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NIH Orders Halt To Embryonic Stem Cell Research
sciencehabit writes "Responding to a court order issued a week ago, the National Institutes of Health (NIH) on Friday ordered intramural researchers studying human embryonic stem cells (hESCs) to shut down their experiments. NIH's action — probably unprecedented in its history — is a response to a preliminary injunction on 23 August from US District Judge Royce Lamberth. The judge ruled that the Obama policy allowing NIH funding to be used to study hESC lines violates a law prohibiting the use of federal funds to destroy embryos."
The judge ruled that the Obama policy allowing NIH funding to be used to study hESC lines violates a law prohibiting the use of federal funds to destroy embryos."
What if the scientists just charge for the research, but present an itemized bill that throws in the embryo destruction for free?
I'm mostly kidding, but isn't there some decent way to weasel around this?
... Backwards ...
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Everyone who is against stem cell research should be unable to ever benefit from the results of said research.
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
Hyperbolic headline department.
Lacking <sarcasm> tags,
Things always go smoothly. But seriously - the "debate" (can't believe there even is one) over creationism is harmful intellectually, but I doubt it is actively inhibiting research on anything. Stem cell research, on the other hand, IS being held back by religious groups that believe any fertilized embryo is a human. And I for one truly detest the role religion is playing in actively inhibiting research on diseases that are currently killing people. My right to swing my fist ends where your nose begins - I can't find a clever way to say it, but why must this still not apply to religion?
"Going to war without the French is like going deer hunting without your accordion." ~General Norman Schwarzkopf
"NIN Orders Halt To Embryonic Stem Cell Research"?
And I'don't like at all Nine Inch Nails.
Is simply this, anyone can donate eggs or sperm for research but they have to paid for it.
I own my own body so why can't I sell Haploid Genetic material to some research firm to do with what they please?
Tsukasa: All I really want, is to be left alone...
Well, it might suck, but presuming the legal basis of the court ruling is valid, I'm appreciative that they shut the experiments down.
Before you flame me into a crispy marshmallow, answer me this: Is the NIH the sort of institution you want playing fast and loose with any law or court ruling that isn't blatantly, obviously unconstitutional or an instantaneous danger to human lives? I want NIH crossing their T's and dotting the shit of out their I's, for my own safety and peace of mind, and while I hope they fight this ruling (because stem cells will save lives in the long run) I'm grimly satisfied they obeyed it while it's legally binding.
to adult stem cells - you know, the ones that have actually led to productive therapies.
Embryonic stem cells are said to have a lot of "potential". Strange, by this time I would think they would have come up with something for all the hype made over them.
The ruling applies to cell lines derived from more recent embryos -- they're already destroyed and would have been anyway, but the cell lines are already harvested. It's a strange ruling since it doesn't prevent any new embryo destruction (and wouldn't anyway, since they're excess IVF embryos and are headed for the biowaste system either way.)
Nope. The Court has ruled. Unless and until a higher court reverses the ruling, it's binding.
Lacking <sarcasm> tags,
That one person's (or group of people's) belief in fairy tales should hold back progress that could save countless lives and easy the suffering of millions.
The enterpretation of the law may be correct but it dosnt stop MOST* of the people who oppose the research using the result as soon as they or a loved one gets sick.
* I know there are some religious groups who do stand by what they preach.
That... or the knights who say NIH! have returned!
Mod me down, my New Earth Global Warmingist friends!
...Osama, I mean, Obama, will still let federal money somehow make it around to where women can have abortions.
We used to criticize the USSR because they politicized science.
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But bear in mind that it's the same group whose belief in fairy tales led directly to the suffering and slaughtering of millions, so this isn't at all out of line with their modus operandi.
Given the wording of the law and the clear legislative intent, the decision seems to be legally correct. The solution here requires congress to act. An additional unfortunate detail is that the Democrats are completely spineless and so getting them to deal with this problem is going to be tough even though this majority of Americans support embryonic stem cell research (source- http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/DailyNews/poll010626.html).
Why is everyone making a big stink about embryonic stell research anyways? Adult stem cell research appears to show a lot more promise and doesn't have all the abortion political baggage tied to it. I don't understand the Obama Administration's stance on this; they spend a lot of political capital on a science that is decades away from producing anything real when a comparable science, Adult Stem Cell research, could be supported without expending almost any political capital.
Consider the other side of the question:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_human_experimentation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731
Where do we draw the line? It is not an easy question, and is not easily answered.
The doctors who did these experiments thought that they knew where to draw the line. Humanity decided that they were wrong.
Awesome, this discussion is along the lines of "Embryonic stem cells will cure all disease!" Research on things we can't even do in rats, huh...
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Very soon--perhaps even already--China will be the premier center of stem cell research in the world. They are making enormous advances, due to their strong economic position and their lack of being hindered by religious conservatives or a two-party system. Researchers will go there, all the intellectual work will flock to China because they can get their funding and have the collaboration they need. And the US will become a short-lived historical footnote, an intellectual backwater led by a corrupt plutocracy, filled with ignorant evangelical nutjobs and greedy corporatists. Americans are stupid, greedy, short-sighted, superstitious, easily cowed, lazy, obsessed with violence and sex, and fiscally irresponsible.
Make no mistake: I do not condone China's abhorrent record on human rights, politics, foreign policy, censorship, or the environment. I especially despise the way they have so brilliantly manipulated the US into conflicts with other countries and have essentially commandeered the global economy. But they have only done this because, again, Americans are too stupid and played right into the trap.
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never a better time to consult with/trust in our 'creators'. the lights are coming up rapidly all over now. see you there?
greed, fear & ego (in any order) are unprecedented evile's primary weapons. those, along with deception & coercion, helps most of us remain (unwittingly?) dependent on its' life0cidal hired goons' agenda. most of our dwindling resources are being squandered on the 'wars', & continuation of the billionerrors stock markup FraUD/pyramid schemes. nobody ever mentions the real long term costs of those debacles in both life & any notion of prosperity for us, or our children. not to mention the abuse of the consciences of those of us who still have one, & the terminal damage to our atmosphere (see also: manufactured 'weather', hot etc...). see you on the other side of it? the lights are coming up all over now. the fairytail is winding down now. let your conscience be your guide. you can be more helpful than you might have imagined. we now have some choices. meanwhile; don't forget to get a little more oxygen on your brain, & look up in the sky from time to time, starting early in the day. there's lots going on up there.
"The current rate of extinction is around 10 to 100 times the usual background level, and has been elevated above the background level since the Pleistocene. The current extinction rate is more rapid than in any other extinction event in earth history, and 50% of species could be extinct by the end of this century. While the role of humans is unclear in the longer-term extinction pattern, it is clear that factors such as deforestation, habitat destruction, hunting, the introduction of non-native species, pollution and climate change have reduced biodiversity profoundly.' (wiki)
"I think the bottom line is, what kind of a world do you want to leave for your children," Andrew Smith, a professor in the Arizona State University School of Life Sciences, said in a telephone interview. "How impoverished we would be if we lost 25 percent of the world's mammals," said Smith, one of more than 100 co-authors of the report. "Within our lifetime hundreds of species could be lost as a result of our own actions, a frightening sign of what is happening to the ecosystems where they live," added Julia Marton-Lefevre, IUCN director general. "We must now set clear targets for the future to reverse this trend to ensure that our enduring legacy is not to wipe out many of our closest relatives."--
"The wealth of the universe is for me. Every thing is explicable and practical for me .... I am defeated all the time; yet to victory I am born." --emerson
no need to confuse 'religion' with being a spiritual being. our soul purpose here is to care for one another. failing that, we're simply passing through (excess baggage) being distracted/consumed by the guaranteed to fail illusionary trappings of man'kind'. & recently (about 10,000 years ago) it was determined that hoarding & excess by a few, resulted in negative consequences for all.
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These right wing nut jobs care about the embryo->fetus, but then when the kid is born they will do anything to not fund programs to help kids.
If abortion is genocide then so are wet dreams and a woman's monthly period.
Charge me with the genocide because last night my body caused the death a billion "potential babies."
Without the two of them, the case has no standing in court. These two whined that the ES cell people were stealing the grant money that should be going to themselves.
Controversy follows James Sherley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Sherley) so much that I've come to the conclusion that he's a total asshole who likes to fuck everyone else over when he doesn't get his own way.
There are lots of countries more than willing to fund research like this.
HTTP/1.1 400
Ideology-testing for anything and everything is really, really stupid. It is mean-spirited and spiteful, as well as impossible to enforce. Let's suppose, just for fun, that the law is changed (as it will be) and federal funding for embryonic stem cell research is allowed. The people whom you wish to deny treatment are now having their tax dollars taken from them to do research they disagree with. Will you still deny them treatment? What if someone is opposed to war. Would you deny them any medical treatment that was advanced or created during wartime for the purpose of treating soldiers? That might include you, or a loved one. Suppose you are on the brink of foreclosure and a millage increase is proposed for schools or the fire department. You vote it down because any tiny increase in your tax burden would push you over the edge into foreclosure. Should your kids be denied access to the schools? Should the fire department pass you by in case of an emergency?
Grow the hell up. We live in a democracy. Some times things will go your way, some times they won't. Deciding to punish people who disagree with you is a really good way to lead to civil strife and violence.
they wouldn't need federal funds to finance it, private corporations would foot the bill.
there has been more advances with adult stem cells anyway
Thanks to file sharing, I purchase more CDs
Thanks to the RIAA, I buy them used...
This is an example of the system working as it should. I don't agree with the court's ruling, however given that they have authority in this matter, their ruling needs to be obeyed until it is overturned. This could be upon appeal, it could also be through a legislative act (I haven't read the ruling but it may well say that it isn't allowed under current law, not that it is constitutionally prohibited or something).
Whatever the case, rule of law applying to the government is important. It is important that one branch of the government not be allowed to ignore the lawful authority of another. This was something that many people really jumped on Bush for. Well guess what? It isn't any more ok to do it when you think it is right or "The ends justify the means," or whatever. Bush thought the same, he just had a very different philosophy from most on Slashdot.
So while I'm hopeful that this ruling is overturned, I am happy to see the NIH complying with it. Rule of law is a real important concept in our society.
Excuse me, but your generalization of "all religions" opposing stem research is false. I hear this all the time, when actually you meant fundamentalist American Christians. There are many Christians that I know who are not opposed to stem cell research. I am a Muslim myself and I am not opposed to stem cell research as in Islam, a fetus is only considered "online" after 120 days of conception, meaning before that it is not yet fully human. Having said that, I am more comfortable if more focus is given to research on adult-derived stem cells but I do not object to embryonic stem cell research as long as it is obtained from embryos that are less than 4 months of gestation. So please, next time, qualify your statements when damning any religions or any groups of people for that matter or you will commit the same behaviour of the very people you despise. Like it or not, religion plays an important part as a checks and balance mechanism to scientific progress. Religion provides another voice in the ethical debates on any new technology. Scientists (I am a microbiologist myself) are prone to jump into any new breakthrough without thinking of the larger consequences. As in everything in life, there are always give and take.
Yes, it's a valid question.
No, we don't seem to have a consensus answer to it. Answers are "at conception" vs. a squishy "don't know but that's not it".
Not long ago another country was derided for terminating 12 million of what were not legally humans.
Maybe we shouldn't be funding the termination of what reasonable people differ over calling "human".
Not a slope we want to start sliding down, especially as we value _individual_ rights. Maybe the person being terminated would like a say too.
Can we get a "-1 Wrong" moderation option?
BTW the same goes for marijuana legalization - just hold the damn referendum already and get on with other things.
Or, since this is in USA, remove the federal choke on the topic and leave it to the individual states - there are worse things already at the state level (IIRC: minimum marrying age? drinking age?)
-- Sig down
a valid, non-religious reason not to experiment with embryonic stem cells? Hey, I'm just asking questions here...
How would they know? They haven't tried. As the GP said, the Democrats are spineless. The Republicans threaten to filibuster, true, so make them do it. Introduce the bill and say "Try it assholes." Maybe they do actually filibuster, but they have to keep it up for it to work. Maybe someone breaks ranks, maybe they get tired and waver. Also, maybe it makes them look like jackasses and loses them votes. It won't with the hardcore righties, of course, but then you aren't concerned with them they always vote the same way.
However just backing down at the threat is spineless and ineffective. I am sick and tired of the Democrats whining that, despite having a near supermajority (59 seats) they can't get anything done because of the "Evil Republicans." Fuck you, that is a bullshit excuse and you know it. If you actually try, and they actually successfully stop things, then ok there is some legitimacy to that. However they just back down and don't try a damn thing.
> are bad because some book can vaguely be interpreted to say so.
And here I thought it was because a fertilized embryo is a living human organism, which is becoming something we all agree to be human, except that, you know, we decided to disassemble them for spare parts because it was better than throwing them out.
I mean, what's your answer to that? Some crap about speciesism? Problem is, it's also "speciesist" to swat a fly because it annoys you (you wouldn't kill a person for the same offense), let alone getting into whether or not it's wrong to eat, say, an octopus. And if you want isms, I could accuse you of ageism, not to mention discrimination in general (an embryo doesn't look human, isn't smart enough yet), etc., but I don't consider that a strong argument on its own, I just consider it the counter to those obsessed with not being a __ist who aren't thinking rationally.
Anyhow, nice strawman argument you've got there. You ever argue against anything else? Because it really doesn't look like you have.
Change the law. As for this Filibuster nonsense, my fellow Hard Core Republicans talk trash, but they can't back it up.
Problem is, it's also "speciesist" to swat a fly because it annoys you (you wouldn't kill a person for the same offense), let alone getting into whether or not it's wrong to eat, say, an octopus.
Plenty of folks I would send to the grave because they annoy me or piss me off. It ain't no speciesism that stops me, but not liking prisons and death rows that stop me.
So it's only the "religious crazies" that think that human embryos are human life? Damn, I think that babies are dumber than a hat full of soup until they hit like 2 maybe. A 6 month old baby is certainly a lot dumber than a 6 month old dog from what I've seen. Kill a 1 day old baby and it's murder, kill it a few months earlier and it's an abortion because it's still in the second trimester.
The nazis were all about doing experiments on people that they thought were sub-standard. Somehow that was OK on their scale because the people they were experimenting on weren't really human anyway. They were the wrong race or mentally handicapped after all.
I really doubt that the Bible has much to say about embryos at all. The Catholic Church certainly don't like birth control, but that's not exactly a universal axiom in Christianity. Conception and death really seem like the only non-arbitrary events in a person's life. The whole argument that all bets are off until the third trimester or birth seem as arbitrary as saying that you aren't an adult until you graduate from high-school.
Creating human life for the express purpose of experimenting on it is just wrong IMO. Unlike adult stem research, when has embrionic stem cell research ever produced anything useful treatments anyway?
If I buy a fetus did I in any way cause the abortion? What a leap. The person that performed the abortion is the only person responsible for the abortion. That includes the Almighty Himself as He aborts quite a few Himself.
From my understanding, embryonic stem cell treatments are going to be genotype specific. This means that you need a tissue match in order to make use of such a treatment, i.e., if not your stem cells then someone who is very close genetically.
So what? Well, if you want production-line embryonic stem cell treatments then you are going to need a way to produce an embryo with the same DNA as the patient you are treating. Not impossible today but moderately difficult. It also opens the door to something that we have so far managed to avoid and has all sorts of nasty side issues - human cloning. You see, if you can manufacture embryonic stem cells to order, then you can manufacture embryos to order as well. And that means you have successful, viable human cloning.
Do we really honestly want to go down that road? Do we need an everlasting supply of Bill Gateses? Because I can assure you that if the process is there and it works some ultra-rich people are going to take advantage of it. Maybe not Bill G., but how about Kim Jong Il?
Yes, I think it is probably a good question about when exactly it is reasonably to kill off a developing (potential) human life. We had a judicially established value (24 weeks) for a while but it is way, way too far along for current medical techniques. At conception turns the switch off on nearly all reasonable and reliable birth control methods. We need something that people can at least agree on even if it isn't a perfect answer.
But embryonic stem cell treatments are not dependent on this decision. I'd say anything that requires human cloning to be able to be effectively used needs to have the human cloning issue decided long before we should be going down the road of even researching embryonic stem cell treatments.
Yet another non-issue designed to distract the two sides from the real issues concerning the impending destruction of our country at the hands of the economic elite.
Let's fix the actually problems before we start quibbling about divisive bullshit - the Indians and Chinese will likely beat us to any breakthroughs in this area anyway.
Willfully ignorant as in "don't have the knowledge and don't care to correct it". Most of the people which are carefuly explained this is a clump of 40 to 100 cells in a very early stage, start to see this is not about sacrificing an "individual" (the embryo) as those clump of cell would anyway not be made otherwise to begin with, and once made have no chance whatsoever to ever be implanted or even come to gestation. You could as well cry yourself to tear when tearing a muscle and losing blood , or masturbating.
I heard you like "Candy" and "Ice Cream". Just substitute "Penis" for "Ice Cream" and you will see why substituting something only tangentially similar to something else in a sentence is a bad idea.
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
One of the more irritating things about this topic in general, is that some liberal-leaning people getting all up in arms about
[The religious fundie anti-science idiots blocking research into stem cells].
This is particularly ironic, given that it shows the complainer's complete lack of scientific education themselves.
"Stem Cell research" continues. Great things continue to be done, in the realm of stem cell research.
It's only "Embryonic" stem cell research that is affected by this.
A rational, scientific person should then be asking the question, SO WHAT? !
Most of the interesting stem cell discoveries, have happened outside of embryonic research. There has been almost nothing of interest discovered in that subset of the field, either inside, or outside of, america.
type1 diabetes cure, from REGULAR stem cells:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article1637528.ece
And there's also stuff like this:
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1826-ultimate-stem-cell-discovered.html
"The work is very exciting," says Ihor Lemischka of Princeton University. "They can differentiate into pretty much everything that an embryonic stem cell can differentiate into."
Similarly, in 2007, http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/genetics/2007-11-20-stem-cells-skin-cells_N.htm
These days, embryonic stem cell research is really only of critical, "must have it" interest to those groups that wish to pursue cloning and other nasty things.
(eg: liberals wishing to bash non-atheists about something, and abortion clinics getting worried about their funding)
IMHO a fertilized embryo has only the potential to become a human organism. But it in itself is not one. Trying to draw the line can be tricky though, as I would also say that once the fetus has a brainstem and brain that governs the heart, it is a human organism. Even so, I would tend to support the right to chose, as the fetus is inside the mother, and as such its rights cannot be protected without violating hers.
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The extra embryos are made because it's cheap insurance to do so. The choice you want (which is "implant all the embryos that are created") isn't going to happen.
Once you have the extra embryos that are no longer needed, you have two choices: 1) throw them away, 2) do science on them and then throw them away.
How is option 1 better than option 2?
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Yes.
Sure it's on the wrong side according to what I think should be done with research.
But it's about time the executive was reminded that the legislative branch out-ranks it in a lot of areas.
Of Alzheimer's.
SLOWLY.
I am so tired of religion damaging civilization. FUCK YOU ALL VERY MUCH.
(Yes, I have a family member who could be helped by stem cell research. Yes, I'm angry. Yes, you Christians are all at fault, since you tithe the fucking money to and buy the fucking books of the people who push the anti-science bullshit into our culture.)
It is so much easier to just say "both sides suck equally" than it is to actually think and take some personal responsibility for your choices.
Under the last 1.5 years of Democratic rule, we've had a landmark overhaul of health care, responsible wind-down of the war in Iraq, refocusing of military energy against people who are actually our enemies, wall street reform, credit card reform, economic stimulus, hate crimes prevention act, student loan reform, funding for energy and science research, and nuclear arms treaty. We've also seen a functional government response to disasters (flooding in TN and oil spill). Oh, and we've managed to repair this country's image in the world's eyes for the most part.
Definitely not perfect, but not that bad considering the state the country was in that he inherited.
The previous 8 years? we had an illiterate cowboy who couldn't figure out which country to shoot at, turned the entire world against us, let people drown to death due to a massive mismanagement of Katrina, pardoned political hacks for outing covert CIA agents, oversaw a doubling of the federal debt and the most massive economic collapse since the Great Depression. Oh, and the country that guy inherited had no outstanding wars and was running a budget surplus.
I guess someone may have noticed that ESC isn't the only method of harvesting stem cells. But then it's the only one that can cause such an uproar. Would there be something wrong with investing the time and money into alternatives? I think maybe it would be worth it... gk
Guess which country won't profit of nearly *all* future medicine development...
I doubt that was meant as a flame
Not Invented Here
if you're a creationist, then refuse any treatment based on modern biology at all
Come again? Why should a belief in the God who created the universe and everything within it preclude me from benefiting from any valid medical treatments derived from the study of His creation, regardless of the beliefs or intentions of the researcher? Even experiments done for the wrong reasons can have some benefits. We see that in the experiments performed by the Nazis. It was certainly abhorrent by any measure to subject the Jews, homosexuals, and mentally retarded to that kind of gross mistreatment, but the information gleaned was useful for determining what limitations the human body has; knowledge acquired through evil means, but is still useful for good and beneficial purposes.
If I feel that ESC treatments are against my beliefs, I will not partake of them. But you know what? That's really easy, because there aren't any viable treatments now, and it isn't likely that there will be any in the future either. Most ESC experiments have generated nothing but massive tumors, and even the ones that don't, don't provide any benefits anyway.