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It's Harder To Get an Uber or Lyft If You're Black, Study Says (time.com)
Black riders have to wait "significantly longer" for their Uber cabs and experience "double" the cancellation rates of white passengers, according to a new study published by the National Bureau of Economic Research. The study, which also observed a similar pattern among Lyft drivers, claims it has found "significant evidence of racial discrimination" in ride-hailing services based on a pair of experiments in Seattle and Boston. From a report on Time: Researchers pulled data from more than 1,400 field tests conducted using mostly Uber and Lyft, but also traditional taxi services. The findings in Boston and Seattle showed evidence of discrimination that manifested in either longer waits or a higher likelihood for cancellation. In Seattle, African-American UberX users on average waited 5 minutes and 15 seconds for pick-ups -- roughly 30% longer than white riders, who waited 4 minutes on average. Lyft users did not experience a significant difference during the experiment. When the research assistants switched between using white-sounding and African-American-sounding names, they did not find a significant increase in their wait times. But the overall rates at which drivers canceled the ride after it was assigned to them was more than one in 10 for riders with black-sounding names, roughly double than for riders with white-sounding names.
Soooooo...!!
This is further proof that these are really just taxi companies.
What are these African-American sounding names? Are you saying that you can tell someone's race by their name? But if races are social constructs and not real, what are they really measuring?
I wonder if study considered black drivers, or just black riders.
Also, did black riders prefer calling non-blacks with intent to later complain?
maybe if uber let it's drivers C & C they would pickup / go to more rough areas
its more the drivers are not going into a crime laden naberhood. unfortunately for the black guy he probably lives there.
Or at least pass the spliff, you cheapskate!
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
This is sad, but not really surprising, and is just one more example of why Uber/Lyft are going to be a disaster for the country once they more completely displace the regulated taxi industry.
Like what, mohammads? That wiuld be a jihaddists-sounding name and no sane person would pick that up.
So maybe it might make sense to name children with more "American" sounding names rather than [made-up] supposedly African ones? I am not saying such discrimination is right, just pointing out it shouldn't be a surprise there are some real-world effects when choosing a name like "Latishquia."
In other news, I bet Muslim-sounding names have a harder time too. Is that surprising?
It might be a good idea for such services to use a nickname or "handle" or just numeric login name for relaying the information to the drivers, releasing the real name only when the actual ride begins....
Were user ratings equal between the ethnicities? Drivers will less likely accept a passenger if his/her user rating is lower than average.
I'd really be interested, are there now names for blacks and names for whites? I thought we're finally over that shit.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
African Americans do in fact, like to make up names/spellings.
No I don't know why.
IIRC there were something like 300 unique spellings of unique used as a name. How many do you think aren't black?
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
It's not that the riders were black, but rather that the names chosen "sounded black". This is significant as it introduces culture as a possible data point which wasn't controlled for.
Were I a freelance driver, I'm not sure how much I'd want to deal with a "La-DASH-ya" either.
Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
...do their apps specify race when you are reserving a ride?
Or maybe it's because the pick up point is in a high crime area.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
I've known Nigerians with Nigerian-sounding names who became US citizens and drove taxis. Only God knows what language they scream in when Brazil is beating Nigeria in the soccer playoffs.
...people are cunts. Film at 11.
Quick! Someone do a TED talk!
Seastead this.
I'd rather wait for a bus than use either of these services. At least the driver lets me drink my beer in peace.
African Americans do in fact, like to make up names/spellings.
No I don't know why.
IIRC there were something like 300 unique spellings of unique used as a name. How many do you think aren't black?
Here are three clues:
1. Denied their original names along with their entire language(s).
2. Systematcally denied literacy.
3. Begrudgingly allowed literacy, but excluded from work that would tend to favor an investment in attaining literacy.
In the meantime hundreds of years pass and traditions evolve as they do.
"Elon" (as in Elon Musk).
He's an African-American from South Africa.
Really? You don't say!
We've known this for decades. The motivation behind Affirmative action was based on hard data. (Weather or not its a good idea or implementation is a different question)
With the rise of big data stuff like this is going to be more common. - If for no other reason that there is money to be made gauging a conumers preferences. Those include race related ones.
What's that about statistics and lies?
Uber drivers dont get my real name, they get my handle. There is no reason for them to know my true full name. UBER, my WISP and CC company has the relevant info if a legal issue arises.
Good-bye
Long ago, it was well known that even black taxi drivers didn't want to pick up black passengers because of a higher risk of being robbed.
It's Harder to get an Uber or Lyft If You Have a Stupid Sounding Name, Study Says
I delivered pizzas as a part-time job when I was in high school. One particular area had a high black population. All the drivers hated delivering there and would try to skip out on the delivery (go to bathroom, take a break, etc), not because the customers were black, but because they didn't tip well. The same thing happened in another area which was predominantly white, but low income (also bad tippers).
Technically this still counts as a prejudice (pre-judging the customer as a bad tipper based solely on where they live). But it's one which is statistically correct most of the time rather than some of the time.
There are first names and family names that are disproportionately common among African-Americans.
http://names.mongabay.com/data... shows over 50% of those with a surname of Jackson self-identify as "Black" (data is from the 2000 US census). Over 40% of Americans with the surname Williams, Harris, Robinson, and Coleman self-identify as "Black."
Washington is the "big winner" with over 80% of Americans with that last name self-identifying as "Black."
http://abcnews.go.com/2020/top... shows some of the "whitest" and "blackest" names.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
Wait a second. If I am a private driver, in my private vehicle, and I am not providing a service but just ride sharing, then any and all hailers are hitchhikers. Such as they are hitchhikers, it is my personal discretion who I allow into my vehicle and who do I not.
Now on the other hand, if I was working for a transportation service, hauling people around is my job, and I wouldn't care less who is in the car as long as they are paying.
I have so far taken in only one hitchhiker in my car, I was stopped in front of a one lane 2 way tunnel waiting for my direction to be allowed in, and there was a smelly woman in dirty muddy rags by the side of the road. There were some vandals or whatcha-call-em, perhaps hooligans, in the two cars behind me, who got out of their cars and started to harass the woman, so I let her in as she was in immediate distress. Other than that, I see no reason to haul around hitchhikers.
maybe if uber let it's drivers C & C they would pickup / go to more rough areas
I'm pretty sure it's illegal to Command & Conquer in the greater Seattle area (not sure about Boston).
Over 40% of Americans with the surname Williams...self-identify as "Black."
But with Williams being the number 3 surname in the country, 40% isn't enough to make it an "African-American-sounding name".
They don't. But that doesn't stop the perception that they do, which perpetuates the myth (and turns into a correlation).
The statistics are clear, a never-accused white is more likely to commit a crime than a never-accused Black. But Blacks are much more likely to be falsely accused, and end up in jail (or dead, like Trevon Martin) for some false accusation by someone. And once they've been through the prison system, they have recidivism similar to everyone else, and end up re-offenders.
If we stopped throwing innocent Blacks in jail, they'd offend less than whites. If we stopped the prisons from being training/breeding grounds for hardened criminals, Blacks would offend less than whites. Blacks in the US are less violent and criminal than whites (when you correct for recidivism).
It's mainly the perception and the perpetuation of the perception that exists.
But my question is, who cares if they are discriminated against for a cab? Trump discriminates openly against Blacks looking for homes, and he's praised for it. Blacks are screened out for jobs for "ethnic" names, or other demographic information that identifies them as minority. So if you can't get a job, and can't get a place to live, why would you care about a cab? Oh, wait. "Uber" gets the front page, even if irrelevant.
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"When the research assistants switched between using white-sounding and African-American-sounding names"
African-America "sounding names" well that's scientific.
Oh wait no that's racist.
Would you pick up someone named Judas Iscariot? Adolf Hitler? Josef Stalin?
Why would someone name their child a name that makes it harder for them in life?
Smells like opportunity to me. "Yes, I'll still pick you up, but it's $10 extra based on your destination"
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
Alden, Kent, Trent, Blaine and Chauncey aren't in the top 20 whitest-sounding boy names. That list is bullshit.
Just like cops shooting people of color at 2-10 times the rate of whites is a coincidence.
Right.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Of course that's nonsense.
Nobody named their kids 'Trevon' in 1960. It's some sort of new insanity.
Granting it is current illiteracy that leads to 'Latrina'. It must be 'acting white' to have any french vocabulary.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
What, you don't think white people do the same thing?
Of course they do, but you are swimming in white culture so you don't even notice it.
For example: Catherine, Katherine, Caitlin, Carrie, Kari, Karen, Katrina, Katerina, Kathleen, Katya.
And those are just the more common variants, all the actual variants add up to well over 70.
As for "unique," no the basename for that is Monique which is a french name with a long history. Variants you may be more familiar with include Monica and Mona.
What is that even supposed to mean? I can't expand C & C to anything rational.
But how will the Music Factory survive in a rough environment?
Yes. Yes, I have ("do" - they're still alive.). And yes, they ARE actually African. For the record, some of them aren't "black". Being born in an African country is what makes you African. Being born in Africa and emigrating to the USA is what makes you an African-American. Your name and skin color have nothing to do with it.
hurdur! Thank you for today's lesson in applying autistic literalism to avoid confronting social complexities.
If the pickup was at night it's entirely possible that the drivers simply could not see the black passengers...
Kane lives in death!
I think he means conceal and carry, and by that I think he means have a gun within reach to shoot people who try to mug them.
They don't. But that doesn't stop the perception that they do, which perpetuates the myth (and turns into a correlation).
The statistics are clear, a never-accused white is more likely to commit a crime than a never-accused Black. ....
Is that something like an insomniac cat?
Given that living locations vary greatly by cost, I'd say realizing that low cost living leads to low tip amounts is not pre-judgement at all. It's basic econ. The local Range Rover dealership isn't marketing to the bad tippers either.
Of course that's nonsense.
So is using a long O in Colin and pronouncing Craig to rhyme with Greg.
I'm not faulting the delivery drivers (who were "selfishly" looking out for themselves just as much as a poorer person tipping less), but I'm academically curious whether the reluctance to deliver to those areas leads to a self fulfilling prophecy - slower delivery times that deserve a smaller tip, leads to slower delivery times, leads to smaller tips...
I only smoke sherm when taking Uber.
Having also delivered pizza. The _worst_ tippers are in the rich neighborhoods and the ghetto. People that also _work_ for a living are likely to tip decently.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
Maybe they tip less because they get poorer service as all the drivers waste time trying to avoid going there. Creates a feedback loop.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Its not racist at all. With birth records, you can map a person's name as well as their race, and all kinds of random other data.
If Eliyah are almost entirely named to black babies, it's a 'black' name statistically.
If Cody's are almost entirely named to white babies, it's a 'white' name statistically.
Once you've got a baseline of extreme limits of 'white', 'black', 'hyspanic', 'asian', etc.. names, you can perform blind tests on how people react to different names. There's nothing racist about it. Its pretty simple to quantify.
The hard names are those used by all cultures, which is why researchers don't use those names when performing these types of tests.
Bye!
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2015/crime-in-the-u.s.-2015/tables/table-43
May I have some of whatever you're on? I would love to shit rainbows and see unicorns.
...had something to do with it.
Nobody named their kids 'Trevon' in 1960. It's some sort of new insanity.
Black Americans have adopted names for themselves that seemed "strange" to other Americans since they were forced to come here and give up their actual names to begin with.
Consider also that there is much more crossover between Black Americans and Carribean, Latin American and Native Americans than among whites and any of these groups, and additionally that their choices in names reflect the cultural and phonetic influences from Spanish and French languages.
Plus the whole, "why would I give my kid the same name as 50,000 assholes and their asshole grandfathers?" factor.
White South Africans don't consider themselves African. So your assertion is wrong. He's Dutch-American (or something like that). As most white people who move out of Africa claim the heritage of their ancestors, not location of birth as their ethnicity.
Learn to love Alaska
They will figure it out. Parents in the '70s learned not to name their kids "Dick Butkiss" because of all the teasing the kids would get at school. Parents in this millennium will figure out not to name their kids something that would prevent Uber from picking them up.
Spoken like a True Democrat that ignores facts and statistic's. Like how African american teens are 10 times more likely to commit a homicide then whites and Hispanic's COMBINED. African american's in general are 8 times more likely commit a Homicide then Whites and Hispanic's COMBINED. Facts and stats show there is a very violent sub culture in african American community. You claim its a perception but the facts show the truth, 647 people been killed in chicago this year( as of right now), Outta all those people only 6 were at the hands of a cop. Outta all those 647 people 481 were African American's killed. Take 1 guess at only time they ever protested? The site doesn't break down racial or ethnicity of 6 people killed by police but least 475 weren't killed by police but that was only time they ever protest is when its a person wear a badge.
- First the actual source link is: http://www.usatoday.com/story/...
- Second, there is no data released.
- Third, gotta call "whites" european-americans if we go by that logic.
Release the data, if you want people to take these studies as seriously as they need to be.
they hate going but one driver still had to go no matter what, so no, your point is invalid. its just the culture of some areas.
Maybe true, maybe an excuse. All you are doing is examining why they are acting like dumbasses, not disputing their dumbassness.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
Wouldn't he be a European-American then? Somebody self identifying as a Zulu-American would seem to be a better corollary to Dutch-American. GP isn't wrong, the labels are based on bullshit, loaded premises.
The only Trent and the only Blaine I ever knew were both black.
"...they did not find a significant increase in their wait times. But the overall rates at which drivers canceled the ride after it was assigned to them was .. roughly double than for riders with white-sounding names."
Rather than just conveniently assume "racism" they should first dig a little deeper and, say, check with the drivers themselves for the existence of other correlations.
...the fact is, stereotypes don't come from a vacuum.
Sorry. If you don't want your kid to wait for a cab, name them Michael or Kathy, not T'quan or Yuneek.
Assuming you aren't trolling;
If 'they' weren't disproportionately from the lower end of the socio-economic spectrum, 'they' wouldn't commit a disproportionate number of crimes.
Crime correlates pretty well with poverty and wealth disparity. Even if you argue that the criminal behaviour is part of what keeps them in poverty, how do you break the cycle? It's certainly a reasonable argument to insist that people are responsible for their own actions, but that's kind of simplistic - not everyone has equal access to all possible choices and of the options that are available, people from different backgrounds are going to experience different 'costs'.
Don't get me wrong, I think that excusing criminal behaviour by blaming 'society' or conditions does a great disservice to the majority of people who experience those same conditions and who choose, repeatedly, to live useful, law-abiding lives. I also think its grossly irresponsible to see people who have had greater difficulties than most and who have fewer resources and do nothing except point the finger. Some combination of personal _and_ social responsibility is needed - neither, alone, is as likely to succeed.
that LaTrina has the same right to a job she's qualified for as Richard? You're basically saying racism's OK as long as it's not too bleeding obvious. Speaking of which, of course nobody f'n had to test LaTrina vs Harley. They never got that far because the most ridiculous test cases blew up first. You would think folks would at least _try_ to hide their racism. Not so much.
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And? I don't think anyone contests that. But the researcher haven't tried to see if the wait times would go up if they used identifying markers for other groups. Vegetarians? Republicans? Or, more narrowly, Trump supporters? Using "black" sounding names is a marker which makes it more likely that a person belongs to a certain group. It doesn't prove that this group experiences more hostility than individuals from other groups which are generally judged by their group membership. A study from a few years ago showed that Prius drivers were the most hostile drivers on the road. So group-affiliation can be an indication of anti-social behavior just as much it can make a person be more likely to be on the receiving end of anti-social behavior. They should do a study of what the delay would be if the desired destination is a Trump rally vs a sporting event (to eliminate congestion as a baseline for bias against driving to a location).
Any guest worker system is indistinguishable from indentured servitude.
you're legally required to validate each candidate on their merits. If you've done what you just suggested then you haven't followed the law. Casual and institutional racism are still racism.
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Hey, that chart shows that while 27.4% of people named "White" identify as "Black", only 18.6% of people named "Black" do.
/s
That chart is obviously incorrect.
as long as La-dash-ya is well behaved and gives you no cause for concern you are legally required to accept her business when you run a public business. The same protections extend to you and everyone else and for reasons to innumerable to list.
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Uber doesn't allow tips. Mind you, the drivers are all absolutely still private contractors thank you very much.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
they start with a hypothesis, test it, and if they get positive results refine. John Oliver just did a very amusing piece on the whole process and how silly it is when lay people jump into a discussion like this one we're having without reading study's statistics and just reading the headline instead.
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My word, he's not "employable", either. Sir Richard employs others, not vice-versa. The very idea.
Also, sir Richard is on the Riviera at this time, so would you kindly cease pestering the house staff. Go on, now.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
People will take you more seriously if you don't use Trevon Martin, who was killed while committing a violent assault that he initiated, as an example of someone who's innocent.
I'll grant freely and willingly that the other party to that case is scarcely a stellar example of humanity as well, and that it took two of them to cause that incident, but a jury found that what was done in that situation was justified.
Now me, I would have avoided that situation even if armed and even if justified. I dont feel the need to be assertive when I'm armed but it is not illegal. But tell me: would avoiding a black man in that exact situation be racist?
And, when you correct for recidivism, Blacks commit fewer crimes. Feel free to post the facts to prove me wrong. So far, I've been modded down, and people argued, but nobody has argued the specific point I made.
Learn to love Alaska
Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics. Ignoring facts like I'm certain if you look at the poverty level where the people in Chicago were killed it's probably fairly high. Also the part where the population is most likely >80% African American. And the part where violence has been stirred.. and how many of the killed were part of gang or other subsets where there is a tendency to step outside the realm of lawsuits?
That isn't what is typically done in these studies. Rather than using a valid method (statistical correlates of names with race) they instead use forced choice ratios.
They ask a sample of 100 people is __name__ black or white?
Then based on the forced choice percentages they assign a 'race' to the name.
They tend to also use extremely common 'white' names and extremely uncommon 'black' names (The studies that have used common black names such as Ebony; show that the common black name ends up with better response rates than the less common white names).
Nope, didn't matter how fast I delivered to those places.
Based on the summery it sounds like:
1) The overall statistics for Uber implied that Black people on average got worse service.
2) Some scientists ran a proper study with controls and found that no discrimination was happening.
3) So we are left with the glaringly obvious conclusion that Uber drivers probably do not wait around in crime filled neighborhoods, and are more likely to refuse to service crime filled neighborhoods.
Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
'Black sounding names'? As for the Person of Color v. White people wait and cancellation time - was any consideration made for the neighborhoods and the times of day the rides were requested?
I don't remember any thing in the uber app that identifies the race of the requester. How can there be a bias. Not saying that it doesn't exist but not seeing how it happens
"John", "George" are very common Nigerian names. English is the native tongue of Nigerians.
$10 based on your skin color.
"Correct for recidivism"?!
What the fuck?
I'm sure that the next time I'm mugged by a black person (happened twice already), it will be of great consolidation that they were statistically lesa likely to do that, once you correct for recidivism.
You're a fucking blathering moron. You are what people mean when they speak of ignorant, out-of-touch, smug, condescending liberal elitists who whine about society, but are totally insulated from the reality of what they preach.
Go fuck yourself.
No, crime does NOT correlate with poverty. This has been debunked over, and over, and over by literally hundreds of studies.
The correlation disappears when you factor out race.
Race and criminality are EIGHT TIMES more strongly correlated than income levels.
Do a fucking Google search at the very least next time before making an ass of yourself.
When I was in college I volunteered in a community service group and became one of the managers. I noticed that one of the other managers complained a lot about his volunteers -- they had a bad attitude, they weren't reliable, etc. Which was weird because I'd worked with the same people and found them to be perfectly reliable and enthusiastic. So I began to watch this guy, and the problem became obvious: he was a condescending jerk who pissed his volunteers off, and when they wouldn't work with him anymore he'd badmouth them. Then the other managers would get a negative attitude towards that volunteer and he'd end up quitting.
Now I don't want to overstate the case here, but there is such a thing as a self-fulfilling prophecy. If drivers try to avoid low-income neighborhoods, then people in that neighborhood will experience, on average, bad service from your pizzeria. Even when a delivery is on time, expecting it to be late poisons the experience. It takes a lot of good customer service to undo even a single instance of bad service, much less a pattern of it.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
But Blacks are much more likely to be falsely accused, and end up in jail (or dead, like Trevon Martin)
All of the physical evidence indicates that Trayvon Martin (yes, you misspelled his name) was killed while committing felony assault. Nobody is going to take your comments seriously when you managed to fuck up two things in one sentence.
All of the physical evidence indicates that Trayvon Martin (yes, you misspelled his name) was killed while committing felony assault.
All the physical evidence indicates he was stalked by an armed aggressor down a blind alley, and when he defended himself from that aggressor, the aggressor killed him.
Learn to love Alaska
Have you been punched in the face lately? If not, why not?
Yeah... recidivism rate is part of crime rate by definition (you know what recidivism means right.. it's relapse into crime, i.e. committing another crime). You can't correct for crime rate when looking at the crime rate. It's like saying "Oh turns out 19 year old men commit crimes at the same rate as nuns once you correct for their crime rate disparities." It's nonsense.
Household Poverty And Nonfatal Violent Victimization, 2008–2012
Second link from the google search for "correlation race poverty crime".
Or, from wikipedia entry Race and crime in the United States.
I've tried variations on "correlation race poverty crime" with "eight" "8 times" etc. to see if I could find where you were sourcing your claim, but am drawing a blank. Rather than continue to make an ass of myself, perhaps you'd be so kind as to provide a link or citation?
Why are you commenting anonymously? You're making good points.
You mean something like Dindu Nuffins?
I wonder why this might be the case. Could it be due to the fact that people are more likely to be robbed by black people than white / asian people? No that would not make sense. Could it be that black people have a great time intimidating and scaring the shit out of those pansy crackers. No that is crazy. It must be because all white people hate black people. Yes, it is because all whites are inherently racist.
> Nobody named their kids 'Trevon' in 1960. It's some sort of new insanity.
No they named them 'Trevor'
If you think changing a single letter in a name is "insanity" then you have completely lost all concept of scale.
Your rigid belief as to how choosing a non-traditional name makes you a dumbass reveals that you are the far greater dumbass. Perhaps you should move to China where you are only permitted to choose from names spelled with just the half of chinese characters that currently have computer representations.
In my country we have pagan celebrations with a procession of white versus black painted people. We don't call Africans 'black' in our language. A black person is an evil person and it has nothing to do with skin color. Yet that pagan celebration that occurs in mid-winter and mid-summer is now banned because it has been considered racist by some American chick who has too much power through the UN. She sees people with white paint and black paint and screams "black faces", completely ignoring the fact that this pagan fest is over 3000 years old.
The old Nazi collaborators were called black. The 'sub-Saharan' Africans where named with the 'n' word in our language. The 'n' word didn't have any negative meaning in our language. In fact it is also used to name the color when dressed in black. But this word has been banned. You now have the awkward situation where older people feel offended when someone younger says they wear a nice 'black' t-shirt. And the other way around a younger person who feels uneasy when an older person says they wear a nice 'n'-word t-shirt.
Now this 'when you're black' thing again. In my language it just means when you are a unpleasant, maybe evil, person. When I look at the Star Wars story, there is also the Light side and Dark side, the white versus black. It is American pop culture where there is still a feeling of white is good and black is evil, just like in our country. Political correctness has banned the use of some words because they are considered racist. Now we end up using words that simply mean something bad. So a black person is still a bad person, but because you also have to use black person for someone with an ebony colored skin the unconsciousness says it is a bad person.
One remarkable thing was a woman from Ghana who emigrated to our country because people in her country harassed her because she had a black skin. Indeed her skin was really black, not ebony. The ebony Ghanese were racist towards a pure black woman (some genetic disorder) and she had to move to a white country to escape racism. So one has to ask, is it really racism or is there also a lot of millennia old tradition of white versus black (day versus night?) that plays a role?
Black ravens, black cats, black cloths, ... it is all more on the bad/evil side. Because we have to call 'black people' black to not be racist, we actually compare them with the 'evilness' of the color black. Does this make sense at all what I'm thinking? This is a question I would really like to pose to those anti-racism 'scientists' to hear their opinion or simply to see if they are really researching or simply have an opinion they hold as the only truth.
It would be nonsense if the rate of incarceration were consistent. But there are great differences in how the first "minor" crimes are treated. A Black child caught shoplifting is more likely to be formally arrested than a white. While the white child will be given a warning by the shipowner or police and "released" to his parents.
Have you not seen all the rape memes? White athletes raping and getting no or minimal jail time, while "innocent" Black men getting long sentences?
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Could you point to some data backing that? It's the first time I heard about that.
Heard this on the radio today.
Great to know good old slashdot is now in lock-step with the mainstream media programming and calling it 'tech'.
~ People that think they are better than anyone else for any reason are the cause of all the strife in the world.
If providing a ride for a black person was a good experience, to and from a safe location, and profitable, they would be preferred.
Such as "Dwyane" instead of "Dwayne", and "Antawn" instead of "Antoine". Strangely they aren't pronounced the way they are spelled. Maybe not so strange - probably indicates the literacy level of their parents.
Uber and Lyft emphasized that they do not tolerate discrimination and their belief that ride-sharing apps make transportation more equitable and available than taxis.
That was borne out when researchers had students hail cabs in downtown Seattle. The first available taxi stopped 60% of the time for a white student but less than 20% of the time for black students. The white students never had more than four taxis pass them before one stopped. African-American students saw six or seven cabs pass them in 20% of cases.
citation
'The tyrant will always find pretext for his tyranny.' - Aesop's Fables
That's not possible to do though. You can't correct crime stats by correcting for crime stats. Maybe there are other factors that add to the recidivism rate for blacks that you can adjust for, but you can't adjust for the rate itself. That just doesn't make sense statistically. It's like having an algebra equation and doing a circular substitution, like "solve x^2 = 4, substitute x^2 for 4, x^2 = x^2, infinite solutions I guess!!!"
As for the memes you're talking about, wouldn't lighter sentences (but convictions nonetheless) lead to a higher recidivism rate for whites? "Hey I can get away with rape, I'll just do it again." Doesn't match reality.
Hmmm. I've never heard Musk refer to his origins or heritage, so I can't speak to that. I do wonder, though, if you're one of those really bright individuals who doesn't realize Africa is a continent, not a country. And how many people to you hear refer to themselves as North American?
Now, as far as country of origin... I've seen several interviews with Dave Matthews, and he does sometimes refer to himself as African, although usually more specifically South African. Several years ago I worked with a guy (whiter than me, which is saying something) who was from South Africa, who referred to himself as South African. Somebody once asked him (being thrown off by his coloring and all, but that wasn't making racist assumptions about a white guy at all, was it?) "You're African?" He didn't get all weird or say he was Dutch or anything like that. He said "Yes." You know, 'cause he was.
My wife has a friend, beautiful girl, blond hair, blue eyes, who was born and raised in Kenya. She refers to herself as Kenyan, but occasionally will say she's from Africa when people don't quite know where Kenya is (more common than you'd like to believe). 'Cause (wait for it...) she is. African, I mean.
So, yeah. Nice job of pulling stuff out of your ass to try to substantiate what you wish were true, but no dice. Thanks for playing though!
That's not possible to do though.
Sure it is. What's the crime rate of whites with no criminal record? Near zero. What's the crime rate of Blacks with no criminal record? Even lower than that.
As for the memes you're talking about, wouldn't lighter sentences (but convictions nonetheless) lead to a higher recidivism rate for whites? "Hey I can get away with rape, I'll just do it again." Doesn't match reality.
You've changed the subject. The American justice system is broken. You can't use that as proof that race isn't a factor, when that was one of the reasons race was a factor.
Learn to love Alaska
Are you saying Blacks and Mexicans don't get along?
White South Africans don't consider themselves African. So your assertion is wrong. He's Dutch-American (or something like that). As most white people who move out of Africa claim the heritage of their ancestors, not location of birth as their ethnicity.
It's not what anyone identifies with personally but what country was your country of origin, i.e. What's on your birth certificate/passport. White Africans are just being racist ass hats wanting to distance them selves from black Africans. Doesn't really surprise me considering South Africa's recent history.
You wrong. We just think that African-American tag you use is hilarious.
I am 5th generation white african
Sure it is. What's the crime rate of whites with no criminal record? Near zero. What's the crime rate of Blacks with no criminal record? Even lower than that.
Well maybe this is just a semantic difference or I misunderstood you.. you're not correcting for recidivism, you're excluding it. Anyway it would be interesting to see your numbers and how they hold up under different types of crime. Based on an article I just glanced over, recidivism rates are much lower for violent crimes than nonviolent crimes. So then it becomes a question of what type of crime you're interested in... rape and murder are much more serious and pertinent to a discussion of crime rates than spray painting... I mean rape and murder are the crimes people are most concerned about.
You've changed the subject. The American justice system is broken. You can't use that as proof that race isn't a factor, when that was one of the reasons race was a factor
If you recall, you brought up the memes of differing rape sentences, I was simply responding to that. If you're now assuming that the justice system is broken, then your whole argument falls apart. You can't adjust for nor exclude recidivism, because recidivism is meaningless under a broken system. The "true" recidivism rates are unknown because we are not cognizant of all criminal behavior. We can't measure relapses if we didn't catch the original act for instance. The documented recidivism rates can be assumed to be representative of the true rates if you believe the justice system works basically equally and effectively. If you believe it's broken, then the documented recidivism rate has no bearing to the true recidivism rate.
Or the smart thing to do is just not delivery to crime ridden slums.
It's not just "technically" prejudice, it's systemic racism which is usually backed up by valid statistics, but still harmful to society. Racism (and sexism, etc.) has nothing to do with statistics being right or wrong, but about creating an equal playing field.
Why don't all the poor, hard done by blacks just agree to live only with whites who WANT to live with them?
Oh, wait... that would be about one percent of white people, wouldn't it.
Why don't all the poor, hard done by blacks want to live AROUND THEIR OWN KIND? Like in Africa, for example?
Why aren't millions of white people moving to AFRICA every year, if we all want 'diversity', as the JEW media keeps telling us?
I've been to USA and i have to say, of all the races the blacks are the most chaotic and crazy.
Homophobia is also quite big in the black collective, far more than even your rednecks.
White South Africans don't consider themselves African.
They have absolutely consider themselves Africans. Heck, they call their language "Afrikaans" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans
Really, your claim is literally cretinous.
Catalin Braescu
Ofaly.com
Yup. It might be that Uber drivers avoid certain neighborhoods. Or that people with "African-American sounding names" have a different time schedule which triggers longer waits. Or that ... But no, let's cry racism before knowing anything. Because that worked so well for the boy that cried wolf, didn't it?
African Americans do in fact, like to make up names/spellings.
There are 9,726 listings for "Upgrade"
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I mean, honestly. Nïggers are violent, unpredictable, sub-human beasts that are more likely steal your car, rob you at gunpoint, or just beat the shit out of you for no reason - because they're nïggers, and that's what nïggers do. Everyone knows this is true, even if they pretend like they don't. Prejudice exists because stereotypes do not evolve in a vacuum.
4. Low IQ, and failure to grasp the basics of the English language.
"It's Harder To Get an Uber or Lyft If You Have a Black-sounding Name , Study Says." There are many blacks that have 'white-sounding' names like, say, Danny Glover or James (Earl) Jones or Sam(uel) Jackson - all of which are famous black actors - who would fall in the well-served 'white-sounding name' category of this study.
Technically this still counts as a prejudice (pre-judging the customer as a bad tipper based solely on where they live). But it's one which is statistically correct most of the time rather than some of the time.
You sure about that? It would be interesting to have data from your own deliveries to back it up.
I know I've seen general studies about tipping behavior in restaurants. Those show black people tipping wee bit less on average, but also reporting receiving worse service. Given that the service happens before the tipping, and its *supposed* to be a reward for good service ...
There's a difference between defending himself and pounding the other guy's head into the pavement.
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
If you think changing a single letter in a name is "insanity" then you have completely lost all concept of scale.
Zilliam, Robelt, Pakricia, Elozabeth...
Looks pretty insane to me.
When the research assistants switched between using white-sounding and African-American-sounding names, they did not find a significant increase in their wait times.
This is the actual result: no discrimination in wait times. Average wait times by race doesn't prove discrimination because race is correlated with other things like location.
But the overall rates at which drivers canceled the ride after it was assigned to them was more than one in 10 for riders with black-sounding names, roughly double than for riders with white-sounding names.
This sounds like a significant result.
However it's already tracked by the service and does not sound like a major inconvenience. Compare it to how hard it is to hail a cab while black: no tracking to fix the problem, and subjectively a much larger problem.
tl;dr should be "Uber and Lyft reduce discrimination."
And personally I fucking hate cab apps because privacy and don't use them, and am scared of being forced to use them by shift in market size.
Zimmerman had wounds on his nose and the back of his head, meanwhile martin had no wounds other than the bullet hole. Jabba the Hut even testified that Martin wanted to "go after that cracka", even after he had an easy chance to leave without having any confrontation. But instead he turns back, follows Zimmerman and confronts him, and then assaults him.
"John", "George" are very common Nigerian names.
Not among the Nigerians I've known.
English is the native tongue of Nigerians.
English is the official language of the former British colony. There are 521 languages spoken in Nigeria.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_Nigeria
You may remember them from such eye-opening studies as the dubya-administration funded study on why prisoners want to escape from prison.
I posted this 'discovery' weeks ago, and now it seems to have an enhanced validity: I learned that Uber drivers actually RATE THEIR PASSENGERS!! and communicate that rating to their network... I thought this practice could be an instrument for discrimination: a driver getting a call from a user of the service can first view the ratings of that passenger's earlier history ... and low ratings based on color or neighborhoods could affect how the driver responds to the call.... independent of the caller's name.
This practice is outrageous!
"There are 11 kinds of people: those who know binary, those who don't, and those who could not care less!"
> White South Africans don't consider themselves African.
Citation needed, because this is utter bullshit. Do you know any? I know plenty.
I delivered pizzas as a part-time job when I was in high school. One particular area had a high black population. All the drivers hated delivering there and would try to skip out on the delivery (go to bathroom, take a break, etc), not because the customers were black, but because they didn't tip well. The same thing happened in another area which was predominantly white, but low income (also bad tippers).
Technically this still counts as a prejudice (pre-judging the customer as a bad tipper based solely on where they live). But it's one which is statistically correct most of the time rather than some of the time.
Those who have low incomes tend to be poor tippers because they have LOW incomes. What a revelation!
Who cares about skin color? It is an irrational data point
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
I wonder if the same people that performed the study could run stats on tipping habits of AA vs rest of population. If African Americans tip less, then that might explain the lesser enthusiasm to serve them. I'm not being facetious.
White South Africans don't consider themselves African.
They have absolutely consider themselves Africans. Heck, they call their language "Afrikaans" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Really, your claim is literally cretinous.
I think the point is that they don't consider themselves "African" in the sense of "African-American". Whilst it may be technically accurate to call Elon Musk "African-American" 99% of normal people would assume this meant he was black, as "African-American" is synonymous with black. In America.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
I worked with a guy from South Africa who put down that he was African-American on all of his forms. He thought it was hysterical.
What are the numbers on deaths that are attributed to murder. The victim stats broken down by race.
Not the people being charged, because you've stated most blacks are "falsely accused".
If that is the case, who is killing all these young black men in black communities?
Why aren't we seeing more white people dying to violent crime?
I used to bag groceries when I was in high school, and back then the bagger would bring the groceries to your car for you and load them. They were frequently tipped, but not much.
We didn't have very many black people, so I didn't worry about them not tipping (there was one ghetto-looking family that for some reason felt entitled to park in the fire lane instead of getting a parking space like everyone else). However, I did learn to discriminate against people based on how many groceries they bought. I found that invariably, the people who bought so much stuff that it took 2 full carts would NEVER tip. Worse, these people usually expected me to push *both* carts at once! So I always tried to skip out on these jerks. People who bought 3 carts' worth of stuff, however, were good tippers, so it was important to be able to judge just how many carts of groceries they had bought. Also, old people were shitty tippers; they'd have expensive Cadillacs and give you a lecture about not slamming the trunk shut because it's auto-closing, but then get in their car and start it up and let you breathe fumes while loading the trunk. Middle-aged people with decent cars were the best tippers, frequently not getting that much stuff but still tipping the most (except maybe for the rare 3-cart shopper).
Unfortunately, it is true about black people and tipping: they're notoriously bad about it.
They will just rob you.
Reminds me of a lot of the hookers around here. Not the $50 streetwalkers, but the decent escorts. Won't see black guys. Even (especially) the black girls want nothing to do with black guys. When you ask why? They try to cheat out on paying them or haggle over price too much. They're cheap.
I know the article is trying to frame it as white, middle-class Uber drivers being racist fucks. Which is probably true. I think there might be larger cultural problems in the black community we're willfully overlooking, though. Is it still racist if black chicks from the ghetto want nothing to do with black dudes of ANY social strata?
For once Grish, we are in agreement.
https://www.balloon-juice.com/2003/03/20/mr-optimus-or-sgt-prime/
I actually met this guy in Camp Slayer Iraq 2007 and ate dinner with him. Many folks think it's military urban legend but it's ridiculously easy to get a name change. If your dad thought it would be clever to Johnny Cash that ass and name you Sue, you don't have to put up with that shit once you hit 18.
I had someone mention it to me, then I had to do my own research after. The studies about the higher arrest rate are there, the studies about the higher conviction rate are there. The studies about longer sentences are there. The studies about recidivism are there. But the number of meta studies that follow the cumulative effect are few. When you do the numbers yourself, the answer is there, but nobody wants the answer. It shows the huge racial bias left in the US.
Learn to love Alaska
Now I don't want to overstate the case here, but there is such a thing as a self-fulfilling prophecy. If low-income neighborhoods treat pizza drivers like shit, then people in that neighborhood will experience, on average, bad service from your pizzeria. Even when a delivery is on time, expecting them to not tip (or worse, complain) poisons the experience. It takes a lot of good experiences to undo even a single instance of bad confrontation, much less a pattern of it.
I changed it around a bit to show another side of the coin.
When reading your comment, I was on pins and needles waiting to see who you were going to relate the bad manager to --
blacks going around bitching that everyone treats them wrong, and therefore people get fed up with that and start treating them wrong
or drivers going around bitching that blacks always treat them wrong, and therefore provide poor service
I wasn't surprised when I reached your final analysis, but I did have an internal chuckle at the conundrum up to that point.
I just don't care. The possibility that someone grew up with poor parents and was too proud to change their name to make you feel better about them has probably never crossed your mind. If it has you've been quick to dismiss it because thinking about real racism might put you on the hook for doing something practical about it instead of something that "feels good".
My comment is still 100% valid. Her name tells you nothing about her as an individual. Only the circumstances of her birth.
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It isn't, you just choose to think so...
It is called playing the odds, a black person is more likely to commit a crime against you.
It's harder to just get on with shit when your so occupied with what colour every fucker is. Give it a rest already. Racism hasn't even a chance of going away while you're all on about black this, white that, brown, yellow, red and all the rest of it (apparently only black and white are the ones worth a damn though). Same with gender. Is white cop shoots innocent black person any worse than black cop shoots innocent white person and are either worse than cop shoots innocent person? If your answer is yes, you're part of the problem.
Wanna buy a shirt?
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It is still an irrational data point. Correlation is not causation.
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
I'm glad you've finally came to terms with your racism. I'm also happy you forgot to check Anonymous.
I bet you get called the r-word a lot, don't you?
Works both ways though. I lived in a condo three doors down from a pizza place (we were good tippers, but I'm guessing most people weren't).
Due to proximity, you could call up on busiest of nights, ask for a delivery, they'd say "Not delivering tonight, where you at?" -- they'd deliver when we told them (guess they got a LOT of business).
Beating someone's head on concrete is hardly equivilent to defending yourself.
If someone knocks me on the ground and tries to kill me by repeatedly slamming my head into the concrete, if I have a gun, better believe I would shoot them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
It is clear from the pictures at this link that Zimmerman was being attacked by a violent offender, and being followed by someone does not give you the right to commit assault against them. If he was concerned, he should have walked to somewhere secure, or made a call to police (if he had a phone), not beat the shit out of someone for committing the crime of walking in the same direction as you.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
No, you're still wrong... but many people enjoy being wrong and then defend their wrongness...
Black people commit crimes at a higher rate than white people. That is not correlation, it is a fact...
It's still a correlation. There is no direct connection between skin color and criminality.
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
Black people commit crimes at a higher rate than white people. That is not correlation, it is a fact...
Actually, it's an imprecise statement, unless you actually have data across the entirety of human history.
I doubt it. You really should know better than to make such open-ended statements, the only thing you've accomplished by making your claim, in the manner you have, is making yourself look like a racist bigot. Hardly a laudable goal.