Slashdot Mirror
Indian State Encourages Microsoft Removal
cultrhetor writes "The New York Times reports that the communist government in the Indian state of Kerala is trying to remove Microsoft from its public institutions, as part of a campaign against monopolistic corporations. From the article: 'schools and public offices across the state are being encouraged to install free software systems instead of purchasing Microsoft's Windows programs. "It is well-known that Microsoft wants to have a monopoly in the field of computer technology. Naturally, being a democratic and progressive government, we want to encourage the spread of free software," M. A. Baby, the state's education minister, said by telephone.' The government is not banning Microsoft, but it is actively encouraging all 12,500 public schools in the state to install Linux."
Kerala is a communist state - they like to tell their citizens what products they can and cannot use (like the recent ridiculous coke and pepsi ban.) This is nothing to be proud of.
Linky.
Revenge is sweet but we should be careful as to not let any one linux company become the next microsoft.
"Remember, when downloading free software, you're downloading communism."
Antti S. Brax - Old school - http://www.iki.fi/asb/
I always get those places mixed up!
or not ...
http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/08/26/ 1732257
Hostes alienigieni me abduxerunt. Qui annus est?
I installed Debian Etch a couple weeks back and was impressed with the progress it has made in installability. Good luck to Keralans with their Linux adventure!
I want M.A. Baby back, Baby back, Baby back, I want M.A. Baby back, Baby back, Baby back...
Doesn't every company want a monopoly?
This was posted last week here: http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/08/26/ 1732257
Any fool can criticise, condemn, and complain, and most fools do. - Benjamin Franklin
I just hope they suggest a particular Linux distro and version to their schools, or they will end up with a dozen variants of Linux all needing different versions of downloaded apps, different config tools, and what not.
I will stop short at suggesting which distro they should choose (and might just avoid being modded troll).
Damn commies! damn slashdot for taking this long to give us some really commies to complain about!
Actually I guess this is gonig to be fun watching people's head spin.. open source good, microsoft bad, but hang on, is communist open source good or bad? Actually Kerala is governed through a parliamentary system of representative democracy, they chose their current political leaders, no totalitarian dictators here. They just prefer communist representatives... Sounds like it's not all a bed of roses but it's in pretty good shape for an Indian state by the accounts I've come across (and a damn nice place to visit as a tourist according to several of my friends).
Isn't a communist country/nation calling someone out for trying to be a monopoly kinda...hypocritical?
In communist Kerala... Linux installs you
sorry, had to be done
...in being the only force defending the free market against monopolisation. Just like in Europe, with the software patents.
Trust me, I work for the government.
If he's successful, Microsoft will be singin' the blues: "Since M.A. Baby left me..."
Why is it that if it's a communist state doing something it's bad and when it's not it's good. It's seems that the wording in the description highlights that it's a communist state that removes it, and not a democratic one. When the real point is that and Indian state is trying to remove it...
It's true that usually so-called "Communist" governments are actually single-party dictatorships, but as strange as it sounds, the communist government of Kerala was actually democratically elected* and it can be removed at the next elections. Kerala is not USSR or North Korea.
India is not a perfect democracy, but it wouldn't tolerate any of its states becoming an outright single-party dictatorship.
(* It must be noted that this piece of knowledge comes from Wikipedia, so you don't have to trust it.)
But what about the CAD tools for electronics(etc) if the dump M$ out? Are there any comprehensive and easy to use tools in Linux ?
Of course, everybody ignores the fact that these communist were busy running MS. IOW, they are no different than anybody else, except now, they appear to want to run a balanced budget and look to the future. I wish that some of the west's politicians would start considering budgets and futures.
and the earlier party to rule was Congress, a non commie one. They just did not implement it... "The Left Democratic Front government targets implementing an earlier government order that was issued during the previous United Democratic Front regime. The decision was taken in 2004 to push open source systems, but this was not actively followed. Initially, schools were given the option to choose whether teachers were to be trained in Linux systems or Microsoft. The option has now narrowed down to migration." Quoted from the article.. http://www.financialexpress.com/fe_full_story.php? content_id=138464
Yes, this is a dupe. Still, there was a bit of new and interesting information:
In a written statement, Microsoft's public sector head in India, Rohit Kumar, said the company had tried to keep its prices low to make them accessible to schools, selling one version of Windows for between $25 and $30 per computer.
This would be the 'crippled' version, I presume. Still, it does show how afraid Microsoft are of Linux adoption. Of course, they could do a great job of defending their monopoly by just giving away a 'crippled' version of windows for free (as in beer). I predict that they will eventually do this; in fact, they already are, in a sense: allowing people to run known pirated copies of Windows - which is exactly what WGA does - is to, in effect, give Windows away for free.
Yes, it's very important to make sure that we throw in the word "communist" because that puts the whole article in perspective. Just saying "the Indian state of Kerala" would have horribly skewered the story.
Pretty blatant attempt at negative association. It's so fucking obvious, it's embarrasing.
This must just a giant communist trap made by the NSA to find and locate all those damn pinko's. Makes sense. I bet they got a back door coded in the software to phone home about what you do with it. Damn you opensource. Now if only we could get the code to make sure it does what it says. But that will never happen.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Go baby go.
The real piece of news is that it's a "communist state" that did it. Therefore it belongs in the "politics" section AND it's way better for good flamefests and revenue-generating ads ! Currently it's night in the U.S. (where people have been taught to loathe communism since the cold war), but wait for America waking up and you will see ;)
I have discovered a truly marvelous proof of killer sig, which this margin is too narrow to contain.
Lets encourage all schools to not teach with Microsoft products... THat way, when you graduate - you won't be prepared for the workforce, where most companies do use microsoft. They are selling their kids futures for a politically motivated stunt! (all they really want is 5 minutes of slashdot fame)
Jesus Saves
I just seen to many windows kids loose it completly when they are put to work with a non-windows computer. Or even DOS. Or an older windows version. Or indeed any computer that is not a 100% copy of their home system.
Wich would you consider the best tech class. One that has a dozen different model and brands of say welders or a class that has just a dozen of 1 model by 1 supplier. I know wich class will produce the better welder.
I actually had a guy complain that our forklift's work differently then the one he was trained on and he couldn't work with it. The problem was that the button to choose direction was on the joystick NOT a handle underneath the steering wheel. Our small one has two seperate pedals for doing back and forth. Wich you need to know because if you don;t and you think you are slamming on the brake you can be in for a suprise. Not as much as the person walking behind the forklift but still.
I seen to many kids come into the workforce trained on standarized equipment and me having to spent then a lot of time retraining them to get used to workplaces were not only is the equipment different but often where every single piece of equipment is off a different model. I for one have rarely seen a company with more then 1 forklift of the same model.
Teach kids how to deal with computers, not how to work with OS X (no not the apple one) version Y, configuration Z. The latter group will have great scores but fail in the workplace.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
If you understand the general principles, how difficult is it to pick up MS, or Apple products? I haven't used MS Office for decades but I could sit down and be productive with it in about 30 seconds flat. The same is true of an MS Office user sitting down in front of OpenOffice or AbiWord. Most software which performs a similar task actually tends to use similar concepts, look and work in a similar manner.
Deleted
the communist government in the Indian state of Kerala
In fact, this decision has nothing to do with the specific government being communist or not, and I welcome this decision, although I have nothing to do with India whatsoever. But, as wonderful western objective journalism rules expect, how nice it is to insert that word in there so as to inflate a latent (or not) hostility right in the beginning towards whatever might come in the following text. Instead of just saying Kerala's state government decided to encourage this and that. These days, I've just become really sensitive to slight (or not so slight) political overtones.
I am putting myself to the fullest possible use, which is all I can think that any conscious entity can ever hope to do.
Why is it that if it's a communist state doing something it's bad and when it's not it's good.
Kerala has also banned Coke & Pepsi.
And they didn't ban other Indian drinks which had the same problems.
Well I guess there is nothing more to say there, Microsoft is officially seen by India as Satan's hell spawn. When God's Own Country chooses the people follow!
http://www.gods-own-country.info/
Anyone against Microsoft must be a communist.
How can a country attack the same company that hires their civilians over Americans? Or at least employ individuals that speak a dialect of English that I can understand for their customer support.
Maybe now they'll start hiring someone that customers can understand and not waste 60 minutes just deciphering their code. But what is likely to happen is that they'll start hiring from some other country that horribly rapes the English language.
Videogames made me kill people...I also eat mushrooms to grow bigger.
...MAKE them come to their own conclusion? I mean, if you assign no money to buy software but FORBID under DRACONIAN measures use of pirated software and MANDATE that they must equip a number of computers, what else really they CAN do but download and install free software? Then they could boast around about their lawfull antipiracy policy instead of beeing accused of beeing anti-business.
communism allies with OSS. Capitalism is pro-MS.
???
LET THE FLAMING BEGIN!
That's an unfortunate step backwards for that country.
"open source good, microsoft bad, but hang on, is communist open source good or bad?"
Slashdot logic FAQ #73:
Two wrongs cancel each other to make a right.
FAQ #73 History:
First articulated in the new testemant as "an eye for an eye", disputed by Gandhi who was ironically assasinated.
FAQ #73 Proof:
Communist - MS => OSS : therefore : Wrong - Wrong => Right.
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
Yikes, so not only are we talked an elected communist government, but one actually willing to implement policy set by the previous one?
* Goes and sits in a corner waiting for the universe to fold in on itself.
People replying to my sig annoy me. That's why I change it all the time.
Microsoft Software on State machines because Microsoft is a monopoly? What do they call the communist party in a Communist Government? MS should fit right in with their "effeciency" of government by brooking no diversion from the party line. Heh, that is interesting.
How fitting, the word in immage happens to be "commune" for me to submit this!
"the Communist government in India's southern state of Kerala "
It is a democrtically elected coalition government in Kerala, led by a Communist party. And communism has no bearing on the discussion.
"The Education Ministry has an annual budget of 40 million rupees, or $1.86 million, to promote computer technology among the one million students"
One US dollar is about 45 Indian rupees or thereabouts. So, 40 million rupees would be less than a million dollars.
"Financial, rather than ideological, reasons may be at the root of the state's decision to promote free software."
Again, not true. People in Kerala have been using computers since the mid '80s actually. The VSSC (Vikram Sarabhai Space Centre) in Trivandrum, the capital of Kerala has lots of Sun graphic workstations supplied by Wipro in the late '80s. Many public sector undertakings, banks and the Railways have been users of Unix based systems for decades now. Many companies in India have realised that it's a total waste of time, money and effort to invest in Microsoft, Oracle and Cisco equipment and their closed-source zero-innovation ideologies for their computing needs.
The Indian branch of the Free Software Foundation is located in Kerala, again because of the high literacy rates, and the forward-thinking, proud and practical people of Kerala. Even if Windows Vista is released free for all the students in Kerala, they would not be inclined to waste their time.
If you keep throwing chairs, one day you'll break windows....
I've been swashdotted -- Elmer Fudd
I wish that some of the west's politicians would start considering budgets and futures.
They do consider the future. But to them the future stops at the next election.
Excessive forking causes un-wanted children.
They could offer free spelling lessons with each download.
How many beans make five, anyhow ?
it seems kerala Govt did not evaluate thier need for software, they just joined anti M$ camp to be in the news. linux is free but not support, they can not ask Redhat/Suse to freely support ultimatly they have to pay. linux is good for developement and can handle good load (if it is used as server). now how kerala govt is going to use linux in schools, it has bloated office suite and average user feel difficult to use. --mad
That's nothing, consider this headline from reuters yesterday, I'm left wondering what Hizbollah really wants:
"Annan urges quick end to Israel, Hizbollah disputes"
- These characters were randomly selected.
A communist government, which is a monopoly of it's own right, not giving people a chance to choose based on practices of which itself is guilty. The irony never stops.
I am so shocked that no chair jokes are made yet...
. o O ( TwO hEaDs ArE mOrE tHaN oNe... )
Yea you also mean like you have to use products tht contain technology that recognizes
the broadcast flag?
Got Code?
And if people choose Microsoft, that's their business.
All any government should do is making sure people are free to make their own choices and that no one company is able to limit their choices.
What?
Communism != totalitarianism.
The 'communist' label has been appropriated by many dictators, as has the 'socialist' label (see: 1930s Europe), and the 'democratic' label (see: post-colonial Africa).
I'm not familiar enough with the area in question to know whether or not the communist party there is truly communist or not, but please don't equate communism with totalitarianism.
"Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
It is one thing to be for cheap/free alternatives, but to be against something strictly because its goal is to control as much market share as possible is quite different. It is everybody's goal to be #1; Microsoft just happens to hold the place due to good timing, marketing, and a long time without viable alternatives. Encouraging free software is certainly a noble thing, but rejecting one specific brand commercial software outright is akin to mudslinging.
I'll be your candy shop of infinite deliciousity if you'll be my discotheque of endless rump-shaking.
Istead of just saying Kerala's state government decided to encourage this and that.
Uhhh, maybe that's because being "encouraged" by a democratic based government has an entirely different historical (read:fact based) context than being "encouraged" by a communist one. See: Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Vladimir Lenin, Mao Tse-tung, etc.
Why does it matter if it's a communist state or not. What does that have to do with any other part of the story. What, are we back in the Red Scare again? The communist country of China says X. The communist country of North Korea says Y. The middle-aged white man of Texas says who gives a sh*t whether they're communist or dairy workers. This has nothing to do with the story of getting rid of microsoft. Just leave the word out if it doesn't matter, K?
I'd be willing to bet Ballmer makes a surprise visit to the region and shortly thereafter they announce they've changed their mind about the whole thing.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
Chill out, parent. The submitter just likes to add a little spice in his posts, figuratively speaking. To stir, figuratively speaking. Hey, that works well for Digg, right? With half of the posts continaing the word "amazing"^h^h^h^h^h^h^h"AMAZING".
The dogma of modern capitalism is if you want to win you have to cry out loud: "Pick me, choose me!!!!". Yet the most astounding successes of modern days are brought by the products and strategies that disregard this dogma in favor of solid content. Take, well, Google, for example. Its enormous success of the past was accumulated due to their 100% user (vs market) oriented interface.
The best consumer products I have got in the last 10 years in US went out of the market pretty quickly. They were simple, very inexpensive tools that eased my life immensely. They were phased out by monstrous common denominator catering heavily shamelessly marketed trash that will break exactly to the time of the next "improvement". Is that what we want?
There is a good reason to keep a balance between capitalism and socialism in the system. Of course, that balance is not needed and dangerous of course when your goal is to achieve the world dominance in less than 8 years.
I admit, the post is slightly OFF topic, but, heck, so was the "communist" remark in the original post.
I do not believe in karma. "Funny"=-6. Do good and forbid evil. Yours, Oft-Offtopic Flamebaiting Troll.
As already pointed out, the Kerala government is a democracy, with the ruling party being a communist one. Communism is a social ideology, and it is not = to dictatorship or despotism. And it has nothing to do with stalinistic totalitarian governments. In many democracies around the world there are communist parties that participate in the democratic process, are elected and rule in parliaments and local councils. The bias towards the Red Scare of gosh-golly eeevil communist dictatorships is a common american thing. Welcome to the real world, get over it.
shana
"It is well-known that Microsoft wants to have a monopoly in the field of computer technology. Naturally, being a democratic and progressive government, we want to encourage the spread of free software," M. A. Baby
M. A. Baby ????
Am I the only one that who thought the person's name sounded too comical for the story?
I totally agree with you that 'communist' has been appropriated by many dictators. As you note dictators tend to adopt whatever is fashionable and acceptable for the time, including 'democratic'. Probably a lot of nasty small places will use terminology acceptable to the US government in the next few years seeing as the USA is the dominant world power (while still carrying out terrible human rights abuses).
:-)
I think the politicians in Kerala are pretty solid about their communist beliefs, but you need to dig into this to get their exact positions on various issues, politics is like flavours of linux eh, lots of subtlety and the most passionate debates are about aspects of their positions that outsiders really don't care about...
Equally I think we agree being communist doesn't preclude one from being involved in democratic politics, there's a history of communist participation in parliamentary democracies. I was just having a little fun with the slashdot stereotype of right wing readers
Im confused as to how this degenerated into a cola war - TFA's point was about Linux. Or GNU/Linux if you really want. No it probably wont be a problem if different schools/libraries/whatever use different linux distros - theres more than enough common, and you know most of them will go in with gnome or kde so they will look basically the same. The hardware shouldn't be a problem since a lot of it will be pretty old.
/. but I can mail them) and poster rm999 (yes yes I know hes already been modded flamebait but I'm going to chomp)....
Also NYT (yes they are not reading
I'm sick of the communist bogeyman. You can mod me flamebait right now if you like but I'm going to make a point. The CPI are a communist party in that they support communist ideals but yes India is a democracy with universal sufferage even (since 1950 and you might argue it was a lot more universal than African Americans were getting in Alabama at the same time). Whether or not they actually live up to communist ideals is another story. But not a different story than a democracy that lives up to democratic ideals by wiretapping its citizens. Sure theres some pandering to the voters by bashing multi-national companies like Pepsi or Coke. Funny I thought that happens here around election time when someone gets us and announces incentives to American farming companies say. The EU certainly thinks so.
Yes the article was probably being biased by mentioning "communist" in the title but these guys aren't communist in the same way as Stalin's USSR or North Korea or *shudder* the PRC, which is quickly becoming the latest "bloc." I'm not an apologist for any of the human rights violations in those countries but please realize that any time you mention communist it does not imply human rights violations. I'll soon have to be yelling this about Islamic states too. Studying current events instead of getting your information from FOX news and actually reading some history makes it much harder to stereotype systems of government. The worst the current communists can do in Kerala are massive unannounced strikes and rallies. Its great intending to drive somewhere and getting stuck in one - you will be there a while. The noise about Pepsi and Coke will go away soon either after election time (or some money greases someones hands). Lets not point fingers so easily shall we... theres a good chap.
Theres actually a whole bunch of communist parties in the US that are not defunct though we all know in a real democracy we have only two viable parties.
disclaimer: not communist just very liberal
Reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled.
And for many of them it will.
Censorship is telling a man he can't have a steak just because a baby can't chew it. --Mark Twain
Let's put this stright. If company/service/whatever A is big and company/service/whatever B is small, and one thinks this difference to be "unjust", thus asking the government to help, the said "injustice" doesn't go away, because then you end up having company/service/whatever B plus Gov. as the big guy, and the original company/service/whatever A Alone as the small one.
Actually, anything that gets the status plus Gov. will always, without exception, be bigger and more powerful than anything what hasn't this status. So, either you give up in thinking that the difference in size is by itself unjust, or you'll have an unsolvable problem in hand. Why? Because you'll then have to start making decisions on HOW MUCH of the plug Gov. status you have to add to each and every company/service/whatever so that A plus X% Gov. perfectly balances out B plus Y% Gov., both perfectly balancing out C plus Z% Gov., and so on and so forth, with X%, Y%, Z% etc. having to be constantly (almost in real time really) reevaluated and redistributed. After all, neither A, nor B, nor C etc. are static and unchangeable.
And that's not to mention the problems arising from new players entering the market and old players leaving it, or the even worse problems arising from external governments also backing their global companies/services/whatevers to counter-compensate the local governments backing of their local companies/services/whatevers...
Conservatism: (n.) love of the existing evils. Liberalism: (n.) desire to substitute new evils for the existing ones.
m a baby. Get it? M a baby.. oh forget it.
Only thing is, he is not a she...
Nothing new there. Again, I'm pretty stuck on post-colonial Africa (where we propped up the 'democratic' regime of Mugabe for decades, and continue to do the like) -- I just finished reading The Fate of Africa by Martin Meredith. Illuminating and disturbing.
"Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
The "for coke pepsi" brigade says there is pestiside in local water too. So why single them out. Well many times while travelling I have not taken local water because of impurity dangers. Now if I am paying money to drink something, I expect it to be free of pesticides. There is nothing new in this issue, its over a year old and keeps shuffling from one dept to other.
My Aurora : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o91ZsGwJYyg
FB : https://www.facebook.com/TanveersPhotography
"as part of a campaign against monopolistic corporations"
hmm..are they going to stop servicing monopolistic corporations too? Since many citizens work at call centers that support these corporations, I don't see this as very effective.
Except Linux isn't a company, so they're not supporting one company over another (they're not even supporting - they're recommending). Linux is an open source operating system that can be supported and modified by any company or group of people. India has a lot of underemployed skilled technical people, having them support and modify Linux distros for Indian schools and companies is much better for India than those companies and schools sending their money to another country.
"What is Internet Explorer 7? Are you saying we can't access the normal internet?" - I love tech support. Really.
It was interesting the spin that CNBC put on this story:
"A communist government in India has banned Microsoft from government computers." The gal's voice was just dripping with sarcasm and hatred.
It's a normal, exciting event when a Christian Democrat or Republican-controlled state or city government starts calling Novel/SuSE and Red Hat, but when communist does it, it really changes the way the media in the US reacts. Btw, they might have been a little mode sedate and professional when interviewing an exec from Red Hat later in the show. Didn't catch the interview.
> "The New York Times reports that the communist government in the
>Indian state of Kerala is trying to remove Microsoft from its public institutions
Ummm, India:
1. Isn't doing so well with their own economic models. For a minister to pretend he's suddenly concerned is beyond belief.
2. India is home to massive governmental-guaranteed (i.e. government-owned) monopolies in hundreds of major industries. If India's primary software were provided by a government-owned company, and had a greater market share than MS, with more quality and security problems, this buffoon rail against privatization with every fiber of his being.
Oh, the temerity of politicians.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
> And exactly why is being a communist bad?
A hundred years ago you could have been excused for speaking something so horrific on the grounds that the jury was still out. History has now rendered its verdict. All of the fad philosophies of the late 19th and early 20th century were fatally flawed. It wasn't just that there were implemented poorly, the wrong people were in charge, the revolution wasn't hijacked. Communism, Socialism, National Socialism, Fascism, all were similar far more than they differed. All were based on the idea that an annoited 'wise' few were capable to and therefore would make all of the decisions and use the power of the modern nationstate to enforce their edicts at gunpoint. All four resulted in millions of corpses in mass graves each and every time any people anywhere tried to implement them. No, shut the fuck up you idiots in the back row, EVERY TIME.
> It is just another idea that tries to create a perfect world.
And gave us Adolph Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Valdimir Lenin, Chairman Mao, Pol Pot, Fidel Castro.... need I continue? NO admirable figures headed up a communist state or similar state. The weakened version, socialism, has left Europe an enfeebled ghost of its former self and is on course to lead to the total loss of Western Civilization. Fascism and National Socialism proved so virulent it required WWII to purge it and even today just speaking their names causes all right thinking people to shudder in memory of the horrors.
> a) tell other people what's good and what's not good (tell as in force them to...)
But isn't that the core idea that underlies all four philosiphical systems you seem to admire? That a small elite, (wise and educated beyond the mere mortals they rule over) will make all decisions, for the people's 'own good.' So why is it good when a cabal of communists decide what is best for the people but so totally wrong when Western corporations try to export market proven products.
Hey, I agree with installing the penguin over spanding scarce export dollars, but lets be clear about these guys motivations, k?
Democrat delenda est
Yep, darn nice place. Not just saying it because I'm from there :)
I know I posted it before, but still makes a good read:
Kerala Enigma
Kerala Model
I remember how quickly things have changed in Kerala over the past few years. It is a good environment for open source to take root. I graduated High School in 1999 (in Oman) and before moving to the US to start college, I spent four months in Kerala - the longest I've ever spent. Back then to get access to the internet, you had to go to Ernakulam, which is about a hour-long car drive from my hometown. When my sister went to India in 2002, there was an Internet Cafe 15 minutes from our house. Broadband too. It only took three years. When I went there in 2004, there were even more internet cafes, and when I went back there again in May there were Internet Cafes all OVER the place - most people are well-versed with the internet and just computers in general. Another thing that you can find in Kerala is computer institutes - all over the place. Billboards advertising training in C/C++/Java/Webdesign etc. etc. Kerala already has a good presence in Open Source (Malayalam Open Source Software, More Malayalam Open Source). A lot of this might be due to the fact that Kerala is the most literate state in India, and also one of the most politically aware. A Malayalee's day starts with a look at the morning newspaper. Also because of the cost-benefits in general, and the fact that Kerala has a penchant for communism, open source will find a good environment to thrive. Monopolies... maybe not so much. Finally, the bulk of the microsoft software is pirated, and with all the validation stuff Microsoft has for their software, it would be easier to make the switch to open source. Then there is also the fact that recently Microsoft conducted a sort of raid in Kerala to look for illegal copies of Microsoft software.
Of course, all this might go down the drain due to the fact that even the most well-intentioned ideas can be disrupted by the notorious hartals (strikes).
Vivin Suresh Paliath
http://vivin.net
I like
I find it amusing when someone (a state, person, business), says, "We hate Microsoft because they're a monopoly, so I'm going to use other products!! Stickin' it to the MAN. Oh Yeaaaah!!" The irony is that the ability to use other products disproves that MS is a monopoly.
How can a state claim that they're fighting against a monopoly by using other products? That a state *can* move entirely to other products proves that there is no monopoly to begin with.
How about using other products because they're "better" (more value for the buck, better support, etc) rather than for some political agenda? If the non-MS software is "better", then great, use it on that basis. But if the MS products are actually "better", but not being used for the sake of a political agenda, then this state is screwing over its citizens by making them take part in the anti-MS jihad that most of them likely couldn't care less about.
-- "I never gave these stories much credence." - HAL 9000
Communisim is bad because it goes against human nature, and therefore is doomed to failure in the long run. Therefore, in order to maintain a communist system, one must eventually use force.
But that's typical of most, if not all, utopian philsophies. You set out to establish a utopia, an ideal system, a man-made paradise where all is good and evil is vanquished. But next thing you know, you find yourself enforcing that utopia at the point of a gun, or are refusing people to leave the utopia after they've become disenchanted. Fortunately, most utopias remain small (cults) so they harm only to the small number of people that were misfortunate enough to join them. Communists, on the other hand, tried to impose their utopia on vast numbers of people, to great harm. It's no accident that during the Cold War, Eastern European countries had much worse living conditions than their Western counterparts, and many Eastern Europeans tried to make it to the West to better their lives, while hardly any Westerners tried to go to the Eastern Bloc. I remember when the Berlin Wall came down, the Eastern Berliners were shocked at how well stocked the Western Berlin stores were with goods.
Taking this discussion to the main topic, this article is simply another example of Communist government trying to impose a utopia on the citizens.
-- "I never gave these stories much credence." - HAL 9000
Isn't it interesting that the "reporter" called the government of India's southern state of Kerala: "Communist".
:) )
Hmm - India has a democratic government, perhaps better or worse than our own. (The USA) but not a communist government.
Hmm.. Is it perhaps possible that AMELIA GENTLEMAN, of the International Herald Tribune has his own agenda?
I think so. Its shameful to see this kind of obviously biased reporting get into the New York Times.
Amelia seems upset that the indian government banned Coke and Pesi recently, but Reuters news service says :
"In a report published earlier this month, environmental group The Centre for Science and Environment (CSE) said it found traces of pesticides far above permissible levels in the products of the two global beverage companies."
Whats interesting about that? Many schools here in the US are banning Coke and Pepsi too, because the stuffs unhealthy and contributes to the 30% rise in America obesity levels. I guess they're all communists too.
Another interesting note. According to the article MS sells windows in to schools in India for between $25 and $30 per computer. The Indian ministry of education as 1.86 million dollars to spend on computer technology for 1 million children. Yup, Thats $1.86 per kid. Hey MS ? Can you get that price a down a bit more? You know, like $0? Hmm.. if the OLPC hits its price point ($100) They can buy 180 thousand laptops. Thats almost 1 for every five kids. Maybe the gates foundation has spare money they can help out on this with. For a mere 8.14 million additional they can get an OLPC laptop for the rest of those kids! (yeah, I know, the OLPC isn't down t0 $100 yet. Using $100 makes the math easy...
I believe the Canadian city of Winnipeg had a communist mayor for a long time. I had the choice of voting for the communist party in our last national election (it was REALLY tempting -- talk about a protest vote).
Communist doesn't really imply totalitarian. In fact, it's kind of odd that the original communist revolutions decided it was necessary to initially have a totalitarian state (which was supposed to be disbanded eventually).
Communisim is bad because it goes against human nature, and therefore is doomed to failure in the long run.
I strongly disagree. Communism works and has worked for as long as human history can record it. It is not against human nature for multiple people to cooperate for the benefit of all of them.
Therefore, in order to maintain a communist system, one must eventually use force.
This is also untrue. One example of communism is the nuclear family. Several people pool their resources and share a home, food, chores, etc. If one wants to leave, there is no reason they need to be forced to stay.
But that's typical of most, if not all, utopian philsophies. You set out to establish a utopia, an ideal system, a man-made paradise where all is good and evil is vanquished. But next thing you know, you find yourself enforcing that utopia at the point of a gun, or are refusing people to leave the utopia after they've become disenchanted.
You're making a fatal misjudgment. "Utopian philosophies" don't fail. Extremism fails. Every economy in the world is a blend of capitalism, communism, and socialism. Trying to eradicate any of these is an extreme and is what results in horrific failure, historically.
Fortunately, most utopias remain small (cults) so they harm only to the small number of people that were misfortunate enough to join them. Communists, on the other hand, tried to impose their utopia on vast numbers of people, to great harm.
There is nothing harmful about communism and nothing about it that implies it has to impose itself on large numbers of people. Communes have existed for thousands of years and are still chugging along just fine. The problem with communism, is that it becomes less and less effective the larger the communist cell grows. Moreover, since it necessarily concentrates decision making, it is more prone to authoritarian abuse than competitive systems.
The real discussion is the proper balance of communism, capitalism, and socialism within a given society. Communist cells compete in a capitalist economy against one another and everyone gives some to help those in need. In the US right now, we don't have socialized health care or drug treatment. We don't have progressive inheritance taxes. Our communist cells are mostly family units, although we also have some tightly knit communities in the form of communes, monasteries, and co-ops. The cell size is shrinking as more and more families become single parent affairs and as extended families spread out and break up.
If you look at the quality of living around the world, it suggests the US has too little socialism, and probably too small of communist cells for optimal efficiency.
Taking this discussion to the main topic, this article is simply another example of Communist government trying to impose a utopia on the citizens.
Ummm, how do you figure? These are people with communist leanings, but not working within a communist cell at all. They are a capitalist economy as much as the US is. Communism has absolutely no bearing on this decision at all. Also, they're not imposing anything. They suggested, but did not order the socialized education system to move away from a company that is a monopoly and which removes the advantages of capitalism, they wish to enjoy. To summarize, this was a bunch of people with communist leanings, directing the socialized part of their economy, to move towards more capitalism. A real capitalist would be overjoyed to hear it.
I find it absolutely amazing that, 17 years after the fall of the Berlin Wall, the word "communist" still constitutes an effective slur in arguments involving US citizens and organizations. Wake up and smell the coffee - Kerala's political leanings are not an issue here: lots of us with very un-Communist political leanings are quite in sympathy with its decision to distance itself from MS' monopolistic practices.
Unlimited growth == Cancer.
This is the same state that banned sale of Coca Cola?
Because we all know Communists are againt monopolies!
My math is a little off today.
OK, so "Democratic and progressive" = "free software".
Err... OK...
Well, let me back up a little and try again:
"Democratic and progressive" = "Antimonopolistic" = "free software".
Err... eh, yeah.
One more try:
"Democratic and progressive" = "Antimonopolistic" = "Anti Microsoft" = "free software".
Err... Well, better... but still...
Maybe its me, but it seems that being Anti-Monopolistic doesn't necessarily mean that you are Anti-Profit, so the leap to "free software" has got me a little confused. I mean, it's not like they're saying their switching to Macs, right? This would be in keeping with their Anti-Monopolistic thing right?
Sounds to me like they just want free stuff.
Not that there's anything wrong with that, I'm just saying, the leaps needed clarification. Or maybe they didn't. I dunno. Meh.
What's even worse is that they are depriving themselves of all that WONDERFUL tech support.... At least the Indians would stand a chance of UNDERSTANDING them now.
The government of a Communist state, which is a democracy... Wait a minute, which is which. Can they both be true?