Lik-Sang.com Taken to Court By Sony

Joe writes "As published on Lik-Sang's Website Sony has taken legal actions against Hong Kong's largest exporter of videogames and videogaming gear. One month before the official european launch and 9 months after the initial release of the PSP, this action looks very late at first sight. Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can permit the resale of the japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong no matter if on the local market or for export, it looks like this is planned to be one of the not the bright marketing ideas of the Sony HQ. The japanese PSP has the same Region Code for UMDs as the ones which will be sold in europe in september. Since the shipping at Lik-Sang is free, the console is even cheaper to import than to buy it locally."

Comments

Cheaper?

[BlackCobra43]

I'd comment but I need to go buy a PSP now

Re:Cheaper?

[NiteHaqr]

Already done, and from Lik-Sang a few months ago.

And its Firmware version 1.50.

Will probably get another one from them when the white ones come out - then I can still do my SNES/Genesis emulation, as well as coding my own stuff as well as having all the cool new features.

Its a pity really, as Sony would earn so much respect by allowing programmers to sign their own code - why cant they come up with a way of doing it that only works on files of say 200MB or less, thus allowinf homebrew, surely they could make it as a loader library, and have it flash up a "This Software is not made or checked by Sony, Use is at your own risk".

Re:Cheaper?

[Anonymous Coward]

Poster needs a grammar check... Or possibly an English lesson... It looks like the output of babelfish...

.. this action looks very late at first sight.

This action looks very late at first glance.

Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can permit the resale of the japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong no matter if on the local market or for export, it looks like this is planned to be one of the not the bright marketing ideas of the Sony HQ.

Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can prevent the resale of the japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong (on the local market or for export), it looks like this poor plan is one of the most bone-headed marketing ideas from Sony HQ.

Re:Cheaper?

[kinzillah]

Because they make their money on the software. The PSP costs them money.

Re:Cheaper?

[NiteHaqr]

Which makes my point even more valid.

I will buy a second PSP that will cost them money because in order to play some of their newer games I will be forced to upgrade my firmware.

So either I cause them a loss by getting the second one - or cause them a bigger loss by not buying new games that require a firmware upgrade.

Allowing homebrew to run will not kill them, as what I am proposing would not allow dumped UMD images to run, only people's own code.

Re:Cheaper?

[JamieKitson]

I'd comment but after attempting to read the synopsis I don't have a clue what the story is about.

What do you mean RTFA. This is Slashdot.

Re:Cheaper?

[Anonymous Coward]

Which makes my point even more valid.

I will buy a second PSP that will cost them money because in order to play some of their newer games I will be forced to upgrade my firmware.

You will, everyone else won't.

Re:Cheaper?

[Anonymous Coward]

that makes zero sense, it is accurate, but it does not support them doing this.

Re:Cheaper?

[(A)*(B)!0_-]

"Allowing homebrew to run will not kill them, as what I am proposing would not allow dumped UMD images to run, only people's own code."

No, it wouldn't "kill" Sony. [Why are we using language like that to discuss this matter anyway?] Allowing homebrew software to run unsigned would add competition to the marketplace, which is something that developers for the PSP would not appreciate. Sony doesn't want homebrew games being released to keep developers happy and because it generates no income for them.

Re:Cheaper?

[syntaxglitch]

If you're referring to them not making profits on the PSP, that DOES make sense--if they take a per-unit loss to sell the systems for less, they're likely to sell MORE of the system, which will encourage more purchasing and more development for the system, and thus the licensing on the games makes them even more money than if they'd been selling the hardware at a better profit.

In an industry like console games, market share = profit.

Not that this really has much to do with the article--it seems that, if anything, anything that encourages more people to buy PSPs would be beneficial.

Re:Cheaper?

[poot_rootbeer]

Its a pity really, as Sony would earn so much respect by allowing programmers to sign their own code

Given the choice between earning respect and earning revenue, I'm pretty sure I know which one Sony would rather have.

Re:Cheaper?

[sigloiv]

Uh, you can emulate SNES/Genesis games/homebrew/demos on the 1.50. My friend owns a PSP and he brings it over all the time for me to put crap on. It's called KXploit. It creates two Eboots, one of which is shown as "corrupt data", the other of which is shown as the actual application. You put all your zipped ROMs into the first folder without the '%' and...well, then you play.

Google it. KXploit

Re:Cheaper?

[Anonymous Coward]

market share really does not mean profit in the console industry since the PSX. Nintendo is the only one on that market now that is not in the red with thier consoles. MS and Sony keep turning up red over and over with thier overfeatured consoles that can do everything well, but doesn't focus on any of them. Nintendo however focuses on what I actually want which is a game machine at a good price and in turn they don't lose on a per console basis (I own all 3 of the current gens btw...3 Xboxes too).

Re:Cheaper?

[Anonymous Coward]

Please provide one example of anything you have coded for your hacked PSP or admit that you are lying and only use it to play pirated games.

Thanks!

Re:Cheaper?

[blincoln]

Sony doesn't want homebrew games being released to keep developers happy and because it generates no income for them.

This is a stupid, shortsighted policy. It's like a retailer deciding not to allow returns because it costs them money.

Just like allowing customer returns increases profit in the long term because those same people will come back to buy other things, allowing people to play little homebrew games on their PSP would increase its value to potential buyers.

Re:Cheaper?

[kinzillah]

Except everyone will get pissed off if they can't return something. There are scores of mindless highschoolers that would use homebrew games if they were available, but really won't sweat it if they can't. Methinks sony dosen't really care about losing a fraction of the fanatical slashdot crowd.

Re:Cheaper?

[Anonymous Coward]

from the grandparent:

Will probably get another one from them when the white ones come out - then I can still do my SNES/Genesis emulation, as well as coding my own stuff as well as having all the cool new features.

dummy

Re:Cheaper?

[gabebear]

How does allowing homebrew software ever net Sony profit?

Allowing customer returns sacrafices profits in the short term so that profits increase in the long term because of return shopping(most stores make sure of this by only allowing store credit on returns). Allowing unsigned code on the PSP increases losses in the short term AND decreases profits in the long run due to less game sales.

I could see Sony allowing homebrew like they did with the PS2, as an expensive Linux add-on. Although this time all they would have to include is a UMD disc that loads code off a memory stick.

Re:Cheaper?

[buffer-overflowed]

If you want to stick it to sony there are far better things to buy for homebrew than a PSP. And you hurt them far more by NOT buying one then you do by buying one.

Say Sony loses $20 per PSP sold. If you buy one of their prodigious backstock @ $250 you just mitigated their loss from $270 to $20, and you also handed them a sale they can point to to try to get some momentum going in the handheld space.

Like gizmondo's new handheld. Or their old one, the GP32. Or hell, even a GBA/DS can do homebrew via a flash cart and in the case of those two they not only have working emulators they're made by one of the companies that put the games out in the first place.

Sony's NOT going to suddenly wake up one day and go "hey, let's allow anyone to write apps!" so how about purchasing one of the many competing products. Either from Nintendo, who have been very hands off so far(tons of homebrew GBA stuff and DS stuff is hitting, no sign of them flashing the firmware yet), or from Gizmondo who actually actively SEEKS that niche.

Re:Cheaper?

[sanosuke76]

Bear in mind that the components, while expensive when a console is released, become much cheaper over time. Consider the original PS2. Then, think of the new slimline PS2's, with most of the system integrated onto one board and several chips' functions combined together. They do start off selling the console at a loss, but consoles don't drop in price too quickly and they're probably not breaking a loss after the first year or so.

Re:Cheaper?

[Sancho]

I don't think he wants to "stick it to sony". He wants a PSP--that's why he's buying a second. He just also wants to play homebrews, something I really agree with.

Unfortunately, as many have pointed out, it's not economically feasible for Sony to allow this.

Either from Nintendo, who have been very hands off so far(tons of homebrew GBA stuff and DS stuff is hitting, no sign of them flashing the firmware yet), or from Gizmondo who actually actively SEEKS that niche.

Do we even know if the DS can be flashed with a new firmware? I'm certain that the GBA cannot be.

Flashable firmware can be very nice, but it certainly takes effort to create a device capable of it. If the Nintendo handhelds weren't made to be flashed, that would certainly prevent Nintendo from doing so to lock out homebrewers.

Re:Cheaper?

[buffer-overflowed]

The PSP is awful for homebrew though. You're better off with other products if that's what you want to take part in. Gizmondo specifically caters to that niche and is releasing a new handheld here soon. I mean, the main reason to get a PSP is/should be PSP games, and having to kill that functionality to run homebrew just makes the whole thing overpriced and a poor value.

Most of the homebrew people want is emulation, and the old GP32 handles all of that wonderfully at less than half the price of admission.

Sony's not going to see the light and let you run your own code on the thing anytime soon.

Yes, you can flash the DS via a DS rom. In order to flash the first 512(or it might be 1024) bytes of the firmware you need to short out SL1. Which is covered by a sticker underneath the battery pack. It's called FlashMe, and is currently used to remove the warning screen(insta boot) and allow the DS to boot into DS mode off the GBA slot w/o a PassMe adapter or booting code via WiFi. It's doubtful that nintendo will reflash the firmware, but it's possible for them to do so. Us dirty device hackers already have after all. Loopy'll(PocketNES, SNESDS) figure it out if they do, and I don't expect them to do it more than once(to plug in a TCP/IP stack for their whole WiFi rollout thing in a few months would be the strongest possibility). Plus, there should be DS flash carts out in the wild sooner or later, rendering the whole thing moot.

The GBA, no idea if it has flashable firmware or not. It's never been an issue. You boot code from a link cable or cart and it runs exactly like it was from a real game cart. Touching the firmware would be kind of taboo, as one of the great things about the GBA was if you screw up while developing something and don't catch it via the emulator, you just power the thing down, no damage done. Lots and lots of cool stuff on the GBA. The huge GBA homebrew community was one of the big reasons I nabbed a DS.

Re:Cheaper?

[(A)*(B)!0_-]

"allowing people to play little homebrew games on their PSP would increase its value to potential buyers."

Prove it in a way that is verifiable and can be directly traced to the bottom line. Because that's what someone at Sony would have to do. It's easy to whine on Slashdot, a lot harder to get something done in the real world.

Re:Cheaper?

[koreaman]

Less game sales?

Availability of homebrew games would entice more people to buy the PSP who wouldn't have otherwise. These people, now that they have a PSP, will inevitably buy "official" games that they wouldn't have bought had they not had a PSP.

Re:Cheaper?

[Anonymous Coward]

All your PSP are belong to us.

-Sony

Re:Cheaper?

[gabebear]

I really doubt it,
Simpler games would no longer have a market in "official" PSP games. While Lumines is a great game, could you see buying it for $40 when 1000 variations of tetris are available for free? This would also hold true for any genre that could be made by homebrew authors.

Homebrew games would be competing directly with the official titles. If one good homebrew game came out in each major genre I could easily see a LOT of PSPs sold without a single game sale.

Re:Cheaper?

[Doctor_Jest]

It doesn't have to, if you think about it. They're spending money trying to combat the homebrew market (and region-free "piracy" or whatnot), which is costing them dollars to do, when they could just turn a blind eye to the "problem", they can save money and concentrate on making some decent titles for the thing. That's a definite bottom line savings. Even a CEO can do the math on that one. I suppose in the mindset of "piracy" one could argue that Sony's just coveting their IP...

Sony's got a great product that is again hampered by a proprietary disc format... And if they continue to rehash PS2 games for it, they're losing out on a grand opportunity to at least get some good market share in the handheld arena (in Nintendo's backyard...)

I've got two games for mine (Lumines and Untold Legends) and the horizon doesn't look all that grand, despite Sony's proclamation at launch. I want some decent RPGs (there's one or two coming, but it's been a while since launch... :) heh..)

Ah well... at least I got Spiderman 2 on UMD. heh.

Re:Cheaper?

[OneHungLo]

The reason they won't do this is because size restrictions of homebrew programs mean nothing. Anyone with a good knowledge of the PSP hardware can write a program that loads a ripped UMD from the memory stick in 16KB of code or less. If you think nobody would do it, you obviously underestimate the so-called "homebrew" community. As much as I'd love for a mainstream console to embrace homebrew development, it probably won't happen. It only takes one bad apple to spoil the bunch.

Re:Cheaper?

[NiteHaqr]

My point was that the UK release version is Firmware 2.0 - which seems to have a few new nice features, so the choice is Flash my 1.50 to 2.0 and lose homebrew or not have those features.

I know all about KXploit :)

Re:Cheaper?

[(A)*(B)!0_-]

"They're spending money trying to combat the homebrew market (and region-free "piracy" or whatnot), which is costing them dollars to do, when they could just turn a blind eye to the "problem", they can save money and concentrate on making some decent titles for the thing."

They're protecting the developers who pay licensing fees to them from competition from developers who do not pay licensing fees to them. Furthermore, this is standard practice and has been for quite some time within the industry.

Re:Cheaper?

[Doctor_Jest]

They aren't saving _that_ much money from licensing fees by locking out the homebrew people. There is not a rampant tide of unlicensed developers "robbing" Sony of licensing fees here. The thread asked how to prove it can save the company money, or benefit the bottom line. It can also benefit Sony in the grand scheme of things with mindshare... something they lose each time they lock down the PSP.

I'm not saying they need to promote the "hackability" of the PSP, just let it bubble in the niche that it is, and they might be surprised how it positively affects market share. And it would save them R&D dollars they normally would use to combat this by allowing a balance to be achieved between homebrew and licensed developers.

It does them little good to spend so much energy in the long run stamping out a few people who might reverse-engineer their product to play Atari 2600 ROMs (or whatever) on it. Those who want to will always find a way. Kinda like crippled CDs. :)

Re:Cheaper?

[(A)*(B)!0_-]

Again, you can't prove any of the above. This is what I was getting at originally. Sony execs see the status quo [as I described in my previous post] as protecting their developers from competition. Thus, to change that policy, execs would demand some type of verifiable proof that the benefits outweight the costs. Thus, the problem with your reply is that all of this is simple conjecture without any hard proof to back it up. You would need statistics and expected impact and, even then, it's still not probable that someone would be willing to put their neck on the line so you can run homebrew applications on the PSP. For many in the corporate world, it is better to fail in a conventional method than to take a chance on an unproven one.

Re:Cheaper?

[Doctor_Jest]

Prove they are losing money to homebrew. You can't, and neither can Sony. It's a guess based on a prejudicial view of their market which stems from a corporate culture that puts faith in many claims like these. All of which have specious arguments and flawed "studies" full of statistical voodoo that is meant to make the shareholders believe what the corporation wants them to believe. Sony's not going bankrupt because someone figured out a way to play NESTER off the memory stick. And there is no mountain of data derived from a formula to prove it does.

Sales being in jeopardy due to homebrew is more conjecture than anything I've said. There is no quantitative proof that they lose any money from the use of homebrew emus and the sort (I won't get into UMD piracy at this point because that falls under an entirely new set of prejudices and arguments) It's assumed. And we all know what that leads to.

You can lie with statistics just as easily. (There's an excellent book entitled "How to Lie With Statistics" that really makes one think... Amazon carries it...)

They (Sony) are not betting on a conventional method with verifiable results based on facts and measurable results. They are toeing the line most corporations have been shackled with since the dawn of the digital age... and that line is just as unproven as anything else that has been said.

Sony's just too old and set in its ways to change...

My original point was that they can safely ignore the "problem" and still show a verifiable savings based on NOT funneling as much money and manpower into anti-piracy and whatnot. That IS verifable on the balance sheet.

Re:Cheaper?

[(A)*(B)!0_-]

" Prove they are losing money to homebrew. You can't, and neither can Sony."

I never have claimed that they were. The point is that the decision makers don't have to prove the status quo is working in business. You have to prove that a change would bring better results. Your call for me to prove the above shows that you both don't understand my statements [since I never made such a claim and asking me to prove it shows you haven't understood that I haven't made such a claim] and you don't understand how business works. See my previous comments and try to absorb them.

Re:Cheaper?

[Doctor_Jest]

I said the status quo was unprovable and wrong in this instance. I never advocated anything else. Sony does not prove the status quo, they just follow it... And blindly in most cases.

You stand on your side, I'll stand on mine.

The claim that "we've always done it this way" is somehow proving an idea is facetious. That's just what Sony is doing.

Largest exporter of video games?

[Nuclear Elephant]

Sony has taken legal actions against Hong Kong's largest exporter of videogames and videogaming gear

This guy?

Re:Largest exporter of video games?

[Hogwash McFly]

Let me guess, you're also one of those people who can't fathom how a first post can be redundant?

Re:Largest exporter of video games?

[jmm36]

Sony needs to make money somehow. Why not sue the people who SELL your systems? So smart! They must be so jealous of Nintendo. Low market share, but smart enough to make a solid profit every year, and Nintendo's only getting better at it. In the end, it will be the most profitable company, not the biggest, that wins. Meanwhile Sony thinks it is competing with Microsoft, who have lost a BILLION dollars a year on the Xbox since it came out! Thank you MS investors for subsidizing our video game fun! Your lost dividends every year could supply the world's poor with 20 MILLION COPIES of the latest Halo, at suggested retail price! That's one copy for every owner of an Xbox! To make that up, you would have to sell 10 extra games to every Xbox owner every year, based on $5 profit to Microsoft per disc (my rough guess) or five at $10 profit. I just don't see that happening. XBox 360 should be Microsoft's last effort, if investor's don't get wise before November. I predict Nintendo is the real winner of the next generation, no matter what sales reports show.

Worst written summary EVAR

[Anonymous Coward]

Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can permit the resale of the japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong no matter if on the local market or for export, it looks like this is planned to be one of the not the bright marketing ideas of the Sony HQ.

Wow, this is bad even for Slashdot.

Re: Worst written summary EVAR

[NerdHead]

Not as bad as misspelling 'ever'.

Re: Worst written summary EVAR

[Anonymous Coward]

No, you have serious case of nerdbrain humor loss. The spelling "evar," especially when capitalized, is a common joke on geek discussion boards.

Funny how someone with "nerd" in his moniker could not know this.

Region codes

[confusion]

Those region codes are SO convenient for consumers. I just LOVE travelling abroad and not being able to watch my dvds. I shouldn't be suprised that SONY would think to do this with UMD too. bah.

Jerry
http://www.cyvin.org/

Re:Region codes

[MyDixieWrecked]

yeah, it sucks.

You can imagine my surprise when after reading all the crap about PSP games not being region encoded, then when UMD movies are finally available I can't play them.

I got my PSP the first week of January. Imported from japan. It's nice that the Japanese PSPs can play US games and vice versa, and not that I would buy them if I could, but it sucks that I can't watch US UMD movies on my japanese PSP.

Re:Region codes

[Forzamilan]

You are totally right, region codes sucks and are an obsolete technology from the 80s when nintendo used it on their NES. Why do we have to buy another movie in region 4 when i already have it in region 1?

Re:Region codes

[Willeh]

Not to mention the whole idea of UMD is garbage anyway. I can't wait to rebuy "The Matrix" for the 5th time just so i can watch it on a tiny screen!

Re:Region Codes

[BloodAngel_Au]

Well in Australia it has been ruled by the courts or the consumer commission) that a region locked DVD player is bad and region unlocked players are compleatly legal.

Re:Region codes

[Anonymous Coward]

You are totally right, region codes sucks and are an obsolete technology from the 80s when nintendo used it on their NES.

Uh, what? They still perform a business function. How are they obsolete?

Why do we have to buy another movie in region 4 when i already have it in region 1?

Because different corporations own the rights to sell the movie in different parts of the world and the region code scheme enforces that. Look on your R1 DVD - it'll say "not for resale outside the US and Canada" or similar. If you are from the US and bought it legally there, you'll have an R1 player, right?

The world isn't a single global market - yet.

Re:Region Codes

[Anonymous Coward]

For the same reasons they don't speak out against all the other obstructions of free trade?

If you're going to get upset about the lack of free trade, I suggest you concentrate your efforts in areas like agriculture, raw materials and the draconian so called free trade agreements the West is making with Africa, South America and parts of Asia, rather than whine about how you have to spend more of your allowence to play games or movies.

Re:Region codes

[MyDixieWrecked]

the idea behind UMD movies is pretty cool.

however, the implementation BLOWS.

a UMD movie has less features and less quality than a DVD... why does it cost at least as much as one? UMD movies should be free in boxes of cereal. They should come with games. they should come with DVDs. They should cost less than a pack of cigarettes (I live in NY, so a pack of cigarettes costs upwards of 7-8$).

Re:Region Codes

[hrieke]

In a word, licensing.
If Sony licenses a song, or a character, or something for use with any of their games, that IP could have a regional license that says that they can use that IP only in certainly countries.
And this goes for any game company- Nintendo, Sega, EA, and even MS and Sony.

Re:Region codes

[mad flyer]

Yes sir, it says not for resale.

It don't forbid me to possess it and leave for another country.

They should enforce the selling part, not the viewing part.

By doing region coding they alienate the end user in order to try to conceal the sellers... As usual, customers are collateral damages...

Re:Region Codes

[Dimensio]

Well in Australia it has been ruled by the courts or the consumer commission) that a region locked DVD player is bad and region unlocked players are compleatly legal.

I thought that all DVD players had to be region-free, or at least that manufacturers had to provide a region-free solution for any consumer who requested it.

I know that the ruling was what enabled me (in the US) to region-hack my Panasonic player; I got my hands on a copy of the 'unlock' disc that Panasonic was legally obligated to make available for Australian consumers.

Re:Region codes

[ShieldW0lf]

Region coding isn't for enforcing resale rules. It is for fighting piracy. Because if it WAS for enforcing reselling rules, that would be price fixing, and it would be illegal.

And this lawsuit is more of the same illegal shit. Sony have no right to prevent Lik-Sang from reselling these. This trademark law argument is so weak. They're not selling knock offs, they're selling legally aquired PSPs with the manufacturing trademark on them.

What I don't understand is why so many dimbulbs on Slashdot stand up to defend the rights of corporations to engage in illegal price fixing.

Re:Region Codes

[iapetus]

More relevantly, in Australia this form of parallel importing is completely legal - though importers are far more responsible for making sure the imported goods are genuine.

Re:Region Codes

[The Analog Kid]

Intellectual Property is an obstruction to free trade and the free market, but you'll never hear any government body speak out against it.

Re:Region codes

[Anonymous Coward]

Region coding isn't for enforcing resale rules. It is for fighting piracy.

Er, how, exactly? All the pirate DVDs I've ever seen were region-free. And all the pirate movies I've seen traded online were DivX or whatever, not actual DVD copies.

Maybe the idea is that Chinese pirates will have to wait for the Chinese release instead of being able to rip the US DVD? No, wait, that doesn't work either, because we have this thing called "international mail" that lets them buy US DVDs to rip.

So, uh, how the fuck does region coding have the slightest thing to do with piracy?

Re:Region codes

[KDR_11k]

I don't think the law even permits prohibiting sales outside of a certain region. First sale doctrine and stuff. It might be arguable for the end user but the retailer certainly did NOT buy a license, they bought the packs they put on the shelves.

Re:Region codes

[ShieldW0lf]

It doesn't. That's how they sold it past the regulators when by rights it ought to land them in jail. I just forgot my tags.

Re:Region codes

[DrXym]

The same could be said of DVDs and VHS cassettes. DVDs are more expensive because the manufacturers promoted the myth that they cost more money. Perhaps they did for a short while, but it was quite obvious that they wouldn't forever. These days, DVDs cost pennies to make. Even if they cost the same as VHS, producers still save money on shipping and packaging and retailers enjoy selling more DVDs per foot than VHS.

The reason UMD costs the same as DVDs is again because Sony knows they can get away with it. The easiest way to force them to drop their prices is to not buy UMDs until they cost as much as you're willing to pay.

Personally I don't see them point of them at all. But then if I had any inclination to play movies, I'd rip them and use a memory stick. I'm sure Sony are gambling that the majority of PSP owners don't bother. Of course Sony get a slice from rippers too since you still have to use their their confusing & proprietary memory stick format.

Re:Region codes

[LWATCDR]

"The world isn't a single global market - yet."
You really could have fooled me. I would say that people are bent over region codes shows that we do live in a global market.
Sorry guys get over it. The Internet and Fed Ex has made the world a much smaller place.

Re:Region codes

[Doomstalk]

Personally I don't see them point of them at all. But then if I had any inclination to play movies, I'd rip them and use a memory stick. I'm sure Sony are gambling that the majority of PSP owners don't bother.

Or the fact that the maximum supported resolution for such videos is considerably lower than that of UMD movies.

Re:Region codes

[Anonymous Coward]

You have it backwards. The consumer clearly has no license or other contract when they purchase a DVD. Nothing printed on (or even inside) the case even approaches a notice of terms that the consumer must agree to in order to use the product. Even clickwrap EULAs have more standing than any claim that my DVDs are "licensed" to me.

Retailers have contracts that they have to abide by or face the consequences, covering stuff like promotion, shelf space, release dates, and so on.

Re:Region codes

[AndyChrist]

Trade is only free for capital. And even then only if you've got a lot of it. Or that seems to be what those with a lot of it want.

When labor is as free to move as capital, I'll be fully converted. (when land is I'll be fucking amazed.)

Re:Region Codes

[supabeast!]

Free trade is an idea dreamed up by huge corporations looking for easy money.

Region coding is an idea dreamed up by huge corporations looking for easy money.

Politicians get elected using bribes from the large corporations.

Is it really that hard to see why region coding and free trade can coexist?

Re:Region codes

[ShieldW0lf]

That was sarcasm tags, btw

Re:Region codes

[sp00nage]

$7 -$8 for cigarettes? Poor you. Try living here in England. You'd be looking at £5 (~$9). And £18 for that DVD! ($32!) I dread to think what UMD movies will cost when they are eventually launched here, if unlike one of Sony's previous attempt at launching a proprietary format for media when an alternative already exists, namely pre-recorded Minidisc, they actually show up in any quantity at all.

Re:Region codes

[TyrionEagle]

Well, Play have UMD movies up already.

172 so far, prices between £9.99 and £15.99 on the first page.

Re:Region codes

[steve_bryan]

Or the fact that the maximum supported resolution for such videos is considerably lower than that of UMD movies.

I have seen people allude to this fact repeatedly and assumed it might be true. But out of curiosity I used QuickTime to export a segment of an episode of Firefly. When I viewed the result on the PSP the picture appeared to be as good as what I had seen in UMD movies. Is it possible that this fact is an artifact of poorly done conversions produced by utility programs? When I tried some of those utility programs I got uniformly dismal results. They didn't handle aspect ratio correctly and the resolution was nothing to write home about. But the clip I converted myself (and then named, put in a folder with the right name, yada, yada, ...) looked remarkably good. Now I'm just waiting for the price of memory sticks to drop to levels that are not obscene.

Re:Region codes

[MyDixieWrecked]

Try living here in England. You'd be looking at £5 (~$9). And £18 for that DVD! ($32!)

jesus christ. at least I have the advantage of hopping over the river to NJ and getting cigarettes for ~$3 cheaper. or, when I visit my friend in PA, getting cigarettes for under $3. Although I quit smoking a couple months ago (but I still buy a pack here and there to fend off the nicotine rage).

and about the DVD price... I don't see how they're getting away with charging that much. I don't see how anyone's getting away with charging as much as they are for nearly everything all of a sudden. It seems that DVD prices have gone up in the last couple years. Gas prices have. The price of parking has more than quadrupled.

The parking meters outside of my old job used to be 25 cents per hour. Now they're 25 cents for 15 minutes. Parking at the train station used to be free, then it was $1.00 for the day, now it's up to $4.00. If you park and don't pay, it's a 45$ ticket.

I think the best bet would be to just give up tech and go homeless. Life would be so much simpler and cheaper.

Re:Region codes

[Doomstalk]

From Engadget:

"With the codec and video expertise of our favorite geek friend, Craig, we tried to convert a video into MPEG-4 format with a 480x272 resolution, which is the native resolution of the PSP LCD. A 480x272 video file should be of higher quality than a stretched 320x240 pixel picture, but unfortunately, all of our attempts failed, no matter what we tried. We would always end up with Incompatible Data or Corrupted Data displayed on our PSP, though it played perfectly on a Windows box."

Re:Region codes

[steve_bryan]

A 480x272 video file should be of higher quality than a stretched 320x240 pixel picture...

It took me a while to find the converted video on my drive to which I referred in my previous post. Its actual resolution is only 368 x 208 so it doesn't include a pixel for each dot on the PSP display but it scales nicely to 480 x 272 and the data rate of 50 kB/s produces a nice smooth picture.

My 19 MB file plays for about 4 minutes and 24 seconds. So it would take a little over 220 MB for an entire episode. That means you could fit four episodes on a 1 Gig memory stick.

The picture does fail to blow nicely on a screen that is 1280 x 1024 (some of the detail is lost) but I can say from experience that on the 480 x 272 PSP screen it is very nice.

Re:Region codes

[Doomstalk]

My point holds true. The maximum supported resolution for non-UMD video is significantly lower than UMD video. It may look decent, but it's still likely an artificial limitation put on the system to encourage you to buy UMD movies.

Re:Region Codes

[BloodAngel_Au]

True, I forgot that even more important point about our Parrallel Importing Laws.

Apparently this is being harped about as the reason books & music (I belive, correct me if I'm wrong) need to launch world wide at the same time. Least its keep Aus from being last to get new books.

Re:Region codes

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, but those outrageous taxes that you pay provide you with such excellent socialized health care. You should be thankful that the government is taking care of you from cradle to grave - too much choice is a bad thing!

Re:Region codes

[steve_bryan]

Two points: I'm not convinced that a double blind comparison of UMD to non-UMD video would be easily decided in favor of UMD, second, I wouldn't assume deviousness (on the part of Sony) is the most likely explanation when incompetence is also a possibility. For instance, the absence of a web browser initially was just that it had not been finished. Maybe they'll improve their video import capability in newer firmware.

The main point I wanted to emphasize is that I got terrible results when I tried the various utility programs that proclaim they can automate the conversion of video for the PSP and rather impressive results when I did the conversions myself. So if someone owns a DVD and assumes he has to buy the corresponding UMD I want to suggest that conversion may be a useful option.

Re:Region codes

[Anonymous Coward]

Pink Floyd - Pulse, when the VHS tape was available, it was only $15. The audio cd is $29.

The video contains all of the same audio plus extras, plus get this... video!

Oddly enough, there is no official US version of Pulse on DVD.

Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Willeh]

Or some other type of fruit. First we have the whole dead pixel on psp debate, then the whole misunderstood OSX / linux debacle, then we get the crackdown of the grey import circuit in the UK, and now this? What gives, Sony? Don't you like money? Surely you don't give a flying fuck as to where people buy your overpriced, undermanufactured console and it's games? Also the price gouging you seem to do as evident in the summary i'm sure won't fly in the face of information and outcry on the internet and hopefully popular media will pick this up as well.

Keep doing this, sony and you will be publicly humiliated (again) and fewer people will buy your stuff. Hell, even Microsoft isn't that evil. Try to control the market in such an evil way, and it will always come back and bite you in the ass.

In summary: If Sony was an icecream flavor, they'd be pralines and dick.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Jeff DeMaagd]

In summary: If Sony was an icecream flavor, they'd be pralines and dick

It is comments like these that cause me to wonder if slashdotters have something against homosexuals, as if they were less than other people.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Anonymous Coward]

If Sony was an icecream flavor, they'd be pralines and dick.

It is a quote, modified of course, from Wayne's World. Don't get your knickers in a twist just because the guy isn't original.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Megane]

You forgot the part about the iTunes Music Store Japan/Australia debacle.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Anonymous Coward]

Hell, even Microsoft isn't that evil

Ummm... I know you're in the heat of the moment, but let's not say things we'll regret.

And please remember, Microsoft now has the monopoly on evil, so please do a little research before making such profoundly unresearched and unsupported statements.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[mac666er]

Amen to that MR Willeh.

I put a lot of value on design for the gadgets that I consume, hence I am a mac geek. However, a time came when I needed to run a Windows App and had to choose a laptop from the Wintel world.

From all the available options, the VAIOs were by far the most appealing ones, so I bought a GRX. The only problem? How awfully they are manufactured and supported, as I later unfortunately found out.

One day the thing just wouldn't recognize half of the RAM installed and sometimes it would freeze without any warning sign of any kind. When trying to find out what was wrong with it, I contacted SONY, and it showed me the finger. The official support site didn't mention anything and the help line guys told me that I needed to send in the laptop and pay a service fee at my expense just to see what was going on.

I later found out in here that the problem was indeed common (pins one to ten in the first memory socket were not soldered properly), that SONY knew about it for a long time, and still didn't EVEN put it in a website as a potential problem that could arise in a VAIO.

To this day (three and a half years after its release) SONY still hasn't aknowledged the faulty motherboard problem. Now, I really am not that picky as not to buy a product from a company that has had this kind of problem, because in the end, every company has had their fair share. But SONY has this strange corporate attitude.

Nice ideas, but... beats me. No wonder their shares have been tanking. I can tell you I will NOT buy a VAIO again and I wished there were some sort of AMAZON store for laptops with a similar "rating and comments" system where I could put this experience up.

If you are thinking of buying a VAIO... DON'T.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Anonymous Coward]

We do.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Anonymous Coward]

why is it that every time someone mentions the word "dick" someone thinks it has something to do with homosexuals.

maybe you should look at your own pre-tensions about sexuality if you're always looking for things like this...

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[swv3752]

Yeah, it is kinda sucky that the memory slots fail on the grx models. But as it is not a safety issue, they are not going to admit to it.

There is an easy work around, just use one slot. Also, there is no service fee to check out the notebook; there is a minimum fee to get the notebok repaired. If you are not willing to pay the aprox. $300, then don't bother sending it in. But, If it is more, than you can get it sent back at no charge.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Eccles]

Have you considered a class action lawsuit? Millions for you and the lawyers, $25 off coupons for the rest of the VIAO owners -- but at least Sony might get the message...

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[mrchaotica]

Sony's attitude towards problems with their products sucks, but that's not even the worst part. The real reason to hate Sony is their love for proprietary formats, DRM, and anticompetitive business tactics (as we see here).

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Anonymous Coward]

In summary: If Sony was an icecream flavor, they'd be pralines and dick.

He's the double threat! Funny AND true!

But no, really, sony. What the fuck are you thinking? It's bad when 50% of slashdot thinks they can be better upper management than you.

Seriously, PR people, Marketing people, Upper management... they should all be slashdotters. This way if they did something wrong, they'd read about it on slashdot and say "oh, shit, disregard that I suck cocks"

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why is it that none of you people actually get the reference that the poster was making? Try googling for "pralines and dick".

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[pete6677]

Sony is running on fumes. That is why their stock price has been shooting down. They make crap, sell it at a high price, and refuse to support it. This is all possible because the Sony name once stood for quality. I suspect they have licensed the name out to cheap third world manufacturers and allowed them to stamp it on poorly built garbage just because the name will increase sales. I along with many people will never buy another Sony product unless they drastically turn themselves around.

Re:Sony has officially gone bananas.

[Trejkaz]

It's comments like these that cause me to wonder if people have even seen Wayne's World.

Say that again?

[scovetta]

Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can permit the resale of the japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong no matter if on the local market or for export, it looks like this is planned to be one of the not the bright marketing ideas of the Sony HQ.

Sorry, I don't mean to be the grammar-police on Monday morning, but that's just plain terrible.

I'll translate:

Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can permit the resale of the Japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong (whether or not they are available for export), this seems to be a rather poor marketing idea coming from Sony's headquarters.

Re:Say that again?

[dreadz1]

Thanks for the translation. I had zero idea what the hell the original poster was trying to say. ~d

Re:Say that again?

[Anonymous Coward]

Shouldn't that 'permit' be 'prevent'?

Re:Say that again?

[PeeAitchPee]

Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can permit the resale of the japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong no matter if on the local market or for export, it looks like this is planned to be one of the not the bright marketing ideas of the Sony HQ.

The submitter clearly pulled this text straight from Lik-Sang's English website. Can you see that I am serious?!??

Re:Say that again?

[Threni]

I still don't understand. Why can't Sony permit the resale of one of it's own products? If the verb had been `forbid` perhaps it'd make more sense...

Re:Say that again?

[Anonymous Coward]

Permit, prevent, same difference. Oh wait.

Re:Say that again?

[Anonymous Coward]

Still wrong.

Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can prevent the resale of the Japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong (whether or not they are available for export), this seems to be a rather poor marketing idea coming from Sony's headquarters.

Re:Say that again?

[Anonymous Coward]

Jeez, the summary should have simply said "Sony's trying to stop Lik-Sang from exporting PSPs". That was the worst write-up I've ever seen on Slashdot. And that's saying a lot.

My Firefox isn't working...

[hedgehog2097]

It's not blocking the huge Lik-Sang advert on the front page of slashdot.

Is there a setting I missed?

Re:My Firefox isn't working...

[Ioldanach]

I'm afraid the firefox ad blocker can only block images and pop-up ads. In-line text ads are unaffected.

Re:My Firefox isn't working...

[H3g3m0n]

Although you can remove a specific table in a page with an extention called Remove It Perementaly http://rip.mozdev.org/

Re:My Firefox isn't working...

[grub]

Woo, nice extension. Thank you!

Re:My Firefox isn't working...

[Anonymous Coward]

Firefox also failed to block the ads for Major League Baseball, National Football League, etc. when I went to ESPN.com.

Oh wait, maybe I go to web sites expecting to read news about certain industries ...

Nevermind. Nothing that is remotely for profit should ever appear in my browser window.

Re:My Firefox isn't working...

[Anonymous Coward]

fuck yes! i've been praying for that extension!
you sir, are the shit. welcome to my friends list.

Re:My Firefox isn't working...

[Ioldanach]

Nope, just too subtle for the likes of you. Slashdot articles are posted as text, ad blockers tend to work against popups and images.

Re:My Firefox isn't working...

[Anonymous Coward]

Can one use that extension to block solely Roland Piquepaille submissions?

Re:My Firefox isn't working...

[Anonymous Coward]

De-Piquepaille Greasemonkey Script

English

[Anonymous Coward]

motherfucker, do you speak it?


(apparently not)

Does Lik-Sang have the resources to fight this?

[defile]

Nonsense lawsuits are only shown to be nonsense lawsuits after lots and lots of money is spent.

I have no idea how big Lik-Sang is, I just bought a GBA transfer cable from them awhile back once. For legitimate purposes, honest!

Re:Does Lik-Sang have the resources to fight this?

[Anonymous Coward]

That is, if you are in the US of A, where legal costs have skyrocketed compared to the rest of the world. I'm sure they have the resources, since they are in Hong Kong.

Re:Does Lik-Sang have the resources to fight this?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, and because basically lik-sang is facilitating wink-wink piracy, I encourage sony to pester them with lawsuits, even if nonsense.

Re:Does Lik-Sang have the resources to fight this?

[blueZhift]

Lik-Sang has been sued by just about all of the major console players over the years, so I'm guessing that they'll be able to handle this latest attack. Go browse their site, and you'll see that they definitely push the envelope with some of the products they sell.

Re:Does Lik-Sang have the resources to fight this?

[defile]

I purchased a GBA transfer cable so that I could develop a videogame using someone else's content. I developed a demo and sent it to the creator. The creator appeared not to like the idea. Since the product was dead, I released it to the general public, code only.

Does that sound like video game piracy to you?

Yes, in addition to booting an image over the cable (that's how multiplayer games work, in addition to my game demo), the GBA transfer cable allows you to copy ROMs onto blank cartridges. Some people could use that for illegal file copying purposes, but I don't think the amateur developer market needs to die because some people copy content illegally.

Console makers argue piracy, but these lawsuits are just as much about the manufacturer maintaining their ability to create artficial supply in the market.

Region Codes

[0olong]

IANAL but to me it seems like region codes are an obstruction of free trade. Why wouldn't any judicial or legislative body speak out against this?

Mod parent up

[The Hobo]

I couldn't decipher the summary properly until I read the parent's post

Re:Mod parent up

[scovetta]

Thanks dude! Next time I have mod points, I'll hook you up.

Constant Target

[ChrisF79]

Lik-Sang has been a constant target for legal issues in the past. I remember a couple of years ago they were selling lots of mod chips and other "hacks" for systems until Nintendo (I believe) put an end to that. I doubt this is the last time we'll read about a Lik-Sang lawsuit in the near future.

Re:Constant Target

[Fordiman]

Not a chance. Where d'you think I got my GBA Flash cart? I mean, while I have used it for "library" testing of commercial games (seriously... 24-hour use, I promise. Most GBA games only take that long to beat or fail to be interesting anyway...), it's also been my primary development outlet for the last year (kinda like programming for a 286 with VGA, only not as peppy, and with assembler that feels suspiciously like it's made entirely of round holes).

Re:Constant Target

[tepples]

[Programming for the Game Boy Advance is] kinda like programming for a 286 with VGA, only not as peppy

Then you must not be using tile mode or sprites. You can make a 2D engine decidedly peppy with the GBA's 2D acceleration hardware.

and with assembler that feels suspiciously like it's made entirely of round holes

What's so bad about ARM assembly language, especially compared to x86?

Re:Constant Target

[Anonymous Coward]

Good, because I never delete anything!

Re:Constant Target

[Yosho]

24-hour use, I promise

You do know that there's no such thing as this "24-hour" rule, right? ROM piraters made it up in an attempt to justify illegal ROM sites. In actuality, you've violated copyright law as soon as you've downloaded a ROM.

It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[PhotoBoy]

Since the shipping at Lik-Sang is free, the console is even cheaper to import than to buy it locally.

It is not cheaper to import to the UK. While the price at Lik-Sang for a PSP minus shipping is cheaper than what the UK PSP price will be, you will always get charged import tax plus. Customs seem to know Lik-Sang and they always slap on the import tax. Plus the courier e.g. UPS, DHL et al always put a surcharge on top of the tax because they pay the tax for you at customes and then demand a cheque when they arrive at your door.

So overall it comes out to be more expensive to import by about £20 or so. Still, if importing annoys Sony then I'm all for it, since I don't see why they should be allowed to dictate who can and cannot sell PSPs, it's just a monopoly.

Re:It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[rmccann]

Lik-Sang must have some kind of warehouse in Germany because I ordered a GBA SP from them (it was cheaper than getting my friend with her staff discount to buy it for me). It came from Germany and hence I was charged no tax.

Plus the courier e.g. UPS, DHL et al always put a surcharge on top of the tax because they pay the tax for you at customes and then demand a cheque when they arrive at your door.

This happend to me when ordering stuff from thinkgeek. The charge for paying the tax was the same as the tax. It's a huge scam.

Re:It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[freeduke]

But you can get the white ceramic PSP, that is not available in Europe.

PSP is just about fashion!

Anyway I will only buy a PSP from lik-sang when my SDs will fit in it.

Re:It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[KDR_11k]

Order via airmail (no shipping fees but slooooow). The tax and duty doesn't push the price above local retail prices. I've imported their 60$ games and ended up paying 55 Euros including tax and duty. Doing the calculations with the 16% tax and 3.5% duty I paid for importing last time I come out at 240 Euros for the PSP. Local price is 250. Of course, had you ordered it earlier you might have gotten it before the european launch but ordering now and using airmail would take longer than waiting for the local release.

Re:It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[KDR_11k]

They have a subsidiary, Lik-Sang Europe. They only stock the stuff you could buy 'round here anyway and all games are still shipped from Hongkong. The PSP isn't on their european list, either.

Re:It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[QJimbo]

Gah yeah I hate that import tax, I've had it on numourous items until I got smart to it *cough* But it feels like there is no escaping rip-off britain sometimes.

"Don't steal - the goverment hates competition"

Re:It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[Tony Hoyle]

I had a run in with lik sang over that.

I bought a GBA cartridge thing... the item was £100. Customs decided it was worth more than that added another £50 to it. UPS then decided it was worth some more and added another £50 'handling fee'.

UPS guy turns up at my door and demands £100 cash for this thing I've already paid for. I told him to fuck off, naturally...

Lik sang refused a refund *and* kept the item. They even sent a pissy email daring us to do anything about it... hardly professional.

Re:It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[Trejkaz]

At around that point, consumers should be within their legal right to punch the UPS arsehole in the face, then kick them in the nuts and take the package.

Re:It is not cheaper to import to the UK...

[rsmith-mac]

Keep in mind that while importing may bring the total cost up to MSRP for you, Sony is sure getting less than if you bought it from Sony Europe.

Fiction.

[Anonymous Coward]

"Since the shipping at Lik-Sang is free, the console is even cheaper to import than to buy it locally."

By the time you've added the UPS Handling Fees, VAT and import duty, it is NOT cheaper.

Re:Fiction.

[PhilHibbs]

There shouldn't be any import duty, but even with just VAT, it will come in at £184 as against the £179 expected launch price. £5 isn't that much for early bragging rights though.

Re:Fiction.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, but Sony want that money and they know that the British will pay it because theyve been price fucking "dry, without vasaline" for years now.

Re:Fiction.

[KDR_11k]

UPS handling fees? You don't get free shipping with UPS at all, the free shipping offer only applies to airmail.

Re:Fiction.

[Tony Hoyle]

Of course there'll be import duty.

On a £180 device it'll be around £50.

Re:Fiction.

[PhilHibbs]

I've never been charged import duty on stuff that I've ordered from abroad. Is our trading relationship with Hong Kong different from the U.S. in that respect?

Re:Fiction.

[Anonymous Coward]

import duty applies to items over a certain value. cheap items are not levied.

there are of course ways to get around such levys, like relocating your company to jersey...

Re:Fiction.

[cjb110]

I got my PSP from videogames.ca delivered to the uk with games for less than the offical launch price.

Agreed I was lucky and didn't get stung by customs, but even if I did the console price was still cheaper.

Global market

[jurt1235]

I thought companies want a global market and are pressing the G7/8 (depends on how you count) to help them in that. But when the market acts back in a global way by protesting against region codings, delayed movie releases (thus watching the copies from the internet), the same companies protest by using their legal means and shear size.

In short: Sony, stop acting like a little kid, just be global, dump region codings, dump price strategies and just sell you products for a fair price all over the globe.

Re:Global market

[Anonymous Coward]

They want access to the market. They want to be able to control what goes in and what it costs. They didn't mean evil consumers should be able import things themselves. That gives choice and competition which we all know is the work of satan.

Re:Global market

[KillShill]

they're not acting like a child, children don't have that amount of control and hubris.

they're acting like illegal monopolies.

why people continue to buy their shit is beyond me.

stop supporting these assholes with your money.

Adjusting for typo...

[Guppy06]

"Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can prohibit the resale of the japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong no matter if on the local market or for export,"

It is true, the sales themselves cannot be stopped. However, as UK importers have learned recently to their chagrin, you selling them can be stopped. All Sony has to do is claim that you are using their trademark on the term "PSP" without their permission, and you'll be forced to sell "popular black handheld video game unit from a major manufacturer of electronic devices," something that just doesn't get many hits in a search engine.

Re:Adjusting for typo...

[DigitalReverend]

Maybe JASC Software can get some money out of this. They've been using the term PSP (Paint Shop Pro) a lot longer than Sony.

Re:Adjusting for typo...

[Anonymous Coward]

Almost as long as idiots on slashdot have been parroting this same tired ass joke.

Re:Adjusting for typo...

[John Hasler]

That won't work in the US. If the object I am offering for sale says "Sony PSP" on it I can say so (not that they might not sue anyway, just for harrassment).

Greed

[CrashRoX]

Sony is being greedy over a few dollars. This company is buying and selling mass amounts of usits. Sony should be happy they are getting there wholesale rate, im sure it doesnt change that much from country to country, its all relative. The whole point of internet commerce is having the ability to find competitive prices and order from anywhere in the world.

Re:Greed

[CrashRoX]

Anonymous Coward you absolutly right... As a consumer I would really like to pay more for my products just because I feel bad that a company like sony doesnt already make enough. Maybe we should just do away with international trade and selling and keep all the money circulating within our own country. Yes it is "Sonys shit" and they can do what they like with it, but I would like to see them remove products from retail stores/resellers and see how well they do on there own. If the profit margin was going to be higher they would have done this a long time ago.

Re:Greed

[Anonymous Coward]

Once they sell those PSPs to Lik-Sang, then it should no longer be "their shit" and they can no longer "do whatever they want with it".

Oh, and nice going with telling the original poster to "grow up" and then acting like a total infantile jackass yourself.

Please Remember

[sesshomaru]

Every time you buy from Sony, God kills a kitten.

Please, think of the kittens.

Re:Please Remember

[sesshomaru]

Hmm, modded overrated?

Guess I just found a new sig!

Re:Please Remember

[KillShill]

actually that should read:

everytime you buy from sony, the RIAA and MPAA extend the copyright on kittens.

Re:Please Remember

[stonecypher]

Actually, that should read:

Every time you make a joke about corporate misbehavior, some tired hack with nothing worth saying will extend the RIAA and MPAA onto a joke about kittens.

Boo Sony

[nmaster64]

See, companies like Sony complain about people importing their products, but if they'd just bring their products to us quicker, this wouldn't happen. Can someone give me one good reason they couldn't launch the PSP in Europe at the same time they launched it in America? If companies can make it more of a priority to bring products to overseas markets quicker, or at all in many cases, than they are going to have to deal with the reality of importing as a consumer solution. For the record, I totally back Lik-Sang.com. They're where I import my Gamecube games from. Awesome site. Down with Sony!

Re:Boo Sony

[TobyWong]

I think initially they were worried they would not be able to produce enough PSPs to meet demand. After all they "soft launched" in north america due to uncertainty about how well it would be received.

Looking at how many titles have come out since launch and at the extremely immature state of the PSP firmware(nice "user-friendly" filesystem you got there sony), this thing was not ready for release anywhere. This is a device that is capable of some very impressive things but limped out of the gates with some pretty sorry software/firmware support.

For the record I actually imported my jap PSP back in january through lik sang but don't tell anyone... I don't want the sony enforcers showing up on my doorstep to beat me up.

Re:Boo Sony

[Anonymous Coward]

Because the US is a bigger market, so they didn't want to short the launch of a bigger market by splitting the launch between two continents. Not that hard to figure out.

Re:Boo Sony

[Anonymous Coward]

So maybe they could delay the launch in both markets until they had built enough units?

Re:Boo Sony

[cornface]

So maybe they could delay the launch in both markets until they had built enough units?

Yes, letting the company that has been utterly dominating the handheld market for the last 16 years gain an even bigger foothold with their new system would guarantee Sony's success!

Hooray for Sony!

Re:Boo Sony

[JazFresh]

> Can someone give me one good reason they couldn't launch the PSP in Europe at the same time they launched it in America?

Sure. Here's two.

- Localization for the 5 major European languages (English, French, Spanish, Italian and German), and support for any others (Dutch, Swedish, Finnish, Norweigan, Russian, etc, etc). Despite what you might think, these take time.
- Sony's couldn't manufacture PSPs fast enough to support all three markets at the same time.

Re:Boo Sony

[dodonpachi]

My japanese PSP has localization (language) for the most important european countries... even Spain ^_^ And even if it hasn't, I think SONY shouldn't have rough times doing a 200 phrase localization... OMG, we are talking about SONY. Come on. The other reason is stronger (production problems). But I have my doubts.

Re:Boo Sony

[nmaster64]

Do European game products support all 5 of those langauges? I wasn't aware that PAL covered all those. Considering Sony's clout and bank account, I find it hard to believe they couldn't push out some extra shipments if they REALLY wanted to.

Nooo...

[Anonymous Coward]

LikSang is so awesome...they are the same people who make those xbox controller to kbm adapters...someone won a tournament using one of those...I hope they make it through the lawsuit!

Who cares

[Turn-X Alphonse]

Couldn't careless what Sony say. I just bought a DS and it truely deserves to be called innovative. Keep your PSPs and whatever else. When you have a game as fun as Zoo Keeper is then maybe I'll look.

Untill then go back to pulling tricks like this and even the Sony fanboys will hate you

Re:Who cares

[Anonymous Coward]

I love my DS and I think it's innovative as hell, but I do hope that you don't go around using Zoo Keeper as an example of its level of innovation, seeing as how it's just Bejeweled in wolf's clothing (and lion's, and panda's, et al). There are many more games out there that really showcase the DS's innovation, like Meteos, Wario Ware: Touched, Yoshi Touch & Go, Kirby Canvas Curse, Elektroplankton, Polarium, etc etc.

Re:Who cares

[Anonymous Coward]

'Insightful'? Well, I guess there's no moderation option for 'predictable fanboy whining'... When will they learn that different people like different games?

Re:Who cares

[TX297]

Nintendogs.

Re:Who cares

[blackmonday]

What's this Zoo Keeper, you say? I'll have to go fire it up on the PSP GBA emulator!

Re:Who cares

[monopole]

Having both the PSP and a DS I agree completely. In particular I've got a Play Yan (imported via Lik-Sang), an I actually prefer to use use the DS for video playback, particularly w/ the firmware upgrade. While the screen is smaller, the DS is compact, much more rugged, and has a fantastic battery life. The Play Yan takes dirt cheap SD cards , and uses a very efficent MP4 compression (with the new firmware) which allows me to store 5+ hours of video on a single 1 GB card. On the other hand the PSP is more expensive (while the play yan jacks up the price of the total package, you make out on the cost of the SD cards) far more fragile, and 1 GB of MS Duo costs more than a DS! Finally, even if I did break down and buy a 1GB Memory Stick I wouldn't have the battery life to watch the contents.
The PSP is a Jaguar overpriced, flashy, and not too practical, the DS is a VW, a little cramped but cheap, reliable and has great gas mileage.

Re:Who cares

[iainl]

And then realise that Bejewelled ripoffs play like absolute shite without a stylus, naturally. Neither the DS nor the PSP are any use for playing the other's games, as the PSP doesn't have a stylus and the DS is a generation behind with 3D graphics.

Re:Who cares

[Turn-X Alphonse]

Didn't say it was innovative, I said it was fun. Kids still find tag fun.. but it's not innovative is it?

Re:Who cares

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't know where you're shopping, but it's not difficult at all to find 1GB MS Duo cards for $90. Last time I checked, that's quite a bit cheaper than a DS, but arguably about twice the price of some SD 1GB cards. That's my one complaint with this platform: The horrible flash media choice.

Other than that, I really enjoy my PSP, especially Lumines and Wipeout Pure. Combine that with the fact that I've got NES, SNES, SCUMM, and MAME emulators on there, and I've got one solid portable console.

But seriously: Drop the battery life complaint. If I can play my PSP as much as I want on a trans-atlantic flight, and still have battery life for the 2 hour shuttle ride home, that's plenty of power. If 5-6 hours of playtime on a portable console is not enough for you, then you gotta find better ways to occupy your time ;)

Re:Who cares

[evilviper]

The PSP is a Jaguar overpriced, flashy, and not too practical,

A Jaguar, huh? I thought those disappeared years ago. I didn't think they were very flashy, either.

</sarcasm>

Srashdot speak Engrish good!

[syntaxglitch]

The grammar of unexpected tells a tale to reader of mystery !

More of a problem for Sony

[aliquis]

Regarding regions and when it will be released here in Europe, I don't see the trouble for Lik-Sang. Sonys own fault...

Lik-Sang FTW.

s/permit/prevent

[Lifewish]

is the only way to read it that makes any sense to me. They're *trying* to prevent it, why would they want to permit it?

In conclusion, never rely solely on Babelfish when trying to write something in a foreign language.

get that beam outta your own eye, bud!

[Thud457]

Seems like you're the one inferring that pralines and dick ice-cream is a bad thing.

I bet you've never even tried it!

Playstation Portable?

[lightspawn]

Not so portable any more, is it?

Free trade

[pieterh]

It's charmingly naive to believe that juidicial or legislative bodies are concerned with free trade. Mainly, they represent power interests and as such the laws created by and for those interests. "Free trade" comes onto the agenda when there is an advantage to be gained: mainly, in access to a market otherwise protected by anti-import legislation.

As another poster in this thread pointed out, free trade is rarely done out of principle, not even by institutions such as the WTO that claim this as their reason for existence.

Thus, the USA can subsidise its own cotton farmers to the point where countries like Niger cannot sell their cotton on the world market for a fair price. That's ok. But when Airbus get cheap loans from governments, that's not ok.

"Free trade" is excellent in theory and nice when it actually happens, but don't imagine it's the top priority for many people except economists.

Your games are region-protected because as a consumer, you don't actually have any rights except to spend / not spend your money. If you don't like companies that rip you off, don't buy their products.

See Tesco Levi case

[makomk]

It's the same trick as Levi used to stop Tesco (a supermarket) selling imported Levi jeans at low prices in the UK. Lev i won, so it's likely Sony are going to get their way too (though IANAL).

Re:See Tesco Levi case

[iapetus]

The big difference in the two cases, of course, is that Tesco was importing the jeans into the UK for resale (which the Trade Marks Act of 1994 makes illegal without the consent of the trademark holder) and Lik Sang is not - individuals are importing the systems from Lik Sang who are based in Hong Kong. IANAL either, but that's a very significant difference, and as far as I'm aware individual consumers are perfectly entitled to import whatever they want.

Re:See Tesco Levi case

[splint3r]

That's about right, yes. See I know because I know that we pay import tax for having things like this shipped.

Fact or Opinion or Advertisement?

[loyukfai]

Hong Kong's largest exporter of videogames and videogaming gear...

That's a bold claim you know...?

Re:Fact or Opinion or Advertisement?

[^_^x]

Very much so, but can you find a larger one? I'd say he was right...

No Sympathy

[Renraku]

I feel no sympathy for any company that creates artifical scarcity using anything similar to region-codes.

Leave it to them to decide not to bring a game to the US and then complain whenever people from the US import it from Japan or Europe, saying that we're making them lose money.

We're buying their product. At a higher price than normal. And WE get bitched at?! Why should I have to wait a year or more for a game if I can read Japanese and want to play it when it comes out in Japan?

Why should I have to import a DVD player if I move to Japan or Europe? Oh, I know. So that they can make more money by locking out entire continents.

In retrospect, I still have no sympathy. And I'm actually surprised that the US doesn't have 5 region codes.

Re:No Sympathy

[KillShill]

i'm surprised you still hold them in high esteem.

if you go to your local brick and mortar and decided to buy a high priced high margin item and the owner told you to fuck off.... you'd be back the next day to give more money to the store?

how about WAKE THE FUCK UP!!

I won't be buying one imported or not (Free Fiona!

[zmower]

because of Sony musics refusal to release Fiona Apple's Extraordinary Machine. I've created a pledge at pledgebank so like-minded people can join me.

Simple:

[Arkan]

Don't buy it. Show Sony that they're doing the wrong thing when suing right and left when people try to give them money. Tell them with the only thing they understand: money. Or the lack of, actually.

--
Arkan

Re:Simple:

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, that'd be the wrong thing to do.

Buy it from Lik-Sang, get it fast, and parade it in front of as many friends/relatives/contacts as you possibly can. Then tell them it's been out in Japan since '04, in the States since May, and you silly Europeans can sit up, waggle your tails, and quietly wait till Sony EU throws you a bone.

Every PSP sold through Lik-Sang will NOT show up on Sony Europe's results sheet, it will be on Sony Asia's.

A Problem of Sony's own creation?

[Mark Gillespie]

Surely Sony created this problem, by delaying the EU launch of the PSP. If they had launched earlier then the problem would not exist. There obviously ARE PSP's surplus, as Lik-Sang can get ahold of plentiful supplies. Hopefully the judge of this case will see the obvious..

Thank you!

[Boogaroo]

For crying out loud why do people NOT understand what you just said? They see it in writing and they believe anything. They try to rationalize their desire for free things with their knowledge that they're infringing copyrights.

I had a friend who just got back from Japan after spending two years there. He enjoys anime and his PSP which is Japanese. He can't use any American UMD movies and he's a little pissed about that. He puts anime he downloads onto Memory Sticks. He said to me, "As long as it's not released in the US, it's legal." Of course, it isn't.

It's ethical IMHO, but not legal.

Brilliant!

[uhlume]

Since it's highly doubtful that Sony can permit the resale of the japanese PSP consoles in Hong Kong no matter if on the local market or for export, it looks like this is planned to be one of the not the bright marketing ideas of the Sony HQ.

Allow me to be the first to congratulate the article submitter on his clever literary device: the writeup itself reads like a poorly-translated Japanese video game. Highly apropos!

Re:Brilliant!

[stonecypher]

But Lord Fountleroy, affectations whence and once put upon do nothing but to reinforce one's demeanor and bearing with the riff and the raff; why, ask anyone - even Count Bonguledorf, that blathering buffoon - all one need exercise is the lexicon the proletariat excise, and one should promptly be the fluff in the pompadour's pomp!

What, did you train at the Montgomery Burns school of tact? Or, do you think introducing words you learned from manpages makes you like sophistimacated?

I suppose there's also the problem of..

[LJ666]

.. warranty? What if your Japanese PSP blows up while your sat at home in London?

They got lik-SPANKED

[Anonymous Coward]

That'll teach em to be asian!

Remember Sony's Restaurant?

[awksedfred]

That always stuck in my mind. I think it was back in the 80s. I haven't bought anything Sony since that little law suit.

Re:Remember Sony's Restaurant?

[sesshomaru]

Here are the details of Sony Florendo's restaurant vs. Sony electronics.

Just another example of Sony wallowing in their own crapulence.

Real issue is pricing (and profits)

[Yi Ding]

The real issue here is money. Why is Sony suing Lik-Sang? It's because Japanese PSPs are much cheaper than American or European PSPs (if they've even come out in Europe) while being practically the exact same product.

Sony sells the Japanese PSP for 20790 Yen after tax in Japan which is equivalent to 186.11 dollars (source Google). Sony sells the US PSP for 249.99 before tax. This means that Lik-Sang makes 63.88 dollars on each PSP they sell minus shipping if they bought these PSPs at retail.

Obviously, this means that Sony is only getting 186.11 dollars (subtract some for wholesale) instead of 249.99 dollars (subtract some for wholesale) for each PSP. No wonder Sony is unhappy, but really its their own fault for pricing the PSP so differently in two different markets.

Trademark violation ?

[Builder]

What I don't get is that Sony are going after these people on the basis of trademark violation. With both the Lik-sang case and the other 2 local cases in the UK (which they won), they have based their case on the fact that the retailer is violating their trademark by advertising the product and displaying images of it.

If that is the case, why aren't they going after Game, Dixons and HMV, all of which have adverts prominently displayed in their stores advertising the PSP with images ?

Why can they use their trademark to shut down people that they don't like, but allow other people to carry on ?

Re:Trademark violation ?

[iapetus]

It's an explicit provision in the Trademarks Act of 1994. You aren't allowed to import goods into the UK without the permission of the UK trademark holder. This doesn't apply to goods imported within the EU, as I understand it, but certainly would for items originating in Japan. It's entirely up to Sony who they give permission to.

As I've said elsewhere on this topic, I don't see how this applies to Lik Sang, who aren't importing goods into the UK, but are exporting them from Hong Kong, where they claim this is perfectly legal.

Re:I won't be buying one imported or not (Free Fio

[stonecypher]

Ascii doesn't allow me to snore loudly enough to get my point across.

Why sony are doing this

[Builder]

Sony screwed up their UK launch BADLY. People were psyched about it coming out here in March, and that didn't happen. As a result, almost everyone I know who wants a PSP has got one, either by ordering from Lik-sang or a local retailer who Sony recently sued out of business.

Sony have lost the wow factor for the launch. Instead of the mass stampede down to the shops that they need, not just for UK sales figures but also for marketting / mindshare purposes, they're going to get significantly fewer sales. This means less press, less hype, less of an edge against the DS which has been out here for ages.

I've not been on the tube in weeks without seeing someone playing with their PSP. Everyone I know, even the non-geeks, have already seen and handled a PSP. So when it launches here, instead of being OH WOW AWESOME, it's going to be more like Ah, finally, I can buy games from Amazon.co.uk.

Codec

[Anonymous Coward]

Another point to be made is that nobody's thusfar compared apples to apples. A newer firmware (1.5.2?) adds support for H.264 video, which is what is used by UMD discs.

MPEG4 is nice, but H.264 is nicer. There's a trade-off, of course -- H.264 is hellaciously computationally expensive and takes forever to encode. But is it possible playback of H.264-encoded video files will look more appealing than MPEG4? Sure.

In the UK

[Anonymous Coward]

Japan 186.11 dollars
US 250 dollars

180 British pounds = 320.83200 U.S. dollars

A 72% markup and very late to boot!

We are being raped!

Re:I won't be buying one imported or not (Free Fio

[zmower]

Next time you've worked hard on something for over a year, think you've done a really good job and produced something fresh and innovative, please come and see me so that I can leave it on my shelf for a year and a half and then make you go back and do it again, only this time with an eye on the money.

Sony of Europe

[Anonymous Coward]

Everyone is talking about SONY as if it was one entity, when infact there are 3 separate entities here, Sony of Japan, Sony of America and Sony of Europe. (SCEJ SCEA SCEE?)
The only people who are complaining at the moment are SoE because of whatever issues they had (NTSC vs PAL isnt a factor in this, no idea why it was so belated) but honestly, its their own fault, what did they expect us to do hang around for 6 months eagerly? and buy the OFFICIAL launch product?
Australia is strangly part of Europe too, and considering the proximity of HK to Au its even worse. SoA and SoJ are just sitting back laughing at SoE fumbling again and again, there were even ps2 titles which were US only releases? whats the deal there american english is too hard to translate??!!?
Never going to buy local unless I am 100% certain I can play import titles via chip or otherwise