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Canadian Startup Uses Trump to Lure Tech Workers (siliconbeat.com)
An anonymous reader writes: A Canadian startup "is using Republican front-runner Donald Trump in its latest campaign to recruit tech talent," reports Silicon Beat. The company's site claims that 31% of Americans they'd surveyed would consider moving to Canada if Trump were elected President. "Now, while we don't think Americans will actually move en masse to Canada if the election doesn't go their way, we do want to extend an offer. Because it's the polite, Canadian thing to do." The Washington Post reported a surge in Google searches in March for "how can I move to Canada," actually slowing down the Canadian government's immigration web site.
Meanwhile, a coalition of Canadian mayors is visiting California this week to promote Canada's booming technology sector. Toronto's mayor told Bloomberg, "The embracing of diversity as opposed to it being some sort of political issue is a huge advantage we have."
its snowing in June in Canada who would move there ..
New Zealand might be a better idea... or some other place in a different hemisphere
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
He can't do any worse then idiot we have in office atm.
Says the anonymous *coward*.
Really?
92% of startups fail in the first 3 years. Can a startup afford to install a safe space around every desk before the next election cycle.
Honestly, the hysteria from these anti-Trump people is hilarious. They're one chalk scribbled MAGA away from having a nervous breakdown.
Trump is unlikely to reach 1,237 delegates. He was on track until losing Ohio to Kasich. Wisconsin is another state Trump very much needs to win, but Cruz is likely to win there. Trump is unlikely to pull an upset in any states going forward because he's consistently underperformed his polling numbers. Trump will likely face a contested convention, winning only about 1,200 pledged delegates. After no candidate wins on the first ballot, delegates will be free to switch their vote. Trump is unpopular and will probably lose delegates on subsequent votes rather than gain them. Trump is unlikely to be the Republican nominee.
Let's say he gets the nomination, somehow. In polls about general election scenarios, Trump trails Clinton by double digits and Sanders by even bigger margins. Although Sanders is quite a long shot to win the Democratic nomination, Clinton would probably defeat Trump in a landslide.
It's actually very unlikely that Trump will become President. It's not even likely that Trump is the Republican nominee. Those who are wanting to leave the US because of a potential Trump presidency are fools.
I wish the survey was more specifically polling tech workers, since most tech workers that I've talked to could care less which moron gets elected president. Sure we debate it, but it's insignificant compared to tech news. The beauty of working in tech is that we do more to affect positive change more than any politician could ever hope to, so it's harder to get disillusioned.
Sure, it's easy to say they would take the tech workers. But would Canada gladly take the 10 million illegal immigrants who may not be as skilled? Those are the ones who really want to flee Trump.
Trudeau's platform included legalizing it. He's made a start but is facing some complications in the form of US treaties.
when we need them??
New Zealand might be a better idea... or some other place in a different hemisphere
That won't help, because like... the atmospheres of the two hemispheres are connected.
You need to go someplace where that Trump can't affect you.
I don't think that's possible. I mean, the sea will be poisoned, the air will burn, famine and pestilence will be everywhere... it'll just be a mess.
You might try that apocalypse condo in Kansas, and see if you can wait things out.
This assumes, of course, that Earth systems can recover and there will be a future time when you can walk outdoors alone and unaided. Then again, there will probably be a lot of others who had to turn to feral cannibalism to survive.
It doesn't look good for you, even the Earth's microorganisms are starting to wonder whether they will survive.
You can avoid a lot of needless pain and suffering if you think things through.
You might ask yourself the question: do you *really* want to live in a world post-Trump?
I believe Trump is just setting a negociation position toward South Korea and Japan about the military support from USA which cost all American citizen a significant amount of their revenues each year. Nothing has been done yet. What he says often is military support offered by USA everywhere in the world is costly and not rewarded by beneficiaries to its real value. That's why he also suggests to stop supporting NATO and many other operations around the world.
Achille Talon
Hop!
Trump is unpopular and will probably lose delegates on subsequent votes rather than gain them. Trump is unlikely to be the Republican nominee.
If Trump has the vast majority of support from primary voters, and doesn't get the nomination due to skulduggery, there will be rioting in the streets.
You say he's unpopular, but only to the 1%ers.
A very large, very scary crowd of people want to see him run.
Be afraid of changing the rules, or of having the appearance of a non-voting process.
Be very afraid.
claims that 31% of Americans they'd surveyed would consider moving to Canada if Foo were elected President.
As has been said every 4 years for the last few decades.
The loss of backbone was a purely American thing. You bailed out the banks because you got scared, and now Wall Street is crazier than ever. Iceland didn't blink.
Ditto with your reps voting to invade Iraq. No backbone - they were scared and would do anything rather than think.
These policies didn't inflict pain on a small number of people for the greater good - quite the opposite.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
I have a hard time believing sonicmerlin is, in fact, your real name.
If you think that's going to happen, you're dreaming. There are very few english quebecers who don't also speak french - and the ones who don't are mostly racist assholes.
And most of the french also speak english.
So c'est quoi ton calice de probleme, tabernac?
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
To be fair the talk of moving is usually based on what the politician claims he/she is going to do once he/she gets elected.
Since it turns out politicians pretty much never does what they promised there is no actual need to move.
Are all those people who moved to Canada when Obama was elected planning to move back?
But this makes him merely a pseudonymous coward.
The US has military forces in the Middle East, partly for the purposes of ensuring that the supply of oil isn't interrupted. This support includes a carrier, which is quite expensive. Implicitly, we've decided that the oil is worth the cost of our patrols. If the oil is worth it, why not the tech products from Japan and South Korea?
If you think this then you need to spend ten minutes thinking about various things Trump has said and imagining what happens if he tries to implement any of them or follow through on what they imply. If you really think that Trump can't do much damage, that says more about you than it says about the situation or Trump.
You're not going to get very many good workers that don't like Trump.
It's been my observation that those who work hardest, and have the most skill either don't care about politics at all, or they like Trump.
Trump has consistently come out on our side, on this one. He doesn't like the fact that wages are being artificially lowered in high skilled professions. He wants American workers to have first priority of any job, and for the H1b Program to be revised so that it's no longer abused by billionaires. Also, he has a softer stance on intellectual property restrictions than Obama (or any democrat for that matter) does, which is important to both open source and freedom of speech. He did come out on the wrong side of the encryption debate, but in his defence... it's a complicated topic.
He's also called for less fraud, waste, and abuse in government, which means more and better software for the plebs like us that write the stuff. And that means more work. The wall he's proposing is also employment positive for programmers, nerds, and IT, as is Keystone XL, which he's in favor of.
I understand the populist Left, but they have yet to propose anything that benefits me as a common programmer and knowledge worker personally. Trump has proposed a dozen unrelated things that do. And I think the overwhelming majority of the tech community is smart enough to see that.
With the industry the way it exists today, my honest feeling is that less domestic competition from people who would rather go to Canada, than stick it out is a good thing. So I encourage all far Left liberal tech workers to at least take offers like this seriously, and consider them. But the way I see it, our professional world gets better if someone with a billionaire’s mindset is running the economy. Not worse.
This signature has Super Cow Powers
Canada won't cut it, if Trump is elected I'll consider starting a new life in the off-world colonies Do you think Mars will be far enough away, or should I start looking for places off the shoulder of Orion, or maybe the Tannhauser gate?
I guess, if you're a spineless twat who thinks anyone to the right of lenin is some kind of fascist.
and cold weather, higher prices...but we do have better beer!
Yes! Let's turn the US military into a global protection racket! Who cares about global security and preserving the Long Peace when we could be wetting our beaks!
I can hear it now, in a particularly obnoxious Brooklyn accent: "You gotta real nice country here, South Korea, it'd be a shame if something happened to it."
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Trump's an idiot, but people don't up and move countries unless there's a serious economic reason to do so, or their safety or lives are at risk. And I don't think that'll happen with Trump... at least not for the first four years.
The Trump ad is a publicity stunt, not anything serious.
Trump says he will build a wall on our southern border and enforce our immigration laws.
Trump says he will enforce the H1B program in the way it was intended instead of allowing foreign workers to take American jobs.
Trump says he will halt immigration of Islamists until we can be sure they are not radicalized.
Trump says he will allow health insurance companies to compete across state lines and take other measures to make health care affordable.
Trump says he will renegotiate trade pacts that do not favor the United States.
Trump says he will reform the VA and ensure our vets get the care they were promised.
Maybe you can actually post some more things he said about what he is going to do. Those seem to be the main things that I've heard. Not sure what is so scary about any of that.
This election for me is about the rule of law. Either we are a country where everyone is equal under the law and laws have to be obeyed, or we are not. It's as simple as that. All the talk about Trump being a fascist is way off base. Trump doesn't have a fascist organization behind him. He's got no brown shirts or brigades, it's just the democratic process and some people reckoning that at least he might do some of things he has promised.
If nothing else, a Trump presidency would shake up the Washington first virus that has infected both parties.
Trump will just take over Canada and Mexico.
Now do you want to be on the mexcien front? NK?
Not to mention we here in Canada have a relatively functional political system and we lack batshit crazy evangelical Christian politicians who foam at the mouth every time they hear the words "same-sex marriage". That's worth the price of admission.
The job of the US military is NOT global security.
Billionaire's mindset? Draft Bloomberg or Buffet.
With Trump what you get is an entitled misogynist brat mindset. His entire political process is to listen to angry people and then sell them a fantasist's parody solution to their fears; a wall to keep out the invaders, locking down the internet, torture as retribution..l
Trump wants America to be his trophy wife. He's going to make you so happy, baby. It's going to be beautiful. You're going to be so rich. Everyone will fear us. It's just you and him against the world. What do you mean, you don't want to have sex with him? He's got no problem there, he guarantees it. If you don't want to have sex with him you must be disgusting, a terrible human. He wishes someone would punch you in the mouth, seriously. He'll pay the legal fees.
yeah, same dilemma here. i'm hoping to head out colorado way to take advantage of legal cannabis and try to find a strain that will help me cope with pseudo-ptsd and whatever else is wrong with me. the old spice did the trick. not the spice got attention from the lamestream media, but spice before hu-210 and jwh-18 were banned. i tried the new spice and it was absolute crap. the old spice really changed me for the better until the dea cracked down on it.
i can't live without it. sure, some people may say that makes me an addict. whatever, i guess. i'm currently addicted to alcohol because it's the only legal escape for me. i could see myself using cannabis at most 3-4 times per week. with alcohol i have to use it 7 days per week and be careful about not taking too much at once, which can cause my blood sodium level to crater. cannabis doesn't have nearly that kind of addiction or those withdrawal symptoms.
i can easily go back to working minimum wage with something that can really defeat my demons like cannabis. with cannabis, it comes easily to me to exercise on a daily basis. the health benefits vs. alcohol are astounding. i guess that's tech's loss. the gaslighting asshole managers driving women programmers out of the field led to the social justice war which is driving me out of the field. well, speaking about fields, i've been looking into cannabis jobs. i understand there is strict regulation, but it would still be cool to get by working in a grow operation.
And not Mexico? I wonder why.
Good thing too - because we're REALLY bad at it. Since out disastrous response to 9/11 the US is often rated as the greatest destabilizing force on the planet.
--- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
It doesnt matter if sortable wants to hire US or foreign citizens, and sortable knows it. What sortable is doing is casting their net for canadian employees using the widest outlets: American media.
the fact is that while you may have qualified to immigrate to canada in the past, after the 2008 economic collapse most of canadas immigration schedules for knowledge workers changed substantially. This was partly done by conservative leaders in canada at the behest of US leaders to prevent a potentially fatal brain-drain from the US. it was also partly done as a way to shore up domestic employment numbers after the Governor General prorogued the house of commons. You see, once Steven Harper let the cat out of the bag and posted record Canadian economic losses, conservative party leaders got an easy pass to clip immigration law in the hopes of shoring up harpers PM confidence after what was widely seen as a narrow miss to send him back to his constituency.
Good people go to bed earlier.
He can't do any worse then idiot we have in office atm.
What office would he then go idiot in? Would he make the Mexicans build him one?
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
Probably not, but I think there's a more sinister reason for all this. See, if I were going to do something like this with my company, it would be for the pure and simple reason of starting flame wars on Slashdot. And, you have to assume that any tech entrepreneur is at least as evil as I am.
This signature has Super Cow Powers
Since the jobs would move away why not follow them?
Vote Trump - for the Atlantic City Casino Boss who cares. Yeah right.
I don't think the idiot in office right now thinks it'd be a nice idea for South Korea and Japan to have the bomb, or any of dozens of other insane thoughts.
An arms race in NE Asia will have negative repercussions for Canadians as much as Americans. Canada would like suffer more from American protectionism than America itself. I don't think you can run away from Trump's problems by moving to Canada.
What makes you think we want California? The people running that crap-show are more looney than an NDP government, and that's saying something!
some karma... and kinda lukewarm about it.
The other half of this is, why do those people think we - Canada - want them? They sound like they'll throw a fit every time things don't go their way and then what? Are they going to move somewhere else?
some karma... and kinda lukewarm about it.
No, Mexico is going to build the Trump Wall. Remember?
I know Fox said "fuck no," but Trump still is saying "yes." That's still his answer to where the money will come from.
I assume it means he intends to invade Mexico first, and set up some sort of strong-arm dictator who doesn't let anybody leave.
As for the catapult, first one lands on a military base and they'll be anti-aircraft cannons on the border.
If the healthcare is 'free' then why were BC Health charging me 50 bucks a month for it?
Better beer yes, but the wine is truly terrible (and overpriced) ;)
We don't want them!
some karma... and kinda lukewarm about it.
So c'est quoi ton calice de probleme, tabernac?
Il s'appele Jean Saisrein. :-P
If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
I'm part black, I can say this, right?
Dude, just because they're eating bagged lunches don't mean it's really a picnic. They only reason they were in the park was to pick up the trash. I'm really positive that shackles are no picnic.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
There's a few batshit crazy evangelical Christian politicians hiding in the Conservative Party, just that Harper did a very good job of keeping them silent. During the election the local Conservative candidates were not allowed to talk to the voters, just Harper's message of low taxes and a government that will keep you safe no matter how much it had to violate your privacy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
Remove every single US military asset from around the world and terminate all of the mutual defense treaties. Vow to never deploy US military forces unless US interests are directly at risk and sit back and watch the fun. If things get too bad China or Russia can dispatch their second rate military power to set things right. Of course Russia and China are incapable of moving large forces outside of their borders so they will have to remedy that before they get to work. China can send their refurbished air craft carrier group to the ME since they need the oil from there a hell of a lot more than the US does.
*stiffles a guffaw*
"Old man yells at systemd"
How very Grecian an idea... Are we going to use the money they give us to make statues of gods or are we going to build a navy with the money?
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
I'm a U.S. citizen. I worked in Canada for a few years. U.S. tax law is crazy. The IRS taxes everything you make regardless of where you make it. Canada tax law is somewhat sane and taxes based on (1) where you earn it, and (2) where you reside (which is why all the Canadians working in the U.S. have to be careful not to spend more than half their time in Canada, lest they become Canadian residents and owe Canadian taxes on their U.S. income).
The net result is double taxation. Canada taxes you because you made the money in Canada and (for the purposes of this story) you're living in Canada. The U.S. taxes you because you're a U.S. citizen. Now, there is a tax treaty between the two countries which lets you take the taxes paid in one country and use it as a tax credit in the other. Since Canadian taxes are higher, you basically pay the Canadian taxes and don't owe U.S. taxes. But the treaty only covers earned income (wages). It doesn't cover unearned income (interest, capital gains, etc). Have an interest-bearing bank account? Double taxed. Sell some of your stock portfolio at a profit? Double taxed. Buy a house, then sell it a few years later at a profit? Double taxed. Get married and have kids who are dual citizens by birth and one of them decides to move back to the U.S. when he's an adult? He'll be double taxed (have to pay U.S.back taxes) on all the unearned income he made while living in Canada from when he was 18 til when he decided to move.
On top of that, you'll experience the joy of having to pay a specialist CPA who is licensed in both countries, because you sure as hell aren't going to be able to figure out how to file your taxes correctly by yourself. I was fortunate to find one who was willing to do it for "only" $500, but my taxes were simple. It's not uncommon for this to cost $1000 or more. (Note: the better employers will help you out with this - either providing a CPA or directing you to one and they'll cover the filing expenses.)
If you're gonna flee to Canada on principle, you're gonna have to go all the way. Apply for Canadian citizenship and renounce your U.S. citizenship.
This is true and also a concern - it's one of the reasons I opened the thread - I'm off to bed soon. But, yes...
Or, rather, no... No, I don't think that this poll is accurate. Trump actually has a number of proponents in the IT industry. They're in that camp for varied reasons but they exist and I'm pretty sure that the numbers are higher than this poll would have you believe. I'm also a bit squirrelly about the number that they have come up with.
In this thread, we'll find more than 14 people who SUPPORT Trump, never mind being willing to move to Canada. I'm too lazy to look but I bet this survey was written to get one type of response, to be manipulated, or to get partial results.
"How likely are you to be willing to emigrate to Canada if Trump is elected president:
0 --- 1 --- 2 --- 3 --- 4 --- 5
With zero meaning that there's no possible way they're going to move to Canada to 5 being very likely to seek a visa.
Now, anybody who answered a number greater than zero is counted in this poll and that's where they got the 84% from - I suspect. It's standard practice. It's also a trick question - few people want to answer in a negative fashion. People are gullible and swallow it all the time. They may also take results from one question and add them in with the first - again being careful about verbiage.
If you give me a few days and a bunch of resources, I could poll the average American and come back with "Stalin was a great man - according to 87% of people in the garments industry."
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
It's almost aways nothing but pure talk. Talk is cheap.
Otis Redding said it best, "Actions speak louder than words..."
It's the same thing we see every time Microsoft releases a new OS, a bunch of people storm around saying they're going to run Linux. The traffic stats revet to normal in about a month. Nah, people will tolerate a whole lot to be where they're acclimated. Many that live in things like war zones could have escaped and sought refuge. However, they stick it out because it is their home.
Either way, I kind of disagree with the sentiment. If your country is having issues, it's your job to help fix it.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
I really don't think Trump will be as bad as people seem to think. That's not a terribly high barrier to cross, however. I don't think he's quite the monster that everyone wants to claim he is.
No, I'm not voting for Trump. I just don't think he's Hitler.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
Suits me and I suspect a lot of other Americans as well. I suspect that people would find that there are many things worse than a US military base nearby. Not unlike how Vieques in Puerto Rico complained *a lot* but then was sad when the US Navy closed the base.
No one said that global security is the job of the US military, but it absolutely has a profound effect. This isn't limited to aggressive military action either, it includes things like aid and disaster relief.
When something happens that has a potentially global impact, we are expected to respond, we are expected to be involved. Every fight is our fight. I'm not saying it's the way it should be, but I am saying it's the way it is.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
He can't do any worse then idiot we have in office atm.
Irony?
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
I guess, if you're a spineless twat who thinks anyone to the right of lenin is some kind of fascist.
Its not about left vs right. Trump is one of the more ideologically moderate Republican candidates, despite his sudden conversion to anti-abortion and anti-gun-control views.
Its just that he says any crazy thing that comes into his head, and we are really worried about the damage he might do.
*shrugs* Most of my immediate neighbourhood is made up of prodominantly Iranians. Surrounding that, there's a significant mix of other races (Indians, Whites, Chinese, etc..) I'm sure that would piss off some, but honestly I could care less. Racial politics are for people oppressed or insecure.
Hello from Canada, all welcome.
Bye!
If Trump actually gets elected (unikely),
Canada is going to need a Wall.
Few years ago talking with someone that retired, took vacation in Vancouver and loved the city, "I'm selling my home in Silicon Valley for lotsa bux and moving to Canada!" Whup, not so fast. Canada just doesn't let anyone move in, she was doing ping pong back and forth (live a few months in Vancouver but had to leave and live a few months more down here). I don't know all the details (and I didn't read article here) but Canada is pretty restrictive on who moves in. I heard there are exceptions like just before Hong Kong handed over to China, they allowed lots of people to move to Canada (though smooth transition as they were UK citizens). I also heard Canada has an unwritten policy prohibiting blacks moving into Canada.
mfwright@batnet.com
You're not going to get very many good workers that don't like Trump.
It's been my observation that those who work hardest, and have the most skill either don't care about politics at all, or they like Trump
I disagree strongly, in fact from what I've seen the most fervent supporters of Trump are the people who haven't had the professional success they expect and are looking for somewhere to put the blame
Normally I do not like to disclose whom I support, except this time
I am for Donald J. Trump
Many of the successful old timers, the compatriots in the tech fields, are supporting Trump as well
You've got nothin' in comparing to us, kid - neither in professional sense, nor the experience we've gotten, nor the wealth we've accumulate
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
The more American assholes move to Canada, the better off America will be. Maybe Obama will move to Canada also. One can dream, right?
"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
Of course, placing US made nuclear weapons into the hands of Saddam's old mates, the sworn enemies of the US and Israel, and also potentially ISIS might be considered a stupid thing in some circles, given the tensions in that region, but hey! what do I know?
If you think Trudeau is a batshit insane leftist politician, well... we have very different ideas of what "insane leftist" means, then.
Legalizing marijuana makes perfect sense if your goal is to reduce harm. If your goal is to fill your jail cells and waste police resources, then sure... keep it illiegal.
The batshit insane Evangelicals in Canada have essentially zero impact on public policy, unlike in the United States where they're preventing access to abortion, telling people like me where we can and can't pee, sneakily introducing religion into the public school systems, etc.
Contrary to the widely-known meme, diversity is not strength. It is a weakness
It depends. It certainly can cause society to fracture as it is in Europe where immigrants are not assimilated. On the other hand, the United States' "melting-pot" approach has been quite successful in creating a cohesive society, and I think it's definitely something Canada can learn from the USA. Our "multiculturalism" approach is, I think, quite dangerous and does risk Canada fracturing along ethnic lines, though we're not (yet) quite as bad as Europe.
just go vote to make sure he doesn't get elected, how difficult can it be?
On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.
Courtesy of The Last Leg:
http://brickingitforcanada.com...
Still quite a few bricks needed!
Confirmation bias, self selection, wishful thinking... We see this all the time. Go take a look at some of the EU Exit campaign forums, or the comments on BBC News stories. They are all convinced that an exit is imminent and the vast majority of people think as they do, but the polls say they are going to lose.
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SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
This is a perfect example of a Trump policy that sounds superficially good but clearly wouldn't work when you think about it for a moment.
Firstly the military industrial complex would go nuts at the thought of having part of their budget set by how much Japan and Korea are willing to pay. So either they would turn on Trump or he would have to guarantee spending anyway to keep them happy.
Many in Japan and Korea would actually like to see the US pull out of the region, or at least substantially reduce its forces there. There is also the difficulty of finding money in their relatively small (compared to the US) defence budgets. There would also be demands to spend the money locally, rather than sending it overseas. So there would be a lot of pressure on those governments to not fund US forces to anything like the amount that the US currently does.
It would also strengthen China politically as the US is seen to weaken its position in the region. It might actually help diffuse the situation somewhat, especially around North Korea, but it could easily go the other way. Japan would likely push ahead with developing its military and revising its pacifist constitution.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Abortion in the United States is legal, whether or not you like it. Yet states like Texas introduce regulations that make it all but impossible for a woman to obtain that which is perfectly legal.
The "where I can pee" thing refers to the North Carolina law that says I have to use the men's room even though I'm a transgender woman and don't look even vaguely male. Amusingly, it would force this guy to use the ladies' room because he has XX chromosomes.
Sneaking religion into public schools refers to the teaching of Creationism in biology class.
If these stereotypes aren't racist, I don't know, what can possibly be...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Excuse me? Where did I blame "a religion" for "all" my problems?
I happen to think that religion (all religion, not just Christianity) is evil and a huge source of injustice in the world. But it's certainly not a cause of all problems in the world... just a lot of them.
And yes, parts of the United States are no better than ISIS-ruled territory in certain respects; the US is mostly a democracy but increasingly, parts of it are dangerously theocratic.
Oh, and I missed answering your question. Canada's a great place to live. Having spent time in both the USA and Canada, not to mention many other countries in the world, I'd definitely pick staying in Canada over anywhere else. My resolve may weaken in mid-February, but then I just look at US politics and it makes me feel better.
Yes. Like I said, the US dealing is with diversity better than most — with the possible exception of Brazil.
But it is still a burden and even our success is overestimated — if an American public school bans American flag as "offensive", there is a big problem.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
For cryin' out loud, this is just senseless hyperbole. Nobody is going to uproot themselves and move to another country just because Trump gets elected. The President is temporary. Moving to another country is not so temporary, and no reasonable person is going to go through that just because Trump gets elected.
It wasn't an American public school that banned the flag. It was a university student government. And most student governments are about as batshit crazy as the Evangelicals, except to the Left. Luckily, most of the students eventually grow up.
First of all, a university receiving public funds is also a public school (especially, if it is entirely State-owned as any branch of University of California is), and it did ban the flag — whether that move was initiated by the monkeys running the zoo or the older officials is secondary in importance.
More importantly, it happened in various actual public high schools too — on the authority of local principals and school districts alike. And the courts support that — for "safety". Evidently, the "batshit crazy" is spreading, while you remain in denial (and sniping at the harmless Evangelicals).
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
No, South Korea does not want the US to pull out or reduce our presence. They rely heavily on us and our big sticks to keep the North in check. Remove our extremely capable forces and the barrier to NK seeking a military resolution to the stalemate is greatly reduced. NK deciding to attack means Seoul is obliterated in minutes.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
Unlike Hitler Trump has several well adjusted children he seems to care quite a bit about. I kind of doubt he wants to destroy the world they live in.
love is just extroverted narcissism
Look, I happen not to agree with banning the flag... but seriously? That's the best you can come up with? Isn't banning the flag just a form of protected expression? Freedom of expression doesn't mean anything if only expression we approve of is allowed.
"harmless" Evangelicals? You must be joking.
Thanks to the Evangelicals, if I go to certain parts of the United States, I must put myself at risk of harassment, assault or murder just to use a public washroom. Thanks to the Evangelicals, in certain parts of the United States it's totally fine to deny LGBT people housing, employment and service.
Religion mixed into politics is totally, unquestionably evil.
Abortion in the United States is legal, whether or not you like it. Yet states like Texas introduce regulations that make it all but impossible for a woman to obtain that which is perfectly legal.
The "where I can pee" thing refers to the North Carolina law that says I have to use the men's room even though I'm a transgender woman and don't look even vaguely male. Amusingly, it would force this guy to use the ladies' room because he has XX chromosomes.
Sneaking religion into public schools refers to the teaching of Creationism in biology class.
It doesn't matter that it's legal. So was slavery. States still exercised their rights to ban that.
Where you can pee? If that is the worst suffering you go through for being transgender, then that just shows the US people are pretty tolerant. If we go the route of allowing people to use whatever restroom they want based on what sex they feel like they are that day, we might as well just make all bathrooms unisex.
A skin lesion may simply be harmless acne, or it may be a sign of cancer. When American children are told, that American flag may be "offensive" to the supposedly fellow Americans, I'm afraid, we are towards the latter. It is not "all" I got, but I deem this to be most troubling because of how wide-spread it is — California and South Carolina are very different locales in many respects, but not in this one...
Wow, that's a creative interpretation... No, a ban issued by a government official is not an expression at all — much less "protected".
That maxim is certainly true, but irrelevant to our conversation. Mexicans weren't prohibited from displaying Mexican flag in an American school, and I proudly have a Ukrainian bumper sticker without any harassment. But I recognize and respect the American flag — while the various schools consider it "offensive" enough to be banned. To me such bans are a clear sign of our "melting pot" struggling (if not outright failing) in dealing with the diversity.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Citations missing.
So, you think, the First Amendment protects a school principal's decision to ban American flag, but would like to ban religious people from running for office?
I'm afraid, your understanding of laws and ethics is just as messed up as your sexuality...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Where you can pee? If that is the worst suffering you go through for being transgender, then that just shows the US people are pretty tolerant.
Most US people are very tolerant. It's the batshit crazy Evangelicals who are bigoted. And hey, why don't you try going to the "opposite" restroom for the next couple of months and see how you fare?
It doesn't matter that it's legal.
Yes, it does. It's perfectly fine to oppose abortion and even to agitate to make it illegal. It's not perfectly fine to subvert the law with restrictive regulations. That's doing an end-run around democracy because it doesn't involve the political process.
The biggest threat of a Trump presidency is having agreement the same party in both the Congress and White House. In this regard, Trump isn't any scarier than any other Republican. Kaisich would be just as dangerous despite the fact that he's good at making himself look harmless. Even the impact of Bernie Breshnev would be blunted by a Congress that is hostile to him.
A good chunk of the Slashdot peanut gallery knows better that to be led around by the nose by the mass market news media.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Well, OK, banning the flag probably was a stupid decision. On the other hand, had violence erupted, the school district might have faced huge lawsuits, so they were stuck between a rock and a hard place.
And I'm not sure you can blame this on "diversity". It seems to me the real culprit is intolerance coupled with intense fear of litigation.
*correction* poohtato farming
And yes, parts of the United States are no better than ISIS-ruled territory in certain respects; the US is mostly a democracy but increasingly, parts of it are dangerously theocratic.
Wow. We are killing people, feeding their kids to their moms, raping, and drowning people? Which region is doing this?
I blame it on diversity because it is at the very root of this problem — there are enough people foreign (despite being born here) to American values and culture to credibly threaten violence over the very symbol of America. This othering by them is the problem — they would not "melt" in the the "pot" — and having to deal with such issues is the burden, the diversity presents.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
What he says often is military support offered by USA everywhere in the world is costly and not rewarded by beneficiaries to its real value
That's just the kind of corporate shortsightedness we need in government.
Note the qualifier in certain respects, by which I mean imposing religious beliefs on others and forcing women who want to terminate their pregnancies to come to term.
Absorbing immigrants takes resources. But I dispute that it's a net loss for a country; immigrants to a country tend to over-contribute to the economy once they get established. The actual cost/benefit analysis is much more complex (PDF) than you seem to be stating.
I had a collegue that is black in the tech field that moved to Canada. He and his kids were very dark skinned and when I expressed a half serious concern about him moving to a northern latitude and vitamin d deficiency he laughed it off. Still, I think it is strange that someone with a dark skin tone would move north given how much vitamin d from sunlight seems to impact cardiovascular health, bone density and all that. It makes me wonder what the health impacts on those immigrant communities are and the long-term viability for those physical traits in those environments given the limited time modern people already spend outdoors.
Neither the gain nor the loss are even quantifiable, but I'm satisfied that you agree, that "it is complex" — rather than insist on it being a "clear benefit".
Brookings is a Left-leaning institution, and thus favors immigrants from poor countries, where government is the main source of wealth — who happened to represent the vast majority of new immigrants over the last several decades.
If even Brookings' analysis remains "complex", then it is probably a net loss. At least, with the currently applied methods of absorption...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
I really don't think Trump will be as bad as people seem to think.
That's only because he'll turn in to a politician and abandon all of his campaign promises.
Trump is so twisted and ignorant that I want to run like hell to almost any other nation if he is elected. He is a liar and an egomaniac and will try to turn the uS into a fascist nation. I would also expect a total collapse of the economic system. Recently he ranted about a deliberate devaluation of the dollar to enable us to compete with China. How many people understand, that the path to devaluing the dollar would be deliberate, high, rates of inflation? In essence, he wants to cut your paychecks in half. And if you get raises to compensate for inflation then you will be pushed into a much higher tax bracket. With inflation your property tax will also go way up as suddenly your property will be worth a lot more, low value dollars.
There is nothing moderate about being for gun control.
Shouldn't that be $75 a month? Government needs money and of course the rich shouldn't pay anymore tax then the average as once they have enough money, they'll become job creators. So here we are with low taxes (income that is), the most expensive gasoline in N. American, the most expensive alcohol in N. America, half our hydro bill going into general revenue, half our car insurance going into general revenue, the highest child poverty rates in Canada, the highest homeless rates in Canada, the most expensive housing in N. America (3rd in the world), the lowest minimum wage in Canada and an economy supported by and dependent on China.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
No, the whole point of having so many checks and balances is to stop bad decisions of one branch of government makes before they create havoc. Small government has nothing to do with it.
Mostly true, as much due to Harper knowing the Canadian people generally wouldn't put up with that BS.
I live next to a bible belt and the fuckers try their hardest to do all the same things as the American Evangelicals. Such a hateful group of people, who'd be the first ones in line to crucify Christ if he came back.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
Yeah, go from one extreme to another, surely there's absolutely no way to find some nice middle point?
Manuals are your last resort only
Jean Saisrein? Tu veux pas dire Jean Sérien plutôt?
I'd say "fuck" and "godamnit" could be replacements. C'est dur de traduire les jurons Québécois car ils sont pour la plupart basés sur la religion catholique.
Only in Montréal, maybe Québec city. In other places, sure there's going to be a lot, but not "most". And in those that do speak english, you won't be able to understand half of them because of the accent. Imagine someone from Texas trying to talk with someone from Australia.
I didn't say "South Korea wants to the US to pull out", that would be stupid because countries don't have opinions. I said some people in South Korea want it to happen, as to many in Japan.
South Korea is hardly matched militarily by the North, and could build themselves up even more if they wanted to. The partnership with the US is mostly because the US likes to be active in the area, near China, and because SK benefits essentially for free because of that. It does however raise tensions in the area, particularly the yearly war games off the NK coast. Many in SK think it would be better to adopt a less aggressive stance, because the best way to resolve the situation is peacefully.
I expect someone will claim that NK is insane and can't be reasoned with, but that's simply not true. For example, Japan has made great progress over recent years trying to resolve the kidnappings of its citizens by NK. Meanwhile the military dick waving and posturing of the US and certain parts of the SK government have contributed to NK developing atomic weapons and long range missiles.
Anyway, whatever you think, it doesn't matter to my original argument, which was merely that a significant number of people would make it very difficult for SK to pay the US any significant money for continued support.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
With roughly 28,500 troops (many non-combat...doctors, lawyers, cooks, etc.) in Korea, our force there is not much more than a tripwire, helping to ensure we'd be involved in the even that the north decides to do something really stupid. Japan has about 50,000, and the gripe is usually about the real estate (like Kadena AB in Okinawa) which would have a lot of value to those on the island. While "many in Japan and Korea would actually like to see the US pull out", many would not for both financial and security reasons.
Just another day in Paradise
Someone should tell the US military.
-- sudon't
Air-ride Equipped
But this makes him merely a pseudonymous coward.
I agree, it hardly makes a difference. See my sig.
-- sudon't
Air-ride Equipped
I really don't think Trump will be as bad as people seem to think. That's not a terribly high barrier to cross, however. I don't think he's quite the monster that everyone wants to claim he is.
No, I'm not voting for Trump. I just don't think he's Hitler.
I agree. Also, he'll only succeed in a fraction of the stuff he wants to do. He will, however, be a uniter. Both the Ds and Rs will oppose him.
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
True.
However say what you want about him, but he has been pretty successful building the "Trump" brand. If all he did was S&P he might be worth more money, however he would also be unknown and probably not running pretty successfully for President (relatively speaking).
Considering so many important things in the world is based on perceived value, confidence, and opinion, Trump has a way of lying pretty successfully...
However when your competition (republicans) is so terrible, it is hard not to come off smelling like roses no matter what you do or say. I expect the Democrats to win by probably one of the largest landslides in US history. Perhaps that will shake up the republican party enough into reality.
This is true and also a concern - it's one of the reasons I opened the thread - I'm off to bed soon. But, yes...
Or, rather, no... No, I don't think that this poll is accurate. Trump actually has a number of proponents in the IT industry. They're in that camp for varied reasons but they exist and I'm pretty sure that the numbers are higher than this poll would have you believe. I'm also a bit squirrelly about the number that they have come up with.
In this thread, we'll find more than 14 people who SUPPORT Trump, never mind being willing to move to Canada. I'm too lazy to look but I bet this survey was written to get one type of response, to be manipulated, or to get partial results.
"How likely are you to be willing to emigrate to Canada if Trump is elected president:
0 --- 1 --- 2 --- 3 --- 4 --- 5
With zero meaning that there's no possible way they're going to move to Canada to 5 being very likely to seek a visa.
Now, anybody who answered a number greater than zero is counted in this poll and that's where they got the 84% from - I suspect. It's standard practice. It's also a trick question - few people want to answer in a negative fashion. People are gullible and swallow it all the time. They may also take results from one question and add them in with the first - again being careful about verbiage.
If you give me a few days and a bunch of resources, I could poll the average American and come back with "Stalin was a great man - according to 87% of people in the garments industry."
No, Canada is the prototype that Sanders wants to see implemented. Single payer Healthcare system (Healthcare is a right, not a privilege or option).
Ditto for prescription drugs. Access to your choice of doctor, specialist, and specialist's hospital affiliation.
Re Education, its between $200-400/semester per course. ($2k / 12mo) Your fees do not finance NFL style football stadiums, building mortgages or outrageous compensations for chairpersons. First year University is is done in community college at most minimal cost, as continuation to high school. A bachelor degree is typically 3 years of further study. You can afford university and healthcare and prescription medication. We are a "no gun" country, multi-cultural, and proud of what we have.
Leslie Satenstein Montreal Quebec Canada
It's a dishonest comparison. That isn't even close to comparison to act like that makes some of the US like the Issis controlled territories.
There are allot of similarities to democrats and the nazi party but it doesn't mean that is an honest comparison.
Issis is imposing their beliefs allot differently than US Christians are. Christians are not cutting off the heads of non-Christians
He thinks it would be better for Iran to have the bomb.
Where you can pee? If that is the worst suffering you go through for being transgender, then that just shows the US people are pretty tolerant.
Most US people are very tolerant. It's the batshit crazy Evangelicals who are bigoted. And hey, why don't you try going to the "opposite" restroom for the next couple of months and see how you fare?
I imagine I'd be arrested.
It doesn't matter that it's legal.
Yes, it does. It's perfectly fine to oppose abortion and even to agitate to make it illegal. It's not perfectly fine to subvert the law with restrictive regulations. That's doing an end-run around democracy because it doesn't involve the political process.
We do this with everythng. And the people doing it clearly campained in the elections they would be doing that
This is exactly why we tech people need to work on new physics and technology to exploit it, namely with wormholes to alternate dimensions. Since every place else on this planet seems to be going to hell, the answer is simple: we need to "slide" into an alternate universe where things are better. The was a TV show about this a while ago. I kinda liked the one where there were very few men left....
Yep, it's exactly like the old adage about slowly boiling a frog.
Except that in reality, frogs aren't actually that stupid. They'll jump out when the water gets too hot. Humans aren't as smart.
http://fortune.com/2015/08/20/...
https://finance.yahoo.com/news...
You are welcome on my lawn.
I love when my Canadian friends talk about how accepting and multicultural they are, being isolated so far north from significant land immigration traffic.
I always offer that we can place buses at the US/Mexico border with a sign saying "free trip to Canada", and drop off anyone who wishes to ride on the Canadian side of the border.
Um, I'm not sure the OP was saying anything negative about legalizing marijuana, he was clearly calling out policies allowing Muslim immigration as being "suicidal". The two aren't the same. Heck I know a bunch of somewhat right-wing people here in the US who are all in favor of legalizing weed, but are also all in favor of banning all immigration by Muslims. (They'd even like to have a Canadian-style healthcare system too.)
Being anti-drug-war does not necessarily equate with being open-borders.
If we go the route of allowing people to use whatever restroom they want based on what sex they feel like they are that day, we might as well just make all bathrooms unisex.
And what's wrong with that? There's plenty of places in western Europe like that.
While it's true that Islam is currently a rather backwards and violent religion, Christianity did the same stuff back in the middle ages. And back then, Islamic society was actually rather progressive by comparison. I guess back then, Islamic society had become a lot like much of Christian society today: people followed a watered-down version of the religion, mostly to keep up appearances and to hear some nice-sounding inspirational stuff on sundays (or whatever day they worship on). But then the fundies took over and things went straight down the shitter.
It'd be all too easy for the exact same thing to happen again with Christianity. It happened before, both with Islam and also with Christianity (again, see the middle ages), and Judaism has its own similar sects. This is the danger with these religions.
Delete your account.
You are welcome on my lawn.
No, he intends to go after remittances by illegal immigrants to their relatives in Mexico.
How... How are you unfamiliar with my posts?
Did you really just call me part of an in-group? Oh my... I continually express my own views, which are not mirrored by people here. In fact, I work to change other's views by showing them alternatives.
I usually ignore ACs as of late but I figure this one needs a response. Hell, I'm the guy who, "learned a few new commands" and "doesn't mind" systemd. Yup. I voice that opinion because I hold that opinion. If, by coincidence, my views mirror someone else's then I am surprised, more often than not. An in-group? Hmm... I don't argue that such exists - but I suspect it's not as large as you're expecting. I'm just not sure why you'd think I'm in that group - especially with that for a reply.
At any rate, we've got checks and balances that kind of still work. We'll be okay. Trump's not Hitler, really.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
Nor would Obama's. Or Hillary's.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
...and it's wealth of social programs to any and all Americans that choose to cross the border and start taking high-tech jobs from Canadians? So I guess I can just cross the border, rent an apartment, and go out and apply for a job & get free health care? How long after I cross the border will I be able to vote in Canadian elections, become a Canadian citizen, and start reaping all those wonderful social programs? I'm positive Canada wouldn't discriminate against foreigners that simply start showing up and drive down the pay scales for low-skill jobs, right?
a society consisting of people from different countries and races can break apart much too easily along the ethnic and religious lines
Then your society isn't really diverse. Or you have elements within it that are willing to destroy it by emphasizing differences rather than working together for the good of all. Better to eliminate these trouble-makers than bend to their wishes for a monoculture.
Have gnu, will travel.
It takes a lot to get even dumber, but that does. At so many levels.
I'm just repeating what I remember him saying, I didn't say it was a great idea.
We do this [subverting the law with restrictive regulations] with everythng. And the people doing it clearly campained in the elections they would be doing that
In a democratic society, you cannot take away people's civil rights even if you have a popular mandate. Abortion is legal in the United States; this was decided by the Supreme Court. The Court decided in a 7-2 vote that women have a Constitutional right to privacy when deciding to terminate their pregnancies. Removing this right (a constitutional right, as decided by the court) through regulations is simply undermining the democratic process.
If you still don't see that, imagine if it were left-wing lawmakers applying restrictive regulations to guns and ammunition and see how many people would cry foul. Well, it's the same principle.
You did not list the logical steps leading you to this conclusion...
Nor this one...
Yes, yes. For everyone to be nice, you must kill all of the naughty ones.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
You did not list the logical steps leading you to this conclusion.
Neither did you. So welcome to the club.
Have gnu, will travel.
If it is then it's an incredibly unprofitable one.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
The Montreal region has more than 3.8 million people, and the Quebec city region has over half a million. The total population is 8.25 million, and there are other enclaves, such as the eastern townships, where English is traditionally used.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
lol I didn't mean to blame you for him. ;)
Maybe while his magical tax fairy is tracking remittances, it can spare an extra wave of the wand to provide the information the IRS needs to finish auditing Trump. They've been auditing him for over a decade, because he won't stop playing games with "continuing transactions" that make it impossible for them to collect enough information to finish the audit.
This very narrow POC on foreign policy is exactly why Trump does not belong in the white house.
The foreign military presence of the United states is a major part of what has ensured a peaceful world for the past 50 years. Under this umbrella of protection, the world economy has flourished and grown exponentially - and being the largest free market economy in the world, the US has been by far the biggest beneficiary. For every dollar spent on foreign lrotection, many more are earned by US companies that would likely not have been earned without that peace. And, we have not even gotten into the very tangible benefits of exporting your culture to the rest of the world via the military.
Let me guess - if Trump is elected you'll get him to build you a wall along your southern border. Seems fair.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
That's true, "most people" does mean numbers and those two combined do account for "most".
If you go outside of these two cities, though, prepare to meet quite a lot of people who either don't speak english, or just berry-lee.
No, Hillary is like Hitler.
Yeah, but when I respond to a logged in user, I know they see my response, and might actually respond, and I know that response is from the same person. With an AC, you never know what you will get. Also, every comment a logged in user makes is available to peruse, while ACs can say anything and it never effects them in any way.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
Um, I don't agree with most of what Barbara said, but You kind of got your response a little confused.
It was in great shape before Obama got hold of it. By handing it to the ayatollah he created the civil wars we now see.
Actually, Obama had no choice on this one, the Iraqi president asked us to leave, are we going to refuse the lawful request of a sitting president and occupy his country? Bush tried to negotiate some soldiers staying, but the Iraqi president refused any concession that included lawful immunity to our soldiers, which was unpalatable to our military leaders. The entire ISIS thing falls on the Iraqi president's shoulders; he made the choice to kick the US soldiers out of Iraq, no one else did.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
Personally, I wonder what the response would be if it were asked about Hillary instead...she should be being prosecuted for the shit she pulled, but she is still the golden child of the Democratic Party.
I however will say, I hate all the candidates from both of the parties. I am waiting to see who runs from the other parties to see if anyone looks good from there. I am not however threatening to throw a temper tantrum because the nominations/elections don't go the way I want, but that may have more to do with neither party representing me in any way.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
I've lived in the US and I've never seen someone pull a gun in my 38 years. People like you are cowards, who let others influence and define their fears. Move to Denmark. It's a great place for authoritarians.
Where in the US ?
Since apparently in Texas it's now considered appropriate to walk into an Arby's with an AR15 slung across your shoulder. Of course if a white person does it, it's his second amendment right. If anybody else did that... he would be shot for being a clear and present danger. The fact is that the US has one of the highest gun-death rates in the world and every country that has a higher one is either a third-world hell-hole or in the middle of a war.
And I would say I am the opposite of a coward. Cowards own guns. Brave men feel no need nor desire for them. It takes a special kind of cowardice to only feel safe in the presence of the means to kill.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Ok, sorry, let me clarify this a bit. You are not "insane" — that's a loaded term anyway. But you do have a delusion:
(That "superior evidence", in this case, is your "biological sex".)
Either that, or, maybe, you have a lighter disorder of pseudologia fantastica.
I'm sorry, but I'm not buying into this subtle differences between "being" and "identifying as". For a man to "identify as" woman is just as (if not more!) delusional (or fraudulent) as for a White to identify as Black. Your "bilogical sex" makes you a man, by definition — which destines you to M-labeled bathrooms, whatever you are wearing.
Nonsense. "Sex" and "gender" are interchangeable synonyms, the latter employed purely to avoid the erotic connotations of the former, when discussing things like grammar. Your attempts to differentiate between these terms may itself be symptomatic of the delusion.
Any references to "scientific papers" can not, unfortunately, be given much credence — because of how sensitive a topic this is politically. For example, imagine that same "sexual dimorphism in the brain" argument used to justify the wage-disparity between sexes. Heck, you don't even need to imagine, just consider the fate of one L.H. Summers.
So, you are claiming, that some organs of your body disagree with others in identifying your sex (brain vs. genitalia)? Even if that were true, you are "fixing" the wrong organs... Which is, of course, your choice — just do not demand, the rest of society changes the language (and bathrooms) to accommodate it.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
In gun loving Wisconsin. I even work in the firearms industry and I've never seen someone pull a gun in anger.
Wisconsin ? Aren't the gun-lovers there mostly actual deer hunters ?
Sorry, but that's just not a representative sample. Those towns in Texas where people insist they have a right to walk into a grocery store with an AR-15 in their hands and NOT be presumed armed robbers (at least if you're white) - now that's a representative sample of gun nuttery. I'm not a fan of hunting, I tolerate the idea but I don't support or participate in it. But hunters are by and large responsible gun owners. They simply are not valid samples for "gun lovers" however.
"The federal government is invalid" sovereign-citizen militian crazy people however - they probably shouldn't have guns. Almost no country that has gun control have eradicated legal guns (a few did, true, but this is neither the average nor the majority case). Canada despite very strict gun control actually has higher per-capita gun ownership than the U.S.
Gun control would have almost no impact in Wisconson. The kind of people it would affect, well the world is genuinely better off if they have to arm themselves with knives - or better yet - can't get a gun without comitting a crime and giving us a reason to put them in jail.
Guns for self-defense is a notoriously bad idea, it's literally the worst possible way to try and achieve that goal. Guns for good guys against bad guys - doesn't work. There are virtually NO examples where it has ever actually worked - it fundamentally relies on fatally failing to understand what happens to people in those circumstances. Nothing you can imagine comes close to it. In the real world - unless you are already highly trained(i.e. a cop or a veteran) even if you have a gun you will not be able to use it and the majority of times when somebody in such a situation actually managed to at least get a shot off - they ended up missing the shooter and hitting a bystander.
None of the reasons given not to control guns make any sense. There really is no sane reason to want to own a pistol or a revolver. Hell there is, for the most part, no sane reason to let a cop have one. Many countries do not - their cops aren't killed as often as American cops are and don't kill citizens as often either. They also have less crime.
In the end, statistically, the single most likely result of owning a handgun is you commit suicide with it - and the second most likely result is somebody you love gets shot by accident and the third most likely result is shooting somebody you love in a fit of rage. Self defence happens so rarely it's not even in the top 10 most likely things to happen. Nowhere that gun control was instituted did it get followed by increases in crime. It has never happened. It has always been followed by significant drops in the murder rate in fact. Which is supported by the fact that guns are useless for self defence in the first place. Oh, and quite a lot of people who did actually shoot intruders with their guns are now serving time for murder - because you can't do that, you only gain the right to use lethal force (anywhere in the free world in fact) in self defence when you have a genuine threat to your life or the lives of others. Courts have never held that you "there is somebody in my house" is reasonably translated into a genuine threat to your life without proof the person was at least armed and their weapon drawn. A threat to your television is not a threat that justifies killing somebody - and you will end up convicted of murder if you act like it does. Frankly the best way to mitigate that threat is to have home-insurance.
Guns don't make you safer. And only a coward needs something tangible that doesn't work to gain a feeling of safety. Much the same way I see a great deal of cowardice in religion (it's not wonder the two are so correlated). Fear of death coupled with the desperate desire to control the uncontrollable lets people keep deadly and useless things in their homes (actually endangering themselves for a false sense of security) and invent elaborate stories about how you get another life
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
What do you know about"those small towns in Texas"? What do you know about Wisconsin? Statistically, by an enormous margin, the most likely result of owning a handgun is absolutely nothing, I didn't read the rest of your crap, because listening to a foreigner tell me what I should believe and how I should live is pretty much at the bottom of the list of things I want to do before I die.
And there it is in a nutshell. American exceptionalism. Its been bullshit in every nation that ever thought they were exceptional and it is bullshot now. I may be a foreigner but I have lived on 4 different continents in 12 different countries. If anything I know more than the Average American because my vision and experience is not so myopic. And if there is one thing I learned from living among all those cultures (including yours by the way) its that while they are all beautifull and unique none are exceptional. Every culture has wonderful things the world should emulate and horifying things they should change. Gun culture is one of the latter in your case.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *