Apple Still Hasn't Fixed Its MacBook Keyboard Problem (wsj.com)

Joanna Stern, writing for the Wall Street Journal [the link may be paywalled]: Why is the breaking of my MacBook Air keyboard so insanely maddening? Let's take a trip down Memory Lane.
April 2015: Apple releases the all-new MacBook with a "butterfly" keyboard. In order to achieve extreme thinness, the keys are much flatter than older generations but the butterfly mechanism underneath, for which the keyboard is named, aims to replicate the bounce of a more traditional keyboard.
October 2016: The MacBook Pro arrives with a second-generation butterfly keyboard. A few months later, some begin to report that letters or characters don't appear, that keys get stuck or that letters unexpectedly repeat.
June 2018: Apple launches a keyboard repair program for what the company says is a "small percentage" of MacBook and MacBook Pro keyboards impacted.
July 2018: Apple releases a new high-end MacBook Pro with the third-generation of the keyboard that's said to fix the issues.
October 2018: Apple's new MacBook Air also has the third-generation keyboard. I recommend it, and even get one for myself.

Which brings us to the grand year 2019 and my MacBook Air's faulty E and R keys. Others have had problems with Apple's latest laptops, too. A proposed nationwide class-action suit alleges that Apple has been aware of the defective nature of these keyboards since 2015 yet sold affected laptops without disclosing the problem. "We are aware that a small number of users are having issues with their third-generation butterfly keyboard and for that we are sorry," an Apple spokesman said in a statement. "The vast majority of Mac notebook customers are having a positive experience with the new keyboard." If you have a problem, contact Apple customer service, he added. John Gruber, a long time Apple columnist: I consider these keyboards the worst products in Apple history. MacBooks should have the best keyboards in the industry; instead they're the worst. They're doing lasting harm to the reputation of the MacBook brand.

Comments

This happens

[Chris Mattern]

when appearance is prioritized over function. When it came out, all the reviewers went into paroxysms of ecstacy about how thin it was. Now we see what happens when it''s not as thick as it needs to be.

Re:This happens

[Mascot]

To boot, the early models were even thinner at the slim end.

2012 MBA: Height: 0.11-0.68 inch (0.3-1.7 cm)
2018 MBA: Height: 0.16–0.61 inch (0.41–1.56 cm)

That they somehow managed to mess up something as testable as a keyboard, is one thing. That they haven't managed to fix it several iterations later, is just sad. I'm sticking with my 2012 model and hoping it never dies.

Re:This happens

[AmiMoJo]

Problem is if they fix it they will be admitting that it was a cock-up. By quietly adding a fraction of a millimetre every year and some little protective membranes they will eventually make it more or less reliable and still get to claim it was a minor issue.

Fortunately people like iFixIt cut through their bullshit, same as they did with the screen cable flaw.

Re:This happens

[jellomizer]

I still like the mechanical key switches. I can understand these thin keys for the laptops, but they also do it for the external keyboards, where we can use a nice heavy mechanical keyboard for, with useful feature like n-key roller and anti-ghosting.

Re:This happens

[bob4u2c]

Plus, people are still buying them. Don't like a product, don't buy it. That sends a clear message to the company to fix their product.

But for most people owning an Apple product its a point of pride, not necessity.

Re:This happens

[fluffernutter]

A lot of people are locked into buying if they are app developers. You can do the Android app on a mac but you can't do the iOS app on Windows or Linux.

Re:This happens

[fluffernutter]

A keyboard has to be cleanable in some way. Dust goes down not up.

Re:This happens

[Freischutz]

A keyboard has to be cleanable in some way. Dust goes down not up.

I'm on my 4th butterfly keyboard, apart from a few keys collapsing on my first keyboard necessitating a replacement, I've had no problems so far. Occasionally a key sticks because of dust but so far that problem has always been solvable by going over the keyboard with a vacuum cleaner or a compressed air bottle from the local electronics shop. It also helps not to eat your bagels or other crumb generating foods like a pig and spill the crumbs all over the keyboard into the key spaces. Having said that, even the crumbs have so far not proven a match for to the vacuum cleaner and the compressed air bottle.

Re:This happens

[fluffernutter]

You shouldn't have to maintain your laptop regularly just to keep it functional.

Re:This happens

[thegarbz]

To boot, the early models were even thinner at the slim end.

Easy solution. Use a file to get the edge of the laptop to a knife edge. Boom a laptop that is 0.001mm thick on it's "slim end".

Seriously are you in marketing?

Re:This happens

[rgmoore]

Don't like a product, don't buy it

This is a nice theory, but it doesn't work very well when the problem people are complaining about is a quality issue that doesn't show up until well after purchase.

Re:This happens

[Anonymous Coward]

I have a 2012 MBP, and the only issue I've had with the keyboard is that after more than 6 years of continuous use, some of the keys are starting to wear out. And by that I mean certain keys have physically worn down on the surface, exposing an underlying layer of plastic. It's only a cosmetic issue. The keyboard is otherwise entirely functional.

I have no interest in a keyboard with less key travel (I've tried the new ones -- I don't like it), and with well-known problems. When I've had this vintage MBP open, the actual space taken up by the keyboard inside is already thin anyway. Why they had to make it even thinner for the sake of lower quality and poorer keyboard ergonomics, I have no idea, like most of Apple's decisions with regard to the MBP for the last several years (e.g., lack of ports unless you want to hook up a dongle that looks like a squid).

I used to be content to pay a higher price for better quality. Now, no. I'll keep working with my old one until it eventually gives out, and then I'll probably try to buy a pre-2015 used one.

Re:This happens

[fluffernutter]

Let's not pretend that there is no one else that makes a laptop that lasts.

Re:This happens

[Solandri]

That they somehow managed to mess up something as testable as a keyboard, is one thing.

They are testing it. They have millions of people willing to buy their products without ever having seen or felt them (the Apple Watch became the #1 selling smartwatch through pre-sales, before it was even released). If you have a fan base that's that irrationally committed, you don't need to pay for product testing. Just make them test it for you.

Re:This happens

[exomondo]

Apple seems to be falling into the Microsoft trap where it doesn't matter if quality goes down so long as sales still go up. macOS, like Windows, has applications that do not run on other platforms so the problem is that people stop buying the product because they want it and start buying it because they need it.

You're pressing it wrong

[mspohr]

We all know that Apple never makes mistakes. It must be you.

Re:You're pressing it wrong

[fahrbot-bot]

We all know that Apple never makes mistakes. It must be you.

I hear their next keyboard will have only one button ... :-)

Re:You're pressing it wrong

[mspohr]

Brilliant!
I'm sure the fanbois will love it.

Re: You're pressing it wrong

[Anonymous Coward]

Two knobs. Uses zero electricity, always on, and to reset, you just tip upside down and shake.

Re:You're pressing it wrong

[ilsaloving]

I'm waiting for the Macbook Wheel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

Re:You're pressing it wrong

[zenbi]

Except it won't be an actual button that physically moves, but a simulated key press using a haptic engine.

Re:You're pressing it wrong

[null etc.]

I hear their next keyboard will have only one button ... :-)

Yes. After all, it's called a "keyboard", not a "keysboard".

Re:You're pressing it wrong

[bidule]

I prefer Windows' 3-button keyboard:

https://vignette.wikia.nocooki...

But hey, Apple is "high quality".

[Anonymous Coward]

I mean I don't mind paying twice as much for three year old technology when it's backed up by the Apple brand. Like hey, it's part of my hipster uniform. That and avacado toast and dorky eyeglasses.

Re:But hey, Apple is "high quality".

[Anonymous Coward]

Hipsters are a marketer’s wet dream! They have proven that they will pay through the nose for “sophisticated”, “artisan”, “craft”. This is not up for debate, just ask the folks at Souja or Stumptown Coffee. Hipsters are probably the easiest people to sell to in American history. This is doubly true if your product photographs well for social media.

Why would they?

[stealth_finger]

Why would they? Suckers keep buying them and then they can make extra on the repairs.

Re:Why would they?

[Anonymous Coward]

I own a 12" MacBook. At first, I liked the feel of the butterfly keyboard, but now it has multiple intermittent and semi-functional keys. Haven't yet found time to bring it in and complain about the sucky keyboard.

Possibly the last Apple product I'll ever buy from them.

Re:Why would they?

[bakoolguy2]

My 2018 MacBook Pro had the keyboard problem and they fixed it for free. In our office three out of four were totally fine.

Re:Why would they?

[fluffernutter]

Lol.. You think it's good that "only one out of four" year-old laptops completely broke.

Re:Why would they?

[Dixie_Flatline]

They're not making any extra on the repairs. I've heard of people bringing in their laptops multiple times for keyboard problems, especially in the first generation. Because the whole top of the case needs to be replaced, it's, like, a $600 part for Apple every time they do it. There's a very real possibility that the repairs is affecting Apple's bottom line when it comes to this model. On top of that, they'll repair ANY laptop with this keyboard from the first two generations, even if you didn't have AppleCare+. It's stunning to me that they released yet another incremental change on this design, even from just a selfish, capitalist standpoint. Leave aside that it's a terrible look for them, it's shrinking their margins.

Re:Why would they?

[stealth_finger]

My 2018 MacBook Pro had the keyboard problem and they fixed it for free. In our office three out of four were totally fine.

So you have a 25% failure rate? Amazing.

It's not that simple

[SuperKendall]

when appearance is prioritized over function.

That's not at all the case though.

I really like how the newer keyboard feels. Yes there's absolutely some fun to typing on a big old clacking keyboard with a long draw, but I find that flatter low travel keyboards are quicker to type on.

So the thinness DOES have function. Now it may be the case that you can't have a reliable keyboard that thin, but I think we have yet to prove out that theory since Apple keeps iterating and the keyboard keeps improving... and even though there are a number of people who have seen issues, I know a lot of people with the newer keyboard who have not.

the reviewers went into paroxysms of ecstacy about how thin it was

Really, who? I recall seeing zero reviews praising that aspect of the keyboard - just the overall thinness of the laptop itself.

Re:It's not that simple

[thereddaikon]

You are the first person I've seen praise the feel of that keyboard.

Re: It's not that simple

[sodul]

I like the new keyboard too. Iâ(TM)m on my third retina MacBook Pro (due to work, not the laptops fault) and I really like it. I am not a Vim user so the escape key is not a big deal, although I would remap caps lock to ESC in that case. I do not eat crumbly food over my laptop and I do not bring it to the beach so I have no issues whatsoever with stuck keys. I have had keyboard go bad on me in the past so I can understand the frustration of users that actually have problems but if you insist on using it in dusty environment or want to use it as a food tray, well add protection to it. There are nice keyboard covers that will do a good job at keeping dust out.

Re:It's not that simple

[fluffernutter]

I don't mind the feel of the keybord per se (and I type a lot) but the following things bother me:
- Touch strip is a bad idea. Maybe it helps people who use fancy software but I'm wearing out a bald spot in the case from when I use vi and miss the recessed non-tactile key.
- The key surface is chicklet and not cupped. This leads to lack of feedback when my hands are drifting off the keys. - A keyboard that cannot be cleaned, really? Many people who buy Macbooks have houses slightly more messy than the Apple store. In fact, I find the neatness of the Apple store a bit unnerving.

I've experienced first hand the sound that the keys make. Picture a gooey public theater floor with spilled pop and candy on it over centuries, now press your foot down on that floor and lift it up. That is the sound the keys make. Fortunately, I got a new keyboard on Apple-care but I now have a laptop that I don't really feel like I can take anywhere because if anything else gets in the keys it will be a problem.

Re: It's not that simple

[Anonymous Coward]

"and the keyboard keeps improving"

No, no it doesn't.

Re:It's not that simple

[thegarbz]

I recall seeing zero reviews praising that aspect of the keyboard - just the overall thinness of the laptop itself.

Not sure if trolling or just stupid...

Re:It's not that simple

[Freischutz]

You are the first person I've seen praise the feel of that keyboard.

Now you've met two. Mostly I just don't give a toss about 'keyboard feel' and certainly not to the point where I have apoplectic rage fits about it like some people do, but the butterfly keyboard is kind of nice as keyboards go.

Re:It's not that simple

[Solandri]

Yes there's absolutely some fun to typing on a big old clacking keyboard with a long draw, but I find that flatter low travel keyboards are quicker to type on.

Yours would appear to be an extreme minority opinion. Keyboards have been around for over a century. If a significant number of people really did prefer low-travel keys, they would've been made thinner nearly a century ago when the first electric typewriters were introduced. You represent such a small minority that in all that time, nobody has even bothered to make a specialty thin keyboard just to sell to your niche market.

Re:It's not that simple

[Mittengrabber]

I'm a Slashdot user and don't feel the need to apologise for the fact that I like and use Apple equipment. I'm also old and I've used a manual typewriter, as had many typists who subsequently moved on to electric typewriters. The throw and effort required for manual typewrites is significant and takes some time to get used to, not to mention the timing needed to avoid tangling the letter hammers. The iteration to electric typewriters was probably something of a compromise, keep the tiered design, find a more comfortable throw, but not too short to really put off people who are used to manual typewriters. Move to where we are now, losing the tiered nature probably pissed a lot of people off, but was necessary for laptop design. Key throw and feel is something that an ergonomics study could easily confirm optimal design, although this may be subject to change over time. As for the butterfly keyboard, I'm with Gruber on this - the design is poor, both from a reliability and usability perspective. As for testing, Apple needs to seed new designs to Slashdotters and anyone else who hates their equipment (I include creatives who are incapable of looking after any of their tools). This would ensure that the kit is properly abused, misused, eaten over and generally treated like crap before being released to the general public.

My Macbook keyboard problem...

[rnturn]

...--at least when I was working at home--was easily fixed with a USB-to-PS2 adapter and an IBM Model M keyboard. (Damned Mac keyboards are too small for my hands, anyway. Nothing but red squigglies and command line error messages using those tiny things.)

Re: My Macbook keyboard problem...

[rnturn]

When the company issues you a Mac, you use their Mac.

Re: My Macbook keyboard problem...

[angle_mark]

You spelled Thinkpad wrong.

Slashdot still hasn't fixed its paywall problem

[Anonymous Coward]

You used to be able to get halfway decent laptops with actually usable keyboards. That appears to've been shoed* away by, well, apple.

We're in a vicious circle of ever worse keyboards because you can't have all three of so stylishly thin you can shave with it, functional nevermind nice to use, and cheap enough for the manufacturer to fit in your overpriced device. You're just typing on it wrong!

* As in shoe event horizon.

The worst laptop keyboard ever made

[fortythirteen]

I know nobody who likes it. Everyone in my office who has this latest generation, including me, avoids the built in keyboard if at all possible. Two people have had popped off, broken keys that required going to the mall to turn in the computer for over a week.

Re:The worst laptop keyboard ever made

[ilsaloving]

Same here. I now refuse to buy Macbooks unless a project specifically requires it for whatever reason.

This new keyboard is not only insultingly poor quality, but it's an ergonomic nightmare too.

Re:So Much .

[Piranhaa]

And you can't replace single keys from what I understand (unless that's changed). You can only replace the whole keyboard. However, since the keyboard is riveted to the upper half of the casing, the whole thing needs to be replaced leading to a multi-hundred dollar repair.

Re:So this is what "news for geeks" has fallen to.

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't you mean "News for Nerds: Stuff that Matters"?

USB microphones.

[Anonymous Coward]

Apple still hasn't addressed the fact that USB mics crap out when used for any length of time.

They used to be the media creators system, but now low latency audio and video platforms are not labelled "Apple".

Re:USB microphones.

[fluffernutter]

Also the USB-C ports wear out quickly. Many people on the Apple "help" forum complaining that USB drives won't stay connected because any jiggle disconnects the USB-C port.

Re:USB microphones.

[fluffernutter]

For fucks sakes, you think I have lint in all my ports? You think it is right that a piece of lint defeats the stability of a port? Grow a brain. And yes I did check my ports for lint, there is no lint.

Re:So this is what "news for geeks" has fallen to.

[GrumpySteen]

At least it's about something technological. It could be yet another article about which politician farted upwind of an orphanage.

ha ha ha

[fat man's underwear]

Just the other day I was wiping the dust off my Commodore 128D keyboard... Still works!

Side note

[nightfire-unique]

I'm not an Apple fan for many reasons, but if I might hijack the story for the moment, I would like to make a side note.

There aren't a whole lot of things a company can do to earn my unbridled loyalty. One of the things they can do is take responsibility for a problem, publicly, loudly, and apologetically. They can offer legitimate solutions to legitimate problems. When a company goes out of their way to say "we fucked up; we're sorry, and here is how we're going to fix it" they gain so many respect points (personally) that they're almost guaranteed I will make it worth their while in the end.

I sometimes wonder if I'm the outlier, or if people are just really bad at business.

Re:Side note

[jenningsthecat]

I sometimes wonder if I'm the outlier, or if people are just really bad at business.

We're definitely the outliers. Most people in the 'mass customer' demographic, (and especially non-techies, it seems) have come to accept and even expect bad, abusive behaviour from the companies whose products they buy. To them that's 'just the way it is'. As a consequence, all of us who reward good behaviour and punish bad by voting with our wallets, represent little more than a rounding error in sales and profit stats.

Re:Side note

[fluffernutter]

I would accept literally any other platform and OS, but XCode has to work on it.

Re:Side note

[strikethree]

When a company goes out of their way to say "we fucked up; we're sorry, and here is how we're going to fix it" they gain so many respect points (personally) that they're almost guaranteed I will make it worth their while in the end.

Me too; however...

I sometimes wonder if I'm the outlier, or if people are just really bad at business.

You are not the outlier, but you are a bit rare, but not an outlier.

The issue is that no company wants to actually pay the penalty for fucking up. Money is king. Nothing matters more than money. They will sing you any song in the world, but they will never, ever, in all of time, let a single penny fall from their clutching hands.

When money is your focus, ideas like "taking responsibility" and "apologizing" all equal to admitting liability which means letting pennies fall from those clutching hands.

While I agree that accounting is an EXTREMELY important aspect of business, the bottom line is that you want people to give you money. Actually earning that money takes work and it is easier to con you or defraud you out of your money than to build an actual reliable product and stand behind it.

Simila Issus

[Zephyn]

Which brings us to the grand year 2019 and my MacBook Air's faulty E and R keys.

I hav noticd simila poblms with my kyboad. It's causing numous os.

This *is* news for *geeks*.

[Anonymous Coward]

This is exactly "news" for geeks, as exemplified by the hipster apple fanboi.

Nerds, the pocket protector-sporting kind, not so much.

I'm guessing the current crop of editors are millennials, and entirely unfamiliar with pocket protectors.

Buy a proper keyboard and shutup

[Murdoch5]

Go out, get a proper mechanical keyboard and shut up.

Re:Buy a proper keyboard and shutup

[Fly Swatter]

Don't forget the roll of duct tape, to you know, strap it onto your laptop.

Re:Buy a proper keyboard and shutup

[sl3xd]

Hey, they strap keyboards to tablets, why not have notebook cases with a fold-out keyboard?

Re:Buy a proper keyboard and shutup

[Waccoon]

Fun fact: I literally had to use duct tape to keep the power cord into my PPC Mini. The first Mini models had a proprietary power cable with no clips, tabs, or even friction to keep the cable in place. Only Apple could possibly fuck up a power cable.

I actually had a bunch of problems with that machine, so it was the last and final Apple product I ever bought.

Apple just wants to be finance company anyway

[stuff-n-things]

With the new Apple credit card, you can pay to have your MBP fixed, or buy a new one every six months.

Itâ(TM)s kinda sad.

[ruddk]

At least before you got the feeling that you bought a premium product. Now other laptop manufacturers are building solid products and Apple keeps raising the price and lowering the quality.

OS X and macs clearly isnâ(TM)t something they care much about anymore, they just want to milk it for what they can until their reputation of selling overpriced crap.
I tried building a hackintosh but then I realised that what I liked about my mac was that I didnâ(TM)t have to deal with drivers updates, configurations etc. Iâ(TM)ll keep my iMac running as long as I can for fcpx and then Iâ(TM)ll have to figure out what to do.

Re:So this is what "news for geeks" has fallen to.

[BringsApples]

Not true. This article is about Apple still having hardware issues. It's useful information for those that use Apple products.

Big touchpad

[fluffernutter]

Isn't Apple on the way to just having everyone use the touchpad? Open your laptop and it's one big touchpad. I

Re:Big touchpad

[DCFusor]

It's only coders and forum users who use the keyboard more than a few keystrokes a day anyway, and we are that small minority of people who have issues with their poor keyboard that will only live through a few strokes a day....We are holding it wrong. You're not supposed to type on it.

Re:Big touchpad

[fluffernutter]

People who code Apple apps are forced to use an Apple. Why would they not make it for coders? They literally force coders to use it as their machine.

Re:Big touchpad

[fluffernutter]

No, I didn't say that. I said if you want to be an iOS developer you have to use an Apple product, unlike many other platforms.

Apple haven't produced a good keyboard for ...

[bb_matt]

... over two decades.

I remember the keyboards that came with the first iMacs, with the fancy coloured plastic.
Just a tiny splash of liquid would render keys permanently inoperable most of the time.

Nothing improved from that time onward. In my hardware graveyard, I have 6 Mac keyboards, suffering from missing keys, keys that don't work and just from good old shit to type on reasons.

In contrast, I have a logitech wireless mac keyboard that's been going strong for 8 years, along with a few mechanical keyboards far older.

Screw how it looks, it's how it TYPES that matters - and how robust it is.
If I spill liquid on it, I expect it to work after it dries.

Re:Apple haven't produced a good keyboard for ...

[Yaztromo]

... over two decades.

That's hardly true, unless you're a complete monster to your keyboards. Most people feel that the previous generation of MacBook Pro keyboards were excellent (for a laptop keyboard in particular). And I still have my A1016 Wireless Keyboard, which IMO sits right up there with the IBM Model M keyboards in terms of design and response. Those were from 2003, but that was just 16 years ago, so certainly less than "over two decades".

Yaz

I COMPLETELY agree .... Worst keyboard ever made.

[Oh really now]

I ranted in a crash report today about it too, whether or not anyone reads it or gives a rip is another question.

My Macbook Pro is really a Mac Mini. I nearly never use it without an external keyboard plugged in.

Fire Johnny Ives....

[Proudrooster]

Yes, this is the reason I am still on a 2013 Mac Book Pro. I mean, I would love to upgrade so I could carry around all the Apple expensive dongles and have to live in the future with only USB-C ports.

Bottom line, Apple will not listen to it's customers and wants thin, unrepairable, expensive still that lasts 2-3 years max.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

Enjoy it while you can get it, but eventually the sheeple will figure it out.

Re:Fire Johnny Ives....

[strikethree]

Yes, this is the reason I am still on a 2013 Mac Book Pro.

My last Macbook Pro was a 5.1. I think that was from ... 2010?

I am honestly surprised you stayed with Apple for so long. I loved my 17 inch Powerbook. I liked my 15 inch Macbook Pros. Then they went back to their old proprietary ways and started soldering RAM in and other lock-in style things and I ran. I ran so far away.

Fuck Apple and fuck what they turned OS X into.

Oh. And fuck their phones too. The last one I bought was the 3GS. That was the last great phone that they produced. Antenna issues on the 4 leading all the way to current issues where this is no headphone jack and such.

No. Fuck Apple and their crappy shit.

Schadenfreude

[VeryFluffyBunny]

This is pure schadenfreude; enjoying the suffering of rich people who choose to buy exclusive, over-priced, & over-hyped luxury consumer electronics. =)))