Slashdot Mirror
Cold War Standoff Over ISS Toilet
Hugh Pickens writes "The International Space Station, once a place where astronauts would share food and facilities, is said to be embroiled in a Cold War-like stand-off after a Russian cosmonaut complained he is no longer allowed to use a US toilet or the US gym machine. Gennady Padalka, a veteran Russian cosmonaut, says that space officials from Russia, the United States and other countries now require cosmonauts and astronauts to eat their own food and follow stringent rules on access to other facilities, including lavatories. Padalka, who will be the station's next commander, says the arguments date back to 2003, when Russia started charging other space agencies for the resources used by their astronauts and other partners in space station responded in kind. 'Cosmonauts are above the ongoing squabble, no matter what officials decide,' says Padalka. 'We are grown-up, well-educated and good-mannered people and can use our own brains to create normal relationship. It's politicians and bureaucrats who can't reach agreement, not us, cosmonauts and astronauts.' While sharing food in the past helped the crew feel like a team, the new rules oblige Russian cosmonauts and US astronauts to eat their own food. 'They also recommend us to only use national toilets,' says Padalka. 'What is going on has an adverse effect on our work.'"
What fucking idiot politician thought this up?
Politicians: Hard at work to put the "I" in ISS...
Bitten Apples are still better than dirty Windows...
They leave the seat up...
im sure some cave man council decided it would create too much cooperation between rival clans, and tried to stop the project.
This must have been a bureaucrat level 34 or better that started this. A 35 wouldn't know how to fill out the proper acquisition forms.
---- aut viam inveniam aut faciam
The escalation must stop before they argue over sharing of oxygen!
What was he eating that he clogged up the US toilet?
Thats a legitimate complaint... do you know how much it costs to get a plumber to do a service call?
"The average Rooskie, son, don't take a dump without a plan."
If you even read the whole summary, you'd note that the Russians began it by charging to use "their" resources. U.S. astronauts can't use Russian facilities either without incurring a hefty bill. Both sides are being petty children.
$_ = "wftedskaebjgdpjgidbsmnjgcdwatb"; tr/a-z/oh, turtleneck Phrase Jar!/; print
"Or vice-versa the humans toilet. The Earth-Vulcan politicians are squabbling over the respective costs, and don't want non-citizens using their toilets." - United Federation of Planets, official notice
That's what Star Trek would be like if it were realistic - trade and cost disputes. Or just watch Babylon 5 ("By Any Means Necessary").
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
Seriously though, can't the crew just tell the people on the ground to shove it up their ass?
I think that's pretty much what they're saying: 'Cosmonauts are above the ongoing squabble, no matter what officials decide,' says Padalka. 'We are grown-up, well-educated and good-mannered people and can use our own brains to create normal relationship. It's politicians and bureaucrats who can't reach agreement, not us, cosmonauts and astronauts.'
It's refreshing to have such a public statement of defiance in the face of stupidity. Too bad Republicans and Democrats (not just the politicians but also their brown shirts on the ground) don't do the same in a very forward manner. Yes, Slashdot drones, I'm looking at you.
Dedicated Cthulhu Cultist since 4523 BC.
Remember, the ISS is now recycling urine for drinking water. Allowing cosmonauts to use our toilet would risk the contamination of our precious bodily fluids. Twice, no less.
What are the bosses going to do, stop by their desk and give them a stern talking-to?
The alternative is "you never go to space again and your career as an astronaut/cosmonaut is over". There have been lots of stories in the past about how astronauts are treated like lab rats but they put up with it because it's the only way to get to orbit.
"Tell me doctor, with all of your defenses, are there any provisions for an attack by killer bees?"
It reminds me of a movie I've seen before.
How childish a thing to do.
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
I think if someone can figure out how to piss on the floor in a freefall environment with no architectural frame of reference for up and down, you've got no right to stop them.
No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
Where the hell does the Japanese guy get to go? I mean, when you gotta go, you gotta go.
Never underestimate the potential of Human stupidity. -Heinlein
You know, its amazing to think how much progress has been destroyed, avoided, or never attained because of stupid, idiotic, invisible little lines drawn up by a bunch of dead men. Maybe that's why I love the internet? It's kind of above this bullshit.
No, this one is on the Russians. They started it. The Americans are just playing tit-for-tat (with random forgiveness, we presume), which is always an appropriate moral strategy.
This is not the first time the Russians, bankrupt, have pulled a stunt like this. Mir was full of junk because the Russians would lease space to whoever to run an experiment and would then refuse to bring the experiment's materials back to Earth. They kept them on board in order to continue charging the (exorbitant) rent for space aboard Mir. The cosmonauts complained about the piles of junk, though not publicly.
FATMOUSE + YOU = FATMOUSE
Do things the RyanAir way.
Squirrel!
"Both sides are being petty children."
Such a departure from the US and Russia of old...
You feel sleepy. Close your eyes. The opinions stated above are yours. You cannot imagine why you ever felt otherwise.
All the organs of the body were having a meeting, trying to decide who was the one in charge.
After a while, the feet, stomach, eyes, and brain agreed that the asshole was in charge.
"We reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals." --The American President (20.1.2009)
Russians began it by charging to use "their" resources
Actually, Russians started to charge for the ride to the station which is completely understandable considering costs involved.
Summary is rather inflammatory by calling it "charging for resources".
Yea, the toilet thing is a really petty retaliation. But this is the era of asymmetric warfare after all...
One of the agencies sends up a bucket of yellow paint and a paint brush?
(for the bright yellow dividing line down the middle of the station)
Future Presidential Speech text:
"Mr. {insert leader here}, Tear down...er....Wipe Up that line!"
WTF? Over?
. . . tired old memes bore you.
What?
After an extended tour on the ISS, your career in space pretty much *is* over. You never completely recover from the bone loss after an extended stay in zero-G.
The astronauts in the ISS should declare independence and form their own state in the ISS.
Fine, but they shouldn't expect any supply missions or help getting back down...
If you are going to declare "independence" it's a good idea to make sure that you are really "independent" first.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
it's more of a "squat off"
This is particularly unfair when you consider that, even before this dust-up, Americans couldn't use the other nations' toilets anyway. You see, their normal-sized pee tubes would not accommodate our large American junk.
Had to be done, sorry. :-]
but have you considered the following argument: shut up.
Its forefathers intended it to be a nation run by and for wealthy white men. Which, for the most part, it still is.
Its forefathers intended it to be an agrarian, rural nation -- Jefferson, for example, believed that large cities were "pestilential to the morals, the health and the liberties of man."
Rebuilding the U.S. "as its forefathers intended" would mean a lot of regression; "accounting for current situations" leaves little relevance to many of their ideas.
The Founders had a few good ideas -- the U.S. ought to avoid foreign wars and mind its own business, government ought to be representative and its powers limited, and those limits should be fixed in writing. And I have to give Washington serious props for doing the Cincinnatus thing.
But by and large, they were slave-owning aristocrats, and we ought not worship them or their ideals.
Tom Swiss | the infamous tms | my blog
You cannot wash away blood with blood
Aah, the Russians, Capitalists through and through...
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
The Americans are just playing tit-for-tat
Or in this case: shit-for-shat
We've gotten more greed, more violence, more sense of entitlement, less drive, less personal responsibility for ones own actions, less entrepreneurial, more broken families, and general falling apart of things that used to unite us all in the US.
It certainly hasn't been getting better over the past 20 years, that's for sure...
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Things seem to have changed since I watched TV in 1992 when Mr. King got the long fucking end of the stick.
...that might be tasteful, but I'm replying to a post that is modded +5 Funny, even though it really isn't funny. On that note, I suggest I'll be modded +5 Informative.
A proud member of the Onion-in-Hand alliance
Oh, God, where to start?
We didn't seem to have as much violence
Murder rates were about 25% higher in 1989 than they are now. Google "US homicide rate by year" and you will find a ton of documentation.
parents weren't afraid to let their kids play outside
The mid-Eighties were the height of the "Satanic ritual child abuse" witch-hunt hysteria. By the late Eighties, the idea that the world was a horrible scary place waiting to eat the poor innocent children was firmly implanted in the public consciousness.
Heck, only a few short years before then...you could fsck all you wanted, and the worst you had to fear was getting a shot from the Dr. to clear up any STD you had.
AIDS was first identified in 1981, and HIV was identified as the pathogen responsible in 1983, IIRC. By 1989, the risks of heterosexual as well as homosexual transmission were well known ... and the drugs available at the time would kill you faster than the disease itself would, as opposed to the current generation of AIDS drugs which, while they still have some pretty nasty side effects, do allow HIV-infected people to live relatively healthy lives for a number of years after infection.
we weren't being overrun by our neighbors from the south as badly as now
America has always gone through ebbs and flows of immigration, and corresponding bouts of hysteria about it. The current anti-immigrant dustup is no different from that which greeted the Scots-Irish, the Germans, the Irish Irish, the Chinese, the Italians, the Poles, etc. Note that most of those people's grandkids and great-grandkids now speak English and call themselves Americans. As for the specific issue of immigration from Mexico, anyone who lives in the Southwest can tell you that it's not exactly a new phenomenon.
Sure, the tech today is SOOO much better, but, it wasn't being twisted and used by the govt. against us quite so badly.
There was this little thing back then called the "Cold War." Ever heard of it? I sure as hell did. I was stationed in Europe when the Wall came down. You want to talk about governments using technology against their citizens, well, holding most of the world's population in a giant game of nuclear "chicken" pretty much takes the cake.
You're not remembering the Eighties. You're remembering a mythical Golden Age, which always seems to occur somewhere between two decades and two centuries in the past. No matter who you talk to, in any country, in any era, there's always The Time When Things Were Better. Except if you go back and look at the facts, you'll see that it hardly ever was.
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
No one really heard much about it till about '84 or so...and it wasn't widespread, and if you weren't an IV user or having male homosexual anal sex, you likely weren't at a risk back then... I *did* say a few years before '89. Really, till about '84-'85, you could pretty much fsck anything that moved (at least heterosexually) and not have to worry much about dying if you didn't put a helmet on your soldier.
Ryan White and Arthur Ashe send their love. (Go ahead, I double-dare you to suggest those are exceptional cases).
I'm just saying that how people treat each other, society in general, and how the govt. is working against us, was not as bad back then. I feel that life and the very minimun, was much more civil, polite and relaxed then.....and decades before.
Hey, remember that time the US government purposely gave 400 of its black citizens, hell, 400 of its MILITARY men, syphillis, then watched them die? I could be cynical and say "I guess *snicker* this is what cayenne8 considers the days when the government was better!," but I really doubt you think the gov't-sponsored-and-ordered execution of 400 black men was really a good thing. Really, you're just describing what one of the GPs accurately describes as gleeful remembrance of the "good ole days."
>>>Jefferson, for example, believed that large cities were "pestilential to the morals, the health and the liberties of man."
He was correct. He was also correct about the corporations being a powerful force that could take-away the freedoms of the citizens, mainly through the power of wealth, and secondarily through the subjugation of the People's government. Ref: RIAA. Ref: The various blacklists corporations use to make finding a job nigh-impossible.
>>>Its forefathers intended it to be a nation run by and for wealthy white men
The only man with any wealth was George Washington (land-based wealth, not cash). All the other founders were deep in debt, with the worst being Jefferson who carried the modern-day equivalent of $200,000 over his head. That's why when he died, his home was immediately appropriated by the bankers, divided-up, and sold.
Your statement would be more accurate if you said, "A nation run by some wealthy, some middling, some poor, but overall highly-educated men." Also I think you've forgotten the founders, while they were still alive, extended suffrage from property owners to commoners, including blacks (in the north) and women (Massachusetts, Rhode Island). Study your history before you offer inaccurate opinion.
Freedom takes a slow progress, but it does progress.
As example: Jefferson's proudest achievements were the founding of his college, so all could benefit from an education, the writing of the Declaration of Independence which codified the principle that governments serve the People, not the other way around, and the abolition of Virginia's official state religion, so that all could worship freely. "Whether my neighbor worships one god, many gods, or no gods, matters not to me. His beliefs do not harm my body, my property, nor my rights." It took him forty years of hard work to make all that happen. Not all the Founders' ideals happened immediately.
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
>>>1989....I liked it.
You have to go much farther back then that. 1910. I obviously don't remember it, but my grandfather did when he was still alive. The one most obvious difference - No income tax. He was allowed to keep every dollar he earned, except for incidentals like sales tax.
Second difference - no RIAA suing you because you played a song on your piano without permission, because even though copyright laws existed, they were designed to favor the people not the corporations. And they had limits.
Third difference - people relied on themselves and their family, not some idiot in D.C. who doesn't care if you live or die. And you could grow your own food, without the EPA or FDA or some other alphabet bozo breathing down your neck and saying, "No no no - you are violating the rationing laws that limit how much corn you're allowed to grow."
Not that 1910 was perfect. Far from it, but it was still better than the present where you're not free to do much of anything, and taxation is at 40% instead of 0-to-1%. If you can't keep the nearly-all the money you earn, then you're not truly free. Somebody else (Congress) owns your body on a part-time basis.
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
Nobody was purposely infected with syphilis.
The Tuskegee Study did not involve purposely infecting anyone. The study started on black men who were infected with untreated syphilis. Not to minimize what did happen which was still pretty bad. There was no effective treatment for syphilis when the study started in the early 1030s and the treatments that did exist were not effective and quite dangerous. Years later penicillin was developed that could have helped but were never used.
What happened was bad enough, there is no need to make it worse than it was.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskegee_study
No matter where you go, there you are.
The article mentions all of this could be resolved if the Russians would just sign the formal agreement paperwork (form # URN8-NP) to have a legal document verifying they agree to the terms and for liability reasons.
Yes..I'd say largely both [Ryan White and Arthur Ashe] examples...were fairly isolated incidences.
IAAD (I am a doctor), and dude, don't act like I didn't dare you. You should have known I already had the stats to back myself up.
"As of December 2001, an estimated 14,262 persons have been diagnosed with AIDS as a result of transfusing contaminated blood or blood products."
To you Cayenne8, Ryan White, Arthur Ashe and 14,260 other "isolated incidents" with names, with real families and real loved ones all send their love.