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Visa Cuts Off AllOfMp3.com
denebian devil writes "On the heals of allofmp3.com's press conference trying to clean up its image, Visa has suspended its credit card service to allofmp3.com. From the article "[Allofmp3 is] no longer permitted to accept Visa cards," said Simon Barker, a Visa International spokesman. "The action we've taken is in line with legislation passed in Russia and international copyright law."
Almost simultaneously, allofmp3.com has announced that it is shifting over to an ad-supported model. For those who don't want to (or can't) buy allofmp3's DRM-free music, they are providing DRM-laden music that can be played only within a restricted player provided by the website."
...there's Mastercard.
So, to recap, it seems that media in Russia is still somewhat regarded as belonging to the people. However, this is not true in many other countries.
I cannot say I blame them with the gustapo **AA about.
My work here is dung.
For those who don't want to (or can't) buy allofmp3's DRM-free music, they are providing DRM-laden music that can be played only within a restricted player provided by the website." ... that anybody can promply record/reencode DRM-free.
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
Powerful friends and in powerful places... MPAA in Bed with VISA...
Not to worry.
I never had any issues with paying for my music. I had issues with the DRM that was applied to that music. AllofMP3 offered that same music without DRM. If they turn out to be illegal (because the group they pay royalties to turns out not to have to license the music to AllOfMP3) then so be it.
I found an alternative, that better suits my taste of music and is completely legit, but a lot more expensive.
http://www.beatport.com/
Dave
* groan *
My inner grammar Nazi is involuntarily goose-stepping after reading that.
Dark Reflection
My heels hurt from reading that summary. I hope they heal soon.
Change your name to Homer Junior! Your friends can call you Hoju
Dead? At the very worst, it's now a free iTunes, and think about how many people pay $1/song to Apple.
Could allofmp3.com route such purchases through paypal?
I realize it probably would not work but it is a posibility.
Procrastinating life a way at a rapid rate of speed.
Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned
No one wants DRM music. That was a primary reason everyone used AllofMP3.com. That and the price of course. Now instead of AllofMP3 customers paying a small fee for music, I bet a lof of them will hit Shareaza and the file share networks again.
Great move RIAA...
Take care,
Brian
wow. just yesterday (seriously) I went back to that site to buy some more music. I had a small balance and added more funds to it. I noticed that visa WAS removed. was this an adblock thing? check firefox - nope. was it a javascript thing (checks my setting; nope, not that either). the visa pulldown just wasn't there anymore! I had a credit card that I used for stuff like this and I couldn't use it. I had to search for a MC card that I don't use anymore but is still valid.
I was able to update my payment and d/l my chosen music. but there was NO explanation as to why this removal of 1 of the 2 major card types was done!
if this is really the end of this site (sigh!) then I suppose I should get as much as I can now while the gettin' is still good.
that site was golden, to me. MY choice of encoding, MY choice of format and bitrate, no US mafia in the way of me buying what I want to buy.
sigh.
this is not good. that was the one place I could still go to buy properly tagged encoded DRM free music. if that site goes, my music buying will 100% end. 100%. I will ONLY download pirated versions, then. screw the industry. you are forcing us all to fight YOU, when you take such strong handed tactics against your own buying base.
screw you riaa and mpaa. I will never be buying a 'shiny cd' or dvd in a store. let the boycotts begin! (like kids today really need my permission to begin the boycott, ha!).
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
Looks like you can point your browser back to Mother Russia at Alltunes.com and be back in business pretty quick (incl. payment with Visa).
Because, of course, people can now carry a laptop with a Wi-Fi connection instead of an iPod. It may be free, but it's stuck in your browser. How is that better than iTunes+iPod?
Steve Jobs was right with the 0.99$/track pricing. Unless you're a huge music consumer (and I do use consumer in the real sense, i.e. fast-food never-stop-eating-even-though-it's-crap sense), paying 0.99$ is less trouble than trying to find a good encode of a song you want, not to mention the morons who normalize their tunes before encoding and uploading on P2P networks, the bad metadata, the start/end song clipping, the badly scanned and/or low-res artwork (if any), etc.
the bribery check was good.
The simple truth is that interstellar distances will not fit into the human imagination
- Douglas Adams
*sigh*
Oh well, it was fun while it lasted
Sound of P2P application starting up
Summation 2
I may be in the minority here, but I do not own an iPod...nor do I buy music online. In fact, this entire DRM movement (and associated legal wrangling) have soured me to purchasing music of any sort.
I have a pile of MP3s ripped from CDs that I currently own, but find that I no longer even purchase CDs. I was formerly a HUGE fan of taking my music on the go...and am quite a tech gadget guy...but the RIAA and DRM in general have driven me away. I find that I just listen to the radio more now. Perhaps I am in the minority. I not only do not feel compelled to buy an iPod, their popularity and supposed status turns me off. I have an old SanDisk MP3 player that takes AAA batteries that I use in the gym...and it is often tuned to an FM station.
This intellectual property fight and the corresponding limitations imposed on hardware for audio and video (crippled HDTV anyone?) have motivated me to spend my discretionary dollars elsewhere. My apologies to U2 and Metallica. They'll just have to settle for one less solid gold toilet.
Why is it dead? If you want to continue to use VISA, go to XROST, buy a XROST-giftcertificate, which you then redeem at allofmp3.com .
I just tried with my maestro card and that was declined too.
-- MartinG To mail me: echo kewyjlcxyzvjfxbqwh | tr bcefhjklqvwxyz
I'll just stick to sending them envelopes of cash like I've always done!
Now I'm going to have to all the way to Russia with cash and bring back a suitecase full of MP3s. As long as I can get past the MP3-sniffing dogs at La Guardia, I should be OK.
Where were you when the voynix came?
FWIW, remember that allofmp3.com claims to be "broadcasting" music on demand over the Internet, under the broadcast laws in Russia. Allofmp3.com pays its royalties based on those broadcast rules. This is similar to how ASCAP, BMI, and SESAC work with broadcast radio stations in this country; the royalties are sent to an agency which distributes the proceeds directly to the artists. The RIAA and others are claiming that allofmp3.com is duplicating and distributing recordings without paying for the rights to do so. Depending on how Russian law on broadcast rights is worded, allofmp3.com may be perfectly legitimate.
Sometimes I worry that I'll develop Alzheimer's disease, but no one will notice.
Can you elaborate?
I saw the XROST option on there a while ago, but I don't know anything about it or how it works.
Also, I recall at one point there was an option to use some type of "online currency" that was sold in the U.K. at gas stations and retail stores, meaning that you could buy them with cash, and then you went to a web site and typed in the number on the card you bought, and could transfer the money to AllOfMp3.com -- that seems like a pretty good way of doing cash-transations on the web. Pity it's not available in the states. Is this the same thing as XROST?
I was thinking next time I went over to England, if they still existed, I'd buy some cards just to have around for stuff like that.
As more and more things get on the web, I think there's going to be a greater and greater demand for a way to accomplish anonymous financial transactions, to replace what's done in the real-world with cash. As of right now, I don't know of any way to do that, and I'm sure the governments of the world like it that way...but if there's a will, there's a way, and pirated music and gambling are a big "will."
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
Crack coming in 5...4...3...
On the heals of allofmp3.com's press conference trying to clean up its image, Visa has suspended its credit card service to allofmp3.com.
/. editors get paid and where do I apply?
So who's going to foot the bill now then ?
Seriously, what do
I didn't know it was hurt. It's good to know that they're doing better now. I suppose this is due to that vaunted Russian healthcare system, which is not only healing citizens who can afford to pay, but is now healing companies that are suffering persecution in the West.
I'm so glad this didn't come on the heels of some other bad news.
Interested in a Flash-based MAME front end? Visit mame.danzbb.com
However, I'd rather pay $12 (average for my CDs, some are cheaper than iTunes) for a CD than $10.99, and have a physical copy that isn't tied to a specific device, and is higher quality.
Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
Steve Jobs was right for people who make about double the national average income.
Not many people have $10,000 to fill up an ipod.
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
Then again, paying eMusic $0.25/track for high quality completely DRM free mp3's is even better. And as the majors dont release there, you're automatically saved the bother of making sure your money doesnt go to the fascists.
I am surprised that ICANN hasn't removed their DNS entry like they are about to do for spamhaus.com. I am sure they can be sued in the USA for copyright infringement.
When his defense asked, "Which computer has Jon Johansen trespassed upon?" the answer was: "His own."
allofmp3.com = Beautiful business model. If it is truly not legitimate, this should be a cue for a ligit company to start up stateside using a similar model. RIAA = Epitome of how an organization should not be run for 3 reasons. #1 is they screw over thier cash cows (the "artists"). #2 it screws over its buyers (us). #3 Thier suckyness is impacting the health of thier business, and will eventually, although it'll take a while and require alot of kicking and screaming, they will fail. Had they created a site like allofmp3.com in 1996 when I began using electronic copies of music...they could have saved themselves. iTunes sucks. Plain and simple. iTunes doesn't carry much of anything I listen to, its DRM is a pain in the balls, and $0.99 is too much to pay for a track with the fraction of the overhead of a record (conventional)store. That is all I have to say.
They have a new ad slogan:
"Mastercard, it is everywhere the law is gray."
It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
Once you bring your purchase into the US, US law applies. For instance, it might be perfectly legal to buy a fully automatic AK-47 in Russia (I suspect not, but it makes a simple example) , but importing such a weapon into the US would require jumping through numerous hoops. Indeed, unless you're a registered firearms collector or have the appropriate license, owning such a firearm would be against the law and you could expect the government to take action against you. The fact that you bought the item in Russia doesn't necessarily mean that Russian law applies.
I'm not a lawyer, but I believe that the AllOfMp3 site violates the spirit, if not the letter, of international copyright law. However, I agree that the law seems to say that distribution, not use, is the problem. That being the case, you're correct that the user isn't breaking the law. It's just a convenient way for AllOfMp3 to shift the blame: "We told them not to download music if they are in a country where this is illegal. We can't be responsible if US or EU users are downloading content that they shouldn't."
Interested in a Flash-based MAME front end? Visit mame.danzbb.com
I'd rather buy my CD's used online for about $4 shipped. I can wait till they drop to that price and by then I'm sure I'm not contributing to the RIAA's pockets.
Georgia Tech, the leader in Chia(tm) technology.
As of 11:00am eastern time in the US the only method of payment available to refill your blance is "credit card" or "gift certificate". Both are down with "sorry we cannot accept credit cards at this time" messages.
:(
I missed it, and I only have $4 left.
How are you suppoed to use XROST when the site has no way to redeem it at allofmp3?
JON
several multimedia corporations have recently signed an agreement stating that the only available form of payment in their soon-to-be-opened electronic music stores will be Visa credit cards.
Is it just me or do other people notice that /. is late by about a day or sometimes more in reporting news stories. In the case of this story, I read about it yesterday on the New York Times... There were other times when I would read something in the WSJ and see it on Slashdot two days later. Makes a feller question certain things..
--
http://unk1911.blogspost.com/
Absolutely, used media - CD, DVD - is the best way to go. You get the same thing ; re-use the original materials instead of creating waste ; and trade with other individuals (transferring ownership of goods) without going back and paying the marketers (RIAA, MPAA)
beaver pelts will they take Canadian Tire money?
Hee Hee The drinking bird does all the work!
>Once you bring your purchase into the US, US law applies.
Yes, but please tell what specific law you have in mind, there really is none.
>The fact that you bought the item in Russia doesn't necessarily
>mean that Russian law applies.
The purchase is done under Russian law if done in Russia. That is allofmp3's responsability. If a person then wants to use what they buy there to break the law in another country is that persons responsability. In the case in question, there is no such law violation though since it is perfectly legal to brgin a copy of a song or music into USA from other countries.
>I'm not a lawyer, but I believe that the AllOfMp3 site violates
>the spirit, if not the letter, of international copyright law.
What spirit? Are you claiming that there is a spirit that says any product with a work protected by copyright can not be moved from one country to another? I suppose someone should tell that to all the stores on international airports selling music CDs. For the record, no, there is no such restriction or anything at all about such restrictions in copyright laws, treaties or that like.
>That being the case, you're correct that the user isn't breaking the law. It's just a
>convenient way for AllOfMp3 to shift the blame:
So allofmp3 is not breaking the law and the buyer is not breaking the law, who is and what law?
>We can't be responsible if US or EU users are downloading content that they shouldn't.
What do you mean "shouldn't"? Either there is some law making it illegal or there is not. It happens to exist no such law.
Actually proper firearms are very much restricted in Russia. Often, guards are reduced to using gas-guns to get over the issues with getting a hand-gun permit. The guards you see with hand-guns are usually moonlighting security-forces/military. Unfortunately, there is a very active black market in weapons so theoretically banned weapons such as automatics are easy to obtain there. I can't see a black market weapon's dealer taking anything other than dollars, cash.
See my journal, I write things there
Visa IS a non-profit company.
What right does Visa have to make this decision?
Actually that really depends on the laws of Russia. In the US AllOfMP3 might well be able to sue and demand service... but then again possibly not, I'm not sure there are laws that compell you to deliver service outside of things like anti-discrimination acts.
It will be interesting to see what Mastercard does.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
eMusic doesn't have the music that people want. Of course, what people wants depends on the marketing and airplay, but still. Saying that eMusic can replace the iTunes Store is like saying an Intellivision can replace a Wii.
I'd rather go get free music on overclockedremix.org than 0.25$/tracks on eMusic.
Very funny. Like everyone fills his iPod with tracks bought on-line. I had over 60 CDs when I bought my iPod, that filled it up at least half-way (preferred tracks, etc). OverClocked Remix filled pretty much the rest of it, with the exception of about 25 tracks bought online via the iTunes Store (which I would have never bought if I had to buy the whole CD for those single tracks).
Thanks for playing the "I''ll try to use the same 5-years old lame FUD about the iPod" game.
"The whole system is fucked, so people justify ripping off the corporation, which in turn rips off the artist (who is already being ripped off by the corporation). The future will be better for the artists"
Only possibly, only some of the time. What is a rip-off? The loss of something, right? Well, if someone downloads an MP3 from Allofmp3.com that they would otherwise never purchase otherwise (due to the price difference and high-quality DRM-free product that Allofmp3.com offers), then there is no loss to the corporation OR artist, and thus no rip-off. Such downloads are a significant percentage of music downloads, right?
Where were you when the voynix came?
Well, you're right for full albums. As an example, the last album I bought was Straight Outta Lynwood by "Weird Al" Yankovic. At 17$CAD for the CD+DVD (though I just watched the DVD and was a bit dissapointed that "White and Nerdy" wasn't on it even though it's in the TV ad), I paid more for it but can rip in the format and bitrate of my choice. AAC is one of the best CODEC right now, but who knows what will replace it in 5 or 10 years? MP3, for example, is about a decade old now.
But for single tracks the iTunes Store is great, especially for the "I want it now without even going out" impulse purchases. I bought about 25 tracks online and that "Weird Al" CD in two years. Without the iTunes Store it would only be that CD.
The artist (or whomever they have signed away their ownership rights to..) is the owner of the music. The whole system is fucked, so people justify ripping off the corporation, which in turn rips off the artist
If you, as a musician, are willing to do business with people who you admit are ripping you off right at the get-go, I have no sympathy for you. Give these goons fifteen bucks so you can get your dime? Not a chance in hell.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
Actually Visa is a consortium of banks and other financial institutions that, in the interest of enticing merchants to accept the card, issues cards that will be accepted by anyone that agrees to accept Visa as a form of payment. MasterCard functions in the same way as do the variety of debit networks (Star, Maestro (owned by MasterCard), MAC, Pulse, Shazam, Interlink, etc.)
Visa's structure is actually not unlike the MPAA or RIAA.
"You're everywhere. You're omnivorous."
Just curious...
Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
Because in Russia you don't own the right to music, the right to music own...
Wait a minute, that didn't work, when did the US have to start looking up to Russia as an example of freedom and capitolism?
"Support artists, not thieves"
Hmmmm? Where is there any theft in the Allofmp3's operations?
Where were you when the voynix came?
Hm, i can't see your problem. Do the following: 1. Go to xrost.biz . Register (it's free). Buy one of their certificates (called icard) with your Visa. 2. Note down the serial-number of the icard and the PIN of the icard. 3. Go to allofmp3.com and log into your account (or create a new one). 4. Click on "balance". Click on "refill balance". 5. Click on "Refill with XROST-ICARD" 6. Enter number and PIN from 2 7. PROFIT!!!!!
Oh Visa... like the credit card company. I read it as Vista, as in the next version of Windows... I was thinking, oh wow, who cares, big suprise, etc.
grep -iw skynet
"I read it as Vista, as in the next version of Windows"
Cue advert: "Vista. It's everywhere you want to be". Fade into still shot of Gates Borg.
Where were you when the voynix came?
A couple months ago it was VISA only, MC not accepted. Now MC works but VISA doesn't? Trouble in quasi-legal paradise.
I'll have to find a new source for my pre-paid "gift" cards. I've been ordering prepaid VISAs that allow online/catalog ordering for a small handling fee as I don't want to send my real CC data overseas. Worth a little peace of mind, IMO.
Hey that's great for you man. I just don't buy the iTUNE price as fair.
.33 for a song.
Likewise- multiple friends have lost the use of their iTUNES songs now based on machine changes.
I think a fair rate is more like
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
it's "on the heels", you nitwit.
Sacred cows make the best burgers.
Why is VISA enforcing laws?
"You're everywhere. You're omnivorous."
it's the horrible music that I can't stand!!!
I don't even have a car radio on my car, but when I'm using the wife's car, I tune to the news stations.
It's better to be the foot on the boot than the face on the pavement. ~~ tkx Kadin2048
Just be glad that Steve Jobs is fighting for us, or else the labels would already be at 2$/track (or more, especially for new songs). You may think 0.99$/track is unfair, but then again an audio CD at 25$ for 12 tracks isn't fair either.
You forgot to mention that the although the latter music option is DRM'ed and needs their own player - it is free. Gratis. Nado. Nothing. Zilch. Thats right, you pay nothing for the music.
Which suddenly makes it a lot more appealing.
Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
I'm curious to know the date of when your spam started (Mine started Sept. 26), and whether you used Chronopay (I started getting them a few days after using it). Otherwise, I had the account for quite some time before receiving any spam.
I understand that Visa may be listing soon which would end its non-profit status. MC is already a listed company.
See my journal, I write things there
Will they take e-gold?
(eheh don't temper with freedom)
\u262D = \u5350
False. Guns banned in California are readily available in Russia:
http://ron.dotson.net/guns/sb23-russia.htm
9/11 Eyewitnesses to Explosive WTC Demolition 1 of 2
So... VISA Is A Goddamn Recursive Algorithm?
Find environmentally and socially responsible products on http://buy-right.net
How is mom and pop consumer to know what retail websites are legit and which are supporting some illegal venture?
a store is a store is a store to joe consumer. and it was taking VISA and MC.
also, this site has not been proven to be illegitimate via the courts, right now it's he said, she said and global politics
Just saying something is illegal and submitting a lawsuit does not make it so
Contrary to a previous post, I just reloaded my Alltunes account via an XROST card, purchased via Click&Buy with my Visa debit. Throw a couple of $20's at Alltunes and your music acquisitions will be safe for a while, anyway.
Isn't their tagline "it's everywhere you want to be"...except what they think might be illegal, or wrong, or immoral....
If you want to make brand money as a cash replacement (which I assume is what their money cards are attempting to do), then you have to be a open carrier (allowing the end users to deal with the legal responsibility of their use of money). Once Visa picks and chooses what uses of their currency to allow, I have no way to know what the value of their currency is (because I don't know what I can do with it), and there's less point to using it over using cash (potential safety is helpful, but like a gift card, limitation in usage is a significant loss in value).
By announcing this loudly, they're telling their cash card holders that what they're holding isn't really cash, though Visa wishes to sell it as such. Maybe Visa's users will get the message.
According to MSNBC alltunes was shut off Oct 1 already by Visa; they are not that stupid, yet. (And no, mastercard does not work either).
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15323093/
Quality Hosting e3 Servers
> You can reset the list of allowed computers in your iTunes account. There's absolutely no good valid reason that your friends "lost" their iTunes-bought songs. They should contact Apple if they need help with this.
Really? I switched from OS X to OpenBSD, and now my iTunes music doesn't work. Can I have iTunes for OpenBSD/PPC, please?
My other car is first.
It is the issuers who have it.
VISA network is used to validate and propgate any Hot Card files: that is all. All banks: StanChart, Bank Am upload their daily Hot Card lists to VISA network which is then propagated by VISA to all its millions of partners.
It is like asking an individual McDonalds to give a list of convicted child rapists who ordered Big Mac. Max Mac can give is number of Big Macs ordered.
"Doing what i can, with what i have." ~ Burt Gummer
Please share with us the laws which make allofmp3.com illegal.
Thankyou
What I would really like to know, is if there are any Real Artists (TM) now reading slashdot, if you could please state how much of your royalties you get from allofmp3.com and how much from, say, itunes? (I hope for you that you get royalties for your music).
To be, or not to be: isn't that quite logical, Slashdot Beta?
I don't know if you're trolling, but you certainly knew iTunes wasn't available for OpenBSD. You should've burned your tracks to an audio CD before removing OS X and installing OpenBSD.
I'm against that idea.
Transporter_ii
Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy knowledge, religion destroys spirituality
I can't find links to the free DRM-enabled downloads, only to the regular pay-downloads. A little help here?
Laws do not persuade just because they threaten. --Seneca
An AK-47 isn't legal in the U.S. Digital music is legal in the U.S., despite RIAA's attempts to limit the channels through which they feel you should be allowed to purchase it through. No one is going to label you a felon for having an MP3 file. This is such an overextreme and bad comparison.
The current loophole works around that situation. It's legal to buy it in this method in Russia, and it's legal to own it in the U.S. (ok, technically you're supposed to pay duty tarriffs when you import things you personally buy, but that's an aside, the act of owning it is legal). It's legal to purchase such things overseas and import them to the US for your own use. There is technically no legal block here for disallowing AllOfMP#, other then the legal block that RIAA wants your Congresspeople to believe, that anyone who has non-endorsed digital audio files must have stolen them, and therefore is a felon.
This space for rent. Call 1-800-STEAK4U
I think you miss the point with your analogy. The reason you can't import automatic firearms is because you also can't buy them here. Buying music from AllOfMp3 while in Russia is assumed to be legal, as would be buying music in a similar fashion from a US merchant. AllOfMp3's critics are claiming that importing it is illegal, although the purchase itself would be legal in this country. With firearms, you're being restricted from having something that you wouldn't be allowed to have anyway, but in this case you're importing something you could legally buy here anyway.
Everyone is born right-handed; only the greatest overcome it
I was wondering what M$ had done to keep people from going to AllOfMp3.com
When I have a kid, I want to put him in one of those strollers for twins and then run around the mall looking frantic.
What exactly would they sue allofmp3 Customers for??? The most they can do is demand that all files purchased from allofmp3.com be deleted. Unless they also have some kind of proof that the buyer has been copying the files to other people, there is no grounds for civil damage.
Where can you score one of those? It'd be the advantages of cash. Pretty sweet.
Laws do not persuade just because they threaten. --Seneca
there was a windows program 'all of mp3 explorer' which was a downloader for their service. I was running it and still am. it mostly works ok and shows you a set of 'meters' like the old kazaa did.
;( ;(
I wanted to see if there was a newer version since I'm getting some download errors (socket errors, windows errors, etc). nowhere on their site could I find a link to the current version or even an older one!
the one I have still mostly works but its very curious how the software is mentioned but not around anymore..
I may have to refill my balance a few more times and 'get while the gettin is still good'. I fear this service may be shut down shortly
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
AllofMP3.com is located in Russia you idiot. US laws don't apply to other countries.
You have to pay to have a Visa card?
Over here, we get them for free just by having a (free) bank checking account. The ATM/debit card doubles as a VISA card, and purchases are withdrawn directly from your checking account.
Would you be so kind as to explain how American copyright law specifically makes allofmp3.com, a company working entirely out of Russia, illegal?
Thankyou
I think you have to be consistent with the application of this mindset. If it's not ok for consumers to shop around for countries with the most convenient laws, then it should not be ok for companies to do the same thing. That means no more situating factories in countries where working hours and conditions would breach your own laws.
AllofMP3.com is located in Russia you idiot. US laws don't apply to other countries.
If Kiddie prOn were legal in Russia, you wouldn't have any problem with those in the US downloading it from Russia?
Just in case there's any doubt, I would.
Tag lost or not installed.
Did I say that american copyright law makes allofmp3.com illegal (I don't know the answer to that personally)? What is illegal is when you personally download a song from allofmp3.com.
I just find it amusing how everyone swarms on this issue. I make one little joke about the RIAA suing users of a service that people in the USA can't legally use, and everyone jumps on me. Downloading a song from allofmp3.com is no different than if you were downloading a song off kazaa (or whatever filesharing people use now) when the person uploading the song to you is located in russia. Just because something might be legal in another country does not make it legal here.
Phil
Is it just me or do other people notice that /. is late by about a day or sometimes more in reporting news stories. In the case of this story, I read about it yesterday on the New York Times...
It's just you.
Actually, Slashdot doesn't "report" stories, it (or those editor guys) just "approves" or "rejects" them.
Perhaps you've seen the link at the bottom of every Slashdot page named contribute story. You can write up your own short blurb about a story, include the link to the NYT webpage or wherever, and maybe the ed's will get around to approving it faster than if you wait a day or two for someone else to do it. I've submitted several stories over the years, and even had one or two approved (though that was over a year ago).
Tag lost or not installed.
Holy crap. I read that as Vista cuts off allofmp3.com! Dang Microsoft!
640YB ought to be enough for anybody.
So is this new DRMed music still available in lossless format? At least my burned CDs and mp3/m4a files I make from them can be created from a good quality source (compared to DRM AAC -> CDs).
I mesread as Vista too. What if MS started to block sites they didn't like? It'snot all that far-fetched.
I don't know if you said copyright law makes allofmp3.com illegal, but the anonymous reply to the question of how allofmp3.com is illegal was title 17, which is copyright law. I agree that downloading a song from allofmp2.com is similar to downloading one through Kazaa. You may note, however, that downloaders do not get sued for using Kazaa, uploaders do. Therefore, if I were to download a song from someone in Russia via Kazaa, RIAA suing precedence suggests there would be no legal consequence.
What I'm more interested in, is how you interpret copyright law to make the claim that downloading songs is illegal.
Just to reconfirm what you are saying, you can make your purchase in russia, and transport your goods to whereever you live. That is not illegal. You could break the law if your country forbids music to be stored in mp3 format, but i know of nowhere where this to be true. It could be like buying a sofa in china for a tenth of the cost it is here, then you bring it here. OMG THE SOFA INDUSTRY IS GOING TO GO BONKERS OVER IT :O
It's legal to buy it in this method in Russia, and it's legal to own it in the U.S.
That's great, but almost no one actually goes to Russia in order to buy it. Instead, they buy it while they're in the US. That the transaction is international doesn't put it under Russian law, it puts it simultaneously under both US and Russian law. Furthermore, copyright law prohibits making copies unlawfully in the US. Since copies are defined as material objects, and you're obviously not downloading actual, tangible hard drives over your connection, you aren't bringing copies (i.e. material objects) into the US. You're making copies in the US by putting the intangible work into material objects that are already here. This is illegal.
(Also it wouldn't be legal to import actual hard drives of music either since they're considered piratical copies under US law and thus their importation is considered infringing under 17 USC 602(b). They can be confiscated by Customs at the border, if they're on the ball enough to notice for a change. But this is neither here nor there.)
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
That comment is very insightful -- I wish I had mod points -- you desrve them but won't get them for bucking the mp3 party line. It's thought provoking too -- the notion that "downloading" isn't actually a transfer (like water through pipes) but merely a signal from one piece of hardware to a remote system that instructs the remote system to generate a copy. All the metaphors we use for the internet sort of break down against this reality that the copy is actually being made on the system "receiving" the data.
Sadly, people will continue to take risks and because they want to continue performing that risky activity, will go to great lengths to convince themselves they are safe.
What changed under Obama? Nothing Good
Your spin was pretty damn obvious.
Oh, it's not just a notion; courts have really said that downloading is infringing because copying necessarily occurs.
Sadly, people will continue to take risks and because they want to continue performing that risky activity, will go to great lengths to convince themselves they are safe.
Meh. If people want to engage in risky activity, that's fine, but they ought to have a clear idea as to the risks, rather than deluding themselves so as to have unfounded confidence.
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
In Soviet Russia, credit card cancels you!
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not entirely sure about the universe - Einstein
This is a Russian prediction of what Russians are planning to do some day in the future. In other words, it's never going to happen. There's never going to be a shift to ad support or a DRM laden player.
They would sue them for copyright infringement. And they would be able to have the files deleted, get a judgment for as much as $150,000 per work infringed (which could easily get up into the hundreds of millions for a typical downloader), and, with a bit of luck, get the defendant to have to pay the lawyer's fees and costs, and if they're very nasty (and a bit luckier still) get his computer equipment destroyed so that he can't use it that way again.
You should take a look through 17 USC 502-505. There's some fun stuff in there.
As for grounds for a civil action, that's 17 USC 501 and 106(1). Pretty open and shut, too, if you can identify the downloader.
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
As for downloading generally, I've been writing the same basic posts enough for one night. I'll just quote from the Utah Lighthouse case, which I find is very clear about the issues involved. It deals with web browsing, but there's no material difference between that and downloading material with a P2P app, or anything else, so far as we're concerned for this discussion.
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
I tried refilling my account several months ago and was declined on the payment. I'd used the same card earlier in the year with no problem. So it looked like this happened quietly a bit ago and it isn't until recently that they've decided to make their decision public.
"Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!"
....My first "In Soviet Russia". Don't think it works though.
And...
"In Soviet Russia, AllOfMp3.com cuts off Visa"
I am dismayed by the amount of support I've seen for allofmp3.com . It's disgusting that people will bitch and complain about paying for a legitimate copy of something, but nevertheless will pay cold hard cash to someone who gives absolutely nothing back to the artists. Sure the record companies rip off artists left and right, but at least they pay. I've downloaded mp3s before. I've used Napster. I know what IRC and bittorent are. (I guess thats a given being on slashdot). Hell I even can tell you the names of some prominent hacker groups, as if a google search couldn't reveal this information already. However, I have not once paid for stolen property. Why? Because its Fucking Stupid to pay anything for something that is illegal in the first place. You're flushing your money down the toilet, while your only return is something that could get you in trouble. I'm sorry but I like to get into trouble for free. So whine and bitch the allofmp3.com no longer takes your Visa cause you'er too dumb to find out how to get your illegal downloads for free. And tell an artist he's lucky that his band is getting blatently ripped off. And next week you can all donate to Pirate Bay.
Before, choosing a credit card was like: do you want Pepsi or Cola with that? Same practical result (you get some water into your body), different aestetic preference.
There actually is a good number of places that sell only one brand of carbonated drinks. But any place that does take a credit card I have seen up to now, always takes both Visa and MasterCard. I have sometimes been wondering what's the difference between the two if every place takes either.
And now, finally, I have a solid reason to choose between Visa and MasterCard, aesthetic preferences aside (e.g. which name sound better or what logo is prettier). Is this actually the only shop in the world that takes just one of the cards? Or am I unaware of other examples?
As it happens, I don't have to switch the card brand: I use a MasterCard.
17779 eligible voters in a district, 17779 'vote' as one. This is Russia.
Incorrect. The mentioned are foul and irrelevant. Jump the shark means that something is not finished yet, but shows a decline in quality. Like, for example, "Santa Barbara" tv-series.
:) In fact, I think this is the main idea behind the AllOfMP3.com.
Russian for "jump the shark" would be something about "second freshness" - there are a lot of jokes about it. Although I can't find the exact synonym for "jump the shark", it is only because my brain is busy with other things. Russian language definitely more rich than English and the only language it can compete with is Chinese.
However, there is another Russian saying, which can be translated as "For each artful ass a dick with a groove can be found". And this is quite relevant to situation with VISA
> I agree that downloading a song from allofmp2.com
> is similar to downloading one through Kazaa.
(Assuming you meant allofmp3) Rethinking after having written the below text, I think we actually agree on the end result but I still think the details and differences is worth pointing out.
It is most certainly not similar in most cases since most work on Kazaa is made available unautorized and in an infringing way. On allofmp3 it is made avilable for purchase in a perfectly legal way!
>You may note, however, that downloaders do not get sued for using Kazaa, uploaders do.
Well, you can get sued for violating the copyright law, it has nothing to do with if you are an "uploader" or a downloader". Both can get sued. Uploaders can get sued for distribution/making the work available to the public. The downloader can be sued for making a copy in an infriging way. Due to the way it works, it is very hard to spot or catch a downloader while relatively more easu to catch an uploader, so you go for the uploader.
Downloading from an unauthorizez source on Kazaa is very different from buying from an authorized source though so while one can get you in trouble, the other won't.
From your quote of a case:
>The first question, then, is whether those who browse any of the three infringing websites
Right there it turns out your example is a quite different one since it assumes the source is infringing to start with. That is not the case with allofmp3, they are not commiting any infringment and buying from them is not buying from an infringing source.
How is that material, though?
The law does not say that reproduction is only against the law if it is from an unauthorized copy. If I take a legally made book, and print up a thousand copies of it myself, I've broken the law. If I sell them, I've broken another law. If the buyers make more copies of those, they've broken the law because what is illegal is making copies, not making copies with a certain history. Their making copies is exactly the same offense as when I made copies earlier.
Go ahead and delude yourself -- you obviously can't be talked out of it. But at least shut up so that you don't trick other people. They should know the facts before they do whatever they want to do.
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
>If I take a legally made book, and print up a
>thousand copies of it myself, I've broken the law.
Not nessecarilly, if you can apply any of the exceptions to the exclusive rights it might not be so. It can depend on how you copy, what you do with them and even how many (so a thousand might be infrigning, while 10 might not) and so on. So no, you might not have broken the law.
>If I sell them, I've broken another law.
Most likely, since for example, you would have a much harder time to claim fair use due to the comercial nature of it and how it affect others.
>If the buyers make more copies of those, they've broken
>the law because what is illegal is making copies,
No, it is not certain they have broken the law, see above for the very same reason it might not have been so for you to start with.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Oh, I knew someone else had spotted it. But no-one had used my awful pun :)
Why not ask them?
l e=Other
https://corporate.visa.com/ut/contactform.jsp?tit
temporarily sigless