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Google's Open Source Mobile Platform

As expected, today Google took the wraps off of the gPhone (as the media have for months been referring to the rumored project). Google is "leading a broad industry alliance to transform mobile phones into powerful mobile computers," and will be licensing its software to all comers on an open source basis under the Apache license. (The Wall Street Journal's Ben Worthen demonstrates a miserable grasp of what "open source" means.) Google's US partners include Nextel and Sprint, but not AT&T nor Verizon. Phones will be available in the second half of 2008 — not the spring as earlier reports had speculated. News.com's analysis warns that Google won't take over the mobile market overnight, though they quote Forrester in the opinion that Google may be one of the three biggest mobile players after several years of shakeout.

199 comments

  1. Phone or Platform? by loubs001 · · Score: 1, Redundant

    So is it an actual product like an iPhone or JUST a platform like Java ME?

    1. Re:Phone or Platform? by timmarhy · · Score: 2, Insightful
      it's just a platform, google has some serious hardware backers though. from googles point of view it's a great move, all they have to produce is software which they are really good at, and someone else takes the risk of producing the actual phones. It would also open up more places for them to shove adsense, which is their cash maker.

      consumers will be the winners because it's a serious competitor to at&t and their outrageous charges, it opens up the possiblity of an adsense supported phone, and because google is doing it microsoft will do it giving us even more competition.

      --
      If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    2. Re:Phone or Platform? by clarkkent09 · · Score: 5, Funny

      Ok, so not reading the article I get, who has the time. I am getting used to people not reading the summary either. But not reading the title of the article is just too much! Thats it, you are expelled from slashdot!

      --
      Negative moral value of force outweighs the positive value of good intentions.
    3. Re:Phone or Platform? by loubs001 · · Score: 1, Interesting

      So it's just a platform. I'm a little dissapointed. I think alot of us were waiting for a iPhone competitor. But so far it's just another linux and Java based software stack. What sets this platform apart form the rest?

    4. Re:Phone or Platform? by kc2keo · · Score: 1

      I for one am happy that Google is entering the mobile market with a Linux based phone. Good for competition and good for Linux.

    5. Re:Phone or Platform? by loubs001 · · Score: 1

      I'll confess I hadnt read the complete article at the time (hey its long! blame the rush to comment early) but I have since. The summary doesnt say that it wasnt a complete phone (a phone can also be a platform, which the iPhone + SDK will be, and the SavaJe built on the JavaFX platform). but I read the article and it turns out its not that. My comment was more of a reaction of suprise since I was expecting something iPhone like. There are already several platforms around. iPhone, Java ME (though its technology is now outgrowing it), OpenMoko, JavaFX, .NET Compact Framework. I wanted to see a device that was going to make me go 'wow'. But we'll have to wait and see what google's partners come up with.

    6. Re:Phone or Platform? by dwater · · Score: 2, Insightful

      > What sets this platform apart form the rest?

      The license, and the license fee. Plus, I'll bet, the development environment.

      --
      Max.
    7. Re:Phone or Platform? by m2943 · · Score: 2, Informative

      HTC, one of the partners, makes a ton of great phone hardware, currently held back by the crappy Windows Mobile software it's running; I'd expect that a lot of that hardware will run Android in the future.

    8. Re:Phone or Platform? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's a platform, development based on Java but not Java ME.

    9. Re:Phone or Platform? by tventiethfret · · Score: 1
      Its open source, not linux based. They are not coming up with a phone either, its just the phone OS.

      Google is giving the software away to others who will build the phones. The company invested heavily in the project to ensure that all of its services are available on mobile phones. Its ultimate goal is to cash in on the effort by selling advertisements to mobile phone users, just as it does on Internet-connected computers. I dont understand how.
    10. Re:Phone or Platform? by jo42 · · Score: 1

      Its the Java platform part that sucks the most - give me C/C++

    11. Re:Phone or Platform? by darkhitman · · Score: 4, Funny

      Are you kidding? He's fast approaching the Ideal Slashdot User, who to this point has only been simulated mathematically - he who reads nothing at all.

      --
      Tell me something...it's still "We, the people"... right?
    12. Re:Phone or Platform? by davester666 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's not the 'openness' of the platform that matters. It's the openness of the end-product, that is delivered to the customer [namely you and me] that matters [well, to you and me]. And that's an issue that's pretty much independent of what OS the phone is running. Particularly in the US.

      And Sprint being part of this 'group' means nothing w.r.t. how open the shipping product will be.

      The US wireless carriers will fight tooth and nail to NOT be treated as what they are: wireless service providers.

      On the other hand, if anything this could make customer demand for 'openness' more difficult, because this fractures the market for developers a bit more. Now, to develop a ubiquitous app, you need to support another platform. One that with the source available, developers can't necessarily count on a given set of API's even being available on a 'googleos' phone...

      I think it'll still take quite a while before the US wireless carriers permit much advancement. Even Apple had to deliberately cripple iTunes support on the iPhone so you can't use it over your "unlimited data plan" EDGE connection.

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    13. Re:Phone or Platform? by smilindog2000 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Nope, it's Linux based, and any add-on Google writes will be under the Apache license. The video also seemed to indicate that linux hackers will be comfortable in the system, as well. Compared to just having some crap Java virtual machine, this could be huge. Hacked iPhones made rapid progress partly because they run real *-nix, and Apache was ported before any of the traditional toy web servers, and SSH before telnet, and even a VNC viewer (with a somewhat broken control interface). I guess we'll see in about a week what's under the hood.

      --
      Beer is proof that God loves us, and wants us to be happy.
    14. Re:Phone or Platform? by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

      Sprint is one of the most "Open" of carriers when it comes to software. Unlike Verizon they don't lock out features of the the phone. Like the ability to transfer files over Bluetooth or use Bluetooth to link your notebook to your phone. They do allow 3rd party software on their phones. Now unlocking phones is a different matter. Most of the Cell companies don't want that because they tend to subsidize the cost of the phone to get you on their network.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    15. Re:Phone or Platform? by Andy+Dodd · · Score: 1

      How is it a serious competitor to AT&T?

      This platform and devices based on it still require you to have service from a wireless service provider. See the press releases, this is a *completely seperate* effort from Google's 700 MHz spectrum efforts. (Although that effort can only be good for their platform.)

      T-Mobile isn't even remotely an option in many areas of the U.S. (including where I live - I would pay through the nose in roaming charges).

      Similarly, Sprint isn't an option in a lot of areas too.

      That said - the moment an unlocked GSM phone based on this platform is released (Which is basically guaranteed), plenty of people will probably be putting their AT&T SIMs in them.

      --
      retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
    16. Re:Phone or Platform? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      they don't lock out features of the the phone.


      Yeah? I wish that were the case, and maybe it's changed since my last few phones. I used to be able to use my phone as a modem by dialing #777. I sent my phone in for repairs, and when it came back, #777 would just ring busy. My wife's identical phone still worked fine. I did some research and found out that Sprint threatened Sanyo that they would stop carrying those phones if a firmware update wasn't issued to block that feature.
    17. Re:Phone or Platform? by norminator · · Score: 1

      > What sets this platform apart form the rest? The license, and the license fee. Plus, I'll bet, the development environment.
      Keep in mind that this Google-led alliance will be releasing an SDK next week, well before any actual phones launch. This is in sharp contrast with Apple, who launched a phone months ago, and still won't be releasing an SDK for months.

      That, and the fact that the Google setup will probably allow just about anyone to develop for the gPlatform, whereas Apple will likely limit it to people who can get expensive signing certificates.
    18. Re:Phone or Platform? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What ever you say. But what I don't understand is why slashdot didn't post anything about Google announcement on the gPhone stuff.

    19. Re:Phone or Platform? by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

      Do you have a data plan?
      That number is only supposed to be used by people with a dataplan.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    20. Re:Phone or Platform? by psychicsword · · Score: 1

      make everything in binary then he will read it!

  2. pictures by timmarhy · · Score: 0
    useless without pictures.

    verizon and at&t don't want to partener with them! what a shock.....

    --
    If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    1. Re:pictures by ynososiduts · · Score: 1

      Especially since AT&T has the iPhone, and Verizon just doesn't like anyone. Man, I have to find a different cell phone provider. Which are the least opressive?

      --
      622677120
    2. Re:pictures by omeomi · · Score: 1

      Verizon just doesn't like anyone.

      Well, that's convenient. I don't like Verizon.

    3. Re:pictures by Mr.Radar · · Score: 5, Informative

      I don't have any experience with Sprint but T-Mobile is probably the best in terms of being "open" of the big four mobile operators in the US. For example, until a few years ago you could get free web browsing through them by exploiting a hole in their free WAP access service. Instead of just shutting the hole and ignoring the people who didn't want to pay for a full Internet plan, they decided to shut it while transitioning to tiered Internet plans so people who didn't need to tether could still get the full web on their phones at a reduced price. Most phones also apparently will still let you tether with their cheap service, though T-Mobile will cut off your access if you use too much bandwidth while doing this.

      They use GSM which is a big plus if you want to buy your own phone. I haven't yet needed to because, while all of their phones that I've owned were locked and had T-Mobile logos and "premium services" everywhere, none of them were in any way crippled like Verizon is infamous for doing. I even added a custom ringtone to one of my phones using only a standard USB cable and the manufacturer's ringtone transfer software. Their coverage is pretty good, the only time I've had trouble with it was when I was traveling through West Virginia which is a hard area to cover with cell phone service anyways. Their biggest problem is that they don't yet have any 3G service available anywhere (they're waiting for the spectrum they bought for it to become available for their use) and their customer service is nothing to write home about, but that's pretty much par for the course in this industry.

      --
      What if this signature were clever?
    4. Re:pictures by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 1

      they don't yet have any 3G service available anywhere (they're waiting for the spectrum they bought for it to become available for their use)

      More information? I'd be curious to read this - last I'd heard they'd deployed to at least a dozen big cities (yeah, yeah, I know they're wayyyyy behind the eight ball, but still)...?

    5. Re:pictures by boredhacker · · Score: 1

      I have to agree with Mr.Radar. After my service contract was up with Sprint I bought an unlocked GSM phone and switched to T-Mobile. I've been much happier ever since. In addition, the vicious rumors of 'coverage problems' some would have you believe seem to be greatly exaggerated (then again I'm in the NYC market which is probably serviced well due to its size). There was only one location in the last two years where I got no signal, Lake Placid NY, but free ring-tones, wallpapers, fully-functioning bluetooth and the ability to install 3rd party Java apps makes that easily tolerable.

    6. Re:pictures by Fred_A · · Score: 1

      useless without pictures. Luckily for you I found one :
      #include libgphone
      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    7. Re:pictures by JCSoRocks · · Score: 1

      none of them were in any way crippled like Verizon is infamous for doing.
      *sigh* so TRUE. I have Verizon now, and it's ridiculous. I'm so torn; although I wish the "gPhone" platform were coming to my carrier, I also know that it would probably end up coming with only half of the features that it's capable of and I'd be charged some mind melting amount to use them. Curse you wireless carriers!
      --
      You are using English. Please learn the difference between loose and lose; they're, there, and their; your and you're.
    8. Re:pictures by Andy+Dodd · · Score: 1

      Not in the U.S.

      Perhaps you're thinking of AT&T? They managed to secure some UMTS spectrum in the preexisting PCS bands and are slowly rolling it out.

      T-Mobile was not - they're waiting for the 1700 MHz band to free up to roll out UMTS.

      Unfortunately, very little hardware supports/will support UMTS1700.

      --
      retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
  3. first psot!!! by doyoulikeworms · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    from my cell phone running the gPhone platform!

    1. Re:first psot!!! by caffeinemessiah · · Score: 5, Informative
      If anyone was interested in Ben Worthen's moronic grasp of open-source, its pasted below. E-mail your tirades to biztech@wsj.com, of which Ben Worthen is the lead writer, and ask him about how he got his job in the first place.

      Information-technology departments will ban employees from connecting phones that run Google's operating system to their computers or the corporate network. The reason is that Google's operating system is open, meaning anyone can write software for it. That includes bad guys, who will doubtlessly develop viruses and other malicious code for these phones, which unsuspecting Google phones owners will download. Employees could spread the malicious code to the rest of the company when they synch their phones to their computers or use it to check email.

      The way to combat this is to develop anti-virus and anti-malware software for phones and to develop security procedures similar to those that have evolved for PCs over the last several years. But that's going to take time and money - neither of which the average IT department has. So until then, expect Google phones to be persona non grata at companies.

      --
      An old-timer with old-timey ideas.
    2. Re:first psot!!! by loubs001 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I think thats a bit harsh. He didnt even use the term 'open source', he just said 'open' and clarified what he meant by it, which is that anyone can write software for it, which is true (contrast that to the pre-SDK iPhone). I think his concern is a valid one. You could imagine a malicious application on the phone that uses Bluetooth to detect other phones nearby and spam them with SMS messages or something. But I'm sure google's thought of this and there will be security mechanisms, permissions, signed applications with digital certificates etc. etc.

    3. Re:first psot!!! by emurphy42 · · Score: 5, Informative
      FWIW, he followed up with the following:

      Update: I've read through the comments and most people seem to think I'm saying something I wasn't trying to say. That's my fault for writing sloppy. I don't think that Google's mobile operating system is a security problem because it's open source. I think that the phones that use it could become a security threat because if Google succeeds there are going to be a lot of applications for this phone and individuals are going to be able to download whichever ones they want to use. As this happens bad guys are going to start targeting these people with their own code, much the way they target PC users today.

      The fact of the matter is that while most companies have anti-virus and anti-malware software on PCs, they don't do much of anything to secure phones. The point that I obviously didn't succeed at making originally is that if Google achieves its vision companies will realize that they have this weakness, and not knowing how to address it — companies would need to buy all sorts of security software and put in place all sorts of policies — their first instinct will be to ban the phones. Employees will get upset because, again if Google achieves its vision, these phones will be pretty darn cool and a pretty helpful business tool. Hence the conflict that I think it will cause. It has nothing to do with open source or Google per se, and everything to do with companies not being prepared for the phone as a dominant computing platform.
    4. Re:first psot!!! by Rude+Turnip · · Score: 1

      The sound you just heard was Walt Mossberg giving Ben Worthen a right bitch-slapping.

    5. Re:first psot!!! by Datamonstar · · Score: 4, Insightful

      No, it's not at all harsh for what is supposed to be a professional writer. He starts off with an idea, a dangerous beginning in the first place, that there should be some sort of software security specifically for interfacing phones and PCs in the office. A good idea (perhaps even a profitable one) and doesn't think it through at all. He starts off, not with the good idea, but with a broad, one-sided assumption that all open applications are prone to security issues simply because they are open. If he were somewhere in the ballpark range of competent he would have reversed the two topics and stated that we need security software for smart phone to PC interfaces and that the result of not developing it could be rogue open applications creating a security nightmare. But he didn't. He speculated on something that went well in hand with his idea, but he didn't have a clue about it worked, and also didn't do any research on it to get more knowledge. He even pretty much says all this (sans admitting that he doesn't know what he's talking about and didn't do any research, but that much is very obvious) in his rehash he added to the article to address the people who e-mailed him about his mistake. The update is almost as large as the article itself. I'd say he pretty much deserves to be criticized on his grasp of Open Source as it is demonstrated by this article.

      --
      The eternal struggle of good vs. evil begins within one's self.
    6. Re:first psot!!! by 7-Vodka · · Score: 1

      I love how in the reply he inserts the word "could" as if he used it the first time around. He did not. He clearly stated it would happen.
      Is this how tech articles get written? The writer spews a load of bollocks and then backs out of his own assertions later by saying he merely thought they "could" happen?

      --

      Liberty.

    7. Re:first psot!!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It has nothing to do with open source or Google per se, and everything to do with companies not being prepared for the phone as a dominant computing platform.

      Yes that clearly comes across in his article...you just have to look past the parts about er...Google and open source.

    8. Re:first psot!!! by Bent+Cardan · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Bent Cardan says: Too bad about the gphone. Why can't they make their operating system open and protected like OS X?

    9. Re:first psot!!! by aichpvee · · Score: 1

      I think that's more him lacking any grasp of technology at all, not uncommon for the wall street journal (or most any news outlet). Out of the box any "gPhone" is going to have about as many security issues related to user-downloadable software as a Blackberry. Just because the operating system is open source in no way implies that the stock firmware shipped by the handset manufacturers or the carriers is going to let the phone do anything that it isn't "supposed" to do. It'll just be another phone running Java apps like all the other phones running Java apps.

      Your average user isn't going to know or care about updating the operating system on their phone. What an idiot!

      --
      The Farewell Tour II
    10. Re:first psot!!! by Sudheer_BV · · Score: 1

      He realized later that he just assumed in his first post that Google's software for mobile phones was insecure. The picture included in the original article adds weight to this argument. And then he tires to defend himself with another interpretation of his article. He's a troll.

      --
      Sudheer Satyanarayana
      www.techchorus.net
    11. Re:first psot!!! by kaizokuace · · Score: 1

      anyone who refers to programmers of virus/malware whathaveyou should go back to the 2nd grade. Why does everything have to be good guys and bad guys. What if good guys wrote some virus or worm to take down a corporation that was doing something unreasonable! is that so bad? yes and no, its grey! bad guys! I will say this, if you look at comic books and movies in various countries. Almost every story in America is good vs evil. And in a lot of other places in the world the stories are usually more real and less dichotomous, for the most part.

      --
      Balderdash!
    12. Re:first psot!!! by McFadden · · Score: 1

      I don't think it's his understanding that is Worthen's problem. More the fact that he posesses all the style and journalistic finesse of a 12 year old. I haven't seen such poor writing from a professional journalist since they let Ann Coulter write a column.

    13. Re:first psot!!! by DanielJosphXhan · · Score: 1

      Update: I've read through the comments and most people seem to think I'm saying something I wasn't trying to say. That's my fault for writing sloppy.


      Yeah, no kidding, and it didn't stop. The word is "sloppily", dear Mr Worthen.

      --
      [ think ]
    14. Re:first psot!!! by YU+Nicks+NE+Way · · Score: 1

      By that standard, then, we should be seeing a slough of malware for Windows Mobile phones, too -- they're every bit as open (in this sense) as Android. We haven't.

      No, the WSJ author is an idiot on this.

    15. Re:first psot!!! by sacrilicious · · Score: 1
      That's my fault for writing sloppy.

      for writing sloppily.

      --
      - First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then ???, then profit.
    16. Re:first psot!!! by Andy+Dodd · · Score: 1

      I was just about to post along these lines, but you beat me to it.

      Anyone can write apps for Windows Mobile. In fact, with the exception of OpenMoko, until Android was announced it was actually the most open of the phone platforms. Motorola's Linux implementations are horribly locked down (I wonder if they will figure out a way to do the same for Android?), and I've heard Symbian is really anal about application signing. Windows Mobile will warn you the first time you try to run an unsigned app, but will remember your response for that application afterwards (until the app's checksum changes, then it will prompt again.)

      This makes me wonder, will Google take any sort of a stand against Tivoization? Most Windows Mobile devices default to being locked down such that they will only allow signed OS images to be loaded and booted (until the device is cracked, fortunately it seems to be pretty easy to crack the bootloaders, HTC devices seem to never last more than a week or so after release before HardSPL is ported to the new unit.), will things be the same for Android? Open source is pretty pointless if the hardware will only flash/load/boot a signed OS image.

      --
      retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
  4. Software Development Skills / Security by religious+freak · · Score: 0

    Google can be great at developing software -- they can also be very average. Hopefully, they deliver the former and not the latter with the gphone.

    Also, am I the only one that would think twice before purchasing a phone like this for concerns over viruses, etc? I don't know of any large scale, massively disruptive phone viruses yet, but they can't be too far behind the iPhone gPhone combo pack.

    --
    If you can read this... 01110101 01110010 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100111 01100101 01100101 01101011
    1. Re:Software Development Skills / Security by cheater512 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You read the article I take it?

      Viruses need to self replicate.
      Social Enginnering 'OMG Download this cool app d00dz' doesnt count.

      There arent any easy ways to get a phone to send a virus to another phone.
      The easiest way is Bluetooth or Wifi and then its still a pain in the ass to make it spread.

      With Bluetooth you first need to somehow get another phone to connect to you, without user intervention which is impossible (without flaws in the stack).
      Then you need to send data to the other phone in a way which makes it execute the code. Also basically impossible.

      Whats the chance of Google's code having fundamental bugs like that? Nil.

    2. Re:Software Development Skills / Security by Score+Whore · · Score: 1

      Viruses need to self replicate.
      Social Enginnering 'OMG Download this cool app d00dz' doesnt count.


      Why? Because it doesn't fit with some particular definition you prefer to use? You do realize that the first computer viruses involved users sticking a floppy disk with a "cool app" in a drive and running the program which happened to be infected by the virus. In fact the traditional virus would attach itself to other programs and had zero to do with the infection vector.

      The Morris Worm on the other hand had a lot more to do with automatically spreading itself.

      I'm a lot more worried if this is the Canter & Siegel moment for cellphones. If so then I'm going to find those wankers at Google and shake my finger under their noses. And possibly pee on their sneakers.
    3. Re:Software Development Skills / Security by dwater · · Score: 1

      > Also, am I the only one that would think twice before purchasing a phone like this for concerns over viruses, etc?

      I'm not sure why you think this platform is any more susceptible than any others (apart from Microsoft ones, of course). There are plenty of Linux phones already (mostly Motorola ones and in China, IINM).

      Of course, you should think twice about purchasing any phone (or anything else, for that matter) for that reason, but I don't think this one will be any different to others.

      --
      Max.
    4. Re:Software Development Skills / Security by fermion · · Score: 1, Interesting
      the rise of the google fanboi. Hail google.

      We know that there are certain security issues that google does not worry about.

      We know that google will put feature about security.

      We also know that google is avoiding those with experience and instead hiring and training those who will tow the party line.

      None of this seems particularly hopeful or optimistic. If a device is discoverable, it is easy enough hook up to and transfer a payload. In public areas I usually see at least a couple discoverable cell phones. Even if bluetooth security is working, people will pass trojans to one another, just like they did in the 90's. Trojans do count, and are the primary threat that must be defended aginst. To use and old metaphor, google is allowing a new generation of unsophisticated users to gain access to powerful and potentially dangerous applications. Not so bad in itself, but bad as google is a very young company, who seems to be blind to the benefits of experience, so appears to be ignoring the lessons of 20 years of security experience.

      --
      "She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
    5. Re:Software Development Skills / Security by timmarhy · · Score: 1, Insightful
      "instead hiring and training those who will tow the party line"

      What a load of spin.

      and your trying to tag google as irresponsible because people might catch trojans? welcome to the fucking world. nothing on earth is going to prevent people willingly running annakornakova.jpg.exe.

      to suggest google is somehow negligent in this area is too retarded for words.

      --
      If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    6. Re:Software Development Skills / Security by cheater512 · · Score: 1

      The first viruses spread themselves by infecting other files which were then moved by the users.
      That fits the definition.

      Social Engineering attacks cannot be stopped. People are extremely stupid and will do what a popup tells them to do.
      IMHO if someone willingly installs malware on their computer, its their own fault.

      Viruses which spread themselves are much more scary however especially the good ones.

    7. Re:Software Development Skills / Security by Paradise+Pete · · Score: 1
      hiring and training those who will tow the party line.

      It's Toe the line. As in "put your foot right there and don't cross over." The way you wrote it they'd have to be dragging around some festive rope or something.

    8. Re:Software Development Skills / Security by Pipaman · · Score: 1

      I agree with you but that's true now. Next year or in some time more, phones will be used as computers: emails and internet will be normal. In that scenario, you'll receive email bombs with trojans or virus, or you'll get virus using the browser (in the same way you can get a virus using IExplorer). I don't mean that I wouldn't buy a phone with this problems but the threats exist as in ordinary computers. Pipaman

  5. hmm by thatskinnyguy · · Score: 1

    But will it run li... perhaps it will!

    --
    The game.
    1. Re:hmm by greg1104 · · Score: 2, Funny

      And it should also be easy to build a Beowulf cluster of these phones.

    2. Re:hmm by kripkenstein · · Score: 1

      But will it run li... perhaps it will! Seriously, though, the real question is which Linux will it run - custom, or based on something familiar? And using what toolkit - GTK or Qt? etc. etc. TFA and the website have no details yet. Perhaps on the 12th we will know more.
  6. Another mobile platform announcement by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Goatse is announce its Open Sores Mobile Anus Platform featuring all of your favorite Slashdot editors

    coming to a town near you soon!!

    sign up now

  7. Creativity by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    A lot of thought must have went into the name of gPhone. Good job Google, we haven't seen any other [lowercase letter]phones before.

    1. Re:Creativity by timmarhy · · Score: 1, Funny
      err, the whole lowercase inital before the name of something started a long time before apple numbnuts.

      i'd strongly advise you don't throw that stone in anyones direction least it fly back and hit you in the head.

      --
      If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    2. Re:Creativity by SnowZero · · Score: 4, Informative

      Google has never called it the "gPhone"; Bloggers and press came up with that name since they needed to call it something. Google's name for the platform is Android.

    3. Re:Creativity by shmackie · · Score: 0

      Also, I believe it was the media that coined the 'gPhone' pseudonym

    4. Re:Creativity by tholomyes · · Score: 1

      I don't know what these "apple numbnuts" are that you speak of, but the earliest example of it that *I* can remember is Apple's eWorld from 1994.

      --
      When did the future switch from being a promise to a threat? -C. Palahniuk
  8. Just in time by Sterling2p · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    This is great! My contract is about to run out and I am thinking about my options.

    1. Re:Just in time by T-Bone-T · · Score: 1

      It seems there won't be any gPhones until the second half of next year, so you have basically a year to think about it.

  9. open phones rock by ILuvRamen · · Score: 5, Funny

    For the past 3 days I've been trying to modify and mess with my Motorola V3M Razor and it's a glitchy hell to try and do. Any phone that's more open than the current phone Nazis keep them is fine with me. All those dollar per ringtone and wallpaper people can shove it. Oh and especially that chick on late night TV commercials with the weird accent telling me I can win like $32,000 if I unscramble the word and text it in. I hope Google tracks her down and gets her deported. Now some of you may be asking, "Do you have anger issues with cell phone carriers and their associates" to which I say, "Don't you?"

    --
    Google's Super Secret Search Algorithm: SELECT @search_results FROM internet WHERE @search_results = 'good'
  10. DUPE by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    Let me be the first to say DUPE.

    Come ON! I guess Slashdot's speed at getting the original post on the front page threw you guys off. Usually these things come at least a day after everyone else.

    (Not that I don't prefer Slashdot. I flame because I care.)

  11. Mobile Data Charges by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I still don't see how this can be useful unless the carriers (in Canada, at least) offer more reasonable data packages. Right now Rogers offers 5MB per month for $5. Additional usage is priced at 3 cents per kilobyte.

    1. Re:Mobile Data Charges by chrisv · · Score: 1

      Eep. That's painful. I would have already spent $120 on data charges if I had to put up with those data rates in the past 2 days... I've only had my current phone for that long, too. Ouch.

      --

      Dogma: Dead (mostly because your Karma ran it over)

  12. it's just incompetence by m2943 · · Score: 1, Insightful

    For the past 3 days I've been trying to modify and mess with my Motorola V3M Razor and it's a glitchy hell to try and do. Any phone that's more open than the current phone Nazis keep them is fine with me.

    You simply bought a bad phone. If you want an extensible or modifiable phone, you can already get a Palm, Nokia, or Windows Mobile GSM phone; those are quite extensible. The advantage of Android over those existing systems is that it's probably easier to program because it gives you a full set of desktop APIs.

    1. Re:it's just incompetence by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 1

      Curious - exactly what APIs will you get with Android that are unavailable to Windows Mobile developers?

    2. Re:it's just incompetence by boredhacker · · Score: 1

      Curious - exactly what APIs will you get with Android that are unavailable to Windows Mobile developers?

      All of them.
    3. Re:it's just incompetence by whyloginwhysubscribe · · Score: 1

      I don't think that the post is necessarily flamebait, as it is being modded.

      In my experience the phones that I've used in the UK (only Nokias and Sony Ericssons) are very easy to customise and not really glitchy. Nokia seems to have lost the plot recently but the latest Sony phones are great.

      I think that you missed the point on Android though - the advantage is that it is Open - like Java ME which is much more popular than Windows Mobile IMO.

      The problem with J2ME is that all phones have a different API, so apps and games have to be programmed for more than one platform - a fault of the hardware manufacturers rather than the J2ME design I think...

    4. Re:it's just incompetence by internewt · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Its all in the eye of the beholder then, as in my experience all mobile phones available in the UK are glitchy. I have not ever used a phone where I have thought the menus or features (like button presses!) responded in a timely manor - but they have gained colour screens and higher res, but they are still awful to use. And they've gained the startup and shutdown times of a fucked install of Windows 98! But people will live with and defend shit when they have paid a lot of money for it...

      I haven't seen a recent phone (since the advent of 2 or 2.5G phones) that doesn't lock up or become unusable over time. Discussing this with people, some have tried to counter this statement, but I have discovered that the people who think that their phone doesn't crash tend to be the people who fiddle with their phone all the time (like disassembly/assembly), or they tend to forget to charge it regularly, so the phone does get power cycled sometimes.

      My nokia sometimes need power cycling sometimes because I'll plug in the charger, and even though the battery should be nearly dead, it'll say "battery full". Unfortunately I have been conditioned by too much use of Windows that my line of thought is "if in doubt, reboot", so when my phone does this I just reboot it. I don't want my phone to not charge because the software is being retarded.

      A mate's got a new touch screen sony thing, and it doesn't notice when outgoing calls are made, but only sometimes! This is a basic fucking feature with a huge bug..... It may be addressable, but it'd mean jumping through hoops no doubt to correct.

      I know this is all anecdotal evidence, but to say phones aren't glitchy is simply wrong! But if they didn't have annoyances then people would have reasons to ever "upgrade".

      An open platform (and I hope it is actually properly open, not marketing speak "open") would hopefully open a route for the development of phone software that isn't like a horrible bespoke proprietry application you might see at a business: you know the kind of shit I mean, VB front ends to access databases or IE only active-X intranet sites. Awful to use, but the only way of getting stuff done.

      --
      Car analogies break down.
    5. Re:it's just incompetence by whyloginwhysubscribe · · Score: 1

      yeah - point taken. Now I think about it I have seen glitchy phones - particularly the "smart" ones ironically.

      Now I've got a Sony Ericsson walkman phone and it really isn't *that* bad! Like you say - perhaps part of it is conditioning as I sometimes have to reboot it and the keys can be unresponsive at times - so yes, I suppose it is glitchy as well!

      But I genuinely am happy with the phone that I'm using - I play games on it and the text messaging interface is great. I didn't pay a lot for it either - although I pay a lot for my monthly contract - about 25 quid.

  13. bluetooth peer to peer by osoese · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    with a sling-blade mmmhmmm.

    1. Re:bluetooth peer to peer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      French fried taters. mmmhmm

  14. [OT] Re:hmm by g0at · · Score: 1

    "This sig is copywritten by the owner and may not be copied in any form without expressed written consent."

    Um... I don't think you understand copyright. It has to do with rights, not with writing. Unless you are trying to make a clever pun...

    -b

    1. Re:[OT] Re:hmm by afabbro · · Score: 1

      Not to mention the phrase is usually "express, written consent". Or perhaps thatskinnyguy writes a sonnet as his expression of written consent.

      --
      Advice: on VPS providers
    2. Re:[OT] Re:hmm by thatskinnyguy · · Score: 1

      I tried to fit the disclaimer (and the word sig) for the National Football League in a sig but it wouldn't fit.

      --
      The game.
  15. Ben Worthen's Opinion by gmuslera · · Score: 1

    Is great. Phones using the gPhone system will be a security nightmare for corporations because, SURELY, will be virus/trojans/malware for them. Have to love how informed and objective is that opinion. Is not like there are no virus already for smartphones (some that were in the wild probably?) but a lot of technologies dont need to have so easy for that kind of malware. Maybe he is generalization about windows, that probably is the only thing he can think of about PC, and that should be already a nightmare for corporatiosn because the traditional "security" of it (something that is instead a beautiful dream when it comes to other OSs seems... at least compared with it).

    And that things are open dont means that could not be signed, or have authoritative portals for that kind of 3rd party applications for those phones integrated with them by default (something like the applets for iGoogle page, or any linux distribution repository).

    1. Re:Ben Worthen's Opinion by Repossessed · · Score: 1

      There are a number of Viruses live for smartphones, though they largely target a single OS (not Windows Mobile actually). Scientific American did a peice on them a while back.

      --
      Liberte, Egalite, Fraternite (TM)
    2. Re:Ben Worthen's Opinion by bhmit1 · · Score: 1

      I think we can all agree his opinion is pretty useless. He's trying to suggest the iPhone is more secure, yet the problem there is that if there was a virus, you wouldn't be allowed to fix the problem. And considering they've already found ways to unlock them and run apps on them, a virus is sure to come one day. If we are going to look at the impact an open phone has, we can review the results of Palm and Windows Mobile and see just how far off from reality he is. You get security problems by writing an insecure OS (e.g. everything as administrator in Windows) and by allowing unknown software to run (ohh, I can click ok to see Britney's boobies!). And I suspect that google and friends will do a better job of that than either Palm or Windows Mobile did.

      And the best part of all, the WSJ blog is run on Apache/Red Hat. Unless we're trying to say Ben Worthen is a worm :-)

    3. Re:Ben Worthen's Opinion by Tony+Hoyle · · Score: 1

      Since the iphone has a wide open security bug that apple still hasn't fixed it's far less secure than other phones right now - visiting the wrong website could have you making a reverse charge call to nigeria.

    4. Re:Ben Worthen's Opinion by SMS_Design · · Score: 1

      Don't even have to go to the wrong site. Man-in-the-middle the HTTP connection to iTunes, replace album art with a bugged .TIF, and you 0wn the iPhone.

  16. Boo by timeOday · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It's still just a client device. Somehow I was hoping for a much bolder stroke from google, like if they'd bought up that new spectrum, thrown in their own fiber backbone, and used it to change the cellco/customer relationship fundamentally. So long as they're working through the same old networks, the US cellphone industry will stay pretty much as-is.

    1. Re:Boo by afabbro · · Score: 1
      Somehow I was hoping for a much bolder stroke from google, like if they'd bought up that new spectrum, thrown in their own fiber backbone

      Sorry, the IPO money is gone.

      --
      Advice: on VPS providers
  17. I for one... by MrLizardo · · Score: 5, Interesting

    ...welcome our Android overlords.

    Good. With that out of the way, I have to say I'm really looking forward to seing what Google can do in terms of getting functionality that has typically been the domain of "smartphones" that typically go for more than $200 w/ contract into the domain of phones that range from free to $50 (again w/ contract). With the minimum requirements set at an ARM9 @ 200MHz, this platform should allow open development on a huge new range of phones. I've already seen people earlier today making dire predictions about how Google is not going to be able to compete with the iPhone or how they prefer phones based on Symbian...and I think these people are completely missing Google's whole plan. I'm sure that initially phones based on Android will fall closer to the smartphone price range, but I can't help but think that eventually Google has to be aiming at the free-to-$50 phones. The "just a basic phone" market is an area in desperate need of a unifyied platform. Between lack of openness and the lack of a properly standardized Java implementation development for a wide range of low end phones is pretty much intractible. If Google can get Android onto low-cost phones *and* ensure "write once, run anywhere" between them I think they will have all the developer support they need. And since they already have the ears of the carriers (T-Mobile, Sprint, etc) they've already ensured they have a way to get this on shipping phones.

    Why do I think low end phones are so important to these companies in the open handset alliance, when they don't have the profit margins of smartphones or "feature-phones"? Simple: Emerging markets. For billions of people around the world it is too expensive or impractical to own and maintain an Internet connected PC. It may be because of upfront cost or it may be a lack of Internet infrastructure in their area. For those people a phone will be their first (and maybe only) connection to the Internet. Right now the browsing experience on basic phones ranges from useless to unbearably slow and there is an impressive *lack* of easily accessible third party applications. If someone could change that it would add incredible value to that class of phones. So what's in it for Google? Making sure that their page is the first one a couple billion people see the first time they get on the Internet is probably worth it.

    --
    ^I'm with stupid.^
    1. Re:I for one... by Ddalex · · Score: 1

      ARM9 at 200MHz is quite slow if it's gonna run a full-featured Linux w/ X interface, if we compare to Nokia 770 - which is quite in the same range.

      --
      Carefully crafted sig.
  18. Obligatory by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    So I suppose instead of hot spots if you have a gPhone you look for gSpots....

    1. Re:Obligatory by GrievousMistake · · Score: 4, Funny

      It will presumably have vibration functions, so sure, if you are a particulary Google-loving nerd girl you could indulge in that kind of... product placement.

      --
      In a fair world, refrigerators would make electricity.
  19. open but for who? by siddesu · · Score: 3, Informative

    Google have been running (on a small scale) something conceptually similar in Japan with one of the major carriers -- KDDI -- for a while now. KDDI have integrated google search as the default search system, and google mail as one of the "official" mail options for that service. In effect there is a KDDI co-branded Google.

    As far as I see it, Google mobile platform is the same thing inside an OS package. The platform will be "open" to carriers and makers who are participants of the Google alliance. However, nowhere in the Google materials have i seen a commitment to make the phone open to the outside developers. Nor does it make any sense for them to open it.

    Depending on how it is rolled out, we may see some sources, but likely we'll never have a chance to apply a patch to the OS actually in the device, or build an application outside of whatever sandbox they put in the OS. There will likely be APIs and widgets tied to the google servers and services, but hardly much freedom beyond that.

    Obviously that is very good for google, if they pull it off. It is less obviously good for the carriers or the makers, but the carriers will eventually agree to this in exchange for revenue-sharing, and because they have nowhere to go, and the makers will be arm-twisted by the carriers. The end result may be that only the "google internet" will be available on the mobile phones that use android. Sorta like an enhanced WAP, imode or EZ web.

    I see no problem with this if one is very-very happy about storing their data on a google server and accessing it via the google phone OS. But I wouldn't call it free in any of the senses of that word we're accustomed to on /.

    But I guess we'll see what it really is when they release the SDK.

    1. Re:open but for who? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      As far as I see it, Google mobile platform is the same thing inside an OS package. The platform will be "open" to carriers and makers who are participants of the Google alliance. However, nowhere in the Google materials have i seen a commitment to make the phone open to the outside developers. Nor does it make any sense for them to open it.

      Depending on how it is rolled out, we may see some sources, but likely we'll never have a chance to apply a patch to the OS actually in the device, or build an application outside of whatever sandbox they put in the OS. There will likely be APIs and widgets tied to the google servers and services, but hardly much freedom beyond that.


      Finding details has been frustrating, but it looks like they're going to open up the complete SDK to everyone, as open source.

      http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2007/11/wheres-my-gphone.html
      http://www.openhandsetalliance.com/android_overview.html

      Wait until Nov 12 I guess.
    2. Re:open but for who? by boredhacker · · Score: 1

      I see no problem with this if one is very-very happy about storing their data on a google server and accessing it via the google phone OS. But I wouldn't call it free in any of the senses of that word we're accustomed to on /.

      The gPhone platform (i.e. Android) will be "free" as in Apache v2 open source license, which is an OSI approved license. I would imagine many slashdotters are accustomed to this kind of freedom as well as other kinds of freedom like BSD, Mozilla, SPL, CPL, Artistic license and even Ms-PL (to name a few).

      Quoting the FAQ:

      Why did you pick the Apache v2 open source license?
      Apache is a commercial-friendly open-source license. The Apache license allows manufacturers and mobile operators to innovate using the platform without the requirement to contribute those innovations back to the open-source community. Because these innovations and differentiated features can be kept proprietary, manufacturers and mobile operators are protected from the "viral infection" problem often associated with other licenses.
    3. Re:open but for who? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative
      Well, http://www.openhandsetalliance.com/android_overview.html says:

      All applications are created equal
      Android does not differentiate between the phone's core applications and third-party applications. They can all be built to have equal access to a phone's capabilities providing users with a broad spectrum of applications and services. With devices built on the Android Platform, users will be able to fully tailor the phone to their interests. They can swap out the phone's homescreen, the style of the dialer, or any of the applications. They can even instruct their phones to use their favorite photo viewing application to handle the viewing of all photos.


      My understanding is that anyone will be able to write applications for Android and use them, without requiring any blessing.

      Nor does it make any sense for them to open it.


      I think it makes a lot of sense for Google to open it (ie. to allow third party developers like yourself to write software for Android), as it will make the platform far far more attractive than it would be otherwise, and I think Google really understands this.

      Disclaimer: I work for Google.
    4. Re:open but for who? by siddesu · · Score: 3, Interesting

      yeah, i read the propaganda, but the question remains open. who decides what runs on your phone? you, google, the maker or the service provider? there is no answer to that question in the paragraph above, nor in the apache license. the makers/carriers are obviously free; it not so obvious if the end user will be.

      incidentally, how come something which is GPL2-based (if it really is off the linux kernel) can be released as Apache2. as far as i remember, the two licenses aren't really compatible.

    5. Re:open but for who? by boredhacker · · Score: 1

      who decides what runs on your phone?
      You do, by examining the product you purchase before forking over your money ;-) No one is holding a gun to anyone's head and forcing them to buy a phone (expect in some very perverse criminal situations, lol).
    6. Re:open but for who? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Disclaimer: I work for Google. In the astroturfing ... errr marketing department?
    7. Re:open but for who? by siddesu · · Score: 1

      yeah, that is true in the theoretical case where there is unlimited competition. in the real world you can only buy what is on offer, and sometimes big companies are known to stand in the way of unlimited competition.

      but this is all theoretical -- i guess we'll see what happens in a few months anyway.

    8. Re:open but for who? by Kelbear · · Score: 1

      That's exactly the problem that came to me as soon as I heard about this "Android".

      Open-source but no provisions that improvements on the open-source software be reintroduced to the open-source community.

      It can only get loaded up on existing phones which are already running proprietary software from the existing companies. So this allows them to take Android, make proprietary software, and pretty much do...exactly what they're doing now.

      I'm not seeing where the incentives are for anyone to use this. And if they can't get these companies to allow users to put this on their phones, there's nowhere to actually use it. Few competitors, and high barriers to entry make me pessimistic that anyone would jump on this and cause everyone involved to have to start competing.

  20. ATT is OK by dookiesan · · Score: 1, Informative

    There is so much complaining about cell carriers, I feel that anyone who is happy with theirs must speak up for the sake of balance and perspective.

    I signed on with Cingular maybe 4 or 5 years ago. I make phone calls and text messages with my phone and I've never had a problem with the company. I'm on my third phone and they've all worked very well and have nice interfaces (I admit the verizon interfaces look like sh*t though).

    Whenever I've called with a problem customer service has been pretty helpful. I've never had a billing issue though I don't change my damn plan every other month either. I even broke my phone halfway through my contract due to my own fault (threw it against the wall), and they gave me a new one as long as I renewed.

    What the F should I be doing with my phone? Somehow everyone here hates their cell carrier, but I've completely missed out on this bitchfest...and it would be great to join. You might complain about how expensive ringtones are, but how pathetic is it to even _want_ a custom ringtone ?! I wish that no one could even turn the ringer ON. (I can upload my own ringtones to the phone for free, btw). I might complain about how much they charge to send pictures (I can download those off the phone for free too), but it doesn't come up since I don't feel the need to constantly verify to my friends that I'm still ugly. Unfortunately coverage has actually improved quite a bit, so I can't complain about that as much either.

    1. Re:ATT is OK by deerpig · · Score: 1

      Compared to what?

      Go to Thailand and even the worst carrier is far cheaper, with better quality of service than the best carrier in the States. And ATT is certainly not the best carrier in the States.

      Cingular has a tendency to eat the last few dollars on prepaid phones, even if your phone is turned off. The phones they give you are locked, you get charged for incoming and outgoing calls, SMS and sending images from a camera phone cost a fortune, international rates are double or triple what you pay in other countries and there are huge dead areas with no signal even in major cities.

      I know that the same can be said for all carriers in the States. But you call this OK?

    2. Re:ATT is OK by naetuir · · Score: 0

      Obviously it's okay. The masses have already spoken, and they will accept the charge!

      --
      Use what works.
    3. Re:ATT is OK by inline_four · · Score: 1

      I'll second your point. I've been a long time Sprint customer and I really can't say I've had any problems with them. I probably overbuy when I'm picking out a plan, but, just as you said, all my phones have worked fine, never had a billing issue, and the features that I do use just work.

      That said, I am excited about Android, provided it is indeed open for 3rd party developers. It would be the first time I was ever excited about anything in the mobile market.

      --
      Alexey
  21. Won't take over the market overnight? by rastoboy29 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I don't think they'll take over the mobile market overnight, either.  I think it'll take at least a few weeks.

    After all, who would want an open standard phone where you can install your own software and not be charged a buck for a text message or a ringtone?  Who the fuck would want that?

    1. Re:Won't take over the market overnight? by imemyself · · Score: 3, Insightful

      There are already plenty of phones that you can install your own software on and not have to pay for ringtones (I can't believe that people are stupid enough to do that). For example, I have a Treo (Windows Mobile) - I can install any software I want on it, and easily create my own Compact .NET Framework apps for it if I want to - it doesn't have to be signed by the carrier or anything. I believe I can use any MP3 file as a ringtone, though I just use one of the MIDI's that came with it. Song ringtones annoy the hell out of me. Text messages aren't free - but that obviously has nothing to do with the phone and isn't going to ever happen. You'll always be paying a service provider for text messages - whether its per text, for unlimited text messages, or bundled in with some plan.

      If Google is really successful it'll be because they are able to lower the price of smartphones from several hundred dollars to where the cheap toy phones (that don't let you install software/ringtones/etc) currently are. While I do not know how much of the cost of smartphones is for the OS, I highly doubt that a free OS will make smartphones that much cheaper. Maybe they'll subsidize some of the cost through AdSense or something, though I personally would hate to have a phone that forced me to look at ads.

      More competition is a good thing though, at the very least it'll hopefully drive prices down a bit.

      --
      Every time you post an article on Slashdot, I kill a server. Think of the servers!
    2. Re:Won't take over the market overnight? by Tony+Hoyle · · Score: 1

      After all, who would want an open standard phone where you can install your own software and not be charged a buck for a text message or a ringtone? Who the fuck would want that?

      So you'll be buying an N800 then? By your argument it should have taken over the market by now.

      No need to go that far though.. the symbian SDK is a free download, the dev certificate is free and I've never met anyone that's paid for a ringtone.. even the cheap payg phones can be persuaded to use free ones.

    3. Re:Won't take over the market overnight? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There are already plenty of phones that you can install your own software on and not have to pay for ringtones (I can't believe that people are stupid enough to do that). Do you mean there are any phones left that can't do that? My 3 year old Nokia can!
      Who's idea was it, anyway, to pay $5 for some suck-ass mono/midi ringtone??
    4. Re:Won't take over the market overnight? by mspohr · · Score: 1

      the n800 isn't a phone

      --
      I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
  22. For free ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If they can make it somehow that this phone is free and all revenue is driven by ads, current cellphone market is dead and everybody in droves will switch to gPhone or whatever it is called. If not but ad revenue takes of the monthly charge... pay 10$ for all you can call, that will kill the current cellphone market. If this is just another platform, no it will not take off. Market is saturated with all types of cellphones and carriers, there is nothing to distinguish this from that....

  23. Sprint AND Nextel? by duranaki · · Score: 1

    Did you miss the whole Sprint buying Nextel thing? They are Sprint/Nextel. Is the point to list them twice so it seems like more wireless carriers are on board?

  24. OpenMoko? by supine · · Score: 2, Interesting

    What does this mean for OpenMoko?

    --
    "I can't buy want I want because it's free. Can't be what they want because I'm me." -Corduroy, Pearl Jam
    1. Re:OpenMoko? by MichaelSmith · · Score: 1

      What does this mean for OpenMoko?

      As it stands I will still buy from them as soon as they put out a working phone with wifi. If google had a desktop linux distribution (say a google branded ubuntu) I doubt I would be using it. OTH new applications deployed on the google platform can only be good for other linux based phones.

      I don't think it is going to hurt them, I just wish they would release something which works.

      Phones using the google OS need not be more open than any other linux based phone.

    2. Re:OpenMoko? by walter_f · · Score: 1

      What does this mean for OpenMoko?

      To OpenMoko, the Android will be far less of a threat than to the traditional closed source mobile platforms, all of them (including the recently released ones).

    3. Re:OpenMoko? by Magada · · Score: 1

      In fact, the two could cross-pollinate nicely.

      --
      Something bad is coming when people are suddenly anxious to tell the truth.
    4. Re:OpenMoko? by chrisd · · Score: 1
      It is worth pointing out since we are going to be releasing a ton of code here that openmoko can absolutely adopt it and incorporate it into their work. That's a nice thing about open source. :-)

      Chris

      --
      Co-Editor, Open Sources
      Open Source Program Manager, Google, Inc.
  25. Betamax by flyingfsck · · Score: 5, Funny

    This guy is so clueless, his Betamax VCR is still flashing 12:00...

    --
    Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
  26. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  27. Minor Correction by Comatose51 · · Score: 2, Informative
    "Google's US partners include Nextel and Sprint..."

    Sprint and Nextel is one company. Sprint acquired Nextel.

    --
    EvilCON - Made Famous by /.
    1. Re:Minor Correction by Poromenos1 · · Score: 1

      So the sentence is correct!

      --
      Send email from the afterlife! Write your e-will at Dead Man's Switch.
    2. Re:Minor Correction by ioshhdflwuegfh · · Score: 1

      "Google's US partners include Nextel and Sprint..."

      Sprint and Nextel is one company. Sprint acquired Nextel. So the sentence is correct! No, not really: the sentence is

      Google's US partners include Nextel and Sprint, but not AT&T nor Verizon. Unless AT&T acquired Verizon or vice-versa...
  28. Still moronic. by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    First, it's a blatant rewrite in at least a few places -- while I saw what he was trying to say, maybe, it was worded so horribly wrong that I'd be amazed if it wasn't intentional.

    "Google's operating system is open, meaning anyone can write software for it."

    Yeah, that's not at all implying that it's about an open platform (vs iPhones locked down one), and not about an open source platform.

    But more importantly, he's assuming that cell phone viruses are somehow new with this phone, and that they will somehow cause problems for a corporate network, and that the way to deal with it is anti-virus.

    This is wrong on all counts. Cell phone (and mobile) viruses are not new, though they've never been widespread. They generally don't jump to desktop machines -- the corporate network should be safe. And generally, no one's stupid enough to run anti-virus software on Linux, and very few on the Mac -- even on Windows, the usefulness of anti-virus is questionable.

    So, your IT guy might freak out -- but really, you've got a much higher risk of getting hit by some road warrior bringing his laptop back into the company network (from Starbucks or whatever).

    So that's two for two. Spam him again. Any chance he'll write an update that isn't pure bullshit?

    --
    Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
    1. Re:Still moronic. by emurphy42 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      But more importantly, he's assuming that cell phone viruses are somehow new with this phone, and that they will somehow cause problems for a corporate network, and that the way to deal with it is anti-virus.

      This is wrong on all counts. Cell phone (and mobile) viruses are not new, though they've never been widespread. They generally don't jump to desktop machines -- the corporate network should be safe. And generally, no one's stupid enough to run anti-virus software on Linux, and very few on the Mac -- even on Windows, the usefulness of anti-virus is questionable.

      Things might change if this platform becomes ubiquitous. I'm not saying it's likely, mind you, and anyway the same arguments could be applied to the iPhone SDK (once the bad guys yoink themselves a copy of those dev tools).

    2. Re:Still moronic. by jrumney · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Symbian and Windows Mobile are already "open" enough platforms to expose companies to the theoretical threats this journalist brings up. Open source has nothing to do with this at all, it is an open to developers issue.

    3. Re:Still moronic. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Symbian OS has been an open platform for developers for ages. You can download a free SDK from the internet and develop apps for Symbian phones.

      Are we seeing the above problem on Nokia phones as they're plugged into computers in corporations to synch with Outlook calendar? Nope? Thought so.

  29. Consider the Impact of Software Development by LifesABeach · · Score: 1

    Take a phone, stick in a 16gig ram chip; And you have a development environment that you can take anywhere. The Boss says, "Oh no! do not plug that thing into our network!", you say, "OK", and then email the solution to the boss, and yourself. Open platform implies that the bad guys can do some goofy things. But it also means that salvation is only a /. away. There is one problem, and that is time in between charges. Maybe a Solar Powered Charger, and I can finally develop,(software), at the beach! (memo to self, get the water proof gPhone)

  30. Sounds vaguely familiar by tm2b · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I dunno... it really strikes me a lot like a number of the software standard alliances that Sun and the other Unix vendors tried to put together or participate in over the years. They always full apart because nobody's interests aligned in any lasting way and everybody had a bad case of NIH ("Not Invented Here").

    I'm not saying none have worked, but I am asking honestly - how many technology projects with even half as many partners have actually succeeded in producing a stable platform? It seems to me that the truly successful open source projects have always been independent of any corporate interests - Linux succeeded in making a standard Unix-like platform where years of Dec / Sun / IBM / HP alliances failed and the business interests that have been successful with Linux have done so by learning to support efforts where there was already community leadership instead of trying to dictate a direction to the platform. Netscape did okay, I guess, but that wasn't a big business alliance and hasn't exactly been an exemplar of efficient platform production.

    I'm just not seeing that this is a big deal, except that everybody thought that something much more exciting was actually going to happen.

    --
    "It is our blasphemy which has made us great, and will sustain us, and which the gods secretly admire in us." - Zelazny
  31. Excellent. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not surprised Sprint is on the bandwagon. They've always been Google friendly and vice versa. Care to guess what mobile phone company had the first native releases of Gmail mobile and Google Maps mobile? This should be very interesting.

  32. Hilarious - article updated by author by Synonymous+Bosch · · Score: 1

    "I've read through the comments and most people seem to think I'm saying something I wasn't trying to say. That's my fault for writing sloppy." You're writing for the Wall Street Journal but excuse yourself with "don't mind me, I'm a lousy journalist"?

    Sorry buddy, that pony ain't gonna fly. You don't get where you are with sloppy writing, you don't get the luxury of that excuse.

    "I'm an ignorant arsehole too lazy to actually write a proper piece for this rag"? Sure, I'd buy that.

    1. Re:Hilarious - article updated by author by damsa · · Score: 1

      To be fair they are now owned by NEWS CORP. They are just trying to market to the Myspace crowd.

    2. Re:Hilarious - article updated by author by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL @ flying ponies (sorry no mod points today :( )

  33. Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by gig · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Both Nokia and Google have announced iPhone-killers and neither of them is going to ship one unit before the second half of 2008. Microsoft will need at least that long to shrink Surface down to the size of a Zune.

    Nokia is promising touchscreens and multimedia and Google is promising open source and the Web. Like we already have in our iPods. And they're going to get that to us real soon now. Like in another year from now.

    It shows how miserable Palm has become that Google didn't even buy them. Not even for the name.

    1. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 4, Informative
      Yeah, because Nokia - well, everyone knows they can't build a phone to save their life, right? Let's see. Camera: iPhone, 2MP, N95, 5MP. Storage: 8GB apiece. Web: iPhone, Safari. N95, based on Mozilla. Accelerometer (that 'gee whiz, doesn't every device need this' that fanboys rave about)? iPhone, check. N95, check. Display? iPhone, 320x480, touch sensitive, N95, 320x240, no touch.

      Shall we continue? 3G? iPhone, uhh, no. N95, UMTS, HSDPA. GPS? iPhone, no, N95, yes. MMS? PTT? Ability to use your music as ringtone without paying money to the empire? Java? iPhone, no no no no no. N95, yes yes yes yes yes.

      A few other neat features of my N95. Tethering? Oh so cool. Especially when your phone can act as a wireless access point. OpenGL hardware acceleration? Yes, you read me right.

      But no mind, you just go on being a raving, frothing at the mouth Apple fanboy, oblivious to the RDF.

    2. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by mad4ngel · · Score: 1

      iPhone, 320x480, touch sensitive, N95, 320x240, no touch.

      Shall we continue?


      was continue bashing nokia? or you thing touch sensitivity and a a higher res is a bad thing?
      --
      Useless did you know #887: My /. ID reads 'big toe' in l33t
    3. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let's see it with what matters to me. Visual voice mail : iPhone, yes yes yes yes. N95, no no no no. iTunes Music Store : iPhone, yes yes yes. N95, no no no (don't talk to me about the IE only Nokia music store). Easy access to any of my 2000 songs : iPhone yes, N95, no. Well, are you starting to get it you Nokia N95 (!!) fanboy ?
      Now maybe what matters is that Apple sold 1.2 millions iPhones in Q3 in US only where Nokia sold 1.5 millions N95 world wide. You can go back and play with your little buttons.

    4. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I believe the point was that increasing the screen resolution and making it a touch-screen is hardly an insurmountable problem.

    5. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      Let's see it with what matters to me. Visual voice mail
      ... What kind of backwards mobile phone provider doesn't support sending your voice mail as MMS messages to your phone (and spoofing the original caller's telephone number as the sender)?

      Now maybe what matters is that Apple sold 1.2 millions iPhones in Q3 in US only where Nokia sold 1.5 millions N95 world wide.
      Source?
      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
    6. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by linj · · Score: 1

      was continue bashing nokia? or you thing touch sensitivity and a a higher res is a bad thing?


      Uhm, notice how the higher res comes with a larger screen? iPhone: 163 ppi. n95: 154 ppi.

      iPhone still wins, but your higher res argument pales in comparison to the following: GPS, 3G/UMTS, 5mp camera, a lighter/more compact phone, microSD-compatible, 3d graphics acceleration, longer talk time, and unlocked status (at least here; in Singapore, your iPhones are still locked, while you can buy a n95 in a perfectly fine, unlocked condition). Oh, and you can use your n95 as a Bluetooth modem for your laptop. Let's see the iPhone do that (with the current firmware).

      I'm not quite sure if you just stopped reading after "Shall we continue," but the n95 has far more happy features than the iPhone. The GP poster was right; RDF it is.

      Oh, and about the touch sensitivity thing? The n95 has an actual keypad. Some people need to actually be able to type quickly, y'know?

      (And, no, I don't have either phone. I actually have a touch-screen HTC Hermes, with qwerty keyboard. For me, a tactile keyboard is about 400x more useful than the omg!-touch-shiny-factor, but to each their own.)
    7. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by gad_zuki! · · Score: 1

      >Like we already have in our iPods.

      "Our" ipods? Not everyone is silly enough to spent 350 dollars on a music player. Hell, you're even comparing apples and oranges. An ipod that can do wifi is useless where there isnt any wifi. Hell, it doesnt even run any apps not approved by apple.

    8. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by p0tat03 · · Score: 1

      I've used an N95 (which I gather from the marketing is Nokia's super-phone, of sorts), and I'm not impressed. Great features like you say, but completely underutilized. All that 3G radio gooey goodness and the phone UI is still cumbersome and a pain to use. This is very typical of Apple vs. their competition. The competition can cram as many features as they want into a neat little device, but Apple will still win by usability alone. Can't say I don't like that, since IMHO technology has always been far too inaccessible to the masses.

    9. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... What kind of backwards mobile phone provider doesn't support sending your voice mail as MMS messages to your phone (and spoofing the original caller's telephone number as the sender)? Jesus, thanks God I don't know any here in Europe, I don't want any of my 160 Mo (do you need some source for this as well ?) to be used by my voice mail MMS messages !!

      Regarding the sources one is from Nokia (d'oh) :
      http://www.nokia.com/A4162334
      And the other is from Apple :
      http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2007/10/22results.html
      Don't hesitate to use Google next time.
    10. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by sootman · · Score: 1

      The devil's in the details. This map app doesn't look too hot. And lacking a touchscreen (and virtual keyboard) my guess is it'll take a LONG time to do any amount of text entry with less than 20 buttons. Predictive text doesn't help much when it comes to names, email addresses, URLs, city names, etc.

      But no mind, you just go on being a raving, frothing at the mouth Nokia fanboy, oblivious to what most people in the world actually want. (Note the proper use of 'oblivious.') We'll compare sales numbers in a year. The parent was specifically talking about "iPhone killers," and if the iPod has shown us anything, it is that feature counts alone don't sell products.

      Java? Are you freaking kidding me?

      I'm sure it's a great phone. I just wanted to bring you down to Earth, same as you wanted to bring down the parent.

      --
      Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
    11. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by thechao · · Score: 1

      Surface has nothing to do with the mechanism used for the iPhone. I don't know anything about the iPhone but I can guess that they use one of a number of techniques for LCD multitouch display; given the touch-patterns used by the iPhone, it is probably just hijacking regular touch technology to look for multitouch and then addressing this as a different set of gestures. The tech behind it uses pressure sensitive or capacitance or whatnot. However, the limitation of those technologies is that two pressure-points result in four readings. Which means that there are multiple gesture modes: one mode for "one touch" and another mode for "multitouch".

      This is different from Surface which uses fiducial based technology (image segmentation); crucially, Surface (and all fiducial touch systems) I know of use a CAMERA to determine where the fiducials are. This means that the system can identify unique touches at unique positions, as opposed to the hijacked `multitouch' that apple uses. Also, please don't refer to "Surface" as MS tech. This kind of fiducially-oriented multitouch system actually predates MS as a company; it is so old that the SECOND generation of patents expired almost 10 years ago. MS simply packaged it in a nice form and then it got all internetized. In fact, LG, Siemens, HP, etc. have sold multitouch fiducial systems for years.

      Now, I vaguely remember an apple patent for augmenting the LCD with a fourth 'pixel' which is actually a CCD element, which would combine a primitive equivalent to a full-blown camera-based fiducial system, but so far it looks like smoke.

      Anyways, just sort of irritated me.

    12. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 1
      Hey, there are many, many problems with the N95. I have no problem 'admitting' that... Predictive text isn't necessarily one of them - custom dictionary, etc, etc.

      The parent was talking about "iPhone killers" in the sense of "we (smug) iPhone users have had all these amazing and advanced features, and Nokia thinks they can put such things in /their/ phone?!?", incredulously disbelieving.

      I like the iPhone, too. But horses for courses.

    13. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 1

      Heh. I loved how you conveniently ignored that the N95 currently on sale has ... da - da da ... 8GB of memory, the same as the iPhone. And that even the original N95 came bundled with (depending on market) 1GB or 2GB microSD. Let's not get into the fact that most VM is stored with a 16kbps codec, if not 9.6kbps.

    14. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 1
      That's great! I love how you neglected to mention the N95 originally wasn't even AVAILABLE in the US, due to poor support for much of its functionality, until consumer demand prompted Nokia to offer it at the end of September! That's what, ooh, let me see, all of a month ago.

      But that's, you know, such a trivial detail when you're comparing sales figures.

    15. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Yeah, because Nokia - well, everyone knows they can't build a phone to save their life, right?

      They can't build a phone that works the way everyone expects a phone to work, no. If you ever have to develop stuff for Nokia + anything else, you'll be cursing Nokia. Well, except Apple, who you can't develop for really.

    16. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've got an N95. Best phone I've ever owned by a country mile.

      I've owned touchscreen phones (although have not played with an iPhone yet) and I wouldn't touch one with a bargepole, the tech is just not needed IMO.

      The map app is fine for simple navigation, just not a Tom Tom. What makes it better than a Tom Tom IMO is the ability to install a free mapping software that includes data from live.com maps, etc.

      My partner has a phone with a mini keyboard and I can type twixe as fast as twice as accurately with predictive text. Sorry if you haven't got the hang of it yet, but predicitve text IS the most superior text entry method. Including for place names, people's names and web addresses, which very rarely are not some amalgamation of actual words.

      Not a fanboy either way, this is my first Nokia and I own a MacBook, just giving my experiences.

      Oh, and the UI is perfectly fine, just as it was on my Sony Ericsson.

    17. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      iPhone is a 2nd class toy compared to top Nokias. Maybe they don't contain latest OSX design ideas, as they are a bit conservative in UI design (future models will probably correct that and take some good ideas from iPhone). Also they are famous for durability (my friend's father happily used that old Matrix "banana" until 2 years ago) and have a huge loyal user base . Nokia is ny no means in a rush to save their business and they'll certainly have a horse to compete with next-gen iPhone.

    18. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      right, cause Nokia has only had what, 20 years head start in the phone market over Apple? I agree that the i-phone has some missing features, I agree that it is not the end all be all phone, but it is a solid offering and one hell of a first try.

    19. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      While it is true that the N95 has GPS and the iPhone does not, the Nokia's battery life suffers for it. A couple of friends of mine have the N95 and neither of them gets more than an hour of use out of the GPS before the battery dies. So yes, the N95 has lots of cool features, but how long will the battery last if you actually start using them?

      Disclaimer: I've not bought a new phone in over 4yrs so I have no personal preference for either.

  34. Somebody fire that guy by SirJorgelOfBorgel · · Score: 2, Interesting

    You will have to forgive me for it being 7 AM, I may not be as irrational as normal ;)

    How did this guy get a job as writer for the "Business Technology" of "The Wall Street Journal" ? It's fairly obvious he doesn't know anything about technology. Open? I do not really expect the gPhone to be open to consumers like a linux PC is open to it's user. A bit more customizable then Windows Mobile, likely, but not anywhere near OpenMoko. The point it seems he is trying to make is that the phone is open in the way that everyone can make software for it. HTC makes devices running Windows Mobile I have absolutely no trouble writing applications for. And indeed, Windows Mobile isn't really open, but if you take a stroll down PPC hacker lane, you'll find that very little is sacred and most things (outside of normal application scope) are not that hard to tap into. It would not be difficult (at least for me, and I'm not a _seasoned_ WM developer) to write virus like or security breaching applications for those phones, and they've been around for what, 5 or 6 years now?

    I guess (and purely a guess, as I haven't even been to the US) for you Americans the real problem is BlackBerry. It steals a lot of the thunder of the current top of the line mobile phones, because it offers similar functionality (be it in an outdated, obsolete and rediculously expensive way), but it is one of the dominant brands. Over here in Europe, where I live, carriers are nice, and everybody and their grandma has a WM-PPC; if not their primary pub-phone, then their work-related phone. I'd be surprised if 1 out of a 100 even ever heard of BlackBerry :)

    In the context of TFA, there is nothing new or even relatively new to the gPhone. I would almost go as far as to say there is nothing 'new' about the gPhone at all - yeah, let's get a bunch of companies together and form and alliance with all the control, then call it open, while it probably isn't really open for end-users, just for the buzz-factor. It's not like we don't have enough 'open' mobile device alliances already. And Google really does seem to be becoming the new microsoft, it's eerie! I Not that I think Windows Mobile is the best thing since sliced bread, performance/power wise it's way lacking compared to Symbian, but nevertheless, it is a really nice platform.

    Obligatory OpenMoko disclaimer; sure OpenMoko may be the shit, but the device simple doesn't fit my hardware needs. It's so horribly two years ago.

    1. Re:Somebody fire that guy by darkfire5252 · · Score: 1

      I don't know why everyone continually seems surprised by Google becoming more like Microsoft. Ethics aside, Microsoft is insanely profitable. One would do well to not forget that, since the IPO, Google is a publicly traded corporation. If the CEO of Google _didn't_ try to 'maximize shareholder returns' aka 'profit at all costs', then the CEO would not only be likely to be fired but could also be held financially responsible for not pursuing the shareholder's interests.

      Microsoft didn't happen in a vacuum. It was and is a product of the corporate goal of only serving the interests of the shareholder, and I'd bet money (or stock!) that Google is destined for similar places. "Do no evil" was good and all, but now if Google's executive stance is anything but "make more profit" then they are legally liable for it and must explain to the shareholders why they were 'fiscally irresponsible in the pursuit of shareholder value and return'.

  35. Carrier lock-out for sure by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This won't help the poor consumer one bit. As long as the carriers force the handset producers (Motorola, LG, Samsung et al.) to "customize" (ie lock out) the features they dont want us to use (yet), we'll be in the same hell we've always been in.

    The only way Google will change things is if they become a carrier and provide unlocked phones and then keep everyone happy by providing the best service and features.

    I'm not saying it'll never happenm but I'm not holding my breath...

  36. Open Source to Who? by DavidD_CA · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Google definitly gets /. props for mentioning the "open source" buzzword, but my question is: open to who?

    I think a lot of Google/Linux fanboys right now are probably foaming at the mouth with visions of linux running on a phone that they have root access to, installing apps whenever they want, downloading music for free, and giving the middle finger to the carriers.

    I don't think that's what Google is doing here. I think Google is creating an "open source" operating system, open to the carriers to do what they want. In all likelihood, it will be "closed" by the time you get it. It will still be locked to the carrier, you'll still be charged for ringtones, and you will still need to buy an outrageous dataplan. I predict this will end up a lot like Symbian or Windows Mobile. The only difference being that there won't be a licensing fee to use it from Google. It may be Free As In Beer, but not to the consumer.

    I don't think this deserves the "open source" moniker that we throw around here on /. At least, I haven't seen evidence of that yet.

    --
    -David
    1. Re:Open Source to Who? by boredhacker · · Score: 1

      I don't think this deserves the "open source" moniker that we throw around here on /. At least, I haven't seen evidence of that yet.

      Of course it deserves the "open source" moniker... Android (aka gPhone) is *not* a phone per se; it is a software platform that will run on many different phones. It will be distributed under the Apache v2 open source license, which is an OSI approved license (see my previous post).

      These sentiments you post stem from the misinformation being reported by bloggers and the media as well a lack of through research on the readers' part. The handset manufacturers, cellphone carriers, and (subsequently) end-users can do anything they want with the Android operating system on their phones so long as they all abide by Apache v2.

      The expectation is that many different phones will use Android. Depending on the target market the actual phone a consumer buys will be restricted to varying degrees. Presumably most *cheaper* phones will be locked down rather tightly (they might even contain varying levels of DRM).

      Other phones (which I'd expect to be more expensive) will be more open. I'd guess that these phones will be targeted at developer/geek types who are more comfortable tweaking their software and are also willing to accept the accompanying risks.

      Android is to cell-phones as the Linux kernel is to PC hardware. The Linux kernel itself is distributed under GPL but devices that use it are not necessarily "free". Just because that fancy new router you bought is running Linux doesn't mean that you can easily replace its kernel with a different one. However, many hardware manufacturers (e.g. HP, Dell, IBM) realize that there is a market for more customizable hardware and they manufacture certain devices so that they can be easily modified to a large extent by the consumer.

      All this should allow for more choice and more competition in the market place, which should lead to greater efficiencies. But, it certainly doesn't mean that companies are going to start giving out "gPhone's" for free! Nor does it mean that consumers will have the ability to change the operating system that these phones use (although some gPhones may allow this too, yipee!).
    2. Re:Open Source to Who? by DavidD_CA · · Score: 1

      I think you and I are saying the same thing, albiet yours more elequoently.

      Basically, I fear that people will go "oooh open source" and be all set to get their free phone and think they can start hacking away at the OS and doing whatever they want with it. Like you said, in all likeliness the phone will be locked down at such a cheap price so that Google/carrier can make their money off it. Users will likely not be able to install whatever they want, install popup blocker software, replace the kernal with homebrew apps, etc.

      That's just my guess.

      --
      -David
    3. Re:Open Source to Who? by boredhacker · · Score: 1

      Basically, I fear that people will go "oooh open source" [but] will likely not be able to install whatever they want, install popup blocker software, replace the kernal with homebrew apps, etc.
      This is probably true for the majority (i.e. the unenlightened). However, you make an interesting point in your previous post:

      The only difference being that there won't be a licensing fee to use it from Google. It may be Free As In Beer, but not to the consumer.
      Therefore this should bring down the cost of better phones for that same unenlightened majority. And... if it gives the enlightened minority a few more open solutions as well, could we not agree that it is pushing the industry in the 'right' direction?
    4. Re:Open Source to Who? by Yer+Mum · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure that solutions on Android will be any more open than on Windows or Symbian.

      There's no way you could modify the code, recompile the kernel and OS, and install a new version. No sane network give approval for devices which allow this.

      Secondly, there's the virus problem. This implies some kind of sandbox and certificate (as on Symbian) or some as yet unknown way (as Jobs vaguely announced for the iPhone). This means you can't recompile user-space applications (e.g. remove Google's adverts from text messages or whatever they end up doing to squeeze cash out of the platform).

      Finally they've chosen a licence which is similar to BSD. So this platform seems as open as Microsoft taking BSD Sockets and coming up with Winsock.

    5. Re:Open Source to Who? by boredhacker · · Score: 1

      I guess it boils down to the age old question... "which is the truly free license, BSD or GPL?"

      My only conclusion is that freedom is in the eye of the beholder.

      That being said, I think we would be remiss to overlook the fact that Android is offering something which (to the best of my knowledge) has yet to be made available... a phone OS that isn't proprietary and not copylefted. It's my belief that more choice is better and I think consumers will be rewarded by the additional competition.

      After all, sometimes we run *BSD, sometimes Linux, and on occasion we even run Windows ;-)

  37. gPhone by mrbluze · · Score: 4, Funny

    Well if it does end up being called a gPhone, I reckon it'll hit Apple right in the iSpot.

    --
    Do it yourself, because no one else will do it yourself. [beta blockade 10-17 Feb]
    1. Re:gPhone by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      but GOOG would never reply back in the gSpot for the same.

  38. That platform won't be open by BESTouff · · Score: 4, Informative
    Sure, the platform will be open for the partners, but not for the developers.
    First, look at the guys forming the "alliance": Broadcom, NVIDIA, Wind River, who are all acting towards closing linux (Wind River was even a vocal opponent to linux some times ago). Furthermore, look at why they choose Android's licence:

    Why did you pick the Apache v2 open source license? Apache is a commercial-friendly open-source license. The Apache license allows manufacturers and mobile operators to innovate using the platform without the requirement to contribute those innovations back to the open-source community. Because these innovations and differentiated features can be kept proprietary, manufacturers and mobile operators are protected from the "viral infection" problem often associated with other licenses.

    There. You can dream all you want about an open platform, like your traditional Fedora or Ubuntu desktop, but that won't be it. Go for Openmoko instead.

    1. Re:That platform won't be open by TrevorDoom · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Gladly.
      Just get Moko to ship a product and I'm waiting, cash in hand, for one.

  39. Smartphone OS licensing costs by Rovaani · · Score: 1

    I couldn't find the cost for Windows Mobile but for Symbian it's as low as $2.50 (used to be up to $7.25).

    (from http://www.symbian.com/news/pr/2006/pr20063401.html)

    --
    Karma: Good! Napster: Baad!
    1. Re:Smartphone OS licensing costs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You still need a UI on top of Symbian, so add in the cost of something like S60 or UIQ. Windows Mobile licenses depend on volume, but can be up to $40.

  40. Re:Grammar police by cathector · · Score: 1

    i say neither pish nor posh but woot and woot !

  41. Thank you Google for the... iPhone SDK?! by ElGanzoLoco · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I was wondering what had prompted Apple to suddenly go out and publish the iPhone SDK. Now I get it - they don't want to risk letting developers flee to Android and miss potential killer apps.

    Now let's see what comes out of Android. It can't be any worse than most current phone OSs anyways.

    --
    Hello! I'm a disaster waiting to happen!
  42. The man's an idiot by naich · · Score: 1

    Ben Worthen - "That's my fault for writing sloppy". And another irony meter explodes...

  43. Speculation or research? by Simon+Brooke · · Score: 2, Informative

    OK, OK, I know we're only supposed to speculate here without actually knowing anything. But if you want to know about it, it's here. It does use a Linux kernel (how then can it be 'Apache Licence'?). Above the kernel it is running a custom virtual machine, which doesn't seem to be a JVM. 'Android', as well as being the name of the project, is the name of a company bought by Google last year which specialised in PDA operating systems; The SDK will be ready for download on 12th November.

    Before they were Android, the people behind the product were Danger, and produced a phone/PDA called HipTop, which was largely Java based.

    --
    I'm old enough to remember when discussions on Slashdot were well informed.
    1. Re:Speculation or research? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Thank you. That was the first comment with some actual information.

  44. Please don't lets have another feature war by Cannelloni · · Score: 1

    Well, cell phones have been stuck in a kind of cold war feature stand-off between Sony Ericsson, Nokia, Motorola and others for many years now, and while the phones have gotten more features and ever more buttons, they tend to be overly complex and buggy. I guess somewhere along the way, phone developers lost track of the users' needs and got bogged down in a Microsoft-like mindset of feature masturbation: to cram as many useless features and gadgets in there as possible. GUess what? People don't want more features. They want real usability, and those concepts are usually mutually exclusive, something the dominant players today will never understand. I hope the Android (and the iPhone SDK) will tackle this and not slowly fizzle out like the Palm OS, Symbian and Windows Mobile are doing. I hope Google et al can do this in a user-centric OS, and not create another feature hell and tarball of bugs. As we all know, the internets are just a series of tubes, and it's all about connecting the wires right...

    --
    Beauty is in the beholder of the eye.
  45. Phone hardware vs phone software by simong · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I have been thinking about the use of Linux on smartphones and one of the conclusions that I came to, rightly or wrongly, is that there is a major licensing problem in the interface between the GPL software in GNU/Linux and the hardware and software employed in a telephony module, to the point that there is a fear that GPL software touching a telephony module would cause the telephony software to become unacceptably open, either from the point of view of business or regulatory authorities, and this is why there is no POTS option for Nokia's Internet Tablet range, and indeed why the iPhone is locked down. OpenMoko has broken this taboo, and will be a major advance in opening the telephony market *if* it passes FCA and European certification - there is no guarantee of this.
    To this end I believe that the Google telephony platform will, in its early stages at least, be a GNU/Linux OS running on an ARM processor or similar with a closed interface to the telephony systems, and with Google Gears and a Java for Mobile Telephony, which may or not be the current Mobile Java, as the developer interfaces. There would still be no direct access to the phone module, and only the only open network access would be over wi-fi unless Google manages to obtain its own pieces of the spectrum across the world or can form deals with phone providers... hmm, does that sound familiar?
    Right now in the UK for example, I can only see one provider even considering allowing the sort of access that Google would want, and that's the one that has no long distance infrastructure of its own and has just introduced a Skype phone that works over its network, partially to reduce its interconnect costs.
    Then again, as most European 3G licences will be about halfway through their life when the OS becomes available, and with the licence holders finally coming to terms with the fact that uptake is being delivered by access to data rather than blocky film clips, the promise of a share of Google's revenues might be enough to encourage the phone providers to open up - a little at least.
    This is all empirical but it's what the current state of telephony looks like from the view of an interested spectator. Feel free to correct me.

  46. The problem is the interface by Colin+Smith · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I Not that I think Windows Mobile is the best thing since sliced bread, performance/power wise it's way lacking compared to Symbian, but nevertheless, it is a really nice platform. You can't just drop a PC style interface onto a mobile, as Qtopia and Windows mobile try to do. It doesn't work. It sucks. There isn't the screen space to waste the way they do, there isn't a keyboard there isn't a mouse.

    Symbian and the iPhone are successful because they don't try to fit an inappropriate interface to the devices.

    Obligatory OpenMoko disclaimer; sure OpenMoko may be the shit, but the device simple doesn't fit my hardware needs. It's so horribly two years ago. It's something which has the potential to revolutionise particularly business applications and processes.
    --
    Deleted
    1. Re:The problem is the interface by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      Symbian and the iPhone are successful because they don't try to fit an inappropriate interface to the devices.
      I'm pretty sure Windows mobile is currently more successful than the iPhone is and in my opinion, the iPhone's current success is largely due to Apple's brand. If Nokia or any of the other big mobile phone companies created the exact same phone instead of Apple, there definitely wouldn't of been such a 'hit'.
      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
    2. Re:The problem is the interface by Tony+Hoyle · · Score: 1

      If Nokia or any of the other big mobile phone companies created the exact same phone instead of Apple, there definitely wouldn't of been such a 'hit'.

      "WTF? No MMS, No 3G, Crappy battery life, Crappy camera. Nokia have lost it."

      Yeah I can see that.. :p

  47. First post by aqsalter · · Score: 1

    From my mobile running Windows Mobile!!
    (unfortunately it took so long to load this page I had to post before the page finished loading...)

  48. English, caffeinemessiah, can you read it? by Timothy+Brownawell · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If anyone was interested in Ben Worthen's moronic grasp of open-source, its pasted below. E-mail your tirades to biztech@wsj.com, of which Ben Worthen is the lead writer, and ask him about how he got his job in the first place.

    Information-technology departments will ban employees from connecting phones that run Google's operating system to their computers or the corporate network. The reason is that Google's operating system is open, meaning anyone can write software for it. That includes bad guys, who will [...]

    He isn't talking about open source. He's talking about it being an open platform like Windows or BSD instead of locked down like game consoles are and the iPhone tried to be. Is the difference really that incomprehensible?

  49. wow... Google drops the ball. by catmistake · · Score: 1

    The big announcement is vapoware? This shit didn't fly very far in the late 90's, and its not going to make it further than 2 years of promises. Google's bubble is going to burst... oh? Did you think their stock would continue to rise ad infinitum? Nope, sell now, it'll be down to $40 before 2010.

  50. No Verizon? by edmicman · · Score: 1

    So, no iPhone for me because I'm not on ATT (Verizon has much better coverage where I am, and first and foremost I need a phone to make calls). And now no Google software-powered goodness, either? Good grief. Ugly retarded phones, and no glitz features at all - way to go Verizon!

  51. What's worse.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well said.... and what's worse is that summary does not even bother to mention tmobile - its the 4th biggest in the usa! Not only the majority are biased towards the big two, even slashdot audience suffer from the same myopia!

    And yes, I am a tmobile fanboy - if there is anything like that.

  52. well. by sh3l1 · · Score: 1

    well. that wsj article gave me a chuckle.

    --
    Help Me! I'm trapped in the tubes! Oh noes! Here comes a internet!
  53. AT&T and Verizon both suck by The+Cisco+Kid · · Score: 1

    And I wouldnt care to have service from them anyway. Oh, and point of fact, "Nextel and Sprint" are the same company now.

  54. From the horses mouth by switcha · · Score: 1
    Well, that "never" didn't last long.
    From TFA:

    "We are not building a GPhone; we are enabling 1,000 people to build a GPhone," said Andy Rubin, Google's director of mobile platforms, who led the effort to develop the software.
    --
    You know what? ... A little club soda *did* get that out!
    1. Re:From the horses mouth by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That was probably just kissing-up for the press. Let us know when you see "GPhone(tm)" somewhere. If that happens, Apple would probably sue within a week.

  55. mp3 ringtones by norminator · · Score: 1

    I even added a custom ringtone to one of my phones using only a standard USB cable and the manufacturer's ringtone transfer software.
    On my T-Mobile RAZR I'm able to just plug it in and access the microSD card as a removable drive, so I could just drop an mp3 into the Music folder in Windows Explorer (or in Metacity or Konqueror or Finder if I wanted to), then from the phone itself, copy it to internal memory, and use it as a ringtone. No need to shorten it to 30 seconds or use any special software.
  56. Windows Mobile by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This sort of makes me laugh - everyone bashes Windows Mobile, but do you know how much you can customise it?

    I'm guessing most don't so here's a short list, all accomplished with a standard (both ends!) USB cable, Bluetooth or transferred via flash card:

    Themes
    -Background
    -Home Screen
    -Fonts/Apperance
    -Accessibility Options (sort of a big deal to a large segment of the population)

    Audio
    -Ringtones
    -Music
    -Roll your own
    -Standard and common formats (mp3, aiff or wav)

    Video
    -Standard and common formats
    -mp4, gp3; wma admittedly preferred

    So while Windows Mobile has a lot of flaws, it's ridiculously receptive to USER level customization. Using ActiveSync is nice, and that's a Windows application available for free (as in beer) download - but you certainly don't have to use it, even if Windows is your OS of choice. Store your data to one of many commonly used flash cards (mine uses microSD) and you're on your way.

    If you're complaining you can't rewrite the stack for WM, this post isn't targeted to you - it's meant for the guy who needlessly pays real money to change his background or ringer. A quick eBay search for WM devices shows used gear to have depreciated nicely for those interested.

    Cheers,
    -William

    PS: I rather don't want to touch off some phone peeing contest - I don't care to peeing of any sort at all from slashdot, thank you very much.

  57. iPhone killers??? by jotaeleemeese · · Score: 1

    Sorry, show me the numbers sunshine, I did not know the iPhone was the dominant phone in any market, but you may have details of this.

    If anything the iPhone is trying to play the Nokia killer role, time shall tel but most likely they will remain a niche player in the telephony side at least (the lack of features is astounding and public in Europe and Asia are used to more sophisticated devices).

    --
    IANAL but write like a drunk one.
  58. Re:Second half of 2008 great for vapor phones huh? by kurt555gs · · Score: 1

    I am what one may call a fonephreak. I have boxes of old cell phones , and even an Iridium. My N95 is far and away the greatest mobile device I have ever had. In combination with the SW-8U folding keyboard, I can even do online banking, and with Gizmo Project, I use is as my WiFi phone at home.

    Yes the iPhone is pretty, but I use my N95 for business so much, it has not only replaced my POTS phone, but most of the functions of my laptop.

    I even do my online banking on it.

    Oh, and it runs putty as well , so when i need to fix something at home while away, I just pop open the folding keyboard and go at it.

    N95 roolz

    --
    * Carthago Delenda Est *
  59. Why do these comments still get +5 insightful? by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 1

    I'll admit that the popularity of a program does influence how secure it appears. There will be more attempts at cracking the dominant OS.

    But, with an open source program, the more popular (and "standard") it is, the more attempts will be made at fixing it, also.

    And, so far, I've seen nothing to convince me that a piece of software cannot be both ubiquitous and bulletproof.

    Let me put it this way...

    How many times has Google.com been cracked?

    Now, yes, the same arguments could be applied to the iPhone SDK -- but I'd think they'd be applied to iPhones, period, no matter if you're allowed to run third-party apps on them. After all, being popular means someone will find a way to crack the iPhone's Safari and release a worm onto an unsuspecting Windows-based corporate network!!!

    And I would have to laugh at any admin who starts banning either gPhone or iPhone. Security is about economics, not paranoia. Otherwise, you may as well unplug everything, including power, just to be safe! (Except, you won't be.)

    --
    Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
  60. I think we need a kdawson sub-section by clayne · · Score: 0

    So I can stop having to scroll past these Google and Microsoft articles.