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Playstation 3 Sells Out At Japanese Launch
s31523 writes "With its high price tag and stiff competition the PS3 was a gamble. Based on the reaction in Japan to the game console's release, there might be a new hot toy on everyone's Christmas list here in the states. According to the article there were 100,000 units [Z: actually, only 80,000 units] available and all were sold out in record time. There are 2 configurations currently offered, a 60GB WiFi enabled box and a 20GB non-WiFi box. The Japanese price for the lower end system is considerably discounted vs. the system to be released in the States." For a look at launch day, Kotaku has photos taken by Sony's Phil Harrison on the streets of Tokyo.
Tomoaki Nakamura, 41, said: "I've been waiting for this day to come for so long. I'll play it all through the weekend. No time for meals."
Well, I guess that shows who Sony's demographics are, 41 year old men who put gaming ahead of basic biological function. Take that Maslow!
Monstar L
1. Manufacture a ridiculously low amount of units 2. Sell out of those units at a highly discounted rate 3. MAKE NO PROFIT!! 4. Declare victory
Sony are going to be touting the "fastest sellout ever", I mean, if I had only a single console to sell, and I sold it straight away, wouldnt that be the fastest sellout ever? I'm really wondering how Sony are going to do when they actually are able to produce more. Will the PS3 be a success?
http://my.telegraph.co.uk/dublinclontarf
.. how come only one of them seems to have had the sense to bring along a portable console to play with while waiting? God only knows what it'll be like when the store I work at gets these in. When the 360's came in, we had people qeueing in the dark from 9PM to 9AM in the morning - just to get core consoles!
Not really, I can't see why anyone would be happy with sony getting 80k units out on "launch day". I'm pretty sure their sales numbers weren't as good as the numbers on xbox 360's launch day, they just had so many fewer units that they sold out sooner. The mocking won't stop here.
"And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the World"
1 John 4:14
Kutaragi-san, don't you have better places to be right now than the slashdot forums?! You should be working on production issues, better developer tools, and lack of strong launch titles...
The nazi's have just taken France.. why don't you stop complaining about them and Hitler, just be happy for them .. just once would ya.
The first one million consoles will be an easy sell for sony all over the world, this is basically the hardcore fans who buy everything, but after that, it will be interesting how the console will sell. You can see that with every major console, that the initial sales are high, there always is enough fanboys who dont matter how much it is for the console, they just want to have it.
"there might be a new hot toy on everyone's Christmas list here in the states."
Is there anyone who ever doubted that the PS3 would be sold out until Spring? I assumed that with all of the stories about people planning to sell it for $3,000 on eBay that this was common knowledge by now.
Whenever the offence inspires less horror than the punishment, the rigour of penal law is obliged to give way...
With a small number of units available, of course they are going to sell out.
http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?strip_id=212
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?strip_id=212
No further comment needed
Insert Sig Here
those are in-game graphics? That's actually pretty impressive, maybe we will finally have the Toy Story graphics Sony promised for the ps2:
"...we could see worlds that could equal what was in use in the movie Toy Story."
I'm still not buying a PS3, but a Xbox360 may be in my future depending on what the new games look like.
my karma will be here long after I'm gone
So?
The Super Nintendo sold out 300,000 units.
Sony provide less than a hundred thousand to an amazingly gadget hungry market and it's now headlines that it sells out?
the opposite of genuine demand, ie: the buzz around wii. nintendo didnt have to chop down the amount of launch units to a miniscule portion to get people hyped up about their system, sony did, hence this article and my reply. sony did this same thing with PS2 launch and even with smaller launches like the PS2 network adapter. just a cheap way of creating, what i consider (if its alright with you...) 'fraudulent demand'
http://www.joystiq.com/2006/11/10/japanese-hardwar e-sales-30-october-5-november-incredibly-inn/
Notice the amount of hardware sold... in a week... in Japan. The DS completely dominates with more than 100,000 sold in a WEEK. This is months after it has launched, while the PS3 has only 80,000 to sell. Now yes, the DS costs much less, but notice that Nintendo probably makes a profit on it rather than a loss, AND this amount of units allows them to sell more software.
How much software is going to move for the PS3 when it's launch is only 80,000? Most of those best seller games are in the area of several 100 thousand to several million units sold. That isn't going to happen for a while. So yes the PS3 sold out, but we can't call it any kind of success yet with this few sold. Maybe if they pushed out 1 million units and sold them all, then we can say they were a success.
"Unless it has a game where you can make little school girls dance to your music!"
So. Fucking. Japanese.
Dear Lord, does somebody havea rusty spoon I can borrow? I need to gouge out my own eyeballs after seeing that saccharine hell.
And I actually thought I was an otaku...
Does anyone remember how many units they originally said they were planning on having for launch? Selling 80k units in your home territory isn't exactly "news". Hell the PS2 managed to sell 900,000 units in its first weekend in Japan. Somehow a 92% reduction in the number of units you managed to push is "newsworthy"? Give me a break.
Insert Sig Here
Nah, not yet. Just look at most of the other replies to this article. Cognitive dissonance is a powerful thing, especially amongst console fanboys...
Rob
Some users are already reporting PS3 games freezing during play and some other technical issues. Makes sense, they cut supplies because they can't get good yields of usable components. That being the case, Sony probably sets the quality control bar as to what consittues a good usnit low as they can so they can have as many as possible. With all the noise made over the 360 overheating problems, I hope for Sony's sake these reports are premature. Because if they freeze or have other technical issues there are some 7 million Xbox 360 owners just wating to make a big deal out of it. I bet ya' everybody and there brother interested in concole gaming is just waiting to take a picture/video of a frozen PS3 and gain YouTube fame.
Actually, that's not a particularly good term, since it is both inaccurate and emotionally loaded. Asking friends to shill your PS3 auction on eBay would be "fraudent demand." This is more like "artificial scarcity." Sony might be acting foolishly, but certainly not fraudulently, unless they are secretly paying people to go buy the units in order to ensure they sell out.
They sold 80,000 units in a day! Huzzah! They can only make money as long as they have units to sell. Only over the long term will we be able to say that it was a success.
Of course this will just drum up buzz and people will pay some lucky bastard on eBay 5 times the retail price for one.
No sig for you!!
Demand for PS3 has been driven very much by the fact that Sony has been promising people all year that they wont be able to get one. Lowered supply, intentional or not, has more than just one effect. contrary to what you believe, and if you cant see that then I suggest you take a psyschology course.
No, he's absolutely right. If there were a couple of million in the channel, there would be no excited crazy reports on the radio, TV, and internet about the people who were in line to get a PS3. This kind of crap makes Grandma's think this is a must have thing for their kid and while it doesn't spur end number demand, it certainly spurs false excitement and false "rush to get it" and even "wow, there aren't many so it's OK to pay this much or I won't get one" types of mentality.
Sony almost certainly have genuine problems producing enough units. Other would-be makers of Blu-Ray drives seem to be having problems too. There's no evidence to suggest that they're artificially restricting supply. (Cue comments from people need the world to know that they don't want a Blu-Ray drive and are OUTRAGED that any product would incorporate one).
Obligatory VGCats, on topic for once!
Considering every time Dragon Warrior or a Final Fantasy game comes out, they sell 2 million copies in the first week-end, of course they're going to sell 80,000 PS3s.
I'd like to see a breakdown of High end-vs-Low end units. Does anyone have those numbers?
Blocklevel: Practical Information Architecture
Agreed. "Artificial Scarcity" is a better term for it. Once again it comes down to semantics here on the /.
IOW, it drives up the market price. Which is what I said. Those grandmas already knew that the kids wanted a PS3 (or at the very least would've heard about it regardless of what the media was saying), it's just that they weren't willing to pay $600 until they heard about the low supply. (And I would argue that a lot of those grandmas would've been willing to pay $600 even if there were millions of units available. The going price on eBay currently appears to be about $1500 or more, nearly three times retail price.)
Rob
Lowered supply in itself has no effect on demand. This is basic economics, which, unlike psychology, is actually relevant to the argument at hand. Certainly a lowered supply combined with a fixed price will increase sales, but this is because the fixed price is well below the ideal price point, not because of an increased demand.
Rob
You're a bit late on that idea. It happened at E3.
lol... that moderation figures - Though technically I was first out of the links by 1 minute! =)
People that believe in their opinions don't post AC.
And which exact part of the demand is "fraudulent"?
It's pretty silly to think that Sony would be deliberately holding their supply to 80K units in Japan, though. A couple hundred thousand units would be almost believable, but 80K?
Rob
I'm really interested, so don't take offense... but why on earth would you be happy for a corporation? They don't give a shit about you, you shouldn't give a shit about them. I've really never understood it. Sure, stand up for and shout all about some small operation that needs the support but don't cry when a corporation gets bashed.
People that believe in their opinions don't post AC.
I disagree. The demand for diamond engagement rings is almost certainly higher due to the suppressed supply. Otherwise nobody would want them.
I don't think there's any doubt that low supply (and apparent or actual exclusivity) can boost demand. Of course, it would be absurd to suggest that that demand was any less "real" or more "fraudulent" than demand boosted by showing pretty girls drooling over the latest car, or adverts proclaiming how wonderfully white the latest washing powder washed, or demand boosted by a campaign pushing the wonderfulness of some new controller.
To summarise the summary of the summary: people are a problem. ~ h2g2
Artifical Scarcity might be more correct, but I think "Fraudulent Demand" conveys Sony's intention better.
Of course it is silly.
There is one reason and one reason only that Sony has fewer PS3s ready for launch, they are about 1 month behind in their production of lasers for the system.
Second, the reason that Japan is getting relatively few systems on launch day compared to NA is Japan is very close to the PS3 manufacturing plants and there will be a steady stream of new PS3s every week - 100k according to Sony. Unlike the US and Europe where it is more important to get as many as possible for launch since subsequent supplies require either slow ship based shipments or fast but expensive air based shipments.
80 or 100k is probably the smallest amount Sony thought they could do for Japan in order to maximize the initial US launch shipment.
Lowered supply in itself has no effect on demand.
What econ did you take? Lowered supply always increases demand unless it is an easily substitutable good, in which case it shifts higher demand to the substitutes (for example a lower supply of milk increases the demand for milk, while a lower supply of butter will increase the demand for margarine).
Computers allow humans to make mistakes at the fastest speeds known, with the possible exception of tequila and handguns
I'm curious what the limiting factor is. Yield on the short wavelength laser diodes? Small production lines?
Here is a rule of /.(what we call Slashdot); you do not call it a forum. Slashdot was created when the original meaning of forum was the only meaning; that is, an open-air market/political debating arena. It was created entirely before blogging. There are several components, but there is only one in truly short supply; the console itself. There is no chance that you could get a PS3, unless you live in a sparsely populated area and go to the nearest PS3-selling store in about 12 hours or so. It will not be available until the 17th in the US, if my sources serve, and the Japanese version will never be compatible with US games, at least until the PAL paradigm breaks down. That will be never, probably.
Ninjas and pirates. How piquant.
1. The precise reason why people demand diamonds so much is because they're scarce; the scarcity enhances their beauty, and the purpose of a diamond is to look pretty. This doesn't apply to the PS3; very few people would buy one simply because not many of them exist. Especially since there's a near-guarantee that there will be more made available soon.
2. People would still demand diamonds, they just wouldn't demand them at current prices.
Now, I will admit that demand has been boosted somewhat, but not to any great extent, and not by the scarcity of the PS3. Instead, demand has been boosted by the media hyping up the scarcity of the PS3. And unless Sony is paying news networks to hype up the PS3 in their reports, there's nothing fraudulent about it.
Rob
EVERY console made by a Japanese company sells out at launch in Japan. The fucking VisualBoy sold out in Japan.
Is (as always) games. Given enough time, any console maker will be able to produce enough so that everyone who wants one has one. However the driving force behind most people wanting one in the end will be games. Does it have the games they want to play and, for the games that are available on multiple consoles, do they look good?
Sony's problem isn't going to be selling out their first consoles. It's going to be making sure they get the games to convince people that it's something they need to have. That was why the PS2 succeeded. I mean really the graphics are nothing special. They were somewhat cool when they came out but nothing you hadn't seen out of a computer and certainly nothing near what Sony claimed they'd be, and the X-box has quite superior graphics. However that's not the issue, the issue is that the PS2 has the games people want to play.
That's what remains to be seen. Will Sony have the games to convince enough people that their pricey console is worth it? It's one of those things that tends to be a kind of feedback cycle. If you have enough games to sell people on your hardware, game makers will want to make games for it to make money, which sells more people on the hardware. However the opposite is true too.
I don't do console games so I haven't looked at the various lineups for the various consoles, but that would be what I'd really have my eye on in terms of PS3 success. Do they have the titles out now and coming out in the next 6 months to convince people it's worth it?
Lowered supply (whether through deliberate withholding of goods or through production problems) shifts the supply curve to the left and does absolutely nothing to the demand curve. Look at your textbook again.
Rob
I have no way of measuring the effect in relation to the PS3 but there are many many people for whom getting something that others don't have (or can't have) yet is a motivation. To witness companies taking this to absurd extreme, look at some of the ridiculous "collector" editions of games.
This is followed by "keeping up with the Joneses" where those left out need to catch up because just as having something limited is a source of pleasure to many, being the one without is a source of discomfort to many.
I'm also unconvinced that scarcity enhances the beauty of diamonds but maybe that's a problem with my eyes. Seems to me that it enhances their usefulness as a display of wealth (and in relation to matrimony, a display of how much boy is willing to spend on girl).
I already said I agree that this isn't fraudulent.
To summarise the summary of the summary: people are a problem. ~ h2g2
I agree, the main purpose of withholding supply is to increase price, and that's true for any product including diamonds. But as I've said several times in this thread, that's a function of the supply curve, not the demand curve.
In the case of diamonds, the effect that lowering supply has on the demand curve is a special function of diamonds, not a universal rule. IOW, yes, the high price of diamonds is a big reason why people want them, but this doesn't apply to the PS3. It very obviously doesn't apply to the PS3, in fact, considering all of the people who complain about the high price of the PS3.
Rob
Exactly, and the lowered supply could infact be what is making the interest in the wii go up. So the "genuine demand" of the wii isn't because people want the wii any more than they want the ps3, it's because it's a substitute for the PS3.
Stupidest...headline...ever. Am I the only one who's reminded of the VG Cats comic about this?
Man, who would have thought that japanese would buy out 80000 consoles. No way!
you really should check out the comments on the photo diary, there are some pretty funny comments and a little "spot the DS" competition going on. Sony's Phil Harrison won't be happy
*''I can't believe it's not a hyperlink.''
ELOI, ELOI, LAMA SABACHTHANI!?
The one with games developed in Virtual Basic?
perception is reality
Ah, dammit. So my sources suck. It still won't work, unless you fiddle with it. And, of course, there is the being-able-to-read-Japanese part.
Ninjas and pirates. How piquant.
thats 10.3k in USD.
No, those reports would be there. Remember how Sony released a probably pre-written press release that all PSPs sold out in record time on the US launch and later had to retract that because people kept wondering about those huge stocks of PSPs many retailers still had at that point?
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
What econ did you take? Lowered supply always increases demand...
Wha? I have one weiner (a low supply you will agree?). Yet there is very little demand. *sigh*
I'm sure you can argue how I'm wrong with my interpretation of your comment, and you could very well be correct in that argument. I'm just joking around, is all.
I'm not a nerd. Nerds are smart.
I'm interested, how big is Japan in the big picture? First or Second? We all know (if even just by how the companies treat them) that Europe is third most important. Anywhere other than North America, Japan, or Europe is rarely even heard in the news. But is Japan the bigger battlefield than the US? If we look at the launch numbers, Sony and Nintendo are both putting more emphasis on the US. Sony's US Launch day is scheduled to have 400,000 PS3 units, about 4x the number of their Japanese launch. Nintendo is planning a US launch day of 1,000,000 Wii units. Meanwhile I can't even find Nintendo's Japan launch day units; they don't even release in Japan until December, after the November US launch. So, the companies seem to indicate that in the big picture, the US is the bigger prize. Launching two days apart, with more units (assumed for Wii Japan) will make a much more useful comparison than a 23-day apart Japan launch with relativly fewer units.
It may also be interesting to see how Sony's launch titles did, since they need games and accessories to pull up the difference. Some of the games present on Sony's Japan launch list also appear on the Wii's. Depending on quantities of these sold compared to the number of units sold in proportion to other games per unit sold may tell us if there are customers prepared to buy the Wii as well and plan on buying those games for the Wii instead. While it would have to be a large difference to overcome the large margin of error such a comparison welcomes, it may still provide some insite into the minds of the buyers and give us a rough idea how the big US launch will go for Sony or Nintendo.
Demented But Determined.
Artificial scarcity can, in fact, cause an increase in the demand as well, though. But it's a psychological thing: if one sees that product X is selling out all the time, they conclude that it is popular, and in a "keeping up with the Joneses" sort of thing, they further conclude that they should endeavor to get one at the earliest opportunity as well, causing the rise in demand.
Even imagined peer pressure can affect a person just as much as real peer pressure, so of course, artificial scarcity doesn't do a single thing to the demand curve among the demographic of people who would not be inclined to submit to such outside influence in the first place.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
And tomorrow there will be 50,000 units on Ebay.
"No, no, no, don't tug on that! You never know what it might be attached to."
As popular as it is to hate on large corporations, it's often overlooked that large corporations are formed from large bodies of employed persons. While one might be entirely guilt-free in hoping a corporation does not entirely dominate their market, it would only be to the detriment of the 'little people' if a corporation got into serious trouble.
Mass layoffs aren't something anyone should be cheering on, IMO. Most of the anti-sony noise started out (I believe) as a hope that Sony would have its wings clipped and its arrogance tamed, rather than wishing the wholesale destruction of the 'evil corporation' and the massive job losses that would accompany it.
Nonsense.
The scarcity is real: there are problems producing blue laser diodes, and Sony has already postponed orders for diodes to other companies and is allocating the entire production to PS3 right now. Sony delayed their own Bluray player for this reason.
There is a reason why both BluRay and HD DVD players are spendy: the diodes are the bottleneck.
Irony: there are more PS3's slated for release day in the US than Microsoft had ready for the 360 release date last year. But in typical "let's bitch about Sony" slashdot crap, this fact is ignored.
As for selling 80,000 PS2's a year ago: well, duh... When a platform is 5 years old, you have very nice stable and predictable manufacturing yeilds. New hardware is always harder to make.
For the sake of argument, I'm going to make up some demand numbers here. If the PS3 has a market of 1,000,000 people, and Sony only releases 500,000 units, those units get snapped up immediately, and Sony can say, "Hey, look! We sold out! What a success!" As the weeks and months go on, the demand numbers will increase as more people see the machine in action and want one, and Sony will be able to continue claiming huge successes with the "Selling out is better than supplying demand" philosophy.
I get the feeling that if Nintendo releases 4,000,000 units, and sells only 2,000,000, the gaming press will look at it as a failure. "They only sold 50% of their stock, what a shame. The Wii isn't nearly as popular as we thought it was going to be." Never mind that they've sold four times what Sony did. Never mind that as demand increases, supply is there. Never mind that Nintendo is making a profit out of the gate. The story will be, "Wii fails."
Sony, time and time again, has shown that the Playstation brand is built on hype and a sell-out only increases the hype.
It seems Sony planned there to be a shortage of consoles just to get sensational media coverage. 1. Make successful line of consoles. 2. Skip out on production. 3. Media Spin, claim your console sold out at record speeds. 4. ??? 5. Profit!
I watched some ps3 kiosks in a store yesterday -- one showing demo loops and one live unit with ridge racer -- and the graphics were actually sort of "meh". Definitely high-res, but that's about it really. The unit showing demo loops had some nice special effects in places (whereas ridge racer seemed pretty "last-gen"), but it was a really mixed bag, lots of low frame-rates, bad animation, weird lighting artifacts etc. Rige racer seemed like it could have been running on a ps2/gc/xbox (albeit probably not on an HDTV).
I suppose the graphics will improve later as developers gain experience, but honestly, given all the hype, I was expecting to be blown away, and wasn't. It's a nice update to the ps2 (which was always a bit weak graphically), to be sure, but it's not at all clear that it's really worth twice what the competition is asking. It's certainly not the life-changing experience Kutaragi seems to think it is.
We live, as we dream -- alone....
It may be built on hype, but you have to do a bit more than that for people *still* to be buying Playstation 2s (even right now, today, even with the Xbox 360 there and Wii and PS3 around the corner). And that's not to mention the success of the predecessor.
-- *~()____) This message will self-destruct in 5 seconds...
Perhaps if yours differed significantly from the other three billion out there?
And, even then, it could be seen as an easily substitutable good, as described earlier in this thread.
This signature carefully hand-crafted from recycled electrons.
Hopefully, this story will reduce the amount of people randomly bashing Sony (and how their PS3 will "obviously" fail) for no reason. Right now I'm just happy for Sony and the rate of sales they've had. Aren't you?
... ...
... The PS3 is selling at about 133% the rate of one of the worst performing systems in the history of consoles in Japan ...
The average sales for the Nintendo DS Lite in a give week are about 100,000 units
On a good week (when they release a highly popular game) the DS Lite sells about 250,000 units
Claiming that the PS3 won't fail because it sold 80,000 units in its launch week is foolish; hell the XBox 360 sold 55,750 in its first week in Japan
Are you sure it is doing all that well?
I could shit in a box and probably sell 1,000 units. 5,000 if I called it a console (aka the phantom).
Selling out at launch isn't hard. It's even easier if you only ship a fraction of what the competition is selling. Which is betterin the Wii selling out over 400,000 units in japan (which is almost definate) or the Ps3 selling out 100,000 units?
I just have one question? Why is this news?
One more thing...can I pre-order for X-mas anywhere? or for any date in that case?
Well actually, it's not so much home turf as much as the area which is a gadget freaks paradise. Now - if you COULDN'T sell there - then you'd have some news.
Oh wait - Microsoft failed to do just that - TWICE.
LikSang could have shifted that
Whoa buddy. You seem to be cramming words into my mouth here. (Perhaps rehashing the console wars over and over again is making people cranky.)
If we agree that fraud is for lying for person gain, then yes, Sony selling fewer units than they actually have and then claiming to have "run out" is fraud. (Although not the criminal kind, I suspect.) The fraud part of course being the second part, where they lie about the supply.
And, strictly speaking, I am pretending this "market vulnerability" you allude to does not exist, since I don't know what the heck you are talking about. (Seriously. This isn't some passive-agressive debate tactic. What are you talking about?)
And as for the last part: Asking for what is causing the shortage does not mean "I would have you believe" anything. I understand that a fake shortage can be used to pump up prices, especially luxury goods whose market price is highly dependent on "buzz". But create too big of a shortage and you are just leaving money on the table. As you point out 80k units is ridiculously small for a launch in Japan. So small, that I can't see how it would generate enough buzz to compensate for leaving hundreds of thousands of potential buyers out in the cold. Maybe Sony really did engineer a shortage to justify a $500-600 price tag, but maybe they just bet the farm of on a poor supply chain. Either way, I don't think this will ultimately be good for their bottom line.
If anything, that shows the power of good software over hardware. God of War, the GTAs, Final Fantasy, Guitar Hero; great games make a great system. More and more of Sony's previously locked in brands are defecting to the 360 and I think that'll be the real downfall of the PS3 if they don't turn that around. Hardware shortages plus game that can be found on either 360 or PS3 are likely to drive 360 sales more than anything else. The PS3 will continue to sell out to the hardcare and the fanboys, but once that base is installed, the question is how do they pull in the rest? I'm not sure that Sony, despite the hype and the media coverage, has an effective plan in place for that.
diamonds are not scare... DeBeers hoard them and create an artificial scarcity in order to keep the price high.
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
They're just doing the same thing Microsoft did for the 360 launch.
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
Except for their being an almost unlimited supply of one-of-a-kind cat shits, along with the abundance of substitutes from dogs, horses, squirrels, deer, rabbit and countless others.
Computers allow humans to make mistakes at the fastest speeds known, with the possible exception of tequila and handguns
This is more like "artificial scarcity." Sony might be acting foolishly, but certainly not fraudulently, unless they are secretly paying people to go buy the units in order to ensure they sell out.
It's not artificial at all, it is about the rate that Cell chips can be supplied and Blurays built. Also consider that unlike Microsoft, Sony does not intend to throw billions down the drain on their console business, and therefore has not written a lot of blank checks to scale up the early production. The early production costs the most and is most prone to defective returns. Better to build fewer units at first and spend more money on quality control.
What Sony needed to do is end the questions about whether the PS3 actually works like it is supposed to, and whether the launch titles are actually ready. Meanwhile at last count the PS2 was still outselling XBox 360. Now that the PS3 is out and launch titles (Fall of Man) are being reviewed, time is on Sony's side.
Have you got your LWN subscription yet?
...PC Watch bought one and took it apart.
Impressions:
- That's one huge cooling fan!
- Why did they use a Seagate drive, when Seagate is known for sucking more power than just about anybody else?
- Not as many components on the MB as you might expect for a first revision.
- The ATI RSX has its video memory on the module, but not in-core.
According to posts on various Japanese sites, there also seem to be a few problems.
- The unit gets hot. Very hot.
- A couple of people reported the unit powering off during the software update, which permanently bricked the unit.
- The browser can't play Flash.
As I understand it, what lowered supply does, though, is make Sony's sales numbers look better than they really are.
Not exactly. It does allow them to say that they sold out at lower numbers, but the numbers are still low. The reason why the Wii launch would be considered a "failure" if it only sold half of the units produced isn't because it didn't sell out, but because it didn't sell to expectations. It bears noting that the PS3 hasn't yet sold to expectations either, though for different reasons.
Rob
Oh, I did. It's just I didn't feel clean again no matter how much I scrubbed afterwards.
So, I decided to go to my local game store (Famicon Jungle) the other night to see the status of the PS3 in Japan (not really giving a crap, as I have my Wii on pre-order, but just to see what games are out and whatnot).
So, I go to the store, and there's about 3 cars waiting outside of the store. 2 have the geekiest geeks you've ever seen in your life sitting in them, 1 has a couple just kind of hanging out eating snacks. They're all waiting for a PS3 shipment that is apparently late getting to the store.
I walk up to the store and there is a big sign on the front that says "We are sorry for the inconvenience, but we will be getting only 1-3 PS3s, and they will be given out at a first come first serve basis." It was 9pm on launch day, and apparently they still hadn't come yet.
To give you some background of where I live: I live in a town of around 500,000 people. The surrounding area is all farms, so I figure within 20km of me, there are all of 3 stores that are selling PS3s. If each one gets 1-3 machines, that means that if one in 100,000 people decides "hmmm, I would like a PS3.." then they will sell out.
Calling that a victory is just lunacy.
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Nothing can be done before the tremendous power!
RabidComics
I think the 360 threat has been overblown, at least a little bit. The big advantage to the 360 is XBox Live, and only a minority of gamers is really interested in a pay service when you can play online for free on the PS3, no matter how good that service may be. Combine that with the fact that the 360 is basically dead in Japan, and we'll probably see Microsoft stay in the second-place position, though probably not as distant as it was last generation.
Rob
1) Sony limited production of the unit 2) Sony cut the price of the Ps3 in Japan by 20% before launch
Nothing to make good PR by cutting your made-up price and making very little product, so you can boast about how it sold out, while there are still plenty of people elsewhere unhappy about unit availability and pricepoint.
Both reasons why I personally won't be waiting with bated breath for one. (That and I've been abducted by PC games)
Kotaku has an interesting report. Apparently, some people hired chinese poor people to stand in the lines and buy PS3s for resale.
Your sources are wrong.
1. PS3 Japan/US versions can no only play the same games, but the same bluray movies.
2. Japan use NTSC. It is Europe that uses PAL, and that's moot with HMDI anyway.
Thanks for playing.
http://page7.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/g5053 3791
This 60GB one's going for ~10 billion yen, or approximately $100M.
What sound do people on rollercoasters make? Hint: it's not Xbox 360.
this is a must read
it seems exploitation and sony do indeed work well together
Seems like the chinese people living in Japan are really digging the PS3... ;)
http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/top/foreigners-and-fi ghts-ps3-jpn-launchs-dark-side-214130.php
eBay
As of 9:57 pm central time USA on November 11, 2006, with 2 minutes left open for bids, a machine was selling for $2,225.
Worth to wait in line? I suppose it depends on how much you like lying around on a Saturday morning in your pajamas drinking coffee.
Well, but if you just look to the sales in Japan and compare the sales of xbox 1 & xbox 360 compare to the ps2 & ps3, then there is a huge difference.
"Freiheit ist immer auch die Freiheit des Andersdenkenden" - Rosa Luxemburg, 1871 - 1919
The high price? I'd rather say, because they are rather rare and special, thats why people want them.
You could also then say poeple want a Ferrari because it is so expensive. And I would say, no, they want a Ferrari, because it is special to own one. (which could be traced back to the fakt that you need gazillions of money units to get one).
"Freiheit ist immer auch die Freiheit des Andersdenkenden" - Rosa Luxemburg, 1871 - 1919
"It is Europe that uses PAL, and that's moot with HMDI anyway."
Unfortunately, it's HDMI that's moot in Europe, not PAL. There have only been something like 2 million hi-def capable TVs sold in Europe, and a fair proportion of those are owned by bars and other such establishments where the attraction is the big screen rather than high definition (which European broadcasters have been slow to take up, so it still isn't available in all countries, even by cable or satellite). Add to this the fact that most of the existing sets lack HDMI inputs, and you have a situation where the PS3's high definition capabilities are not going to be a major selling point, either for games, or movies. Of course, this doesn't mean that the PS3 won't sell in Europe, but it will have to do so irrespective of its HD capabilities rather than because of them.
NB: Sony do have one major ally in the form of Nintendo Europe, who have probably done as much to sell PS2s and XBoxes as Sony and MS. They have more power than anyone else to ensure a miserable European XMas for the Wii .
I'm not going to change your sheets again, Mr. Hastings.
Electronics stores in Japan have sold out of PlayStation 3 consoles after thousands of gamers queued for hours in the cold to buy them.
I'll wait. Thanks.
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
Yes but it sold very little after that.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
I think his point is only that we cannot derive from this instant sellout that the PS3 will be a success overall.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
I think Tales of Symphonia looked just as impressive (i.e. looked like the cel-shading would make it look perfectly like a cartoon) on the early screenshots.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
Chinese people buying the japanese PS3s (Score:3, garbage)
davecb5620@gmail.com
300+ people camping out for a console many days in advance, that most people on Digg and Slashdot said wouldn't sell.
:-)
:-)
Selling out ~100k consoles in record time in Japan.
Selling out every preorder in America in record time.
Seeing that people are already camping in the U.S. over a week in advance.
Selling another 100k per week for the rest of the year in Japan.
More than likely selling 400,000 units in American as fast as the stores can process the orders on launch day.
Obviously selling out the second shipment to America ~600k by the end of the year.
Having a launch lineup of around 20+ titles, downloadable demos and music day one.
Seeing that you just sold more BlueRay players in Japan, in one day than all HD-DVD players world wide for the entire year.
Seeing that you will sell 8X as many BlueRay players in America, in one day than all HD-DVD players sold last year world wide, and giving them a "test" movie to help them try out playing movies.
Seeing that a ton of people are willing to pay 2 and even 4 times the list price to get a PS3 on Ebay.
Being able to produce ~6 million consoles by March of 2006, and having a market that looks like it will buy every last one of them.
Having a "last gen" console still continually outsell your competitors "next gen" system month after month.
Providing support for Yellow Dog Linux out of the gate and also helping with OpenGL (setting it as the default for all PS3 games, thus helping out the entire open source community).
Helping to make 1080P a reality in console gaming.
Priceless...
Now I am not going to say that Sony could have done a ton better by getting all 6 million consoles out before Christmas, but their future doesn't look too bad from a lot of peoples perspective. It is very safe to say that Sony will sell 6 million consoles by March of 2007, and then they can decide if they need to do anything about the price.
So, Mr Gates, I realize that you are still stinging from dropping over 4 Billion in the last XBOX and never making a profit, but don't worry I am sure that someone will want a 360 this year. I hear that they are going like "fire", or was that they are actually "on fire"... either way you should get some people that will want to buy/replace one until they can get a PS3. Good luck on the new Xbox 720, I heard that you may release it next Christmas, and I am sure that won't make too many of your customers angry. You obviously have learned a lot from Sega. Their partnership with you has worked out great! Come to think of it, your partnership with every company has worked out great. Well, perhaps not so great for your partners... Oh yeah, one last thing; keep up the point system, people love it! Whatever you do don't use real currency, that would confuse them.
The more I learn about science, the more my faith in God increases.
What makes you think "basic economics" has anything to do with the real world? Economics is a pseudoscience based on rules of thumb and ideology, and most economists are full of shit.
Who do you think those businessmen are selling the PS3s to?
Rob
eBay moguls could always buy a 360 to actually play games. Best Buy will offer Xbox 360 launch day deals for PS3 campers who did not get their prize. http://news.punchjump.com/article.php?id=3341
Selling out ~100k consoles in record time in Japan. The Japanese will always buy the Japanese console, no matter how cheap or how good the Gaijin console is. Bill Gates could pay the Japanese to take an Xbox360 home, they'll still buy Sony because Sony is Japanese.
Selling out every preorder in America in record time. Wow, 40,000 pre-orders. Compared to millions of literal working Xbox360s in homes right now. A pre-order simply reserves one and gives you the option of buying, not every pre-orderer will return to pay for the ps3. It happens with all preorders.
Seeing that people are already camping in the U.S. over a week in advance. People camped out for months to watch Phantom Menance. So there's actually less interest in ps3 than Jar Jar Binks. Color me impressed.
Selling another 100k per week for the rest of the year in Japan. Where did you get the time machine, dude? Ps3 has been out in Japan for less than a week. You have no idea what will happen for the rest of the year. Just wait until the Wii comes out in Japan. I doubt as many ps3s will sell with competition from a Japanese console.
More than likely selling 400,000 units in American as fast as the stores can process the orders on launch day. Another message from the Future? Now you can predict the sales before they're even available for purchase in America. Your talents are wasted shilling for Sony. With this uncanny ability to predict the future, you should work for Homeland Security.
Obviously selling out the second shipment to America ~600k by the end of the year. Seriously stop predicting stuff no one can possibly know.
Having a launch lineup of around 20+ titles, downloadable demos and music day one. And our Gigantic System Seller? A game the average gamer is dying to play? Anyone? Anyone? Buehler? Buehler?
Seeing that you just sold more BlueRay players in Japan, in one day than all HD-DVD players world wide for the entire year. :-)
Seeing that HD-DVD is cheaper to make, both for the players and the media itself, and thus is cheaper for the public, I don't see an advantage. :-)
Seeing that you will sell 8X as many BlueRay players in America, in one day than all HD-DVD players sold last year world wide, and giving them a "test" movie to help them try out playing movies. :-)
Seeing that a ton of people are willing to pay 2 and even 4 times the list price to get a PS3 on Ebay.
Seeing that you can buy a grilled cheese sandwhich with a burn mark that looks like Jesus, or if you prefer Elvis, all I see is that people are willing to pay lots of money for items of questionable value.
Being able to produce ~6 million consoles by March of 2006, and having a market that looks like it will buy every last one of them. What market? The ones that already have an Xbox or the ones that are Drooling over the Wii?
Having a "last gen" console still continually outsell your competitors "next gen" system month after month. The Last Gen Console breaks easily, and is being repurchased.
Providing support for Yellow Dog Linux out of the gate and also helping with OpenGL (setting it as the default for all PS3 games, thus helping out the entire open source community). And pushing DRM to the point where the system is more locked down than Windows.
Helping to make 1080P a reality in console gaming. For the 15% of American households rich enough to afford any type of HD. The government has been trying to force HD-TV instead of CRT TV since the 90's. We were supposed to have HD-only-TV in the mid 1990's. It's still so expensive that people can'
Did it occur to any of you that "launch day" means launch in the home market?
"And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the World"
1 John 4:14
This means software sales in Japan for any particular title could at most be 80,000 units in real sales. This is real bad for the software companies that would rely on a big 4th quarter.
I can't seem to get an answer from anyone. Does it or does it not run Linux by default ? Or is it an add-on like for the PS2 ?
considering how many millions of people live in Japan... it hardly surprises me that 80,000 of them want and can afford a ps3
The US market is roughly twice as big as the Japanese market so any comparisons between the two are pointless.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
While I don't think the PS3 will "obviously" fail, I think it's worth noting that the PS3, for all its supposed success, will be out-sold by the DS Lite this week in Japan. After all, only having 80,000 units tends to hurt your ability to compete with a system that sells over 150,000 units per week in Japan alone. If they don't step up production, then regardless of popularity they won't be able to reach the top spot at all.
-=-=-=-=-=
I'd rather be flamed than ignored.
The Week (likely the day, but I'll say week) that the Wii launches in Japan it will outsell the PS3, and 360 in Japan. Unless there are serious manufacturing/supply issues from Nintendo I expect that to be the "Next Gen" market leader in Japan through 2007.
"Selling another 100k per week for the rest of the year in Japan. Where did you get the time machine, dude?"
:-) Seeing that HD-DVD is cheaper to make, both for the players and the media itself, and thus is cheaper for the public, I don't see an advantage. :-)"
So are you willing to bet that Sony won't sell 400k consoles at launch? Is ANYONE here on Slashdot willing to say that? I doubt it.
"Obviously selling out the second shipment to America ~600k by the end of the year. Seriously stop predicting stuff no one can possibly know."
Again I ask, are you willing to say that Sony won't sell an additional 600k consoles by the end of the year? Look at the demand! It is more than obvious that they will.
". Bill Gates could pay the Japanese to take an Xbox360 home, they'll still buy Sony because Sony is Japanese."
So what? What does this have to do with anything? If Japan is willing to buy millions of PS3's much like they did PS1 and PS2's then those still count as sales.
"With the DS, there were people camped out for the launch of each new color"
Not nearly the same amount of people. People didn't quit their jobs and camp. There were literally over 1,000 people waiting in some lines in Japan. By most accounts there were around 300 or so people in line(s) for the DS lite.
"Seeing that people are already camping in the U.S. over a week in advance. People camped out for months to watch Phantom Menance. So there's actually less interest in ps3 than Jar Jar Binks. Color me impressed."
Yes, and we all know how poorly the StarWars franchise has done. My point is that by these HUGE early lines it shows that there is significant interest in the PS3.
"Having a launch lineup of around 20+ titles, downloadable demos and music day one. And our Gigantic System Seller? A game the average gamer is dying to play? Anyone? Anyone? Buehler? Buehler?"
You need to define "average" gamer. I was one of the people in the preorder lines and I can say that even the "hard core" gamers had a very different view on "must have" games. Out of the first 10 people in line, you couldn't find more than three people saying that any game was the must have game. If by "average" you mean kids games, then I would agree that the PS3 doesn't have a great lineup for the 10 and under crowd. However, for that market I would say just pick up one of the 1,000+ PS2 kids games for your PS3. It is backward compatible. I for one am looking forward to Marvel Ultimate Alliance at 1080P. Yes it can be bought for multiple consoles, but most people would agree that 1080P will look far far better than 480i. The same can be said for Tony Hawk. Now seeing that the majority of people picking up a PS3 before March of 2007 will not be kids under 10, is this really that big of an issue?
"Seeing that you just sold more BlueRay players in Japan, in one day than all HD-DVD players world wide for the entire year.
Cheaper for now, how much "cheaper" will it be when the manufacturing of blueRay hits in the millions. Also, I don't know where you get your information from on the disk format, but the pricing is around the same. At the end of the day you will have MILLIONS of BlueRay players and at best 50k HD-DVD players. HD-DVD is all but dead.
"Seeing that a ton of people are willing to pay 2 and even 4 times the list price to get a PS3 on Ebay. Seeing that you can buy a grilled cheese sandwhich with a burn mark that looks like Jesus, or if you prefer Elvis, all I see is that people are willing to pay lots of money for items of questionable value."
How many people? Have you looked at the number of EBAY sales? It isn't 5 or 10 or 20 or 50. At what point do you have to concede that a ton of people want a PS3 and are willing to pay 2X or 3X the price to get one? It looks like thousands of them will sell for ~2X their price or greater. That is a far cry from one sandwich. If there were hundreds of sandwiches out there selling for hundre
The more I learn about science, the more my faith in God increases.
I visited my local eb games last week and the ps3 was on the shelves with all the release games as well.. Are you saying that this system is not yet released yet in the US?
Yeah, that's what we're saying. The U.S. launch date is 11/17. Put down the blotter paper with the blue stars on it, wait until the walls stop crying and the universe ceases to whisper cheat codes to you, and go back to EB.
The enemies of Democracy are
Artificial scarcity is still scarcity as far as demand is concerned.
In the future, all spacecraft will be made of cheese.
Demand is demand. If you own a business you do whatever you can to create demand for your products and services. If you don't then you won't be in business long. I don't see the point at bitching at Sony for being better at creating frenzy for their products than their competition. Do you remember when the original Matrix movie came out? They understood what Sony is doing. There was little hard evidence as to what the movie was about before it's release and they teased you with rumors of awesome tech, kung fu training for the cast, etc without ever giving away details that would give away the movie. People were going nuts wanting to see that movie. That's exactly what Sony does and it's a good reason why Sony will continue to beat their competition. Naive people think that making the units harder to get and more expensive will make them sell fewer units while people who actually have experience in markting know that usually the reverse is true. It's not cheating - it's smart business.
People buy a Ford Focus but what they really want is a something fast, expensive, and harder to get. It's true in any market really. I've sold hot tubs and it's that way. The first time people often buy they go for the $2000 crap-o-spa from Costco but next time they buy the $10000 wonder spa that does more, works better, and lasts longer and they're much happier. Given that people will easily hand over $10000 for a glorified bath tub I have no trouble seeing people shelling out $600 for a PS3. The high cost and limited supply will make them sell more units.
At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
Not exactly. It does allow them to say that they sold out at lower numbers, but the numbers are still low. The reason why the Wii launch would be considered a "failure" if it only sold half of the units produced isn't because it didn't sell out, but because it didn't sell to expectations. It bears noting that the PS3 hasn't yet sold to expectations either, though for different reasons.
...).
Hmmm. If that is so, we should note that demand for the Wii is so high that the entire game shelf at my local EBX in Seattle is empty. Everyone already pre-ordered all the games the store is receiving on launch day, as well as all the Wii consoles, Wii-motes, and such.
And this is even with a much larger supply of consoles than Sony has for the PS3.
From this we can gather that Wii and the PS3 may be in the same category of consumption, and both in high demand and low supply.
When I was there, I noticed someone actually getting his mom to buy an xBox360, with controllers and games, since he was unable to buy either a Wii or a PS3, so from this we can infer that all game consoles are marginally tradeable to satisfy Maslow's needs/wants, and that the xBox360 is not in short supply. However, I also noticed almost everybody there was talking about the Wii, not the PS3, nor the xBox360 - so from this an economist would expect that demand for the Wii is in fact higher than for the PS3 or the xBox360, which is a more accurate measure of reality.
However, it is possible that demand in Japan for the Sony PS3 may be higher than it is in the US - both Sony and Nintendo are Japanese companies, but all three game consoles have Japanese games (man, I can't wait till they port those to the Wii
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
As of this post, price for completed auctions are around 80k yen for 20GB units. That's about 30k yen premium over retail, which isn't much if you considered the profiteering that went on on ePay during the first three months after xbox360 launch.
ELOI, ELOI, LAMA SABACHTHANI!?
Counterargument: You're in Seattle, which of course is a mere bike-ride away from the American headquarters of both Nintendo and Microsoft, while SCEA's headquarters are in a suburb of San Francisco. I would expect that Seattle citizens are exposed to much more hype from the two resident companies than from Sony, what with a large number of them being employed by said two companies and so forth.
And besides, Seattle is kind of weird.
Rob