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MLB Fans Who Bought DRM Videos Get Hosed

Billosaur writes "Major League Baseball has just strengthened the case against DRM. If you downloaded videos of baseball games from MLB.com before 2006, apparently they no longer work and you are out of luck. MLB.com, sometime during 2006, changed their DRM system. Result: game videos purchased before that time will now no longer work, as the previous DRM system is no longer supported. When the video is played, apparently the MLB.com servers are contacted and a license obtained to verify the authenticity of the video; this is done by a web link. That link no longer exists, and so now the videos will no longer play, even though the MLB FAQ says that a license is only obtained once and will not need to be re-obtained. The blogger who is reporting this contacted MLB technical support, only to be told there are no refunds due to this problem."

299 comments

  1. No support? Hear from my lawyer. by Volante3192 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The blogger who is reporting this contacted MLB technical support, only to be told there are no refunds due to this problem

    I smell a class action coming along..

  2. Translation? by phalse+phace · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "....there are no refunds due to this problem.""

    It's your problem, not ours.

    1. Re:Translation? by sm62704 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      -1, troll? Who gave major league baseball owners slashdot mod points? The parent is correct, albeit sarcastically (and I'd have been sarcastic too). It's not a problem to the MLB, they already GOT your money, sucker!

      Now mod me troll too.

      -mcgrew

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    2. Re:Translation? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      If the product is defective by design, and you buy it, and it turns out to be defective, the product is working as intended. I don't see what the problem is.

    3. Re:Translation? by Jeff+DeMaagd · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There may yet be a chance to settle it.

      If you can dig up the credit card bills, you might still be able to do a charge-back. I know it's kind of pushing it, but my mom does the CC transactions for the family business, and she says that in some cases, there is time limit for a charge-back. It's really brutal for the merchant though, $15 fees per transaction on top of losing the money. Normally, I'd say doing a chargeback two years after the purchase is pretty dickish, this situation is ridiculous. I'd check your card's policies first, but once you know for sure, I suggest that you take it up with the customer service and threaten to do a charge-back before going through the procedure.

    4. Re:Translation? by Intron · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Seems reasonable. You got to use the video for two years. They got to use your money for two years. They take the video back, you take your money back. Fair is fair.

      --
      Intron: the portion of DNA which expresses nothing useful.
    5. Re:Translation? by ubrgeek · · Score: 2, Funny

      Steve Ballmer reads Slashdot?!?? *grin*

      --
      Bark less. Wag more.
    6. Re:Translation? by Trillan · · Score: 1

      I don't know if this would work, but it's definitely worth investigating. Assuming the videos were purchased individually, the chargebacks on those 71 games would cost them $1,065. Yowsers.

    7. Re:Translation? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      It's more than brutal to vendors - three chargebacks and you lose your merchant account for 7 years. And you can't get another one because you're blackballed that is, lose your visa account and M/C and Amex won't give you one either.

      But there's a 6 month time limit (I think; that # is off the top of my head; 70% confidence in it)

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    8. Re:Translation? by jdjbuffalo · · Score: 1

      Citation?

      Unless things have changed in the last couple of years since I had a merchant account that's not true plus seems waaay to brutal. The merchant account I had stated that if you had 1% of sales (assuming you got more than a handful of charges per month, like we did) chargeback then you not only would lose your merchant account but they would consider fining you insane amounts of money (like $100k).

      --
      We have four boxes with which to defend our freedom: the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box.
    9. Re:Translation? by Jeff+DeMaagd · · Score: 1

      I was told the figure was 1% when I signed onto my merchant account. I don't know if it is 1% by number of transactions or by money. Over 1% was enough to yank your account and basically blacklist you. 3 chargebacks is very low in my opinion - but I've never had one over hundreds of transactions in a year, and I don't think my parent's business had a charge-back and they've had a merchant account for maybe 20 years.

      Maybe six months is the time limit, I don't know.

    10. Re:Translation? by SL+Baur · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Why the hell do these stupid sports-minded assholes think the major league organizations are any better than the **AA. They're getting what they deserve for their misplaced trust, just as the music/movie idiots are. Not very tactfully put, but brutally correct. They (I'm looking especially at MLB) have been abusing their fans for years. Who do they think pays the bills?

      There's only one way to bring these motherfucking bastards to their knees -- just say NO. Yeah. The year they went on strike and cancelled the World Series I went on strike too. Their loss. I've been to hundreds of Los Angeles Dodger home games, but not any more. I still love baseball, but I follow Japanese professional baseball now.
    11. Re:Translation? by loraksus · · Score: 4, Informative

      BTW - Discover - the card with the most worthless chargeback policy in the industry (amex is the best) will automatically reject any claim that has to do with a purchase more than 6 months ago.
      While other cards have limits, the "clock restarts" in certain circumstances - for instance, if the product was sold with a 2 year warranty and they refuse warranty service, you're covered for x months after the claimed warranty expires to file a claim regarding warranty.
      So, despite what the wonderful people at MLB claim, you'll probably be able to file a successful chargeback. If you get resistance from phone CSRs, file a written chargeback (crappy banks (chase, etc) can jerk you around a lot more over the phone)
      BTW - Successful chargebacks are punitive to the merchants and a large number can significantly affect them financially, so this is the best way to get back at them.

      --
      1q2w3e4r5t6y7u8i9o0pqawsedrftgthyjukilo;p'azsxdcfv gbhnjmk,l.;/
    12. Re:Translation? by Smauler · · Score: 2, Interesting

      That's one thing that confuses me completely. They don't have _any_ of my money. However, I watched the world series live this year completely legally, without adverts. How did I do this? I live in the UK, and channel 5 aired them all in full. When the US broadcast goes to adverts, in the UK we get local commentary on the game.

      Channel 5 is a free to view channel that relies on advertising for it's revenue. It is not affiliated with the BBC or has anything to do with the license fee. I doubt they could get a huge amount of money with advertising at the time most US sports show anyway (all the world series games started at about 1am here). However, _somebody_ is paying for channel 5 to air MLB, and it isn't me.

      My best guess on who is paying for MLB, NBA, NHL and NFL (yes, we get the others too) to be aired on five is the MLB, NBA, NHL and NFL. I can't imagine channel 5 are paying much, if anything, since they do not air adverts during the games.

      This is mostly a rant on how where you live affects what you can watch, and how in some cases the MLB does not care who watches their games for free. Restrictions will only apply to the populace who wants it most - if the populace doesn't want it, there is no need for restrictions. We have the same thing in the UK - it costs an arm and a leg to watch any football on TV (excluding events in law that must be on standard tv, that is the FA cup, the world cup, and England's competitive home games iirc). Anyone who wants to follow their own club on TV has to pay through the nose... though I'm not often affected by this because I support Colchester United :P. (though Colchester are now riding high and are on TV now and again)

      Just to clarify - channel 5 generally only show four US sports events a week - on Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday. On Thursday, Friday and Saturday, they have crap phone in game shows on (which presumably net them more profit). They have shown the MLB world series in full for at least a few years, they show the Stanley cup in full. The Superbowl goes to ITV (channel 3, also commercial) who generally do a god awful job of covering it with random rugby celebrities. The NBA I'm not as interested in, but I think it goes somewhere else in finals too.

      Wow... this must be nearly my longest /. post, and I've not really made a pertinent point. Oh, DRM is crap. There you go.

    13. Re:Translation? by lewp · · Score: 1

      they show the Stanley cup in full.

      Really? I'm not sure anybody shows the full Stanley Cup in the US anymore.

      Maybe Food Network?

      --
      Game... blouses.
    14. Re:Translation? by Smauler · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure what your point is - my nomenclature may be off, I meant the Stanley cup finals. Anyway, ice hockey is IMO probably the biggest and most international sport originating outside of the UK (I nearly put England there and forgot golf ;P). Hockey is definitely my favorite sport from across the pond. I can listen to it free, too, though this has unintended drawbacks - if I ever go across the Atlantic to Toronto, I'll have somewhere to pick up my home security. Alaaaaarm force! (I even remember the number)

    15. Re:Translation? by Fnkmaster · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Time limits aside, VISA and Mastercard are consumer-friendly to the point of being idiotic when it comes to chargebacks, for non-card-present transactions. My company wins *every* chargeback with Amex - we record inbound calls and just play back the audio where the cardholder agreed to a certain charge/policy when people contest the charges (they are always legitimate charges, we just deal in big ticket items, and it turns out we have a lot of scumbag customers who take advantage of the system). We also win every VISA/Mastercard chargeback where we have a signature on a credit card slip for the appropriate amount, and we lose *every* VISA/Mastercard chargeback that we don't have that slip for.

      Of course, since we deal in big ticket items, we just hand people over to a collections agency when they play this game with us.

    16. Re:Translation? by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      It's more than brutal to vendors - three chargebacks and you lose your merchant account for 7 years.
      I can't belive the figure is anywhere near this low for big merchants. If it was none of them would be taking cards.

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
    17. Re:Translation? by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 1

      No kidding. That's the thing with DRM, it gives the company the ability to revoke your product any time they want, and there's nothing you can do about it. Class action suit? Great, have fun cashing your check for 13 cents. That'll teach 'em a lesson.

      Face it, DRM means you are at their mercy, and companies ain't got no mercy. They can do whatever they want to you, and you gotta grin and bear it.

      --
      You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
    18. Re:Translation? by Heian-794 · · Score: 1

      how in some cases the MLB does not care who watches their games for free. Restrictions will only apply to the populace who wants it most - if the populace doesn't want it, there is no need for restrictions.

      You can say that again. Here in Japan, evidently people are so desperate to watch major league baseball that MLB.com has implemented the heaviest restrictions in the world: every single game is blacked out. Forget about watching them on TV for free; here we can't even pay to watch them.

      You would think that the group of fans who want to watch the Japanese-born major leaguers whose games are on satellite in Japan, and the group of fans who are more interested in English-language broadcasts of teams that don't have Japanese-born players on them, would be mutually exclusive (and that the latter group would be so small that it wouldn't be worth going to the hassle of blacking them out).

      Since every game, for every team, is blacked out every single day, I just buy single games when I'm outside of Japan. And now I can't even watch those old games that I saved!?

      History will not judge Bud Selig kindly.

    19. Re:Translation? by Punko · · Score: 1

      Sorry, lost you there.

      You mentioned hockey and Toronto in the same sentence.
      We don't consider Toronto a real team.

      Go Sens!

      --
      If only we could fall into a woman's arms without falling into her hands
    20. Re:Translation? by dotancohen · · Score: 1
      --
      It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.
    21. Re:Translation? by Jerry · · Score: 1

      This is the "free crack" phase of peddling dope.

      After Brits get addicted to watching NFL, if ever, then comes the ads and fees.

      --

      Running with Linux for over 20 years!

    22. Re:Translation? by Autonomous+Crowhard · · Score: 1
      Not only does a chargeback cost them immediately, if there are enough chargebacks the the CCs will raise the per transaction cost. This way the CCs are covering themselves from the chargeback risk.

      Make the calls even though they might be rejected. If there is enough of a hit on the Ricks department at the CCs they might get nasty with MLB even if they won't refund the money.

    23. Re:Translation? by ratbert6 · · Score: 1

      [OT] regarding chargebacks and your comment "(amex is the best)" I can only say I respectfully disagree unless they have changed their policies significantly since my experience.

      I have been a proud Amex Non-member since 1996 due to a attempted chargeback to a hotel that I cancelled a week long stay within 15 minutes of checking into the hotel for very good reasons. The hotel management at the moment witnessed the event and had no problem with me cancelling but I lost my receipt proving I did cancel before leaving the hotel, which later allowed them to "dispute" my claims after the fact.

      We booked another room at significant additional expense down the road.

      Due to other issues with Amex (they randomly changed my mailing address to a non-deliverable address from time to time) I didn't always get my statements very timely. Another reason for ditching the idiots right there.

      While working through the dispute resolution process with Amex and the Hotel (The manager had been replaced already so noone that I had booked with or talked to even worked there anymore) my 3 month time-frame expired and suddenly it was my problem,

      Quote from Amex as best I can recall:

      AMEX: Sorry, it looks like you are correct but there is nothing we can do as your dispute time has elapsed and the merchant does not have to return the funds now

      ME: But YOU changed my address causing me not to get my statements and various other communicatiuons about this event (I had to file a written complaint and respond to their response - which I didn't get for quite awhile)

      AMEX: Yep, it appears you've moved a couple of times in the last year, that can result in delays in getting mail forward etc.

      ME: I have not moved. YOU changed my address for reasons unknown to me. I discover you changed it, have you fix it, and I start getting my statements again. Why am I responsible for your actions?

      AMEX: Sir, we do not change people addresses unless directed to by the customer

      ME: BS, check your call notes and history from me, this is at least the third time this has happened in the last year.

      AMEX: Yes, it appears you've been moving back and forth between two similar looking addresses.....

      If you want to know I live in a town without a post office, so my physical address is not the same as my postal address (the town is different) Amex was deciding my TOWN name was no good, so they looked for a similar TOWN name and changed it in my records, also substituing in the new towns ZIP code for the correct one that I already had. They were assuming because I had a TOWN name that didn't match the database then BOTH my TOWN and ZIP were wrong, when in fact the ZIP was correct and of course the local postmaster at my ZIP knows all about my TOWN not having it's own post office so there is not a problem, unless you are AMEX in search of the perfectly consistent database that can never match the imperfect real world... Clueless fucks

      I closed down several Amex accounts that day and do not regret it one little bit.

      FUCK AMERICAN EXPRESS

      --
      There is no innocence in the eyes of an evil man with power. Referring to Judge Roy A. Scoggins 378th District Court
    24. Re:Translation? by Grishnakh · · Score: 1

      Yep, I got an AMEX card because of the reputation for being customer-friendly. What a lie that was. AMEX is just a big scam as far as I'm concerned.

      AMEX has gotten worse since you left. Now, they sign you up for services you didn't request (like unnecessary travel insurance), and then give you a hard time when you ask for a chargeback. The fake insurance company will claim that you authorized the charges, and that they have a tape of this, but can't find it. The company is actually run by Amex, and after enough complaints they'll reverse the charge, but most people don't bother, or don't notice the charges.

  3. Yea that's a shame... by Wolvie+MkM · · Score: 5, Funny

    Excuse me while I enjoy my NHL feed on YouTube :)

    --
    I Like Pie...
    1. Re:Yea that's a shame... by sm62704 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Excuse me while I enjoy my MLB feed on Morpheus. Oh wait, I forgot - I stopped watching baseball the year they cancelled the world series.

      My point, thoough, is that the only ones with functioning videos got them illegally.

      -mcgrew

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    2. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Bert64 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      In any case, those people who obtained pirate copies often have a superior experience to legit buyers. All this does is encourage more piracy.

      --
      http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
    3. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Wolvie+MkM · · Score: 1

      Hence why I'm proud that one of the few things that the NHL has done recently is to not limit their fans to some locked in DRM'd platform.

      Granted the NHL is desperate for viewers outside of Canada and the NE of the United States, but baseball is hardly pulling down serious money out side of it's top 5 markets.

      The MLB has done a fantastic job this year of screwing their loyal fans out of their money.

      --
      I Like Pie...
    4. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Jherek+Carnelian · · Score: 1

      Excuse me while I enjoy my MLB feed on Morpheus.
      Oh wait, I forgot - I stopped watching baseball the year they cancelled the world series. In hyper-capitalist america, MLB cancels you!
    5. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Alzheimers · · Score: 1

      I guess you don't use NHL.TV then.

    6. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Wolvie+MkM · · Score: 1

      Sweet Jesus! You just made my year! Thanks!

      --
      I Like Pie...
    7. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Fred_A · · Score: 1

      Granted the NHL is desperate for viewers outside of Canada and the NE of the United States, but baseball is hardly pulling down serious money out side of it's top 5 markets. Apart from Japan where I believe it enjoys some popularity, baseball is completely ignored outside of the US (and apparently Canada). The NHL might be desperate for viewers but I don't think many viewers are desperate for what it has to offer.

      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    8. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Wolvie+MkM · · Score: 1

      Very true! Shame since it combines two things (speed & violence) that you'd think would resonate with American viewers based on what is popular in the marketplace!

      Sorry for dragging this off on a side topic anyways!

      --
      I Like Pie...
    9. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      BTW, the H in NHL is Hockey ;)

    10. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Fred_A · · Score: 1

      BTW, the H in NHL is Hockey ;) Oh, right. Well, that's not really a worldwide sport either at any rate... :)
      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    11. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's very popular in Cuba, I believe...

    12. Re:Yea that's a shame... by mpe · · Score: 1

      In any case, those people who obtained pirate copies often have a superior experience to legit buyers.

      DRM more or less ensures that this is the case (if the "pirate copy" is free then that is a bonus). The pirate version would have to be very poor for the DRMed version to even get a look in.

      All this does is encourage more piracy.

      Which is something the advocates of DRM just don't get...

    13. Re:Yea that's a shame... by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      "I was at a boxing match last night, and a hockey game broke out." -Rodney Dangerfield

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    14. Re:Yea that's a shame... by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      In Soviet USSA, MLB cancels you!

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    15. Re:Yea that's a shame... by Wolvie+MkM · · Score: 1

      You've been watching some Leafs vs Sens games I see ;)

      --
      I Like Pie...
  4. A Slow Death by JBMcB · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I don't think DRM is going to go away until a lot more people get burned by it in this way. Most people don't understand or care, once something like this rears up and bites them in the ass, the outrage machine will start. Thank you, MLB, for being the obnoxious, monopoly-driven organization we've all come to love to hate.

    --
    My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
    1. Re:A Slow Death by Dachannien · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Digital TV and the assault on the VCR/DVR is going to be the telling moment in the fight against DRM. Everybody's got a TV, and just about everyone has either set their VCR or DVR to record a show or movie for them or gotten their nine-year-old child to do it for them. When the media companies finally get their way and Joe and Jane Sixpack can no longer freely re-watch "It's a Wonderful Life" to their heart's desire every holiday season, there will be outrage. Of course, by that time, the technology will be so entrenched that it will be next to impossible to remove it.

    2. Re:A Slow Death by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Digital TV and the assault on the VCR/DVR is going to be the telling moment in the fight against DRM. A day doesn't go by when my Series3 TiVo doesn't tell me some HD programming it recorded is not authorized for display over an HDMI connection. (WTF?! Component I could understand, but why the hell would it prevent playing over HDMI?) So far I've managed to get around it by one or more of going back to Now Playing and selecting the recording again, turning the HDTV off and back on, or turning the HDMI switchbox between them off and back on.
      --
      Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
    3. Re:A Slow Death by mike260 · · Score: 5, Funny

      When the media companies finally get their way and Joe and Jane Sixpack can no longer freely re-watch "It's a Wonderful Life" to their heart's desire every holiday season, there will be outrage. Angry mob: "Hey! Where are those digital rights we gave you to manage? We want them back!"
      Jimmy Stewart: "Well I don't have your rights here, they're in Bill's house, and in Steve's house..."
    4. Re:A Slow Death by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      [DRM] will be so entrenched that it will be next to impossible to remove it. You need to visit doom9.net and SlySoft a little more often.
      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    5. Re:A Slow Death by OldSoldier · · Score: 2, Interesting

      My Comcast DVR is already like this.

      I live in an area where power outages for a few days happen at least once a winter. When the power goes out, often times the cable does too. We have a generator, and use the Comcast DVR quite heavily. Imagine my surprise when during one recent power outage we thought we'd watch some DVRed programs only to find out that THE DVR DIDN'T WORK. I couldn't bring up the menu system w/o an active connection to Comcast central.

      Go figure.

    6. Re:A Slow Death by Dachannien · · Score: 1

      I guess I should have qualified my statement with "and not live in fear of going to federal pound-me-in-the-ass prison".

    7. Re:A Slow Death by xoff00 · · Score: 2

      A day doesn't go by when my Series3 TiVo doesn't tell me some HD programming it recorded is not authorized for display over an HDMI connection. (WTF?! Component I could understand, but why the hell would it prevent playing over HDMI?) So far I've managed to get around it by one or more of going back to Now Playing and selecting the recording again, turning the HDTV off and back on, or turning the HDMI switchbox between them off and back on. This why I chose not to bother with HDMI when I built my new HD system and just use component video and digital audio instead. I can't tell the difference, to be honest. (I did make sure I *have* HDMI capability, hoping they fix the crap, but I'm not holding my breath.) Component is a "good enough" picture, especially when the alternative is suffering the look from Wife 2.0 (I upgraded to the model with the nicer case) when, Cthulhu forbid, she can't watch Dancing with the Stars because of some HDMI BS.
      --
      ...Xoff
      Phineas J. Whoopie, you're the greatest!
    8. Re:A Slow Death by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      Most people don't understand or care, once something like this rears up and bites them in the ass, the outrage machine will start.
      Because they don't understand, they'll just assume it's all this "new fangled" technology and just assume that's the way it is with computers.

      There won't be outrage.
      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
    9. Re:A Slow Death by Eskarel · · Score: 1
      People don't care because when DRM is non intrusive it doesn't affect most people.

      The average person has no information ideology and so long as they're not inconvenienced by whatever DRM exists they don't care.

      That said you're right, the more companies use DRM to be dickheads(and MLB is notorious about being dickheads about copyright), the more it will inconvenience people and the more they'll want it gone. So for all of you who have a fundamental objection to DRM, send a thank you letter to MLB because it's folks like them who will get rid of it for you.

    10. Re:A Slow Death by SynapseLapse · · Score: 4, Funny

      ...especially when the alternative is suffering the look from Wife 2.0 (I upgraded to the model with the nicer case) when, Cthulhu forbid, she can't watch Dancing with the Stars because of some HDMI BS.

      Completely off-topic, but I think using phrases suchs as "Wife 2.0" and "I upgraded to the model with the nicer case" are the real reasons you get that look in the first place.
    11. Re:A Slow Death by greedyturtle · · Score: 1

      Or by saying entrenched in the market, as opposed to uncrackable DRM.

    12. Re:A Slow Death by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      Either case just lays out the core problem with DRM: it doesn't work. It's the law(s) that worry people, and that's really the only disincentive. DRM is actually an incentive to break the current law as established in the DMCA, just to exercise your fair rights as understood until the corporate loved DMCA was passed.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
  5. One more reason... by capt.Hij · · Score: 5, Funny

    This is one more reason not to pay money to watch grown men sweat a lot and scratch themselves. A few more of things like this and I am going to just give it up completely.

    1. Re:One more reason... by phalse+phace · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Correction. This is another reason why you shouldn't pay money for DRM'ed content.

    2. Re:One more reason... by Stanislav_J · · Score: 1

      This is one more reason not to pay money to watch grown men sweat a lot and scratch themselves.

      Hell, I agree. There are plenty of neighborhoods around here where I can see that for free all day long...

      --
      "Every great cause begins as a movement, becomes a business, and eventually degenerates into a racket." -- Eric Hoffer
    3. Re:One more reason... by heinousjay · · Score: 0, Troll

      You shouldn't pay money for anything. I have all these VHS tapes and no working player. Do they expect me to go buy another VCR? Screw them, they should give me the HD-DVDs for free. That's why I pirate. I deserve to be entertained.

      --
      Slashdot - where whining about luck is the new way to make the world you want.
    4. Re:One more reason... by edwardpickman · · Score: 1
      This is one more reason not to pay money to watch grown men sweat a lot and scratch themselves

      That IS a sport in some countries. Ever watch Sumo wrestling?

    5. Re:One more reason... by gclef · · Score: 1

      Yeah, 'cause watching grown men sweat a lot and scratch themselves for *free* is so much better...

    6. Re:One more reason... by lelitsch · · Score: 1

      This is one more reason not to pay money to watch grown men sweat a lot and scratch themselves. Oh puh-leeeze. Have you ever seen a baseball player sweat on the field, rather than in front of a grand jury?
    7. Re:One more reason... by thegrassyknowl · · Score: 1

      Correction. This is another reason why you shouldn't pay money for DRM'ed content.

      I have always been wary of things with DRM including iTunes. I have purchased a couple of tracks from iTunes but I immediately convert them to unencumbered MP3s so that I don't risk losing the music if iTunes one day decides that I shouldn't be able to play it any more. At least iTunes allows me to do that still. Sure you lose a bit of quality, but while ever you can play the original files it's good. It's only when you can't play the encrypted files that you need to revert to the MP3s. I won't be buying any more tracks from there though.

      I would hazard a guess that a similar thing could have been done with the MLB videos (probably not legally), but people were either complacent or just not aware of the problems DRM could cause them.

      --
      I drink to make other people interesting!
    8. Re:One more reason... by mightybaldking · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I realize you're being sarcastic. But, I'd be happy to pay, say $5, to upgrade all my VHS and DVDs to HD-DVD. I've already paid a licence for the material when I bought the original. I don't see why I should re-licence just to change formats. $5 should cover production, distribution and VHS disposal, and even leave a small profit. And no, I'm not paying for DVD "Extras" I want my Godfather, not a Making Of documentary. I've bought "Dire Straits - Brothers in Arms" 4 times now. 1: LP - 1985 2: Cassette - 1987 - Road trip! 3: CD - ~1991 4: CD 2 ~2002 when the first was scratched beyond recognition. CD 2 was then stepped on. I found a FLAC on a torrent site and burned my own. Not paying again.

    9. Re:One more reason... by Eccles · · Score: 4, Funny

      I've bought "Dire Straits - Brothers in Arms" 4 times now.

      Talk about your "Money for Nothing"!

      --
      Ooh, a sarcasm detector. Oh, that's a real useful invention.
    10. Re:One more reason... by toadlife · · Score: 1

      "I immediately convert them to unencumbered MP3s..." Did you remember to pay the required royalty fee to Fraunhofer before converting those files? ;)
      --
      I don't always use unix-like operating systems; but when I do, I prefer FreeBSD.
    11. Re:One more reason... by Applekid · · Score: 1

      Nah, you purchased the right to view a subset of the pixels available for a film. Those other pixels left out? Hoo, boy, those'll cost ya. :)

      --
      More Twoson than Cupertino
    12. Re:One more reason... by LWATCDR · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Not even close to the same thing.
      1. With VHS you could borrow a friends VHS deck to watch the tapes. You can not with DRM content.
      2. With VHS tapes you could sell them on Ebay if you didn't want to buy a new VHS deck.
      3. With VHS tapes you could have gotten tuner card for you PC and dumped them to your PC as a back up and burned your own DVDs.

      What the DRM content providers are giving you is the right to use the media. You don't own the media, you can not resell it when you don't want it anymore and you can not make backups of it.
      Well if I am buying just the right to use the media then they are under an obligation to make sure that I can use that media.
      I don't condone piracy and I don't do it myself but I sure wouldn't every buy a DRMed video from the MBL again! When you are talking about material that is broadcast then things seem a bit fuzzy.
      If I record the show myself that is fine. But if I forget to record the show and download it then that is illegal? I will not even start on the "rules" that NFL put on their broadcast games. Heck just talking about a game you saw on TV seems to be violation of their rules.
      The media producers would love it if.
      You had to pay every time you watched a show or listened to a song.
      You couldn't skip over any commercials.
      Get up and go the bathroom when the commercials are on.
      Then you have the people that think they should pay for nothing. I say a Pox on both their houses. The problem is that DRM provides no benift to anyone. Well except the DRM producers.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    13. Re:One more reason... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Agreed. Paying money to watch sweaty groan men slap each other on the ass is still cool -- as long as it's not DRM'd.

    14. Re:One more reason... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      ... but at least the chicks were free.

      (btw, weren't you supposed to just want your MTV and be happy with that?)

    15. Re:One more reason... by Belgand · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yet another reason to invest exclusively in prints.

      I mean, OK it's a hell of a lot less convenient to carry around the five massive cans compared to one DVD and I either have to string them all together and break them down again or get up every fifteen minutes to switch reels. Not to mention the problems in archiving the damn things correctly, but dammit I'm getting all my pixels! That is, until the restoration prints come out....

    16. Re:One more reason... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Additionally, patent holders declined to enforce license fees on free and open source decoders, allowing many free MP3 decoders to develop.[17] Furthermore, while attempts have been made to discourage distribution of encoder binaries, Thomson has stated that individuals using free MP3 encoders are not required to pay fees. Thus while patent fees have been an issue for companies attempting to use MP3, they have not meaningfully impacted users, allowing the format to grow in popularity."

      MP3 article on wikipedia.

      Stop being a gnubie, please.

    17. Re:One more reason... by thegrassyknowl · · Score: 1

      Did you remember to pay the required royalty fee to Fraunhofer before converting those files? ;)

      Ahh but those legal and financial gurus at Apple took care of all that for me when they made iTunes able to encode to MP3 files. They are so smart :p

      --
      I drink to make other people interesting!
    18. Re:One more reason... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Correction. This is another reason why you shouldn't pay money for DRM'ed content.

      Re-correction -- the fundamental problem is that there are enough morons who want to watch the bullshit content at all that it's been worth DRMing. You put a value on sweating and ball-scratching and they will DRM it.

      Grow fucking up. Sweat yourself and scratch your own balls -- it's no different.

    19. Re:One more reason... by Sancho · · Score: 3, Informative

      NO NO NO!

      Don't fall into this trap! You did not purchase a license, you purchased a copy. There are huge differences in the rights you acquire when you purchase a copy vs. a license to view.

    20. Re:One more reason... by Selivanow · · Score: 2, Funny

      But...But...But...doesn't the FBI warning tell me that the Video Cassette/Video Disc/Whatever is licensed for home use only and if I even attempt to view it with anyone except/including my immediate family then I will be fined $1,000,000,000....sent to ass-raping prison...sentenced to death or all three?

      --
      -- ...trying to make digital files uncopyable is like trying to make water not wet. -Bruce Schneier
    21. Re:One more reason... by mightybaldking · · Score: 1

      I'm playing their game. If I purchases a licence, then I shouldn't need to purchase another.

  6. hmmm. by apodyopsis · · Score: 4, Funny

    In a highly litigious culture, about a sport which borders on an obsession, about access perceived as a right...?

    I predict the big winners in this one will be the lawyers....

    1. Re:hmmm. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What a moronic statement. He paid for the content. Access is his right by contract. Nimrod.

    2. Re:hmmm. by mentaldelusions · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I love how lawyers make money off the screw ups in our society... i guess you could judge how damaged a culture was by saying it was proportional to the average salary of a lawyer

    3. Re:hmmm. by iocat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Access which you purchase with the proviso that it will always be there IS a right. It's fine to make fun of baseball, fans, and our culture, but if someone sold you a book, and told you you'd always be able to read it, and then two years later you couldn't -- well, to it bluntly, that's fucked. MLB needs to provide the access, or refund the money. It wasn't a time-limited purchase, and MLB is on the hook for this.

      --

      Dude, I think I can see my house from here.

    4. Re:hmmm. by fredrated · · Score: 1

      I think the right demanded is the ability to use what you paid for.

      As for the lawyers, they always win, no matter what.
      (With the possible exception of Pakistan, where right now they are being clubbed)

    5. Re:hmmm. by hedwards · · Score: 1

      I think that what he's getting at is that rather than MLB just providing new copies, they'll probably end up going to court. The lawyers will get the thing certified as a class action suit, then take 40% of whatever the award is.

      Leaving the people that were hurt with perhaps a credit, or a fraction of what they were screwed of. And probably several new ulcers to boot.

    6. Re:hmmm. by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 1

      I'm willing to bet that somewhere in the user agreement, there's a provision that lets them do exactly this, and abusive hard-to-read* EULAs that no one really expects people will read, are just as much the problem.

      *I'm not just talking about the legalese, but how such screens are inevitably different from reading text in the rest of the product, and how it's hard to scroll through or search through, and there's no standard EULA that it can stipulate a deviation from.

    7. Re:hmmm. by RattFink · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm willing to bet that somewhere in the user agreement, there's a provision that lets them do exactly this, and abusive hard-to-read* EULAs that no one really expects people will read, are just as much the problem.

      I am no lawyer but selling someone something and delivering something entirely different is fraud. When you start marketing the videos in the same manner as you do DVDs it's not unreasonable for the customer to expect the same lifespan of the product. I just don't see however much wrangling is done in the EULA could overcome that expectation in the sale.
      --
      "I don't necessarily agree with everything I say." - Marshall McLuhan
    8. Re:hmmm. by spiritu · · Score: 1

      Lawyers in 2004 made a median of $94,930. The median programmer, by way of comparison, made $62,890. For net/sysadmins, the median is $58,190. The lowest median salary by specialty for doctors was $137,119. Surgeons made over $250,000, on the median. Computing and information systems managers made a median of $92,570.

    9. Re:hmmm. by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      An equitable solution would be to either provide the purchasers with DRM-free or reauthorizationless versions of the same clips in equivalent or better quality or tools to permanently unlock the clips they've already downloaded. Give the consumers that and the lawyers can have the entire additional cash award.

      An injunction against MLB against doing anything like this again would also be nice, with a nice big automatic penalty in the billions of dollars, with no cuts going to lawyers fees (that's strictly MLB out-of-pocket). But that probably won't happen.

      --
      Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
    10. Re:hmmm. by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 1

      As for the lawyers, they always win, no matter what.
      (With the possible exception of Pakistan, where right now they are being clubbed) I take it this clubbing does not involve glow-sticks.
      --
      Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
    11. Re:hmmm. by a_nonamiss · · Score: 1

      I predict the big winners in this one will be the lawyers.... You're really not going out on a limb much. That's always a safe prediction.
      --
      -Arthur
      Cave ne ante ullas catapultas ambules
    12. Re:hmmm. by compro01 · · Score: 1

      I'm willing to bet that somewhere in the user agreement, there's a provision that lets them do exactly this

      and as i said upthread, comcast had a provision in their contract saying you couldn't sue them.

      guess what the judges said about that. (PDF warning, though only 100k)

      --
      upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
    13. Re:hmmm. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, No: The Orioles will still suck

  7. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by fredrated · · Score: 2, Insightful

    How can you classify speculation as a fact?

  8. Re:No support? Hear from my lawyer. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You need at least two people to initiate it.

  9. Re:No support? Hear from my lawyer. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Noo... that's not how it works.

    I smell MLB.com launching a defamation suit against the blogger.

  10. I wish I had that kind of time by Schlemphfer · · Score: 4, Funny
    DRM sucks, and inevitiably produces unfair situations like this, where legitimate licencees get screwed. But having said that, what kind of person has so much time on their hands that they would ever want to watch a baseball game from previous seasons? And I thought posting to Slashdot was a time waste ;)

    --
    I'm generally "Interesting," "Insightful," and even "Funny" here. What the hell happens to me at parties?
    1. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by griffjon · · Score: 1

      I knew a guy who'd watch a season of Celtics basketball over and over and over again; they exist.

      I for one welcome our.. er, am happy that the true stupidity of DRM is biting more consumers. remember DIVX (the circuitcity one?) Anything that reminds consumers that they're getting screwed, even if they may not immediately realize it, is a good thing for raising anti-drm awareness. People who played nice with the monopolies and paid for their DRMed content are now SOL, while people who downloaded pirate versions can watch them whenever, wherever, and on whichever device they choose. Hm.

      --
      Returned Peace Corps IT Volunteer
    2. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by Bert64 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      People who *play* any given sport will often watch old games. If your coaching someone in a sport, showing the players your coaching an old game is a very good way to show and explain examples.

      --
      http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
    3. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by John+Hasler · · Score: 1, Troll

      > ...what kind of person has so much time on their hands that they would ever want to watch
      > a baseball game from previous seasons?

      What kind of person has so much time on their hands that they would ever want to watch a major-league baseball game, full stop?

      --
      Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
    4. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by Alzheimers · · Score: 1

      Lately, Yankees fans.

    5. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      let me guess, the big, mean jocks beat you up in high school?

    6. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You might also want to give the kids you're coaching some time off to learn English from someone literate.

    7. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sorry - what would that have to do with 9 overweight guys standing around scratching themselves?

      And for the record, I played football in school, and was a track star.

    8. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by flamdrag · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I've never watched a movie twice or kept a magazine article or read a book again. In fact I only listen to music once and then throw it away.

    9. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by bakes · · Score: 1

      What kind of person has so much time on their hands that they would ever want to watch a major-league baseball game, full stop? Yeah, I don't get it, I can't believe people would waste so much of their time on that stuff.

      On a completely unrelated and much more exciting topic, I'm so excited that the Australia / Sri Lanka test cricket series starts today!!
      --
      Ho! Haha! Guard! Turn! Parry! Dodge! Spin! Ha! Thrust!
    10. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by psm321 · · Score: 1

      Interestingly enough, I actually parsed the second "your" in his sentence as written the first time through, which gives it a different but valid meaning than "you're" (but still, I'm sure he probably meant "you're").

    11. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      That cricket match should be ending some time in 2012.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    12. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      I thought so too, at first. The second 'your' seems to be used almost correctly minus a preposition, eg.:

      showing the players your coaching in an old game is a very good way to show and explain examples.
      But you don't want to show them your coaching, you want to show them the old games, so he clearly spelled "you're" wrong twice. Which puts him at or below the writing level of a fourth grader. Oh well, it's not like coaches are role models or anything.
    13. Re:I wish I had that kind of time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, we are discussing sports. Maybe, just maybe, this excuse could cover the non-ability to write proper grammar/spelling/etc. I know we aren't discussing the NBA, but at least he didn't say "UH" after every couple of words... which UH counts for UH a LOT in UH UH my book UH. *shudder*

      Note... he could have been dictating.

  11. DRM is a VERY expensive version of "Mother May I?" by sehlat · · Score: 0, Redundant

    And the answer is always: "FO"

  12. Doesn't matter how many by pinguwin · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Not the point how many people are affected. The point is that they can take it away from you when they feel like and say, "Suck it". What are you going to do? File a class action lawsuit where the lawyers actually make some cash and you get coupons for 20% expired peanuts at your local teams next away game.

    1. Re:Doesn't matter how many by sholden · · Score: 1

      Filing in small claims yourself would seem better. Seems a pretty clear cut case, though reading whatever the original license was would best done first...

  13. Whoa now... by Chairboy · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm pretty sure we're not allowed to talk about this without the express written consent of Major League Baseball.

    1. Re:Whoa now... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh no! I thought I could do it with implied oral consent!

    2. Re:Whoa now... by CompSci101 · · Score: 1

      Dammit. I should have known that implied oral consent was not enough!

      The cease-and-desist should be here any minute now...

      C

      --
      The Sun is proof that we can't even do fire properly.
    3. Re:Whoa now... by dgatwood · · Score: 3, Funny

      Do you have the express written consent of Major League Baseball and the American Broadcasting Company?

      Just ABC.

      *sound of gunfire*

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    4. Re:Whoa now... by trb · · Score: 5, Funny

      They gave me express written consent, but it's in this document that I can't read any more.

    5. Re:Whoa now... by Stormy+Dragon · · Score: 1

      Darn it! I only have implied oral consent.

    6. Re:Whoa now... by jmauro · · Score: 1

      That's better than me, all I got was implied oral consent.

  14. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by rootofevil · · Score: 4, Funny

    duh, this is slashdot. wild speculation of those that clothe themselves in tinfoil is taken as the gospel truth, no questions asked.

    --
    turn up the jukebox and tell me a lie
  15. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by freshmayka · · Score: 2, Funny

    Yeah BUT...

    If it was 20 CHILDREN then my god something must be done! WHAT about the children?!?!

  16. EULA? by finnw · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Depends whether anyone saved a copy of the EULA they signed when they downloaded the videos.
    If it favours MLB they'll find a copy. But if it doesn't, it would be quite easy for them to say "We've lost all copies of that EULA but our policy back then was to put in a 1-year time limit" and given the small numbers involved, probably no-one will be able to prove otherwise. I think I'll get in the habit of saving a copy before clicking on "I Agree" from now on.

    --
    Is Betteridge's Law of Headlines Correct?
    1. Re:EULA? by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 2, Informative

      Their EULA is horrible and long.
      Its also buried away in a tiny text frame and opens up to a novel size.

      however there is one gem which made me smile:

      2. Message Features

                Participation. The Website may offer opportunities for you to transmit messages in connection with various features including, but not limited to, vanity email, auctions, contests, games, blogs, video submissions message boards and chat features ("Message Features"). You must use Message Features in a responsible manner, and are solely responsible for any content you transmit. You must not transmit any message ("Message") in connection with any Message Feature that: (i) imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load on the Website's infrastructure, or otherwise adversely affects, restricts or inhibits any other user from using and enjoying the Website; (ii) is threatening, abusive, libelous, defamatory, obscene, vulgar, offensive, pornographic, profane, sexually explicit or indecent; (iii) constitutes or encourages conduct that would constitute a criminal offense, give rise to civil liability or otherwise violate any local, state, national or international law; (iv) violates, plagiarizes or infringes the rights of third parties including, without limitation, copyright, trademark, patent, rights of privacy or publicity or any other proprietary right; (v) contains a virus, trojan horse, worm, time bomb, cancelbot or other similar harmful or deleterious programming routine; (vi) contains any information, software or other material of a commercial nature; (vii) contains advertising, promotions or commercial solicitations of any kind; (viii) constitutes or contains false or misleading indications of origin or statements of fact; or (ix) contains material irrelevant to the subject matter of the Message Feature. In order to participate in any Message Feature, you may be asked to register by providing certain personal information such as your name and/or email address. (The Website's Privacy Policy explains how such information may be collected and used.) You may also be asked to select a screen name ("Screen Name") for identification purposes. You must not use any Screen Name that violates any term of subsections (i)-(ix) above, or any other operating term set forth by MLBAM.

      --
      liqbase :: faster than paper
    2. Re:EULA? by kimvette · · Score: 3, Informative

      No. It states that YOU cannot post a time bomb, not that they won't sell you one.

      This is why DRM is evil, and so are EULAs when you are PURCHASING product.

      --
      The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
    3. Re:EULA? by kat_skan · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I think I'll get in the habit of saving a copy before clicking on "I Agree" from now on.

      Just out of curiosity, how are you planning to prove that the EULA you have is the one they made you agree to you?

    4. Re:EULA? by Nullav · · Score: 1

      Strangely enough, I've seen several EULAs with 'no weapons' clauses. (The Linux version of Seatools lacks that section for some reason.)

      --
      I just read Slashdot for the articles.
    5. Re:EULA? by Penguinisto · · Score: 1

      Just out of curiosity, how are you planning to prove that the EULA you have is the one they made you agree to you?

      If it's part of a setup executable or script, you save a copy of that.

      It isn't perfect, but certainly puts things into "reasonable evidence" territory.

      /P

      --
      Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
    6. Re:EULA? by drcagn · · Score: 1

      A "time bomb" is a type of malware... all infected machines perform a certain action at a certain time.

      --
      Scorta futuere amo!
    7. Re:EULA? by M.+Baranczak · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think I'll get in the habit of saving a copy before clicking on "I Agree" from now on. Just out of curiosity, how are you planning to prove that the EULA you have is the one they made you agree to you? How are they planning to prove that the EULA they have is the one you agreed to?
    8. Re:EULA? by Bee1zebub · · Score: 1

      In the iTunes EULA it forbids you from using it in the manufacture of nuclear or biological weapons. Presumably this is to compply with some US arms law, but it does seem a little pointless given that (1)the only uses for iTunes which might be covered would be listening to music played on it while working on a bomb, or listening to bomb-making instructions, and (2) anyone making nuclear weapons would presumably ignore such a restriction anyway.

    9. Re:EULA? by mpe · · Score: 1

      In the iTunes EULA it forbids you from using it in the manufacture of nuclear or biological weapons.

      But you are OK if you want use it for chemical weapons. e.g. turning an Ipod into a bomb and getting an ememy to use it...

    10. Re:EULA? by clambake · · Score: 1

      To which you respond, "Ah ha, I found one after all, it says, 'MLB revokes ALL copyright on this worka nd it is not public domain, and whomever has a copy of this EULA next year own all the baseball teams.'"

      NOW see how fast they "find" the original.

    11. Re:EULA? by mpe · · Score: 1

      Just out of curiosity, how are you planning to prove that the EULA you have is the one they made you agree to you?

      Possibly more important is what parts (if any) of the EULA does the judge think are actually binding...

    12. Re:EULA? by greedyturtle · · Score: 1

      Does using your iPhone to trigger a bomb count?

  17. Phoning home is OK for E.T. by olddotter · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I don't want any product hardware, software, or DRM media that must phone home for permission to work. Too much a risk that the company will go out of business, or decide maintaining the service is no longer profitable.

    If this story is true, I think a class action lawsuit is in order...

    1. Re:Phoning home is OK for E.T. by tm2b · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I smell a class action suit too.

      Which really means, people screwed by MLB's DRM will get a coupon for $.28 off of their next $10 coke at a baseball game and the attorneys filing the suit will get $25 million.

      --
      "It is our blasphemy which has made us great, and will sustain us, and which the gods secretly admire in us." - Zelazny
  18. No surprise there... by WaterDamage · · Score: 1

    Hmmmmm...I wonder what will happen to all those iTunes songs once Apple moves to a new DRM or non-DRM format in the future and stops supporting their old format???

    1. Re:No surprise there... by Brett+Buck · · Score: 1

      Probably nothing, since one of the first things they suggest is to back up the file on CD, so you can re-import it any time you want.

            Brett

    2. Re:No surprise there... by Andy+Dodd · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Same thing that happened to people who bought into Microsoft's "Plays for Sure" system and then bought a Zune?

      Ooops... I found it hilarious that the first company to break compatibility with a system called "Plays for Sure" was the company that created the system... (Note that I said break it, companies which never implemented it in the first place don't count.)

      --
      retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
    3. Re:No surprise there... by sarahbau · · Score: 1

      When they do end up doing that, songs should still play on the computers they're authorized for since it only "calls home" the first time you try to play it on a computer. Hopefully Apple will be smart enough to provide something to remove the DRM though.

    4. Re:No surprise there... by SeaFox · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hmmmmm...I wonder what will happen to all those iTunes songs once Apple moves to a new DRM or non-DRM format in the future and stops supporting their old format???

      Well, since iTunes doesn't verify you have rights to the songs with Apple's servers every time you play them, unlike these MLB clips, nothing would happen.

      If your hard drive got corrupted and you had to reinstall everything, you aren't allowed to redownload the lost files. Just like if your house burns down the record companies don't have to replace your crispy CDs.
    5. Re:No surprise there... by davitf · · Score: 1

      Probably nothing, since one of the first things they suggest is to back up the file on CD, so you can re-import it any time you want.

      If you're talking about simply copying the files to a CD (as iTunes suggests after the files are downloaded), you'll lose access to the data if (when) you switch computers and their authentication system no longer provides you with the key you need to play the files.

      If you're talking about burning them as audio tracks on CDs that can then be re-imported to whatever format you want, for many people that's not an acceptable solution: it requires you to use many more CDs than simply storing the compressed files (and what happens if I don't want to use CDs at all, but instead backup to some other HD or remote service?), and re-importing it will either cause further quality loss or occupy a lot more space than the original files.

      Personally, I only started buying DVDs after CSS was broken, I only buy music from iTunes because QTFairUse is available, and I'd only consider buying encrypted PDFs because there are programs that remove their protection. There are some videos there I'd also like to buy, but I'll only do it the day a program that can remove the DRM from them appears. I prefer buying content in an unprotected format if at all possible, but when it's not, my policy is to never buy any protected content from which I can't remove the protection without losing information.

    6. Re:No surprise there... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They're already hard at work on its successor, WePromiseItWillPlayReallyWeMeanItHeyStopRunning.

    7. Re:No surprise there... by ekhben · · Score: 1

      If you're sensible, you're doing one of three things. (1) Not buying from the iTunes store. (2) Buying, but immediately stripping the DRM. Or (3) Buying only the iTunes PLUS tracks, same cost, no DRM. If you don't understand that "DRM" means "we will fuck you in the ass sooner or later" then, well, you're going to get fucked in the ass, sooner or later.

    8. Re:No surprise there... by jcnnghm · · Score: 1

      But if you had to reinstall without your hard drive crashing, or you were wise enough to make backups, you wouldn't be able to access the Apple Server to issue a new entitlement to the new install to view the content that you purchased. It's very much a similar situation, except the entitlement doesn't happen every time a track is played, just every time a new machine is authorized to play a track.

      --
      You don't make the poor richer by making the rich poorer. - Winston Churchill
    9. Re:No surprise there... by SeaFox · · Score: 1

      If you were wise enough to make backups of the DRMed files, you should have made a backup of your iTunes library file, which I believe might hold the authorization rights.

    10. Re:No surprise there... by Danimoth · · Score: 1

      Hopefully, Apples apparent move away from DRM should help us out in case of such an eventuality.

      --
      No smoking sigs indoors.
  19. Thank You MLB by GweeDo · · Score: 1

    I just want to say Thank you to MLB for this. The more cases of things like this screwing over the consumer the sooner we can see DRM die the death it deserves. So again...Thank you MLB.

  20. DRM - Don't Restrict Me by patternmatch · · Score: 1

    The unofficial motto of the Amazon MP3 store: http://weill.org/photos/show/recent/photo/1832021825/

  21. Yes, but... by n0dna · · Score: 5, Funny

    It's MLB.

    The videos already wouldn't play if it was Cold. Or Raining. Or Night. Or Outside.

    1. Re:Yes, but... by Stalin · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure what sport you're talking about. All game one of the 2007 World Series was missing from your list is a cold temperature, and that is because it was unusually warm in Boston. Well, I assume it was unusually warm. I doubt Boston is normally 70 degrees on October 24.

    2. Re:Yes, but... by conteXXt · · Score: 1

      Baseball is a sport? That's the best one I have heard today.

      Baseball (like American football) is a placeholder between commercials.

      --
      The truth about Led Zep should never be told on /. (Karma suicide ensues)
    3. Re:Yes, but... by Dare+nMc · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure what sport you're talking about.

      Would have been funnier if you had chosen a dome stadium for your single event dis-proof.

      Having not watched a entire game in over 5 years, I was preparing for a laugh, but alas google images disappointed.
    4. Re:Yes, but... by tenton · · Score: 1

      Baseball (like American football) is a placeholder between commercials.

      Congratulations. You've just described TV. ^_^

      Shoot, you've described radio, too.

    5. Re:Yes, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Baseball (like American football) is a placeholder between commercials. Baseball is a game. Football (both American and European) is a sport.

      If you can play it while intoxicated, it's not a sport.
    6. Re:Yes, but... by UncleTogie · · Score: 1

      If you can play it while intoxicated, it's not a sport.

      Never underestimate the ability of a redneck to try ANYTHING drunk.

      Myself, I'm partial to riding a bicycle drunk; it's FAR more of a challenge to stay upright for some odd reason...

      --
      Don't tell me to get a life. I'm a gamer; I have LOTS of lives!
  22. Unlocking Software by TheVelvetFlamebait · · Score: 4, Insightful

    MLB should release unlocking software for the old DRM scheme, even if all the software does is apply the new scheme instead. DRM doesn't have to mean that the files you purchase suddenly become useless, if the company actually takes responsibility for it and fixes it. It's ethically their responsibility to rectify any damage their actions do to other people's property. But there's probably some clause saying that the people don't actually own the video, and are thus under no obligation to ensure the playability of the file. What's worse is that people aren't technically allowed to do it themselves, thanks to the DMCA. I think, however, that MLB is going to learn the meaning of the old saying: "those who aren't permitted to do, sue".

    --
    You know, there is a difference between trolling and pointing out the flaws in your reasoning. Just saying.
    1. Re:Unlocking Software by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      if the company actually takes responsibility for it and fixes it. It's ethically their responsibility to rectify any damage their actions do to other people's property.

      Possession is nine-tenths of the law. I know, it's just a saying, but it is the reason why DRM is so risky. The seller may not have a legal leg to stand on, but in practice he can do whatever he wants because he has control, which is de-facto ownership when customers have no reasonable possibility of redress and no way to remove the DRM. You can thank Congress, once again, for this truly one-sided up state of affairs.

      I mean, if you have to spend a few million dollars on lawyers to get access to your property you're screwed. Furthermore, corporate ethics don't enter the picture, since under no conditions can you assume a particular vendor of DRMed material is ethical, or will always remain so. Quite the opposite, in fact. I have little interest in organized sports myself, but if there ever were a video that I wanted to buy from them, it had better be in a completely DRM-free format (or have an efficient crack available) or I won't buy it. The same applies to music or any other commercial media.

      Why is that? I'll you: it's because I don't trust them with my money ... and neither should you. None of them. They will say, "well, why should we trust you with our products" to which I say, "that's your cost of doing business." Don't take the shady way out. You're just making (ahem) "alternate forms of distribution" that much more desirable.

      Besides, as Lazarus Long once said, "Never trust to a man's better nature. He might not have one."

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
  23. Serves them right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

    Serves them right. If you support DRM by buying this shit I don't feel sorry for you when it no longer works.
    You got what you paid for and everybody told you so beforehand.

    [OT] That's like those people who actually buy that viagra spam, because it's impossible to get from the pharmacy.

    1. Re:Serves them right by Bert64 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Unfortunately, most people don't realise what DRM is or why it's bad...
      They believe the marketing hype, designed to make people think it's a good thing. The people need to be educated about the dangers of DRM, and stories like this are good examples. People won't believe you without hard evidence, they're more likely to believe mass market propaganda.

      --
      http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
    2. Re:Serves them right by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 1

      Serves them right. If you support DRM by buying this shit I don't feel sorry for you when it no longer works.
      You got what you paid for and everybody told you so beforehand. But what if you bought it knowing that someday it will no longer work so that you'll have standing to sue and drive a nail into the concept of DRM industry-width through the legal system?

      The idea is to play them at their own game, and win.
      --
      Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
    3. Re:Serves them right by rmerry72 · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately, most people don't realise what DRM is or why it's bad... They believe the marketing hype, designed to make people think it's a good thing. The people need to be educated about the dangers of DRM, and stories like this are good examples. People won't believe you without hard evidence, they're more likely to believe mass market propaganda.

      People don't want education about DRM. They want to believe the marketing hype. They are not buying a product, they are buying the dream.

      Its like eating MacDonalds or other take-out. Everyone knows its not quality food, nor that cheap, nor hygienic even. They know that better quality food is out there. They couldn't be bothered and don't care. They just want to believe take-out is good - or good enough - and that's it. If they get caught out, or feel a little sick or a little overweight its "Oh well, better luck next time" or "So what, its my money" or "Its not my fault, I didn't know".

      Mindless cattle who want to be led around by the nose by marketing types.

      --
      We do not inherit the Earth from our parents. We borrow it from our children.
  24. MLB Strikes Out Fans Who Bought DRM Videos by Shadow+Wrought · · Score: 4, Funny

    Fixed the headline for you.

    --
    If brevity is the soul of wit, then how does one explain Twitter?
  25. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by wattrlz · · Score: 1

    More of a hypothesis, really. How many people who knew about such a thing would pay money to download a baseball game?

  26. Goatse DRM by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm working on a way to allow Goatse to be downloaded and only viewed for 2 hours, after which it will close up and you won't be able to see it any more.

    I'll keep you all posted.

  27. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's easy. That's a fact.

  28. People just don't get it, companies that use DRM.. by Snotman · · Score: 1

    do not give a hoot about their customers. If they did, they would understand what DRM means and would protect a consumers property so that it is useful in the future. Companies do not care and people should give them the finger for not caring about those that would patronize their services.

  29. Nonono. by Chas · · Score: 1

    It's "Well...we've got our money...*CLICK*"

    --


    Chas - The one, the only.
    THANK GOD!!!
  30. Sounds like a class-action lawsuit... by John+Hasler · · Score: 1

    ...to me.

    --
    Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
  31. Digital Restictions Management ala Star Wars by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "The more you tighten your grip, [insert media company], the more [customers] will slip through your fingers."

  32. I can't wait for this to go to court by Pluvius · · Score: 1

    After the judge sides with the plaintiff, he'll take a printout of the sentence "any rebroadcast, reproduction, or other use of the pictures and accounts of this game without the express written consent of Major League Baseball is prohibited" and shove it up Bud Selig's ass.

    At least, that's what'll happen in my dreams.

    Rob

    1. Re:I can't wait for this to go to court by Technician · · Score: 2, Interesting

      After the judge sides with the plaintiff, he'll take a printout of the sentence "any rebroadcast, reproduction, or other use of the pictures and accounts of this game without the express written consent of Major League Baseball is prohibited" and shove it up Bud Selig's ass.

      It will happen when the plaintiff is shown the credit card bill where the defendant explicitly sold the right for reproduction (Playback at a later time) to the plaintiff. The right was revoked without due cause or compensation. The judge can rightly view this as theft of privilages purchased by the plaintiff.

      Make no mistake, it will happen and not just in your dreams.

      --
      The truth shall set you free!
  33. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by Alzheimers · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Apparently, according to this study, not as much as if it were just ONE child:

    In another study, Paul Slovic, a psychology professor at the University of Oregon, found that people were more sympathetic to a single starving child than they were to two children facing the same plight.

    "We cannot wrap our minds around two people as well as around one," said Mr. Slovic.

  34. MOD PARENT UP by MixMasterMizzike · · Score: 1

    WTF Why the hell is this a troll?

  35. Google Video killed purchased files too. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative
    Coincides with what happened at Google when they killed off Google Video and all the files purchased there died. Excellent article on that mirrors what MLB just did - lose customer trust - and how it in the long run will destroy their chances of selling videos in the future.

    Google Throws Lead Paint on Movie Download Market http://www.mp3newswire.net/stories/7002/google-video.html

    1. Re:Google Video killed purchased files too. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As far as I remember Google gave those users a full refund. In addition to that they got the same amount of money to spend on checkout. And they could still watch the videos for several months after the announcement. Not that I ever bought any of those videos myself, the first time I read about Google selling videos was when slashdot wrote that it was shutting down.

  36. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by Opportunist · · Score: 2, Funny

    He said "fact", can't you read? This is the internet, when someone says "fact" it has to be.

    For reference, see "obviously".

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  37. THINK OF THE CHILDREN by hurfy · · Score: 1

    Seriously....

    There must be a mom of one of the players that has lost precious video of her son. Get her out to front the issue for the masses ;)

    I hate this kind of trick nowdays. I have a scanner driver that won't work and needs an update that requires being registered...registration page no longer exists :(

  38. 3D Baseball Cards by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 1

    When this stunt works for MLB, resulting in people buying their <2006 videos again in the "new format", they'll finally roll out those 3D baseball cards. Sure, they need special glasses to view, but that keeps people who didn't pay for them from pirating them. Betcha can't wait for 2009, when they upgrade those goggles to the incompatible "widescreen" version!

    --

    --
    make install -not war

  39. No sympathy. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You buy the DRM, you are bending over, giving them money, and asking for this.

  40. this is not fascism by cliffski · · Score: 4, Insightful

    and the idiot who tagged it as such needs to read some history. This is BAD DRM, and sucks, and the people responsible are idiots and should be sued. but to equate not being able to watch sports videos with fascism is just immature bullshit that makes you look foolish. Don't cry wolf.

    --
    DRM-free indie games for the PC and Mac: Positech Games
    1. Re:this is not fascism by AK+Marc · · Score: 0, Troll

      This is BAD DRM, and sucks, and the people responsible are idiots and should be sued. but to equate not being able to watch sports videos with fascism is just immature bullshit that makes you look foolish.

      With equating corporations with the governemnt (not a big stretch to some that believe all polititians are already bought), this is exactly fascism. The government is telling you what you can do, when, and how. Yes, this isn't as bad as the cases that lead to the definition of fascism, but it is fascism none the less.

    2. Re:this is not fascism by hmccabe · · Score: 1

      The MLB could never get the trains to run on time.

  41. Took them long enough by Fujisawa+Sensei · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If you downloaded videos of baseball games from MLB.com before 2006, apparently they no longer work and you are out of luck. MLB.com, sometime during 2006, changed their DRM system. Result: game videos purchased before that time will now no longer work

    The change was made sometime during 2006, and its now October 2007, and people are only noticing this!?

    --
    If someone is passing you on the right, you are an asshole for driving in the wrong lane.
    1. Re:Took them long enough by ahecht · · Score: 4, Informative

      The switched to the new system in 2006, but the old system kept working until April. In April, MLB said they would have a fix available shortly. Now they have changed to saying that they will not fix it.

    2. Re:Took them long enough by ucblockhead · · Score: 1

      They stopped selling videos with the DRM server before 2006. They just shut down the DRM server that allowed those files to be viewed. They need to be sued for this.

      --
      The cake is a pie
    3. Re:Took them long enough by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 1

      Okay this *is* baseball fans we're talking about here, people excited enough about it to watch ancient games on their little home computer. Not the folks who go to games and watch it on TV to be part of the in crowd, sort of social event; we're talking about the people who actually get intellectual stimulation from watching *baseball* games.

      Starting to make sense now?

    4. Re:Took them long enough by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Baseball never made sense without the beer.

  42. People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by Alzheimers · · Score: 5, Insightful

    DRM - Digital Rights Management.

    It's about THEIR rights, not yours.

    1. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by TheVelvetFlamebait · · Score: 1

      I don't get why people are bothering to change it to "Digital Restrictions Management". I always thought that "Digital Rights Management" sounded appropriately sinister. I mean, who really wants their rights "managed" by a company that doesn't trust you?

      --
      You know, there is a difference between trolling and pointing out the flaws in your reasoning. Just saying.
    2. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by norite · · Score: 1

      The truth is, DRM actually stands for Digitally Restricted Media

      --
      -- Fuck Beta
    3. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 1

      Mall security guards: they're about the MERCHANTS' property rights, not yours.

    4. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by noidentity · · Score: 1

      Digital Restrictions Management is what it really means.

    5. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by arkhan_jg · · Score: 1

      Yes, but I don't get the mall security guards coming home with me after I've made my purchases, standing in my house, and telling me how I'm allowed to use the things I've bought; then after two years preventing me from using them at all because their office got closed by the mall and they can't radio in to ask for permission any more.

      --
      Remember kids, it's all fun and games until someone commits wholesale galactic genocide.
    6. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 1

      Mall security guards stop you from taking property you didn't buy.

      DRM stops you from taking property (distribution rights) you didn't buy.

      Mall security guards have false positives (stop you when you've done nothing wrong).

      DRM has false positives.

      You accept the validity of using mall guards to protect mall property.

      You don't accept the validity of using DRM to protect intellectual property.

      You're not very good with analogies, are you?

    7. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by arkhan_jg · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Intellectual property is a fiction. It's an attempt to conflate non-physical legal protections with property to make them sound better. You have patents, copyright and trade marks. None of them are property, or have the properties of property. With physical property it is clear who has it, and who owns it, as there's only one physical thing. With patents, copyrights and trademarks, very different rules apply to different uses. Intellectual property conflates many different laws into one handy label, when they shouldn't be. It's sloppy thinking.

      DRM is a technical measure over-enforcing copyright. It prevents the exercise of fair use. The DRM on the MLB videos is preventing people watching their purchased copies, and the seller has no intention of fixing it. DRM has nothing to do with protecting patents or trade marks, just copyright. Distribution rights are not property.

      But since we're playing this bad analogy between physical property and copyright protection, I again point out that after I buy something from a store, and take it home, it's mine to do with as I please. It's my property. If I break criminal law with it, I get investigated and prosecuted by the police. If I break a civil law with it, I get sued by the other party. At no point after I've left the mall do the guards get involved with this.

      With DRM, I buy a copy of copyrighted material infected with DRM. The DRM decides what I get to do with my property, regardless of its legality. It decides what computer I play it on. It decides where I can play it. It decides whether I'm allowed to use extracts for parody or news commentary. It's unthinking rules standing over my shoulder, saying yes or no to what I can do with my purchased property, despite all of them being legal.

      DRM is poisonous to fair use and normal use, and removing it or telling others how to remove it is prohibited by law. That is wrong. If mall guards did what DRM does, I'd refuse to shop at that mall too. Bet those people who bought the MLB videos wish they hadn't bought them now.

      --
      Remember kids, it's all fun and games until someone commits wholesale galactic genocide.
    8. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's about THEIR rights, not yours.

      You mean, this should be in "Their rights online" not "Your rights online"?
    9. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Oh geez, not this again...

      Intellectual property is a fiction. It's an attempt to conflate non-physical legal protections with property to make them sound better. You have patents, copyright and trade marks. ... Intellectual property conflates many different laws into one handy label, when they shouldn't be. It's sloppy thinking.

      IP is only a fiction in the sense that *physical* property rights are a fiction. Property rights delineate the boundaries of acceptable behavior regarding identifiable things, and so does IP. Remember: physical property rights don't automatically spring from nature; they are things we assign to people regarding physical objects. When you say "I own this item that I can touch and feel and all that crap", what you really own is a bundle of rights that use that item as a referent, and those rights are precisely as intangible as IP.

      They are both called "property" in common parlance because each and every honest, intelligent person who approaches the issue sees striking similarities. Namely, behavior restrictions start applying at the moment of discovery, and then can be transferred to others. The reason trademarks, patents, copyrights, likeness rights, etc. are combined into one handy label is because that is how nomenclature works. When someone wants to refer to all members of a set without having to enumerate them, we create terms to avoid excessive verbiage for unnecessary clarity. In the exact same sense, we have no probleem using terms like "significant other" to refer to: {husband, wife, fiancee, fiance, boyfriend, girlfriend} even though there are very different implications to each of these relationships.

      DRM is a technical measure over-enforcing copyright. It prevents the exercise of fair use. The DRM on the MLB videos is preventing people watching their purchased copies

      I agree that the DRM here violated the purchase agreement. And I agree that they should be made whole with a full refund + damages or restored access. But it is no different from any other time someone fails to uphold their end of a contract or falsely recognizes a property right as not belonging to you. It says nothing about DRM as such; that was simply the means to act on a false positive this time.

      But since we're playing this bad analogy between physical property and copyright protection, I again point out that after I buy something from a store, and take it home, it's mine to do with as I please. ... If I break a civil law with it, I get sued by the other party. At no point after I've left the mall do the guards get involved with this.

      Newsflash: ALL analogies are bad when you don't see the correspondence. The fact that guards don't follow you home is irrelevant to the point I was making. The point was that the provider had a false positive and denied someone access to something to which they had a right. This happens at malls just as online. The fact that someone had a false positive and denied you access says nothing about whether the means they used are inherently unjust. That was the point.

      DRM is poisonous to fair use and normal use, and removing it or telling others how to remove it is prohibited by law. That is wrong. If mall guards did what DRM does, I'd refuse to shop at that mall too.

      REALLY? If mall guards ever stopped you at any time that you hadn't done anything wrong, you would never shop their again? And I supposed you'd do the same if that happened to someone else. So, to summarize, if mall security ever inconveniences someone who hadn't done anything wrong, you would never shop at that mall. Therefore, you don't go to any malls.

      But why stop there? Police pull people over when they haven't done anything wrong. Hell, people are detained and stand trial, when they later turn out to be innocent. I guess to be really consistent, you have to flee those countries.

      Of course, you're not. That wasn't the point. Your poin

    10. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by arkhan_jg · · Score: 1

      The laws for patents, copyright and trademarks are all very, very different. They are also very different from physical property laws. lumping them all together is blantantly misleading. Repeat it as often as you want that it's all sort of the same thing, it's just not. Try *reading* those laws sometime. You might as well call rapists murderers because they're both crimes of violence.

      he fact that someone had a false positive and denied you access says nothing about whether the means they used are inherently unjust. That was the point.

      The DRM problem people are experiencing is not a 'false positive'. It's working exactly as it's designed to do, deny people access to their own data.


      But why stop there? Police pull people over when they haven't done anything wrong. Hell, people are detained and stand trial, when they later turn out to be innocent. I guess to be really consistent, you have to flee those countries.


      If I lived in a police state, where I was randomly stopped and imprisoned for life for no reason, with no right of appeal and no humans involved in the process, yes I would indeed flee that country. fortunately, I don't live in the US!

      Of course, you're not. That wasn't the point. Your point was that you were trying to use an instance of misuse of DRM to generate the phony indignation to make a case against all of it. Bet you wish you knew what argument you were responding to.

      You're being deliberately dense, and you've resulted to insulting me to try and make your case. I'm done with you and your trolling.

      --
      Remember kids, it's all fun and games until someone commits wholesale galactic genocide.
    11. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by Steve+B · · Score: 1

      physical property rights don't automatically spring from nature

      Hmmmm... who's more credible on political theory -- John Locke or UbuntuDupe? Decisions, decisions....

      --
      /. If the government wants us to respect the law, it should set a better example.
    12. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 1

      The laws for patents, copyright and trademarks are all very, very different.

      Yes, and the laws and social conventions for wives, girlfriends, and fiancees are all very, very different. Still doesn't justify your claim about the evilness of a catch-all term.

      The DRM problem people are experiencing is not a 'false positive'. It's working exactly as it's designed to do, deny people access to their own data.

      No. What it is intended to do is restrict certain uses. It most certainly was not intended to deny access after a year or so, like it did.

      If I lived in a police state, where I was randomly stopped and imprisoned for life for no reason, with no right of appeal and no humans involved in the process, yes I would indeed flee that country. fortunately, I don't live in the US!

      That wasn't the question. The question was, would you flee any shop or country that at any time denied anyone access to anything to which they -- once all facts were known -- had a right? (a false positive) This is what happens whenever an enforcement system isn't 100% accurate at instantly knowing who has violated whose rights.

      Which is what happened here: the DRM was not intended to have this access cutoff date. Certainly, the company that denied access -- in contravention of the purchase agreement -- should make the victims whole, but that says nothing about DRM.

      (Btw, there are humans involved in this process.)

      You're being deliberately dense, and you've resulted to insulting me to try and make your case.

      I didn't insult you; the feeling you have right now is what it feels like to be proven wrong on an issue you're emotional about.

      I'm done with you and your trolling.

      If what I posted was trolling, I don't want to be insightful.

    13. Re:People keep forgetting what DRM stands for by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty sure John Locke never claimed there were rights in objects before people existed.

  43. Not the first time, not the last, but a good start by Opportunist · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This happened before. And it will happen as long as people buy cripplified content. ANY content that requires you to contact its maker before it plays has the chance to follow this road. No contact, no content.

    This will happen again, I'm sure. Whenever some media company goes out of biz, whenever some media company decides that they can make more money by disabling everything they already sold, this will strike again. And more people will get pissed.

    Unfortunately at the company that did it, not DRM itself. But given time, people will learn. People are used to "buying" content. They're used to buying a DVD and being able to play it 'til the earth stops turning. Changing this model will not go without resistance. It will take a while for the masses to notice that seemingly minor difference, but they will.

    Unfortunately that takes time. Whether it takes too long we'll see. It will sooner or later fall back on them, though. People will stop buying content, fearing that it will some day stop to "work".

    So what I started to do was to do some spinning myself. Whenever some friend of mine tries to buy something DRMified, I remind him of the time when whatever DRM crippled content backfired on him. Yes, it's another company, but it also got DRM, it just MIGHT do the same, ya know... Yes, it's a lie. Still, for some odd reason my conscience gives me an A-OK for it.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  44. But, isn't that the real purpose of DRM? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    To make you pay over and over again for the same content? Do you really think that when you lose your MP3 player with the songs locked to the hardware, that you WON'T have to buy those songs all over again? Do you really think that when you buy a new PC, you'll be able to use the licensed software that ran on the old PC? Face it, if it's got DRM, you didn't buy it -- you're just renting it!

    1. Re:But, isn't that the real purpose of DRM? by mianne · · Score: 1

      I'm purely playing devil's advocate here. (and yes, it's appropos as evil as I consider DRM to be) But DRM can be viewed as a way to re-introduce obsolesence into digital media that could otherwise persist indefinitely.

      So while you probably didn't bother to re-purchase your LP's of the 1910 Fruitgum Co., your 8-tracks of KC & the Sunshine Band, or your cassettes of Michael Jackson; you may have repurchased Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon in all those different formats, and yet again on CD. However, now that you've presumably either ripped the CD or even purchased/pirated mp3's of the album, you will probably have no need to ever purchase the album again for as long as you live, even if you still chose to listen to it frequently.

      Those albums that you no longer cared to own, if not promptly garage saled eventually were removed from your collection within 5-10 years generally by obsolesence. So it could be concluded that 5-10 years is (or was) the expected shelf life of any particular item in your audio library. Therefore, in order to sustain revenue, obsolesence must be maintained via DRM or similar technology. You may not want to repurchase/listen to your Britney Spears album 5 years from now, but if Green Day's American Idiot still belongs in your collection, then you'll need to pony up again at that time.

      Anyway, now that I've built a straw man on behalf of the MAFIAA, let me tear it down:

      Firstly, the purchasers of the MLB content did not get anywhere near a 5-10 year lifespan on their purchases. Some may not have received a full year's worth. Same could be said for "purchasers" of Microsoft's "Plays For Sure" encoded files and the Microsoft Zune.

      Secondly, there are no absolutes on obsolesence. I know people who still have 78's. Granted, I know of no one who personally owns a vintage phonograph, and the 78's still in existance (mandatorily via very careful preservation) are still generally in very poor condition and barely playable, but it is still the consumer's choice. Especially given that many of the recordings on those cylinders are no longer available for purchase in any format.

      Lastly, it should be made absolutely clear up front if obsolesence via DRM is to be employed, not buried deep in an EULA with language such as "we assume no liability for losses due to technological improvements, internet inaccessibility, ...." and must be uniform for all purchasers. As in "The track you are about to purchase will cease to operate no sooner than [x years from today's date]. You will be required to re-obtain a license after that date if you wish to continue using it." Otherwise, a refund is owed to the consumer.

      Yes a class action is defintely warranted in this case, but while I haven't checked, odds are, purchasers also unwittingly agreed to binding arbitration, so forget about forming a class.

      --
      Javascript, cookies, flash, and ActiveX must be enabled in order to view this sig.
  45. Easy for society to fix this by Sloppy · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Don't give copyright protection to publications that use copy protection. DRM -> PD. Let publishers (and their markets) decide which mutually-exclusive way to go.

    --
    As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
    1. Re:Easy for society to fix this by david.emery · · Score: 1

      Mod parent up. I thought I had some moderator points myself, but they've apparently expired. That's a very interesting idea.

              dave

    2. Re:Easy for society to fix this by gujo-odori · · Score: 1

      I like it too, wish I had mod points. "Copyright protection or DRM. Pick one." Now *that* would be a copyright act I could live with!

    3. Re:Easy for society to fix this by Ox0065 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      YES!!!

      Copyright is given as a gift in exchange for your contribution to the world's body of literature. If its not available to society when the payback is supposed to occur, why should society give them any gift of protection. If you DRM it, you're free game. Sounds fair to me.

      --
      thx e
  46. Call 866-800-1275 and be a PITA by whackco · · Score: 4, Informative

    Call 866-800-1275 just to be a pain in the ass. I don't even watch baseball, but I called it to protest their treatment of customers. The guy was nice to me, and admitted they have a big problem, they will try to fix.

  47. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by superbus1929 · · Score: 1

    If that's so, I'm one of those 20. Granted, it was only two games (total cost: just under $8 USD), but it shows the system is fucked beyond reproach.

    --
    Let's stop dilly-dallying and just change "-1: Overrated" to "-1: Disagree" or "-1: Doesn't Subscribe to Groupthink".
  48. The REAL Question is... by DarthTeufel · · Score: 1

    Who actually can spend the time watching a baseball game that is over 2 season old? Thats freaking dedication right there. Its one thing to watch a baseball game when you don't know whats going to happen next, but to watch one where you know the outcome... 2 years after the fact just blows my mind

    1. Re:The REAL Question is... by Guppy06 · · Score: 1

      "Its one thing to watch a baseball game when you don't know whats going to happen next, but to watch one where you know the outcome... 2 years after the fact just blows my mind"

      You know... Ensign Redshirt's going to bite it, Scotty will violate the laws of physics even after exclaiming that he can't, Bones will once again impatiently explain that he's a doctor rather than some other profession, Spock will play the comic straight man, and Kirk is gonna put it in the alien chick.

      Why do you watch shows that are decades old, especially when you already know what's going to happen?

    2. Re:The REAL Question is... by eMartin · · Score: 1

      I have no interest in Baseball, so maybe I'm wrong here, but many of my friends talk about games that happened long ago. More specifically, things that happened in those games. I can see how being able to watch specific moments might appeal to them even if they would never go back and watch the whole game.

    3. Re:The REAL Question is... by Steve+B · · Score: 1
      Who actually can spend the time watching a baseball game that is over 2 season old? Thats freaking dedication right there. Its one thing to watch a baseball game when you don't know whats going to happen next, but to watch one where you know the outcome... 2 years after the fact just blows my mind


      The boat sinks.

      Rosebud was his sled.

      Hamlet and Claudius both die.


      No point watching any of those again, either.

      --
      /. If the government wants us to respect the law, it should set a better example.
  49. DRM by Slashdot+Parent · · Score: 1

    I always thought DRM meant Digital Restrictions Management.

    --
    They don't grade fathers, but if your daughter's a stripper, you fucked up. --Chris Rock
    1. Re:DRM by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 1

      That's because you read too many posts on Slashdot by people who think it's more convincing to play silly word games than to make a real argument.

      There are plenty of legitimate reasons to attack abusive DRM schemes like this, and plenty of cogent arguments you can make to do so. We don't need the cheap parlour tricks.

      --
      If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  50. Re: Baseball Videos by TaoPhoenix · · Score: 1

    You mean they don't speed the video up 170% first?
    Oh right, that's only on YouTube.

    This is why I run the page in the background and refresh every half hour.
    "Look. An inning went by."

    The Captcha is "bloody". Go Schilling!

    --
    My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
  51. MLB and Silverlight by hansamurai · · Score: 1

    MLB.com has made a lot of mistakes lately, the most recent being their commitment to Silverlight, Microsoft's "Flash-killer". It's really quite annoying and I refuse to download their plugin (is there even a plugin for Firefox?).

    I love baseball, but MLB can be so draconian about things. They have a subscription service that I would totally sign up for if everything MLB.com touched didn't eventually rot.

    1. Re:MLB and Silverlight by geekoid · · Score: 1

      They have always been draconian bastards, and have pushed people around weather people were in the right or not.
      Now they are doing it in an environment where many people can find out about there crap almost immediately.

      I hope he sues the bastards.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    2. Re:MLB and Silverlight by Esteanil · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yes, there's a plugin for Firefox.
      There's also Moonlight, the Open Source Silverlight implementation working with M$ support.
      No, I don't like Microsoft either, but after working a little with Flash, and seeing their license fees for doing anything interesting with it, I heartily welcome the competition. (Something like 98% of Web users have Flash installed... According to Adobe).

      --
      I'm a dreamer, the world is my playpen. But hey, I'm a serious person, I can't dream all the time.
  52. Sue the Bastards by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 1

    Sue the bastards for stealing back what they're already sold you. Do it as a Class. I expect they'll cave very quickly if they encounter some consumer push-back.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
  53. Easy - File Wire Fraud Complaint by FellowConspirator · · Score: 1

    If it works as they said, anyone affected can request their money back and, if denied, file a wire fraud complaint.

  54. Re:Credit Card refund? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Why hasn't he contacted his credit card company? He paid with a credit card, right? File a complaint with them.

  55. MLB is on the hook for user stupidity? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

    if someone sold you a book, and told you you'd always be able to read it, and then two years later you couldn't -- well, to it bluntly, that's fucked

    If you want to make an analogy, at least make a complete one.

    "Here's your book. It's encrypted, but cheap. To read it, just come by my house, and use the decoder ring I have out front." (2 years pass.) "Oh, I remodeled my house and lost the decoder ring. Sorry."

    Now try applying common sense. If you couldn't view the content unless your computer was connected to mlb.com, and you assumed that mlb.com would stay around with the same content until the end of time, then you're a moron. Yes, they screwed you, but boy did you walk into that one.

    1. Re:MLB is on the hook for user stupidity? by xouumalperxe · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Expecting the population in general to understand the tech behind DRM is really not a fair expectation. How many non-technical people (or even technical but non-computer related) do you know that actually properly understand the concepts of domain, subdomain, top-level domain, web server, smtp/pop/imap servers and how they relate to each other? How many people do you know actually know that a "web server" isn't an alien machine but just a plain old computer, possibly assembled from more expensive parts and in a different type of case?

      Now, how much do you think the average MLB video buyer knows about DRM and how it works? How much should he have to know? How much did MLB publicize the fact that you need them to give you a permission on a view-by-view basis?

      Usually, to use a DVD without encountering DRM issues, you just need to know the region code on your player, and check the tag on the DVD against that code. The DVD's region encoding is usually quite visible near the credits on the backside of the box. Assuming you know about region codes, this is quite simple and hassle free (though you're still in for a shock if you're not aware of this, go into a different region and buy a DVD only to not be able to read it at home). When I see that the videos on MLB.com have copy protection, why can't I assume that it'll be approximately as hassle free as a DVD?

    2. Re:MLB is on the hook for user stupidity? by Thraxen · · Score: 1

      That's asinine. If the initial purchase didn't stipulate any time limit then that's exactly what the end user should get. It shouldn't matter what the hell happens to MLB.com. Sorry, but if they changed their technology and aren't willing to support the old one via their servers any more, then they need to give the "decoder ring" to the end user. At that point the onus will be on the end user to not lose the "decoder ring". If they lose it at that point then, yeah, they're screwed... but in this case it's MLB that's going to get screwed in the end. They WILL lose this battle.

  56. Re:No support? Hear from my lawyer. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    You need at least two people to initiate it.

    Actually, you need a case first. They said no refunds would be given, they didn't say the DRM website won't be resurrected. Alternatively, they could provide a new version w/ the current DRM.

  57. One down! by superbus1929 · · Score: 1

    I've actually been a paying customer of the MLB.tv system for a few years now. I've liked the service purely for the streaming games; I'm the type of fan that can have as much fun watching the Royals playing the Angels as I would watching my Mets play.

    Those days are over. I'm normally against DRM in the first place, and they almost lost me when they dropped RealPlayer support (and told Linux to fuck itself; I think that was a Microsoft forced hand). This is the final straw. It's too bad because honestly, it's a good service once you take that out.

    I'll order MLB Extra Innings instead, and if I need to record something for posterity, I'll break out an old-fashioned VHS recorder. I won't have the archives anymore, but I'll live.

    Meanwhile, I'll be looking into that NHL.com Centre Ice package online. Once they get archives, and if they eschew DRM, I'm in there.

    --
    Let's stop dilly-dallying and just change "-1: Overrated" to "-1: Disagree" or "-1: Doesn't Subscribe to Groupthink".
    1. Re:One down! by AK+Marc · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'll order MLB Extra Innings instead,

      So you take a company being noticed for screwing their customers, and you are looking for ways to give them more money. And people wonder why corporations think they can do anything they want without repercussions.

    2. Re:One down! by rhpenguin · · Score: 2, Informative

      MythTV, man.. MythTV... I have a triple tuner DVB-S setup and have recorded the NHL games of interest to me this season. I archive everything to DVD when its done recording. ... Maybe something you should look into!

    3. Re:One down! by superbus1929 · · Score: 1

      Someone please mark this man up! That's brilliant. Thanks!

      --
      Let's stop dilly-dallying and just change "-1: Overrated" to "-1: Disagree" or "-1: Doesn't Subscribe to Groupthink".
    4. Re:One down! by Zontar_Thing_From_Ve · · Score: 1

      So you take a company being noticed for screwing their customers, and you are looking for ways to give them more money. And people wonder why corporations think they can do anything they want without repercussions.

      Actually, the reason for this called "addiction". It happens a lot in the USA because we have so many sports that people feel passionately about. In other countries this usually only happens with what we call "soccer" and they call "football". Where I live, I get the new NHL Channel (NHL is National Hockey League, for people who don't know) on my cable TV. I watched it a few days ago. It's truly awful, a complete waste of time. Yet you can go to fan forums at official websites for various teams in the NHL and you will find plenty of fans gushing about how great it is and how they can't live without it and watch it every day. My best friend from college is a junkie and his drug is football. We went to a smallish university that doesn't have a football team. Yet he has adopted the college his wife went to as his team. It is about a 90 minute drive from his house to the stadium and he goes to every home game. He goes to most of the road games. He only misses 1 or 2 road games a year. Then he goes to every home game of our local NFL team and between 2 and 4 of their road games every year. Every year the prices on his tickets (college and professional) get raised. He pays it. He wears a headset to listen to the game on radio while he is in the stands watching it to be sure he doesn't miss anything. He records the NFL games he watches in person on his DVD recorder from the TV broadcast to watch them again later. While I think my friend is nuts, he's got a mild case of addiction compared to some people. I have known fans of the University of Tennessee's football program that were far worse than my friend. I had one friend who went to school there and when the university was scheduled to play a game in Japan, he was honestly looking into spending over $1000 to go there to the game. I was shocked when he didn't go. I knew another U of T fan who used to wear his jersey EVERYWHERE, even when he went to Canada, in the hopes that wherever he was, he might find another supporter of his school. I remember telling him once that over a billion Chinese people really didn't care at all about US college football so he might put that into perspective about how important US college football was in the scheme of life on earth, but he didn't like that. So don't underestimate sports addiction as a motivator for putting up with this kind of abuse.

  58. Copyright exemptions? by VGPowerlord · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Didn't one of the fair use exemptions passed down by the Registrar of Copyrights involve DRM that was no longer supported?

    Or am I totally misremembering?

    --
    GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
    1. Re:Copyright exemptions? by Dachannien · · Score: 3, Informative

      Didn't one of the fair use exemptions passed down by the Registrar of Copyrights involve DRM that was no longer supported? Unfortunately, no (at least, not in such broad terms).
  59. Already happening...they're upgradable. by Foerstner · · Score: 1

    Hmmmmm...I wonder what will happen to all those iTunes songs once Apple moves to a new DRM or non-DRM format in the future and stops supporting their old format???

    This is already happening. It's called iTunes Plus, a non-DRM AAC file at twice the bitrate of the standard iTunes offerings. The price for new songs is the same as for the DRM-d, lower-quality version. But only one of the big record companies will allow it so far.

    Upgrades to the new format are currently US$ 0.30 for previously purchased songs My guess is, when/if Steve Jobs gets his way, the old authentication mechanism will be shut down, and you'll either have to pay up, or you'll be limited to playing your old content on the computers you've previously authenticated.

    --
    The US free market: two halves of a government-granted duopoly are free to set the market price.
  60. Re:Credit Card refund? by A+nonymous+Coward · · Score: 1

    Probably has to be done within 60 days.

  61. It used to resonate by marcus · · Score: 1

    Not any more.

    Ever since they canceled the season I just don't have any interest. This from some one who was once an avid fan. My wife and I met while watching an NHL game at a bar, and we used to have season tickets.

    Now I'm 100% NFL. Glad that that boring waste of time called baseball is not cluttering up the airwaves anymore. Back to my roots you might say, speed and violence!

    --
    Good judgement comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
    - W. Wriston, former Citibank CEO
    1. Re:It used to resonate by Wolvie+MkM · · Score: 1

      Too bad, it's a wonderful sport, the lockout really killed anything good that was happening in the US. Here in Canada it really didn't matter, we're going to hand the money over in buckets for our hockey.

      We're still waiting on one of those US teams to move back to Canada ;)

      --
      I Like Pie...
  62. Small claims court. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Take MLB to small claims court. It's streamlined and can't be hijacked by lawyers the same way the normal court system is.

  63. Re:No support? Hear from my lawyer. by compro01 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    They said no refunds would be given

    and Comcast said no lawsuits. Guess what the courts said about that.

    --
    upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
  64. indeed by TamMan2000 · · Score: 1

    Baseball doesn't make you sweat unless so hot that standing makes you sweet...

    The fact that people think it is an athletic activity is part of why the US is so fat... An afternoon of playing baseball is no more athletic than an afternoon of golf.

    football, basketball, track and field, soccer... those all make you sweat

    --
    "I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...
    1. Re:indeed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Says the basement dweller. Can you even make it up
      the
      stairs anymore? Maybe if you got a job things would be
      different. I actually have a job for you. A few of the
      brothers are getting released from prison and the need a
      rape victim. They will be in your "basement" at 7:30.

    2. Re:indeed by TamMan2000 · · Score: 1

      I know I am being trolled... but...

      I ran 7 miles today, during my lunch break. In the last 5 years I have run 7 marathon or longer races, and placed in my age group in multiple smaller events...

      I can conservatively claim that the vast majority of baseball _fans_ couldn't hold a candle to me athletically... And it has little to do with genetics (I have no particular gifts when it comes to fitness, I work hard), I take care of my body, most baseball fans don't...

      --
      "I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...
  65. That's odd by raygundan · · Score: 1

    I've not had that problem in the year since I picked up the Series 3. Nonetheless, it underscores the problem with DRM-- even a well-behaved customer who is playing by the rules (connecting his DRM-protected DVR to his DRM-protected TV with an approved DRM connector) is subject to glitches in the DRM implementation. It's not helping anybody, since I'm not likely to have any illegal programs on my Tivo in the first place... but it sure bugs honest people when it breaks.

  66. How exactly by CaptainZapp · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Does that jibe with the legal requirement of any business entity to safe keep their legal documentation for a minimum period of seven years?

    Claiming that an EULA is not a legal document sounds somewhat hypocritical.

    --
    ich bin der musikant

    mit taschenrechner in der hand

    kraftwerk

    1. Re:How exactly by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 1

      I just had to comment that you are the first person I've ever seen that realizes the word is "jibe" and not "jive".

      --
      You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
  67. A fine line. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    the system is fucked beyond reproach.

    It has been said that there is a fine line between clever and stupid. I'm completely stumped as to which side this is on...

  68. Agreed, mostly... by msimm · · Score: 3, Interesting

    But your comparison is a little off. Is someone sold me a book with a fishy modem and a giant electronic lock strapped to it.

    --
    Quack, quack.
  69. Also applicable to patents. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If a product has patented devices, the entire spec has to be available. If you want to keep it secret, no patents. You can either trust in secrecy or on the legal profession, but not both.

  70. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by Technician · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If that's so, I'm one of those 20. Granted, it was only two games (total cost: just under $8 USD), but it shows the system is fucked beyond reproach.

    This is the beauty of the system and the Internet. As people find out what doesn't work, they quit buying it. From your comment "it shows the system is fucked beyond reproach." shows me you are not going to be a repeat consumer. Between online rent-a-song for the Plays for Sure music to retractable email, to Vista Activation, the fact is DRM is killing sales of content as more get the fact the system is broken.

    DRM, Activaction, and cost are the main reasons I left Vista upgrades out of my future plans. I have moved to Open Source. As such, DRM is now an incompatible format. I can't use DRM, so I don't buy it. Amazon got it. Apple is just now waking up to the fact.

    DRM protects content. DRM kills sales. Some loss due to piracy is an issue. DRM is the answer. Some loss of sales is due to DRM. When that is a bigger problem than piracy, DRM starts to go away. It happened on floppys and came back on CDs. Items with high incidence of copyright violations is the only items with DRM on CDs. Most software CD's except Games and high cost MS products and some high priced music and movies (High Def formats) are free of DRM. Most all my purchased software CDs are DRM free.

    --
    The truth shall set you free!
  71. lawyers by nurb432 · · Score: 1

    How can they lose? Even if they lose the case, they still get paid, with no refunds.

    Sort of like doctors. They "practice" on you, and if they make a mistake, you get to pay for the return trip. If i tried that as a network/pc/sql/etc guy, id be in jail.

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
  72. Not the first time by Todd+Knarr · · Score: 1

    One word: Divx. Not the codec, the video-disc format. Did anyone seriously think that it wouldn't work out that way again?

    First rule: Do not look into laser with remaining eye.

  73. BAd Example by brunes69 · · Score: 1

    When the media companies finally get their way and Joe and Jane Sixpack can no longer freely re-watch "It's a Wonderful Life" to their heart's desire every holiday season, there will be outrage

    Who needs a PVR when they already show the damn thing 24/7 on about 15 channels at once for a week straight?

  74. Comcast: No 30 second skip? by assassinator42 · · Score: 1

    Do they still have the 30 second skip button disabled? There's no button on the remote, but you could manually assign it to an unused button. Apparently my area was (one of) the first to get the button disabled. I don't have Comcast anymore, is the button still disabled?

    1. Re:Comcast: No 30 second skip? by MTocci · · Score: 1

      The 30 second skip works on my Comcast DVR in MA.

  75. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by superbus1929 · · Score: 1

    No, I won't be a returning customer. I just have to decide now if I want the MLB Extra Innings package; on the one hand, it's still giving money to MLB. On the other, there's no DRM involved. Decisions, decisions.

    I might just say "fuck it", and tell them to fuck off completely, also considering their horrible deal with DirecTV which did nothing for the consumer.

    I wouldn't even be so angry if it wasn't for their "no refunds" policy. They're brutal when it comes to supporting users; you HAVE to use Internet Explorer, and you HAVE to use WMP, or they won't even talk to you. Firefox? What's that? (Note: the preceeding was a question asked to me. Literally.)

    --
    Let's stop dilly-dallying and just change "-1: Overrated" to "-1: Disagree" or "-1: Doesn't Subscribe to Groupthink".
  76. Hmmmm by Falshrmjgr · · Score: 1

    Anyone remember MightyWords?

    --
    "I wasn't using my civil rights anyway...."
  77. MLB = Microsoft Shill by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's because MLB got paid a boatload of money by Microsoft to switch over to "Silverlight" (MS needed at least one credible partner - so they basically paid for their new site and infrastructure)

  78. I work for MLB.com... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    ...and as an employee can honestly tell you that this latest DRM snafu is just that, a snafu. When the old DDS system has been taken offline, many people within the company predicted that this would happen, but this project has slipped due to technical difficulties. I for one feel really badly about how we're basically screwing the fans out of their money. As much as this is sad, however, I'd like to ask everyone to bear with us and let us work out a solution to this issue. We're not doing this on purpose, and a solution will be found.

    I hope at least some of you would believe me, even though I have to post anonymously. I'm really just another geek working for a big corporation, trying to make ends meet.

    1. Re:I work for MLB.com... by aug24 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You say that *you* feel bad, and that a solution will be found, but I also work for big corporations and while I, the geek, may well want to spend time on doing something that is right, The Man (in the form of the bean-counters) often overrides me because it's not profit-making to do the right thing.

      Maybe a solution will be found without antipathy. Or maybe it'll take a lawsuit to make the MLB bean-counters accept that a solution will be best for the company. Either way I agree that it is going to be found, and maybe the good that comes out of this is that everyone who likes baseball will learn to think twice before buying DRMed media.

      Justin.

      --
      You're only jealous cos the little penguins are talking to me.
    2. Re:I work for MLB.com... by runderwo · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I for one feel really badly about how we're basically screwing the fans out of their money. As much as this is sad, however, I'd like to ask everyone to bear with us and let us work out a solution to this issue. We're not doing this on purpose, and a solution will be found.
      So MLB refusing refund requests is considered "not doing this on purpose" and "feeling really badly"? Please!
    3. Re:I work for MLB.com... by Al+Dimond · · Score: 1

      This isn't some kind of super hard technical problem, is it? The resource was available, now it isn't. Restore it!

      For everyone affected by this: DRM of this sort means that users have to trust providers to maintain a system as long as they want to use the content. If the users only pay once for the content, the only way that users have to put economic pressure on providers to properly maintain their DRM systems is through refund demands backed by lawsuits. Users shouldn't bear with MLB. That is absurd. If users accept a DRM solution of this nature they should demand 100% service. Maintaining old solutions for a very long time is part of deploying a DRM system. If companies aren't willing to do that they shouldn't use DRM. And if the only way consumers have to enforce that it stays up is threat of refunds and lawsuits, then they have to use those methods.

  79. Re:No support? Hear from my lawyer. by Brian+Gordon · · Score: 1

    the MLB FAQ says that a license is only obtained once and will not need to be re-obtained
    Could that be relevant?
  80. Just remove the DRM by klossner · · Score: 2, Informative

    Use FairUse4WM to remove the DRM. Problem solved.

    1. Re:Just remove the DRM by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      can you remove the DRM with tools like that when you have already lost the ability to play the file?

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
  81. A better habit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How about not agreeing to crap like this ?

  82. Say Anything.... by Bonewalker · · Score: 1

    I don't want to sell anything, buy anything, or process or DRM anything as a career. I don't want to sell anything bought or processed or DRM'd, or buy anything sold or processed or DRM'd, or process anything sold, bought, or processed or DRM'd, or repair anything sold, bought, or processed or DRM'd. You know, as a career, I don't want to do that.

  83. Well... by Laindraug · · Score: 1

    My word would be that anyone these days that keeps paying for a DRM Encoded file should be waiting for somethiing like this, there is NOT A FUCKING WEEK taht we dont ear a story like this, STOP PAYING FOR DRM FILES, simple.

  84. What does this have to do with email? by Besna · · Score: 1

    It seems that a part of you just wants to show off.

  85. Re:Not the first time, not the last, but a good st by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Your conscience gives it an A-OK because it's not a lie that DRM might cause a problem. It's within the realm of possibility any time DRM that might introduce an incompatibility or phones home is introduced in to a system. DRM always fails to accomplish the ostensible goal (stopping piracy) and works only to lock out legit customers.

    The only way to make the backlash against DRM work is to hold enough users of it accountable that they become afraid of using it. The only way to do THAT is to educate the common folk who don't realize (yet) that they're getting screwed. Keep up the good work, you're doing nothing wrong.

  86. Sweating girls for me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    yep, i know we are in minority, but guys like us are not much more into those football/baseball/basketball heroes, we prefer sweating girls over those ladyboys.

    but you guys, chose what you like most, i mean, thanks to that i am straight, i am more tolerant since i am minority...

  87. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by garbletext · · Score: 1

    This is usually true in a competitive free market environment, but MLB is a state-supported monopoly. If you're a baseball fan in the US, you don't have much choice but to deal with them, which is one of the reasons they've become so arrogant and anti-consumer. And most sports fans are willing to put up with a hell of a lot of abuse before they stop spending money on their team. This intentional DRM expiration issue was one that people have been positing for a while, and I'm hardly surprised that this horrible organization is the first one to implement it.

  88. FBI warning by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Actually, that's before the FBI warning, IIRC. What it says about licensing is that "the propriator has licensed this disk..." well, I didn't get a license agreement and my commercial relationship is with the merchant, NOT the propriator of the movie. So if I have no license to break, I just have use. If I use the disk in a public broadcast, maybe the propriator can sue the merchant because they weren't licensed to sell it to someone who would do that, but not me.

    Unfortunately, DRM bypasses that because the code decides what you do, not you.

  89. When did watching become "distribution"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    no text

  90. HAhAhHAhAHahHAahaha by drx · · Score: 1

    HAHA aHA Hahaha
    HahAhaHahahAhaha
    Hahahahaaa!!

    Bruahahaha ...

    Oh my stomach ...

    Sorry guys. But this is such a ridiculous story.

    Don't let anybody sell your memories as a service.

  91. How many cases like this will it take by RealBorg · · Score: 1

    until people learn not to buy any DRM media?

    Tom

  92. Baseball by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    'rounders' for grown men. haha

  93. Nothing will change -- they don't phone home by Dekortage · · Score: 1

    Hmmmmm...I wonder what will happen to all those iTunes songs once Apple moves to a new DRM or non-DRM format in the future and stops supporting their old format???

    Nothing will happen to them. iTunes doesn't phone home when you want to play your music. It DRM's the song specifically for your iTunes account, then sends you the song. You can listen to it whenever you want, with or without Internet access. You can even select those songs and convert them to DRM-less MP3s, or burn them to CD and reimport them in DRM-less format, and then you don't have to worry about DRM at all.

    Heck, even if your hard drive crashes and you lose all your music, you can boot up iTunes and re-authorize it to the same account. Then contact Apple, and they'll let you re-download all the music you bought on the account, at no extra charge. Officially they only let you do this once per account, but there are many reports of people doing it two or three times -- for example, their hard drive crashed but then they bought a new computer and wanted to transfer iTunes to it.

    --
    $nice = $webHosting + $domainNames + $sslCerts
  94. Maybe, but it is the road to fascism.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    see "The right to read" on the GNU site..

  95. There is no requirement to keep "legal docs" for 7 by Steve+Hamlin · · Score: 1


    What legal requirement to keep legal documentation for 7 years? Source, please?

    As far as I know, there is no overarching requirement to keep business or legal documentation for any period of time. Certain types of business records need to be kept for different periods of time, but not in general for all "legal" documentation. Tax records, financial records, employment records, health care records, business entity records - yes, all of those have retention requirements, from 1yr to permanently. Regulated industry? Even more rules.

    Currently in, or even anticipating, litigation? Extra rules on preservation of potentially discoverable material.

    But a mandatory 7 year period for "legal documentation"? Doesn't exist.

    /s/igned - a Compliance Officer for a public company in a regulated industry (but not our Records Retention lead). This is not legal advice, I'm not your lawyer, etc.

  96. When MS wants to boost Vista sales... by knorthern+knight · · Score: 1

    ...they'll simply stop re-authorizing copies of XP. WGA will occasionally demand to call home, and will shut down Windows if it can't connect, or if it connects and doesn't get permission from Steve.

    --

    I'm not repeating myself
    I'm an X window user; I'm an ex-Windows user
  97. Films on film by BenEnglishAtHome · · Score: 1

    It has only been about 10 years since the distribution of major Hollywood films on 8mm stock pretty much dried up. A little over a decade ago, the small independent video rental shop near my home still advertised and would fill orders for 8mm prints. I have a few, but then again I still have a few 8mm "loops", as they were called in the trade. There's something cool about buying a film for roughly the same price as anyone pays for other media, then having giant screen playback (as big as the side of your house, if you wanted) for just the cost of a $200 projector. To me, films need to be shown on big screens. It's just part of the package. Along with popcorn. Oh, yeah, popcorn!

    Films on film and sound recordings on reel-to-reel - two things I *really* miss.

  98. Re:No support? Hear from my lawyer. by eth1 · · Score: 1

    Screw class-action... that takes years, and you won't get anything back, anyway.

    Just call up the credit card company you used to buy it, explain that they stole it from you and that you'd like to charge it back.

    Credit card companies might be evil, but they are occasionally useful...

  99. Any chance by SnarfQuest · · Score: 1

    Any chance that they can do this to my neighbors vacation movies?

    --
    Who would win this election: Andrew Weiner vs Andrew Weiner's weiner.
  100. Or a slight less drastic version by michaelepley · · Score: 1

    Allow DRM only if a non-DRM version is made available (say, via a deposit with the Copyright office), but still allow copyright for both. Much more likely to be adopted: corporate copyright holders (think Disney) are not just going to roll over that easily.

  101. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by Technician · · Score: 1

    If you're a baseball fan in the US, you don't have much choice but to deal with them, which is one of the reasons they've become so arrogant and anti-consumer. And most sports fans are willing to put up with a hell of a lot of abuse before they stop spending money on their team.

    In the first part "If you're a baseball fan in the US, you don't have much choice but to deal with them," I disagree. If you watch baseball on TV, you are dead on. But if you take in local, not national games, there is lots of school sports that have nothing to do with the national organization. I have been to several school and church league games and enjoyed them.

    The next part is the problem.. "And most sports fans are willing to put up with a hell of a lot of abuse before they stop spending money on their team." Put down the remote and get out. I have dropped pay TV over 15 years ago. I could care less who the MLB teams are. On the flipside, I know the standing and schedule of some of my foster kids teams.

    --
    The truth shall set you free!
  102. Re:Too bad it won't affect many... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think many "experts" mis-identify this behavior..... It is a economic one..... when people see one child they can identify it as an individual problem.... when you have more than one "individual" you have a systemic problem (That you as an individual can not effectively confront).. It is the same reasons Communisms and Socialism don't work well, One the individual is no longer responsible for doing the right thing they can pawn the duty off to another or the government. The government does not have an incentive to act because it also, does not see the problems of the individual, but as a member of a larger block of what it sees as its dependents or clients. Government and its employees have vested interests in not decreasing their client base by solving their problems and obsolescing their function. Thus, no one with a problem is seen as a person in distress, but as a group and charity that results from compassion for the individual is lost.

  103. Calling DVDJon by iminplaya · · Score: 1

    please pick up the white courtesy phone...

    No, I said the white phone.

    --
    What?
  104. youngster.... by david+in+brasil · · Score: 1

    Us old guys can easily beat you on that one... let's see. How 'bout Chicago V? Since 1973, I've bought 2 albums, an 8-track, a cassette and a CD. Maybe 2 CDs; I'm so damn old I can't remember anymore... BTW, "Dialogue" on that album is an antiwar, anti-apathy song that couldn't fit any more with today's mood than if it were written yesterday.

  105. DRM has got to go! by Techogeek · · Score: 1

    Title says it all...

  106. Re:There is no requirement to keep "legal docs" fo by CaptainZapp · · Score: 1

    Source, please?

    Source?

    Well, I read it on Slashdot.

    --
    ich bin der musikant

    mit taschenrechner in der hand

    kraftwerk

  107. Re:Well... by anubi · · Score: 1
    I remember the frustration I got when I bought the CDROM version of IC Master catalog. That was ten years ago.

    I was expecting a nicely done HTML version. I figured it was a helluva lot easier to click on hypertext links than to reference page after page. Besides I could easily print off interesting pages for my project binder instead of getting up and running to the copier.

    What I got was some weird DRM scheme which worked a couple of times, then when I used another machine, it never worked again.

    So much for giving me stuff electronically. I wish I could subscribe to technical magazines electronically, but the lure of DRM to business types renders their product unusable. Its much like going to some restaurant, only having the Maitre'D lording over me to see I dine in strict accordance to their rules.

    And the suprising thing is - it was a damm catalog! A sales tool! Why would any businessman in his right mind encrypt a friggen catalog? It seems as stupid to me as mass mailing expired coupons - all of the expense of printing and distribution, with none of the benefits of the sale.

    I ended up throwing that sorry disc away. Never bought another. Neither will I install any software that some ad-head comes up with which is prerequisite to viewing a vendor catalog.

    If its beyond their capability to make a simple HTML catalog, viewable on ANY browser, then its useless - and I won't have anything to do with it. Anyone passing a community college HTML course should be able to lay out such a disc.

    I continue using the paper version, because I know it will sit on the shelf - for years if need be - then work when I need it. I can't even begin to come close to this compatibility with electronic media. There are businessmen executive types out there who don't really care if they create junk, and there are developers out there who are really good and finding out who these executives are. That's why we have such a mess out there. All sorts of incompatible crap, viruses, and stuff that flat doesn't work. There is always someone who will pay to have it made.

    --
    "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]

  108. FYI, E-mail from MLB by chrisaj5 · · Score: 1

    I received the following e-mail from MLB.com today (I purchased a game in 2006, which still works!):

    MLB.com Fri, Nov 9, 2007 at 7:36 AM
    To: me@gmail.com

    Dear Valued Customer,

    It has come to our attention that a small subset of our MLB.com Digital Download customers are unable to access and watch certain games that they purchased prior to 2007. MLB.com is committed to ensuring that all non-functioning MLB.com Digital Downloads that were previously purchased are again made available at no additional cost to our customers.

    If you are unable to view any MLB.com Digital Download game that you purchased prior to 2007, please contact MLB.com Customer Service by either (1) sending an e-mail to customerservice@website.mlb.com listing the games that are no longer accessible, or (2) by calling 1-866-800-1275 to speak to a representative.

    We will then send you an e-mail containing information on how to re-download and access these games. Please note that all Regular Season games will be available, in the originally purchased format, and all Postseason games will be made available, in the same format currently used on mlb.com/downloads.

    We regret any inconvenience, and value your continued support.

    Sincerely,
    MLB.com

  109. MLB made good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Does anyone know or care that MLB came clean and has made all old videos purchased under their DRM valid? Much ado about nothing. My 2004 ALCS videos worked without any problem. Of course, this is 2-day old news and no one cares anymore -- MLB and DRM are just evil. Point made, case closed. But it's not as simple as that.

    What would it take to make this front-page Slashdot material again, with a complete retraction?

    Email from mlb.com:

    Dear Valued Customer,

    It has come to our attention that a small subset of our MLB.com Digital Download customers are unable to access and watch certain games that they purchased prior to 2007. MLB.com is committed to ensuring that all non-functioning MLB.com Digital Downloads that were previously purchased are again made available at no additional cost to our customers.

    If you are unable to view any MLB.com Digital Download game that you purchased prior to 2007, please contact MLB.com Customer Service by either (1) sending an e-mail to customerservice@website.mlb.com listing the games that are no longer accessible, or (2) by calling 1-866-800-1275 to speak to a representative.

    We will then send you an e-mail containing information on how to re-download and access these games. Please note that all Regular Season games will be available, in the originally purchased format, and all Postseason games will be made available, in the same format currently used on mlb.com/downloads.

    We regret any inconvenience, and value your continued support.

    Sincerely,
    MLB.com