Slashdot Mirror
Toonami Plans Revealed
da3dAlus writes: "Cartoon Network has revealed its plans for Toonami for the end of the year. About.com holds the article that details CN's plan for the next wave of anime to hit U.S. shores beginning in September. This includes more Gundam series, Blue Submarine #6, two Reboot movies, Sailor Moon movies, and even some of their own material. Unfortunately, there will be no uncut Tenchi episodes." Blue Sub #6 is crazy but highly interesting (notable for amazing surround sound effects, and abnormal quantity of CGI, that isn't always perfectly integrated).
But guns and violence on TV? Sure! No problem.
You people ("Americans") crack me up, really. You have absolutely no problem with showing all sorts of violent acts and the such on television - note, i'm not saying that's bad or anything - and yet you freak out whenever sex is involved. Let's try see here, sex... the most natural thing on earth, our way of reproduction, what ensures our survival as a species, no... god no, can't have that. Violence, blood and guts, sure... let the kids have what they want, if smashed brains on a wall is what they want.
Again, I'm not saying it's bad to show people what reality is all about, but don't you think it's a bit hypocritical when you won't even show them one of the most basic things humans being have to do to go on?
This is a troll, right?
Anime doesn't need Disney, give me a god damn break. Anime is an accepted part of culture in Japan, you seriously think they give a crap about what goes to American television? Please.
Furthermore, how can you even respect anything that comes out of corporate America these days? All this reality tv crap, god damn game shows are back too, what the hell is going on? And yes, I do watch some stuff, and I do watch lots of movies that come out of America, not everything there is bad, of course. But mainstream things, boy oh boy, don't bother putting your thinking cap on, you're not going to need it, seems to me they're just feeding you guys with the most mindless idiotic crap and you just swallow it. Come on, I know some of you watch Cops, admit it.
Anyhow, back to the original comment, Disney doesn't do anything for anime, anime always has and will always survive on its own, with or without Americans.
...doesn't anyone else think that the Slashdot "anime" icon sucks? Really really sucks? Fix it!!
The Cartoon Network is spinning of a channel called "Boomerang". The idea is to take all of the old content (ie. Looney Tunes, Tom and Jerry, etc...) and put them on the separate channel so Cartoon Network can focus more on new content, both in-house and licensed.
So, it's not that they are spinning off a Toonami channel, but they are spinning off the old stuff and making the main network mostly Toonami.
Rock on.
You should never take life too seriously - You'll never get out of it alive.
...is that Arthur C. Clarke predicted this (editing out cigarettes in old movies) for a somewhat dystopian future c. 2012 in The Ghost from the Grand Banks (IIRC).
The future is now...
::cue cheesy sci-fi music::
Maybe not, but it's a damn good show. The worst you can call it is offtopic.
Heh, Fist of the North Star was hilarious...
:)
If braveheart had the same voice actors, they would all be going 'yip yip yip yip yip' as they sliced people to pieces...
Sorry, I still can't get over that. And I love anime to death.
Erik
I hate martial arts movies, but you have to see (if you can find it) 'Drunken Master'..
Hilarious.
Erik
Portland, OR.
Heh HB has never been known for artistic or animation quality - sitcom-style plot is where they excel, not that that's a plus, either.
.. 'realistic' in quality, and the actual art of the group being stellar (IRT Reboot), the animation should have been MUCH better. Beastwars is a perfect example. Even the drollest scenes have very, very fluid animation even if the actual movements aren't very complex.
Most SHOWS don't animate at 30fps, true. However, with something like CGI, being so
Older cartoons still rule the framerate region.. WB and MGM to be specific. (older disney perhaps.. but i still can't watch it on GP)
IIRC, Akira was animated ABOVE 32 fps in 90% of the scenes, of course, even the most die hard anime fans, as much as the more pretentious hate to admit it, love the movie. It is a perfect example of quality in plot and animation, which is exactly why it's become so popular, and probably did most of the work breaking the ice in american acceptance of anime.
That's another thing, I have a real, real, hard time comparing anime like Gundam/Eva/NS/Golgo to things like, well, pokemon. Anime to me says 'excellence in artistic and plot form, with emphasis to japanese style'. Not, 'japanese animation'. Most of those anime's I listed above if not, are animating real, real close to 30 in the more fast paced scenes where it's required.
For a perfect example of what's NOT and SHOULD be animated at 30, take a look at the recent attempts Marvel has made at animating their own comics (X-Men, SpiderMan). If you watch an hour of episodes, you're almost guaranteed to see 'teleporting characters' or scenes that seem like the animators intended to provide 'slow-mo' by making the framerate 6fps or so.
Oh yes. There's nothing wrong with recycled animation, i never said that. It's just smart, like reusing code. But just like reusing anything, if it doesn't work, don't bother trying. 99% of actual productions seem to blatantly ignore this rule.
Erik
*COUGH*Roadrunner*COUGH*
:)
It's like MGM with Tom & Jerry, when Hanna and Barbera actually did the artwork and animation, then take a look at the later stuff when HB actually got the cartoon back.. crrrrrap!
'nuff said
Erik
I know I'm going to start a flamewar here.... sorry.
Reboot is by far one of the worst animated CGI Cartoons that I have ever seen. Beastwars, done by the same guys, is bounds and leaps beyond what this cartoon was. In fact, I'd even go to say that the only reason that reboot was ever popular is because it pretty much was the first full CGI cartoon pushed to american audiences.
The characters are blocky, the light is constantly off, the animatronics blow chunks, all the characters 'walk like an egyptian'.. I could go on. The visuals and plot, however, are excellent and unfortunately the lack of work by their animation team somewhat ruined that for me.
I guess I'm anal about animation, personally, if it's not animated at 30 fps or better it's not worth watching. Movies like Akira or Ninja Scroll or just about anything by Disney (despite plot) are grand to admire as an art form. The Gundam series is one of the better animated ones on TV, Tenchi and Ranma shouldn't be excluded from this though.
Also some of the more detailed scenes in DragonBall Z/GT. Unfortunately DragonBall really blows chunks in quality in the episodes where major plot events aren't happening. So sad. And funimation made things even worse by cropping almost half of each episode out for americans.
Personally, overall my favorite anime is 'The Professional', which had a great plot and was a groundbreaker, considering it was using 'decent' CGI in 1985.
Oh yes, and we mustn't forget John K., probably the best american animator working, creator of Ren & Stimpy.For those interested, there is a divx encoded copy of 'Man's Best Friend', floating around on gnutella. It's the episode that got John K. banned from MTV/Nickelodeon, and it's probably one of the best episodes out there. I suggest you take a look at it, it's not the greatest quality but watchable.
Oh yes. For those in the portland, or area, the guy who owns the Clinton St theatre has a vast collection of banned and 'disowned' cartoons, mainly from Warner Bros and a few Joe Fleischman (Popeye) cartoons that make some of the craziest Hentai look like Saturday morning television. He shows them every now and then in a series... Pretty neat stuff, cheap seats.. I guess Warner is trying to sue him for holding the episodes (which are mostly war propoganda and the bing crosby original clip).
Erik
I'm not around to see the 5:30 showing, but one of my roommates is, and he's pointed out a couple of things that were cut for the earlier broadcast but left in the midnight one. Mostly brief scenes that the producers apparently thought were too violent or gory. One that I remember off the top of my head was when Hiro was being rescued from the medical center and he'd broken through one of the wrist straps on his own, leaving a good bit of blood on the table.
--Phil (/me tries to imagine the reaction of the average American to Lain.)
355/113 -- Not the famous irrational number PI, but an incredible simulation!
Check out the phrase below the name "Slashdot"
"News for Nerds."
Gee, do you think SOME nerds (or geeks) might like and matter to them. Anime? RPGs? Star Wars? Macs? Security? Digital toys? Movies? Humor? There are many times that people claim that certain topics are off-topic for slashdot. That is only true if Cmdr Taco says so. It's his site.
The other poster noted that that topic can be eliminated from in your profile. There are lots of categories you can block out so you never see it. Heck you can even block out certain authors. Like Katz, or even CmdrTaco if that gives you a woody.
Actually, they do show an "uncut" version of Gundam Wing during their "Midnight Run".... Although I've yet to be able to sit through enough of an episode to actually notice a difference.
You _have_ to be joking. No one, but no one does animation at 30fps. It's a waste of time and money. Only occassionally, when great fluidity is needed might someone even think about doing ones. For instance the bit of fighting between Escaflowne and Schezarade in the opening of Vision of Escaflowne might be on ones. That's what - a few seconds?
Twos are the best you'll ever see normally. Threes or fours are much more common. But the Japanese are well known for recycling animation, or employing other tricks (e.g. dramatic pauses - or having characters talk with their mouths concealed - or camera tricks) to cut down on animating anything.
If you're really all that concerned about frame count, go watch more American animation (other than cheap crap, like most Hanna Barbera series)
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
Well, while CGI requires a totally different sort of work on the part of the animators, that doesn't mean that it's going to hit high framerates. The rendering alone takes a lot of time, and the animation is still an art - can you make characters that walk realistically in 2d or 3d? It's not particularly easy.
;)
Reboot was limited because not only did they have a very tight schedule, being a weekly show, but also because it was the first AFAIK show entirely in CGI meaning that the animators were still learning, and they had significantly less powerful computers to work with than they do today. The stunning difference between the end of the 2nd season and the beginning of the 3rd season highlights this.
Akira, IIRC, was filmed on ones (meaning 24fps - it's a movie) but it's virtually alone in that class. I liked it a lot, though my favorite anime movies are probably Dirty Pair: Project Eden, and Patlabor 2. Anime isn't frequently done at Akira levels is all I'm saying. If the animators are careful, it doesn't have to be (this is where the dramatic pauses come in...
And Eva has lots of good animation in some parts, and cheats insanely at others. I believe there's a full two minutes of Rei on an elevator in which there are probably 10 frames for the entire scene. By the end of the series they were IIRC over budget and behind schedule and it shows.
The Marvel series on Fox are awful, you're right. IMHO this is because they're trying to animate the same character designs that they use for the comics. One of the greatest successes of the Batman cartoon was that the character designs were so simple that fluid animation was relatively easy. (the excellent writing didn't hurt either) Animating each and every hair on Wolverine's arms is a PITA. It's got a lot to do with why it's so jerky at times. They had crappy backgrounds too.
The work that the Warner Bros. animation department did in the 30s-50s was really good, with lots of subtle movement all the time that probaby wasn't necessary, but really makes the shorts look great. No one does this anymore (e.g. characters idly shifting from foot to foot even though that's not the center of attention) Unfortunately their work started to get pretty bad by about the midpoint of Chuck Jones' reign - overly cute character designs and poor writing.
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
There's just no way that an American cartoon produced today can portray casual smoking to a young audience. It's almost like having a character transform into his secret identity by drinking cleaning fluid and jumping into an abandoned refrigerator. An absurd smoking toothpick is far more justifiable than actual clear-as-day cigarette smoking.
It is a shame, though. Just last night this subject came up and the example was given that it would be practically impossible these days for a show to have even a somewhat sympathetic character smoking, like J. Jonah Jameson puffing on a cigar, unless maybe it's the episode where he gets jaw cancer.
If I recall correctly, there were a few characters in Looney Toones that smoked.
Actually, things went way beyond that in that era.
Also, as others have said, I would support an Anime Network spinoff. I definitely would want the Macross, Neon Genesis Evangelion and Escaflowne to be played though. They are my favorites.
remy
http://www.mklinux.org
http://www.dartmouth.edu
"...Jon is to geekdom as Hitler was to his victims..."
Godwin's Law. Thread closed. *THUMP*
Uh, this is incredibly funny considering that episode two has about 5 minutes in a smoke filled room. And the smoke looks incredible, they did a great job with a lot of the CG effects in this.
:)
Of course the bigger editing is done on Mewtio and her freinds, they are mermaids essentially, not Disney mermaids either.
Q.
It's called the Cartoon Network, not the Children's Network. I know, I know. Cartoons are for kids in the U.S.
Have you, however, looked at the other animated shows on the CN? Johnny Bravo's constant come-on's and degredation of women (granted it's making fun of him). Siezure-inducing violence of the Powerpuff Girls (awesome show). Other cartoons that are irreverent and slightly rude (nudge, nudge).
Just because the shows use voice actors instead of "live" actors and the situations are over-the-top doesn't mean they are all geared towards children...intenionally anyways.
Also, can you please show me where you get the idea that pedophelia is "HUGE" in Japan? I'm sure a good number of Japanese citizens would take offense at that remark.
Looking at American non-animated television and movies I could probably create a few links between, oh, Popular, Saved by the Bell, Porky's, American Pie, Dawson's Creek, 90210, Episode I, and numerous others and the "HUGE" wave of pedophelia in the U.S.
Just something to think about.
Strange that you would consider Japanese animated television and film to be eroding Japanese and American culture. What about American television and film? Is it not degrading the way of life for people across the globe, not to mention here in the U.S.?
Also, if you want real (note tongue-in-cheek) Japanese culture turn off your Bach and Miles Davis for a moment and listen to some truly groundbreaking audio experimentation (mistakenly called "noise") by the likes of audio masters Boredoms, Merzbow, Masonna, Melt Banana, KK Null, etc. If you think anime is the decline of culture, you haven't seen or heard anything yet.
Card Captor Sakura's been showing on WB for about a month or two. Unfortunately, they renamed the series to Cardcaptors and cut out a lot of the episodes focusing on Sakura. Check out http://www.anipike.com/lastexit/lexit2.html for more info (only good for 4 more days, it's the July issue)
http://www.redrival.com/moonbrat/c herryblossoms/ looks like a pretty good site for analysis of the American dub.
Compare The Lion King and Hamlet sometime in the near future. Then give Hamlet a happy ending, and compare again.
.sig
Fellowship 9/11
Can you do me a favor?
My karma has gotten too high. I need to drop it by about 20 points. Please go into my user info and start moderating down my previous comments. Don't worry about the moral implications, I'm clearly abusing the +2 bonus and deserve what I get.
--Shoeboy
Mods like this is what M2 is for...
:)
It's likely someone eather dosn't like ReBoot or objects to the whole Anima theme.
This one is inline for the famous Slashot:BitchSlap.
Insert evil laugh
Grab bad moderator throw him into convenently placed pile of boxes as moderator smuches one... [Reboot Season 1 refrence]
Personally I liked the viruses
I don't actually exist.
You'll notice that anime now has its own category. If you don't want it, filter it out. Thats what the filters are there for.
-[Blaine]- "'Oh dear,' says God, 'I hadn't thought of that,' and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic."
What about the other 2 cuties from the FreeBSD booth? Hello nurse!
I only bothered to watch a few of the episodes in the midnight showing (I have to work too early to be up that late), and the only difference I noticed was in episode one, appairntly Heero saying "I'll kill you" to Relena had to be changed into "I'll distroy you" for the small childeren in the audience. That change made no sence to me, I could only assume that it came from the Japanese somehow...
-Ted
Depending on the system of conversion to Romanji, Washu is fine. In fact, it is the accepted version of the spelling of her name. The one that they botched horribly was "Aeka" which they spelled "Ayeka" for no good reason. Look up the FAQ for the various spellings.
(BTW, I maintain the FAQ, and I don't think I have ever seen anyone spell it with two uu's. If you are going to spell it differently, it is usuall wasyu with a yu (which sounds closer to how she pronunces her name).
I was actually refereing to the character design and the lack of hair that resembles modern art. Blame that on sailor moon. Tenchi, of course, takes that to the ultimate extreme.
There are plenty of series that fit into what you are trying to see. While some anime quality has gone downhill (observe the sheer number of wacky ideas in Urusai Yatsura vs. Ranma 1/2) much of it is still awesome. Here are some I particullarly like.
1) Ghibili's work... I can hear the see, as well as the more traditional "Nauscaa, Mononoke, Laputa etc". These are great stories with fairly good animation. The character designs are not real extravagent, but in the post-sailor moon days that's probibly a good thing. They all tell a story (most of which I disagree with) but are excelent. This tends to be the man vs. nature themese that were so prevelant early on in the century.
2) Cowboy Bebop
Is a effort to tell stories about the greys. There arn't any hero's per se, but the story is a bit more day in the life. The artwork is excellent.
3) Gundam Wing.
(Don't scoff). Wing takes a long hard look at pacifism and war. It examines everything from the commonly held belief that war is needed to "refresh" civilization (Jefferson and Hitler both though this) to the idea that violence is never sanctioned.
4) Lain
Umm... good... evil? Not in this series. Not that there arn't absolutes, but rather that the story is about the melding of life with electronics. How people act, see the world, and commuincate are all very affected.
5) Rurouni Kenshin (Samurai X)
See the OVA's. From what you have written This may be the closest. It follows the Meiji Restoration (civil war) and also goes over themes like what I have mentioned above.
It looks like they will be doing some heavy digital editing because, "the folks at CN want the channel to be a safe place to go to [for kids]."
The article says that "This allows them to keep the show intact, and it makes everyone associated with the show very happy. (note: It also makes the fans very happy)." Well, it doesn't make me happy nor the fans in my local anime clubs.
And... "They split the costs with the producer of the anime." This could mean the producers sensing a growing market in America may begin self censorship in future productions. That is bad.
What the hell are you talking about? To me, this *is* news. You know, "News for Nerds. Stuff that matters". This definitely fits in both categories.
It kind of looks sick.
Someone should make a better one.
He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.
You're my favorite troll. Do you write this stuff, or just gank it from somewhere? My friend thinks you write it, but I'm guessing it's "borrowed."
-Andy Martin
-Andy Martin
If y'all don't like me, blow me.
Why don't they bring back RoboTech? That was the most kick ass series when I was a kid. I wish they'd bring it back - the original ones, with Min Mae and Rick Hunter!
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." - Jed Babbin
Okay, make that 4 imposters...
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." - Jed Babbin
Heh - yeah, I don't know if it's male or female, but it's definately elfin! Check out them ears!
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." - Jed Babbin
VALD you mean - not Vlad - I didn't post that.
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." - Jed Babbin
Do you admit that Akira didn't suffer from these problems? Truely one of my favorite movies - right up there with BladRunner, The Matrix, and The Magnificent Seven (which is a remake of a Kurosawa film).
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." - Jed Babbin
What about Fantasia? What about Bambi? What fairy tale was Bambi taken from? How about Toy Story? How about The Lion King? Don't knock Disney - rather thank them for the efforts that lead to Anime having a chance in the first place.
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." - Jed Babbin
Don't knock Disney. If it wasn't for those "Whores", Anime would have a much tougher road to hoe.
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." - Jed Babbin
The Lion King is rehashed Hamlet.
"If one is really a superior person, the fact is likely to leak out without too much assistance" -- John Andrew Holmes
Not according to this essay, or indeed any source I've been able to find in ten minutes of Google-searching that has actual research and scholarship to back it up. If I had some of my books handy, I'd go through and do a nice essay-style citations, but I trust you know how to use a search engine.
The explanation certainly makes sense; if it directly lifted from English it would be called some variation of "animation", allowing for Japanese pronounciation. the French/Japanese connection makes more sense, again allowing for pronounciation.
--
These are *MY* opinions.
These are *MY* opinions.
They will not be *YOUR* opinions until the Orbital Mind Control Lasers are operati
The total otaku who insist doggedly that their favorite masterpieces be completely unsullied are, IMO, full of it. Translation is *never* enough; literal translations are dry and lifeless. Localizations are what are required; one must smooth the differences in the two languages/cultures involved, especially when they are as different as Japanese and English/American culture. It burns me even more when I hear rants on how "Americans are not worthy of this art" - well, a country that invented the concept of virtual dating games, Pokemon, and the schoolgirl fetish has more than a few things to answer for itself. We're all fscked up equally; the difference is HOW.
That said, I hate the Serena/Usagi thing. "Bunny" is a perfectly good English name. Makes the character sound like a ditz, but... well... duh.
--
These are *MY* opinions.
These are *MY* opinions.
They will not be *YOUR* opinions until the Orbital Mind Control Lasers are operati
I'm not an anime fan, never have been, and don't think I ever can be. But, I will admit that I have great respect for the talents of the many wonderful artists who work on all the anime that is out there.
One thing I noticed about this article was that it was poorly written. Grammatical errors abound, and on a more general level, stylistically it was written so that my first thought was not of what exact point they were trying to portray (which I presume, by now, was merely doling out information about Toonami, which must be an anime company), but rather was "this is crack!"
But, I noted that the article did mention "Reboot" - which, if I'm understanding this correctly, is/was a CGI (am I correct? - has to be..) cartoon that I watched every Saturday for a long time. I loved that show.
Anyway, I guess the point of my post was to comment that they need to work on their journalism... ermm... hmm.. uh...
Insert mind here.
The majority of other programmers and "nerds" I know like anime. Some like it more than others, and so I see no problem with the topic on Slashdot. If you don't like anime, you can IGNORE anime topic posts, just like you would a Katz article. Not everyone likes anime. Not everyone likes Star Wars either, but it still has its own topic and nobody seems to complain.
While Anime has a high geek quotient (in that many in geekdom are nutso for anime), I don't think the same holds true for Katz. Jon is to geekdom as Hitler was to his victims - Both talk about them a lot, but neither respects them and both are given to overexaggeration of their abilities and importance or lack thereof.
Why not a Poll - Anime vs Katz - I expect you'd get a 4:1 ratio even with Jon trying to get the trolls to stuff the ballot box for him.
Will in Seattle
TROLL!
Where're my moderator points when I need 'em,
- Twon
Yes. I have to credit Evangelion with having (with the exception of a few scenes, generally involving Misato) the most disturbing, least sexual use of nudity EVER.
when did showing someone smoke on TV become unacceptable?
Once the public found out how bad smoking is for you. Back in the Looney Toones days the dangerous of smoking weren't as well known.
... that Anime is created in mind for the adult audience.
What I have a problem with is that American society still thinks of all cartoons as childern's entertainment.
If Cartoon Network cannot accept the responsibility giving us unedited versions of Anime, then they should not broadcast Anime.
At least give some respect to the people who create these wodnerful works of art. Is it our fault that Disney sucks at animation?
ChozSun [e-mail]
ChozSun
ChozSun.com
You know, back in the evangelization phase of American anime culture, people (me, included ;_;) thought popularity would be a good thing.
But after awhile, I realized that popularity is _never_ a good thing (OT: witness Kuro5hin or even the decline of Slashdot). In the case of anime because it can end up with the real fans being sacrificed in favor of more "mainstream" audiences.
However, to quote Ambassador Kosh (B5), "The avalanche has already started, it is too late for the pebbles to vote."
All the creatures will die, And all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai. (Jubai, 1605)
Lord. Yes, and music in America has utterly died and descended into Britney Spears and N'Sync. Theatre has been replaced by re-runs of "Roseanne" (or perhaps the latest action film starring Arnold and his walker) and fine art has given way to supermarket logos. Literature has ceased, the closest thing being either Stephen King's self-described "Literary equivilent of a Big Mac" or the summeries on the back of the box of the home video copies of "Cheers".
Lets just kill ourselves now before the government outlaws the use of sharp and dangerous instruments, guns, and chewable dramamine.
Courtesy of Stile and the Stile Project.
Wah!
Iie desu ne!
Anyway: what I would really love to see one day (but probably never will) is the 24/7 Anime Channel. Nothing but all of the best, most innovative series, OAV's and full-length anime movies from Japan all on one station 24/7, 365 with no censorship and no commercials. Think about it: Ranma, Sailor Moon, Serial Experiment Lain, Urusei Yatsura, Cowboy Bebop, Grave of the Fireflies, Shojo Kaume Utena, Ghost In The Shell, Akira and a hundred other shows/series we've never even heard of, all subbed, dubbed or in the raw Japanese. If such a thing ever graced the airwaves, not only would I buy a telvision to watch it, I would spring for a friggin' home theater!
My favorite channel MTV (#include sarcasm.h) looks like it's rubbing off on /. MTV has taken itself from the music TV that it was and now is an icon for popculture TV. It disturbs me that /. is heading in this same direction. Is /. tring to be the one-stop geek culture center of the net? Should they? As you probably have guessed, my feeling is No. /. is a NEWS site not a CULTURE site. While they come close in implementation, the purpose is quite different. I'm wondering how much the Andoverizing of /. has effected content, or is /. just getting lame?
/. but lately, I've been becomimg more and more displeased. Is the hormone induced euphoria wearing off? Or is it going down hill?
Don't get me wrong, I used to love
Just think of the effect all of this 'clean' anime will have on the adults. In making it safe for our children, our adults will slowly become like the very children it's safe for. :)
In all honesty though, as _long_ as it's as close to the original anime as possible, I don't mind slight edits for the sake of TV. It gives me an idea of whether I want to go and find it on DVD (preferred) or VHS (well, any port in a storm, as they say). I really dislike seeing anime mangled though (can we say Robotech?), in order to make it more 'acceptable' to US audiences.
Who defines 'acceptable' anyway? In most cases, definitely not the original writers and directors.
Grei
As this /. article pointed out a while back, the first few episodes are available online. If you don't want to click the link, they are at starblazers.com... of course Ranma would be really nice to see... but then it would be edited heavily... Well Eva would be nice too.... ah well, i can dream.
There's and interesting book written in the 70s (don't recall the name) about the degree of masculine values (re-defined as individuality, competetive drive directed against fellow employees, expectaion of personal recognition) and femenine values (re-defined as prefering to work with others to solve problem, redirecting recognition to team members, cooperation with fellow employees in more aspects than what needs to be done) found in various nation's corporate cultures. They do the study by asking employees to rate how they prefer to work in respects to the values. The data collected shows the US UK and Japan to be (oddly) fairly equal in masculine values, and denemark, norway, and sweden to be fairly equal in femenine values. The implications of which are discussed to some degree, but I didn't read the whole thing.
Basically if in the 70s an American were to interview with a danish company they might, through applying common interview tecniques of american culture, come off as over-competative, and possibly incapable of teamwork; conversly a danish person interviewing at an american firm might be thought incapable of individual innovation, lacking in desire to strike out for change etc... None of this says whether any of these values are good or bad, but by understanding the difference it more likley for an american company to do well with danish employees in a danish branch rather than feeling they must hire americans and bring them over at greater cost.
Anyway, in general an isolationist view of the world leads to xenophobia, and worse yet, wars... lots of them. So better than getting all worked up about cultural pillars and ways of life and social change, just relax a bit and enjoy whats available to you. If you start thinking about the way things should be for your children's children you're thinking a bit too much since you realy have no control over the political and social atmosphere that will exist by then.
The above does not apply to environmental issues, those can be fairly clearly defined as good and bad, and you should be thinking about your children's children.
ReBoot is not anime, at least not in my collection.
mitd -- Made in the Dark
"One good thing about spam... You don't gotta answer it"
Obviously, and as usual, this will only be limited to the American version of CN I guess... I hope they will get to their senses one day and also show the Europeans better cartoons than giving us 24/7 reruns of old Hanna Barbara cartoons which get pretty boring after seeing them run for a zillion times.
I didn't know you could go into people's user info and do that. Neat.
*Writes that down*
Now all I need are modpoints...
:)
Is this post not nifty? Sluggy Freelance. Worshi
I prefer Saitou because that makes more sense to me. I also prefer to keep the name in Japanese order.
Of course, these are just nitpicky things.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
The majority of other programmers and "nerds" I know like anime. Some like it more than others, and so I see no problem with the topic on Slashdot. If you don't like anime, you can IGNORE anime topic posts, just like you would a Katz article. Not everyone likes anime. Not everyone likes Star Wars either, but it still has its own topic and nobody seems to complain.
Slashdot is supposed to be news for all types of nerds. Not just "your" type of nerd, so your always going to see things you don't like. Live with it.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
Shine on, you crazy diamond.
For all of you anime fans out there, Otakon 2000 is august 4,5, and 6th in Baltimore, MD. Tons of neat events, and really fun. I went last year and loved it so much I am going again this year. hope to see some slashdotters representing.
Yeah. Let me know when Disney comes up with an original story and just some whitewashed retelling of an old-world fairy tail.
Why are people all of a sudden into anime?
Like you said: "It's about the story." Most anime has well-told original stories. Not just the same old prince-saves-the-beautiful-maiden-from-the-evil-st epmother crap.
Heyyyy, wait a minute. You're just a troll?!? Nevermind then.
--
NetInfo connection failed for server 127.0.0.1/local
You can thank the USofA for the pedophilia problem. We outlawed pubic hair in photographs and drawings. Consequently, the most portrayed part of society is that which is least likely to have pubic hair. We sure showed them, didn't we.
All of these young, breast-less, big eyed girls in these shows, with their short skirts and knee-high socks, are really just a subtle way of losening our children's morals and making them more susceptible to attack from a pedophile.
Your children are more susceptible to attack because you try to hide reality from them. You make them go to strangers to learn about sex, and to learn why their bodies are the way they are. If we stopped lieing to them ("The stork brought you" "I found you in a cabbage patch") we might have a chance to save them, and they might not grow up to become pedophiles.
--
NetInfo connection failed for server 127.0.0.1/local
No plot. No story. You should just hate that.
What about Bambi?
I don't know.
How about Toy Story?
Toy Story is NOT Disney.
How about The Lion King?
Lying King is a blatant rip-off of Kimba, The White Lion, a long-running animated Japanese television show from the 1960s. Read the comparisons here
Disney hasn't done anything original in decades. Their contribution to the success of anime in the US is much the same as Window's contribution to the success of Linux.
--
NetInfo connection failed for server 127.0.0.1/local
Heh, I'm an American and I agree with you 110%. I bet Cartoon Network is going to get a flood of mail from "concerned parents" once they start pimping out the anime lineup on the air, even though the stuff they'll show is going to be squeaky clean. A large portion of the idiots in this country are so deeply repressed (I'm talking even more repressed than the sad amount of repression that damn near everyone here suffers from) that as soon as they see some quality animation that doesn't have a two dimensional puppet singing, they immediately freak out like it was the Urotsukidoji or something. Well, if you'll excuse me, I'm off to go watch a horror flick on the TV; don't worry, the quick flash of that chicks boobs just before she gets sliced into fish sticks has been carefuly removed so as not to harm anyone. :/
Deo
I don't know, that's some pretty damn good animation if you can beat someone to death with it. I don't know about that jackass pron, though; I saw a donkey show a few years back outside of TJ and that was pretty disturbing stuff.
Deo
Get off your high horse. Speaking as someone who's had plenty of experience living in both Asian and Western culture, I say you're putting traditional Asian culture on a much higher pedestel than it deserves. Just because it's so oddly different from Western culture doesn't automatically make it any better (or worse). Difference is merely difference, it has no innate correspondence to worth or specialness.
"The writings of the great authors are wine, my writing is water. Everybody drinks water."
-Mark Twain (paraphrased)
"Image is nothing. Thirst is everything. Obey your thirst."
-wise words from a crass commercial
And anyway, "low culture" entertainment eventually becomes "high culture," given enough time. Great writers such as Mark Twain, Shakespeare, and Salinger were all reviled as uncouth hacks in their time. If everyone merely followed in the footsteps of "the great ones", then culture would stagnate and die. I'd rather have a chaotic morass of crudeness and commercialism, because such humble, rude fodder is _needed_ to keep the soil of creativity fertile and rich, so that something stronger than the old can grow. I'm not willing to sacrifice growth just so one I can maintain a useless image of refinement and feel oh-so-superior. Like living creatures, when a culture feeds and grows, when times change, it's always _ugly_. It's impossible to be otherwise, simply because it's changing to something different from old standards of beauty.
"May you live in interesting times."
-ancient Chinese curse
'Sides, if you're really looking for artsy anime titles, then the paltry few you mentioned sure as hell aren't going to cut it. Try out Mononoke Hime, Patlabor Movie #2, Gasaraki, Grave of the Fireflies, or Tale of Genji (yes, there's an anime adaptation). You won't find most of these right off the rental rack at Blockbuster, but if that's all the effort you're willing to expend in your search, then you certainly don't deserve the highfalutin', pseudo-scolarly studious attitude you're displaying, especially when it comes to anime. Can you say in all seriousness and honesty that you've watched a thousand different anime titles? Then you're in no position to judge it, no more than anyone who hasn't read a thousand different books is for judging literature.
I think I need to lie down and relax now. Where are my encyclopaedias?
Did you even READ the article? Or the post? ReBoot is one of the things that's mentioned. If you'd like to let me know what the heck you were thinking, I'd be really interested in hearing.
Normally, I don't get upset over this sort of thing. But in this case, I'll make an exception. Stupidity is one of the things that really gets to me.
ReBoot, for those of you who may not know, is a CGI cartoon by a Canadian company called Mainframe Entertainment. It was supposedly about the "sprites" inside of a computer. I know, it sounds bad.
But it's not. Especially the second and third seasons of the show. It features fairly adult-targeted references and plots, such as the plot where the main character questions his own methods in hunting down his nemesis, or references to Army of Darkness or Bond movies. (completely with a bond-style intro).
Regardless, check it out if you get a chance. The second and third seasons have some incredible episodes in them. My personal favorite is an episode that is influenced by two rather different sources: Star Wars: A New Hope, and spaghetti westerns. It's definitely worth a look.
"Toonami" ? What the hell is this ?
Big budget CGI-ed anime about huge-eyed Geordie football supporters and the 'Toon Army ?
The Fat Slags, in little sailor suits ?
Look, if you're a Yank, just forget it. It's Brit humour and it doesn't travel
How much story do you expect in an hour or so long film? Its just meant as entertainment, not art. Two of those stories are just meant as a small part of their bigger manga Universe anyway. And what the hell is wrong with titilation for its own sake? Are you a prude?
I am not American, so I wonder... That Albees and Updikes you mention who are saving you from cultural death, what percentage of Americans do you think which have voluntarily read them? I wouldnt be surprised if they arent "saving" a whole lot of Americans.
Not that people like me really want to be saved... there is a very good reason we dont seek out translated Basho, it would bore us to death. Its just like with Classical music, apart from the more populist stuff I just dont grok it... doesnt do a thing for me, if thats for a lack of education fine so be it. But I can still enjoy a good movie like the Matrix, or a good anime like Mahou Tsukai Tai or a good Sci-Fi novel like Snow-Crash (actually something like "Use of weapons" is more my thing, but I wanted to pick something even someoene has highly cultured as yourself was likely to recognise). Those suit my coarse taste just fine. In the end this is all about taste, you have yours... keep it.
"However, at least some semblance of quality American/Western culture is being preserved by the numerous great and recognizeable literary artists we still have alive today"
Ill go along with that.
"Unfortunately such is not the case with modern Japanese culture"
Lets assume thats true for the moment you are going to present the evidence shortly, here it comes...
"For example, the only recent (in the late 20th century) great Japanese cultural celebrity who Americans have been mass exposed to is Akiro Kurasawa. Sadly, commercialized anime is being mass releaed dominating the exposure of true Japanese art and literature. Soon it seems as if true Japanese literature will become extinct as we are losing our connection to their culture. We should be preserving the true art of Japan, not killing it by buying up cheesy anime."
Oh wait I was mistaken, no proof present... all you have shown that the American perception of Japanese culture (according to your standards of course) is in decline. How US centric can you get? You arent being exposed to the creme the la creme of Japanese culture so it might as well not exist????
The Japanese are perfectly able of preserving those parts of their own culture they wish just like you are. Not too many Europeans read any of those great contemporary literary artists of your's either but we sure do mass consume your more popular entertainment. There is little difference between our relationship towards the US than your's with Japan apart from the fact that a little more of the artsy fartsy stuff can get accross due to the absense of the huge language barrier and because the large amounts of popular entertainment and common cultural background has given us a frame of reference, I doubt its because of their higher inherent quality.
Fist of the North star?! that takes the concept of blood and guts to new levels! this makes violent anime movies look like barney. Granted we would all like to see barney turned inside out, but this movie goes beyound the realm of good taste. has some awsome fight scenes though.
guvf vf zl fvt
Yup. This guy's an American all right!
I don't like Anime and I don't like CGI. The only good animation is Disney.
Well, that's pretty ironic, seeing as pretty much EVERY SINGLE disney movie to come out in the past 3 years has had gobs of CGI all over it. Remember the marauding mongol hordes in Mulan? Yup. Those were CGI. Even the Lion King had CGI.
Animation is not about the fucking drawing. It's about the story. That's where Disney will stomp a mudhole in those japs anyday.
Yeah, after all, who cares about what gives a person an identity, or what exactly IS a person's identity (see: Ghost In The Shell). I just wanna know if the cute fuzzy animal (that I happen to be consuming) is gonna get away from the big bad MAN HUNTER! oh boy.
But back to my point.
No, seriously, you had a "point"?
They're real Americans. Not wanna be arthouse, coffee slurping fags.
Translation: My freinds are REAL AMERICANS(tm)! They all watch football like we have actually something to do with the sport, watch MTV, are homophobic, xenophobic, have an IQ that's only slightly greater than their shoe size, and we drink beer and eat pork rinds!
Just for clarity, I am an American, but fucking idiots like this are what make everyone else on the planet biased against me because of where I'm from.
-SaintAlex (/slugsalt)
Observe, reason, and experiment.
Observe, reason, and experiment.
(if you're too dumb, just pray)
But wouldn't Tezuka be guilty of the same offences? Take a look at some of the Tetsuwan Atom and Black Jack designs, they're as freaky as anything you see in Tenchi, in their own way.
Not that I'm complaining. I like character designs that don't look like everyone else's stuff, as with a lot of American series (compare the designs in Godzilla and NASCAR Racers, for instance).
I agree with your choices, but I do have a comment or two on the above. It should be noted that nature is very much idealized by urban Japanese, and a connection to nature is considered by Japanese to be a big part of their character, regardless of whether they practice it or not. So the Ghibli stories, concentrating on the natural world and nostalgic themes (as in the wonderful "Only Yesterday") touch on a powerful societal chord.
Also, I don't think you meant it as such, but it does look like you're defining the Ghibli work as "post-sailor moon", which we know isn't the case. Much of Miyazaki's work comes from before the magical girl genre.
And don't be too quick to discount the value of shows like Sailor Moon. Those who have seen the original version know that there's a hell of a lot more depth to the story and characters that never made it to these shores. Blind SM-bashing for the sake of protecting machismo or some such is one thing, but let's be fair here.
Warner Brothers is probably going to horibly mutilate Card Captor Sakura when they get it on the air next year. Dammit! It's just fine the way it is! Who cares if the fundies will get upset about some vague suggestions of sexuality? Sout Park seems to be doing quite well without them.
Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose that you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.
Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day, but set him on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
I'm not really a big fan of anime, but I see that Cartoon Network may have quite a market considering how big their Toonami section has grown.
I second that notion! (And third and fourth it, too.) An all-anime, all-the-time station would be great! I don't know if the market/demographics/whatever would support it, but it would be nice to not only be able to turn on the TV any time and see some anime, but also increase the exposure to the general public of more anime than just Sailor Moon and Dragon Ball.
Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose that you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.
Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day, but set him on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Well, to answer my own question, I guess that the Cartoon Network replays the same daytime anime late at night because they've already bought the rights to it. But it would be nice if they could something different, aimed towrads "adults", like Ranma 1/2, Slayers, Fushigi Yugi and so on. Of course, these things would appeal to more people than simply adults, but Cartoon Network seems to be thinking "kids" when it does it's programming: Dragon Ball (blech!), Sailor Moon (blech!).
If Cartoon Network is thinking long-term, they should try to increase the appeal of cartoons to adults, and one of the best ways to do that would be with Anime that has some appeal towards adults. I'd think that they'd also find that kids out there have more mature of a taste than the marketroids are giving them credit for.
Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose that you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.
Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day, but set him on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Where else do you get complicated political and social relationships in a war time setting. Space:Above and Beyond?
Where else do you see a group of girls that are so devoted to each other that they're willing to die for each other while arguing like girls in real life? Roller Derby? :-)
"History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme." Mark Twain
Then I suggest you check out anime such as the following:
Vision of Escaflowne
Ruroni Kenshin
Perfect Blue
Princess Mononoke, or, for that matter, pretty much anything by Miyazaki
All of these titles are, or soon will be, available in English.
Ahem... Sorry about that...
-Elendale (and poor TM is going to look very poor after they get done with it. Imagine the bath scene...)
Karma burn coming
As i meta-troll again
IANAT (I Am Not A Troll)
-Elendale (they need the good stuff though)
Karma burn coming
As i meta-troll again
IANAT (I Am Not A Troll)
-Elendale (wonder what the moderators will think of this...)
Karma burn coming
As i meta-troll again
IANAT (I Am Not A Troll)
On a side note, one thing that is often forgotten about anime is most (probably 70-80% or higher) of it is complete and utter crap. The redeeming quality is anime like NGE or Slayers (humor has its place). In any case, even the best literature looks bad eventually. We will just have to wait longer for somethings.
-Elendale (blah blah blah)
Karma burn coming
As i meta-troll again
IANAT (I Am Not A Troll)
-Elendale (is bored again... that means trouble)
Karma burn coming
As i meta-troll again
IANAT (I Am Not A Troll)
-Elendale (and if you really look, you can see it in the culture... much more than pearl harbor)
Karma burn coming
As i meta-troll again
IANAT (I Am Not A Troll)
Being a standard cable channel, they simply aren't allowed by the government to show certain things. If they did something like show Tenchi unedited, they'd be shoulder-deep in legal trouble before they knew it. If they had a Toonami channel, they would have to make it a pay channel (similar to Cinemax or HBO) in order to show unedited material on it.
Karma: Terrifying (mostly affected by atrocities you've committed)
I never thought of it as anime...
;)
Maybe because I like reboot, and I don't (generally) like anime.
Reboot has some very awesome graphics for a tv cartoon (these are the same guys that make Transformers beast wars/beasties) and you can even see an improvement from season to season (as they got more bucks for bigger iron...)
If you ever get a chance - go on the Reboot ride film... it's pretty cool - went on it at the Playdium outside of Toronto last year... and it rocks.
My favourite Reboot episode - the one where Big Enzo and Megabyte fight... the best part is when Enzo is down, and MB is running down the dome towards him... your first hint that he's coming is that Enzo's ear-ring starts to jangle... shortly before virbrations start shaking the entire building... It's a great fight scene all around.
BlackNova Traders
--Forager.
student of animation and the fine arts
I'm sure a lot of you would agree that they need to spin off a Toonami channel !
--
Wooden armaments to battle your imaginary foes!
-I'm sorry but the only anime that works for me involves tentacles and exploding orgasms...
-And maybe that cute girl from FreeBSD at last year's Linux thingy in NY
This
About Tenchi: They have gotten only a few calls about the 'sexiness' of Tenchi.
Oh great, what next!? PokePorn?
thinks to self: no wait, that CAN'T be new, I saw it last night
AboutPCs.com
-----
------------
Tonight on Fox: Deadliest Executions Part XVII
-Nightmare Butterfly
!sirE liaH ->- Hail Eris!
I don't know, but it just recently became real unnacceptable for a cartoon to smoke a cigarette. Stupid people sued for 200 billion. I wouldn't want to take the chance that some retarded kids mom would misconstrue it as advertising and get my ass sued off. I like my ass. It's sad though... What if a cartoon character is addicted. They have to quit cold turkey. It must get real tough after sex^H^H^H^H lying in bed with a fellow cartoon character with a computer generated swimsuit on.
When I saw the word Toonami, I was expecting a story on Newcastle United.
I REALLY hope that Turner decides to put Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz on after this run of Gundam Wing. I just finished up watching the end of the series (last 3 episodes), and uh...........WOW. I love it! Annoys me that all of the DVDs won't be out until the end of 2001, but I can live. I highly reccomend this series :)
Don't you understand, though, that different anime have completely different styles? Saying that "Gundam Wing is good and Sailor Moon is bad" is the same as saying "Seinfeld is good and Barney is bad". Just because I don't like rap music doesn't mean that it loses all credibility as a viable art form.
And face the facts.. society is changing. No matter how much anyone wants to keep their deathgrip hold on the good old days, culture is changing all around us. And before you say it, that isn't a bad thing. We're not going to forget the past, we're not going to burn all the copies of Picasso's work, for instance... but if we tried to make all the new art follow the same form as the old art, society would stagnate. In a hundred years or two, music history classes will have essays on the deep emotional stress that instigated Eminem's work. (Ok, so maybe that's a little far-fetched.)
Another major point that comes up is the subject of anime editing. Face it, our society here in America is different than Japanese society. Many of the anime series that go on Toonami, for instance, are meant to be children's shows. Now, in Japan, families are not worried about exposing their children to nudity, violence, or the more shocking aspects of society. However, Americans as a whole have more conservative taste.. and to keep the intent of the anime alive, edits have to be made. Just as someone who translates a book into another language must keep the author's thoughts intact, not just translate every idiom word-for-word, when a company translates an anime show for the US, if the target audience is children, then it must be edited to suit them. It's a fact of life. And no one is stopping you from watching the original episodes, if you really must see the uncut anime. I'm not saying that I like cut anime.. I can't stand watching it, in general. But does that mean I bitch and moan about it? No, that means I take it upon myself to find the uncut originals. Demanding that commercial translators give you your uncut anime just isn't going to work, because the market for it is anime otaku, which isn't that big. Businesses work for the market... and in this case the market is American children, because most American adults aren't into cartoons of any kind.
My point, though, is that trying to pass off your personal opinions as fact is just foolish, because we all have different opinions. Personally, I like different things depending on the mood I'm in. If I've had a long day and I want to unwind with some non-thought-provoking stuff, I might pop in a tape of Sailor Moon, grab a Coke, and lie down on the sofa. It all depends on the mood, and more importantly on the tastes of the person that's watching. There's no such thing as a bad anime.. just one that you don't like.
Fantasia was a rehash of the classic tale to warn us that power which is not earned is dangerous. Bambi is a typical, mindless, animals talking to each other in the woods type story. Toy story was stolen from the Nutcracker, as far as the 'originality'. And the Lion King is a real Myth from Africa.
Disney doesn't just steal myths and whitewash them. They destroy the myths. Watch Hercules, for instance. During the last five minutes, Hera picks Hercules up, cluthches him to her breast, and yells out 'My Son!' Don't tell me not to knock Disney. They are whores, who can't tell a story to save their fucking lives.
Beavis: Heh huh heh heh huh, He said 'titilate'. Butthead: Yeah! Cool! Huh huh heh heh. Beavis: He also said "bastardization", Huh huh. Butthead: Heh huh, Errrr. I like 'titilate' better. Beavis: Heh huh ha heh, Me too! Butthead: Heh huh heh he heh heh huh heh.
Anime is all about plot, when you do animation, the sky's the limit on what type of show you can do.
Nudity on Japanese TV in animation is simply characters with no clothes on, no details. This means no hair, no nipples, just flesh colored characters with a line or two to indicate the shape. Normally for TV, it isn't even shaded to show any curvature.
The Lion King appears to have been a blatant rip off of a 1950's B&W anime called Kimba The White Lion
It's not only on TV you know. Remember Lucky Luke comics (and later cartoons). Originally he smoked cigarettes all the time (like "real" cowboys do). Someone came up with the idea that he would be a bad example for the kids so they replaced the cigarette with a grass-straw. All this stuff happenend really long ago (more than 20 years IIRC) :-)
Of course it's not Japanse Anime...
Ahhh...the great dumpster continuum. Many a free computer will be found there. -- sowth (748135)
Shinseiki Evangelion, AKA Neon Genesis Evangelion, nothing less than the Uber-God of all Anime!?! Yes, there are some controversial parts, some minor nudity, a little violence, but mostly the prob is a sort of dark pathos and very serious topics (the calm consideration of Armageddon, and it looks like the good guys will lose...). They can't very well cut it (miss a second, miss gigabytes of implied information), but it would make a killer addition. Hell, giant mecha (such as the Evangelions themselves) seem to go over quite well...
If violence isn't solving your problems, you're not using enough of it. - MAJ Misato Katsuragi
People have already commented that there is a good deal of anime that actually rivals western film/tv work in plot/theme/characters, so I won't dwell on this.
However, you did mention that perhaps reading Japanese literature is one solution. I just wanted to point out that most Anime videos actually came about due to original "Manga", or Japanese 'comic books' (so to speak). In many cases, the manga are much better than the videos (if you understand Japanese) and are filled with plot/theme/characterization...far more so than your typical Wolverine(tm) title.
Gainax should be ranked right below Studio Ghibli! They made Wings of Honneamise, which many consider to be one of the best movies; they made Evangelion, which is arguably the most profound anime ever created; and they made His and Her Circumstances, which contains very interesting and realistic issues regarding relationships at the teenage level (at least very much applicable to Asian students...); and the list goes on.
Personally, I haven't seen enough of Beebop to really have an opinion, but from what I've seen, it's nothing spetacular. Kenshin contain historic events, but other than that aspect and a well made OVA, it's overrated. I've recently changed my views regarding Gundam Wings, after watching 0083 and Endless Waltz, and agree that it's one of the best series. It picked up where original Macross left off. Since Original Macross movie, Macross II was only so-so, Macross Plus OVA was superb, but Macross 7 was pretty bad...As for Lain...It's good, but it's also a bit too crazy/weird...
Well in the rest of America, the Cartoon Network's Toonami consists of "Shadow Raiders", "Beast Wars", "The adventures of Johnny Quest" and "Pokemon". The only other anime I recall seeing lately in Latin CN is Speed Racer.
Barely on Topic: on the other hand, at least here in Mexico we get to see "Pokemon", "Ranma 1/2", "Dragon Ball Z" and "Dragon Ball GT" every day, plus several other shows. Guess what? The kids all over the country go nuts over the anime. I've got 7 and 9 year old cousins which know the names of all 251 Pokemon. I just hope they dont discover Hentai anime until they're 15!
Tongue-tied and twisted, just an earth-bound misfit, I
Learning to fly, Pink Floyd.
Speaking of which, if the Cartoon Network episodes of Tenchi Muyo! are going to horribly hacked up (hell, I bet they're spelling Washuu's name as "Washu" or something equally stupid), then I don't see any reason that we, the anime community, should view, promote, or even acknowledge the existence of this travesty. Until companies learn that anime is not to be hacked up to suit network TV, then they have no right to try to take over beloved series like Tenchi Muyo! or Pocket Monsters.
True, Kite's missing 10 minutes in the American release is a good example, where thankfully perfectly acceptable standard Japanese content was deemed unacceptable to more Puritan American eyes (or rather not worth the risk in corporate reputation of releasing it on Americans without the necessary Homogenization/Puritanization).
:)
Fansubs are so perfect. Now release dates are set so early that there isn't much time, and, you're right, that's only going to attenuate. *Sniff* Hopefully some napster-like technology will save us, not so much in increasing consumer bootlegging, but in driving down prices from the stratosphere-- $30 for TWO EPISODES/ONE HOUR?!?!
It's such a racket. The subs are always more expensive and the consumer gets reamed so that a bunch of ADV employees can live on the con circuit and biz exp garage kits while the execs live the cream exec life (or better, so that they can spend the money making newer renditions of ugly CG intros).
Yet, even more revolting, they can't sell them for less, because it does take a lot of money to run a business, distribute, market, and compete, and if they did charge a lot less, it's all too likely their more ruthless competitors would just buy their noble yet cash-sapped asses.
I long for the upcoming days of gigabit bandwidth. Then I don't have to shell for their stupid tape, box, distribution, and marketing-- meaning it should be $10 for those 2 eps. With that bandwidth, they can't charge more, otherwise people will bootleg it guiltlessly (not unlike in China where everyone has a family CD burner; and isn't that such a better investment than One kosher windows 95 liscence in a land where a good dinner is a buck? It brings new fulfillment to MS's slogan "where do you want to go today?").
I think Eva was the decline point for me as well. I remember really being into it and finally understanding the popularity because it is quite good-- until the last two afu episodes. Since then, seeing yet another Rei poster or web page conjures up disgust. What's the point?
Just like the anime topic icon. No, actually that's a far uglier reaction.
I assume that quote is from the good/original Kosh, and not the later one that was overcome by the cruel effects of overpopularization.
Maybe it's better they don't release it on TV; then it doesn't get hacked. Nadesico and Eva certianly wouldn't survive the process. Anime's much more widespread than four years ago. Hopefully the process will continue and some cable network will see the light. More preferably, hopefully some cool developer or cofounder will put those options to good use and start an all-anime cable channel, altering only to add 3 (not 4) commercials per episode.
/., and the results would definitely be visually pleasaing (which is kinda the point, ne?).
I know someone took great time and care drawing the new anime topic icon; but, uhm, am I the only one that finds it unrepresentatively un-kawaii? There are so many cute or cool characters out there; Ruri, Mill-chan, Ed, Miyu, Van, Lain, etc. So they probably can't be used, but fan art sites, like fredart.com have artists who would love to have their fine work represented every four days or so on the cover of
//We asked about their treatment of Tenchi Muyo and how they decided to handle the 'nudity' within some scenes. He was very emphatic that all of the Toonami staff are fans and that they do not believe in chopping up anime. Therefore, the only solution for them is to digitally fix the scenes. This allows them to keep the show intact, and it makes everyone associated with the show very happy. (note: It also makes the fans very happy).
So far, examples of this digital editing has shown up in Tenchi as bathing suits added to the girls during a scene at a hot spring. Doing this type of work is very expensive. They split the costs with the producer of the anime. It is expensive but they are happy to do it.
//
As an anime purist, I am extremely happy that CN didn't butcher Tenchi (truthfully I haven't had time to see the show much). I am also glad, however, that they are not showing the un-edited versions on the midnight run. From my time spent in Japan I can tell you that there are some things in Japanese culture that would not be appropriate for the same audience in this culture, and some things just should not be brought over here. CN has done a wonderful job of keeping the shows true to the original format, with only appropriate, minor edits here and there.
-Johan
"Jesus saves, but everyone else in a 10 foot radius takes full damage from the fireball."
It's great that Cartoon Network would be showing anime (at long last) but I say FORGET IT! You've probably wondering why just about every anime out there is going to be watered down (read chopped up) for all the kiddies (or people with kids IQ anyway) to watch
You're probably thinking that I'm some sort of anti-anime nut, well you're darn wrong why don't you check out my webpage to see what it all about!. It's nothing more than anime. The problem is that most anime out there contain alot of violence, gore, sensless destruction, nudity or scenes which are just to disturbing for our kids, little brothers & sisters. here are a few listed anime which would be hacked to pieces if ever got shown
Ranma ½
SailorMoon
Neon Genesis Evangelion
Dual! Parallel Adventures
The first one listed (Ranma ½) would be hacked to itty-bitty pieces the moment it came on screen, it's chok full of nudity (check out the bath scenes) not to mention about that peverted old coot Happosai. Sure it's a fun watch but I wouldn't want little kiddies to follow their behaviour. The last three has way lots of violence (I could name you other but you wouldn't have of them anyway) & don't get me started on the nude scenes in them!
So what the bottom line here? Simple, don't bother showing anime unless they don't intend on mutilating or mind your kids or little brothers & sisters being exposed to all the negativity (which BTW is meant for more mature minds).
-----
Instead, they're actually spending the time and money (and it takes a lot of time and money) to go back and overlay swimsuits on all the frames of Tenchi in order to bring it to U.S. standards. Granted, I think there's nothing wrong with nudity, but somewhere between the Greeks and now, nudity became taboo, and we must appease the majority of conservative america.
Even being a fairly hardcore anime fan I would say we ought to really applaud what C.N. is doing. Even with Escaflowne, all that's changed are the opening and closing, so I'd say anime is gaining more respect in its original art form. (music and the opening is more action oriented)
(well, except for Cardcaptors, (C.C.S.) but lets not go there.)
--------------------------------------------
And lastly, a blatant plug- for those of you living in the Houston area, come visit the Rice University Anime club. Drop me an e-mail (kashent@rice.edu) or drop by the webpage
http://www.rice.edu/anime
for info. We'll officially start back up again this year first week of September. And there is a big library of all of this fan subtitled anime that everyone keeps mentioning for free to all members.
You're forgetting that what makes the Japanese/Chinese culture so rich today is the many millenia of crap that got weeded out.
So we have, today, in an information rich era, *tons* of crap Anime and such, that in 2000 years will be treasured as classics and relics. Trigun, BGC, Mononoke, whatever.
The great artwork you so mourn is still here. It will still be studied, and seen, and remembered. But we are in the midst, today, of creating new traditions, new mythologies, new historical stories. Kenshin is a childish, goofy, wacky story in Anime and Manga of the transition of Japan into the Meji era. Sure it's pop, and a little crass. But then look at your Sui-koden stories, and how simple and entertaining they are. This 95 episode series, Kenshin, may become the Sui-koden of the next Millenium.
You're looking at the worst of today's excesses; the problem is that people of the future will have thrown away all of that crap already. If it really isn't worth keeping, it will get lost, and even if it is worth keeping, it still might get lost. So attrition will guarantee that students in the future will only see our greatest works, and not our trash.
Cultural death is alittle bit too hasty a judgement, isn't it?
Bye!
GPL Deconstructed
Face it, if you want to see uncensored,undedited,90% correctly translated anime you might as well trade for fansubs or download them off usenet/irc/gnutella/etc. American cartoons with the exception of the stuff Fox Shows on sunday night tend to be G-rated and boring as they recycle plot lines and then try to sell them as "new" stuff under a different name ... example, Looney Toons ->Tiny Toons -> Pinky and the Brain... Same stuff, different name. The only big improvements (applies to Anime and American cartoons) that's been introduced and actually used is Color and Computer animation. Stereo? I've yet to see any tv show make use of Stereo or Surround sound. Surround seems to only exist in movies. Look at the quality increases in the Simpsons and the futurama... same recycled jokes, a larger jump in Animation quality. Look at the quality increases in Anime, (Have to love Japanese for being early adopters of everything) that was around almost 10 years before americans cartoons used them. The next step might be getting rid of hand-drawing altogether and just doing everything in the computer (like Reboot) Though there is some cases where computer animation with anime/cartoons just goes too far and doesn't enhance it. (3D that neither looks realistic and is sluggish/choppy to the point of asking "why bother?" (Nintendo's Donkey Kong Country was an example of use of 3D but boring stories, likewise Voltron the 3rd Dimension was even worse (Smooth animation, no attempts at all to syncronize speech, boring stories)) If you think about it, American and Japanese animation just keep playing off each other, but Japanese are not afraid to show everything (be it violence,nudity,suggestive behavior.) Anyone who thinks Dragon Ball Z was a good dubbed anime should get their head examined. (It was edited for violence big time, however the translation was changed so nobody ever "died" they just went "to another dimension") Likewise 95% of all Anime get's butchered if it's destination is TV (Sailor Moon, Gundam Wing, Pokemon, DBZ, to name a few), if it's destination is home video/DVD, there might be an option to view dub/sub versions on the same disc (Warning, if a SUBTITLED version (*thwaps* Disney) is not availible, it is highly likely that that anime has been butchered to a point where they could not put both audio tracks on the same disc because they've done something to mess it up.) Fox pushes the "family" rating (I don't know what the simpsons is rated in the USA, but in Canada it's TV14) there are some attempts to push it further (South Park) but if you want to stop taking what the networks are feeding you and get what you really want, just go and buy the DVD/VHS tape/Fansub, and then quit complaining. (BTW, I prefer the Usenet method since this area is practically devoid of Anime and DVD's)
I thought that there would be more DBZ episodes as well... that's what I heard from my DBZ friend from school....
- Danny
YES!!
That site rules. Back in my training days all the guys got porno anime magazines. I kept all mine!
That site brings back many a memory of sleepless nights!
FAWKING TROLLS!
Crazy wicked CGI stuff, manga with a good flavour, got their first episode DVD here and can recommend it, obviously the story sucks but the gfx and sfx are awesome, so what the fuck...
EVERYTHING ON TONNAMI IS EDITED!! they never will show any cartoon not edited. i mean sure the cartoons may be cool but it is so edited that it gets hard to understand. i even heard they edited out the word shit in DBZ. I love dbz (uncut) but they make like a show for 3-7 year olds. also why not show the ninja scroll movie................hmmmm maybe because it has some naked women in it. i mean they seem to love violance but they cant have a naked woman bathing. What is this load of crap. I bet CN could make alot of money if they put toonami on a separate channel and posted uncut anime all day long. i mean they hav millions of dollors to work with...so why dont they import more cartoons LEAVE THEM UNEDITED, translate them and put on the toonami channel i talked about erlier. o well nuff said.
Does anyone remember Exo-Squad? It is perhaps the greatest American cartoon ever made and should definitely be on toonami.
A friend of mine works for the Cartoon Network. She claims that CN is considered a channel for children and not just a channel for cartoon lovers. It is, therefore, subject to the FCC's "KidVid" regulations for childrens programming. Until Ted Turner changes his mind CN cannot show much of the great animation that is out there; not just anime but the animation that tours with Spike and Mike's.
They are planning on doing an "adult block" of programming, but it will not include anime.
The only good is knowledge, the only evil is ignorance.