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IBM to Regulate Employee Second Life Behavior

mytrip writes "In hopes of avoiding potentially embarrassing incidents, IBM is taking the unusual step of establishing official guidelines for its more than 5,000 employees who inhabit Second Life and other virtual worlds. 'IBM appears to be the first corporation to create rules governing virtual worlds. The move has critics, who say that mandating behavior for the so-called "metaverse" is unlikely to reform impish avatars. They also question why IBM would add a layer of buttoned-down bureaucracy to this relatively rollicking corner of the Internet. IBM executives counter that having a code of conduct is akin to a corporate stamp of approval, encouraging workers to explore more than 100 worlds IBM collectively calls the 3D Internet.'" This regulation may be coming from more than self-interest: IBM sees these environments as management training courses in some ways; working inter-personal skills via chat and human resources via guild activities.

165 comments

  1. Um... by Dragonshed · · Score: 4, Funny

    So IBM sanctions playing Secondlife while on the clock?

    This, I have to see for myself.

    1. Re:Um... by JustNiz · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I admit up-front that I don't 'get' the whole second-life thing. It only took me about 20 minutes to realise how dull and pointless it is. There's nothing going on, loads of places you can't go, and its totally boring just wandering around. Also even on broadband the crappy world graphics update so slowly its painful. Literally. You can bump into walls even minutes before they get drawn.

      So I wouldn't classify second life as a game as there is no fun or objectives and its very clunky so 'playing' it isn't accurate.

    2. Re:Um... by timster · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Years after most people had figured out that the Internet wasn't a virtual world, the idiot media was still going on about "cyberspace". So somebody figured out that if you actually developed the product that the idiot media imagined, you'd get loads of free PR. It doesn't matter that the product is useless.

      --
      I have seen the future, and it is inconvenient.
    3. Re:Um... by Stalus · · Score: 2, Interesting

      IBM isn't sanctioning 'playing' Second Life. They're sanctioning business activities in Second Life, hence the guidelines. They're going to have guidelines for anything where employees are doing things on the clock in a public space. Plus, if some guy is burning half his time in some virtual dance club, he's probably not going to look so great when it comes around to evaluations.

      But, yes. IBM is a tech company. They have islands in Second Life, and there are certainly people who have legitimate reasons to be exploring and doing things there on the clock, so why would it be a surprise that they'd sanction this?

    4. Re:Um... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      > So IBM sanctions playing Secondlife while on the clock?
      >This, I have to see for myself.

      Q: What do you get when you cross Second Life with IBM?
      A: Solutions for a small planet: Charlie Chaplin dressed up a Big Blue fursuit.

      No, I do not want to see for myself.

    5. Re:Um... by xednieht · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Short-term technical limitation aside it seems that you actually do get it quite well... It is a game only to the extent that life is a game. Therefore you are quite right when you say "'playing' isn't accurate."

      Never-the-less interacting with digital representations of physical objects is a lot more intuitive than 'click this' or 'click that' blah blah blah that you get on current websites. Consider the possibility of an integration of something like SecondLife with something like Google Earth and replace all those web servers on the Internet with 'web servers' that can model the objects and then you would truly have the real Web 2.0.

      I believe IBM has it right and have a big stake in it. If they integrate the Linden technology into Websphere.... wow that would be awesome.

      --

      Hope is the currency of fools
    6. Re:Um... by UncleTogie · · Score: 1

      Never-the-less interacting with digital representations of physical objects is a lot more intuitive than 'click this' or 'click that' blah blah blah that you get on current websites.

      ...what makes "digital representation of physical objects" so different from a "Buy it now!" button? The button is just that; a digital representation of a "real" button.

      --
      Don't tell me to get a life. I'm a gamer; I have LOTS of lives!
    7. Re:Um... by Arthur+B. · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I wish I could mod you up. The vision of Internet as a 3D cyberworld completly lacks of imagination, it reuuses what we have to try and predict the future... The internet forum for example has evolved to a specific form which is extremely efficient to handle its task. Absolutely nothing looked like an internet forum 50 years ago...

      A cyberspace import limitation of the physical world that get in the way... brought to you by the same people who imagined giant network of tubes to deliver mails.

      --
      \u262D = \u5350
    8. Re:Um... by AIM_is_t3h_sux · · Score: 0

      How is a virtual world useless? It cuts a given company's travel expenses while maintaining some of that "personal touch" so many customers look for in the real world. I agree with you that the "idiot media" does hype up that which it does not understand. However, this "Second Life" product is useful in so many different situations (making telecommuters feel like they are right there in the office, to teaching kids in remote parts of the world with a more personal touch, etc.) that to discredit it is to go against the grain for the sake of going against the grain.

    9. Re:Um... by xednieht · · Score: 1

      You will see precious, oh yes!!! you will see...

      --

      Hope is the currency of fools
    10. Re:Um... by recharged95 · · Score: 1
      So this means:

      • now that IBM can make money off gambling, or other tax-manuever VR biz epmployees need to watch themselves. So much for making money on company time off customer's high charge rate.
      • You must wera the trademark blue, short sleeved shirt for now on
      • I have to admit IBM is a great company for the virtual world to create virtual apps (or is it that's what they do in the real world?).

    11. Re:Um... by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1
      How is a virtual world useless?

      It emulates a world, and it requires undivided (or nearly so) attention while being "in" the world. The Internet and Internet messaging media are very useful _because_ you can multi-task whilst using them. Second Life/Metaverses/whatever seem like they'd be *more* time consuming than operating in the real world.

      -b.

    12. Re:Um... by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1
      Never-the-less interacting with digital representations of physical objects is a lot more intuitive than 'click this' or 'click that' blah blah blah that you get on current websites. Consider the possibility of an integration of something like SecondLife with something like Google Earth and replace all those web servers on the Internet with 'web servers' that can model the objects and then you would truly have the real Web 2.0.

      The "clicking" interface is actually pretty consistent, unlike a simulation of real life where you have to explore to find stuff. And clicking/searching around is actually a pretty fast way to deal with a lot of textual/photographic information. Second Life interposes most of the inefficiencies of "real life" onto the Internet, and is a parallel niche, not a replacement. And, yes, it's good for some things -- companies that build things like cars or houses could have a presence to show their wares, and it's may even be good for some types of training (I've heard of it being used for EMT training).

      However, for socializing? No thanks -- I'd rather either talk to someone on the phone, use text chat and do other things as well, or, best of all, go out and DO something. Something sterile and contrived like Second Life can't replace real human interaction. For business? Maybe in a limited set of cases, but face-to-face still is best, or you can use voice chat or online chat (which allow you to multi-task).

      If you could have truly automated robotic avatars, things might get interesting, but then again, what's the advantage over a Web page for most tasks?

      -b.

    13. Re:Um... by TechnicolourSquirrel · · Score: 1

      Years after most people had figured out that the Internet wasn't a virtual world, the idiot media was still going on about "cyberspace". So somebody figured out that if you actually developed the product that the idiot media imagined, you'd get loads of free PR. It doesn't matter that the product is useless. So then ... I guess the hype about the internet was way better than the reality. Oh, and that opinion itself is just hype....since the hyped version is actually way worse than the reality ... or something? Trying to make sense of your reasoning here turns me in circles, because you see it's impossible for me to believe that a software idea that could capture the imagination of the whole online planet and yet not have any uses.
    14. Re:Um... by xednieht · · Score: 1

      Sorry but you could not be more wrong... I have to bite my tongue and deal with it I guess but consider this:

      Do you know how to say the word "key" or "door" in 239 languages... i don't

      Do you know how to say the words "buy now" in 239 languages... i don't

      I can show a key to anyone from any country and they know instantly what it is and what is is used for.

      To me earth is just one big space station and what bugs me is that I can't communicate with most of the rest of it's inhabitants.

      From any angle you can consider the textual Internet is far from what it can be...

      --

      Hope is the currency of fools
    15. Re:Um... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How is a Second Life meeting better than a real world video conference call? They both cut travel expenses.

    16. Re:Um... by sgant · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Don't worry, I'm right with you. And I seriously doubt there are 5000 IBM employees playing this. There's not even 5000 people in the world playing this. Ever go there? I log on every once in a while just to look and it's a ghost town. Every time I go there, I never ever see anyone else in the actual world. The only time you actually see other people is at the starting island where you make your character and learn how to move. Other than that, it's a virtual ghost town....filled with buildings that you have to stand and wait to render/download to your computer (in other words, TONS of pop-up geometry).

      Second Life is ALL hype, little to no substance. One thing that Second Life does well is marketing and generating buzz. You hear about it all the time in the media...but it's just nothing there.

      --

      "Leo Fender was in a 'state of grace' when he designed the Stratocaster." -- Paul Reed Smith
    17. Re:Um... by ta_relax · · Score: 1

      Internet forum evolved to its current form through technological limitations during its history. If anyone started designing a forum today or in the near future from scratch when 3D graphic cards are dirt cheap, then participants would express themselves and interact with each other graphically (people love expressing themselves, especially visually) and forums would look quite a bit like cyberworlds. Besides, the idea of cyberworld is hardly old (70s or 80s? has not done homework, references?). If you find it unimaginative, this is proof alone that it has become part of our lives already in conceptual form!

    18. Re:Um... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      To me earth is just one big space station and what bugs me is that I can't communicate with most of the rest of it's inhabitants.
      It doesn't bug them. In fact they're pretty relieved.
    19. Re:Um... by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1
      Sorry but you could not be more wrong... I have to bite my tongue and deal with it I guess but consider this:

      It's not impossible to create a symbolic point-and-click interface if you really wanted to. And I suppose that language-agnostic applications might be another good use for the "metaverse." This still doesn't change the fact that an interface designed to emulate real life has most of the disadvantages of real life as well. It's also not too usable on mobile devices with small screens and slow connections. But as I said, it does have its uses. Just not as a replacement for the textual Web.

      -b.

    20. Re:Um... by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1
      If anyone started designing a forum today or in the near future from scratch when 3D graphic cards are dirt cheap, then participants would express themselves and interact with each other graphically (people love expressing themselves, especially visually) and forums would look quite a bit like cyberworlds.

      A lot of information is in textual form. A full-scale cyberworld doesn't help you organize that info, and having to "move around" it to find info would be a hindrance not a help. An emulation of a world takes more attention to use than a Web-type interface.

      It does have its place though, for things like demonstrating products for sale, apartments, teaching stuff that involves moving around... But I think that 3-D animations, visuals, and linke to Second Life areas might ultimately be incorporated into the Web via links and viewers rather than being a seperate Web.

      -b.

    21. Re:Um... by Criterion · · Score: 1

      "now that IBM can make money off gambling"

      Since LL have just banned gambling I surely don't see a point here.

      --
      We have enough youth, how about a fountain of SMART?
    22. Re:Um... by Criterion · · Score: 1

      Ah, the mindset that wants SL to be a game, and for everything there to have some relevance to them. Thats just not how it works, and there are certainly way more than 5000 people there. That you have not found your place there does not take away from the fact that many others have.

      --
      We have enough youth, how about a fountain of SMART?
    23. Re:Um... by Seumas · · Score: 1

      I've been telecommuting my entire career and I would never sink low enough to waste my time and CPU cycles in a "virtual office" in Second Life. Seriously, how is that a personal touch?

      Email. Jabber. Telephone.

      To wrap oneself up with the whole idea that there is some real benefit in walking around a crappy 3D floor-show to interview with crappy 3D recruiters and attend crappy 3D training sessions or work in a crappy 3D office is to go along with the hype for the sake of going along with the hype.

      Or, to put it in a more familiar way -- companies in Second Life should be taken about as seriously as companies who still preface their name with a lower case 'i' or hyphenated 'e', other than Apple.

    24. Re:Um... by Unequivocal · · Score: 1

      I agree with you, but SL isn't really meant to be a game. In this context SL is more of a toy. Unlike games, toys aren't goal or end-point oriented, they are open ended.

      More substantially to your point, I think that SL and other v-worlds are "lowest common denominator" kind of systems. They appeal to many people who cannot make sense of the "real" internet. So my father will think SL is "cool" (or "boss" in his idiom). He can immediately understand it, yet he can still take advantage of certain communication systems that he would probably not engage with through the traditional internet (multi-person chat & on-line shopping are easy examples). It's not b/c he's incompetent to log into Amazon and buy something there but going to a book store in SL (I assume there must be such a place) would be much more intuitive and appealing for him - and in the end he'd still buy a book over the internet..

      I'm not saying all SL'ers are noobs - just that noobs "get it" in SL much more quickly than they do on the internet, and that makes v-world tech potentially very powerful. Certainly as another child post says, reporters are noobs; reporters "get" SL, therefore reporters write about SL all the time. It's great press. But we must ask ourselves why reporters get SL and can write copy about it that their readers understand..

    25. Re:Um... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The real value is the laughs you get when you see how serious some people take it.

      To quote someone in-world I talked to

      "IT IS NOT A GAME. IT IS REVOLUTION. CALL IT THAT AGAIN AND I WILL REPORT YOU FOR GRIEFING."

      btw, "griefing" is a stupid replacement term for trolling. and it can get you hardware blocked from the game, just on someone's say so.

      which is why it's important to piss as many people off as possible. :)

      Seriously though, the real reason why everything was empty and dead is because a few people are out shopping for clothing to dress up their virtual barbies. ..the rest are buying sex shit, and having cybersex, or soliciting it.

      Then you have spies who basically plant devices to listen in on conversations to get groups they don't like banned.

      It's basically a mirror of reality if morals didn't apply, or physical harm applied run by a totalitarian regime.

      yeah, it's as fucked up as it sounds.

    26. Re:Um... by mwvdlee · · Score: 1

      It just a 3D version of IRC.

      You can chat (or interact) with anybody in the channel (piece of 3D land) you're in and you can build objects (like colored text) and script (like bots). Second Life basically caters to the same audience that IRC does.

      If you prefer not to speak to people on the internet or if you prefer being entertained as opposed to creating your own entertainment, Second Life is not for you. If chatting, painting, programming, moddeling or making music is boring to you, Second Life will be too. If you do like social or creative activities, Second Life may have something fun to offer.

      --
      Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
    27. Re:Um... by ta_relax · · Score: 1

      Good points. I guess we will wait and see which one gets embedded into which. My guess is 2D will be embedded into 3D simply because it is a subset of the other and not vice versa. You can link from pages to locations but it would be more artificial than putting documents into places.

    28. Re:Um... by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1
      My guess is 2D will be embedded into 3D simply because it is a subset of the other and not vice versa.


      But maybe the 3D interface for browsing documents won't look anything like "real life" or be a stylized version thereof. (Just like a desktop on a computer now doesn't look much like a desk!)


      -b.

  2. So...? by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 1

    When logged onto Second Life at work (or presumably using the same account you use at work), they want you to project the corporate image. This seems reasonable, although perhaps overly anal.

    --
    Your ad here. Ask me how!
    1. Re:So...? by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 1

      It's reasonable only when you say in game that you work for IBM other then STAY THE F*** OUT of my home life. You job does not take full control of your life and they should not be able to tell you what you can do on your time off there is one place that tried to fire people who where smoking in there off time It is ok to say no smoking at the office but at home? Also what is next beer, types food that they don't like, pop, and other things you do on your time off.

    2. Re:So...? by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 3, Insightful

      There are political considerations, of course.

      Say, for example, the guys down the hall have been at the company for ten years, and you're a new hire, and they issue to you a challenge to be able to code $something, or find a bug in a particular process, or prove to them how a particular bug can be turned into an exploit. And they're all be-boppin' 'n' scattin' all over you every time they see you, frat boy hazing style, and constantly giving you digs about how,"If you were any sort of real programmer you'd have it done by now" while, in private, constantly reassuring you that it's impossible because they have never been able to do it.

      Then, one day, you pull it off. And all of they're be-boppin' 'n' scattin' and taunts and hazing comes back on them from the people in the other building who've been quietly hoping to hell you'll pull off the challenge because, several years back, their department got their budget slashed because the guys down the hall (who issued the challenge and followed it with taunting) managed to come up with a miraculous save on one of their projects and have been egotistical knuckleheads about it ever since. At least until you showed up and put their challenge right back up their nose (where it needed to be).

      So now you've become the unwitting participant in a five-to-ten year running ego war between two prominent researchers, both from lengthy lines of prominent publishing research groups, both managing groups of thirty to fifty people with budgets figured in the tens of millions.

      Kind of an awkward position, isn't it? Okay, but you're still proud of yourself that you managed to accomplish the $challenge.

      Then, one day, when you log on to Second Life... you find yourself surrounded by griefers who never go away and, the day you finally tell one of the griefers to "Shove it!" using rather colorful language, that day is immediately followed the next morning by a reprimand from corporate for not observing the corporate image online.

      And then you begin to get snyde in-the-hall comments from the be-boppin' 'n' scattin' hazing frat boy fanclub down the hall that, yes, they're the griefers who've been trolling you on Second Life... but there's nothing you can do about it because they turned you in to HR first, and anything you say now will need to go both against their collective reputation (which, given they came up with the miraculous breakthrough five years ago, is pretty darn big) and the impression that you're just a malcontent who's retaliating against "The Man" and with some psychotic conspiracy theory.

      No. No, and No. It is not a good idea for an employer to have any legal authority, either inside or outside the workplace, to observe, monitor, or check on anything you do once you leave their doors.

      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    3. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      You'd better hope that your company doesn't start cracking down on grammar in internet posts you make on your off time.

      I'm not even sure what your first "sentence" is supposed to mean.

    4. Re:So...? by EvanED · · Score: 4, Informative

      I have to say that this is one of the more.. fanciful... posts I've read here in a while.

    5. Re:So...? by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 1

      I know, I know: RTFA is a joke. RTFS is dead. RTFT happens on occasion. But would you mind RMFP (My F* Post) before replying. They want the avatars you use on company time to adhere to some decorum. Even if you use them also at home. TFA doesn't say explicitly, but implies these are IBM's avatars you may use from home (RTFA for context, I don't feel like retyping it here.) So, yes, they are saying in the game they work for IBM.

      --
      Your ad here. Ask me how!
    6. Re:So...? by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 0, Troll

      I know, I know: RTFA is a joke. How about Read the Fine Road Signs? Can you name one instance where a corporate policy used to regulate the workforce has ever been lessened? Am I the only person who looks to the future?
      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    7. Re:So...? by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 0, Troll

      What kind of company do you work in? In every company I've worked in that sort of game has been the rule of play. Always put the new guy in the middle of political power struggles--that way the major combatants don't get their hands dirty.

      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    8. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Am I the only person who looks to the future?
      If you've been looking to the future, how come you didn't see yourself being homeless for eight months and find a solution to prevent it? Or is that where the conspiracies come in to makeup for your failures?
    9. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your line of work must not have been that important if you've had time for all the politics you've claimed to be a victim of.

    10. Re:So...? by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Can you back that claim up? Do you know what my line of work was? What politics was I involved in?

      Do you know anything of what you're talking about or do you just come around to monitor and harass me?

      Why isn't your IP banned?

      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    11. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You job does not take full control of your life and they should not be able to tell you what you can do on your time off there is one place that tried to fire people who where smoking in there off time It is ok to say no smoking at the office but at home? Also what is next beer, types food that they don't like, pop, and other things you do on your time off.


      Have a toke and find out.
    12. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Taking into account the amount of bitching you do over trivial situations, I'd say your own character is substantially more backup to what I've said than any backup you've provided for your statements.

      Do you know anything of what you're talking about or do you just come to Slashdot to troll?

      Why isn't your IP banned?

    13. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      You left your job because you weren't able to play well with others, simple as that. The "failures" I'm referring to are your inability to obtain shelter and your habbit of substance abuse.

      How come nobody mods you troll?
      Quite simply because I'm not. You're modded as a troll because you are one.

      Why hasn't your IP been banned yet?
      Why would I be banned?

      Are you in Slashdot corporate?
      Yes.

      You haven't offered a single fact to support your harassment yet.
      How have you been harassed? No one is forcing you to respond. Set your threshold to +1. It's that simple.
    14. Re:So...? by fonik · · Score: 2, Informative

      I seem to be having the same problem today. I think Slashdot is getting "raided" by idiots from 4chan or something. Either that or the mods are all on acid.

    15. Re:So...? by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 1

      Can you name one instance where a corporate policy used to regulate the workforce has ever been lessened?

      Trivial. The payment of workers in company script, which allowed companies to regulate how the workforce spends their money, has been entirely elimiated.

      --
      Your ad here. Ask me how!
    16. Re:So...? by UncleTogie · · Score: 1

      Also what is next beer, types food that they don't like, pop, and other things you do on your time off.
      Ever have to take a urine/blood test for work?
      --
      Don't tell me to get a life. I'm a gamer; I have LOTS of lives!
    17. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Crazy baiting is probably bad form, ethically speaking.

    18. Re:So...? by Serzen · · Score: 1
      Erm, IBM actually has a long history of telling employees what to do when not at work. Policy used to be--and not even all that long ago--that employees wore a suit that met certain standards; dark gray or blue, I think. Even the janitors couldn't be seen entering or leaving the building without a suit. They had to wear a coat and tie to come to work, change into their other uniform when they got there, and back to the coat and tie when they left.


      In the '50s, you could be fired for cashing your paycheck anywhere that wasn't a bank. Feel like a drink after work? Stop at the bank first, because if you cash it at the bar, you won't have a job next week. Even though at least some IBMers were huge partyers (even a proper word there?) who could drink like there was no tomorrow (I say this from family experience), the company would not permit the public perception that IMBers did something as low-brow as go to a bar.

      Chances are, if you work for IBM, you're used to this sort of treatment and having some management guy come along and tell you what games you can and can't play, and how to "dress" in those games is just the regular old SNAFU that is IBM life.

    19. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Chances are, if you work for IBM, you're used to this sort of treatment and having some management guy come along and tell you what games you can and can't play, and how to "dress" in those games is just the regular old SNAFU that is IBM life.

      I worked for IBM from 1999 to 2003. The only time any manager ever mentioned outside behavior involved alcohol, specifically that IBMers are generally not expected to drink during lunch and return to work that day. (The exception was for client schmoozing of course.)

      If any manager had told me what to do on my time off, HR would have had a phone call within minutes.

    20. Re:So...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No matter how you bitch and dance, the last joke is still in your pants.

  3. Apparently. by khasim · · Score: 3, Insightful
    From TFA:

    IBM, whose 20th century employees were parodied as corporate cogs in matching navy suits, doesn't have an avatar dress code. But guidelines suggest being "especially sensitive to the appropriateness of your avatar or persona's appearance when you are meeting with IBM clients or conducting IBM business."

    Okay, aside from the concept of "meeting with IBM clients" in Second Life ... why not just go all the way and license something unique for your company sponsored avatars? Then, if you're representing the company, you use a company avatar.

    When you're on your own you can whatever you want to be.

    Seriously, anyone who needs to be told what is appropriate for meeting clients really should NOT be meeting clients. In real life or online.
    1. Re:Apparently. by karmaflux · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Seriously, anyone who needs to be told what is appropriate for meeting clients really should NOT be meeting clients. In real life or online.
      And what happens if someone slips through the radar, gets hired, and conducts IBM business dressed as a flying phallus? Do they fire him? Get sued for discrimination, because there's no written dress code? Not IBM. They've been in the game too long to make naive mistakes like the one you're advocating. It's a litigious society; if you expect something from someone, put it in writing. That's all they're doing here.
      --

      REM Old programmers don't die. They just GOSUB without RETURN.

    2. Re:Apparently. by Original+Replica · · Score: 1

      And what happens if someone slips through the radar, gets hired, and conducts IBM business dressed as a flying phallus?

      Then couldn't they be fired for conducting IBM business through a non-company avatar? Sidenote: Does the company you work for have a written policy against flashing clients?

      --
      We are all just people.
    3. Re:Apparently. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do people really do that? Why the hell would someone meet with clients in Second Life?!
      Its a video game. Just because it doesn't have any entertaining aspect doesn't change that fact. And, it being a freaking game aside, why would you pick Second Life to meet clients. I mean, why not, say, World of Warcraft? What really separates the two? The fact that one's actually fun? Fantasy elements versus fake daily life? Furthermore, why would anyone waste their time with virtual real life instead of actually living real life or playing a game that involves doing something you can't do in real life (like casting spells, shooting aliens, ect.)?
      Maybe I'm just stupid, but I don't get it.

    4. Re:Apparently. by jimpop · · Score: 1

      Does the company you work for have a written policy against flashing clients?

      Isn't that already covered by existing laws? Companies don't normally setup corporate regulations/requirements for existing case law. YMMV.

    5. Re:Apparently. by aix+tom · · Score: 1

      Maybe you could go into Second Live to play World of Warcraft, because you can afford a computer with better graphics in there? ;-)

    6. Re:Apparently. by Seumas · · Score: 1

      I would have a hard time taking an employer seriously if they were pandering to the Second Life thing. Let me say this now -- if you want to interview me in a virtual 3D environment where girls like to play dress up like barbie and people build and furnish houses, I have no interest in working for you. Let's be grown ups an I'll send you my resume. You read my resume. Then we have a phone call, an interview and a meeting.

      Here's a great policy for employees in Second Life: If you are stupid enough to waste your time playing Second Life, you are no longer employed by us.

  4. So... by bomanbot · · Score: 5, Funny

    No flying genitalia in IBM business attire then, eh?

  5. One has to wonder, however.... by mark-t · · Score: 3, Funny

    Are they suggesting that they should be able to govern how their employees spend their spare time, or are they just expecting their employees to play the game when they are supposed to be working?

    1. Re:One has to wonder, however.... by TheAwfulTruth · · Score: 2, Informative

      Obviously you didn't RTFM

      They are both giving good advice to their potentially noob employees about how to interact on line at ANY time, but then have specific guidlines that must be followed "When representing the company in a virtual world".

      It was all very straight forward looking.

      --
      Contrary to popular belief, coding is not all free blow-jobs and beer. Those things cost MONEY!
    2. Re:One has to wonder, however.... by jimpop · · Score: 1

      Are they suggesting that they should be able to govern how their employees spend their spare time, or are they just expecting their employees to play the game when they are supposed to be working?

      First, Second Life isn't a game, it's a metaverse. Secondly IBMers are IBMers 100% of the time. That is 24x7x365 they represent the company and are expected to do so with good taste. There is no 9 to 5 mentality at IBM, you get paid well to live and perform well, all of the time.

      Finally, IBM isn't governing how IBMers spend their spare time. IBM is providing guidelines for how their employees represent IBM regardless of the time of day or year. If and IBMer goes on vacation, and identifies themself as an IBMer, they have a responsibility to not dis-credit the IBM name. The same thing holds true with law enforcement officers, and other public officials (although public officials don't seem to try as hard as IBMers) ;-)

    3. Re:One has to wonder, however.... by Dragonslicer · · Score: 1

      Obviously you didn't RTFM Is the manual available to people that aren't IBM employees?
    4. Re:One has to wonder, however.... by Bastard+of+Subhumani · · Score: 1

      inally, IBM isn't governing how IBMers spend their spare time.
      From the rest of your post it would appear that there's no such thing.
      --
      Only three things are certain; death, taxes, and apocryphal quotations - Ben Franklin.
    5. Re:One has to wonder, however.... by jimpop · · Score: 1

      To be clear... IBM isn't governing how IBMers spend their spare time... unless those IBMers leverage IBM while on their spare time (i.e. American Airlines giving IBMers discounts on personal travel).

  6. mrrrph? by Lije+Baley · · Score: 1

    I'll see that Huh?, and raise you a WTF?

    --
    Strange things are afoot at the Circle-K.
  7. Rule number one by Bender+Unit+22 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    1) Don't use Second Life. It is embarrassing and no one in the real world cares besides the news media and misc. company bosses.

    (it is kinda like the "news media" just discovered that you can make a virtual world online)

    1. Re:Rule number one by Adambomb · · Score: 1

      (it is kinda like the "news media" just discovered that you can make a virtual world online) Nail on head sir.

      MUDs, MUCKs, BBS's, and my alltime nostalgia favorite Quantum Link using ye old accoustic coupler.

      Yeah second life requires a whole new train of thought because we must keep control of these newfangled virtual wo...wait what?
      --
      Ice Cream has no bones.
  8. "Second" Life? by mugnyte · · Score: 4, Funny


      IBM would like to discourage employees from

        aimless wandering around
        dressing up as a flying phallus (without a tie)
        crowding around the "hot looking"
        starting conversations with "check out my new script" ...oh and there's new rules for Second Life too.

    1. Re:"Second" Life? by f1r3f0g · · Score: 2, Funny

      starting conversations with "check out my new script"
      Is that the geek equivalent of "Hey Y'all! Watch this!"?
  9. Is it even legal? by ElGanzoLoco · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Honest question here (IANAL): can it even be legal for the employer to issue guidelines/codes of conduct for activities that are presumably not happening at the workplace?

    --
    Hello! I'm a disaster waiting to happen!
    1. Re:Is it even legal? by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 0

      can it even be legal for the employer to issue guidelines/codes of conduct for activities that are presumably not happening at the workplace? Most corporations already have an Employee Code of Conduct which includes admonitions for behavior outside the workplace. The enforceability of these is similar to EULAs: a million people never contest it, so it must be okay. If one person should ever contest it there's both an enormous legal hurdle (ie. the company can afford more lawyers than you can) and the precedent set by,"Those million people over there don't have a problem with it."

      Case closed.
      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    2. Re:Is it even legal? by Anarchitektur · · Score: 1

      Ever heard of random drug testing?

    3. Re:Is it even legal? by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Which means you can do what every your weant, as long as you pass the test while at work.

      'Drugs' have a special evil status now, so rules to apply when going after 'them'.

      Fucking Reagan

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:Is it even legal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Case closed.
      Thanks for your pseudo-analysis of the situation. What law school did you go to? Oh, that's right, you have no knowledge, background or experience in U.S., or any legal system. Thanks for your input, I'll take it as seriously as I would any other homeless persons'.
    5. Re:Is it even legal? by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 0, Redundant

      Oh, that's right, you have no knowledge, background or experience in U.S., or any legal system Can you offer any details to support this? How do you know I have no knowledge or background? Can you tell me of any prominent cases where EULAs have been ruled definitively invalid, and the ruling used to uphold other cases? Can you point to any cases where an employee has both won a case against an employer who was overbearing in regulating off-hours behavior and that case was used to set a precedent to tell other employers to back off?

      No, of course you can't, because you're just coming up with blanket questions to harass me, which you've been doing for eight months. How come nobody ever mods you the troll? How come your IP isn't banned? How come nobody ever questions your knowledge, experience, or your derogatory claims against me?
      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    6. Re:Is it even legal? by Ajehals · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't want a doctor / a pilot / a bus driver stoned whilst working, those are public safety related and there are laws against that kind of thing, enforcement and detection can be left up to people with the relevant powers.

      Saying that, I wouldn't want anyone who has any responsibility or access to anything remotely sensitive within my organisation to use drugs (all sorts of risk, from instability to susceptibility to blackmail or other pressure). I would however hope that my management team would detect any strange behaviour (never mind coming in stoned) and to deal with it, help where appropriate, disciplinary action or dismissal where necessary. In house drug testing however? No way - it violates privacy and destroys trust, especially if that testing does not include testing the board and senior staff.

      It is similar to alcohol in this regard (although not wholly). I don't care if you got drunk last night but it had better not impair your ability to work today, anybody failing to come back to work after a work function, or is late due to a hangover shouldn't bother coming back at all (if you really cant work with a hangover don't drink so much, or book a day off in advance.

    7. Re:Is it even legal? by Wordplay · · Score: 1

      As stated, this is more of a business thing.

      That said, "lifestyle discrimination" is legal in most places. More accurately, companies can discriminate based on anything not defined as illegal, and most states don't have any laws against discrimination aside from the usual protected classes (race, religion, medical, sexual preference (that's relatively recent, etc.).

      This is a particular problem for smokers and other people with unpopular habits. I once had a company threaten to fire me if I didn't quit, because another employee with smoke allergies complained that the smoke clinging to my clothing was causing issues. BS or not, I don't know, but it would have been perfectly legal for them to can me over it.

    8. Re:Is it even legal? by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 1, Insightful

      I wouldn't want a doctor / a pilot / a bus driver stoned whilst working, Why not? Have you smoked marijuana on a regular basis for any length of time? Do you personally believe that everyone suffers the same weakness which is exploited in government reports? How about doctors, pilots, or bus drivers working at high altitudes? Shouldn't the lack of oxygen predispose them to weakness? What? Oh... you mean they grow accustomed to it? Is that even possible in nature? *gasp* Shock and awe... I thought nobody would ever think of it.

      those are public safety related So is driving with one hand, listening to the radio, talking on the cell phone, dealing with kids in the back seat...

      I would however hope that my management team would detect any strange behaviour You mean the classical management behavior of being high-handed, abusive, derogatory, self-important, and dismissive of the concerns of the employees beneath them? Oh, you mean that's the acceptable "strange" behavior? Let's be honest with ourselves about this.

      It is similar to alcohol in this regard No, it's not, but you keep telling your ignorant, big bad self, that so that you can continue to spread the government line about the evils of that terrible plant.
      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    9. Re:Is it even legal? by Dhalka226 · · Score: 1

      big bad self

      You really shouldn't talk. Your entire post smacked of ego. It was one pure ad hominem attack wrapped in a lame attempt at sarcasm, and with absolutely no substance.

      You don't think marijuana is a problem? Fine. How about some research? How about some reasonable points to debate? Hell, how about anything other than the self-righteous crap you decided to spew instead?

      Nah. Much easier to just walk around in your sarcastic holier-than-thou way.

    10. Re:Is it even legal? by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 1

      You don't think marijuana is a problem? Fine. How about some research? Because, if it were truly dangerous to human life, then humans would avoid it the same way we avoid other poisons and strong hallucinogens. If it truly were evil then it wouldn't have a world-wide reputation (among actual users, as opposed to ignorant witch-hunters) as a peaceful drug, as a way to relax, and as a way to enjoy life.

      What is it about ten thousand years of historical record that is wiped away by eighty years of government lies?
      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    11. Re:Is it even legal? by XorNand · · Score: 1

      I recently met a person who works for the American Cancer Society and we got to talking about her job. They are explicitly prohibited from smoking on or off the job. They even sign a contract consenting to occasional searches of their personal effects for cigarettes (she didn't say if/how often that occurs though). I also remember reading about a private sector employer who enacted similar measures about a year ago. In Ohio I think? I'm sure a bit of googling would turn something up; it made quite a bit of press.

      --
      Entrepreneur : (noun), French for "unemployed"
    12. Re:Is it even legal? by magictiger · · Score: 1

      Because, if it were truly dangerous to human life, then humans would avoid it the same way we avoid other poisons and strong hallucinogens.

      You were doing so well right up until you crossed this line... at the beginning of your post. *sigh*

      Not like drugs are ever laced with anything... and you completely dismiss the fact that a lot of people actually ARE taking poisons. Some people avoid these things, but others actively seek them out.

      I'm not pro- or anti-drug. I think people should be allowed to do whatever the hell they want as long as it does not potentially impact me. Should someone be allowed to smoke up as long as they do it in private and stay in private until the effects have worn off? Yes. Should someone be allowed to take something that will drive them into a rage and potentially cause them to break into my home? Hell no. Should someone be allowed to drive while intoxicated? HELL no.

      Keep me (and others) out of it, and do whatever you want.

    13. Re:Is it even legal? by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 1

      Because, if it were truly dangerous to human life, then humans would avoid it the same way we avoid other poisons and strong hallucinogens. If it truly were evil then it wouldn't have a world-wide reputation (among actual users, as opposed to ignorant witch-hunters) as a peaceful drug, as a way to relax, and as a way to enjoy life. What is it about ten thousand years of historical record that is wiped away by eighty years of government lies?

      Would you be alright with me cutting, pasting, and attributing your comments in response to a thread about tobacco elsewhere on the tubes? Although, I would like to trade 80 to 60, as I believe that will be accurate.

      --
      Your ad here. Ask me how!
    14. Re:Is it even legal? by SeaFox · · Score: 1

      Ever heard of random drug testing?

      There's a [i]slight[/i] difference between your employer catching you doing substances (which may effect your performance on the job), and trying to dictate how you behave outside the workplace when you're doing nothing illegal.

      Frankly, if I'm having to follow someone else's code of conduct 24hrs a day, I expect to be compensated for it 24hrs a day.
    15. Re:Is it even legal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just make sure you are willing to give him a six figure job on a silver platter, else prepare for the ad hominem attacks.

    16. Re:Is it even legal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sorry, your arguement is baseless. Human life has seen human sacrafices, warfare, and slavery consistantly for over ten thousand years. Infact, they've been crucial points in our history. Why should we let government lies prevent these lifestyles? They are afterall done with the intention of relaxing and enjoying life.

    17. Re:Is it even legal? by Ajehals · · Score: 1

      Sorry for the late reply - I've been a little busy.


      Setting aside the personal attacks (as clearly this topic is one that you feel fairly strongly about) I think I can address your serious points.


      Firstly, with regard to the Doctor, Pilot, Bus Driver scenario, the question whether it would be acceptable for them to use drugs is fairly clear cut. Would you allow a doctor to treat you if he was a heavy heroin user? I assume here that the risks would be multiple, anything from the fact that his mental processes may be impaired through to the fact that he may be more prone to HIV or hepatitis etc... Personally I would prefer not to have to run additional risks. The same goes for the Pilot or Bus Driver, what if they had taken speed or a similar drug prior to getting behind the controls? Would you trust them to safely convey you from A to B?. In all these cases the drug user would be risking the lives of those around them, potentially to an extraordinary degree (especially in the case of the pilot). As such it is absolutely justifiable that people in these positions face legal repercussions if they act in such an irresponsible and dangerous manner, risking the lives of many people.

      So is driving with one hand, listening to the radio, talking on the cell phone, dealing with kids in the back seat...

      Yes that is potentially dangerous, and if a police officer feels that you are driving dangerously they are within their rights to stop you and tell you why you are acting inappropriately, or charging you with dangerous driving. just because one act of stupidity is commonplace does not mean that an even greater one is acceptable.


      Now at this point you felt the need to attack not what I said but your perception of it. So I will clarify

      If your idea of a management team is a group of people who are paid more than you, have arbitrary power over you but are in the end useless, then I agree with you. If I found a manager within an organisation who was being high-handed, abusive, derogatory, self-important, and dismissive of the concerns of the employees beneath them I would have them removed, they are not doing their job.

      Managers should be there to do the things that staff shouldn't need to come in contact with. Why would I bother an engineer with the details of how many consumables are being used within the office, or why should I have a programmer waste time organising a coding team's training or transport to a seminar? Managers should not be there to control people, they should be there to ensure their staff get what they need to do their job, and ensure that they have all the support that they can get. They should also be in a position to identify talent and recommend promotions.

      Talented people drive company's, not some thin definition of manager, or team leader, any company that has semi-qualified managers (or marketeers) directing technical projects, or doing any strategic planning without someone qualified to point them in the right direction wont do well, if you don't listen to your staff, what's the point in employing them?.


      Most importantly though a manager should be in the position to notice if a member on his team is not acting normally, and by normally I don't mean that they are acting with in some company accepted norms, but not acting how they normally act... That is not just in relation to drugs, but also to identify things like stress or depression, it happens, and when it does it needs to be fixed.

      I'm sorry that you seemed to take quite as much offence as you did, and I am fairly sure I didn't deserve an outright attack, but you should be able to acknowledge that drugs add risk to any given project, (as I said earlier, leaving aside all the medical elements, if drug use is illegal there will always be blackmail) and as such organisations should be able to take steps to minimise such risk, however forcing people (as a condition of employment) to have drug tests is not suitable outside of the police or the military.

    18. Re:Is it even legal? by Tsu+Doh+Nym · · Score: 1

      There's a [i]slight[/i] difference between your employer catching you doing substances (which may effect your performance on the job), and trying to dictate how you behave outside the workplace when you're doing nothing illegal.
      There are a lot of things outside of the workplace that "may" affect your performance on the job including your diet, your personal relationships and how much sleep and exercise you get. That reasoning would support employers intruding into these areas as well.

      As for the legality bit, remember that under US law people are supposed to be considered innocent until proved guilty by a competent court of law. A drug testing lab is not a competent court of law so failing a drug test does not mean a person is guilty of a crime. So while a person can be fired for failing a drug test, that cannot be rightfully extended to say that they doing something illegal (without a court determination to that effect).

      Frankly, if I'm having to follow someone else's code of conduct 24hrs a day, I expect to be compensated for it 24hrs a day.
      Then you may be disappointed.
    19. Re:Is it even legal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Firstly, with regard to the Doctor, Pilot, Bus Driver scenario, the question whether it would be acceptable for them to use drugs is fairly clear cut. Would you allow a doctor to treat you if he was a heavy heroin user?
      How about if he was a light heroin user? An occasional pot smoker? Wired out of his gourd on caffeine?
    20. Re:Is it even legal? by Tsu+Doh+Nym · · Score: 1

      Should someone be allowed to take something that will drive them into a rage and potentially cause them to break into my home?
      Ever heard of caffeine? Ever heard of 'roid rage? When was the last time you heard of marijuana inducing rage? I've got news for you: The movie "Reefer Madness" was all made up.
    21. Re:Is it even legal? by Ajehals · · Score: 1

      Its all about drawing a line somewhere isn't it. I wouldn't want a doctor treating me if he was just plain incompetent, and guess what - they try and test for that too. Are you honestly saying that rather than have limits (in some case somewhat arbitrary limits, but what socially defined limit isn't arbitrary.. ) you would allow everyone to act as they want, and as a by product potentially risk a huge number of lives? This isn't like preventing women becoming doctors or voting, no one choses the se they are born with (lets not over complicate that statement... )the doctor has (or had) a choice as to whether to use drugs, that choice is incompatible with his profession - one or the other needs to stop.

    22. Re:Is it even legal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Its all about drawing a line somewhere isn't it.
      Sometimes

      I wouldn't want a doctor treating me if he was just plain incompetent, and guess what - they try and test for that too.
      Me neither.

      Are you honestly saying that rather than have limits (in some case somewhat arbitrary limits, but what socially defined limit isn't arbitrary.. ) you would allow everyone to act as they want, and as a by product potentially risk a huge number of lives?
      Not all. Now you're trying to infer that I said something that clearly didn't. Just the opposite: I want to know everything about my doctor. I want to know what he/she did this weekend (is there trouble brewing?). I want to know about all his personal relationships (is he/she distracted?). I want to know about his/her health (medications, etc. Is a woman doctor "on her period"?). I should have a right to know anything that could possibly affect me.
    23. Re:Is it even legal? by Chandon+Seldon · · Score: 1

      Because, if it were truly dangerous to human life, then humans would avoid it the same way we avoid other poisons and strong hallucinogens. If it truly were evil then it wouldn't have a world-wide reputation (among actual users, as opposed to ignorant witch-hunters) as a peaceful drug, as a way to relax, and as a way to enjoy life.

      Just because the government lies about the harmful effects of marijuana does not mean that it's a good idea to be high all the time. There are two very real side effects of marijuana that you should keep in mind at all times:

      • If you've smoked in the last day or so, logical reasoning becomes more difficult. If you're a scientist or technician, this is really critical - but for any sort of normal lifestyle / normal job this has a detrimental effect on performance.
      • If you've smoked in the last week or so, your ability to retain new information suffers. The major effect of this is that some new skills that you would have learned easily you instead don't learn because they're "too much work". This is compounded by the time you spend actually high instead of doing something useful.

      I guess an easy way to think about it is this: Getting high is no worse than goofing off at school / work and spending all your free time watching reruns of lame shows on TV. It won't immediately and directly harm you, but you're still wasting your life.

      --
      -- The act of censorship is always worse than whatever is being censored. Always.
    24. Re:Is it even legal? by Ajehals · · Score: 1

      I'm sure it would be nice to guarantee your peace of mind by giving you all that information, not going to happen, so how about we decide what we think is important and create some rules, if they are enforced then our safety is nicely balanced with all the other things that are important like other people's privacy. All we have to so to create some arbitrary limits....

      In short, its not about what the doctor wants, (in this case to be a heavy heroin user) or about what you want (to know everything about the doctor that treats you). Its a compromise between the two, defined by a society and laid down in the rules that govern that society.

      To take my original point, it is fair for the police to test someone for drugs, after all they have to justify what they are doing to a high standard, in advance, and you have recourse if they fail to adhere to their procedures. It is not acceptable to have an employer randomly drug test his workforce, it is acceptable for an employer to have a zero tolerance policy where drugs are concerned and to sack transgressors.

      Anyway, enough of that.

    25. Re:Is it even legal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm sure it would be nice to guarantee your peace of mind by giving you all that information,
      It's not just my so-called "peace of mind", it's my and my CHILDREN's very life on the line!!!

      not going to happen,
      What, you claiming the ability to see the future? That's what they used to say about drug testing too but look what happened.

      how about we decide what we think is important and create some rules,
      And we need some new ones, like I said above.

      if they are enforced then our safety is nicely balanced with all the other things that are important like other people's privacy.
      My family's safety is more important than someone else's right to endanger that safety in "private".

      All we have to so to create some arbitrary limits....
      And those limits need to be based on what's most important: The safety of our families or someone's "privacy".

      In short, its not about what the doctor wants, (in this case to be a heavy heroin user) or about what you want (to know everything about the doctor that treats you). Its a compromise between the two, defined by a society and laid down in the rules that govern that society.
      Or to even be a "light" heroin user. They gave up the right to do anything to endanger patients when they became doctors. And they shouldn't be able to use "privacy" to hide those things either. If they don't like that, they shouldn't be doctors.

      To take my original point, it is fair for the police to test someone for drugs, after all they have to justify what they are doing to a high standard, in advance, and you have recourse if they fail to adhere to their procedures
      And for patients to test their doctors for the exact same reasons.
    26. Re:Is it even legal? by magictiger · · Score: 1
      Where did I mention marijuana? Oh yeah... I didn't. Congratulations on completely missing my point. There are more drugs out there than just marijuana, and several of them are illegal for legitimate reasons.

      I have yet to see anyone on such a caffeine rush that they lose control and bust down doors. I'm not saying it's impossible, but unlikely enough that I haven't heard of it.

      Should someone be allowed access to an amount of steroids that would cause them to go into a berserk rage? No.

    27. Re:Is it even legal? by Restil · · Score: 1

      The difference between a code of conduct and a EULA is that most codes of conduct are signed by the employee either at, before, or very shortly after getting hired. There IS a contract in place there. And as far as it being legal, there is a specific list of things that a company can't discriminate against, but how you choose to behave in public is not part of that list. It's also not helpful that challenges to codes of conduct only come about after said code of conduct has been violated and appropriate discipline enforced.

      -Restil

      --
      Play with my webcams and lights here
    28. Re:Is it even legal? by Anarchitektur · · Score: 1

      The only difference is context. They both operate under the premise that every employee is potentially guilty and they throw a fishing net out there to catch one of them. I don't object to something rational like a clause that says they reserve the right to test in the event drug abuse is suspected to have had something to do with a specific incident, but to have a policy of random testing mostly just creates problems that aren't really there. If someone's performance is not in question, where is the logic in a company throwing away a perfectly good employee because they failed a drug test due to a joint they smoked at a party over the weekend? In this regard, a casual user whose work was in no way affected is lumped into the same category as someone who comes into work with a needle still hanging out of his arm. So, because you can be fired for something you were doing in your own time, the company is controlling your life by making certain decisions for you.

  10. Guidelines by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    I'd love to see the IBM Employee Handbook section on yiffing etiquette.

  11. HR Drones by Trailwalker · · Score: 1

    attempt to justify their existence.

  12. RTFA by Wesley+Felter · · Score: 3, Informative

    The whole point of the rules is that IBM is using Second Life for business purposes. It's a no-brainer, really: if you're doing business in SL from the office during work hours then obviously you should act like it.

    1. Re:RTFA by forgotten_my_nick · · Score: 1

      The only problem where this falls over is after hours.

      The way the SL system is set up is you pick ONE character who represents you. If you want a second avatar you have to pay for both.

      So your employee in work using a work account is logged in on a free SL account (does IBM even supply SL accounts?). They do their job and go home.

      At home they log in on their own machine using the same free account are they still expected to behave as if in work?

      I think IBM would have a case if they supplied their employees with their own SL account.

      Although SL is seriously buggy and crashes a lot I can't see how anyone would use it as a stable platform to conduct business (no w32 jokes please. :p ).

  13. Yep. It's teh latest Intarwebs buzzword. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What's next, YouTube? Facebook? MySpace?

  14. Acceptable Second Life Behavior by Derek+Loev · · Score: 2, Funny

    Damn, all this world needs is another 5,000 people in blue suits.

    1. Re:Acceptable Second Life Behavior by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1
      Damn, all this world needs is another 5,000 people in blue suits.

      It's OK, I'm releasing 5,000 'bots in ninja suits to show their kung-fu skills. "My kid beat up your honor student." Oh, and a few dozen Daleks to randomly roll around and exterminate things...

      -b.

  15. ...for business purposes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The IBM worker homepage links to this article. Basically, it's due to the fact that IBM uses tools like Secondlife to conduct business. A lot of us use virtual offices anyway, and the guides for IM, et. Al are out there already: what's the difference really? In the scope of things: if you represent the company, you are (if you value your job) liable to uphold the ethics and code you agreed to. So if you use the same avatar for both work and play, you're just courting trouble.

    1. Re:...for business purposes by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 1

      Basically, it's due to the fact that IBM uses tools like Secondlife to conduct business. So, if business lunches are often conducted at the local DuClaw's, you're automatically banned from playing pool there? If some drunk idiot starts taunting you and getting in your face, in your off hours, with the blessing of the pub owner, you're just supposed to shrug it off because "We might tell your Mommy if you say anything back"? What's to stop IBM from conducting business _everywhere_ on the web and using that as justification to monitor all employees at all times?

      Do authoritarians ever draw a line when pursuing their own power?
      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    2. Re:...for business purposes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0


      What's to stop IBM from conducting business _everywhere_ on the web and using that as justification to monitor all employees at all times?

      Look at this from a different angle. IBM isn't monitoring or policing every employee's WOW or Myspace activities. What they are doing is giving fair warning that if you attract negative attention for these activities you will be let go.

      Which is completely fair IMO. They don't want the term "IBM employee" to be included in a news story about this or that online scandal (and this reaches far beyond the obvious illegal ones.)

  16. which is odd by geekoid · · Score: 2, Funny

    because so many IBM consultants are dicks.

    --
    The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  17. That was close by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Looks like fur parties are still in!

  18. IBM guidelines by thpr · · Score: 1
    I see a number of people raising concerns about IBM's guidelines and what they mean for employee's personal time.

    For those that are interested, you can read IBM's Business Conduct Guidelines, specifically the section On Your Own Time, as well as IBM's Blogging Policy and Guidelines and the Virtual World Guidelines.

    1. Re:IBM guidelines by fonik · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Your private life is very much your own. You are, however, an IBMer both on and off the job and a conflict of interest may arise if you engage in any activities or advance any personal interests, at the expense of IBM's interests.
      Nice. "Your free time is very much your own as long as you aren't doing anything we don't like."
    2. Re:IBM guidelines by supremebob · · Score: 1

      Basically, it looks like you can do whatever you want (within reason) as long as you don't talk about IBM or identify yourself as an IBMer.

      The second IBM gets involved in the conversation, though, you gotta follow their rules.

    3. Re:IBM guidelines by fonik · · Score: 1

      Yeah, it looks like you're right. The business conduct guidelines are written in very terse legalese to keep themselves covered. The blogging guidelines, which are written more informally, seem perfectly reasonable. "Don't be a dick while representing our company to the public."

    4. Re:IBM guidelines by SillyNickName · · Score: 1
      The "Virtual World Guidelines" seem to written to allow IBM to arbitrarily punish employees after the fact. For example:

      You need to be especially sensitive to the appropriateness of your avatar or
      persona's appearance when you are meeting with IBM clients or conducting IBM business.
      without defining "appropriateness". Can you be fired for wearing the wrong color suit? How about for having a tail? It's all up to how some manager wants to interpret it after the fact (and perhaps increase his bonus by having an excuse to deny you a bonus or raise).
  19. "other virtual worlds"... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This mean I'm going to have to run the destruction of Matari terrorists by my boss now? :P

  20. Opportunity, dude! by StefanJ · · Score: 1

    If you know enough about that scene you could write up such a section as a humor article.

    And maybe some clueless IBM HR drone would buy it to use for real!

  21. So...Overexciting IBM. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Lends new meaning to the phrase "blue balls".

  22. Are these employees IDing themselves as IBMers? by davidwr · · Score: 1

    If they are, then Big Blue has every right to tell them how to behave. After all, they are at least in some small way representing the company.

    If they are not, then IBM's rights are much more limited: They have only as much right to dictate behavior in the game as they do real-life off-hours behavior. This is usually limited to not violating confidentiality, not doing anything illegal, or not doing anything that would violate a reasonable "morals clause" you see in some employee handbooks. For example, some companies have rules against disparaging their competition on or off the clock. Others have rules against gambling for employees in sensitive positions. These rules would apply in-game the same as out-of-game.

    Frankly, a bigger problem for IBM and the rest of Corporate America is probably bleary-eyed employees who spend too much time fighting and not enough time sleeping.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
    1. Re:Are these employees IDing themselves as IBMers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      More or less.. if you know where to look you can identify all the IBMers in SecondLife, as we are all required to belong to certain groups, (some very obvious and some not so obvious). As far as afterhours, most IBMers only camp ....

  23. Um...Thuddite. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Years after most people had figured out that the Internet wasn't a virtual world"

    And the internet wasn't mocked-up text and graphics either, until the Nexus browser brought us the World Wide Web

  24. Somebody shoot William Gibson... by TerranFury · · Score: 1

    ...retroactively, please. Sometime pre-Neuromancer would be nice. Bonus: You'd prevent Pattern Recognition while you were at it!

    These journalists! They try too hard to be hip; they pretend to be well-versed in technology -- and yet they coin nonsense phrases like "Cyberspace!" It is they who are responsible for this! (Regina Lynn on Wired: I'm looking at you too. At least Gibson wrote some Cyberpunk.) So, while -- fine -- shooting might be a bit harsh, I do think the pillory could be in order...

    [Neal Stephenson gets off the hook completely, 'cus even though he had a "Metaverse" in Snow Crash, he at least (1) clearly knows what he's talking about, and (2) wrote Cryptonomicon (and after you write something as mindshatteringly awesome as Cryptonomicon, you can get away with a lot.)]

    EOF.
    1. Re:Somebody shoot William Gibson... by jne_oioioi · · Score: 0

      (and after you write something as mindshatteringly awesome as Cryptonomicon, you can get away with a lot.)
      You don't read much now do you ?
    2. Re:Somebody shoot William Gibson... by rkanodia · · Score: 1

      and after you write something as mindshatteringly awesome as Cryptonomicon, you can get away with a lot ... which apparently includes traveling backwards in time to write a novel about 'the metaverse'.

    3. Re:Somebody shoot William Gibson... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh for godsakes, do you know what "fiction" is? Gibson has never made any bones about that. Here, from the man himself [in 1993, already well into the second trilogy]: "If I could send them a message... If Mister Gibson could send a message to the boys on the InterNet I'd tell them to go and get a dictionary and look up the word irony."

    4. Re:Somebody shoot William Gibson... by Warin · · Score: 1

      What I find amusing about your post is that Stephenson's "Metaverse" looks a whole lot more like Second Life than Gibson's virtual world. As such, I figure Neal is far more responsible for shaping ideas within Second Life than William Gibson is. Sadly, Gibson gets the most guff because he did it first, and far better, than anyone else.

      Plus, I think it is super awesome that Neuromancer was written on a typewriter.

  25. No, one knows... by Roadkills-R-Us · · Score: 1

    A friend's sibling was telling us at diner last night that IBM (their employer) encourages them to use Second Life for virtual meetings, hence these guidelines.

    IBM has always had strict guidelines about how IBM employees relate to the rest of the world, but at least in the last two decades (the main time I've had any involvement with them, including time contracting there) I have not been aware of them ever crossing the line you're asking about. At any ate, I haven't seen any evidence they are in this case.

    1. Re:No, one knows... by Bastard+of+Subhumani · · Score: 1

      IBM (their employer) encourages them to use Second Life for virtual meetings
      Do they have some kind of private area? If not, what's to stop a competitor sending someone to spy on them, or virtually disrupting the meeting? That would be kind of fun, busting in on them and kicking their asses...
      --
      Only three things are certain; death, taxes, and apocryphal quotations - Ben Franklin.
  26. Off hours restrictions by nurb432 · · Score: 1

    A company that restricts your off-hours activities is way out of bounds. Yes, i know it happens all the time, but that doesn't make it right by any stretch of the imagination.

    Now if they are talking on-hours, then thats a bit different as you are on their dime. I cant get to the story to see which we are talking about.

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
    1. Re:Off hours restrictions by Billly+Gates · · Score: 1

      A simple quote can make a lawyers day if IBM is ever sued.

      Also press leaks on secret projects are big deal too.

      I worked for a temp agency for a major gaming company and to this day I can not tell you where I worked. I can mention it on a job app or something but not on the web.

      Reason being is the media and competitors will do anything to get trade secrets. So yes if your sallaried your always on the clock and if not then signing a document should be required for employment.

      What if an IBM employee told a secret that MS got ahold of? OR what if he identified himself as an IBM employee and then did something illegal like hit up on a minor. Could IBM be sued? If he identified himself as an IBM employee then possibly.

    2. Re:Off hours restrictions by nurb432 · · Score: 1

      If you identify youself as an employee, then you really arent on your own time at that point. Telling/selling secrets doesnt ecen come into the 'my time / your time' debate.

      I dont agree with the statement 'if you are on salary you are always on the clock'. If you are at home watching tv you are on your own time. They dont own you 24/7. If you go back into the office at 2am to fix a problem, or start doing some work at home, sure you are 'back on the clock', but sitting at dinner? Nope, there are limits.

      --
      ---- Booth was a patriot ----
  27. I work for IBM and... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    all they are doing is making sure that employees don't reflect badly on the company. Imagine if a Microsoft employee started spouting negatively and inaccurately about a non-MS product in SL. Or Slashdot. Instant flame and bad rep for MS. Also, consider the litigation opportunities.

    IBM's pretty permissive in what it allows its employees to do on work time. Little Internet port blocking. No onerous logging. For me it makes for an innovative environment where I feel I can relax and try stuff out. I'd recommend IBM as an employer at least for that aspect.

    1. Re:I work for IBM and... by Billly+Gates · · Score: 1

      I used to work for a gaming company and I almost got fired on my first day for mentioning where I worked on my livejournal. THe market department flipped out and called my bosses and boss. Ouch.

      I turned the entry friends only.

      They are obsessed with media misquoting even a lowly temp help desk worker. I had to sign a legal document saying I can tell my friends where I work and used to work but not anywhere on the internet. Especially /. :-)

      I no longer work there but I can still be sued for giving out any information on how our servers work or rumors of upcoming projects. It was strange but I guess the major game publisher had bad press releases and lawsuits where /. ers who worked there quotes were actually used in court.

      If I were IBM I would make any remark that I even work there on the net a firable offense.

  28. Big Blue Uniform? by dakirw · · Score: 1

    Okay, aside from the concept of "meeting with IBM clients" in Second Life ... why not just go all the way and license something unique for your company sponsored avatars? Then, if you're representing the company, you use a company avatar
    You mean like the prototypical IBM outfit - dark blue suit and black wingtips?
  29. Pretty much, yep. by khasim · · Score: 2, Insightful

    You mean like the prototypical IBM outfit - dark blue suit and black wingtips?

    Pretty much. They'd have a selection. Male and female of different appearances. So you can sort of match it to you. And so you don't look like Agent Smith when a group of five of you show up.

    And they'd hire people to polish them. You want to present the most professional appearance possible (if you're IBM). So spending money on getting the textures and shadows right is important. It's all about paying attention to the smallest details.

    You'd all have the same "look" and that "look" would be "polished professional".
    1. Re:Pretty much, yep. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      You'd all have the same "look" and that "look" would be "polished professional"...

      ...and all the women would wear Ally McBeal-type short skirts? PleaseOhPleaseOhPlease?

  30. IBM VP keen Second Lifer by Chemicalscum · · Score: 1
    Dr. Bob Sutor, IBM VP for Standards and Open Source is a keen Second Lifer. He refers to it quite often in his blog. Recently he has discussed the problems of getting the latest version running on Ubuntu Feisty on his laptops in his blog here:

    http://www.sutor.com/newsite/blog-open/?p=1633

    Where he posts an image of Second Life running under Feisty. Since the image apparently shows his avatar we now know what the IBM dress code is in virtual worlds - Muscle Tee shirts and sunglasses.

    1. Re:IBM VP keen Second Lifer by supremebob · · Score: 1

      Hmm... I wonder if that's an IBM issued laptop that he's running an unauthorized software build on?

      If so, I bet that he's breaking a ton of IT security regulations!

    2. Re:IBM VP keen Second Lifer by jimpop · · Score: 1

      Hmm... I wonder if that's an IBM issued laptop that he's running an unauthorized software build on?

      There is no such thing in IBM as an unauthorized software build. There are, however, unsupported (internally) software OSes.

      If so, I bet that he's breaking a ton of IT security regulations!

      Not! I'm posting this right now from my IBM provided T60 running Ubuntu Edgy Eft, and no it's not a dual-boot laptop. I don't mess with SL though, so I can't speak to it's capabilities under Ubuntu. ;-)

    3. Re:IBM VP keen Second Lifer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually IBMers can do pretty much what they want with their thinkpads, provided they aren't going against the business conduct guidelines.

      Installing linux on the thinkpads isn't just "tolerated", its encouraged. Dual-boot or single-boot; your choice. There is also an official internal IBM linux distribution, as well as linux packages for all the usual corporate tools...but thats easy because its all java anyway.

  31. It's A Fucking Game! by DragonTHC · · Score: 1

    block it from work.

    it's completely unecessary.

    Anyone who uses it is a co-dependent basket case.

    --
    They're using their grammar skills there.
    1. Re:It's A Fucking Game! by TheAwfulTruth · · Score: 1

      Wow, someone else that missed the point utterly...

      Did even one single person RTFM?

      Dude, IBM is USING SL as a buisness tool, they HAVE to have employees going there. They are regulating what the employees are allowed to do there when on as emploees doing their job and representing IBM as a company.

      There also apparently happened to be some no-nonsense "good advice" for people tjhat were otherwise completely new to this kind of thing which might help them /if they choose/ when they get on as alternate private characters after work.

      --
      Contrary to popular belief, coding is not all free blow-jobs and beer. Those things cost MONEY!
    2. Re:It's A Fucking Game! by SillyNickName · · Score: 1

      Wow, someone else that missed the point utterly...
      Yes, but it believe it may have been you. The point was that maybe IBM shouldn't be using games such as this in the first place (they're not really a "game" company). Hence, they should block it, not encourage it in the first place. I'm not saying whether I agree or not, but just that you missed the point.
  32. Bureaucracy? by The+Fanta+Menace · · Score: 1

    They also question why IBM would add a layer of buttoned-down bureaucracy to this relatively rollicking corner of the Internet.

    The real question, of course, is to ask why they only added one layer of bureaucracy. IBM manages to add twenty layers of it to everything else they do, to the extent that working in a tech job there just is not even vaguely interesting.

    --
    -- Even if a god did exist, why the fsck should I worship it?
  33. People who comment on this story probably by Danathar · · Score: 1


    1. Have never tried Second Life

    2. Tried it for 20 min and declared "The graphics suck, the game sucks" (even though technically it's not a "game")

    3. Hate Second Life (or any other tech that is popular) and love being "Devil's advocates"

    1. Re:People who comment on this story probably by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      According to you then, since you commented on this story you:

      1. Have never tried Second Life

      2. Tried it for 20 min and declared "The graphics suck, the game sucks" (even though technically it's not a "game")

      3. Hate Second Life (or any other tech that is popular) and love being a "Devil's advocate"

  34. Too Far..... by IHC+Navistar · · Score: 1

    How on Earth are companies allowed to regulate the private lives of it's employees?

    It's not like government jobs, where there is a genuine conflict of interest or national security is at stake. An example would be how Gaming Board employees aren't allowed to enter/gamble/conduct any kind of business in casinos.

    Companies that do this, such as Blockbuster, and now IBM, claim that the actions of their employees reflect on the company. That may be true, albeit insignificantly, but it is going to have to be a risk that companies with employees are going to have to accept. Regulating personal and private life for the perceived "image" of a company is definitely going to far.

    I don't know about other companies, but Blockbuster Video (aka "Lackluster Video), has a policy that is pretty good at punishing you for personal, non-work related indiscretions:

    It is Blockbuster company policy for employees to report indiscretions that may reflect negatively upon the company. Failure to do so can resuly in 'disciplinary action' (*Not verbatim, but the best I can remember. It was really short and simple). Basically, you can be fired any kind of run-in with the law, business-related or not.

    --
    Knowing Google's lust for data collection, the Soviet Union is still alive and well inside the psyche of Sergey Brin....
    1. Re:Too Far..... by TheAwfulTruth · · Score: 1

      Exactly where did it say it was regulating the private lives of their employees again?

      --
      Contrary to popular belief, coding is not all free blow-jobs and beer. Those things cost MONEY!
    2. Re:Too Far..... by IHC+Navistar · · Score: 1

      Playing in Second Life is a private activity, unless it is being done while AT WORK. Unless it is being done AT WORK, IBM cannot tell employees how to behave.

      --
      Knowing Google's lust for data collection, the Soviet Union is still alive and well inside the psyche of Sergey Brin....
  35. Tell that to people making money in SL by Infonaut · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It is embarrassing and no one in the real world cares besides the news media and misc. company bosses.

    People are making money in SL. This is the biggest differentiator between SL and previous virtual worlds. As soon as profit enters the picture, everyone starts paying attention.

    Your comment reminds me of comments in '94/'95 about the Web. That flash in the pan has carried on pretty well, I'd say.

    --
    Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
    1. Re:Tell that to people making money in SL by drsquare · · Score: 1

      People make money in pyramid schemes, this is nothing different. Expect a mini dot-com crash when the fad dies off and people have invested in effectively nothing.

    2. Re:Tell that to people making money in SL by Infonaut · · Score: 1

      People make money in pyramid schemes, this is nothing different. Expect a mini dot-com crash when the fad dies off and people have invested in effectively nothing.

      There may indeed be a crash in the SL market. Already the mainstream media has caught onto the fact that too many marketing dollars are chasing too few players. However, that doesn't mean people are making money in pyramid schemes. There is nothing nefarious about it, nor are there multiple layers of sellers, all skimming off those below them in a race to get out before the pyramid collapses.

      A certain population is willing to spend real money on activities that occur in a virtual environment. The price they pay for these activities may drop, but if it does, that doesn't mean that these people gained nothing from the expense. Nobody is being duped, any more than I was being duped when I was a kid sticking quarters into the Tempest machine at the video game arcade back in the 1980s.

      As for SL being a fad, you may be right, and you may be wrong. The concept of commerce in virtual worlds isn't going away, though. The technology is maturing rapidly, and for some kinds of commerce and other interaction, virtual worlds provide advantages the Web can't match. I think this is still at a very early stage of development.

      --
      Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
  36. Considerations by psquare · · Score: 1

    A couple of considerations that the IBMers probably made: 1. Nobody is as they seem, and everyone has a deep dark secret. Just ask Bill Clinton! 2. People are more likely to say what is on their mind when hiding from behind a computer screen. 3. Its always good to have guidelines for legal reasons.

  37. Better watch out by neuromancer23 · · Score: 1


    Next thing you know, they'll be gassing people by the millions with Zyklon-B just because it boosts their profit margins.

    Just kidding Second Life users. Your characters are completely safe.

    IBM only does things like that in the real world.

    1. Re:Better watch out by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Way to hit Godwin's Law so early!

      (For those who don't get it, Zyklon-B was what the NAZIs used to gas "undesirables", particularly Jews.)

  38. required to be in certain groups??? by davidwr · · Score: 1

    as we are all required to belong to certain groups So, if I'm a 2nd Lifer, and I happen to work for IBM, what happens if I do not belong to those groups and do not in any way shape or form indicate my affiliation with 2nd life? Assuming I don't do anything to hurt IBM, will I be fired over it?
    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
  39. Incompatible by hangableautobulb · · Score: 1

    Interestingly, for the past two years all new hires to the IBM corporation have been provided with new laptops running the Intel 950xx graphics chipset ... one of the only chipsets incompatible with Second Life ... a coincidence?