? It's five dollars off the guide if you get it with the game.
(Her): No. My son likes figuring these things out on his own. This game is appropriate for a ten year old, right?
(Me): No ma'am, it's not.
I proceeded to explain what the 'M' meant and showed her that while some games only had one or two 'blurbs' on the back listing what made them mature games, that GTA:Vice City had several more.
Needless to say, she not only did not get the game, she got something else and went home to have some words with her son.
My manager was impressed with the way I handled that, because we had a couple salesclerks that would have just sold her the game.
Atomic batteries to power! Turbines to speed!
Funny, I don't ever recall reading any studies connecting the compulsive watching of television sports while drinking beer and eating junk food as a contributor to obesity.
Or paintball as a gateway to violent behavior.
Maybe I'm not reading the right stuff.
A guy I know had a bumper sticker on his car:
"Kids who hunt, trap, and fish, don't mug little old ladies".
No, they just torture and kill defenseless little animals. Kids who play video games (or D&D) don't usually do that either.
They don't care about the children. They care about enforcing their moral values on others. That's ALL they care about. The "think of the children" argument is just a smokescreen to get you to go along with them.
Boobies never hurt anyone. - Sherry Glaser.
Anyone out there besides me catch congressional proceedings about this on CSPAN? There was more nudity on there than anything else I've seen on 'normal' cable tv (green wobbly scrambled porn doesn't count). They showed a bunch of tit shots from The Guy Game and some clip of a piece of wood humping some cartoon girl in all sorts of different positions. Freakin' hillarious. Nothing was blurred out, just some message on the bottom saying the program may contain nudity and adult content. Makes me glad I didn't program out CSPAN and CSPAN2 on my TV. I wonder how many complaints the FCC will get about this. Went way beyond some 2 second flash of Janet's boob.
Rampant Ninja related crimes these days...Whitehouse is not the exception
They had a video during their live presentation which was attended by Senator Lieberman and covered by CSPAN. I didn't realize what it was, at first, because I was flipping through channels when I saw DOOM III being played. It turns out the video they were playing was a montage of various "problematic" games, including GFA and others, designed to show just how inappropriate to kids they were.
Towards the end, they showed the latest Leisure Suit Larry game and something called The Guy Game. The Guy Game, for those of you that aren't familiar with it, seems to be a trivia-type game that allows you to see real video of real girls taking off their tops when you answer correctly. Can you guess where this is going? Sure enough, their demo showed full boobage, which CSPAN did not censor. There were a good 5-10 seconds of actual, real (or at least not simulated) breasts running on CSPAN! This has got to be a first. Thank you, Senator Lieberman!
If porn is legal, and violent R-rated movies are legal, then whats the problem with GTA?
The Doormat
If you're not outraged, then you're not paying attention.
No, I think you're mistaking the world's attitude towards videogames today for the one ten years ago.
College campuses are full of people, not guys, people, who play games. It is a fully acceptable hobby for people other than geeks now. And while it's not the sort frequented by Hell's Angels, it's not anything other than an ordinary college town bar.
But as other posters have noted, even if most stores honor their ratings code and don't sell, the kids will still get these games if they are available. Children are canny consumers. I remember as a kid growing up, most young people of my peer group knew the places where you could buy cigarettes and alcohol, for example. And with the Internet there are other ways to get ahold of a game, making it even easier to get the content.
So ultimately, you can't really "save" a kid from being exposed to this sort of media. So the ones who affect how they deal with that exposure are the parents. If they are actively involved in their child's life, they are the ones who can be at least generally aware of what they are doing on their computers or console games. Of course, parents cannot protect their children 100%, since the kids can always go over to a friend's house to play, but they can inculcate in the child the values needed for a child to place the violence in his/her surrounding culture into the proper context.
Unfortunately, these days many (not all) parents are dodging these responsibilities, and leave the media to raise their kids (television, video games, the Internet, peer groups). Then they bitch when they come home and see their kid playing GTA. In this context, the easiest solution from their point of view is to ban/regulate the content.
You can't put the genie back into the bottle. Porn, violence, a whole slew of sick shit... it's out there, and it ain't going away no matter how much the radical right shrieks and moans. People want this content, and not just the depraved liberals and scrubby proletarians.
I thought it was ironic that there was a piece in my local paper last week juxtaposing the triumph of "values/morals" in the recent election with the popularity of trash TV. The conservatives get all bent out of shape when a naked woman embraces a football player on TV, and yet ratings show that the smutty dramas and vapid reality shows are being watched eagerly by these same people who voted the "moral" ticket. Hypocrites.
OK... any under 17 /.ers ever been carded / refused when trying to purchase an "M" rated (17+) game? An "AO" (18+) game? If so, where?
We apologize for the preceding message. All those responsible have been sacked.
...more adult content.
I'm in my early 30's. Card me all you want at the counter. Grand Theft Auto should not be in the hands of minors anyway. But at the same time present me, a "grown-up", with the choice of titles with pure adult content.
Then we will all be happy. Well, until they decide to take their crusade further, which is the fear I suppose.
"The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel Boorstin
I'm reminded of a quote from one of my favorites, High Fidelity - "What came first, the music or the misery? People worry about kids playing with guns, or watching violent videos, that some sort of culture of violence will take them over. Nobody worries about kids listening to thousands, literally thousands of songs about heartbreak, rejection, pain, misery and loss. Did I listen to pop music because I was miserable? Or was I miserable because I listened to pop music?"
There's nothing wrong with violence, sexuality, etc etc - it's all about placement. Teach your kids that stress relief by acting out frustrations on your opponents is different than whacking around another kid in a playground. Hunting in the wilds is different than blowing people away with a shotgun, etc etc.
Personally I'm still more afraid of the influence upon children of today that post 9-11 is giving (hey, let's go blow up some countries because they might harbour terrorists, and it's ok to lock up a few innocents and torture information out of them because we need to catch the real bad guys).
Back in highschool, for about 2 years, the question wasn't "was I stoned" but instead what days I wasn't stoned.
A small group of friends and I smoked pot constantly, daily, until one day one of our major sources moved away.
At that time we basically decided that was fun, now time to move on with our lives.
And we did, there was no cravings, no elevated emotional states, or any other addictive type symptons. We just quit, simple as that.
Now it's about 20 years later, and while I've smoked the occasional bowl a few times within those years, I've never gotten addicted to it nor even bothered to try any of the hardcore drugs that pot is supposed to lead you into.
As for your friend, he sounds like a very addictive personality that runs the risk of becoming addicted to anything. There are people like that, who I wouldn't advise using pot, but then I wouldn't advise them to start playing EverQuest either.