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Transgaming Introduces Cedega 6.0
Tux Penguin writes "Today Transgaming introduced Cedega 6.0, which is the popular Linux game emulator based upon WINE. Among the new features in Cedega 6.0 is support for a number of new games, Shader Model 2.0 support, new FBO extensions support, and ALSA audio. Phoronix has provided a performance preview that has Doom 3 and Enemy Territory benchmarks from Windows XP, Windows Vista, Linux, WINE, and Cedega."
...I'll bet that it still doesn't work right.
Honestly, in the past I've had more success running games with just straight up WINE than Cedega. I had a 1 month subscription, and it was a complete waste, cheap as it was. Not a single game worked as advertised.
As usual, I'm sure their benchmarks were acquired from a machine with a very specific setup requiring hours of tweaking to get right.
Linux has its uses, and they are many. Gaming is not currently among them, and this hack (yeah, I went there; Cedega is a hack, nothing more) is not the solution to bring Linux gaming into the mainstream.
"You will pay for your lack of vision..." - Emperor Palpatine to Ray Charles
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item =681&num=2
Under the influence of Post-Cyberpunk Gonzo Journalism
If you're going to test the performance of an emulation layer you certainly don't do so using graphics intensive games on low end and/or integrated graphics solutions. They should have at least used a midrange GPU. There are numerous other problems with the whole thing. Basically, not everything works and the performance of what *does* work is on par with the Linux equivalent based on the poorly thought out testing methodology.
Don't waste your time.
Because it's based off a really old version of WINE?
On topic, kinda: I use Cedega because I'm lazy and don't mind the $5 it cost me to get a copy. I read the review linked in TFA, and I'm curious; how well does WINE play with WoW? Is it worth the (little, i'm sure) extra effort to get up and running to put that $5 towards something else the next time an upgrade comes around?
If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.
je suis parce que j'aime
Looking at the benchmarks, there's what, one test where Cedega outperformed Wine? What exactly is this monthly subscription fee supposed to pay for, minimal if any improvement over Wine? I understand that it supports newer games than Wine does, but I'd rather put my money into an open-source project than throw it into a monthly fee, especially considering the minor differences.
Am I misunderstanding something vital about Cedega here, or is Transgaming really asking us to pay for the same functionality?
Today is red jello day - all workers must eat all of their red jello. Failure to comply will result in five demerits.
Maybe I'm missing something, but aren't Doom 3 and Enemy Territory OpenGL based and Linux native? Benchmarking them with Cedega is pointless.
Because the redunancy of acronyms doesn't cascade to their derivative projects?
Isn't this what was stopping splinter cell 1 & 2 from working? I still play multiplayer chaos theory so I'd love splinter cell support.
Asside from that, yeah I hear you.
Under the influence of Post-Cyberpunk Gonzo Journalism
thank you, mr. stalin. we'll gas them as soon as we round them up!
BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
They ARE open source. CVS access is available, sourcecode is GPL.
What you have to pay for is the convenient "snapshot" taken at a stable moment plus the packaging. You also support development that way.
It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile
Be yourself no matter what they say
Anyone else notice...
"For our Vista "Longhorn" benchmarks we had used Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate RC1 (Build 5600)".
Sure. Because that will give you a good, impartial quality result.
Bloody muppets.
Here's how you do so:
;)
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Linux
NOTICE:
You might want to check the history for the last Mongoose update in case asshats from slashdot add bullshit to the wiki entry.
Cedega *IS* open source, and you don't have to pay for it. Next?
How, exactly, are we enemies to Free Software? I could just as well be playing the games in Windows, and not even using Linux at all. I submit bug reports, beta (and even alpha) test, though I'm not exactly the most knowledgeable person when it comes to using OSS. I donate to the projects I use, when I can. Perhaps you can help Transgaming go open source by convincing the gaming studios to use OpenGL, or petition for DirectX to be opened up. Or, better still, petition the game studios to develop for Linux? id does it, and does it well. Doom3 ran faster, natively, in Linux than it did in Windows on my machine.
If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.
I am going to address the FPS portion of your comment. The reason why I personally and I suspect many others enjoy online FPS games is because it is raw skill/talent vs another. Most games skill/player ability has little to do with the outcome of the fight. I am currently playing Eve-online and I enjoy playing it. The PVP aspect of the game IMHO is not very fun and very far from balanced. A !skill player in a hugely expensive well equipped ship will annilate a highly skilled player in the same ship but using more midrange quality of the same gear. Just because of the game mechanics.
FPS is equal footing for all players and it is your skill that allows you to do well.
It is open sourced for the most part. The copy protections are licensed from other companies so that part is closed. But you can build Cedega from their CVS repository. You get support from the company for the cost and prepackaged binaries. I however have built Cedega from source and it works just fine I did not notice any problems with running most of the games I was using.
There exists some positive integer N that you are the Nth person to read this signature.
Just fyi history > date/time of updaten ux&oldid=106687
http://www.uesp.net/w/index.php?title=Oblivion:Li
Also there have been a couple changes since the last Mongoose entry that included many typo-fixes, and a possibly improved way of installing the DirectX dll's
09:F9:11:02 - 9D:74:E3:5B - D8:41:56:C5 - 63:56:88:C0
I dunno - I kind of like the idea: It would make a good selling point to developers who are thinking of doing a Linux port of their product. I can very easily imagine a developer saying "oh, why bother? it runs good enough in Cedega/WINE/etc". This way you have numbers to show up-front that porting may or may not be worth the trouble.
Ferinstance, I can use Cedega or Crossover (both worked at one time) to run 3D/CG hobbyist apps in Linux (DAZ|Studio, Poser)... If I can show the producer how much faster, say, a frame render would complete natively vs. under emulation (games performance make a damned good comparator in many aspects), it's one less argument to have to chew on so much.
Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
Absolutely, completely wrong. Turn based strategy is the true test of skill. It doesn't matter if you're an 80 year old paraplegic in a wheelchair or a 16 year old teenager. Everyone competes equally. FPS is just about who can react faster. Big deal.
Close. The open-source bits of Cedega are LGPL'd or AFPL'd. The closed-source bits (the Cedega GUI, the copy-protection modules, and IIRC some DirectX goodies), plus the binary packaging and official support, are what you actually pay for.
the coolest club on
What good is the CVS if it doesn't run?
I tried it, and it compiled correctly, but it failed to run because it was missing some library that I couldn't find anywhere. Plus, it overwrites WINE. >:(
I talked it over with some more experienced linux users and they are of the opinion the CVS version is intentionally hard to use, and even lacking in features, in order to force people to buy the commercial version.
Transgaming negotiated with game companies and are required to close the source. The agreement was that if game companies are going to share their copy protection code with Transgaming then they need to not release that code under the GPL in Cadega. Seems ok to me.
Obviously free software is good but if a company is worried about the "viral nature" of the GPL they need to have some assurance that when they work with free software they are not going to get their code displayed for all to see. Ya the Transgaming people made a deal with the devil, get over it.
unzip; strip; touch; finger; mount; fsck; more; yes; unmount; sleep
not really, I like to play CS and HL2 Deathmatch, even with latency near 200 I do about the same score wise. There is a great deal of inante ability necessary but when you play the skill is all down to you, did you dpot that go running along the second floor, are you going to take the stair to head him off, what route do you go to get to the sniper, team play, how acurate is your aiming. I've always found RTS games require 1 strategy build a base go insane wasting 90% of resources on making an incredible defense then go away for half an hour as you start building a redicioulus sized army (scout the enemey and tailor army to match his/her units) then send out insane sized army while creating a secondary force, once the secondary force is half way complete, attack then attack with primary amd send in secondary force as re-enforcements. A single strategy thats worked since C&C from single player to multiplayer, it only get interesting on who can do it first. Game like FF are save, play against monster if you scrape a win reload and then grind until your double your current level then repeat, when the games online research the untouchable level grind till you get there. Niether requires much in the way of real skill however. Driving and FPS games do
Umm, really? Transgaming originally forked wine because the license went from the more permissible license which allowed them to have a closed version (safedisk, etc) to the LGPL (to prevent some of the games transgaming was playing). You can indeed get a source tree for transgaming, minus all the things like safedisk that are in their commercial version.
Sort of open source. It'd be nice if they contributed changes upstream to the WINE project. Many of the problems they've had with games certain (esp older) games not working would be fixed if they used a recent version of WINE. (Un)Fortunately WINE wised-up and stopped using the MIT license, so Cedega development has suffered.
CrossOver Office contributes their changes, and they continue to exist and earn money. We could have had good D3D support in Wine a long time ago if Transgaming wasn't a bunch of freeloading asshats.
I thought Cedega had killed Linux years ago.....and that all Linux gamers have since switched to Windows, and that Cedega, not competetion from consoles, had killed Linux gaming for good, and blah blah blah blah.
For high level play, FPS is purely about the mindgames. It's assumed that everyone has near perfect twitch ability, so the only distinguishing factor is your ability to predict your opponent's moves while remaining as unpredictable as possible yourself. In this respect the FPS is very similar to the Street Fighter style fighting game.
That simply isn't the case.
Firstly, the sourcecode has never been GPL, it is a mix of AFPL, LGPL and proprietary licensed code that is not included on the CVS.
Secondly, the CVS hasn't been updated for ages.
I had old winx 2. something, but couln't find it, and I have tried downloading from torrent, but asked me information about logging on to get key or some such. WTF?
Can you even buy a few months anymore, and play your games?
The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions that I wish it to be always kept alive
Wall of Text hits you for 43124 (crushing).
Your equipped items suffer a 10% durability loss.
You are dead.
Nice... Even the mirror is slashdotted. :-) lol
But this is slashdot. A slashdoter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber!
I believe there's a Doom 3 client for Linux and I know for certain there's an Enemy-Territory version for Linux. What's the point of benchmarking? They trying to show that the CEDEGA implementation is good when compared to the client running natively under linux and how that cmopares to those clients running under windows?
You can lead a man with reason but you can't make him think.
But if you try to redistribute it, Transgaming will change their license to prevent you from doing so.
The good thing is that QEmu is finally at sufficient quality and speed to replace VMWare, so I have a good alternative now. Still... I'm disappointed about the lack of Wine. Sometimes its nice to run something w/o the overhead of a full VM.
Method of processing duck feet
since wine aims to provide a directx compatible windows api, is directx a hack too?
I've tried BlorgOS but I actually prefer its cousin, BorgOS. It's superior in that it uses you as its soundcard, and just about everything else while it's at it.
(In mother Russia...)
for running Windows games under Linux.
What needs to happen is for gaming companies to write Linux versions of games so that there won't be any performance issues due to running in some Windows environment or emulator.
I think the fact that many are buying Cedega and other Windows environment programs to play Windows games under Linux shows that there is a need for Linux native games.
My brother is a Gamehead and the only reason that he uses Windows XP still is because running the Windows games under Linux gives him great lag and performance issues. He says that if they wrote Linux native versions of the games, he'd switch to Linux.
Remember, Slashdot does not have a -1 disagree moderation, and no, troll, flamebait, and overrated are not substitutes.
Adult.
*burble*
(:
Quack, quack.
To more effectively karma-whore, you should first consider learning the base skill of paragraph-whoring :)
My blog. Good stuff (when I remember to update it). Read it.
I got owned by the fact that there is no edit button. Welcome to the year 2000.
For chrissake use punctuation and paragraphs. What's the matter with you? Even if your point is valid, I can't understand a damn thing you wrote.
Wow... I'm actually still a subscriber... but I hardly ever use it.
Just the other day I was thinking "Maybe I should cancel that... they haven't come out with any real improvements in a while"... Lo and Behold....
I'll give it a whirl and see if I can spend some more time in Linux...
Derek
And on top of that, according to reliable reports, cedega is only marginally more stable than Wine ever was. Which in my opinion is not worth five bucks, especially given how much progress Wine has made in the last year or so in terms of compatability. Heck, the latest version can even run WoW with minimal amounts of fuss (according to its rank, which is Gold). And I'd rather wait for someone to brute-force copy protection in a free way instead of having to be at the mercy of those that provide it.
Cedega doesn't need your support. Wine does. Give the latest version a spin, download it, and provide bug reports for your favorite games so the remaining bugaboos can be fixed up.
I'm the guy with the unpopular opinion
Why? No offense I'm not trying to be insightful or anything my spelling and grammar have always sucked and the only reason I'm even on slashdot is because I need a break from writing a project report its nice not having to use big words, check for grammatical correctness and worry about the flow of a paragraph for a minute and try to ask a question that makes the poster attempt to actually justify their comment, but since you asked:
FPS games do not just rely on fast reaction times, I like to play CS and HL2 Deathmatch. Even when suffering from high latency (150 to 200) my score doesn't change much. There is a great deal of innate ability necessary to play a FPS game but, when you play the it is all down to you. Did you spot that guy running along the second floor? Are you going to take the stairs to head him off? What route do you go to get to the sniper? Team play? How accurate is your aiming?
I've always found RTS games require a single strategy which is to build a base, waste 90% of resources on building an incredible defence, While your defence keeps the attackers at bay leave for half an hour with your manufacturing facilities set to build a ridiculous sized army (scout the enemy and tailor army to match his/her units.) Once this is complete send out your army, as this army moves into position start creating a secondary force which is equal or half of your current force, once the secondary force is half way complete attack your enemy. Attack with the primary force and send in the secondary force as re-enforcements. A single strategy that's worked since C&C in single player and multiplayer, the only interesting aspect is when other human players use the same strategy and it becomes a game of who can get their army built first.
Games like Final Fantasy are very formulaic. First save your game, play against the next monster if you scrape a win then reload your game and level grind until your double the original level. When the games are online, all you have to do is research the 'untouchable' level and grind until you get to that level. Neither requires much in the way of real skill, just patience.
Driving and FPS games do rely on the players natural skill.
I'm glad my car doesn't go 200mph, because the temptation of all that raw horsepower will be too great to resist. High speed pursuits and law enforcement derived beatings will certainly ensue. It's a used geo metro for me.
This sig has been temporarily disconnected or is no longer in service
You got owned by the fact that you were too lazy to use the preview button.
Yes, there are native clients for both games. The Doom3 client actually uses the same data as the Windows one, it's really a small download, consisting of little else than the binary itself. Funny how they benchmark two of the very few popular games that have native Linux clients, indeed.
What a HORRIBLE review done in TFA. It only compares games whose rendering engine is OpenGL (doom3 and enemy territory). I don't give a shit about how Cedega "emulates" OpenGL games. All it's doing is forwarding those requests unmodified (or maybe *slightly* modified) to the native OpenGL subsystem running on the Linux box. What I, and I'm assuming all others out there are concerned with, is gaming performance when Cedega is actually emulating Direc3D calls. Not only are there barely any game companies left that use OpenGL for their games, but the ones that do (ID Software, Epic) already have versions of their games for Linux. The fact that games utilizing Direc3D are omitted from the Cedega benchmarks listed in the article implies to me that it's probably not even worth the trouble of trying it out...
"Use the Preview Button! Check those URLs!"
Been there on the page for like 10 years now
In my experience Doom III played better on Linux than it did with Windows on the exact same system.
Make SELinux enforcing again!
Cedega Emulates Direct Ex Games (Almost)?
[ok, so I had to cheat a bit...]
deus does not exist but if he does
They tested games that also run natively on Linux, emulating the Windows versions of them via WINE/Cedega is going to get you good performance. The games also use OpenGL, which leads to low Vista results and high performance everywhere else. A better test of performance across the board would be to use games like Half Life 2 that can use different DirectX versions. WINE has made great progress (can't comment on Cedega) but unless you've got some programming ability or want to run a popular program then you are out of luck.
Why? Because if you're going to bother posting at all, ostensibly so that other people can real the textual expression of your ideas and opinions, you may as well make it readable. If you don't care about other people's ability to understand your post, why bother posting at all?
Well, of course you will lose if you have slow reflexes. FPSs aren't for everyone. But "twitch", as in snap aiming skill, is developed by training. Once you've trained this skill enough that you're into severely diminishing returns and can hit a fast moving target from across the map, then things become interesting.
a game will come out on Windows that simulates Linux within it and someone will run it on Cedega on Linux and create a rip in spacetime.
In the meantime, I see no point in emulating Windows guts on Linux just to play games. I'll stick with XP for that. When the Linux community gets its head out of its rear regarding making money being evil, intellectual property ownership being evil, corporate regimentation in product development via economically sustainable business investment, and mere polite cooperation and gets something going on *nix comparable to Active X, because OpenGL AIN'T it, then we can see about games on Linux.
Until then, XP is where it is at. Sad that an OS platform like Linux which is not nearly so heavily loaded right at the finish of booting to a GUI desktop as Windows is and Vista even more so, cannot get out of its own way. This property of DOS, dedication to the task at hand with all else shoved out of the way, was what made Doom rock compared to the best of early Windows games. Linux can do this and still multitask. XP pretty much sort of agrees to cooperate and Vists basically says screw you, the OS and every damn tchtochke code piece MS could toss in comes first no matter what and your needs dead last.
Wake up Linux idiots! Time to shine, time to seize the day! Don't make the mistake the Macintosh cultists took! Seize victory from the jaws of defeat and not the other way around. Make gaming on the Linux platform family easy, fast, and mind blowing.
For pete's sake, just with OpenGL the Really Slick Screensavers rock. The proper nVidia drivers make Tux Racer fly. And yet you still maintain a Windows box for freaking Rainbox Six!
If my grammar and spelling are off, I am [distracted/tired/careless] (take your pick)
That's the point. So they can compare the Windows version, the Linux version, & the Windows version on both Wine & Cedega. This lets the folk doing the benchmark figure out how much overhead there is to wine & cedega and show if it perform better, worse, or the same than playing games natively.
I have a very small mind and must live with it.
-- E. Dijkstra
First of all, Transgaming really doesn't have much in the way of changes to contribute. They license, rather than develop in-house. CrossOver/Codeweavers is Wine, more or less. They bankroll the thing and have all the key developers on their payroll.
Jesus is coming -- look busy!
where credit is due? Namely, CodeWeavers? I agree that the TransGaming/Cedega crew has acted objectionably and their product is questionable. CodeWeavers are a much better example of OSS stewardship with a product that I think is actually worthwhile *and* worth supporting.
:)
I'm all for railing as much as anyone else, but if you're going to slam a company and there is another doing exactly what you feel the first should be doing, giving that other company credit is always a nice thing to do.
Quack, quack.
I tried that.
It's bull. The CVS source doesn't even come close to compiling or running. You can't even start to compile it without a many-years-old unmaintained version of flex.
Wine just compiles. Winex doesn't.
My blog: http://www.seebs.net/log/ --- My iPhone/iPad app: http://www.seebs.net/seebsfrac/
Note that AFPL is not properly open-source: it restricts commercial redistribution.
Would people stop spreading this Cedegra is open source nonsense. There is some source available for Cedegra but only what they have to make available under the terms of the LGPL. Some is actually under the AFPL which is not an open source license at all because it bars commercial distribution. Everything that they can get away with not opening up isn't opened up. The CVS isn't compilable or even up to date.
Most won't see that, and the sig was one letter too long for slashdotter....
But this is slashdot. A slashdoter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber!
Not to forget that OpenGL can not be compared to DirectX as DirectX besides Direct3D, there are a lot of other full fledged features as DirectInput, DirectPlay, DirectSound, DirectMusic, DirectSetup, DirectX-Media and DirectX Media Objects (Look at wikipedia for a description of all of those), all of that in one lean package and consistent APIs (through all of them... of course the darn version function suffixes are shit).
Whereas in Linux you'll have to make a mutant join of SDL(with all the half assed libraries that were never finished to play) OpenAL OpenGL Allegro X11 , TCP/IP freetype, ffmpeg etc etc etc etc...
I know because I have developed games in both of them.
As a personal opinion, I still prefer the OpenGL modeling approach (against the Direct3D one), as it is cleaner. I use it when doing scientific 3D visualization apps (which do not need all the other media things).
Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
My Gosh ! For how long have you been not playing online ? This strategy might have worked in the infancy of C&C when nobody really knew how to play, but these happy times are over. If it was that straightforward to win, it would be really easy to make computer opponents that would outright crush you. However, it appears that in most strategy games, the AI is unable to beat experienced players without having to resort on cheating (having an economy boost, their build time reduced, etc...).
In opposition, you can make FPS bots with insane reaction times. They might be challenged in gametypes requiring a strong team strategy (Team DM with spawning weapons, multiclass games such as TF/Gloom/Tremulous), but in my opinion, they are much more effective than their strategy games counterparts. And they will own Free For All games.
By the way, you might have noticed that your parent did not talk about Real Time Strategy games (RTS), but about Turn Based Strategy games (TBS).
Every time someone mods satire as Troll, Baby Jesus cries.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
I didn't make a statement on CodeWavers precisely becauase I haven't checked them out personally, due to me not particularly needing many Windows productivity applications since the Linux ones are almost as nice.
However, I'll take your word for it unless someone posts to the contrary. In fact, since you say such nice things about them, I might have to give Codeweavers a spin out of principle. =)
I'm the guy with the unpopular opinion
Fair enough. They are the corporate sponsors of the Wine project, so they do have OSS cred. (:
Quack, quack.