Alaskans Prepare For Volcanic Eruption

An anonymous reader writes "Mount Redoubt, or Redoubt Volcano, is an active stratovolcano in the largely volcanic Aleutian Range of Alaska. The once quiet volcano has begun to roar once again. Its last eruption was in 1989 and geologists suggest that the next one is upon us. Alaskans who lived through the earlier eruption are stocking up on breathing masks and goggles. Starting on Friday, January 23 2009, the level of seismic activity increased markedly, and on Sunday AVO raised the Aviation Color Code to ORANGE and the Volcano Alert Level to WATCH. On the basis of all available monitoring data AVO regards that an eruption similar to or smaller than the one that occurred in 1989-90 is the most probable outcome. We expect such an eruption to occur within days to weeks." From the AP article: "Alaska's volcanoes are not like Hawaii's. 'Most of them don't put out the red river of lava,' said the observatory's John Power. Instead, they typically explode and shoot ash 30,000 to 50,000 feet high — more than nine miles — into the jet stream. 'It's a very abrasive kind of rock fragment,' Power said. The particulate has jagged edges and has been used as an industrial abrasive. 'They use this to polish all kinds of metals,' he said." The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive.

Comments

Really?

[egcagrac0]

Perpare?

Re:Really?

[$RANDOMLUSER]

Perpare?

Yup, that's the way we say it in Chicago. Just ask the mare.

Re:Really?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yse, perpare! Seh's gnona bolw!

Re:Really?

[azav]

Yeah. Someone should invent a spell checking program.

Re:Really?

[Dystopian Rebel]

You betcha! (winks)

Re:Really?

[Anonymous Coward]

Also, "It's" last eruption was in 1989...

Re:Really?

[MartinSchou]

*shakes head* Why overdo it, when a single mistake would have been a lot smarter:

"Yes, perpare! She's gonna bowl!"

Re:Really?

[binarylarry]

I lrnead ta jmimy jhnos taht the olny ltetrs taht rlaley mtater are the fsirt and lsat.

Re:Really?

[MartinSchou]

Yes, because we all know that the farmers of the constitution all played blowing with The Dude.

Re:Really?

[nightcats]

In fact, there is not a single mistake in this post, for ITS writer doesn't know the difference between ITS and IT'S. Let's review:

Its: belong to it, as in "its last eruption..."
It's: It is...as in: It's amazing to me that geeks, to whom a single typo in code can be disaster, regularly butcher the English language.

Bah!

[elrous0]

My grandpappy stayed on this mountain, and I'll be damned if I'm going to leave it! I'm staying righ#@$#@%$NO CARRIER

Re:Bah!

[Shakrai]

My grandpappy stayed on this mountain, and I'll be damned if I'm going to leave it! I'm staying righ#@$#@%$NO CARRIER

Ok, so we've got someone who is unwilling to evacuate. Check. Now all we need is a fairly attractive MILF who may sire the future leader of the human resistance^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^Wis the mayor of a small town. Oh and Pierce Brosnan too. Can't forget him. Add those two things in and I think we've got ourselves a movie ;)

(Bonus points for adding in a family dog that will survive all manner of bad situations even as the humans around him are dropping like flies)

Re:Bah!

[Daswolfen]

Better than Tommy Lee Jones stopping lava with concrete and fire hoses.... ... oh and a building.

Re:Bah!

[Muad'Dave]

You left out the part where that MILF used to make out with a half beast dude that lived in the subway.

Re:Bah!

[Shakrai]

Ah, I'd forgotten about that one. Yeah that was pretty cheesy. They did actually manage such a feat in Iceland once upon a time. Of course it took millions of gallons of water (far more then you'd get from fire trucks) and they didn't stop the lava flow -- all they did was divert it from a harbor that they were trying to save.

Re:Bah!

[Hoi Polloi]

It's been done.

Re:Bah!

[tsa]

Tom Jones! We need Tom Jones in the movie too.

Ocol

[Talisman]

Fi Noly Ilnux ahd a psellchecker.

Re:Ocol

[kurtmckee]

...and a grammar checker. Its a shame.

Unresponsive web page

[trigggl]

I assumed it was a slashdot effect, but I guess the site was down pre-slashdot. Perhaps it was the Drudge effect? That's where I tried from.

Re:Unresponsive web page

[Anonymous Coward]

They were not perpared.

Re:Unresponsive web page

[Anonymous Coward]

Apparently you didn't RTFT, "Alaskans Perpare for VOLCANIC ERUPTION"

Re:Unresponsive web page

[element-o.p.]

More than likely, it was all of us in Kenai, Soldotna and Anchorage reloading every five minutes to get the latest update on Redoubt.

Re:Unresponsive web page

[indifferent children]

A Slashcano erupted in their servers at 8:55 this morning.

Re:Unresponsive web page

[danbert8]

Could be... My brother lives in Kenai and I was able to check the information last night just fine. I think what happened is that every news network picked up on it today.

adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Red Flayer]

The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive.

And so you post a direct link to it on the slashdot front page?

Way to go, kdawson, way to go. You've ensured the Alaska Volcano Observatory site is going to be down even longer.

Why would you do that? Did that site molest you when you were young or something?

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Rasit]

I have to admit that the first thing I did upon reading that was to click the link to see if the server really was down. *hangs head in shame*

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Anonymous Coward]

Neh, it's just that he likes Alaskans.

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[AntEater]

The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive.

I'm sure we have nothing at all to do with this. Nothing at all...

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Anonymous Coward]

I did the same, but for another reason: when it goes down, you have to make sure it /stays/ down.

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Anonymous Coward]

It is a secret /. conspiracy to destroy Alaska.

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Anonymous Coward]

The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive.

And so you post a direct link to it on the slashdot front page? Way to go, kdawson, way to go. You've ensured the Alaska Volcano Observatory site is going to be down even longer. Why would you do that? Did that site molest you when you were young or something?

Because he doesn't actually believe that anybody reads the article anyway?

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[nonewmsgs]

i just checked it to try to see if it is back up and it is, so we don't have to worry. you can always see for yourselves if you don't believe me.

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Hoi Polloi]

I'll just set up a batch job to keep pinging it until it comes up...

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Cally]

There's a minimalist backup site. FWIW the banner says the normal site was overwhelmed with traffic after national media coverage (which I take to be TV); somehow I think CNN would have a bigger effect than Slashdot.

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[moosesocks]

I'm actually a bit surprised by this. UAF (where AVO are located) have plenty of computing capacity.

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[Tenebrousedge]

How many of your supercomputers do you use as web servers?

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[LynnwoodRooster]

Shoot it to the ground, then follow up with a shot to the head. It's the only way to kill a zombie (machine or human).

Re:adding fuel to the (server) fire

[cdfh]

Surely a busy-wait infinite loop would be better?

I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[txoof]

I find this to be pretty exciting. I was just a little kid when St. Helens blew her top. I remember the ash coating our cars in Colorado. I thought it was so cool that it was snowing dirt.

Then again, I don't live right under the thing and my home, livelihood, health and property aren't currently being threatened by microscopic airborne razor blades.

Have any slashdot readers been close to an erupting volcano? Especially the subduction zone variety? Can you give us an account of what it's like?

These ring-o-fire volcanoes usually explode rather than ooze due to the composition of their magma. There's lots of dissolved gasses that like to become undissolved in massive bangs.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[indi0144]

Have you ever being in an earthquake? those in which you can listen the earth "roaring"? A volcano it's a bit more frightening since earth roars, smells like the Erebus should smell and the sight of a 5 mile high gray cloud makes it apocalyptic.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[drinkypoo]

Then again, I don't live right under the thing and my home, livelihood, health and property aren't currently being threatened by microscopic airborne razor blades.

Those microscopic airborne razor blades will probably be distributed across much of the US due to the jet stream.

On the plus side, a dust mask is probably sufficient protection for those without beards.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[trigggl]

I was a kid in Eugene(sp), Oregon when Mt. St. Helens blew. I was too young to know what was going on at the time, but I remember hearing 2 very loud booms followed by rattling windows. I thought maybe it was a sonic boom, but didn't see any airplanes. Also, it was a bright sunny day with no thunderclouds. Later that year, I flew out of Portland Oregon to St. Louis. It was kind of a gray orangish sky with a thin film of ash on the ground.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Anonymous Coward]

I accidentally the whole earthquake!

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Dunbal]

I've been in several earthquakes, the largest being 7.8, and I've never heard the "earth roar". My most recent was earlier this month in Costa Rica, where I live.

        I've heard my house rattling, I've seen things falling off my tables and walls. But the only time I've heard the earth "roar" was while watching Hollywood movies of earthquakes.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Daswolfen]

Call me crazy, but I think a volcanic plume is beautiful. I love the pattern in the the clouds of the pyroclastic flows.

And this is a good time for us to observe a volcano fairly close to a major population center, so we can be ready when Yellowstone erupts on 12/21/12 at 11:11 GMT.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Remloc]

May depend on the composition of the faults/rock.
The larger ones in Southern California definitely make noise. I always called it "grinding," but "roar" could also be an appropriate term.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Anonymous Coward]

Perhaps your hearing is limited in the low frequencies, or you haven't been in enough earthquakes, or you need to be in one away from buildings?

I have been in countless minor but very local earthquakes and some major ones, and have often noticed a deep rumbling or "roaring" sound before the first bit of obvious shaking arrives. The local ones were the loudest, sometimes consisting of a rumble and then one sharp bang which sounded like something crashed into my house.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Muad'Dave]

Not exactly a roar, but there was a tiny (M2.9) earthquake whose epicenter was very close (2km) to my house. It was too small to feel, but I distinctly heard it as a sharp "boom" sound that resonated in my basement. I doubt anyone without a basement heard or felt it.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[DeadCatX2]

AK is pretty far up on the globe compared to the continental US. If I were you, I would invest in a Canadian dust mask company.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Tristanic]

And this morning we had a m4.6 earthquake here in seattle. I remember kids going out and playing in the 'snow' after St. Helens blew. They ended up going to the doctor because their eyes got all itchy and red.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Directrix1]

9 mile high in this case.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Directrix1]

You breath through your beard?

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Bastard of Subhumani]

Will Russians be able to see it from their house?

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Anonymous Coward]

maybe it was roaring in spanish and you just didn't understand it

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[SIR_Taco]

Those microscopic airborne razor blades will probably be distributed across much of the US due to the jet stream.

What a relief... here I thought Canada might get some of those.
I guess "microscopic airborne razor blades" are pretty loyal to their country of origin. Good thing we didn't add those to NAFTA. I, for one, am glad that it's just going to skip over Canada.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[BTG9999]

I was on the last airplane out of Anchorage International Airport after the eruption of Mt. Redoubt in 1989. Just as we were about to board the volcano erupted, they said we had about 30 minutes to get on the plane and takeoff before the airport was closed. We just barely made it. An unfortunate KLM 747 flew right thru the ash cloud, lost all four engines and was not able to get them back til about 5k feet. We saw it when we got back, it looked like they had sandblasted it.

I also fondly remember watching the ash cloud head our way from the Mt Spur, and the shovelling the ash the next day off the driveway with snow shovels.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[onkelonkel]

He must be a kernel dev. Bow down in awe.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Anonymous Coward]

I've been in a least one that roared. The one that sticks out in my mind was outside of San Diego in the mid-80's. In the moments before the quake hit, the only thing my brain could link the sound to was something like a *really* big truck coming down the road really fast.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Anonymous Coward]

What is the 21st month? Smarch?

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[hydertech]

I've lived in Anchorage since 1975 and have seen at least 10 volcanic eruptions. The sky gets dark and ash falls. You don't fly airplanes when the ash is in the air. You clean your air filters on your vehicles after the ash subsides. If it is really bad you wash your gutters out after it's over. That's pretty much it.

I can still remember driving to work sometime in the late 80's during a moderate ash fall after an eruption and looking over at the guy in the car next to me. He had a respirator mask on! I thought WTF is this? Until that time I had never seen such a thing. I imagine if it were really bad a mask might be necessary, but really it's the same people who go nuts when someone smokes a cigarette within 100' of them that really freak out.

I think the only people "preparing" are those with severe respiratory problems, the hypochondriacs, the airlines, the vulcanologists and mostly and the press: "KILLER VOLCANO THREATENS YOUR BABY!"

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Anonymous Coward]

You breath through your beard?

I breath through my snotcicle, you insensitive clod!

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[element-o.p.]

The volcanic plume can definitely be beautiful. IIRC, AVO has some images from a few years ago when Mt. Augustine erupted, one of which shows the shadow of the plume against the western sky as the sun set -- very, very beautiful. I'd post a link, but if AVO is already down...

Anyway, I know you were j/k, but we've had Redoubt, Spurr and Augustine erupt since I moved to AK in 1989, so I don't think this next eruption of Redoubt is going to be an earth-shaking event (no pun intended).

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[element-o.p.]

Only from their back yards ;)

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[element-o.p.]

Yep -- I've still got a bottle of ash from Mt. Spur(r?), and in the private pilot ground schools I teach, I usually mention the KLM flight as an example of why you don't want to fly during an active eruption.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[jcr]

I remember the ash coating our cars in Colorado.

Wow. I didn't realize it got that far. I was living in Virginia at the time, and a friend of mine had a sack of ash that a relative had sent him. It had the consistency of talcum powder, and we mixed it with a bit of water and used it for polishing brass and chrome.

-jcr

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Anonymous Coward]

I've been in several earthquakes, the largest being 7.8, and I've never heard the "earth roar"....

I don't know if I would call it a "roar" but I've definitely heard a loud grinding noise during an earthquake. And that only a 5.8 or so.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[Anonymous Coward]

Perhaps your hearing is limited in the low frequencies, or you haven't been in enough earthquakes, or you need to be in one away from buildings?

Or maybe all those car alarms just drowned it out.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[jwhitener]

I was in Ellensburg Washington at the time of the St. Helens explosion. I remember it being around lunch time, and the sky darkened and basically felt like night.

Very quickly we had inches of ash on the ground. I was pretty young at the time, but watching the sky darken so quickly is still something I can clearly remember. It was both neat, and quite scary.

I've visited St. Helens several times throughout the years. Early after the explosion, some years later, etc..

Its simply amazing how much destructive power was unleashed. Its interesting to hear about it, and see metaphors comparing it to X nuclear bombs and such, but walking around on the ground near it, and see miles of forest laying down flat is just incredible.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[troll8901]

I had always thought seeing Russia from the USA is a myth. Until I've read about the Diomede Islands. They're only 4 km (and 21 hours) apart.

Still, I enjoy your jokes. Haha. Whoooooosh!!

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[drinkypoo]

AK is pretty far up on the globe compared to the continental US. If I were you, I would invest in a Canadian dust mask company.

1) Sorry, I forgot to explicitly mention the US Annex by name. I'll try not to make that mistake again.

2) But wait... the Polar Jet Stream typically swoops down from just South of Alaska to cross over the Northern USA. Which is where I said the stuff was going. Apparently even the Jet Stream doesn't want to go to Canada. Eh, Hoser?

3) I would bet good money that the most popular dust masks in Canada are the same ones as in the USA. And I would further bet that the best one you can buy at a hardware store is still made by one of the greatest exploiters of the Earth of all time, 3M. I like the one with the exhaust flap valve. As always, invest in destruction of the planet to guarantee long-term gains.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[DeadCatX2]

1) Ten seconds of googling will show that the jet stream changes dramatically from day to day

If the volcano explodes this Thursday, then the vast majority of the US will likely be spared the fate you are so certain they will suffer. One day earlier and it will be dumped all over the east coast; one day later and the west coast will suffer instead.

2) I find that most people who engage in ad hominems have low self esteem and use the attacks to boost their ego by creating the illusion of superiority. A well-adjusted human being respects others and knows that there are more effective ways to communicate.

Maybe you were you having a bad day? Normally my attempts at humor are transparent enough that others don't react so flippantly. But, hey, fight fire with fire. If you're already embracing arrogant behavior, then here's to tit-for-tat!

3) Actually, you said the stuff was going over "much of the US". But don't let minor inconsistencies like this knock you off your high horse; I wouldn't want you to bruise your ego when you landed.

4) I've got a lot of faith in nature; I don't think there's anything that humans could do that would completely destroy the planet. In the mean time, society should advance forward with inventions that improve life and expand knowledge.

May I suggest helping to nurture the green revolution? It could lead to investors who favor eco-friendly stocks over dividend-friendly stocks. In fact, you could start right now, by going out and purchasing stock from companies who you think do business the right way. Without your contribution, how can they stand up to the 3M's and the Wal-Mart's of the world?

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[ckaminski]

Now imagine that shit in your lungs.

Re:I have a vague memory of St. Helens

[jcr]

That's why we invented respirators.

It was a pretty good abrasive, as I recall. Extremely fine, but very sharp.

-jcr

Simpsons?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm pretty sure the goggles tag is a reference to the simpsons. I'm wondering if that episode is famous enough to warrant a meme or if its just because it was the one they showed last night.

Re:Simpsons?

[Rasit]

I'm pretty sure the goggles tag is a reference to the simpsons. I'm wondering if that episode is famous enough to warrant a meme or if its just because it was the one they showed last night.

The googles, they do nothing! = 239,000 results.
The goggles do nothing = 325,000 results.

I think that it qualifies to be called a internet meme.

Re:Simpsons?

[frieko]

Milhouse 893,000 results.

Does this mean Milhouse is a meme???

Re:Simpsons?

[sukotto]

It's from the "Radioactive Man" episode in season 7. The Wolfcastle (McBain) character is about to be covered in acid and is given a pair of goggles to protect his eyes.

When the acid hits, he cries out that "The goggles, they do nothing!"

Re:Simpsons?

[Anonymous Coward]

There's only 20,400 results for Millhouse is not a meme. So... maybe.

Re:Simpsons?

[jamesh]

Does this mean Milhouse is a meme???

Yes. Yes it does.

Poor Observatory

[gakguk]

> The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive.

And we're helping the poor sysadm by linking from /. homepage, right? kdawson, you're da man :)

Sarah Palin

[arkham6]

So I guess Sarah Palin is not the only thing from Alaska that emits a lot of gas and hot air.

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah it's considered an industrial strength abrasive!

Sarah, not the volcano. That would be an insult to the volcano.

-AC

Re:Sarah Palin

[elrous0]

Bad comparison. When a volcano wants your attention, it spits. When Sarah Palin wants something, she swallows.

Re:Sarah Palin

[INT_QRK]

How utterly clever. Did you think of it yourself or did you get your political thoughts from the great analytical thinkers of our time, like, Letterman, Rosie O'Donnell, the faculty of The View...

Re:Sarah Palin

[tuxgeek]

Mod parent up Funny

Reality: Sarah Palin forced herself into the spotlight and then said stupid shit on camera. If she wants to continue to be in the spot light, she deserves all the abuse the attentive public wants to dish out.

<rant>
Dislaimer: I live in Alaska, I have to live with the stupid shit she says and does everyday, like giving away our north slope natural gas to Canada after her election promise of building a pipeline to the south to deliver the gas to Alaskans and the lower 48. All Alaskans want access to our natural gas. Even staunch republicans talk of having access to it. For those outside, the interior heats and produces power with diesel and coal. We even pay the highest prices in the nation for diesel and gasoline and we have and refine our own north slope crude. WTF????

Palin is raping the system here and nobody complains. WTF???
She flies her children all over the country when she travels on state business @ taxpayer expense and acts like she is entitled to this.
She is never at her desk in the state capitol of Juneau, she is instead kicking back at her home in Wasilla, sleeping in her own bed, and charging the state enormous per diem fees for it. WTF???
She is even so fucking lame, she want to move the state capitol to Anchorage so she can be closer to her home. WTF???

Lets put this into the proper perspective here. As an Alaskan, to be proud of Sarah Palin, is the same as calling Illinous home and being proud of Rod Blagojevich.
She is raping the system here, and if someday she advances to federal office, she will do the same to the country, if given the opportunity.
</rant>

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

That's awfully rude. Dontcha know that Sarah can see the volcano which makes her an expert geologist. She's not worried about it, so I'm not.

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

Your satire is so obviously superior.

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

Troll really?
I thought parent was insightful or even informative

Somebody my need to be kicked out of the gene pool!

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

lol troll i found it funny

i guess u upset some republican still bitter about that dumb bitch not getting in

touchy subject for sore losers i guess

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

Yep, I guess Republicans are still a little bitter they got their arses kicked by the one thing they lack- intelligent thought.

Re:Sarah Palin

[INT_QRK]

Ah, "Funny" when disparaging the Republican and "Troll" when defending her. Of course, this is how I expect NEOCOMMIES react to nonconformist attitude.

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

There's a difference between non-conformist attitude and idiot attitude.

Thinking in any way whatsoever that Sarah Palin is a good politician is outright idiocy. It requires an exceptionally dumb person to believe she has any place in a modern, positive, forward thinking political system.

Re:Sarah Palin

[INT_QRK]

Well, certainly a moderately successful politician, wouldn't you say? How many Gubernatorial elections have you won? I thought so. And "forward thinking" is NEOCOMMIE for what, funding ACORN, the criminal voter fraud cell of the democrat political machine, as "Economic Stimulus"?

Re:Sarah Palin

[elrous0]

Maybe they were offended at the implication that any Republican woman swallows.

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, troll.

"Even staunch republicans talk of having access to it."

The ass-wipe makes it sound like a partisan issue. EVERY Alaskan, except for the hard-core greenies wanted an Alaskan only (North Slope to Valdez) pipeline. And even most greenies said that IF we were not going to abandon fossil fuels, the Alaska route was better for the State.

"move the state capitol to Anchorage"

When did she, or ANYONE, other than "the guy at the bar", ever say this? Willow is the city mentioned when discussing moving the Capital because it is central in the State's road system. You know, access to government and all that. Of note, Alaska has voted TWICE to move the capital out of Juneau, but the politicians from BOTH sides, (with substantial pressure from Juneau) decry this as not fiscally responsible - so instead we move them and their house-hold goods twice a year. Oh yeah, and almost everyone of them supports and office in Anchorage.

"Palin is raping the system here and nobody complains. "

The GP should get over his fear of anything "conservative" and listen to local talk-radio. Rick Ridel, a well-known simpleton, and Andrew Halcro, an articulate independent ex-legislator, lambaste her daily. Both are "right-wing" enough to strike fear and loathing into the heart of any liberal.

We get it, the GP doesn't like Sarah. BFD, don't vote for her next go-round. None of the "staunch Republicans" will be either. But the bed-wetting hysterics to karma-whore for those who hate republicans is boring.

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't worry, fuckwit. The reason you're being modded down has nothing to do with party politics.

Re:Sarah Palin

[failedlogic]

Correct. There will be a VULVAanic-Explosion!

Re:Sarah Palin

[INT_QRK]

Dear coward, obviously it is. That's how you NEOCOMMIES operate.

Re:Sarah Palin

[Anonymous Coward]

Using that logic, George Bush was also a good politician, but then you seem dumb enough to actually believe that. You see, the reason they're successful is because the US has a disturbing amount of stupid people like you who simply have no clue or understanding about what's good for their country or the world around them but instead shout "OMG HOT WOMAN WITH GUN, FUCK YEAH!" and pencil their vote in.

Being a successful politician does not mean someone is a good politician. Prior to George Bush the US was the single most powerful political entity in the world, after 9/11 Iran was so scared of the US that it offered to help, but since Bush told them he wasn't interested and went into Iraq destroying Iran's strongest threat in the area Iran can stand up to the US and laugh in it's face, whilst negotiations in the middle east and north korea mean the US has to sit back and take second place to Europe and China. Even Russia isn't afraid to stand up to the US and start sending long range bombers to patrol it's air space now.

The US has, in the last two presidential terms dropped so far in political standing internationally that it no longer has unilateral control of the world, if Obama can't stop or reverse this then the US stands to lose it's position as the only remaining super-power just as Russia, Britain, France did before it and it's likely China will soon take it's place.

Oh and:

"And "forward thinking" is NEOCOMMIE for what"

Thank you for proving my point, you are clearly just dumb if you can't understand such a simple, commonly used term, but then, this isn't news, because you support Sarah Palin. You are no less dumb than the Iranians that voted in Amadinejad, the Russians that voted Putin and the Venezuelans that voted Chavez. Not that I expect you to know who any of those are with your clearly ignorant, naive political world view.

Now go pray on the bible or whatever idiocy it is you like to waste your time on rather than say, becoming intelligent and getting a clue.

Damn globe

[Cornwallis]

...contributing to its own global warming.

Re:Damn globe

[indi0144]

one would say.. "it's like the earth wants to get rid of us" but thats crazy talk. It's more like the underground Molemen are pissed off by all the media coverage for things like tsunamis and fires. Maybe Dr. Evil allied with the Molemen and tried to blow the inners of the earth again but Austin Powers could not do anythings since he converted to some kind of guru. I blame religion for this.

Re:Damn globe

[Shakrai]

It's more like the underground Molemen are pissed off

Crab people. Crab people. Taste like crab, talk like people. Crab people. Crab people.......

Re:Damn globe

[JohnnyGTO]

You make joke, good joke mind you.

Actually I'd love to see a comparison of supposed man made climate changing gasses verses natural. Do you know there is a lake in Rawanda that contains enough gases to end live as we no it if it turns over, ya the planet is trying to kill us!

Re:Damn globe

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't worry, I'm sure Al Gore will be willing to pay for the carbon offsets to ensure the volcano stays carbon neutral.

Re:Damn globe

[INT_QRK]

I'd say more like Global Cooling. Stratospheric volcanic clouds are more likely to reflect sunlight back into space, thus are more likely to cause cooling than contribute significantly to greenhouse effect. See http://www.cotf.edu/ete/modules/volcanoes/vclimate.html

Re:Damn globe

[meringuoid]

Actually I'd love to see a comparison of supposed man made climate changing gasses verses natural.

Human activity typically puts out some 130 times more carbon dioxide than all the world's volcanoes combined. Neither come close to the amount of carbon dioxide emitted by rotting foliage in the autumn - but that is cancelled out by the carbon dioxide absorbed by growing foliage in the spring. That's why the concentration in the atmosphere oscillates up and down, but maintains a continuous upward trend.

Re:Damn globe

[Dragoness Eclectic]

There are actually three such lakes, and both the Rwandan lake and the lake in Cameroon have erupted in the past, killing hundreds of people and thousands of livestock.

I remember when those eruptions happened, in the mid-1980s. It was world news, because it was such an utterly bizarre disaster right out of a bad scifi movie. I mean, who expects the deep lake you live near to barf suffocating gas one day and kill everyone downhill from it?

Re:Damn globe

[Cally]

I recommend reading the IPCC Fourth Assessment Report, then. You'll find lots of fascinating facts in there.

Re:Damn globe

[Anonymous Coward]

I AM THE UNDERMINER! I am beneath you, but NOTHING is beneath ME!

Governor Palin

[linumax]

is looking out her window with anxiety, 'perparing' to obtain her PhD in Igneous petrology.

Sarah Palin an expert in geology and vulcanology

[MasterOfMagic]

Given her foreign policy credentials, are the Republican talking heads going to advance this event as proof of her experience with geology and vulconalogy?

And with all that ash in the air...

[Ellis D. Tripp]

she won't be able to see Russia from her backyard anymore!

Re:And with all that ash in the air...

[SatanicPuppy]

Goddamn it, beat me to it.

Well played sir, well played.

Re:And with all that ash in the air...

[SargentDU]

Now you are quoting a Saturday Night Live comediane not the person she was impersonating. :) I hope you knew that, but just in case you didn't.

Re:And with all that ash in the air...

[revlayle]

....doesn't really matter anymore

Re:And with all that ash in the air...

[Anonymous Coward]

And here was I, thinking it was the other way around.

Re:And with all that ash in the air...

[mrsquid0]

To be fair to Sarah Palin, she never actually said that she could see Russia from her backyard. She said some things that were far dafter, but not that one.

Re:And with all that ash in the air...

[Anonymous Coward]

Matters about as much as the fact that Al Gore never actually claimed to have invented the internet...

Re:And with all that ash in the air...

[Cally]

Actually,

PALIN:And, Charlie, you're in Alaska. We have that very narrow maritime border between the United States, and the 49th state, Alaska, and Russia. They are our next door neighbors.We need to have a good relationship with them. They're very, very important to us and they are our next door neighbor.

GIBSON: What insight into Russian actions, particularly in the last couple of weeks, does the proximity of the state give you?

PALIN: They're our next door neighbors and you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska, from an island in Alaska.

Re:And with all that ash in the air...

[mrsquid0]

And she is absolutely right, one can see Russia from the Diomede Islands. However, those are a long way from her house. Palin said lots of moronic things, but the "I can see Russia from my house" comment was not one of them.

Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[bogaboga]

My prayer to all those concerned is to work hard in order to avoid another "Katrina." Just like Katrina, we know this natural disaster is probably coming, like Katrina, we know its likely to be big and therefore affect many folks.

So let us prepare and not screw up everything. Events that transpired during and after Katrina were no less than events that would have transpired in a 3rd world country. Now that's shameful and we should avoid it.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[wurble]

It can't be as bad as Katrina. There are currently over 1,000,000 people in the New Orleans metro area. That's AFTER Katrina; the population of new Orleans literally dropped in half since 2000. And Katrina affected a heck of a lot larger area than just the New Orleans metro.

The entire state of Alaska has around 680,000 people.

So while this has the potential to be a major disaster, it will never be anything as bad as Katrina in scale and number of people affected.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[laejoh]

my pary are already with the father who lost his chrilden ; i am truley sorry for your lots!

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[BobMcD]

I have to admit I'm a bit torn by this sentiment. On the one hand, yes, this is shaping up to be rather tragic. On the other, isn't this sort of thing rather avoidable by just not living there?

To be fair, Katrina (specifically as it pertains to New Orleans) is only about 50/50 on the whole 'just dont live there' thing for me - hurricanes can hit the entire coast, but perhaps you should consider allowing the below-sea-level areas to flood at some point. Or fill it in somehow, or use a system of tubes, or stilts, or whatever engineering marvel amounts to a better idea than 'build a wall and pray'. It isn't like water is some kind of super-intelligent villain. It just sort of flows downhill until it hits the ocean...

This Alaskan situation, on the other hand, is a volcano. It doesn't move around much. It also erupts in a fairly predicable way, and makes a lot of noise letting you know its about to happen.

It just reminds me of the security guard on Austin Powers, I guess.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[will_die]

Doubtful that it will be another Katrina for three reasons
1) the People in he nearby cities are preparing for it. Buying emergencies suppies, food, flashlights,etc.
2) The mayors in nearby cities are informing the people, have emergency procedures already in place and plan to follow them.
3) the governor is working with the mayors, has plans aready in place for when emergencies happen, and is prepared to activate emergency personnel as needed.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Umm, an ash cloud can be harmful, but the nearest large city has fewer than 280,000 people. Last time it erupted they told us to take out our contacts and stay indoors. Kids sold pantyhose on streetcorners to put over the air intake of your car. Footprints in the snow after the fallout appear brilliantly white, and after a couple days of sulphury flavor, the dust problem goes away. This will not be another Katrina.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[NinthAgendaDotCom]

4) Michael "heck of a job" Brown no longer at FEMA

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

You're right. Unlike the crappy job the City, Parish, and State governments did in preparation for a hurricane and the absolute lack of response they gave after "Katrina", lets ensure that the Alaskan City, County, and State governments do their job and make sure preparations are taken care of. Lets not forget the inconvenient fact that its the local governments job to response first... not sit on their ass and wait for Federal hand-outs.

Based on all current reports, Alaaskan's are on top of it.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[argStyopa]

"Just like Katrina, we know this natural disaster is probably coming, like Katrina, we know its likely to be big and therefore affect many folks."

And just like Katrina, anyone too stupid to look after their own behinds and expect the government to come save them is an idiot who probably is due for a Darwinistic culling.

Be intelligent. Prepare yourself. Evacuate as YOUR judgement suggests is reasonable, and understand that the consequences for being wrong could be severe, so you might want to err on the side of caution.

What shamed me as an American during Katrina wasn't the much-publicized "failure" of Bush and co. No, what disgusted me was that in a society with free public education to age 18, widespread information-distribution technology, and AMPLE transportation resources, we have apparently bred a new generation of sheep, er, Americans with no interest in helping their fellow-man, so dependent and with so little motivation that even self-preservation can't get them to lift a finger in their own interest.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[citizenr]

My prayer

when was the last time that helped anyone?

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

This will probably look good for Obama.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

So you're saying 2000 years after Pompeii we still haven't figured out that living next to a volcano is a bad idea???

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

A look at the map sometimes helps to get some kind of perspective.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm sure this will not be another Katrina. You are comparing a group of self-reliant, independent, hardworking generally conservative people in Alaska to a bunch of whiny liberals who expect the Government to take care of their every need.

Also you won't see any city in Alaska trying to violate the 2nd Amendment like happened in New Orleans. Not only do the police in Alaska known and understand the 2nd Amendment, they also know if they attempted to illegal take people firearms they would be shot.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[ari_j]

Also, Alaskans are, in general, more prepared to go without power, heat, water, transportation, and the like for months at a time. They call it "winter."

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

So you're saying 2000 years after Pompeii we still haven't figured out that living next to a volcano is a bad idea???

The problem is that some of the most fertile ground you can find is right next to a volcano (usually, but not always). Not so important now, but it was hugely important during our agrarian days.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[ultranova]

I have to admit I'm a bit torn by this sentiment. On the one hand, yes, this is shaping up to be rather tragic. On the other, isn't this sort of thing rather avoidable by just not living there?

No. There are not enough safe areas on Earth to hold all or even the majority of the population, and even those are safe only in relation to some other area. Add the facts that the tighter you pack humans, the easier it is for plagues and such to spread, the more dependent on infrastructure they become, and the more destruction any disaster that does happen causes, and it becomes obvious that "don't live in a dangerous area" is not viable advice.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Daswolfen]

Ok... you know what.. stop beating the horse, because its dead.

Lay the blame on Ray 'Chocolate Town' Nagin and Governor Blanco. They waited less than 24 hours for a mandatory evacuation. How many city and school buses could have been used to get those out of the affected area if the evacuation would have been called at the proper time 48+ hours before? Instead the sit there and the city floods. The media, already with an intense hatred of Bush, lays blame on him. Reality is, FEMA was there

"New Orleans's emergency operations chief Terry Ebbert blamed the inadequate response on the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). "This is not a FEMA operation. I haven't seen a single FEMA guy", he said. "FEMA has been here three days, yet there is no command and control. We can send massive amounts of aid to tsunami victims, but we can't bail out the city of New Orleans."[9] At the time, the main staging area was only 6 miles away along the adjoining I-10 at the Causeway intersection, and FEMA had apparently been at the Superdome three days earlier."

Was there dropped balls on all sides? Yes. But if Nagin would have done his job, then the loss of life would have been significantly lessened.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[BobMcD]

it becomes obvious that "don't live in a dangerous area" is not viable advice

Perhaps. It could be modified a bit, however, could it not?

Perhaps "if you live in a dangerous area, be prepared to periodically evacuate and rebuild"?

Or "live in the least dangerous area possible"?

I do fundamentally disagree, however, that Alaska has become populated through necessity. There are still vast tracts of land in the lower-48 that are uninhabited. Look also at New Orleans after Katrina. The relief efforts somehow managed to find a place to park trailers that was above the water line. I saw a few photos, and didn't notice that they were all packed between skyscrapers...

The more I think about it, I'm going to need to see some numbers to support your premise that "there are not enough safe areas on Earth to hold the majority of the population". It would seem to take a very tight definition of 'safe' to make that statement true.

Again, I'm not overly concerned about hurricanes, tornadoes, and the like. Those are harder to predict. That's fair. On the other hand, floods and volcanoes are in a totally different league.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Also, Alaskans are, in general, more prepared to go without power, heat, water, transportation, and the like for months at a time. They call it "winter."

It's also known as "self-sufficiency", and it works a lot better than "government dependence", which was what was expected by too many people after Hurricane Katrina.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Agreed. I like to think how 2000 years ago, this volcano erupting would have been a sure sign that some god hated humans and was punishing them. Today, we can predict it and have taken god out of it.

These days, some people pray for god to stop events that have been predicted by science. I think that the idea of god will always be there, but that it has definitely become less influential than in the past. It's a process, it will take a while, but hopefully the idea can be banished forever in some Utopian future.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[khallow]

Hmmm, it could very well be another Katrina event. First, Anchorage at 280,000 people is about half the size of New Orleans at the time it was devastated by Katrina. Second, a considerable portion of Anchorage is on high ground (I see parts of it are hundreds of feet above sea level) so it probably won't get completely wiped by a tsunami. So similar physical damage though loss of life would be much higher.

For any Anchorage people out there, here's my take. You're at the end of a huge fjord and downhill from at least three active stratovolcanoes. You also happen to be near a very active earthquake zone that has in the past produced the second and third largest earthquakes ever measured. You don't get to say that there won't be a Katrina. The only question at this point is the frequency of events that are capable of destroying Anchorage, not whether they will happen. My take is that Anchorage probably has the worst long term disaster risk of any major city in the US.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Waffle Iron]

No. There are not enough safe areas on Earth to hold all or even the majority of the population

Sure there are. They're just not generally close enough to the trendy seashores for most people's tastes.

Today, people are actually packed tightest into the relatively small high risk areas because they have the most attractive geological features and climate.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

I'd be willing to bet that if a comet hit the earth, as you sat there slowly starving to death in the dark subzero temperatures, with your last breath you'd be ranting about how somebody is surely trying to take away your god damned guns.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[El Torico]

So you're saying 2000 years after Pompeii we still haven't figured out that living next to a volcano is a bad idea???

Well, one million Neapolitans haven't figured that out yet.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[amoeba1911]

Also, I would think Alaskans are far less likely to go around looting stores and shooting at rescue workers during an emergency.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[ultranova]

And just like Katrina, anyone too stupid to look after their own behinds and expect the government to come save them is an idiot who probably is due for a Darwinistic culling.

One of the reasons the society - whose coordination center the government is - exists in the first place is to assist people in emergencies. It is hardly unreasonable to expect it to do its job.

What shamed me as an American during Katrina wasn't the much-publicized "failure" of Bush and co. No, what disgusted me was that in a society with free public education to age 18, widespread information-distribution technology, and AMPLE transportation resources, we have apparently bred a new generation of sheep, er, Americans with no interest in helping their fellow-man, so dependent and with so little motivation that even self-preservation can't get them to lift a finger in their own interest.

Yes, of course. Fortifying in your own home rather than fleeing is clearly a sign of being deserving of Darwinistic culling. It implies sheepdom, rather than, say, carefully weighting the advantages of having shelter and being able to guard your property against post-evacuation looting against possibly - not certainly, since they are unpredictable - being out of the storm's path but losing your property and quite possibly dying from lack of food, water and shelter on the run - remember, there's hundreds of thousands of other people on the run too.

This whole "people are sheep" has become a meme repeated by people with delusions of grandeur. Ironically enough, mindlessly repeating a meme makes these people themselves the very sheep they so despise.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Fjandr]

While that is true in general, living below sea level in an area surrounded by a big wall is really, really stupid.

I'm not actually saying that people should have necessarily moved out of New Orleans before Katrina. No, the really stupid thing was people moving back to the undersea city. The only thing worse is people building houses on unstable hills in California, and there the damage is very limited in the scope of its effects on the population of the area. Massive hurricanes hit populated areas way more often than any other natural disaster, with the possible exception of fire.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[khallow]

Three things. First, the metro area of Anchorage is about a third the size of the metro area of New Orleans. So it is comparable in size. Second, most of the metropolitan area of New Orleans wasn't significantly affected by Hurricane Katrina. The real damage was caused by two or three collapsed dikes in downtown New Orleans. If they hadn't failed, then Katrina would have been just another relatively destructive hurricane. In comparison, my impression is that most of the Anchorage metro area is at risk from a tsunami. There are parts that are at high elevation, but I gather most of the city (and much of the surrounding area) is near sea level. Third, any tsunami causing event is going to give maybe a few tens of seconds of warning.

If Anchorage gets hit directly by a big tsunami, it'll probably rank among the worst volcanic disasters of history and far greater than that of Hurricane Katrina. This is something which I believe Mount Redoubt is capable of. The mountain is 9000 feet high. If a major chunk of that volcano blows north, it'll run down a valley all the way to Cook Inlet with the force directed towards Anchorage.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[mdarksbane]

The fun thing about disasters is that they come fairly randomly. Cities have been hit as hard as New Orleans was several times during our history, and many more times than that around the world. It's been just long enough in between for people to forget how to handle the things.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Nope, I'd be happily eating the food you hoarded but had nothing to defend yourself with.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

So you'd be a murderer and a thief.

Then when that stolen supply of food ran out, as you starve you'd still be foaming about people who want to take away your stupid guns. (Which you'd actually have no right to poses because you'd be a felon.)

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[FiloEleven]

This whole "people are sheep" has become a meme repeated by people with delusions of grandeur. Ironically enough, mindlessly repeating a meme makes these people themselves the very sheep they so despise.

That was an excellent statement. I have been occasionally fighting against the same meme (though in relation to political action) and I had never put together how such baseless grandstanding affects the speaker.

FWIW, though I disagree with GP's assessment of Katrina and his characterization of people, I do agree that the interest in helping our fellow citizens has waned. Perhaps the depression that's coming if we continue on our current course will reawaken a spirit of community and responsibility.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[D Ninja]

It isn't like water is some kind of super-intelligent villain. It just sort of flows downhill until it hits the ocean...

Will Superman be able to defeat...WATER MAN! This villain flows downhill, destroying everything in his path. Can the Man of Steel stand up to the great strength and force of this nemesis, or will he be all washed up? Find out in our next episode - Downhill Battle!

Yeah...I'm not really excited about that episode, either.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[DrData99]

"attractive geological features and climate"?!?!

Have you ever been to Anchorage?

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Walkingshark]

Right, Alaskans are all pure and good, not like those evil people in New Orleans who sit around all day waiting for disasters to destroy their city so they can smash and grab everything in sight. And the shooting at rescue workers thing was a myth perpetuated by people trying to sell commercials.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[BlackSnake112]

So it is up the the federal government to prepare for all natural disasters?

You do know the states are supposed to take care of that themselves, right? They (the states) can ask for additional aid but still it is on the states to take care of that. The federal people were telling LA since the 60s to fix the levees. New Orleans and the rest of LA just kept on partying. Is it bad? yes. The entire blame should not be put on the federal government like it has been. Most of it should be on the state. Each state is supposed to have its own emergency system in case of natural disasters. Hurricanes are not new. And Katrina was not the strongest storm to ever hit the US. Hell FL got hit with what 4 in the same year and no one bitched about the federal response then.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[jcr]

5) Nagin is about 3,000 miles away.

-jcr

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Darby]

It's also known as "self-sufficiency", and it works a lot better than "government dependence", which was what was expected by too many people after Hurricane Katrina.

LOL,

that's why Alaska is the queen of the welfare states. How about you start being a little bit self-sufficient and stop taking 2 dollars from me for every dollar you pay in taxes ya god damned welfare leech.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[moosesocks]

Anchorage is a fairly established city, and being near to the sea, its climate isn't terribly different from Chicago's.

Even folks from Fairbanks would balk at your comment!*

*A few of us do indeed still live "off the grid," without public utilities that many of us take for granted. The rest of the population find these people to be completely insane.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Wow. They are worse than...wait for it...Louisiana. http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/266.html#fedspend_per_taxesbystate-20071009

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[moosesocks]

Anchorage is mostly at risk for an Earthquake. The city basically got leveled by one in 1964.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Joey Vegetables]

4) Alaskans are used to being maximally self-reliant, and the rest of us would be well-advised to follow their example.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[element-o.p.]

I don't think most of us up here are too worried about it. I've lived here through Redoubt in '89, Spurr a few years later and Augustine just a couple of years ago, and none of these have been anything more than a bit of an inconvenience in Anchorage. We've had some ash fall on us, and that can certainly cause some complications, but nothing on the order of Katrina -- not even remotely close.

Where I work, we've started making plans for what it would take to shut all of our servers and network equipment down in a hurry (to protect from ash). People are stocking up on pantyhose (to use as a pre-filter for cars to keep the ash out of engines) and buying dust masks. But I don't think anyone here expects Redoubt to be the next Krakatoa or anything like that.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[element-o.p.]

Yeah...store owners would shoot back. It's not by accident that our governor lists the ability to field dress a moose as one of her qualifications ;)

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[element-o.p.]

In comparison, my impression is that most of the Anchorage metro area is at risk from a tsunami.

Negative. I've never seen it actually documented (or else I'd provide a link), but the urban legend (at least) in Anchorage is that Cook Inlet isn't conducive to tsunamis reaching the Anchorage area. Most of the water near Anchorage is pretty shallow, which you can verify for yourself by looking at Cook Inlet, Knik Arm and Turnagain Arm at low tide -- especially this time of year, when the glacial-fed rivers that empty into Knik and Turnagain arms are just barely trickling. Therefore, most of the energy of a tsunami would be dissipated before reaching Anchorage. Also, Anchorage sits on a ~100 foot high bluff. The airport elevation at Merrill Field is ~130 feet above sea level. While there are parts of Anchorage that are lower (the port and some of the area near the Coastal Trail), I suspect it would take a really large wall of water (which I already showed isn't likely) to flood most of Anchorage.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[element-o.p.]

Where would you recommend living, then? In Alaska, we have cold, volcanoes and earthquakes. Along the west coast of the lower-48 and in Hawaii, we have much the same, minus the cold. The midwest through the southeast has tornados and the gulf states have hurricanes. The east coast is already overpopulated, and also deals with the hurricanes that don't make landfall in the gulf states.

I'll take my chances with volcanoes that at least give you some warning, first.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Cally]

Yeah, that 'self-sufficiency' is really working out well, Ms. Rand...

Tucker included a terse case list of 25 households he had contacted. It read like a report from a Third World country.

"Near-middle-aged couple, family of six. The husband cried as he was talking to me. . . . ," one summary read. "He receives a very small unemployment income and is out of fuel a lot. . . . His family has been out of food for quite some time now. Their 1-year-old child is out of milk, can't get it and [the father] has no idea when he will be able to get the next can. He has been borrowing milk from anyone he can. His moose meat supply is running out. . . . The electricity has skyrocketed and he can't pay all the bills."

From a couple in their mid-30s: "He and his girlfriend have no heating fuel. Whatever money he gets goes to getting gasoline for his snow machine to get logs. . . . Today, they had nothing for breakfast. Most of the time, they have some dry fish for lunch or cup of noodles with [crackers]."

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[CrimsonAvenger]

It can't be as bad as Katrina. There are currently over 1,000,000 people in the New Orleans metro area. That's AFTER Katrina; the population of new Orleans literally dropped in half since 2000.

Umm, no. New Orleans metro area population dropped by maybe 25% since 2000. And a fair amount of that loss happened pre-Katrina, since New Orleans is basically a terrible place to live unless you're really into fine dining.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Cally]

You are more right than you thought you were.

From Wikipedia:

On 9 July 1958, a giant landslide at the head of Lituya Bay in Alaska, caused by an earthquake, generated a wave with an initial amplitude of 524m (1720 ft). This is the highest wave ever recorded, and surged over the headland opposite, stripping trees and soil down to bedrock, and surged along the fjord which forms Lituya Bay, destroying a fishing boat anchored there and killing two people. Howard Ultrich and his son managed to ride the wave in their boat, and both survived.

Plus 100 points for what must have been the most amazing point break ever caught, but minus several million for bowel-liquifying terror.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[CrimsonAvenger]

Also, I would think Alaskans are far less likely to go around looting stores and shooting at rescue workers during an emergency.

A modern myth. Ever notice that in all those news stories about looting in New Orleans after Katrina, they showed the same footage? And most of the tales of someone shooting at a rescue worker were told third or fourth hand. Like the fairy tales about rape and murder in the Superdome....

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

It's probably based on the 1964 Alaska earthquake, which was HUGE (~3rd largest earthquake ever measured), but Anchorage did not experience tsunami damage from it. Whether this is due to the geometry of the marine basin in front of the city (as you suggest) or because of the exact motion that occurred during this earthquake or the location of it, I don't know. It did generate a major tsunami elsewhere, but the epicentre was on the other side of the Seward Peninsula, which makes me suspect it was just the location. An event in Cook Inlet could be a completely different story.

That being said, Anchorage was pretty badly trashed during the 1964 earthquake for other reasons (shaking damage to buildings, uplift and subsidence, and landslides). It's not a low risk area in terms of geological risks, but you're probably right that a tsunami from a Mt. Redoubt eruption isn't likely. It's a long way to the sea, and most lahars would probably be pretty weak by the time they got there. It also looks too far away for a sector collapse to reach the inlet.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[black_lbi]

[...] or use a system of tubes [...]

How could you possibly use internet against floods?

I suggest a firewall.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[ari_j]

The day that Chicago made the national news for having a wind chill of -40F, just a couple weeks ago, the temperature here was -44F without any wind factored in. Some places within 150 miles of me were colder still. I did an active search for anywhere colder. Barrow, AK; Alert, Nunavut; and Svalbard, Norway were all at least 35 degrees warmer.

That said, I didn't RTFA. Is Anchorage in line for a direct hit from the fallout of this volcano? They still prepare for winter better than Chicago does, because climate to the side, they are more isolated from supply lines.

Either way, I did operate on the assumption that Alaskans are, in general, prepared for winter on a level similar to us North Dakotans. I may have assumed incorrectly, and if so I apologize. I was only trying to give Alaskans the benefit of the doubt of not being "cityots." Let's pave the road to hell with my good intentions, why not. ;)

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Ah, the self-righteous SOB known as Darby...

Yeah, that is why we raped, looted and pillaged after the 64 quake like they did in NO. Oh, wait, we didn't.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[RodgerDodger]

You do know that the last couple of hurricanes to get in the area did result in mandatory evacuation more than 48 hours in advance, which did result in looting and other activities done by individuals lifting a finger (and other peoples property) in their own interest, right?

You also know that the previous evacuation saw a significant number of people refuse to leave, due to fears that their homes would be looted and the hurricane would miss, right?

You also know that if the dykes hadn't failed - a contingency that nobody was ready for - the smartest thing to do in the hurricane was sit it out, right?

And finally - you know the biggest impediment to evacuation afterwards, when it was clear the dykes were going to fail, was the massive traffic jams caused by individuals fleeing by car rather than waiting to be organized into convoys with decent traffic control, right? The problem wasn't "not enough transportation", but rather "too much, doing stupid stuff".

Oh wait - silly me. I'm guessing you don't know that (or much else)

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Tenebrousedge]

The Alaskan Bush is for all intents and purposes a third world country, and an inaccessible, harsh, and unforgiving one at that. What that article is describing is the result of Native peoples discarding the lifestyles that sustained them for thousands of years.

If you're going to live in the Bush, adopt sustainable living methods. Hunt, fish, farm, use renewable power or do without. You don't need a goddamn snowmachine, or milk, or heating oil, or even much in the way of money.

If you're going to want a lifestyle that includes snowmachines, oil, and nonrenewable power sources, don't do it in one of the harshest and most isolated places on the planet.

I live in rural Alaska, and I know plenty of people that live off the grid, in similar conditions to those shmucks described in that article. I can say authoritatively that if those people are starving, they have no one else to blame except themselves.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Tenebrousedge]

Yes, but he went to Fairbanks first.

Fairbanks can most aptly be described as a cross between Cocytus and a demilitarized zone. Anchorage, by comparison, is a charming, balmy seaside metropolis.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Tenebrousedge]

Anchorage was fairly well leveled by the 1964 Earthquake. If anything should be compared to Katrina, it should be that event. In terms of destructive power, this estimate of Katrina's moment magnitude gives the impression that the two events were within an order of magnitude of each other (Katrina 8.8, 1964 quake 9.2). Anchorage suffered fewer deaths despite there not being much in the way of aid available.

Since the 1964 quake, most structures are built to withstand strong earthquakes. On a quick google search, I see many newspaper articles from last year talking about how the levees are still not safe enough. I think I'd rather put my money on Anchorage.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Heck of a job Daswolfenie!

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Have to love how easy it is to taunt idiots like you!

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Anonymous Coward]

Sure there are. They're just not generally close enough to the trendy seashores for most people's tastes.

Yeah, there's plenty of space in tornado alley...

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[evilviper]

Sure there are. They're just not generally close enough to the trendy seashores for most people's tastes.

Point to them. I'll be happy to tell you why you're so utterly wrong.

I don't believe there's enough safe area on earth for 1/10th the current population. And guess what? Areas that are very "safe" when sparsely populated, become extremely dangerous when developed into densely packed cities. Witness: Los Angeles.

For all the hysteria about the hurricane season on the coasts that kill a dozen people each year, the hundreds that die in the north from freezing cold, snow and ice storms go almost completely unreported, unless the newscasters feel like laughing at the "funny" video of cars sliding over the roads. And in the non-coastal areas of the south have tornadoes to contend with. Of course that's US-centric, but all geographical areas have their trade-offs, and natural disasters, that you just have to hope don't occur in your particular area, within your lifetime.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Waffle Iron]

For all the hysteria about the hurricane season on the coasts that kill a dozen people each year, the hundreds that die in the north from freezing cold, snow and ice storms go almost completely unreported,

In both of those cases, the majority of casualties are those who foolishly don't take a few basic precautions in the face of weather warnings. The difference is that in a hurricane zone dozens of counties can have a significant chunk of their real estate wiped off the map in one single event. Most peoples lives in the region are totally disrupted and it takes many years to recover.

Moreover, the winter weather warning is: "stay in your house tonight". No big deal. The hurricane warning is: "Cram your family in the car, drive 200 miles in gridlock and hole up in a hotel for half a week." That sucks.

Witness: Los Angeles.

When the "big one" hits Los Angeles without warning, then you'll really witness something that wasn't a safe place to begin with. It wasn't safe when it was sparsely populated because people built a lot of unreinforced masonry structures. It's actually a little bit safer now with more modern building codes.

Not to mention the tsunami risk they face if a even a tiny asteroid hits anywhere in the Pacific ocean or there's a large undersea landslide or earthquake in the right spot. All of these things potentially dwarf the murder rate you seem to be hinting at.

And in the non-coastal areas of the south have tornadoes to contend with.

That's unfortunately true, but these days with a tornado you usually have enough warning to take cover, and even in the worst case you can walk a hundred yards or so to return to normalcy after the event. Volcanoes, hurricanes, tsunamis and earthquakes can all potentially turn an entire region into a nightmare for weeks, while causing orders of magnitude more damage than any tornado could.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[wurble]

I said the population of New Orleans dropped by a half, not that the metro area dropped by that much.

Population of New Orleans in 2000: 484,674
Population of New Orleans in 2006: 223,388

The metro area CURRENTLY has slightly over 1,000,000

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[khallow]

Hope you're right. The real question though would be how deep Cook Inlet is where the landslide would get dumped. A landslide induced tsunami (especially one induced by a good portion of a 9000 foot volcano losing much of its top) can be one to two orders of magnitude larger in height than an earthquake induced tsunami. But there needs to be enough water there for that to happen. My take is that in the southern part of the Inlet, there probably is enough water.

The shallowness of Cook Inlet around Anchorage isn't going to help much to weaken an oncoming tsunami. The bluff is going to help a lot, but from a glance at Google maps (which I did before I posted the first time), indicates that the densest parts of the city (and a good portion of the city overall) aren't on those bluffs. Doesn't mean this disaster scenario is anything more than a remote possibility, but you haven't told me anything that really changes my opinion. Finally, keep in mind that Anchorage doesn't have much of a geological record to help us decide one way or another. Recent glacier activity (within say 10-20k years) scrubbed most of that away. Makes it particularly hard to figure out what the dangers are.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[khallow]

Anchorage is at least five times larger now and much more dense. Plus, it didn't experience tsunami in the last earthquake. Someone was claiming that was because Cook Inlet has a geometry which prevents tsunami from forming, I think it's more just a quirk of the earthquake.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[evilviper]

Moreover, the winter weather warning is: "stay in your house tonight". No big deal. The hurricane warning is: "Cram your family in the car, drive 200 miles in gridlock and hole up in a hotel for half a week." That sucks.

Absolutely not. You'd have to hole-up in your house for weeks, perhaps months, to avoid the HUGE risk of driving on ice. Hell, even WALKING on ice is pretty damn dangerous. The death toll from one year of winter weather alone will outstrip a decade worth of hurricanes.

even in the worst case you can walk a hundred yards or so to return to normalcy after the event.

That's completely untrue. Entire cities are often devastated by tornadoes. With wind speeds more than twice that of the strongest hurricanes, the debris spreads over a very wide area, and does severe damage for dozens of miles around.

Again, the only reason tornadoes don't kill a vastly larger number of people, and do billions of dollars in property damage, are simply because the affected areas are so sparsely populated that some don't come within a hundred miles of the nearest human, and others only cross the edge of some town, in the middle of some large swath of vacant land.

When the "big one" hits Los Angeles without warning, then you'll really witness something that wasn't a safe place to begin with.

It wasn't safe when it was sparsely populated because people built a lot of unreinforced masonry structures. It's actually a little bit safer now with more modern building codes.

It would be exceedingly safe with a rural population. An un-reinforced building, nowhere near a fault line, has little to worry about. Now that buildings and bridges are reinforced, per-capita, it may be safer, but that still means a very, very large number of deaths.

If you want proof, just look up and compare the Landers quake with the Northridge quake. Funny how the much larger quake killed essentially no-one (I refuse to count heart attacks).

Not to mention the tsunami risk they face if a even a tiny asteroid hits anywhere in the Pacific ocean or there's a large undersea landslide or earthquake in the right spot.

At an elevation of 200+ feet, it would require a hell of a tidal wave to damage anything more than the relatively small percentage of beachfront areas.

All of these things potentially dwarf the murder rate you seem to be hinting at.

I wasn't referring to murder at all. Try mudslides, forest fires, extensive flooding due to urban runoff, earthquakes as mentioned above, etc.

Traffic accidents should also be considered, as inclement weather (fog, ice, whatever) are only minimally dangerous until combined with high-speed vehicles. But being unable to see the road won't likely kill anyone, unless there is traffic

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[Waffle Iron]

You'd have to hole-up in your house for weeks, perhaps months, to avoid the HUGE risk of driving on ice.

I take it you've never been up north. Road ice is usually cleared within a day or two of any storm. They have these things called plows and salt trucks. During any given winter, only a handful of days are genuinely dangerous for travel.

With wind speeds more than twice that of the strongest hurricanes, the debris spreads over a very wide area, and does severe damage for dozens of miles around.

I take it you've never been in a tornado zone. These storms travel in a geometric pattern called a line. If you walk perpendicular to said line, you'll be out of the damage zone within a minute or two. Even the most rare, largest tornadoes leave a swath not much more than a mile wide.

At an elevation of 200+ feet, it would require a hell of a tidal wave to damage anything more than the relatively small percentage of beachfront areas.

That's what you get with asteroids: Monster waves hundreds of feet high.

Re:Let's work to avoid another "Katrina"

[evilviper]

I take it you've never been up north.

You take it wrong. I lived in Wisconsin, of all places.

Road ice is usually cleared within a day or two of any storm.

I'd like to know where YOU live, that you can go through winter with all the snow and ice confined to just a few days of the year. In most places, it's a near continual process, and there's ice on the roads very nearly EVERY DAY.

It snows, the snow melts, it re-freezes into ice, and you have a fun surprise on your drive to work.

Even if it was confined to a few days, where do you work that you get to just take a day off after every storm?

I take it you've never been in a tornado zone. These storms travel in a geometric pattern called a line.

You couldn't be more wrong. I've spent plenty of time in Oklahoma, and still regularly visit relatives there. I've seen the aftermath of several tornadoes. I don't know where you get your information, but it's a complete fairy tail.

Yes, the tornado isn't very wide... but as soon as it picks up a car, destroys a house, etc., the debris it picks up goes for MILES, and does SEVERE damage to ALL the surrounding areas.

That's what you get with asteroids: Monster waves hundreds of feet high.

Yes. And the odds of that occurring are so close as to be indistinguishable from ZERO.

If you're advocating living somewhere that the death and destruction is much larger, but simply spread out so it doesn't LOOK quite as bad, just say so. So far, you couldn't have made a less compelling point that the frozen north is safe, while anywhere near the oceans is horribly dangerous.

Re:Sarah Palin an expert in geology and vulcanolog

[MadMidnightBomber]

Score 2, Flamebait? Boy is someone still sore about the election.

Server Unresponsive

[cdrudge]

The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive.

The server's unresponsive, but damn it we're still going to link to it. If it had any chance at all to recover, we're going to make sure it stays down for the count. What did the machine do to piss off the slashdot editor?

Re:Server Unresponsive

[mysticgoat]

Oh yeah! And let's be sure to add redundant links, just in case somebody doesn't recognize that they missed their first chance to contribute to the problem.

I'll help out too: Alaska Volcano Observatory

Re:Server Unresponsive

[mysticgoat]

I've got one word to say to whoever modded parent post as "troll":

Woosh!

Things like this...

[BobMcD]

...remind me to call my mom, kiss my wife, and hug my kids. If this volcano blows, people in Alaska are going to have a really bad time. Additionally if the big one under the Rockies goes up (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellowstone_caldera), we're ALL going to die.

And its overdue. And it is moving. Yeah!

To be fair, no respectable person seems to think it is going to happen any time soon, but it still serves as a gentle reminder of how fragile everything we hold dear truly is...

Re:Things like this...

[Cowmonaut]

It'll suck when Yellowstone blows. Pretty much everyone in Montana, Idaho, the western half of Washington and Oregon, North East Nevada, Wyoming, and North West Colorado is dead inside a week just from the dust cloud. Let's not forget to mention the people within the rather large blast zone that will die during the eruption itself. 7 months or so down the way, the world is in volcanic winter and the average temperature drops about 15 degrees Celsius.

Even better, the overdue earthquake in the Cascadia Subduction Zone is expected to be greater than 9.0 It'll cause a tsunami to hit the western seaboard of the US and Canada, from British Columbia down to the northern half of California. It hits the coast at over 700 feet within 15 minutes of the earthquake too. Pretty much everything 10-20 miles in is gone too, which is a lot of people and property.

Why mention the subduction zone? Well, there's been more recent evidence that earthquakes cause far reaching effects with volcanoes, and Yellowstone specifically. Since I live in WA, just south of St Helens, it makes me nervous to think that scientists think that the Tsunami and Yellowstone are real threats that will happen within the next 100, 150 years. It'll pretty much smite America, and WA and OR won't be in shape to take care of themselves. The likely global war over food or alternative collapse of society help the story I'm writing, but are kind of bleak potential futures we have waiting for us soon.

Re:Things like this...

[BobMcD]

The likely global war over food or alternative collapse of society help the story I'm writing, but are kind of bleak potential futures we have waiting for us soon.

That's kind of how I see it playing out for us as well. Without the Midwest as a viable source of food for several decades, North America will probably go to war.

Re:Things like this...

[captainClassLoader]

It will "suck when Yellowstone blows" in the same way that it will suck if an asteroid a couple of hundred meters in diameter hits Earth. The Lost Creek eruption of ~630K years ago put about a half meter of so of ash over about 2/3rds of what is now the US. Reference and maps here

Re:Things like this...

[Anonymous Coward]

The subduction zone seems to pop about every 500-800 years on average, so it certainly seems possible that it could happen in the next 150. The Yellowstone volcano on the other hand has gone 3 times in the last 2+ million. Granted, the most recent was 630,000 years ago, but it seems that the likely time won't be put into a range as tight as 100-150 years.

Re:Things like this...

[element-o.p.]

If this volcano blows, people in Alaska are going to have a really bad time.

I doubt it. Redoubt blew 20 years ago, and was no big deal. Spurr blew a few years later ('92, IIRC) and was no big deal. Augustine started steaming a few years ago and was no big deal. I haven't heard anything from AVO to suggest that Redoubt's repeat engagement will be any different.

Re:Things like this...

[Cally]

It'll suck when Yellowstone blows.

So, they'll cancel each other out, right?

Pretty much everyone in Montana, Idaho, the western half of Washington and Oregon, North East Nevada, Wyoming, and North West Colorado is dead inside a week just from the dust cloud.

Bonus!!1 !

By the way, are you familiar with the writings of Dimitri Orlov?

We need practice at this

[Nautical Insanity]

Because evacuations, preparations, and repair related to this volcano are going to be nothing compared to what will be needed when geologists start warning us that Yellowstone is about to blow.

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[MasterOfMagic]

Wow, is that the best the dittoheads can come up with? I think Rush was much more comical and insightful on drugs.

Yellowstone

[Anonymous Coward]

The biggest problem with the Yellowstone supervolcano would be the large amounts of ash ejected REALLY high into the atmosphere and across large portions of the US as well due to the high pressure eruption.

The prudent thing would be to place tactical nuclear warheads in deep wells around the entire perimeter of the magma chamber, and if it begins erupting, to crack the whole top at once. The area around Yellowstone will be destroyed, but the outlet for the pressure will be so large, far less ash is going to be ejected far lower in the atmosphere. We may even be able to avoid a massive drop in global temperatures, and crop failures that would otherwise kill a billion people.

P.S. Had to post as Anon as I moderated some totally unrelated posts.

Meuge

Re:Yellowstone

[Anonymous Coward]

Techniques like the parent's suggestion have been studied and are being studied. One problem is the complexity of the bedrock, etc. To figure out how to do this properly, you'd need a fairly deep set of cores taken across Yellowstone... at, oh, 10m grid. That's an incredibly expensive thing to do (and no, GPR doesn't get around the problem). One of the outcomes of such a study is, plausibly, that there is no viable mitigation. Given the cost - which would be a pretty chunk of GDP - it's probably better to focus on more predictable areas of risk mitigation.

Sitting here in Anchorage right now 'preparing'

[lukej]

If you mean by preparing, drinking some morning tea, and playing with my iPhone.

OBLG: BSG

[powerlord]

And its overdue. And it is moving.

... and it has a plan.

Re:OBLG: BSG

[hansamurai]

And then you find out, it really doesn't... but you still watch because in some ways, it's still entertaining.

The Road

[agnosticanarch]

And to think, right now Hollywood is wasting time making a movie based on The Road when pretty soon we'll all be living it! Better get that bathwater started...

~AA

Overloaded and unresponsive

[Dibblah]

"The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive. "

.... Okay. And just in case it wasn't busy enough, HERE'S THE LINK!

Nice way to empathize, /. submitter.

Think of the polar bears!!!

[belligerent0001]

Come on people we are loosing our perspective here....First the polar bears loose their ice flows only to then be coated in gray ash! how will they ever survive this? And because they no longer have ice flows to hunt from, most of them have taken on land based jobs. If the volcano REALLY blows it's top this could spark a fairly localized volcanic winter and these poor bears, who have taken it upon themselves to hunt from land will be force, once again to hunt from ice flows....HOLY SHIT people. We can not ask these bears to do this (as they have since the beginning of time)
On a more serious note did anyone catch new '78 like weather in the midwest? wasn't that about the same time period that the climatologist of the day were running around with their hair on fire spouting global cooling? Just checking...

Re:Think of the polar bears!!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Is this satire or our you serious? If you are serious, you need to check your facts. If you're trying to be funny, it's not working.

AVO already overloaded, now Slashdot!?

[twistah]

"The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive."

And so then you felt the best thing to do was to link to it from /.? This is a public safety resource that probably doesn't need the extra traffic right now.

Re:AVO already overloaded, now Slashdot!?

[u38cg]

Happily, they have done the sensible thing and replaced it with a single static HTML page. The tl;dr version is "Nothing happened yet, might happen later".

Unnecesary link

[stm2]

This is not Microsoft website in the day of the "slammer", this is a public service in an emergency, I think it would be wise to remove the link.

Re:Unnecesary link

[Anonymous Coward]

Please mod parent up, and remove the link.

nobody can stop the Ash

[rarel]

Shop smart, shop S-MART!

Sounds scary

[david@ecsd.com]

You betcha!

abrasive particulate -- moon dust testing?

[Luyseyal]

Hrm. If it is possible to collect the particulate and magnetize it, it could be useful for testing future moon equipment.

-l

That's what a "government" is for

[Moraelin]

Sad to break this to you, but humans usually _organize_ for this kind of thing, so it doesn't become a matter of individual people helping individual people. There are a lot of things which just don't scale if done that way.

E.g.,

- It's more efficient and a better use of everyone's resources to have a tiny fraction of the population as cops, than to have each person stand guard with a shotgun on their own property 27/7. The former lets you actually, say, go to work and leave that home unattended.

- It's more efficient to have a few doctors, than have everyone learn to treat their own wounds and illnesses,

- It's more efficient to have an insurance spread the risk and cost, than have everyone save for the freak case that an airplane falls on their roof, they run their car into a tree, _and_ get a MRSA infection in the resulting fractures

- It's more efficient to have some consumer laws and organizations, than have everyone spend countless hours and effort running the EULA for every single pencil, second-hand car, and party hat by a lawyer to be sure they haven't sold their firstborn into slavery in clause 255 on page 100 of the small print,

Etc.

Just like making shoes for a hundred million people ends up cheaper and more efficient that each of those people each raising their own pig/cow/whatever, personally tanning its hide, and sewing their own shoes.

People organize so a centralized group can do some things cheaper and more efficient than in an every-man-for-himself world. _That's why we have governments (local, federal, whatever), agencies like the FEMA, etc. That's their job.

And the fact that you're so quick to dismiss their responsibility and blame it on the victims... well, maybe _that_ idiocy is proof of what's wrong with education.

Re:That's what a "government" is for

[rev_g33k_101]

All of what you said still dose not change the fact that if a car is speeding towards you the best course of action is to get out of the way, not wait for somebody to come scoop you out of the path of danger.

The first point of fail in Katrina was the individual people not thinking "oh shit! I should get out of the way", then it falls on the Town, then the Parrish, and so on up the chain.

Re:That's what a "government" is for

[saider]

That is all well and good, but what do you do when the police don't show up for work and the hospital is flooded out? When it comes to preparing for disasters, you need more self reliance than under normal circumstances because the authorities will have their hands full with recovery efforts.

This is why you need to be able to feed yourself, defend yourself, and heal yourself and otherwise manage your own affairs until the situation returns to normal. If you are unprepared to do this, you leave yourself at the mercy of the situation.

Re:That's what a "government" is for

[ShakaUVM]

>>And the fact that you're so quick to dismiss their responsibility and blame it on the victims... well, maybe _that_ idiocy is proof of what's wrong with education.

As one of the Victims of Katrina said (on NPR). "Don't call us victims! If you have to call us anything, call us... heroes!"

That's part of the problem. You get your house flooded, that qualifies you to be a hero these days?

Actually, Katrina was very instructive on a number of different fronts. As the GP said, the people of New Orleans acted like idiots. You also had Mayor "Chocolate Factory" Nagin acting like a criminal idiot, refusing to release school buses for evacuation, AS PER HIS CITY'S EVACUATION PLAN. And then, yeah, you also had FEMA acting like idiots.

But since only the behavior of FEMA could plausibly be blamed on Bush, FEMA was the focus. That, and racism:

Mayor Nagin: "[T]he more I think about it, definitely race played into this. If it's race, fine, let's call a spade a spade, a diamond a diamond. We can never let this happen again. Even if you hate black people and you are in a leadership position, this did not help anybody."

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[gEvil (beta)]

Sorry, after three weeks of Change I think I might have been better off with moose gurl.

Yup, sounds like a Republican. He isn't even aware that Obama's only been in charge for just over a week. I always get the feeling that Republicans were the ones who failed their 7th grade Civics classes.

Montserrat

[ConanG]

I was sailing near Montserrat during the June '97 eruption. I didn't hear it, but I could definitely smell the sulfur. The skies gradually turned dark over the course of days and remained that way for quite a while. I remember thinking it was pretty cool until I found out how devastating it was to the people living there. 19 lost their lives.

I've also seen Etna (at NAS Sigonella from 15 miles), St. Helens (recent minor eruptions), and Kilauea (March '08 explosions). I've seen magma from Etna and Kiluea.

Kilauea is the most spectacular, in my opinion. Especially watching the magma enter the ocean. There was a massive amount of Vog in March and April all around the Big Island. I was able to clearly see the observatories atop Mauna Kea from Hilo before the explosions, but not after (I left in early May).

I was there for the last one

[ATestR]

I lived in Anchorage the last time there was an eruption, back in the 80's. It did scatter some ash, but not a whole lot, that far away. Mostly it was a matter of brushing the crap off your car so it wouldn't scratch the paint.

Wouldn't want to be much closer to it though... I could imagine what a foot of ash would be like.

Think of the Airlines as Well.

[BigAssRat]

This takes me back to 1989 when I was supposed to be taking a MAC flight from L.A. to Seoul, South Korea. Because the eruption occurred a day or two before my flight was suppose to take off they had to cancel the flight. We were told that all routes were diverted because the MAC flight before the one I was supposed to be on experienced a sudden loss of altitude due to the ash in the air

So instead I ended up in lay-over status for 3 days, in a crappy hotel outside of LAX, waiting for a commercial flight to Seoul. I guess I won out in the end, instead of a 24 - 36 (I could never get a final answer to the actual flight time) hour military plane hop I got to fly on a commercial flight for 15, or so, hours.

I wonder what kind of plans or route diversions they are making for military and commercial flights right now?

Re:Think of the Airlines as Well.

[srussia]

I wonder what kind of plans or route diversions they are making for military and commercial flights right now?

The particulate has jagged edges and has been used as an industrial abrasive. 'They use this to polish all kinds of metals,'

So I'm guessing American Airlines will be routing their whole fleet right over it for a free polish!

Re:Think of the Airlines as Well.

[onedobb]

No, You got it all wrong. Northwest is going to fly their whole feet over it so they don't need to spend the money to strip all the paint off of their fleet to change them all over to Delta.

One chance to stop the eruption!

[kheldan]

Volcano God unhappy! Bind and gag Sarah Palin and throw her in, then everything will be OK!
..seriously, it's a win-win situation for everyone. ;-)

Re:One chance to stop the eruption!

[Cally]

...except the volcono! The poor thing...

Re:One chance to stop the eruption!

[Dystopian Rebel]

Volcano God unhappy! Bind and gag Sarah Palin and throw her in, then everything will be OK! ..seriously, it's a win-win situation for everyone. ;-)

I believe it is also the plot of the sequel to "Nalin Palin".

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[Hork_Monkey]

For better or worse, it looked to me that he's been dictating policy since the election was over. While he's only been officially in charge for a week, I don't know of another instance of history where a president elect was more powerful.

Eruption Theme Song

[Hoi Polloi]

At least you will have a theme song to play during the eruption.

Re:Eruption Theme Song

[Anonymous Coward]

there are no lyrics to eruption... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eruption_(song)

Re:Sarah Palin an expert in geology and vulcanolog

[tuxgeek]

I saw that too
And yet another Flamebait observation:
The republican trolls are having a field day here modding down all the funny and/or insightful posts today.
Too many trolls with mod points I'd say ...

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[khallow]

Obama is so bad that one week seems like three. *rolls eyes*

Stopping lava

[Petronius Arbiter]

The Sicilians have been partially successfully stopping lava from Etna for centuries. The bishop in Catania was ordering buildings torn down to stop an eruption in the 1680s IIRC. It's imperfect since the lava is massive, heavy, and coming downhill at you. But you can do a little. More recently in the eruption in 2002 or so, I believe that bulldozers and water were used. This was uphill a lot, not near Catania.

In the 1680s case, the townspeople then went uphill to try to break a lava tube, since they knew even then that the lava tubes enabled the lava to travel so far. However, that enraged the residents of the next town over, who thought that they might be the new recipients of the diverted lava.

Re:Stopping lava

[Cally]

Again, though, that's silica rich "treacley rivers of fire" type lava[1], not the "vaporise the upper 500m of the freaking mountain & blow it into the stratosphere" type. With the latter, the only way to win the game is not to take part. [1] Rock stars don't shoot videos on explosive volcanos. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=256wgwz-sTw

Re:Stopping lava

[OVDoobie]

Video is not available in my country, wtf Youtube...

Re:Stopping lava

[Cally]

This one might work? http://www.spiritualized.com/admissions/videography/out-of-sight/

Re:MOD PARENT DOWN.

[Anonymous Coward]

I'll mod him down, right after I post this. I just hope that the active volcano that I too live on doesn't blow before I ca#@$#@%$NO CARRIER

Re:MOD PARENT DOWN.

[elrous0]

I bet your friends just love it when you come to the comedy club with them.

Pre-slashdot effect

[messner_007]

It is a pre-slashdot effect.

Types of volcano

[rubato]

Volcanoes 101.

There are three basic types of volcano, based on the composition of the magma.

Basaltic. Heaviest magma. Eruptions produce thick, slow, lava flows. Most beautiful, least dangerous. examples: Hawaii (Mauna Loa).

Andesitic. Lighter magma of mixed composition. Eruptions are explosive; much more dangerous. West coast of North America (Mt. St. Helens, Mt. Redoubt)

Rhyolitic. Lightest magma. Eruptions can be cataclysmic. Most dangerous; if you live within 1000 miles of a big eruption, you can kiss your ass goodbye. (Yellowstone, most volcanoes in New Zealand.)

One thing we learned while on an Earthwatch volcano-monitoring expedition some years ago is that there are no "dead" volcanoes. We are merely talking in those cases about extremely long between-eruption periods, which can be millions of years.

Re:MOD PARENT DOWN.

[Captain Splendid]

Wow. Someone got piss instead of milk in their cornflakes this morning.

In other seismic news,..

[Cally]

looks like Ballmer's been reading MiniMicrosoft :>

pansys...

[akboss]

I live across from Redoubt.

There are another 12 active volcanos in the area.

There is the valley of ten thousand smokes which is a super volcano (Katmia)there also.

I have been through several of these since '75. Augustine (three times) Redoubt (now the third time) Spurr, so it isnt anything special.

It does however give me a chance to sit on the beach and video tape the event hopefully.

So nothing to see here, go back to your wimpy ice storms and snow while we Alaskans handle the real manly stuff ...ok...

There there now nothing to be frightened of...just a little volcano farting....

Re:pansys...

[MarkvW]

Good luck to you. I hope that your risk assessment, based on 'human time,' isn't overridden by a powerful volcanic incident, occurring in geologic time.

Re:pansys...

[TFloore]

Okay, you are

real manly

But perhaps not terribly consistent.

Why would you

video tape the event

if there is

nothing to see here

.

Aside from a cool volcanic eruption, what am I missing?

Re:pansys...

[jonfr]

You can hope that the volcano does not blow it self up (caldera formation). As sometimes happens with this type of volcanoes.

Re:pansys...

[JDevers]

You know, the area I live in that got nailed by an ice storm is also a major tornado target. So while you get nice and predictable (the eruptions aren't, but we've known those volcanoes were present for a LONG time) major damage producers we get massively unpredictable minor to medium damage producers. It all washes out in the end. Of course all the Alaskans I know can drink me under the table, so I guess you still win (I do have an Australian friend that can drink everyone I have ever met under the table, but he is also a rather large person).

Re:pansys...

[LynnwoodRooster]

Dude, for the Youtube ratings! Duh...

Re:pansys...

[troll8901]

(caldera formation)

(Resisting urge to make lame joke on Linux lawsuits...)

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[Anonymous Coward]

Not only are you stupid, you can't even spell President.
Give the man some time. It took the republican congress, with dubya's help, 8 years to crash the entire global economy. The damage isn't going to be undone in a day.

"There is no limit as to how bad things can get."
So on the positive side, we all should be grateful that America was able to kick most of the worst republicans out of office last November. Had the republicans stolen another election, who knows, another 4 years would have sent the entire human race back to living in caves and resorting to cannibalism to survive.

Back up and running

[Anonymous Coward]

It looks like they have a minimal server back up and running on the linked site.

"AVO's website has been overwhelmed with traffic this morning because of extensive national news coverage. A backup, low-bandwidth webserver is operating with limited information."

Let me know when /. equates to extensive national news coverage.

Re:MOD PARENT DOWN.

[Vectronic]

maybe they drop bits as the frequency fades, what was ABCDEF, becomes !"#$%&, etc... then not enough to interpret as a char, then NO CARRIER/SIGNAL LOST...etc...

Re:MOD PARENT DOWN.

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe pressing other key combinations will A_344bscS;'l@Q^D

Connection to host lost.

God send

[Anonymous Coward]

Sure,all that abrasive ash sounds bad, but it's a god send for all the smokers out there who need their lungs "scrubbed" of tar

Alaska Volcano Observatory website

[revlayle]

(yes, redundant, but worth posting again)

"The server for the Alaska Volcano Observatory appears to be overloaded and is unresponsive."

QUIT FREAKING LINKING TO IT IN THE SUMMARY

flying may be curtailed

[peter303]

Volcanic ash is almost as bad geese for airplane engines and for visibility. Both commercial jets and bush planes. The latter is a necessity in some parts of Alaska.

Some Geographic Perspective

[golden.radish]

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&msa=0&msid=100265160767669824996.000461b5f81c6c092e535&t=h&z=8 Hello, Anchorage!

Ahh Alaska...

[Anonymous Coward]

America's other Texas...

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, just look at this terrible deficit we're in! And what the hell is going on in Iraq!? Why are we even there?

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[tuxgeek]

"Obama is so bad that one week seems like three."
Really? What evidence do you have of this?
Anything that sticks out in your mind, or just repeating political opinions you hear on fox news corp?

Is his administration any worse than that of bush's and all the convicted felons that he surrounded himself with?
You certainly can't consider them as model citizens.

Re:Sarah Palin an expert in geology and vulcanolog

[moosesocks]

Have you read the comments on any of the political stories lately?

Make a joke, ask for Obama's impeachment, and watch it get modded to +5 Insightful.

Regardless of your political leanings, the current state of political discourse and debate is absolutely shameful.

The analogy holds, whether it's overused or not

[argStyopa]

Ever work with sheep?

They're the stupidest creatures on God's earth, except (perhaps) domestic turkeys.

In a burning building? They don't leave. Rest of the flock is walking into a gully (essentially, off a small cliff)...just follow along. Oh, and when they get into said trouble, they tend to BLEAT WILDLY.

I use the comparison in PRECISELY this sense.

When every news station is saying "CATEGORY 5 HURRICANE APPROACHING" and (in the first place) I live BELOW SEA LEVEL, I don't think it's extraordinarily insightful thinking that's required to evacuate.

I was in no sense advocating the sort of 'survivalist' approach you seemed to read into my post. What I was pointing at was entire neighborhoods (it seemed to be groupthink, from this outsider's view) disregarding warnings until it was well past too late, then complaining about the circumstances their idiocy left them in. The barrage of looting that took place suggests that any rational calculus that took place was based on a HOPEFUL breakdown of the rule of law and amoral opportunism, more than anything.

Yes, perhaps the "American People are Sheep" analogy is overused. This doesn't make it wrong (cf. Congressional Re-election Rates). Simply because something is distasteful isn't in itself a criticism of its utility.

Re:The analogy holds, whether it's overused or not

[ultranova]

When every news station is saying "CATEGORY 5 HURRICANE APPROACHING" and (in the first place) I live BELOW SEA LEVEL, I don't think it's extraordinarily insightful thinking that's required to evacuate.

There's a category 5 hurricane approaching and will hit in a few days. There's at least a million people attempting to flee to safety, which means that there's not only a gridlock of traffick but also a shortage of housing and other resources in nearby areas. Given this, there's no guarantee that fleeing will actually get me out of the storm's way, and even if it does, that I can get food and water while in evacuation. Furthermore, I risk losing all my earthly possessions in the aftermath if I'm not home to defend them. I live below sea level, but there's a dam and a pump system between me and it, both which are designed to take a storm. Finally, the act of fleeing will, even in the best case, severely strain my financial resources.

We know that the dam and the pumps failed and the city flooded, but the people staying in only knew that it might happen. Fleeing was a risk, staying was a risk; and no matter how insightful you are, you can still guess wrong.

I was in no sense advocating the sort of 'survivalist' approach you seemed to read into my post.

It's kinda hard to not read it into a comment about "Darwinistic culling".

What I was pointing at was entire neighborhoods (it seemed to be groupthink, from this outsider's view) disregarding warnings until it was well past too late, then complaining about the circumstances their idiocy left them in.

In a crisis, it makes sense to stay with your friends and neighbours, since they are more likely to help you than total strangers. This is likely the reason why the phenomenon of groupthink evolved in the first place; in this particular instance, it was entirely appropriate. And, again, it is not idiocy to guess wrong.p>

The barrage of looting that took place suggests that any rational calculus that took place was based on a HOPEFUL breakdown of the rule of law and amoral opportunism, more than anything.

The barrage of looting lends further credence to the "defend your home" argument for staying.

Yes, perhaps the "American People are Sheep" analogy is overused. This doesn't make it wrong (cf. Congressional Re-election Rates). Simply because something is distasteful isn't in itself a criticism of its utility.

It's not just distasteful, it's also a bastard child of true scotsman, appeal to emotion and appeal to ridicule fallacies: only a sheep would do something I don't like, so if you do it, you are a sheep. It's a way of dismissing your opponents claims without having to actually answer them; as such, it needs to be opposed at every turn, for politics are already pathetic enough as is.

Air Israel, please clear the runway!

[Anonymous Coward]

typically explode and shoot ash 30,000 to 50,000 feet high â" more than nine miles â" into the jet stream.

Into the jet stream?! You mean, flying my private jet to escape the lava flow was a bad ide2!@#*)& NO CARRIER

OBLG: The Lost Work: Jurasic Park Quote

[powerlord]

And then you find out, it really doesn't... but you still watch because in some ways, it's still entertaining.

Dr. Ian Malcolm: Oh, yeah. Oooh, ahhh, that's how it always starts. Then later there's running and screaming.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0119567/quotes

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[Specter]

Yeah, this administration is TOTALLY different than the last one. Why you'd never see Obama nominate a person for the Secretary of the Treasury who'd intentionally cheated on his income taxes!

It's laughable to think that someone who's a tax cheat would end up running the IRS. Did I say laughable? I meant sad, dispiriting, and totally expected.

Whoo hoo! Change I can believe in!

AVO Twitter

[ak_hepcat]

The Alaska Volcano Observatory posts updates to their twitter account.

http://twitter.com/alaska_avo

Re:Sarah Palin an expert in geology and vulcanolog

[Anonymous Coward]

Forget the Russians, she can see the Vulcans from her house!

Slashdot to the rescue

[redcaboodle]

Did we slashdot the volcano or just the observatory?

And there's only 3 people in Alaska :)

[curri]

Sorry, couldn't resist

Re:Sarah Palin an expert in geology and vulcanolog

[Shotgun]

That's because they're neither funny or insightful. You had someone with no more foreign experience that me running second on the ticket, vs someone running first on the ticket who's foreign experience consisted of a rock-band tour of Europe. Oh, there was that trip to Africa to find his daddy, but I'm not sure how that qualifies one to run a nations foreign policy.

You had a VP candidate making blunders while grasping for straws to look qualified for the job that no one running is qualified for, vs a Presidential candidate openly saying that he will unilaterally invade our allies. The point here is that Palin was doing what all politicians do. Why is it funny or insightful just because it is a bash against the other team?

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[Shotgun]

He's going to close the prison camp, just as he pledged. He's just not going to free the prisoners. They're going to other secret camps. Way to spend lots of money to appease the partisans, without actually accomplishing anything.

That's just the first thing.

Rush

[Anonymous Coward]

> I think Rush was much more comical and insightful on drugs.

Yeah, it hasn't been the same ever since he admitted his addiction to oxy.

Though it does help explain some of his positions. A relative of mine went paranoid and had to be taken off of oxy while in the hospital because it was driving her crazy. Do that for that many years, and I guess you wind up with Limbaugh.

Re:Sarah Palin an expert in geology and vulcanolog

[Arcane_Rhino]

"Regardless of your political leanings, the current state of political discourse and debate is absolutely shameful."

Now this ^^ is truly worthy of an insightful moderation.

Status update on the volcano

[jonfr]

Here is a status update on the volcano. I got this with a email just now.

----
ALASKA VOLCANO OBSERVATORY CURRENT STATUS REPORT
Friday, January 30, 2009 12:20 PM AKST (Friday, January 30, 2009 21:20 UTC)

REDOUBT VOLCANO (CAVW #1103-03-)
60Â29'7" N 152Â44'38" W, Summit Elevation 10197 ft (3108 m)
Current Aviation Color Code: ORANGE
Current Volcano Alert Level: WATCH

Unrest at Redoubt Volcano continues, though no eruption has yet
occurred. Seismicity levels have increased since yesterday evening and
have also risen markedly over the last hour. Pilot reports, clear AVO
webcam views, and satellite and radar views confirm that Redoubt
Volcano has not yet erupted at the time of this report. Redoubt
remains at Aviation Color Code ORANGE and Volcano Alert Level WATCH.

AVO's website continues to be overwhelmed with traffic today likely
due to the extensive local and national news coverage of this
activity. A backup, low-bandwidth webserver is operating with limited
information.

Staff are currently monitoring the volcano 24 hours a day. We will
issue further information as it becomes available.
-----

No.

[/dev/trash]

That site will not be down for ever.

Seriously?

[Kingrames]

Alaskans? admit to global warming? psh.

what are they gonna do, take off one of their 6 coats?

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[khallow]

Really? What evidence do you have of this?

Conservative scientists noted this problem during the debates. McCain seemed more sluggish and unresponsive than expected. It is already known that US Senators warp nearby spacetime, but it is an effect experienced only by those nearby, say in the same room. Other Senators, due to their peculiar method of construction are immune to this effect. It is only now, with painstaking measurements and futurist rooms filled with blinking lights that conservative scientists have uncovered the Truth. Obama is a WMtD - a Weapon of Mass time Dialation. We don't know how, but he has the power to alter the time flow of entire countries. There is some speculation that Obama is attempting to bring back 1935, which was a very good year for Democrats - though with a bit of nutty flavor that may be hard for some to overlook. Or maybe he is trying, successfully to keep the elections of 2014 from ever happening. In any case, you will see more and more conservatives complaining bitterly about how long the Obama presidency is, until with the inevitability of a stopped clock, they complain no more. :-O

Re:and Mr. Present, the Messiah

[tuxgeek]

funny, I hadn't thought of that, but good observation! cheers