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US Tells Germany To Stop Using Huawei Equipment Or Lose Some Intelligence Access (theverge.com)
The Wall Street Journal is reporting that the United States has told Germany to drop Huawei from its future plans or risk losing access to some U.S. intelligence. The U.S. says the Chinese company's equipment could be used for espionage -- a concern that Huawei says is unfounded. "The Trump administration has been pressing allies to end their relationships with Huawei, but Germany, moving ahead with its plans, has not moved to ban the company from its networks," reports The Verge. From the report: According to the Journal, a letter sent from the U.S. Ambassador to Germany warns the country that the U.S. will stop sharing some secrets if it allows Huawei to work on its next-generation 5G infrastructure. The letter, according to the Journal, argues that network security can't be effectively managed by audits of equipment or software. While the U.S. plans to continue sharing intelligence with Germany regardless, the Journal reports, officials plan to curtail the scope of that information if Huawei equipment is used in German infrastructure.
What's next - invade Germany?
That intelligence is nice but if it's not as nice as you think it is, well, you lose allies right quick that way.
And what's that one Chinese company to you anyway? There are so many more.
What else? Maybe Cisco? https://www.tomshardware.com/n...
So did the NSA use Huawei to spy on Merkel?
I think we'll get by just fine without it ...
Oh you Europeans are just jealous of how well people respond when the US commands.
Believe you me, the Swiss are getting as tired of the EU as you are of the US.
Believe me, Without the EU you wouldn't have the knowledge the build the military tech you require to maintain your stupid empire.
And indeed, maybe we should start banning the US from our European knowledge and technology.
You know ASML? The company that makes the factories and machines that your silly Intel needs to make CPUs that are littered with security faults? European.
I can go on and on and on this way. Including space technology that you need to make and launch your military spy satellites. All European.
The truth is that your economy sucks, that your US brainpower sucks and that Europe and especially European technology, science and academic education dominates your empire in every individual aspect of humanity.
Your extremist capitalist society requires extravagant propaganda to maintain itself. And it's utterly scheduled for complete failure. All the signs are clear that the US empire is going down. And it's going down hard.
We just ask you to be silent. And don't kill too many people as you go down. There is an earth and a humanity after the US's empire.
Come on. You just stated that WE are not stupid. So I'm going to assume that you include yourself.
Just because the US does not want us to use Huawei for their own selfish reasons, does not mean that we should just trust China and Huwawei out of spite. Turn our backs on one big power that has pissed us off in the recent past, just to become dependent on another big power who? What kind of stupid reasoning is that?
Even if there's no evidence of spying so far, we should still demand from them to let us review all their hardware and code. Get the CCC involved. It's in our own best interest to do this.
We really need to start assigning mod points more accurately soon
This is obviously true. We shouldn't be naive about the Chinese.
And I agree. Let's get the CCC involved. Let's use reproducible builds for the source code. Let's put the SoCs and chips under an electron microscope. Let's let the EU institutions fund such analysis and research in foreign hardware.
We have plenty of money and if not we can let the ECB print the money for this.
However. Let's not let the Americans tell us with whom we do business and with whom we don't.
We will do business with China.
Full stop.
Don't buy huwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawei, it's my way or the huwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawei.
This is a joke, btw.
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
Yes yes. It's going really well for the Brits. You can see that.
Poor people living there. It must have been great listening to the populist propaganda back then, though. Is costing them and will cost them their welfare state.
But whatever. If you look at the stock market in the EU, you notice that we've mostly passed the pain already. The UK has not, though. The EU country's economy is going fine and continuing. As expected.
Why do I speak English? Well, because you don't speak any other language. And I'm communicating to people like you. It's kinda a tradition in Europe to try to speak the language of the person in front of you. It's a form of politeness. Usually if the person in front of you notices that you have difficulties speaking their language, they'll try to make a friendly and social compromise with you on a language you both know.
Very often that is English. That's because internationally English is the current lingua Romana. When that lingua Romana switches to some other language, you bet that we will switch too. And that this website wont be dominantly in English.
But English is a relatively simple language. So why not? I'm fine with it.
You seem to be to only one who wants to turn that into a sign of superiority for the US. Well, actually, the US got English as their mother tongue from foreign invasions from Europe in the past. You do know that, don't you?
If it wasn't for the US involvement in the second world war, we would probably be speaking Russian over here.
However. Nice Godwin you did there.
You loose the debate. Completely.
Why doesn't anyone talk about the NSA's known actions to install physical and software backdoors in American hardware, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/..., and that Huawei has never been shown to do that?
This looks like a Trump MAGA Tamtrum to protect Cisco, etc, and wage a useless trade ware.
As an European, I don't feel identified with this person's comment and tone.
Where exactly did Trunp say buy American 5g?
He did not. You dumb children have to make shit up to justify your TDS.
Go ahead, use the Chinese governments equipment in your national network. Same company already busted for spying, supporting a nuclear terrorist state, money laundering and who knows what else?
You hate Trump so much you would rather deal with your enemies. Well, go ahead. Do what you like. The price is intelligence info. Especially important considering your mass importation policy of terrorist rapists.
You Eurotrash are that stupid. And anyway you abdicated your future by importing migrant labor. They are Europe's future. Better get used to that idea and quickly, or leave while you can.
I have no idea what makes you think I'm a US citizen.
Oh and for the record. The commander and military force who liberated my village was Canadian.
The guy has a statue. We remember the soldiers who died for us every year with the whole village. Respectfully organized by the village counsel and federal government.
Some of them stayed here and they got housing from out government. They nowadays have a family, children and grandchildren. They are all integrated in our societies. And they are very much respected by our society. They just live among us, enjoying the freedom their grandfathers fought for. Just like our grandfathers did. Alongside with them.
Well, invoking Godwin's law is only legitimate if the mentioning of Nazi Germany isn't connected to the topic.
And it IS quite possible that without US intervention, the Soviets would have caved to the Nazi onslaught. After all, Stalin DID send unarmed men to defend Stalingrad, did he not?
So yeah, America did have its uses. YOU need to accept that. You're probably right, tthough, that this has little influence on our current debate.
actually Godwin doesn’t apply here given that it is directly related. Nice attempt at deflection though. Either way I guess you would rather be under Putin's rule than what you have currently.
Anything that spies on you sends the results to the same database in the end, which certain alphabet agencies and Mossad have direct access to.
Use of Huawei by Germany should be discontinued because it would be a threat to US intelligence for sharing secret information with Germany.
Get real, most Americans cannot find Venezuela on a map much less give a flying rat's ass about it. The problem in the knob in the White House.
Just try not to kill them. For once. Try not to.
If you want to talk bye-bye, you just wait till you have to pay for your own military instead of mooching off the United States. Bye-bye free college. And don’t even start with that you have your own military shit I have been a UN peacekeeper before. The largest country to contribute forces outside of the United States only donates 1200 to 2000 troops. That pales in comparison to the 30,000 troops we have to supply. I would love nothing better than to have to start pulling your weight for you. It’s about time our citizens got free college instead of having to bail your asses out all the time. I doubt you’d understand that since you can’t fight your way out of a wet paper bag, but still. You make no sense, you rail against nationalism, and then cry like a little bitch when you experience globalism. If you want the United States out of your business you should be preaching nationalism dumbass
And since they spied on Merkel already, what the fuck do they think Germany feels about being told what they have to do to share with the USA? This is fucking Trump, misogynist, making this move.
You know, maybe it would have done you good. However we could not allow your manufacturing capabilities and your harbours with access to the Atlantic and Mediterranean used by the Soviets. By the way, Dieselgate should be a good reminder that we can switch off the EU economy when we please, and that the EU wouldn't last ten minutes in a military confrontation with the US. Keep this firmly in mind.
As I said, we would probably be speaking Russian.
It indeed has little to do with what is going on today.
Multiple generations have passed since this event. As a non-German European I even don't blame any single German person anymore.
This is now history.
Because none of their kit was ever backdoored (see iraq war where US very proudly admitted they disabled remotely the iraqui telecoms kit (which was US kit).
So, basically, in short with this veiled threat to Germany, the US is trying to get the german intelligence services to be better buddies with the chinese.
Greed and politics for the win!
Since everybody is forced to use VPN to access Google and such.
But we'll go with the batshit crazy stupid version you prefer, then: USA tells germany that if they move to 5G that the USA will stop sharing anything with them from their intel (though they will still demand that Germany hand over stuff to them, even if it is via a proxy state like the UK).
Please don't save us and stay home. Spend your American tax dollars on bridges and education.
Like we do.
You need it.
A military confrontation between the EU and the US would end in an earth that is sterile. Keep this firmly in mind.
Better use US made stuff so US intelligence can have a backdoor.
Damn Chines won't allow us in.
WW2 has fuck all to do with the USA's better skills, except in so far as Europe being fucked up by the war while the USA was untouched entirely let to the economic boom the USA foind after it.
The fuck does nazi germany (who would not have won WW2 anyway, once he started invading Russia) have to do with democratic germany using chinese kit?
FFS you retarded moron.
Sounds like a great idea to ask the ECB to print Euros so that we can create our own DARPA.
We need the Euro to inflate anyway.
The EU's economy is a lot larger than the US's economy.
You bet that we can support a larger military than your country can.
We just don't want to, right now.
But challenge us. Go ahead. You'll quickly notice how fast we will militarily dominate you after you are already economically dominated by the EU (and nowadays China, too).
Nice try. Germany and Russia were allies until Roosevelt and Churchhill got the idea of persuading Germany to doublecross Stalin. With that little tidbit gone, it would’ve been divided 50-50 between them. Well I’m sure Mussolini would’ve gotten a couple hand-me-downs
My guess is you’re from France, the country that sued Yahoo because somebody was able to look up information about the third Reich. Apparently over there if they are recent from the history books it just never happened. But hey what’s a little genocide between neighbors as long as your art museums don’t get destroyed, am I right comrad? When your kids are born do they already have the brown pants and the white flag or does that come later?
The "American empire" had nothing to do with the Nazi defeat. It was the Soviet Union and the European Resistance that put a nail in that coffin. The US waited until the end of 1941 to pick sides.
I don't get your joke. Please explain.
How the claim from merkins demanding that their mercenary work, MASSIVLEY paid for over generations from the UK, is normally "you'd be speaking german if it weren't for us", because as we all know, even merkins, the USA only has rose tints to claim they're the best in the world, so they have to trade on long-past assistance (paid or gifted, they will presume it was gifted). Yet they aren't doing it here. It's now the Russians who would have won the war if the USA hadn't leapt in after joining 3 years too late (though be fair, the UK and most of Europe were 2 years late before that, sorry Poland and central europe), but it was never counted that way until Germany are the ones being screamed at for not being sufficiently cowed by USA's mercenary actions 70 years ago.
Because the reason why the USA joined in was twofold:
Primarily, because Germany declared war on them The USA would not have gone in otherwise, they were making big bank off Germany investments.
Secondarily to stop Russia gaining most of Europe because even then the red scare was looming for "god's own chosen country". After all if godless commies were to do better, it would mean god preferred the GODLESS to the holy peoples of merkinania.
How? EU doesn't have an army (unless you count that joke called PESCO). Britain does but it is leaving. France won't use its nukes 'for the EU'.
You are a moron. You probably think you are a 'European citizen', whatever that means.
Do you mean the political EU where they are not a part of and just have signed several agreements/treaties that, if they so wish, can un-sign?
Or do you mean the geographical EU?
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
Of course we should consider that Huawai may be forced to include backdoors.
On the other hand, with Cisco, we know it.
And if the US wants to start the blackmailing game, I'm sure they can call Cisco and make sure that their prices are.... compareable. Or if you have anything that may hint that Huawai indeed build in backdoors: Come up with some proof. Or at least an effing hint. Or clue. Or inkling... anything that is better than mere claim.
I'd even go as far and say that we'd be willing to believe any actual evidence (better to be spied on by the US than China) but as long there isn't anything like that the only sensible way to go is to put any possible vendor through a strict security check.
bickerdyke
Germany even after the Versailles treaty rebuilt its army so quickly it caught everybody by surprise.
Not only that. Almost all military high-tech that is being developed in the world is being developed in the European Union. This includes rockets for your ballistic missiles, space industry, airplanes, etc.
You really think we can't develop military hardware to fight the US? Look at where your army's toys come from.
They come from us. Especially the high tech. Especially that.
You don't want us to turn those toys against you.
Germany doesn't want Russia to get a hold of their intel.
That means that it is better to let China snoop in than to let the US snoop in.
Oh that evil German rule that gave all their citizens jobs and created programs for the betterment of their non-parasite citizens. If only we could all import those with no common heritage to suck the welfare teat and rot our nations from within.
"Mooching the United States"?
How so? Please elaborate, with real numbers based on real data.
Ok so the US is concerned that Huawei gear could be used to spy.
The question I have is, why the hell is data (government or otherwise) being sent over cellular networks in a way that compromised gear (regardless of manufacturer) could steal it?
What data (intelligence or otherwise) are the US scared the Chinese might steal and why would it be sent over any networks without encryption?
Ever asked why there are so many refugees and who is often responsible for them?
Ever asked what drives Islamic terrorists (tip: US drone war, etc.)?
The European countries already have militaries. Two of the best in the world are in Europe: UK and France. You just hear trump complain about the USA military being used by europe and believe, because (a) you're an idiot) (b) you listen to bigger idiots.
Feel free to try. Meanwhile in the real world you couldn't even take on Serbia without the US. :) And by the way, any Euro military move against the US would be answered with immediate destruction of European industrial and transport infrastructure. The only nuclear assets the EU could use are the French SLBM fleet, and it would doom Europe to nuclear destruction. Of course, you can always align with Russia. :)
I figured I give you a low tech example: The Goalkeeper.
This thing is keeping your aircraft carriers safe. Developed and produced in The Netherlands.
But I can also show you some websites of European companies who are producing the mirrors and camera's of your spy satellites, rocket engines, bombs being given to your F22 pilots. You want nuclear technology including nuclear weapons? Sure. We do that too. Better than you. Much better and much more reliable. Like the German cars, you know. The ones everybody wants because they actually work.
The US's technology is basically marketing. The EU's technology is the real thing that actually works.
I you had listened French and German intelligence agencies, 9/11 probably wouldn't have happened.
But you didn't.
Instead of LISTENING you [try to] SPY on us.
From european POV, US intelligence seems to be more and more about hurting our economy and nothing else.
So I wouldn't be too confident on this kind of threat to make Germany drop Huawei.
We don't trust american hardware more than others.
If you stop sharing secrets with us then be it, I guess you wouldn't be bothered if EU don't share anything at all with US too.
Of course you can develop military hardware, and the industrial infrastructure to manufacture it. But that takes time. The idea is to have such hardware toward the beginning of a conflict - very hard to build a factory once air superiority is forfeited and bombs rain down upon any ground movement. The idea of a US-European conflict is absurd - the US is the EU's security umbrella, and has been since WW2.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
And after that event, all of the world's military powers will be bombarding the US with nuclear weapons. Including the remaining EU military power.
Of course is the idea absurd. I wasn't the one who suggested it in this thread.
I called out the absurdity of the very idea from the beginning.
So they won't be able to sell the information back they would get from the bugs in the US made 5G network equipment? ;)
Why would you buy anything from Huawei? Why not support an EU company? Doing business with China is going to be a lot harder when China is spying on you.
The only pblic record is people in the USA claiming this shit is happening.
Look up any UN peacekeeper involvement and run the numbers of body contribution. The US foots 80%. Go ahead, look it up, I’m waiting. While you’re at it how about donating as much money as we do to NATO? It cost money to keep the lights running you know, and the EU has just as many fucking billionaires as we do, how about paying an equal share? Is it too much to ask? Maybe then we could afford to fucking send our people to college without making them permanent financial slaves the rest of their life
Because why not? Sure we can ask Nokia and Siemens to work harder. But if they don't want to compete hard enough with Huawei, we just buy Huawei.
It's called capitalism.
OK.
9/11 would not have happened if you had listened French intelligence agency.
It took years for France to convince US that it operates the highest ever ranked spies in USSR.
So as you never listened to us but prefer to spy on us I guess you'll be ok with EU stopping to share secrets too.
OK again
Let's make laws to forbid EU countries to buy american weapons.
France and Germany are pissed of seeing eastern countries buying american crappy weapons or vehicles because eastern countries believe that will help 'em to get US "protection".
In 2017, the U.S. accounted for 51.1 percent of NATO's combined GDP and 71.7 percent of its combined defense expenditure. In short, the U.S. contributed more funds to NATO than Germany, France, Italy, Spain, the United Kingdom and Canada combined.
Printing money increases supply and drives deflation, I'd suggest you not knowing something that simple is a pretty good indicator of how seriously the rest of your rhetoric should be considered.
The EU can't viably support a military the size of America's and nor should it want to. First the EU's GDP is roughly the same as the USA's not "a lot larger". Secondly, Europe has (rightly in my opinion) considerable government spending requirements on priorities like universal healthcare that the USA doesn't. The USA spends around $450,000,000,000 (500 Billion dollars) more on it's military than the EU states (inc the UK). It would be incredibly difficult for the EU to find nearly $1,000 per citizen per year in additional taxation or cuts to government spending to fund that increase. Even if they did, tripling military spending in a way that is remotely effective would take a couple of decades.
And you know what the above shouldn't matter. Although the EU should probably be investing more in defence the world, and Europe itself, doesn't need another military of that scale. The relative differences between the EU and the USA are still quite small, and anyone suggesting that it's beneficial to either side for this not to be a close friendship is an idiot or shilling for a country that benefits from that relationship being harmed.
Feel free to try. We're standing here. Meanwhile the EU will do as the US say. As always. :)
That's a nice piece of Russian propaganda you believe there.
It would be nice if they at least match 1:1 for troop donation. They are almost the same size the United States is it too much to ask for it to be 50-50?
You know who is spying on the German government ? US spy agencies, that's right. So much for being "partners".
All that Huawei fud is being spread without any technical evidence, it is clearly made up to block 5G competition, nicely disguised as "security concerns".
I'm absolutely not disagreeing with you that the EU doesn't need a mega military like the US has.
The result would only be military confrontations that would basically wipe out all life forms on earth.
This is obviously not beneficial for either the US or the EU.
However. The EU does need to do business with China. No matter what the US thinks about that. This includes doing business with Huawei.
We are not part of the US's trade war. So the US can fuck off.
So what? We don't want to spend money on soldiers and military toys.
You do.
You are basically telling us to spend money on something we don't want.
Why don't you fuck off with your military?
Get out of Europe. Get out of Rammstein. Go away.
When you have someone who is willing to put the tab on their credit card to go out partying why not? Lets be honest that is how the US is funding the military spending to keep the defense economy running. It's like a snake eating its own tail. Some point something is going to give, China could stop it tomorrow except they have too much money invested as well.
Do you speak Mandarin, Russian, or Arabic?
It is critically important to speak your Masters native language if you want to survive as a thrall.
So? We don't want to spend money on military.
You, the US (assuming you are a US citizen) do.
We don't.
Please leave Europe with your military.
Go away.
Actually, increasingly, we are ignoring you.
For example. Very few EU countries helped you in Iraq. Very few helped you in Syria.
You can bet that almost none will help you in Venezuela.
Meanwhile we are building the North Stream 2 pipeline with Russia.
You and your regime are being ignored.
We also want you and your military to leave Europe. We are indeed not investing in NATO. We will start investing in our own European army.
This will continue like that until you Americans get it.
We want you to leave.
The cost of free higher education is nothing compared to the US military budget. Let's face it, you need to pay for colleges because it is the American Way of Live and everything else would be communism. Guess why the USA have the strongest military presence in nearly every area of conflict?
(1) Because the USA started half of them.
(2) Because they have to keep all those hands busy.
No party dares to gut the military, both for the direct backslash in terms of election funding and the socioeconomic changes. Lot's of unemployed people, esp. lower income families where the military is the only job to find.
A large part of the current conflict with Russia is a direct result of the NATO violating the commitments made during the negotiations of the German Reunion. Imagine China stationing troops and missiles not just on Cuba, but Mexico, the Caribbean and all of Canada?
The problems in the middle east? Remember those regime changes the USA helped along? What about Afghanistan? Latin America?
The comments are always full of whattaboutism with Cisco. That's a red herring to the discussion. And to the arrogant Europeans who think they can live without US intelligence because Orange Man Bad. Enjoy losing access to all of those satellites, drones, ELINT platforms and more. Its a hard pill to swallow but Europe's military is tiny and you simply haven't invested in those platforms. Without access to US assets you have little to no intelligence gathering capability on your own. I also don't think there is anything unreasonable about the requirements. Would you have said the same thing in the 60's if the US refused to share intel over Russian built radios? Why do you think Chinese built hardware is acceptable for official purposes. You have your own tech companies, buy their hardware.
Certain things are documented over here. Like who liberated who isn't a matter of propaganda but a matter of well documented facts with thousands of witnesses.
We tried. Your guys begged us not to. Tell your guys to stop begging. Again, stop bitching about nationalism when your clearly against globalism. Nationalism is the opposite of globalism, you do understand how this works right? First you panick when trump wanted to pull out of nato, now your mad that he didnt. Make up your mind
So when the guy with the credit card is funding the party, its prettymuch his call on which bars you hit and whose balloons get bought right? Thats generally how it works.
I speak Dutch (well, Flemish). My master's native language used to be French.
Our Dutch speaking area is right now the area that is the area that keeps the country economically alive.
We say here that a language is a dialect with an army.
Well. There was never a "Flemish" army because Flemish are so many dialects that we'd kill each other with laughter about all the different ways to say friet (frietn, frut, frutten, fruttekes, etc) before we could pick up weapons to fight each other over it.
Still. Our masters (the Francophones in Brussels about 200 or so years ago) couldn't make us speak French to each other.
If there is any population on this earth who you can't convince that military might or political might can force a group of people to speak some language, it's the population that I grew up in. The Flemish people.
Will will psychologically drain you, your colonels and soldiers so much that they will massively start killing each other. Ask Napoleon, ask Julius Caesar, ask Hitler ask anybody. They all left Belgium. Because we are fucking assholes who will fuck up, psychologically, the minds of your stupid leaders.
It's totally absurd. You don't want to rule us. You will kill yourself.
Do you speak Mandarin, Russian, or Arabic?
It is critically important to speak your Masters native language if you want to survive as a thrall.
Arabic isn't too hard to speak, it can be easy to write, but it's a bitch to read.
The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
We simply don't want to spend money on military. And especially not on military like NATO that helps the US with world dominance.
So no. We're not going to try to match 1:1 for troop donation.
Bye.
Uh, I think you'd have less information about threats in the world without access to American information gathering.
That's about it. What do I care if Germany has 25% more terrorist attacks? It won't effect the parts of their economy that affect me.
And it isn't like Germany spends money collecting an equal amount of information to share.
I want the US Government to focus on protecting Americans; if we share data with allies, it is because we have shared values and a common cause. If the other country decides that is no longer true, then damn straight we should stop sharing data. Fucking DUH, that's what us American fuckwits think. But we have the same information access either way, too, so who is the fuckwit?
Also, nobody gets to kill Venezuelans but Venezuelans. Hasn't Germany done enough killing on their own, why are you chomping at the bit to see more killing? Why the fuck would the US bomb Venezuela? Are you that clueless that you don't even know that wars have causal factors?
We want you to slowly leave, while we build up our own EU army.
Not drastically and immediate.
But if you do leave immediate and drastically, then that's fine too.
We'll cope. We might take from you the military NATO bases and weapons that are stored there, though. If necessary by force.
You really think that "Yankee go home" is means "please stay"?
"It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
Not really. You are still spending your credit card money in our European bar or disco. If we, the owner, don't want you here then you leave.
No matter the size of your stupid credit card bank account.
We can assume that the US intelligence on the issues pertaining German security (say terrorist network cells in Germany, or German infrastructure being infiltrated by foreign actors) is the one that interests Germans the most, and it's inconceivable that US won't share it because of Huawei. Imagine that after a major terrorist attack in Germany someone in the WH announced, "see, we could have warned you, but you! bought Huawei equipment! never!"
The problem with the EU is that it's members do not always share the same interests. I would rather agree that the EU could be a big military player if it's members get to agree on common interests. Unfortunately they don't. Even though it is the biggest single market in the world, it is hardly a player in international affairs. The lack of common goals and orientation have a lot to do with that and I doubt it will change soon.
Maybe EU leaders should think about solving their own internal problems and avoiding the collapse of the Union before attempting to build an Empire.
I live in the EU and am deeply pro-EU but reality is different these days
You can't even build enough transports to move your military equipment, even after decades of considering it a priority.
You didn't know this, but almost all the US military equipment is made in the USA. You thought you were building our rockets? And airplanes? Wow, get you some internet.
I'm sure you could design some military hardware, but good fucking luck trying to spend the money it takes to actually build it. You'd have riots in the streets before you were even ready to challenge Canada.
US companies bitch and moan for a while, but at the end they pay the fines and kiss the EU pinky ring.
Your country is right now waging a propaganda war against the current rules in Venezuela.
This is and has always been the pretext of an American bombing campaign.
That is why I think pretty soon the US is going to be bombing Venezuela.
Oh and also because Venezuela has oil. And because Venezuela wants to switch away from the US Dollar for trading that oil. Also because of that.
How Ironic that Putin now controls America without a shedding a single drop of blood.
The EU is fully capable of building a military to take on America, they choose to spend their money on social programs (public healthcare, public education, etc) instead. If "Western" countries can reach an agreement with Russia and China to prevent conflict then America could do the same.
That was jointly developed by General Dynamics. From Virginia.
Your argument is so weak; because we buy some parts for spy satellites from allies, that causes you to think we couldn't build them on our own?
We buy those parts to help support your industry, in the hopes that somebody protecting you will cost us less of our own blood and treasure.
The dick-waving "we do nuclear weapons better than you" is hilarious though. Dude, when you're waving a fake dick that hard, it is called "projection."
German cars are not something "everybody wants because they actually work." If you want a car that "actually works," you buy Japanese. Everybody knows that. The German cars that "everybody wants" are luxury cars. And guess what? People want luxury cars wherever they're from.
We remember the soldiers who died for us every year with the whole village.
Well you do a shitty job at it. Those Canadians are close allies of the US, you weren't saved by Canada. Canada was part of an allied effort mostly contributed by the US. There is no way around that.
You're just an ungrateful asshole.
Nope, Hitler always intended to invade Russia for the natural resoures of the Baltic area and the food production of the central plains, see lebensraum. The pact with Russia was to allow Germany to neuter Europe, the country he was afraid of. He was absolutely unafraid of Russia because
1) no aryan stock
2) godless now under stalin
3) they're soviets
4) they look different to WASPs.
5) god was on hitlers' side. god told him so.
As a European, I'm horrified by this kind of mindset. Sane Europeans only want peace and stability, and good relationship with the US which have always been mutually beneficial. I long to see complete demilitarization of Europe, and an end to costly and risky adventures overseas that have only brought more dangers to the European populace. No European would ever seriously entertain thoughts of confrontation - especially military - between us and the USA or any other, for that purpose. This "freax" person is either a troll or a severely damaged person. Please do not listen to that revanchist nonsense.
Well the US "got" English because the US was founded by invaders that spoke English. The English got English when languages were introduced by people who invaded then became English themselves. Of course some parts of the English language were adopted without any invasion at all. Assimilating useful aspects of other cultures is one characteristic of a healthy society.
But English is used because of the British empire then the US empire after that. These places are where most of the scientific and technical action was happening as well. So if your academics wanted to get current they had to read English. And if you wanted to at least copy some of the capabilities that allowed for production and utilization of various means of wealth and healthy life, then you had to understand English. And then there has been the artistic onslaught from both the US and the UK in the form of music and film that has been specifically mentioned as a source used by many to learn to speak English. It hasn't just been scientific and technical dominance.
But you are right. Once forced to behave and not slaughter millions, Europeans can be quite courteous.
I'm not saying the US couldn't produce their own military toys. I'm saying the EU could produce the same military toys, and already produces the current military high tech toys.
I'm also saying that, if necessary, the EU could turn its mighty industry against the US's military industrial complex. And the EU would, while it itself gets bombed sterile, bomb the US sterile. Neither populations, not the US nor the EU's, would have one single survivor.
Except maybe a few who where smart enough to flee on boats that can drift for a few years on the planet's oceans. But those people will die of starvation a few years later too.
Somebody already mentioned it: a military confrontation between the EU and the US is absurd. It would mean the end of both mankind and all of animal lifeforms. Probably also the end of bacteria and plants, too. We would probably destroy the planet itself in the process.
It's absurd.
We're not telling you what to do; receiving access to US intelligence is a benefit for the recipient country. Being military information, sharing it has restrictions. That isn't telling you what to do, that is merely telling you what the conditions of being that close of friends are.
It is so European to be given a choice, where you can do it our way and get full access, or do it your own way with partial access, and we're still going to cooperate either way; and you present that as telling you what to do, because we didn't give you all our toys for free?
Personally, I hope your politicians are as stupid as your internet denizens, sharing our military intelligence with Germany was always an iffy proposition.
Huawei are probably providing back doors to the Chinese government, but American companies have been doing the same thing for a long time on national security grounds. Microsoft were caught out providing a backdoor in Window NT to the NSA.
American wants to retain its capability, which never included Germany.
I'm not, at all, asking for a military confrontation with the US. I'm responding to many people that it's absurd.
Please read what I wrote better.
That's probably true (that our populations wouldn't want it). And that's also why we aren't investing in or waging wars.
It hasn't and it won't. Take a look at the growth and unemployment figures in the UK and compare them to, say, France. The Eurozone is in terminal decline.
Wait, I'm not saying it's a bad thing that the US stops sharing intelligence data with the EU.
It's fine. We are just saying bye to you.
We read enough to be horrified. And about Venezuela, the EU supports Guaido. Seek help.
US was caught spying on germany's chancellor few years ago...
case closed
I'm following this antics in Venezuela up close. My humble guess is that the real US leaders (those who rule the US economy) are seriously thinking of going to war against China (or maybe Russia too), and for this they are looking to secure a near source of oil by putting a puppet government in Venezuela just like they did recently in Brazil (as soon as the "pre-salt" - a new source of light oil in the Brazilian coast - was discovered the "protests" and the riots against the legitimate Brazilian government began).
Religion: The greatest weapon of mass destruction of all time
Wrong. The US does not need nuclear weapons to devastate Europe. We can do it with conventional warheads on cruise missiles. The first salvos would be aimed at your transport infrastructure, crippling your internal market, and your power nodes. One day without electricity will be enough. Nuclears would only be called on if the euros were so stupid as to make an attempt with the french "force de frappe". The big problem is that you don't have enough to enact both a counterforce and countervalue strike against CONUS, while we only have to detonate some warheads at high altitude to destroy all electronics over all the EU territory, condemning your population to pre-industrial state. But this idle talk, if ever the threat of armed confrontation would come up, the EU would either back down, sue for peace or surrender unconditionally. Nobody in Brussels or anywhere else wants to see the work of generations destroyed in minutes.
The U.S. has zero day attacks ready to go to knock out infrastructure (pipelines, electrical, telecommunication etc.) anywhere in the world. Using chinese equipment might stop the activation commands and scripts from reaching their targets. Can't have that, eh?
what utter crap you posted.
Canada was allied with the British, which is why it entered the war. If you look, the US joined WWII rather late in the game.
"you weren't saved by Canada. "
Did the dudes who liberated his village have a Canadian flag on their uniforms?
Or people go to other more affordable bars or decide to stay home and have a party and invite other people who don't necessarily get along with the guy who was the life of the party before.
The US and Germany have decades of close cooperation against the greatest enemy both have face - Putin's Satanic Russia. Trump is an obvious traitor and agent for Putin who needs to be removed from all influence. When that is done, relations with China will correct because it will allow China to wage war against Putin and kill him. That will bring actual world peace.
Re "bye bye intelligence access".
Thats free real time global access to the CIA, NSA for Germany.
Germany can't get that quality alone globally.
Who is going to replace the data flows from a NSA, CIA, GCHQ, Canada ect for Germany? Thats 24/7 global spying for free.
Real time support on any topic of interest or collected mention of Germany.
The USA and UK will remove that access. Never to be given back to the BND.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
Every kind. West Germany intelligence after WW2 was a creation of the NSA, GCHQ and CIA.
Trusted West German staff where more connected to their US and UK NSA/GCHQ colleagues than any elected West German government over the decades.
That total trust and extra support carried over to Germany.
Germany now wants to go Communist?
Why should the US and UK support that and give their secrets away in Germany?
That was support for German freedom and democracy.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
The one from countries that we Germans and the US fucked up due to meddling imperialism and greed? Who are now sprinkled with mentally unstable/religious people as a result?
Or the ones who invaded Germany before that, who came from western Russia and were called ... "Prussians"?
Or do you mean those middle-eastern religious invaders called ... "Christians"?
Wait, maybe you mean way back, when we were invaded by those creepy slender degenerates from Africa called ... "homo sapiens"?
You're right. How dare a million of them come over, to destroy our weak culture of *only* 80 million. How dare those illiterate morons take our high-quality jobs? How dare those abusive ugly motherfuckers take our womem?
With our culture, looks, behavior, education and skills we *totally* have *no chance*.
</sarcasm level=over-9000>
The best thing that the US could do is to withdraw from Europe. The US will save hundreds of billions annually, and the EU citizens can learn Russian.
Next is getting rid of most of their navy. They don't need it.
Excluding Mexico and Canada, International trade account for 5% of US GDP. They can thrive without. They don't need to keep the sea lanes open anymore.
The US is now effectively 100% energy independent. They don't need to keep the see lanes open anymore.
The US no longer gets anything from their Empire. Get rid of it.
thank you for making my point. In the world of life it boils down to 3 things, the whores, the pimps, and the paying client. At some point you eventually wish to stop being the whore and either become a pimp or become the paying client. Some way or another you're always one of the three, sometimes your a whore about one thing and a pimp about another. Whores, Pimps, and Johns my friend; whores, pimps, and Johns.
We Europeans are not stupid. We crystal clearly know ...
Way to undermine your own point lol
Wanna buy a shirt?
https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
Please Germany, show some spine and tell the US-ians to f off. We'll have a proper 5G implementation a lot faster and it might even be the beginning of the end for the 5 eyes agreement.
Yep and at some point the pimp realizes the client can decide to go elsewhere regardless of how much free skin they have been provided.
That all said I don't blame the US putting restrictions on the hardware that their allies use especially for critical infrastructure especially if there is a concern about the data going across it.
If not for the American empire, and I will not dispute we are in fact an empire, you would be under Nazi control, and if not them then Russian.
To be clear are you pointing out to Germans that they would be under control of the political party they elected and the side they fought for in a war?
Remember the big problem with the Nazis was their means, not their vision. So I guess "thank you" for coming in, defeating us in a war at a time where we were expanding and taking over europe. "Thank you" for kicking our democratically elected leaders. "Thank you" for liberating the country from jobs, and rising prosperity.
No secret information is transferred over any network without adding additional layers of encryption. NOBODY in their right mind trusts the encryption of the underlying network infrastructure, especially secret services.
So this is clearly an attempt to bully Germany into taking part in Trumps trade wars.
You really don't get how globalism works do you? It doesn't work that way. You don't get a soft Brexit. You'll get threatened and your country will comply. It simply wont have a choice. A quick withdrawl creates a power vacuum, one that you wont be able to fill before someone else moves in. You claim you dont want a military but its not really a choice. You either use someone elses, and then capitulate to their every demand, or you use your own. Choosing neither means someone else comes in and makes the choice for you, and now someone else makes you capitulate to _their_ demands. Look there is a slow long game of world domination at play here. And you're caught right in the middle of it. Best I can tell its a 3 way battle between a Bear, an Eagle, and a Dragon. The EU really doesn't factor into this at all. In the end one of the 3 is probably going run everything. 10 years ago the Euro was worth 1.5 USD. Now its right on par. Remember that whole Greece thing that has german citizens really pissed off, and rightly so? One bank, Goldman Sachs, bet against Greece, the credit rating goes to crap and boom, economic turmoil. That wasnt an accident, that was someone saying 'play ball or else'. Meanwhile germany has to pick up the slack, the hard working ass germans who work 6 days a week are bailing out a country that barely worked 4 days a week with insane vacation time. Is Greece still working at half the time of germany? That cant be fun.
As a libertarian, I want you to have a strong defense. I want you to be independent and not need help. But the reality is you still do. Its terribly unfortunate because it makes you beholden and I hate that for you. Too many there don't want to do what is necessary to preserve your way of life. Its ugly, its messy, and not many have the resolve for it. It is also very much a necessity. But such things are very expensive and when you do pay for them, well then maybe you'll understand our difficulty in getting some of the same things we want for ourselves that you enjoy by specifically not having to pay for a defense. I'm sick of being the police for the entire world. I hate being part of anything the UN does globally. I hated going into Somalia. I hate having to guard oil Tankers just so some other country can cut supply in order to increase profits. As a libertarian I believe its everyone right to fuck their life up however they see fit. So naturally I am verymuch NOT a globalist, which pretty much makes me a nationalist by default. There is no inbetween here. Either your against Globalism, or you are for it. Globalism is unchecked more than unregulated capitolism. Its going to go down just like in Highlander, there can be only 1. It might take another 100 years, it might happen in as little as 10, but as long as globalism pushes its way forward, world domination is only a few steps behind it.
So, you cannot show any numbers. Thought so.
Oh please..
Canada entered WW2 on Sept 1939.. US entered in Dec 1941.
Sure.. you " mostly contributed by the US.".. except when you didnt as you were not even participating.
Next. when was his village liberated? if it was prior to 1941...
Lastly, Canada entered as a british ally... because again, the US wasnt involved until later in the game... so clearly Canada wasnt a "US ally" in 1939.
The Canadian flag wasn't adopted until the 1960s... so, no. They would have been under the British red ensign at the time.
Keep in mind when arguing with Americans that they don't believe anything ever happens in the world that they didn't solve. As far as they're concerned the war didn't start until they joined. Hollywood doesn't exactly help this view either when it frequently re-writes history to replace other nationalities with Americans in WWII films.
I don't get your joke. Please explain.
OK, let me call the Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaambulance to race up the huwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawei.
This whole situation is fucking ridiculous and deserves parody in a lame joke because that's how lame it is. One because China is obviously lying and two because the US does it too and they are having a tantrum over who is going to control the biggest segment of the population so they both can fucking ass rape our freedom with a jackhammer.
A police state in everything but name.
Meanwhile people seeing this post on facebook have a mild moment of outrage and say "yeah" and slip back into their apathy as they keep scrolling.
Either way, we loose, get it?
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
Mejor vas aprendiendo ya español.
NATO was the defense shield of the US against the USSR/Warsaw pact. I am not exactly sure what purpose does it serve today, when the USSR and the Warsaw pact have been gone for decades. But when NATO still had a purpose, it was to use the territory of Western Europe to protect the US. It was quite clear that Europe would bear most of the damage of an USSR land assault. So, naturally, the larger contribution of the US to the "common good" was in more military equipment.
It is ridiculous to only calculate the direct defense expenditures.
Unless, of course, you're home-schooled and your only tertiary education degree is a Trump University diploma.
And interestingly enough, Germany has specifically stated that they aren't going to ban Huawei, but they ARE going to implement stricter security checks on ALL vendors.
So far Huawei has never been caught spying. The same can't be said for the US tech companies, so we'll see how that goes.
Americans don't like capitalism. They prefer Cronyism. It's not about who makes the better product at the better price, it's about who better bribes politicians and and who is willing to install American back doors.
And the US only entered because of the Japanese bombing Pearl Harbor.
umm someone else already beat me to it. The nato budget. There was no point in repeating it. The US spends more than every other country combined. Its unfortunate you kids today have a dictionary and encyclopedia at your finger tips and are too lazy to even ask google. In my high school years we had to get our asses to a college technical library in order to find a tenth of the shit I look up in the matter of seconds. And that data was often 10 years out of date. Are you always this bad at looking shit up? Eye witness testimony not good enough for you? Me actually having been a UN Peacekeeper MULTIPLE times not direct enough testimony? If you wont accept my testimony why would I believe you'll believe my numbers either. Go use the fingers god gave you and find out in real dollars (not percentages of a countries GDP) how much the US pays in both dollars and manpower compared to every other country. Then you can return with a little crow feathers left in the corner of your mouth. Only a fool would dispute how much the US pays into NATO vs the rest of the world. Its not even remotely up for debate.
Democracies with freedoms such as press and individual rights should be careful about ceding to much power to a nation with differing values. Telecom infrastructure is becoming a vital tech component of our societies. Need to co-exist and trade generally helps keep us from killing each other. Not sure if a full ban warranted but limits on how much reliance seem sensible. Mobile devices should be less of a concern since many options and easy to replace.
The writing's pretty, though.
I don't speak Arabic, but when I sign my name on a tablet, it looks like Arabic.
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
The US does not contribute UN peace keepers.
Goalkeeper uses a US gun, the General Electric GAU-8/A Avenger. It's famously used in the A-10 as well.
The only carriers ever fitted with Goalkeeper were HMS Invincible and HMS Illustrious, both of which are long gone. The USN carriers use Phalanx, which is a US made system.
ROKS Dokdo and ROKS Marado use Goalkeeper, but they're classed as amphibious assault ships*, not carriers.
*LPH for you naval types.
It's never too late to have a happy childhood.
The German people voted for Hitler to be democratically elected and democratically held accountable. He tricked their Reichstag and government in general to create a de facto dictatorship. Your selective facts show your ignorance on the matter.
Oh so i wasnt in Somalia then? Youre a retard. I dont use that word lightly. I have been stuck under the command of some british general more times than you've been on dates. I fucking know when Im told we're now under the joint task force under authority of the united nations.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Next you'll be denying US troops in Kosovo for a NATO led action.
Contributing countries for KFOR btw: .... yes thats right, fucking TEN
Albania - 10 soldiers
Belgium - 1100
Bulgaria - 11 soldiers.... guess they didnt want to be shown up by the albanians
Canada - 1470
Croatia - 20
Czech Republc - 97
Denmark - 308, well we're finnally up to triple digits for an european country contribution
Estonia - 122
Findland - 395
France - 7000 (but they showed up with enough white flags for everyone just in case... haha)
Germany - 8500
Greece - 1000
Hungary - 223
Italy - 5000
Lithuania - 30
Luxembourg - 23
Montenegro - 2 (Really?!? was someone holding up their hand saying 'were still two men short, i need two men!')
Netherlands - 3600
Norway - 2300
Poland - 800
Portugal - 4 (see montenegro)
Romania - 62
Russia - 4000
Slovenia - 316
Spain - 1712
Turkey - 752
UAE - 1500
UK - 7000 (a country not much bigger than rhode island contributes 7000 of their elite forces,no wonder they want to Brexit, doing all that heavy lifting)
Ukrain - 1300
United States - 19,000
Americans moaning about immigration like their country isn't based off the fucking concept.
The world moaning about ancient history as if it's fucking relevant anymore. Those that migrated to the US hundreds of years ago weren't.....
BZZT.
Immigration peak was actually in 1930. That's not 'hundreds of years ago'.
Since Trump and the red-hats are only shades different from Hitler and the brown shirts, I don't think America has lots of room to speak, here. Trump is just biding his time until his own Reichstag fire.
mod parent up
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
Where exactly did Trunp say buy American 5g?
He did not. You dumb children have to make shit up to justify your TDS.
Go ahead, use the Chinese governments equipment in your national network. Same company already busted for spying, supporting a nuclear terrorist state, money laundering and who knows what else?
You hate Trump so much you would rather deal with your enemies. Well, go ahead. Do what you like. The price is intelligence info. Especially important considering your mass importation policy of terrorist rapists.
Why are you yelling at socialists who are doing socialist shit?
The TDS infected WANT the destruction of Western culture and success.
You know who is spying on the German government ? US spy agencies, that's right. So much for being "partners".
WHATABOUTISM
You need to think precisely about things. NATO is not the UN. UN Peacekeeprs are soldiers contributed to UN missions, not US led cooperative ones. Try thinking.
And the US knows damn well that Germany will spy on Trump any chance they get. We spy on the UK. The UK spies on US. Everybody is spying on everybody, and everybody knows it.
What was your case, again?
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
Somalia WAS UN led... read the damn link i sent!!! You need to try READING
Consider the results if Huawei equipment were used to completely control telecommunications and the Chinese government asked the company to have the equipment "stop working" in all capitalist countries. They would let it be "turned back on" if the proper incentives were created......
Which brings up an interesting point about "empires".
Compare the world map pre- and post- WWII. The war that established the US "Empire". Why don't we control all the territories that we conquered?
That "empire" thing is such a stupid talking point.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
I understand the thinking here that pretty much any Chinese company must bend to the will of the Chinese government which, in effect, means Huawei can become ( or, secretly, already is ) a government run company.
However, the same is true for any company in any country. Here in the US, companies have to play nice with the USG or risk losing those lucrative government contracts. Even if they don't play nice, the USG makes them unwitting participants anyway. ( See NSA Tailored Access Group ) Perhaps it is their extensive knowledge of just how EASY it is to penetrate a foreign network if you have access to the network hardware ( even briefly ) that is the source of the concern.
In the end, Germany will simply have to choose which is more important to them: Saving $$$ on network hardware or the Intelligence Data they receive.
It will be one or the other.
what propaganda?
what he posted was mostly factual
https://www2.gwu.edu/~erpapers/teachinger/glossary/world-war-2.cfm
"Although the war began with Nazi Germany's attack on Poland in September 1939, the United States did not enter the war until after the Japanese bombed the American fleet in Pearl Harbor, Hawaii, on December 7, 1941."
Go back and watch some hollywood movies about how the US single-handed put an end to WW2.. then come back and let us know why the US has not done well in ANY war it has engaged since WW2.
This is coming from the US Govt that has spied on the Germans in the past. What irony.. a nation with fingers in each and every conflict around the world. A shameless type of human with such audacity.. There are certainly unnatural things coming out of the US Govt no matter the party.
Fuck off, Nazi.
Chinese are not our enemies, since we ain't the one running empire (anymore). They might be your enemies, but they are our partner, just like you are. If you don't like it, you're free to fuck off.
And no, we don't need your help, you need help with history. Your mighty power couldn't do shit againt vietnam. Sure you bombed the shit out of them, similarly as nazis rampaged europe. But in long term, you had to fuck off, just as nazis would have to fuck off. It's too costly to govern hostile people. Unless you just exterminate them.
I'm reading this as, "Huawei was the only company that wouldn't put a back door into their firmware at your request, so we want you to stop using it."
US already stopped using Huawei and the president lost HIS intelligence, i guess they have proven correct ;)
Intelligence? Big Giant Orange Head was literally just quoted as saying, "aircraft are getting too complex to fly."
This is what passes for intelligence these days from America?
Nor is this the first time. BGOH has said so many head-slappingly stupid things, it has become a running joke. "Trade wars are good and easy to win", "Peace in the Middle East will be so simple", "Who knew healthcare was complicated?", "Amazon shouldn't be using the USPS", "I just grab them by the pussy", "He (Putin) told me he didn't do it", "I should have said he didn't not want to not do it, that ought to clear that up", the list is endless.
This isn't intelligence. This is Cletus in a fine suit, trying to look like he belongs there.
US tells Germany to stop using Huawei Equipment or US loses some intelligence access, to be more clear what is probably going to happen. After all who bugged Merkel's phone, and exactly how did they get access to her phone both wired and cell phone communications?
russian troll alert
America is a bigger threat to some of ours security. For example, America is known for putting people on no-fly lists and enforcing it on their allies, which can be a direct threat to my freedom.
America would also rather put tariffs on my country with no exceptions then China, which gets lots of exceptions and shows America's true colours.
Electing Trump shows that America could actually elect someone truly evil instead of like Trump, just more crooked then usual. A good chunk of the American voters seem to ignore that Trump ignores the emoluments clause of the American Constitution.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
Yeah, just banning them without proper cause doesn't seem like a smart idea either.
"Vertrauen ist gut, Kontrolle ist besser!"
Even if this is attributed to Lenin, and you may think about him and his ideology what you want, there is some pragmatic caution to this attitude.
Especially after we've already been burned by an ally, who probably took that Lenin quote to heart, it would be foolish to just assume the next big competitor we turn to would never ever abuse our trust and will always refrain from getting an edge over us if there is a chance. By extension it also only seems prudent if the same caution is extended to all other vendors as well.
Who is bombing the Venezuelan substations?
Yesterday I asked 10 people in the office a "Fun International Trivia" question.
The question: What country on Earth is four days into a countrywide electrical blackout?
2 people knew the answer.
That said, I didn't learn of the blackout until day 3, and then I figured it would be a minor event. Today is day 5...
You sir, are spot on.
BlameBillCosby.com
germany, tell murka to fuck off, and you won't send them data either.
Oh yeah, we Americans don't want those stinky intelligence on Iraq WMDs, we just demand more nude photos of Angela. If the Germans start using Huawei, how can we get those photos?!
After all they did appropriate plans for the F-35 by hacking a defense contractor. Chinese are generally a lot smarter that USAians, and they work harder too. It is about time the USA got in the game and started to accept China for the competitor they are. Do not allow your communications infrastructure be made by someone that is trying to do you harm.
Stop buying from China. Support the country you live in. Stop believing the Chinese owned news conglomerates that tell you to hate your neighbor because she or he is a conservative or a liberal
A conglomeration of Chinese, Mexican, and Russian stockholders control USAian media. The media cartel is playing the USA like a fiddle. Divide and conquer worked on the first inhabitants of North America. It is working on the second batch too.
Just means you cannot compete. If your best business strategy is lying about the products of the competition, then you do not have a future. Obviously that is one part of what is going on. The second one may be that US has trouble breaking into Huawei products to spy in its "allies". ("Vassals", really in their thinking.)
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
...if the hacked hardware intercepting the intelligence is replaced by Huawei equipment. So they're not really making a threat, they're just laying out the facts of the situation.
As has been noted by others, the US does not provide UN peacekeepers. They do participate in UN sanctioned military action though. As for the UN peacekeeping budget, EU countries pay a larger share than the US, see http://www.un.org/en/ga/search... Again, obviously if the US is participating in actions but not under the UN banner, then they will be paying more on top of that, which would likely make them the top monetary contributer. In the end, the official UN statistics are not going to reflect true US conributions, but that is the choice of the US. America decided to distance themselves somewhat from UN peacekeeping because they are unwilling to allow their troops be tried for war crimes.
yeah but that's what we grew up in or condition to then we would put up with that is just the way things are same way we put up with our current government.
Actually, the countries in Europe who have the most recent direct experience with Russia/USSR (and have borders with Russia) very much do want the Americans to stay and increase their local presence. Just last year Poland made a direct request for a US base on its territory.
https://www.euractiv.com/secti...
and
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/22...
Freax, the facts are very simple. Only an angry little Euroboy would think the EU (the whole damned thing and you can count the U.K., too) would last more than a few days of conventional bombing before suing for peace.
If the US military were truly unleashed no holds barred there is no country that could survive a conventional fight.
Your nattering about nuclear is the kind of stuff we babbled about in the schoolyard when I was 12. No one is laubchiht nukes. And sure as hell your ridiculous idea that the rest of the world (who? China? Russia? Venezuela?) will nuke the US in revenge for Europes destruction is just bizarre.
Now that would be news! :-D
Oh, that would be the USA.
I think the USA is shitting its pants, not because Huawei may have backdoors, but by using their gear it removes all the US backdoors.
Right, the people who walked into the village were not the cause of the village being saved.
It took the entire war effort.
Without the support of the Americans, the Canadians would not have been there at all.
It is quite simple; the village was liberated by the Allies. Not by Canada.
It wasn't even Canada that chose that specific village to be assigned to the Canadians.
Pointing at the Canadian military and thinking that is substantially distinct from the American military, during joint operations, is just absurd. They're cheek and jowl. Canadian soldiers are ready to protect America, just like America is ready to protect Canada.
We don't have to tell Canada what to do for military cooperation, because they were already in the room when we decided what it was we wanted done, and they probably helped us decide it.
They got involved ONLY because Germany declared war on them. THEN the USA joined the war.
Because I nominate this guy. He's been entertaining us all day!
We were supporting the British war effort from the start, did you actually not know about that?
We didn't have a big enough military when the war broke out to start fighting right away. Our whole society had to be put on hold, the Sleeping Giant had to wake up and take over American life for a few years to build enough equipment and train enough soldiers to go and fight.
Both my grandfathers fought in WWII, one in the Navy and one in the Air Force. You can't do those jobs without warships and warplanes.
My grandfather flew behind enemy lines, over the alps, to deliver donkeys and bullets to Partisans in the Balkans. On the way back over, they'd aim hand-tossed bombs out the door of the plane at the German supply paths over the Alps. They calculated how many bombs they could carry by their "reserve" fuel.
He didn't do it because he thought they'd be thankful, he just did it because it was the right thing to do. Snooty Europeans can't really imagine that aspect of the American military, which is also why they don't have comparable operational capability. Courage of conviction is a powerful thing, and we have it. Do you think Europeans making noises, "schna, schna, schna" into their coffee causes them to be morally superior? That's exactly the Freedom we wanted for you! Duh.
That's because we never had an "empire" like the Europeans did, we only had Allies who can come and go as they please.
Only an idiot would think we didn't "pick sides" prior to giving the British substantial material support. We gave them as much free military equipment as we could ship through contested waters, and it was a lot!
If you only have "thousands" of witnesses, you have no idea how they got there, or who else made it safe for them to walk into your village.
I guess you think some Canadians wandered out behind German lines into your village, and the Germans moved their lines back to let them have it.
You should listen to the Germans cry and whine when we threaten to reduce troop numbers, though.
"Oh but the jobs on the base, we need those dollars!" LOL
You'd "cope" by learning Russian though.
You wouldn't look back on it as "coping," either.
Yes. Whatever Europe says, it means "please stay," because they also say that.
Europe is very careful to only let people who don't matter say the "go home" part, and then they coordinate to make sure all the important people say "please stay."
Also, most Americans aren't even from New England, the region that has "Yankees." So when they say, "Yankee go home," we know it is a total fucking cluestick talking, who has no concept of international geography even at the "names and places" level.
What does it even mean? Does it mean you want the Americans who support the British to go back to Britain? Or is it just a warning that "schna, schna, schna" sounds and the smell of cigarettes are about to erupt into the air of a cafe somewhere? A warning to get out umbrellas to avoid drowning in a rain shower?
China doesn't loan us money, they buy US Treasury Bonds.
The bonds have a certain repayment value. If a major buyer stops buying, that actually means the other buyers will get more profit. The higher the demand for bonds, the lower the profit.
If China stops buying them, non-China demand goes up.
In fact, most of them would be bought by Americans if the international demand was low enough that it could compete with other investments we have available. But large investors like nation states can't really find other investments that large; the money would just sit in a giant Scrooge McDuck vault otherwise, sitting there shrinking due to inflation.
Except that you're the town drunk in this metaphor, and the bar owners all love us. ;)
Why are you talking about something that occurred more than 30 years ago! Ever since then US doesn't contribute much to the UN peacekeeping force. That's pretty much clear. You're old, and simply still think that something that happened 30 years ago is recent.
Wah. The US is donating so much money to NATO. The Europeans are contributing nothing. Look buddy without the US military budget (which is mostly spent fighting wars OUTSIDE of Europe), NATO members are still outspending by 3-4x Russia's military budget, their "GREAT" enemy. To say they need to spend more for no reason is just idiotic. The only reason why Trump is saying to spend more, is so that they can buy more US weapons, because we know the US doesn't manufacture anything except military hardware these days.
You can put a chips under an electron microscope, but it won't help you:
https://www.itnews.com.au/news...
New things are always on the horizon
Just you, alone on you island of self-deceit. Everyone else in the EU is begging us to stay.
Every time we don't defend you leeches, Russia gobbles up more territory. Do you want to live the way Crimean's do, or do you want the US? That's the choice, and luckily for your ignorant ass, not one you have the power to make.
All the US would have to do to win a war with the EU is to tell Russia the US military will not shed blood for Europeans this time.
Where exactly did Trunp say buy American 5g?
He did not. You dumb children have to make shit up to justify your TDS.
He didn't outright say it, but that's what he wants
https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/1098581869233344512
I want 5G, and even 6G, technology in the United States as soon as possible. It is far more powerful, faster, and smarter than the current standard. American companies must step up their efforts, or get left behind. There is no reason that we should be lagging behind on.........
https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/1098583029713420288
While I mostly agree with you, a few points:
Montenegro was Serbia's ally in the wars and were bombed during the actions to free Kosova. Sending 2 people allows them to participate to show a positive current political position, but without traumatizing the people being protected. You don't really want the combatants to do the peacekeeping.
Albania and Bulgaria are both really poor and downtrodden. They can't really send more.
UK will still be contributing to peacekeeping in the same way, because their position in NATO will be unchanged. They send more because they want to; like the US.
Germany sends that many because if they don't that's a lecture they're really tired of hearing and blame on their grandparents neighbors.
“Well, I think we have a lot of foes,” Trump told CBS News at his Turnberry golf resort in Scotland. “I think the European Union is a foe, what they do to us in trade. Now you wouldn’t think of the European Union but they’re a foe.”
You're dumb.
Full stop.
I need me one of them there Scrooge McDuck vaults. Any idea where I can find one? O.o
--Highdude702(mods)
Total military spending is not the same as NATO contributions. The US pays less than its fair share of the NATO budget.
Tell me again how Germany has been a world leader over the last 100 years, and all the wars you guys won.
I'm waiting..
I long to see complete demilitarization of Europe,
paints you as a fool. There will always be bad people in the world.. Sometimes those bad people will become heads of state.. Sometimes those Heads of State will want to invade other countries... They will have to be dealt with... World Peace is just as likely as my winning the lottery.. Unlikely to the extreme...
Sounds like the EU can build a 5G network without risking the use of potentially compromised Huawei equipment.
Your argument is so weak; because we buy some parts for spy satellites from allies, that causes you to think we couldn't build them on our own?
Because you can't. E.g. the balls in the ball-bearings of the inertia navigation systems of your cruise missiles are made in: Japan. They are actually derived from 1980s video recorder ball bearings for the magnetic head.
As far as I know the states can do a few things right, the stuff Elon is doing, Intel Chips (within limits considering Spectre et. all.) and hand guns. Did I miss something? Is there a car that is better than a european? A plane? A sub? Ah, well, you have lots of nukes, we not so much.
You can not even produce the steel needed for the catching ropes of an air craft carrier. Ah, but you have carriers, Germany e.g. has none. Well ... happy carrier if it meets a Swedish or a German sub ... good bye.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
You are a bit delusional.
While Europe has nukes, Germany's nukes are on bombers and on "field artillery shells".
So that leaves France and UK to nuke USA. With submarines.
Most of them are not really operational. Europe has no ICBMs.
So, no: EU/Europe has no nukes to hit the US in a significant way. ...
The EU has in total something like 8 carriers, 4 mothballed at the moment, 2 or 3 under construction (UK ones, no idea how many they are building, ah, and a new french on if the construction is not put on hold)
While we would beat US easily on our soil, just like we would the Russians, there is no way the EU/Europe could attack the US with a quick positiv result.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
the hard working ass germans who work 6 days a week are bailing out a country that barely worked 4 days a week with insane vacation time.
I think you are mixing up Greece and German working times and vacations.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
LOL so when an American liberates something it's because of guts and guns and glory, but if anyone else does it they just wandered on in. I love that idea. I bet that's coming soon to an elementary school history book.
It's OK Bender, there's no such thing as 2.
The go home and please stay is simply explained.
Politically we want the americans to go home.
But economically we like them to stay, (even if it would be bottom line much more economical if they left, e.g. for the housing market).
However Rammstein/Germany is the biggest military airport of the world. And it has one of the biggest military hospitals of the world. I have no idea how many starts and landings they do and how much personell is stationed there or how many people work in the hospitals.
But they all have flats there, and buy food ... (they don't pay taxes, though).
So when they say, "Yankee go home," we know it is a total fucking cluestick talking, who has no concept of international geography even at the "names and places" level. ... you introduced the term, we did not look it up in a dictionary
You are just plain stupid. Americans are called all over the world Yankees or Yanks
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
I actually didn't know that Yankee referred to only a certain type of American. From now on I'll use "Seppo" (shortened form of "Septic Tank" which is rhyming slang for "Yank").
It's OK Bender, there's no such thing as 2.
nothing has ever been found to show that they were. If they did Germany and the rest would drop them like a hot potato. This is just anti-China bashing because its a popular sport at the moment.
When are you moving in?
https://gearburn.com/2018/01/u...
Still didn't find anything...
No they want the best equipment at the best price. Seems pretty capitalist. Not the crony capitalist version you have fallen into in the US. Keep buying cisco because we still need access to our 'allies' data. Fuck you America.
The long game here is to ruin the FIVE EYES relationships between the USA and Britain, Germany, and to a lesser extent Australia and New Zealand, by creating a fait acompli scenario where cellular carriers in those countries, facing the fantastic capital expenses involved in 5G rollouts, have no choice but to buy Hauwei, and thus backdoor themselves to a level unacceptable for the USA. The 5G spec was effectively authored by Hauwei because most other participants failed to show up to the 3GPP meetings, let alone make meaningful contributions to the spec. If you want the highest compatibility, then by definition you should buy Hauwei gear. Thus, a wedge is driven into the relationship between the USA/NSA and other FIVE EYES participants, hobbling intel gathering. A nice example of Soft Power in geopolitics.
Why would non China demand go up if China stops buying them? Magic? Or just the wishful thinking of an Idiot?
Some demand is from China, obviously. If China stops then demand is less...are you retarded to not see this?
Less demand means the prices go down. Which in this case means the interest rate the US has to offer to sell them goes up.
Or you could just have less money to spend instead. It's almost as if China is loaning you the money to support your extravagant lifestyles. And you foolishly think things will get better if they decide to stop... Lunacy.
You must have gone to the WindBourne school of finance.
Intelligence info aka Secrets. What secrets does America have they they don't want China knowing? Maybe the ones that have seen other nations and people's terrorized the world over. At some point with a list as long as America has nations it has fucked with you have to ask who is the real problem globally.
the US would have more credibility on this subject if they hadn't already admitted to listening into the Germans phones. This sounds more like a commercial thing than a security issue otherwise the US would supply evidence of Huawei listening in.
"The hands that help are better far than lips that pray." - Robert Ingersoll (1833-1899)
As a Cold War veteran, I spent six years over there helping defend against the Soviets. In the early 90s when they broke up, everyone seemed to think we'd all be holding hands and kissing each other's asses. How's that worked out for the folks in the Ukraine?
History repeats itself.
Just another day in Paradise
How did that Syria thing work out for you with all the refugees? How is working with Russia working out for the Ukraine? Do you really believe Putin doesn't have more expansion plans?
Just another day in Paradise
You actually need to take a look at the history of events to know, instead of just deciding what you think happened based on the feelies you have when you think about the names of different parties.
Except it was not "free". Look up lend-lease, and read a bit of post-WWII history. The episode where Harry Trumpman nearly bankrupted the UK in 1946 is a very enlightening one. The jump in the number of "US" island bases after the 1940s on islands that were formerly UK too. The UK paid its last WWII loan installments in the late 80s.
The US WWII participation was about profits and nothing else.
The US even saved most of the German and Japanese war criminals and stashed them into the US to continue working on space, WMDs, conventional weaponry, intelligence.
"...clearly Canada wasnt a 'US ally' in 1939."
Derp! Clearly you aren't the brightest bulb in the bin, are you? Canada has been a US ally since the War of 1812, an inconclusive and muddled affair that (territorially) achieved nothing.
Whaaaatttt?? Allies don't always do exactly the same thing at the same time? Say it isn't so!