Slashdot Mirror
Green Light for Human/Animal Hybrids
Henneshoe writes "BBC News is reporting that two research facilities have been given the green light to create part human, part animal embryos. According the the report, 'Scientists want to create hybrid embryos by merging human cells with animal eggs in a bid to extract stem cells. The embryos would then be destroyed within 14 days.' The decision to allow the embryos was made after research showed that people in large are OK with the idea."
"Your Honour, I was just working on creating a Human/Sheep hybrid."
Trolling is a art,
God, schomd, I want my monkey-man!
--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
Can I get horns with that ?
Its not the years, its the mileage
Dibs on platypus!
Do they speak English in Iarge?
"It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education." -Albert Einstein
I am glad that we are trusting the unwashed masses to make important technical decisions that they know nothing about. If Britney says it's safe, then it must be. God bless Democracy.
I, for one, welcome our species hopping virus overlords.
Dr. Moreau unavailable for comment.
Gives new meaning to saying that your girlfriend is a fox!
Presumably none of these so-called "people at-large" have ever seen the movie "The Fly".
Rule #1 -- Politics always trumps technology.
DAMMIT i don't want my first life to be second life :(
Since when should the perception of the public decide what research is done and which is not? I can at least understand why a panel such as the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Authority would want to have their opinion heard, but why would they waste their time consulting the public?
Why even create such a government body if they were just going to conduct opinion polls to make their decisions? If you are going to assemble a panel of scientists and ethicists to regulate the scientific community (well at least in the UK), at least you would hope they would use their expertise instead of referring to the public.
-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
I think I dated one of these...
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full frontal lobotomy.
Furries across the world rejoiced in their parents' basements.
Approved over 4 years after Chinese scientists apparently already began experimenting with the same.
Oh, and the obligatory "I for one welcome our new <insert your own human/animal hybrid here> overlords."
Saying Android is a family of phones is akin to saying Linux is a family of PCs.
That's the most deprived form of alchemy their is...
Ask not what you can do for your country. Ask what your country did to you
Yes. In a wood chipper.
The embryos would then be destroyed within 14 days.
So, anyone else consider that the single most dissapointing part of this?
They'd almost certainly not live long enough to ever call them infants, but even in the steps they do last through, we could learn so much by watching how they develop differently from either human or other-half embryos.
And if they actually lived to term, well, I would consider their cognitive develpment nothing short of fascinating to observe.
No wait, a human-roach hybrid, now that could like become the actual true master race...
Yeah. Sign me up for the human-compatible (hung like a...) appendage transplant.
I know a lot of people are against cloning human embryos extracting the stem cells and then aborting them. So how on earth could splicing humans cells with animals, harvesting it, and then aborting it possibly be construed as better? Personally I don't care either way, but I can't see how you could be happier with cross species embryos than with good old cloning from a moral standpoint
Man, this sounds very fun. I have no clue what they'd create in beyond the 14 days (very unlikely to survive anyway) - the idea that there will be a generation of scientists experienced with work like this is exciting!
In some years from now, some regime will pay for the experiments to continue the 14 growth into longer periods, perhaps drilling a way towards useful organs. I seriously doubt a full creature could ever result - really. But I'd certainly like to be able to graft on a tail that wasn't rejected because it used my cells as a root.
The embryos would then be destroyed within 14 days.
I have a hunch that some lab tech would end up with a private Island of Doctor Moreau in their garage, via a few test tubes that were somehow misplaced at the lab.
Dan East
Better known as 318230.
This is animal cruelty, plain and simple.
Because 14-day-old embryos have such well-developed nervous systems that they can appreciate (nevermind even "experience") pain?
Do you know how many embryos are going to be destroyed
No. Do you?
More importantly - So what? At that stage of life, you have organic scum in a tube. What it could someday turn into has no relevance to its status at that developmental level.
There are better ways to get stem cells people.
Yes - Yes, we do indeed have better ways. But the goddamned fundies don't seem inclined to let us use the numerous extra embryos from human fertility therapies (nevermind abortions), so we need to find new, even more absurd, ways to get them.
You know weirdly, I'd have been o.k. with it, but now reading the slashdot headline, I'm against it for some weird reason. Why is this?
I'm o.k. with having pigs and other animals genetically engineered to grow ideal human organs for transplant into humans. I could care less about the animal. I'm also o.k. with vat like bacteria/yeast making various human hormones and other things. I don't care about animals of other species being mass slaughtered for our benefit. I eat at McDonald's every day so I enjoy the fruits of mass slaughtering cattle. It's got to be that it's in a slashdot headline that makes something about this inherently wrong.
This headline feels "wrong" for some reason.
I want to adopt one.
...I guess that makes Mansquito a documentary, then?
In Soviet Russia, Chuck Norris will still kick your ass.
...co-exist peacefully..within the same egg.
So, my question is, is this truly a case of hybridization (ie a cross of human and animal genetic material with attributes of both), or is this inserting human DNA into an animal egg to grow human stem cells? TFA is pretty lacking in any kind of detail.
This is nothing that hasn't been done before. The Denver Broncos' head coach is a living example of this.
Mike Shanahan: http://www.chieftain.com/archive/2003/dec/5/sptPBS105BRONCOSBENGALS.jpg
Animal Embryo source: http://www.noblepest.com/images/brown-rat.jpg
You know, since human beings are all biologically classified as animals and the word hybrid has a fuzzy definition to say the least, I would think that everyone would already have the "green light go-ahead" to go and reproduce the old fashioned way. Of course, I could be wrong.
If you can read this, I forgot to post anonymously.
... welcome our new Manimal overlords.
Especially if they are in Neko Mimi Mode.
So you not only take issue with human stem cells, but animal stem cells as well. You have concern for the small number (say 10,000) of animals which may die to provide the embryos.
Somehow you seem more horrified that those 10,000 die to provide embryos (which you so clearly point out can be used to ease human suffering) than the millions upon millions of animals that die every year to feed us (inefficiently, from a calorie viewpoint), or the thousands of animals which get tested on.
Why people care so much about things which are never self-aware, let alone capable of feeling pain, yet turn a blind eye to the suffering of people (and animals) that is very real astounds me. Darfur? No, you're more outraged about stem cell research.
You can have moral issues with both, but please get your priorities straight. Hundreds of thousands dying and starving for NO good reason compared to cells with hundreds of deaths that were going to happen anyway (abortion isn't going away, even if made illegal) that may alleviate the suffering of millions.
I am not an expert. If I am misled in something, please correct me.
Something half pig, half manbear must come out of this.
Better call Al Gore.
But he used the monkey to do it
Apes in the plan
Were all here to prove it
I can walk like an ape
Talk like an ape
I can do what a monkey can do
God made man
But a monkey supplied the glue
-JOCKO HOMO
Shoes for Industry. Shoes for the Dead.
I hope you are a veggan, otherwise you animal rights accusations are completely hypocritical.
As for the rich getting better medical care than the poor, this has always been the case, always will be. However, in many countries, the poorer get a minimum amount of health care, and if significant advances are made using stem cells, those people would benefit as well.
Are they safe to eat?
You sir, pwn.
Trogdor was a man!
I mean, he was a... dragon-man!
Er, maybe he was just a dragon
But he was still
TROGDOOOOOOR! TROGDOOOOOR!
AND THEN TROGDOR COMES IN THE NIIIIIIGHT!
Will there be overlords?
Better hurry up and build that Internet censorship proxy fast, the Chinese are beating us at that one too.
You are not a brain: http://books.google.com/books?id=2oV61CeDx-YC
What you have is a little blob of animal stem cells with a few human stem cells thrown into the mix. Both are multiplying, but we mostly have animal cells. What would likely happen is once the embryo's cells begin specialization and an immune system develops, it would kill off all the human cells leaving itself crippled, deformed and dying.
Remember how everyone said "Aww shucks! We're just going to use cloning for stem cell research! We'd NEVER do anything funky like crossing humans and animals!" in response to cloning critics?
Well now those critics have been validated, and the Religious Right has more ammunition with which they can stall actual valid medical research.
This is what unrestrained morbid curiosity gets you. Too bad productive science as a whole has to suffer.
"Ask not what your country can do for you." --John F. Kennedy
There already are two furry conventions in the UK - RBW and ConFuzzled. See the furry convention map for more worldwide.
This creepy thing is most likely a freakishly deformed puppy, but I'm sure it will be good for some tabloid news stories.
I hope they're not planning a human/ipod hybrid... That could be what leads to the inslavement of the human race! If only we would have known they'd unite and overthrow the humans -- I can see it now!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtsHLLqs1D0
sigh
The tagline at the top should be changed to:
"From the Department of Dr. Moreau"
"This is animal cruelty, plain and simple. "
..."
no it's not, not by any stretch of imagination...well, except you and a few deluded others.
"Do you know how many embryos are going to be destroyed, and how many animals are going to be sacrificed to get said embryos, in order to do this ridiculous research?"
No, and the research isn't ridiculous, it's needed.
"...but I fear
That explains your emotional reaction and lack of actual logic."
"he rich living forever."
Why is that bad? It's not like when they die the money gets returned. From a financial standpoint, they DO live forever.
"This research makes a frankenstein much closer to reality."
Except it has nothing in common with the book or the movie 'Frankenstein'. In fact, what the hell would be wrong with being able to bring the dead back to life?
This research will let us stop aging, and eradicate the disease of aging and dying of natural causes then I'm all for it. I want to live forever. and ever. and then some.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Will they have a green light on on their foreheads?
(And, will their entry into the world mark them as greenhorns?)
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
Because, you know, that would be a little too creepy.
Gives a whole new meaning to the word "furry".
This is a sig. It is like every other sig in the world, except that it is mine, and it is different.
the heeling, healing heels of the SETI report. I can hear "THIS is the DAWNING of the AGE of aQUEERiUS.... AGE of aQUEERiUUUSSS.. a-QUEER-EE-UhhhhSSS...."
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
... test the shit out of these orc parts before they put them into people. I'd hate to see a new AIDS come of this.
"The irony when tending a flock of sheep is the dogs you put in place to protect them are genetically mutated wolves"
or would it be Homo Taurus
I read Slashdot for the headlines, because the headlines, unlike the articles, are usually original and never duplicated
...Not kawaii at all!
I drank what? -- Socrates
Not to go on all-Fours; that is the Law. Are we not Men? Not to eat Flesh or Fish; that is the Law. Are we not Men? Not to claw Bark of Trees; that is the Law. Are we not Men? Not to chase other Men; that is the Law. Are we not Men?"
I'll never understand this sort of mindset. If it were up to you, we'd still be painting mammoths on cave walls, and you'd be bitching about this new-fangled "art" thing, too.
So, it is not cruel when one does not "appreciate" or "experience" pain? You could then sedate a person to the point of being incapable of doing either in order to morally kill them? Your argument is stupid and you know it, so why bother posting it?
What it could someday turn into has no relevance to its status at that developmental level.
Until somebody INEVITABLY allows such an embryo to develop. What then?
"Ask not what your country can do for you." --John F. Kennedy
Stem cells my foot. People just want to see if they can create lizardmen and minotaurs. Those WoW enthusiasts need to calm down with their grass root politics.
Welcome to the 21st century ... ethics by opinion polls!
The 20th century's politics by opinion polls was bad enough.
Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. - Dr. Seus
A 13 year old boy and a man in a large suit of armor have been seen strolling around different parts of the country riding trains and causing general mayhem and seeking the Philosopher's Stone.
I'm thinking of a miserable future along the lines of The Island of Dr. Moreau...
Beauty is in the beholder of the eye.
Is the research taking place on a secluded island?
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." - Oscar Wilde
By our favorite simian/homo-sapien hybrid:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2006/01/20060131-10.html#
You can't seriously think those examples are exactly the same, can you?
The problem is that we didn't "INVENT" biology, it invented us. Because of that, it is very likely that there might be some things going on in there that we have no clue about.
But, by all means, please, don't let a little concern stop you. After all, your little example of the atom bomb turned out completely benign, so no worries.
Full speed ahead!
*Pulls train whistle
Choo! Choo!
Well, we all know how it ended with the atomic bombs.
Scientists will probably be our undoing this way. They never wonder IF they should do something, since they only care about HOW they should do something.
Knowledge is power. Knowledge shared is power lost.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7193820.stm
I find this incredibly irritating. The specifics of the term "hybrid" are not elaborated upon and the continual use of the term"human-animal hybrid" allows for people to develop the notion that scientists out there are actually creating some monster chimeric creature.
Not. True. If you click on "Q&A Hybrid Embryos", found in the right hand nav bar, you'll see what I mean. I've provided the link below:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/6233415.stm
This second link elaborates on why these eggs are considered "hybrid". Genetic material (DNA) is essentially removed from animal cells, leaving an empty nucleus and functional cellular machinery. In other words, you have a cell without DNA that looks very much like a human cell without it's DNA. The scientists then inject human DNA into the animal cell's nucleus; at this point the animal cell reads instructions off the DNA and carries them out. The end product is essentially A HUMAN CELL, but with left over proteins and cellular material generated from the old animal DNA.
This is FAR different from what people appear to be assuming. It's not going to generate some half cow-half human monster/creature, and does NOT "blur" the boundaries between humans and other species.
I for one welcome our anthropomorphic overlords.
That the world's first genuine furries are going to be abortions?
If the embryos are going to be just 14 days old at the start, it's really not a problem on the pain/development level. Of course, if they do seem viable before they're destroyed, it does raise some unsettling questions about how to proceed from there. Let them develop three months until destruction? Second trimester? Let them be born?
Of course, this all depends on scientists working some extremely interesting biological tricks to cram a square genetic peg into a round genetic hole.
I'm serial!
I think we all wish you weren't an intellectually bankrupt hysteric, but wishes don't seem to help very much.
If you truly believe that a few cells bound together are capable of experiencing cruelty, then how do you go through your day? If you sneeze you're killing more cells than that. I certainly hope you're a vegan, but even there, how do you bear the sufferings of all the vegetables?
In your world menstruation is murder, and masturbation is genocide, so why don't you go crusade against porn or something?
ad logicam Claiming a proposition is false because it was presented as the conclusion of a fallacious argument.
I thought the RIAA was working on that.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
"Scientist blends DNA with arachnid. Amazing Spider-Man wreaks havoc on New York City. Further Superheroes to follow"
"Teach a man to build a fire, and he's warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life."
Can be a creepy result... A sheep with a human brain... Or the opposite... Those are extremes...
But what about a human with polar bear fur?
Never mind - there are better features that I would have had... Better eyesight maybe? Birds are able to see UV-radiation, and some birds have a lot better vision than humans. On the other hand the genome for UV isn't lost in humans - it's actually changed into blue instead, probably because it's more useful that way. (so we can see the BSOD from M$)
Or a simple feature - why does humans really need toilet paper? Most animals can keep themselves clean anyway!
And the XXX industry would like to have a man hung like a horse...
And the athletes would like to be able to run like a cheetah.
But don't forget - humans are actually one of the more adaptable species in the world, even if laziness and sex drive are the most prominent features of a human. (don't underestimate the amount of work a human can do to avoid work later...)
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
What, one Steve Ballmer isn't enough for you?
*** Where are we going? And what's with this handbasket?
Will I get better mileage with a human/animal hybrid than a gas/electric?
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
Oh, yeah, we knew EVERYTHING about fire before we started using it. Gotcha. Thanks for the input.
No, you see, I'm not going to let YOUR concern stop me. If I want to make something, and I'm satisfied that I'm doing it right, then I'm bloody well gonna go and do it, and if you get in my way you're going to go home with a bloody nose. If you've got a valid reason why it shouldn't be done, then state your case, but I'm sick and tired of clueless cowards trying to tell me that I can't do something because they "feel" that it might be wrong.
I just don't get why this would be unethical? Does mother nature hold patents I'm not aware of?
Yes - Yes, we do indeed have better ways. But the goddamned fundies don't seem inclined to let us use the numerous extra embryos from human fertility therapies (nevermind abortions), so we need to find new, even more absurd, ways to get them.
I don't know that I'd say absurd. If we can get stem cells and appease the religious nuts at the same time without spending appreciably more money, then go for it. Most arguments against stem cell research are based on the idea that we're experimenting with "human life". This clearly isn't. Of course some nutbar is still going to equate destroying the embryos with abortion, but I'd say those people will largely be on the fringe."Please describe the scientific nature of the 'whammy'" - Agent Scully
[quote]Because 14-day-old embryos have such well-developed nervous systems that they can appreciate (nevermind even "experience") pain?[/quote] This has always interested me. If you continue your reasoning, will that mean that you can kill someone under anaesthesia? (I know it's absurd, but just for discussing)
... are humans not animals? If humans aren't animals, what are they?
i\hbar\dot{\psi}=\hat{H}\psi
For discussion's sake, I'd say there's two separate reasons that are both necessary for that argument and if you only have one you can wind up on a morally slippery slope (or more so than this issue already is.)
The lack of pain makes it far more civil than it would be. This should be a goal for all but the most basic of creatures; most people have a problem with tearing the wings off a fly, and so it makes reasonable sense to not cause any more pain than necessary, and if the pain is too extreme for the benefit received then the action shouldn't be taken at all.
Another area we should define is self-awareness, which is why it is usually considered bad to kill another human, because we also destroy the unique personality that was them. We have awareness and a desire to live, to achieve things for another day beyond that of most other animals. This is probably why although most people object to tearing the wings off a fly, most advocate swatting or zapping them. This is the tacit point which puts a dent in your reasoning.
Beyond this we have the issue of potential, which is where most religious issues come into play; is it right to kill something that has the potential to one day have the same rights, freedoms and thoughts as the rest of us. It's not the most morally clear area, and I don't know people who advocate it simply for it's own sake, however when not done chaotically, but done for a reason it becomes a much harder point to define. My opinion is that an established life has a far greater weight than the potential for life; the established life already is important to many.
I tend to believe that an individual should be able to decide their own fate (and support euthanasia for terminally ill patients.) For larger issues I believe the populace should decide what is right and wrong to the extent that popular opinion does not impede unduly on the minority.
I am not an expert. If I am misled in something, please correct me.
Heck, we still don't know much about the hundreds of different processes that occur in something as seemingly simple as a candle flame. Odd that that came up just now, as I have an article on my desk about just that (sorry, no linkie, Discover never published it online that I can find).
Fascinating article, tho. Did you know that if you shine a bright light on a flame, it casts a shadow? Comes from the various solid products (soot and unburned particles from the fuel) that are mixed within the flame...
tic
A: Ejaculate into a Kleenex, or
B: Dump the contents of your uterus into the toilet
You know what? You're right! That would mean a hell of a lot more copulation for everyone on Slashdot! Hell, most of the world!
Round everyone up! Time for the orgies to begin! In the name of animal/human rights! =D
Screw the rules, I have green hair!
That's stupid.
Screw the rules, I have green hair!
Unfortunately, you'd find it tricky to get within range, as all relevant conventions are fully booked until December. European furry convention organizers are being hard-pressed to keep up with increasing demand, despite significant expansion in the last few years.
I think you dropped your bible.
They need to make Centaurs!
Also, OwlBears.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
I always argue with my friend about animal rights.
:)
Me: Can bees vote?
Steve: No, they're not men.
Me: Can half-man half-bees vote?
Steve: No, they're too bee.
Me: Can 90% man 10% bee vote?
:
:
:
and so on
I don't have an answer for this, but I can't stad vegans so it's hard to take a safe stance. I guess I should do what maddox does and take a non-safe stance: Man-Bee can vote but I can kill him and eat him if I choose.
"you're going to go home with a bloody nose"
Wow! That was uncalled for.
It saddens me that you're so angry, and I hope you can get over whatever it is that troubles you.
Have a safe and pleasant evening.
Hardvark.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
except the person had the desire before they went under using anesthesia. That have had desire, and embryo can not desire, it's not possible at all. desire needs higher brain functions, as apposed to a ball of about 128 cells.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
So many comments clearly have no idea about what the article is about. THere will be no genome mixing... No manbearpigs, no gumans, hardvarks or even polar bumans. Just trying to turn random human cells into stem cells by using animal eggs without their DNA... Then if it works they terminate the experiment and try again :)
If they didn't cancel the experiment, you get a human clone. No animal hybrids.
...I'm sick and tired of clueless cowards trying to tell me that I can't do something because they "feel" that it might be wrong.I don't really think you made him feel warm and fuzzy inside. With the right friends you might ask someone to take a look, otherwise you should understand that assholes like this won't likely hurt you unless they're ordered too (they can't really think for themselves), or you tell them you love them. In which case you just went from annoying nerd to abused boyfriend.
Under the influence of Post-Cyberpunk Gonzo Journalism
I'm glad you found it somewhat enlightening.
I think I can counter your point by the fact that the individual under anesthesia was capable of these things before going under, while a human embryo has never had experiences, nor does it have anyone attached to it's personality (this is not to discount those who have had miscarriages)
As for humans having a desire to live versus all living things, I'd submit that all living things do indeed have a desire to live, but humans (and perhaps a few other species, to an extent) have a conscious ability to not live, i.e. it is possible for an individual who is physically fully functioning to choose to end their life, and we tend to honor the idea that someone might die so that someone else could live, even someone not related to them.
While it is true that some animals will do this for the herd or for their offspring, this is true of all animals of that same species and type. Humans differ in that they can choose to sacrifice or not. I also know of no animal who can choose death (suicide) when otherwise healthy. From this perspective humans have a unique desire to live, or at least a far more nuanced one.
We can also justify our choices by looking at the natural cycle of the world which involves death, usually more painful than what humans deem inhumane. The main difference between humans and other animals is that we're too good at what we do. Our killing of things is a near absolute certainty, and it is rare that we have take on much risk to ourselves in doing so.
I am not an expert. If I am misled in something, please correct me.
"A planet where apes evolved from men? There's got to be an answer."
Don't look for it, Taylor. You may not like what you find.
Dirty deeds, done with sheep...
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
"Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed"
Know who said that? Thomas fucking Jefferson, that's who. Maybe you've heard of him?
But you don't have to take it from a dead guy:
"Stop throwing the Constitution in my face. It's just a goddamned piece of paper!"
Truer words have never been spoken.
Oh, don't worry. I'm sure that with my training in mechanical engineering and some basic materials, we won't have to get all that close. >;)
Constitutional rights may be respected, repealed, or modified; but they must never be ignored.
With all the religious comments, I'm surprised no one said the obvious about the result being the Beast from Revelation? It sure makes it possible. (Or all those commenters just trying to talk around it.)
Tracy Johnson
Old fashioned text games hosted below:
http://empire.openmpe.com/
BT
I'm sure at some point, some crazy bastard will try to use this to create animals with intelligence and motivations far closer to humans. If, at one point, such a pokemon-esque creature breaks the communication barrier with mankind, this could be the first words it utters in some form.
8==8 Bones 8==8
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
I don't usually use toilet paper - I use water and soap to clean, and then a towel to dry (trick is to make sure everything is clean first, otherwise... :) ). I don't think I'm the only one in the world who does this.
I find the idea of using toilet paper rather unsanitary (and also less comfortable too).
If using soap and water is good enough to clean your hands, it should be good enough for cleaning your butt. If it isn't good enough for you then you should be using something better, and toilet paper certainly isn't better - I don't see surgeons cleaning their hands and arms with toilet paper.
If you're obsessive you could apply alcohol to kill any left over germs.
Nobody seems to have asked for donated human material, with consent to use the cells in this fashion. I'm sure male cells can't be hard to obtain...
(Hmm - "Wank for research material! Form orderly queue here!")
Why is it that the hairdresser throws away my hair, donating blood is laudable, organ donation saves lives - but donating some of my hundreds of useless eggs (how many kids I am realistically going to have?) is morally outrageous and really quite hard to do - neither my doctor nor the local fertility clinic had any clue on how to do such.
Who do we vote out / mob / de-fund to get some common sense injected to reasearch ethics committees?
Ohhhhh... Is that what the catapult arm thing from the other story is for?
I only respect a person's views if he or she has reasonable arguments for it. I don't respect ignorance. Also, non sequiturs such as "it says so in the Bible" aren't reasonable arguments.
But yes, I think it's our duty to either meet reasonable arguments for our opposite views with reasonable counter-arguments or rethink our own views if we can't find them.
"That's stupid!" is a perfectly valid way to dismiss an argument that IS stupid, but very often people say stupid things not because they are stupid but because there's a conflict of interest involved, or they are simply blinded by culture and ignorant about it.
My other account has a 3-digit UID.
Where's the chimera tag?
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
Well, that robot arm it's far too inefficient for use as a catapult. We are, however, working on a direct monkey->giant-robotic-arm neural interface, for superior Furry battering ability... Which if you think adds a pinch of irony; who would expect a furry little creature to use a giant robotic arm to splatter humans dressed in animal costumes?
Constitutional rights may be respected, repealed, or modified; but they must never be ignored.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=76500023080227528&q=chicken+lady&total=357&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=1
"At first, we thought it was just another snake cult."
What if one embryo gets 'lost' and somehow reaches birth, would the result be a human or an animal? If uncertainty remains, what about the poor thing's rights?
It is diverting, Per Wigren, that your only reasoning on calling my argument stupid is that you have capitalized "is". And regarding logical fallacies, you also tried to poison the well with your reference on the Bible: along with "it's our duty", that did bring a smile, thanks :)
Project Manticore can now proceed. Hopefully they make many, many Jessica Albas.
Nothing to see here. Move along.