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Mozilla 0.9.2 Storms Out The Gates
Well, a lot of you were up late or up early finding out that 0.9.2 of Mozilla has been released unto the world. The Mozilla folks have also, in fine fashion, put out release notes as well.
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Am I the only one who noticed that Netscape released the first preview of Netscape 6.1 based on Mozilla 0.9.1???? Well they did, and it rules.
Site to test: www.freepascal.org (cheetah top left)
At one time, they had the chrome both in a jar and all uncompressed both in the same nightly builds and since they removed one, the download has shrunk.
Skipstone (which uses GtkMozEmbed) does this crash recovery URL chain thing absolutely perfectly. Not to mention that Skipstone is about 10x better than Mozilla in every other way ;), and has a bunch of other features not found in Mozilla such as URL prefixes (or at least I couldn't find them in Mozilla).
actually, you can easo;u keep Windows from loading I.E. Go to a command prompt and type "cd\windows\sys" (or cd\winnt\sys for winnt or win2k.). Then "del *.dll". No more IE.
You can use the settings of Junkbuster (http://www.junkbuster.com) to change the user agent to anything you want and it also blocks banner ads.
LDAP is supported since 0.9.1
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Jabel D. Morales - VMan of Mana
I am not a coward, just lazy to register ^_~
Uh, so do I, but I don't mention it here much.
~~~
1) Mozilla's "History" info tends to corrupt after Mozilla crashes, meaning that you can't access the sites that you just visited. My machine just crashed with 0.9.2 running, and Mozilla lost all my past few days' history.
2) I use Mozilla's email exclusively, but had a disturbing experience in 0.9.1 when it lost all my "Collected Email Addresses". I'm not sure how such a thing can happen, but it shouldn't.
3) There has been a few cases where Mozilla (0.9 and 0.9.1)strangely corrupted the order of the emails. Meaning that when I click on an email, it showed me the content of the NEXT email. Luckily they were not important mails. (But Mozilla's mail reader definintely wins over Netscape 6's. NS6's mail reader was totally unuseable.)
But all in all, I'm quite happy with the browser/email client, and am continuing to use it! :)
Look at the Font Deuglification HOWTO.
I have some thoughts about Mozilla: :-)
1) It's much better than it was. The last few releases have seen huge improvements each time. 0.9.2 is much better than 0.9.1, 0.9.1 is much better than 0.9 & so on.
2) The stablity is great. Most bugs are minor weirdo ones (such as the right-click menu disappearing at times, form security notices appearing 3 times instead of once) which seem to be appearing when the programmers add new features. I know from my visits to irc.mozilla.org that handling Bugzilla's torrent of bug reports has them a bit under the weather.
3) The whole Mozilla project is seriously lacking programmers & quality assurance people. They are simply overloaded. This is one of the most (if not the most) important open source projects, yet it is heavily understaffed. They need help really badly.4) It's simply better to browse with & more stable. I've switched to using it for my browsing.
5) The IRC client is too bare bones & would confuse 90% of internet users.
6) No IE for mee
Mozilla has tons of prefs with no UI yet (popup smashing, UA setting, and stopping of animated gifs have been around for ages). Instructions on their use can be found here:
http://www.mozilla.org/unix/customizing.html
- The same icons are used for Mail/News and
Navigator, so when minimised, sometimes "which
one's my mail window?!" becomes a problem. It
only requires the Mozilla developers to add 2
words somewhere, but it's still not fixed.
- In the "Tasks" menu, the "Mail" entry is
used to access the mail and news client.
With such a poor description you could be
thinking Mozilla doesn't have a news client.
- The release notes say "The preferences dialog now allows you to turn off animated gif images or set them to only animate once". And where is this animated GIF preference? In the Privacy and Security category... right...
- Not interface-related, but it is very annoying that Mozilla only imports 4.x profiles during profile migration, in the mail client.
Seems like there's a bit of the "it's 'only' the interface" mentality at Mozilla. But apart from these annoying little bugs, Mozilla is great. I can't wait for the 1.0 release.The tabs from Skipstone! Instead of opening many windows you just used one with a new tab for each new window. Very cool even though Skip crashed a lot.
You may be interested in the Multizilla project, which aims to give a tabbed interface to Mozilla.
Alex Bischoff
Alex Bischoff
HTML/CSS coder for hire
If you're interested in support for Opera-like gestures, please vote for bug 76537 (of course, you'll need a free Bugzilla account to vote).
In case you're not familiar with the feature, Opera has gesture support. For instance, to reload a document, just hold down the right mouse button, and move the mouse up then down. Or, to go back a page, hold down the right mouse button and click the left mouse button ("forward" is just the reverse: hold down the left mouse button and click the right mouse button).
Alex Bischoff
Alex Bischoff
HTML/CSS coder for hire
Personally I think it's a memory problem, the extra memory needed (under windows, I've never seen this under linux netscape/mozilla/galeon) is just too much. When this happens with IE you'll notice other neat things, like icons not rendering in other apps, being unable to open up images/documents, and all sorts of other fun stuff.
:)
Guess the linux memory model works a little better eh Bill?
--
Linux user since early January 1992.
..not to mention that the fonts look crappy on some pages (zdnet, cnet).
/usr/local, and in /usr/lib (which is where Mandrake 8 puts its mozilla rpm).
I've tried installing in ~, in
No go. No Java, no Flash. Can't make it seem to read its own fershlugginer plugins directory. Annoys the hell out of me. Other than that it looks to be a nice fast stable release of Mozilla. (I blame the problems on 'drake 8 which is a pain in the tooshie in other ways too)
G
jwz claims the idea of having a ton of shit in Netscape, and so in Mozilla, was not his (iirc). Also, at least with current releases of Mozilla, you can install just the components you want (broswer, mail/news client, IRC client, xmlterm, PSM), without installing everything.
_____
Sam: "That was needlessly cryptic."
Sam: "That was needlessly cryptic."
Max: "I'd be peeing my pants if I wore any!"
FYI: there are other *IX systems out there than just Debian. Solaris, for example, on the systems of my university. And even if apt-get were installed there, I don't have root. Or enough disk quota to compile it myself. So you see, apt-get is no magic cure for all problems. Downloading the pre-built binaries as a tarball is pretty much the only option I have, and the multi-user installation problem is very relevant.
It's nice that you have found a workaround that works for you. But that doesn't take away the fact that the release notes explicitly say that if you plan to run Mozilla on a multi user system you should install it in every users' home directory separately!
Thanks to Ben Bucksch you will be able to find how to do that here:
bug 74574. It could use some more votes. (hint)
At work, among the 20 odd developers there's a creeping migration from IE to Mozilla. Mozilla is just plain nice to look at, starting with .9.1 it was ready for daily use, after a day with .9.2 I'd say it really is the best browser out there, except for speed, where Opera rules. On a Windows 2000 box at work, .9.2 beats IE for rendering time. On a Redhat 7.1 box at work, Mozilla .9.2 isn't as fast as Opera, but seems to handle some sites better, and definitely handles fonts, Javascript, etc. better than Konqueror. I *love* KDE, but right now I'd say Konqueror should strive to pick up some of the rendering polish that Mozilla has attained.
Crash or just stop loading? I have hade several cases where Mozilla has just showed the spash screen and then stopped. However, when killing an extra Outlook process, it loaded just fine. Do you have double processes of some app where that is not what you want?
War is one of the most horrible things a human can be exposed to. And one of the worlds largest industries.
Basically, it loads Mozilla into memory and never leaves. When you click the Moz icon, the window pops up instantly. Downside of this? You have a browser running 100% of the time. It requires memory, but if you have 640MB memory (I love cheap SDRAM!) it's not much of a problem.
War is one of the most horrible things a human can be exposed to. And one of the worlds largest industries.
Despite recent Slashdot interpretations of events, MS were cleared of illegally trying to leverage their OS monopoly to gain a browser monopoly.
No they weren't. The Appeals Court just struck down the lower court's penalty. The Findings of Fact and the conclusion that they illegally used monopoly power still stand. They tossed out the penalty because Jackson didn't hold remedy hearings and gave interviews to the media. It's still possible that once the new judge examines the evidence and documents from the previous trial, holds remedy hearings, etc. that they may still be broken up. That would be funny.
the good ground has been paved over by suicidal maniacs
Each new version it is faster, better, and sexier. Check out new modern icons and scrollbars in the latest nightlies. They rule.
I tried the Winders with Talkback, went through the installer, picked the defaults and it immediatly blows up upon launch. The only thing that shows up is the splash screen. Am I unique here?
I'm on W2K sp2, all patched up, IE6 beta and there was no previous installation of ye' olde lizzard.
After trying all the browsers my conclusion is that what I'd like is parts of each all lumped together.
What's sad is that Mozilla is SOOO close to being a great browser. It just lacks the good GUI (good in the sense of responsive, fast, and usable), which has improved some over the years but not enough to give hope that things will radically change.
According to the latest development roadmaps I've seen, Netscape will continue to hammer on the 0.9.2 branch, and the result will become Netscape 6.1 final. Mozilla will do an 0.9.2.1 release from this branch when Netscape 6.1 is released.
1.) it uses nearly 80% of the CPU with one window (or even 0 windows open)
I don't know for sure that they've completely fixed this, but at least one of the major underlying bugs that was causing it was fixed this past week.
7.) no java or plug-ins (java is an apple issue)
The plug-in bug has been resolved -- they should work in the next Fizzilla build.
I can't wait for nightly builds for Fizilla
According to a few Mozilla.org folks in the newsgroups, nightlies will arrive as soon as more RAM gets added to the build machines (they estimated sometime next week.)
Performance and footprint test results are
posted regularly to the
netscape.public.mozilla.performance newsgroup.
You can see graphs and performance notes from
engineers working on footprint and bloat issues.
ironically, as people are screaming
;P But, I can see their point - I'd rather have the devteam concentrate on tightening the code, and fixing existing bugs before they go and add more features. Once the existing bugs get squished, however, it'd be nice to have something like this.
about how the moz team is adding too many features...
Well, I wouldn't say screaming
One thing I would like to see (outside of the roll-your-own system) is some sort of componentized download - so if I wanted just the web browser, and nothing else (mail/news, composer, etc...) so I could download a smaller file, and have a smaller memory footprint, compared to someone who uses the mail client and/or the composer, who could trade a larger download/memory footprint for those extra features.
I'm actually very happy with the stability improvements over the past few months (I download nightlies twice a week) - the devteam has been doing an excellent job at bugsquishing =)
It's not a memory problem. Sadly, Windows 98 is still using graphics and UI systems derived from Windows 3, with internal tables limited to 64K in size. Windows 2000 doesn't have this problem.
That would be 35 MB of virtual memory, which will gradually get moved into your swap-file.
Actually, most of the Mozilla workers are employed by AOL to do Mozilla.
Engineering and the Ultimate
Depending on where you upgraded from, you need to remove all of your mozilla files, all mozilla things in c:\windows, and all Mozilla registry entries.
Engineering and the Ultimate
The reason why I use NS/Mozilla clients under Linux is that Balsa, et al don't support HTML-formatted mail, making them almost useless for me. I can deal with not sending HTML mail, but every other e-mail I receive these days is HTML-formatted.
mozilla in turbo mode with the following windows open: slashdot window comments, the slashdot comment post window which I'm typing in :), two pages on mozilla.org. and an about: mozilla window.
2 copies of mirc
miranda icq (great win32 icq clone, GPL'd)
innoculate it virus scanner (only free as in beer)
du meter
leechftp
taskmanager
I have a mozilla icon to execute "mozilla -turbo". That way I can boot up faster and execute it when I know I'm gonna be smurfing the web a lot. And if you want it out of memory, just select file->exit from the mozilla window. The quicklaunch thing definitely isn't end all be all, but for people with gobs of ram, it's great. My housemate found sticks of 256meg sdram dimms the other day for under $40. Anyway, I don't think it's a bad trade off, seeing as how I rarely use up 384 meg of ram in win2k anyway, well, unless I start up gamespy, then my ram usage shoots through the roof, I've caught that pos using near 100 megs of ram before here.
Win2k takes forever to boot up anyways on this machine though, I really don't want some quicklaunch thing slowing it down, since I like to turn my machine off at night to save power and what not. Which is why I have the -turbo icon.... :) There always an extra few minutes of grinding after my desktop comes up, win2k goes off starting up 10 million services I don't use and can't possibly turn off because they are "vital". My linux machine on the other hand only runs what I SAY to run. It's just a beautiful desktop machine, and runs quake3 great. :) What we really need is -turbo mode for linux, it's amazing how fast a 1.33ghz machine running reiserfs comes up, even when shutdown badly. :) And startx with windowmaker is no more than a few seconds, even with 6 retarded dock apps... heh
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I am extremely pleased with Mozilla. In fact I use it as my full-time browser both at work in Windows (where IE is company policy) and at home in Linux.
:(
Unfortunately I cannot move completely from Netscape Mail at home because I use my own system to pull my pop mail from all my accounts via ssh and therefore need the MoveMail using external script option that isn't present under Mozilla
One strange thing in the browser that I've noticed is that if I use Microsoft's Courier New truetype font for the Monospace category, all of my input fields become around twice as tall as before. So I stick with the default Adobe-courier font for that category. Anyone know why this is so? I guess I'll go scan Bugzilla again and submit something.
have you used -turbo (or the Quick Launch pref under advanced prefs)?
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what if windows crashes and mozilla goes with it? what if your cat turned off the computer? it's a useful feature to have and moz guys are still working on stability
---
I think what you want is configurable keybindings-a good idea. but i think gestures are for people like me who are completely attached to the mouse
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- 0.9.2 - 9.2 M
- 0.9.1 - 9.4 M
- 0.9 - 9.4 M
- 0.8.1 - 11.0 M
- 0.8 - 11.0 M
- 0.7 - 10.5 M
- 0.6 - 10.5 M
ThePosted from the wireless couch.
It doesn't work for me >:( I can't find any way for it to remember any settings I make regarding borwser windows..
- Henrik
- Henrik
- when the Shadows descend -
Probably.
However, Protozilla is a powerful, externally-developed add-on that solves the problem and allows you to do lots of other stuff.
It's unlikely (read: not going) to get added before 1.0, but the author of Protozilla has hopes of getting Protozilla added as a standard part of Mozilla at some point (read: when he can convince the guy who'd be in charge of adding it to add it).
Steven E. Ehrbar
0.9.2 ist still extremely slow, you can see this when you try faster websites (1 sec. load time) - there is a very noticeable delay of 1-2 seconds. Very unfortunate.
"I love my job, but I hate talking to people like you" (Freddie Mercury)
Use a proxy, and log everything. (-;
Humm, then you could run a log analyzer on it, and have a nicely formated html output of the day. Never forget a URL again.
Best part you can filter out those nasty ads, and speed up your surfing.
--
I regret to say that we of the FBI are powerless to act in cases of oral-genital intimacy, unless it has in some way obstructed interstate commerce. ~J. Edgar Hoover, attributed
(In case you're wondering, animations can be disabled via Preferences->Privacy and Security->Images.)
ooops. right. I knew that. wanna hit on this?
ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
Mozilla comes with a powerful configuration tool called gcc, which combined with an editor, can be used to change every facet of the programs behavior.
ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
I have a similar problem with Netscape 4.7x on linux. If a page is very long, the widgets at the top repeat themselves somewhere down the page.
Surfing the net and other cliches...
Surfing the net and other cliches...
(Who Meta-Meta-Moderates the Meta-Moderators?)
However, somewhat to my amazement, the keyboard input is unable to keep up with typing speed on a 233 MHz machine. It takes some talent to design such a topheavy keyboard input stack.
Some browsers (opera), recognizing the fact that crashes do happen, are now saving the window/url chain state so they can resume more or less where they left off. Mozilla isn't doing this, and should. Besides taking the sting out of crashes, it lets you shut down without worrying about losing all your windows. This is a big deal, for a small amount of programming effort.
The bottom line for me is, the Lizard is here, and here to stay.
--
Life's a bitch but somebody's gotta do it.
You can fix this by enabling the Search button and using it instead of "Go" (or the enter key).
I agree that getting dumped at the NS search page is confusing, but what you were doing wasn't "searching", but instead requesting a "keyword" lookup.
--
Business. Numbers. Money. People. Computer World.
I routinely fight with Java and Mozilla, probably because I actuall have to use Java for some other things.
Here's what works (on Windows) -- Use add/remove programs to remove all JRE and JDK installations and then delete all the empty directories.
Don't use Mozilla's means for installing Java. Instead, install the latest JDK (err, J2SDK) which now includes plug-in support from java.sun.com. The JRE works also, but having multiple Java installs seems to confuse Mozilla.
Re-install Mozilla. Fix all your classpaths and anything else you need for other java apps.
--
Business. Numbers. Money. People. Computer World.
I have really ugly fonts with Mozilla 0.9.2. They were OK with 0.8.
Debian 2.2, FontPaths in XF86Config as in Font-Deuglyfication-HOWTO.
No idea how to fix it.
Well, Mozilla has more code in it than Linux kernel.
It was not only written from scratch but it was
held up by Nutscrape releasing code that Mozilla had
to give up bit by bit because it was so ugly.
It has gotten to a usable and quite competitive
state since 0.9.1.
I personally am more disappointed that they are
now rushing Mozilla out the door to 1.0 status.
A recent mozillazine article by Gervase Markham
proposed to not imporve stability or speed from
current levels, just to ensure standards
compliance and call it 1.0 release. That's what I
think is wrong with Mozilla. They should take
their time, freeze features and then release a
perfect (i.e. fully bug-free and speed optimized)
browser when it is ready.
Try http://recall.mozdev.org, but see also http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=36810 -- quote: "I started a project here but haven't worked on it in a while."
I hate the idea of having newsgroups and Email integrated into the browser, I want fast tools that do a single job well.
But the last two versions of Galeon I tried (using both linux & MSwindows) were so hideously unstable I couldn't really use them.
That said, I hope Galeon eventually triumphs. I will keep checking in regularly!
-Charlie
Two things, The problem isn't jsut horizontal... Load a large image and scroll left to right, and you'll see what I mean.
The other thing is, on the three machines I have it only happens on one of them. The machine it happens on has XFree 4.0.3 and a TNT2, while the other two have XFree 4.0.2 one with an ATI Rage pro and the other with a Matrox something or other.... Maybe it isn't a Mozilla bug.
now now, no need to moderate this guy down. it's always nice to hear from the gay community.
i'm willing to bet your name is dobey or timecop though.
Mozilla on linux does not open telnet sessions when a telnet://x.x.x.x link is selected.
Mozilla bug 33282 has been open for over a year on this issue.
Will 1.0 ship with telnet:// broken?
Barnaby
But there is also Opera. [...] it has a pretty slick interface
The interface sucks. Its pretty and nice eye candy, but i already have a window manager. I don't need a web browser with a built in window manager. It's limiting. The windows don't behave like my other windows. They don't respond to my key commands. They don't have the same minimal window decorations. I can't have other apps layered between them. Most importantly, I can't drag one to a different workspace/monitor/etc. I can't take opera seriously while it has such a horrid UI.
--sean, posting with galeon.
Gesture UI is pretty neat (check out wayv at http://www.stressbunny.com/wayv/ to use it directly with Xfree instead of just in opera), but i find i use the keyboard for most stuff instead. I've tried opera a few times, its rendering engine is pretty good.. fast, small, and it seems to render most stuff correctly.. but the moronic window management is a showstopper for me. Even on my laptop, i often have mozilla windows open in more than one workspace.
As for stability, thats no longer an issue for me. Since 0.9.1, mozilla hasn't crashed once, and when i've tried opera, it never crashed either.
--sean, using mozilla 0.9.1 this time.
starts up slow. renders quick. scrolls jerkily. icon is the same color as the standard windows desktop, so it disappears. typing in a url prompts you to "search netscape". this isn't worse than the competition, but doesn't need to be in there.
Yay - I can finally log into wells fargo. I guess the bank folks figured that once they'd made banking available on the palm, they may as well allow mozilla in ..... (and I'm guessing the "issues" got worked out with netscape).
All I saw was a canned list of search engines that I never use. Sure would be nice to put in google, or excite, or even yahoo.
A new Galeon release, targeted for Mozilla 0.9.2, will be released Monday.
GNU/Linux. The Freshmaker.
Hi all!
This message is (sadly) posted in IE5 - which, let's be honest, sucks, but I'm stuck in Windows and NS4.7 is just painful.
I would love to try Mozilla - except that I have a really, really large back archive of mail in Netscape Messenger which I can't afford to lose. I can't find an answer anywhere, so does anyone know if I can run NS4.7x and Moz 0.9x in parallel under the same OS install without causing problems?
Thanks,
Greg
(Inside a nuclear plant)
Aaaarrrggh! Run! The canary has mutated!
unstable ? i never, not once, ever, have had IE crash on me. bloated ? pot? this is kettle.. -c
I have discovered a truly remarkable proof which this margin is too small to contain.
If you download the 1.3.1 Java RPMs from java.sun.com, and symlink /usr/java/jdk1.3.1/jre/plugin/i386/ns600/libjavapl ugin_oji.so
into your plugins directory, it will work just fine as a Mozilla Java plugin without having to set LD_ASSUME_KERNEL. No need to download the Java VM off mozilla.org in this case.
I just wish you could disable that annoying auto-search feature...
Whenever you just want to type in an url in the address bar, that bloody autosearch pops up drawing away your focus.
Call me old fashioned, but I prefer just going to google (or any other search engine) myself and search from there. This is just more bloat and I wish I could disable it.
It's not a problem with the markup on the /.
It's actually a really simple problem. On a machine with limited resources (win9x is crippled by design with this), the large number of combo-boxes being rendered in one control array overflows the control array. I found this out while trying to reproduce the problem in VC6.. (I was curious).. easy prob to program around too..
It's kinda neat to look at, and (so far) hasn't hosed my windoze dev box... I've had controls disappear, smear or just never render. Leave the desktop in that state for when friends/co-workers come by, then go off like it's spreading through the entire network.. always a laugh.. ;)
Yes, one day I may actually learn to spell...
you probably installed a theme that wasn't updated for that version of mozilla... something similar happened to me around .8 or so (i think it was with the aqua theme as well).
you have to delete one of the auto-generated xml config files in windows\application data\mozilla\user50\default\>whatever\chrome... i think it's called user-skins.rdf.
the next time it should load up with the default skin.
otherwise, the improvements in speed all around, including the time for it to start up, has been outstanding. and like someone else has said, the new "modern" theme and it's new icons look really nice.
Mutt will understand a .mailcap, and can thus be used to configure lynx for reading HTML email. Very nice indeed.
I wish I could agree based on my experiences with it on W2K. The install went fine and I was up and browsing in no time. It looked really cool.
I decided to try out the Aqua theme. I downloaded it and was told that the changes would take place the next time I started the program. I exited out and tried to launch it again... "mozilla.exe has generated errors and will be closed by Windows..."
This was the first time I had tried to launch it after the initial install, so I don't know if it would have happened whether I had switched themes or not.
Anyway, I've tried reinstalling, uninstalling - rebooting - installing, everything. I get the same dr. watson error every time.
Oh well, IE has been the only reason I keep this box around anyway... If the linux version has this type of reliability, it looks like I've got quite awhile before I can get rid of Windows completely.
load "linux",8,1
you can turn this off Edit|Preferences|Navigator|Smart Browsing|Enable Internet Keywords. you will still have to tab to the search item on the popup to initiate a search. I believe you can edit the location to change the keyword lookup to take you to Google's 'feeling lucky' results instead of Netscape's database results. To do this try editing all.js (found in C:\Program Files\Mozilla\bin\defaults\pref for me) to replace the netscape URL with a Google URL
--Asa
0.9.1 is old. 0.9.2 is better (don't know if we have a fizzilla build yet). right now fizzilla doesn't come with PSM (security module). This should change very soon and fizzilla builds will also start to become available daily.
--Asa
Now, if people started to make real XUL applications... (A web browser is definitely not the best way to browse slashdot messages, for instance).
FORUMZILLA ROCKS!
--Asa
Opera for Linux does not have Java support, nor does it support Netscape plugins or (and I quote) "Proper help windows." Sounds pretty feature-poor right now.
For more information, click here.
One of the most irritating things about Mozilla is that I can't use it with my bank. Actually, this is probably an irritating thing about Citibank, which assumes that anything other than Netscape 4 or IE 4+ is unsupported. I can use Opera with "Identify as Mozilla 4/IE 5.0" but then Citibank's web site never loads due to some bug in the miles of JavaScript that they use.
Is there a way for Mozilla to tell web sites that it is a different version? Obviously, I'd want this to be a toggle, but it would help me out a lot.
For more information, click here.
I have about a dozen different email accounts, mostly IMAP w/ one or two POP thrown in. None of the dedicated email clients that I've tried in Linux can handle this type of setup nearly as well as Mozilla can; I've been using it as my primary mail client for about 6 months now w/o a major hitch.
You should try Opera. I used to use it at work, and it rocks. It definately impacted my browsing style. When I used Netscape 4, I would have 4 or 5 windows open at a time. But with Opera, openning a new window is so fast that you just do it as a matter of course. If I'm reading something with an interesting link, I just open it in a new window and come back for it later. Sometimes I would have upwards of 30 windows open -- and leave them open for weeks.
I think your IE browsing habits are similar to my Opera browsing habits. The difference is that Opera supports that kind of hard-core browsing, and encourages it. You should give it a shot.
Mozilla builds fine on Irix. Feel free to grab a 0.9.2 tree, build it, and contribute a build. :)
Some browsers (opera), recognizing the fact that crashes do happen, are now saving the window/url chain state so they can resume more or less where they left off. Mozilla isn't doing this, and should. Besides taking the sting out of crashes, it lets you shut down without worrying about losing all your windows. This is a big deal, for a small amount of programming effort.
Well, Alphanumerica (creators of the Aphrodite skin) were working on a package called 'Total Recall', which promised just that. It's now been subverted to a generic browser plug-in called Recall, available at http://recall.mosdev.org. Worth checking out!
There's a lot of cool projects being worked on at Mozdev. XUL is starting to look like a viable platform, now the spec's more or less cast in stone!
nada...and when I called MS, they said, "You installed an update without having a specific bugfix in mind? The updates aren't meant to used unless they are required." I found that very strange. Crash? Did you update? Oh, then that might me the reason.
Ironically, this is the worst PITA problem with the IE on Windows HTMLAREA inout widget.
Anyone know if this is working on the *n?x versions? I tried -turbo, but it didn't seem to have an effect.
actually, i thought the fonts looked better in .9.2 than in some of the latest cvs updates i've done. for a while, it looked like they were going back to the classic netscape standard of tiny and unreadable fonts.
what fonts do you use to browse the web? you should try truetype fonts if you haven't already.
t.
Ok, I really like mozilla 0.9.1. mozilla has been my main browser for quite a while, and recently it became able to talk to a slightly unusual https site I need access to, so I almost never run netscape 4.x anymore.
However, that damn installer is keeping me from downloading mozilla 0.9.2, much as it used to keep me from downloading some of the netscape 6.x releases.
Is there some trick to getting it not to segfault? It seems phase of the moon for me.
Is there some way to download mozilla without the silly installer?
I'd say less than 50%, but I have to agree with you. The Microsoft groupie at the ISP I used to work at and I would always have shouting matches whenever he thought we should put the latest and greatest IE on our install CD and have it be the exclusive option. He won out, and tech support would have to deal with it utterly destroying several machines.
To this day I have a machine that will run quite well (for Windows) :-) if installed with 98lite, but if you put standard Windows 98 on it, either with IE4 or SE with IE5, the machine will bluescreen and fry. Without IE, the machine is fine...
Did they do the same thing for IE?
Just because you can't type 100wpm doesn't mean the rest of us can't. Geeze.
If you can't code- complain. I don't mean to mozilla.org they are working their butts off. I mean, complain to companies who's products exclude mozilla from operating on their web sites.
I could reel them off- they don't recognize mozilla and/or use javascript to restrict using it with their products. Products like livelink.
To preserve the web we MUST complain and force those companies we can to SUPPORT THE STANDARDS. If they support mozilla their code should work with IE. There's little reason anymore for products to not support mozilla, konqueror and IE. It's not tough and we deserve it.
Netscape 4 mail had a nice "spell check" button. Now, I don't see a spell checker at all. Can anyone either verify this or smack me upside the head and tell me where it went?
heh.. Your obviously not using IE on Solaris. I can vouch for Solaris as stable -- when on Sun hardware but I can't say much for that version of IE. Say, how does IE run on Mac OSX? Hmm.. So IE only works on windows. Whelp, good luck with that then as I rather like my unix boxes.
Rod Taylor
Seriously. Are the freaking buttons that far from the cursor? Are you that hard-pressed for saving .05 seconds for mouse-moving?
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python -c "x='python -c %sx=%s; print x%%(chr(34),repr(x),chr(34))%s'; print x%(chr(34),repr(x),chr(34))"
I took a look at 0.9.1 yesterday for OS X (fizzila) and it couldn't handle the authenticated SMTP, so I can't use it as a replacement for mail.app on OS X. With mail.app I can send and recieve email through mac.com which is very slick..
Quick launch (AKA "turbo") merely preloads mozilla at startup so when you start mozilla for the first time it seems faster. In reality this is just an illusion, don't let it placate you, demand a better solution!
It's not an illusion that with quicklaunch turned on, I can close Mozilla windows without first checking to make sure that I'm not closing the last window.
The shareholder is always right.
Personally, I like Mozilla, and even more than that I like using Galeon, all the greatness of Mozilla with a nice GTK interface.
/usr/include dir while building mozilla (don't ask me how!) and was left with no browser to use, but I downloaded Opera in just a few minutes so I could keep entertaining myself while fixing my machine ; ) There's no other browser you could do that with while being stuck on a 56k line.
Then there is Konqueror, which, while I think it has a disgustingly ugly interface, the latest version which I just tried out yesterday is absolutely great. It renders things (IMO) almost as well as Mozilla, some things even better. It's very good, without Mozilla I might use it.
But there is also Opera. I dislike it because it is not Free, as in closed source. You can get a free (as in beer) version, but it has a banner ad that always displays in the top. Aside from that, it is absolutely excellent. It's very fast, and (other than the damn banner ad) it has a pretty slick interface. It's definately different than any other browser interface out there, better or worse it's definately interesting. It renders html extremely well, not as good as Mozilla, and not quite as good as Konq, it seems to have a few nasty rendering bugs here and there, but it's still really great. One really great thing about it is it is EXTREMELY light weight. The version, with QT statically linked, is under 3 megs!
Funny story, last night I accidentally rm -rf'ed my
Enough friggin rambling from me...
So anyway, my point is that now we actually have multiple alternatives on Linux. Imagine that! I was worried it would never happen, but check it out, the state of browsing the web in Linux is almost on par with windows! Only thing lacking now is plugins(if you even care about that sort of thing). For those that do, there is a wine based plugin being developed by codeweavers that will allow windows plugings to be used in Linux! Quicktime, Active _BLAH_, etc. is all going to work.
Things are really looking up. Soon Distributions will be shipping with perfectly stable IE rivaling browsers, one of the most important thing Linux has always lacked which turned away many newbies.
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
But that's probably just me. If software doesn't include the kitchen sink today it's not complete.
You'll have to thank jwz for that. During the very initial stages of Mozilla Project planning and development, the Netscape developers were soliciting ideas from people on what they wanted in the new web browser.
More than a couple people announced that they would like to have the browser, mail, composer, etc all as separate programs. We argued that there was no technical reason to lump them all together in one big monolithic program, especially when the users only actually uses one (maybe two) at the same time and the different parts never really talk to each other either.
jwz told us to go to hell, the kitchen sink method was what he wanted and managed to convince everyone else of the same. Enter Mozilla.
I tried experimenting with the mail client in 0.9.1 (whist 0.9.2 was downloading) and it seems very nice and complete except that it takes *ages* for the damned interface to render.
Click on a message and it takes a second or two to actually display it. Hit Reply and you sit there wondering for awhile if Mozilla actually registered the mouse input....
I would use Mozilla's Mail client if it were just plain faster. I've got an Athlon 750 with loads of memory, so it's not like my machine is too slow.
I guess you have a point about the ability to install the different components.
I guess what I disagree with is the fact that the framework for Mozilla (and components) is just proportionally huge compared to the parts that actually "do stuff".
I realize they did it this way on purpose so that they could have a common development environment for all components and make it more or less cross-platform at the same time, but I wish they would have postponed the idea until they could figure out a way to do it without bloat and without slowness, which are my ONLY TWO GRIPES about Mozilla.
What we really need is -turbo mode for linux
Don't forget that Linux has exceedingly powerful disk caching. I've got 384MB of RAM and after I start and application once (including mozilla), it never has to access the disk to load again.
Gotta love those unix-clone boxen.
Browsing seems even faster than with 0.9.1, and the release notes claim that 25 segfault bugs have been crushed since the previous version - not that I ever hit these bugs. The drop-down history bar which was dismally slow to update in 0.9.1 also seems a little more responsive, though I think that feature is going a little towards the bloat side of things.
2 or 3 years ago, Linux users had every right to be concerned with the general direction of Web browsers in Linux versus The Competition. But if Mozilla development continues at this rate, we have nothing to worry about, and there is a fine alternative, Konqueror, if for some reason Netscape/AOL/Time-Warner is prevented from continuing development of Mozilla due to the new anti-GPL/viral clauses in their EULAs.
Mozilla may never have swept away the competition, but I strongly believe that it has saved us from a much more terrible state of affairs just by existing. There are two types of Open Source success: Apache, Perl: The instant hits. Linux, Mozilla: those that steadily improve over several years, rise to prominence, and eventually vanquish the competition. Although the entrepreneurs with capital obviously want to fund the former, companies like IBM, HP and Compaq know that the latter is what will lead to eventual World Domination.
I am sure I'm not the only one, but I must say that am pleased with the progress Mozilla makes from one release to the next. I quickly hacked the FreeBSD mozilla port to build 0.9.2 and the difference is quite palpable. The biggest surprise is that the memory footprint of mozilla is now *only* double that of Netscape 4.x. Every day and in every way it gets better and better.
Keep up the good work, guys!
Tony
With 0.9.1 it looks O.K, but when loading the same page with 0.9.2 the letters are all jagged.
Roland
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence.
Thanks for the tip!
I changed the scaling (View -> Text Size) to 90%, and the fonts look better now (although somewhat smaller :)
Roland
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence.
Anyone else seeing the same problem?
Roland
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence.
So then Windows loads two browsers permiently in memory, great.
Windows defaults to ALWAYS loading IE and Office into memory permanently (assuming Office is installed). Anytime you want to use a competitor's product you will find unpleasant things from Microsoft.
All your apps are belong to BG. And your $$.
I think there's a fix in hand.
This bug is described here.
Relax man, he was joking.
- Steeltoe
http://www.debunkingskeptics.com/
Who needs'em? I can't for the love of God think of ONE benefit of gestures other than the coolness factor. Play with it for 5 minutes and you get stinky bored with it.
- Steeltoe
http://www.debunkingskeptics.com/
In QuickLaunch mode, when you close your last Mozilla window, Mozilla stays in memory, so if you load it again it just picks up where it left off. (Oh yeah, and on my Win2k machine, eats up 35MB RAM in /idle/ mode.)
This "feature" has been discussed on /. before, and it is probably because Win98 is not designed to handle 640+ drop-down moderation boxes... :)
It's not related to the horrible /. markup though.
What about irix support for mozilla?
It seems no new irix version has came out since 0.9
I'm a bookmark control-freak, and this bug irritated me to no end.
P.S. Can we declare all "Konq/Galleon/Opera/IE/NCSA Mosaic/Lynx/fuckall is better than Moz" posts to be redundant right off the bat, unless they're discussing features specific to this build?
We've heard it all before, guys, now let us read our SlashMeat in peace.
Thanks.
Karma: Bored. (Thinking about resurrecting the "Anyone else is an imposter" joke.)
You misunderstood me. I meant I have 256 MB total, 35 of which is being taken up by Moz. But I'm still using 148 total. But that's only with Moz, AIM, the distributed.net client, and Norton AV plus some misc TSRs. I wonder, does Win98 suck that much?
Karma: Bored. (Thinking about resurrecting the "Anyone else is an imposter" joke.)
Anyone know what this does? A seach of mozilla.org turned up nothing. Having to choose stuff like this inside the installer pisses me off, because I can't get to the help yet to find out what the fsck it does.
I mean, hey, I'm all about faster startups (ahem), but if it's an opt-in kind of thing rather than opt-out (and the fact than some people apparently wouldn't want it), that makes me kinda nervous.
Karma: Bored. (Thinking about resurrecting the "Anyone else is an imposter" joke.)
But I rebooted and shore nuff, Windows took forever to load, I'm down 34 megs of RAM (out of 256), and starting up mozilla is just like hitting CTRL-N for a new window.
The true test will be whether or not it effects my Quake game.
Thanks again for all the responses. Cheers.
Karma: Bored. (Thinking about resurrecting the "Anyone else is an imposter" joke.)
Yes, there is. IE5 runs on (at least) HP-UX and Solaris. But the HP-UX version is buggy and deathly slow, so Moz still doesn't need -turbo.
Not always. MSIE 5.5 running atop Windows98 exhibits similar behavior ... I always assumed there was something funky with the markup of the comment pages and all those form controls, but I keep forgetting to take a snap of the page and run a validator against it ...
Running this Mozilla article at "score=2, nested" turns up 223 errors, 501 warnings with CSE HTML Validator (granted, I enable most every error check). Definitely some nesting issues with form markup present even here, though.
That's a markup error every 380 characters, and a warning condition every 169 characters. Talk about overachieving! :)
oh, but to do that, you'd have to be running a unix like OS. sorry.
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"don't smoke, don't drink, don't fuck
at least i can fucking think"
Minor Threat
I haven't used the Windows version, so I cannot compare the speeds of the two. But the Linux version is coming along nicely as they've updated from 0.8 to 0.9.1. Speed is very good now.
I guess some Web Service based on SOAP should be set up on the Mozilla site that allows comparing a checksum of a local (extracted) file (from the nightly executables' tarball) to the tarball's contents on mozzilla.org.... Offcourse I could also host this Web Service, but my Internet access doesn't have the bandwidth :-)
I'd like to second that. Using Mozilla on a 128MB PIII-800 running NetBSD 1.5.1, it often takes several seconds until the Mozilla GUI is paged in. (When working with other apps in the mean time).
Next, Mozilla often just sits there saying "Resolving www.whatever.xx" in the last line, when it has already loaded data from that exact site. Kinda annoying when nothing's moving for nothing (obvious).
And last, it would still be nice when Mozilla supported the -geometry standard X switch, or at least *something* siimlar, so I can place coordinates and a size for when it starts up. I
don't want to use the mouse for placing Mozilla on startup. This was filed for quite some time as a bug now, but it seems it's not important enough to get fixed.
- Hubert
I canot really comment on the fact if the developers' team is understaffed or not, but I'd prefer if the people would concentrate on the web browser. I know where to get a HTML Editor/Mail/IRC/whatever when I want one.
But that's probably just me. If software doesn't include the kitchen sink today it's not complete.
- Hubert
but that's due to lack of a native Flash plugin, I guess. :(
- Hubert
Most of the browsers tend to gUNzip files they download. The file was is .tar.gz format. It was just saved uncompressed after you downloaded.
Then ask it to be re-opened. I did that with a bug I had reported. And with more details, they were able to find the root cause. I'll find out on Monday whether they really fixed it.
Has an article on 0.9.2 with comments.
icqqm [ICQ:11952102]
I've noticed that IE's problem handling mod points is a memory related issue. I compared this once when I had a 64MB machine at work and a 128MB machine at home. I didn't get the effect at home.
Mozilla has an excellent development team which is concerned solely with Mozilla's good functioning as a browser.
And that's what it has an e-mail client, newsreader, IRC client, and HTML composer, right? Really, as much as I love Mozilla -- I'm using it right now -- it's just plain delusional to pretend they're solely concerned with making a good browser...
--
Karma: Terrifying (mostly affected by atrocities you've committed)
Have they fixed the annoying GIF bug that gives transparent GIFs black background? .*shrc is
--
$HOME is where the
$HOME is where the
-- silver_p
multiple imap accounts!
multiple smtp servers!
correlate smtp server with imap account!
goodbye Outlook. (:
Go green: turn off your refrigerator.
There you go, I just reopened it for you :-)
Try using Galeon (found at galeon.sourceforge.net). It can block popups, recover URL's after a crash, and has tabbed browsing. Tabbed browsing is the main reason I use it. I'm surprised more browsers don't have that feature.
Everytime you look at porn a devil gets their horns.
I really hate that 'show attachments inline' feature. With Netscape you could turn that off. Mail part still has many attachment related bugs, and my Mozilla 9.2 has already crashed few times when reading forwarded mails with attachments.
BigWhale!
---------------
I never wanted to go anywhere. I'm happy here...
The Sig, the sig
then your experience is vastly different than most users. I have crashed Ie and seen it crashed on literally dozens of computers running 95, 98, Milleniun, NT 4.0, 2000. I used to work IT and maintained about 100 desktop machines, mostly running IE... about 50% of them had chronic issues with IE crashing.
got drum'n'bass?
http://mp3.com/vitriolix
--
TO BUY A NEW CAR WOULD MAKE YOU SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
Wondering how this release stacks up to previous ones in terms of performance? Check out this page.
--rimdo
If it wasn't for Mozilla's composer always making links absolute instead of relative, I wouldn't even have netscape on my (windows) machine.
I left my Dreamweaver serial # 5000 miles away...dammit
Or GNOME an OpenOffice, StarOffice, etc. Those too take longer to compile.
Notice how those are some pretty impressive apps, that have quite a bit of functionality behind them...
In fact, most major applications should take much longer to compile than X. Would you really want your apps to be smaller than your GUI framework? (Mind you the GUI framework just ties things together, it essentially isn't even an app).
Have you ever tried to compile mozilla yourself? There are a billion options you can append to ./configure Which is what makes Mozilla amazing in the sense that you can customize it so well to what you want it to be like on multiple operating systems
Think before you speak
Sunny Dubey
It's probably more to the point that Mozilla is now more stable than Konqueror. It would be petty for me to compare the development time spent on the two projects. And the rendering engine for Konqueror still needs a lot of work, whereas the Mozilla's is complete and compliant. And the XML support is as sexy as hell....
This version just might replace Konqueror (my current Linux browser) and IE. I would miss the whiz-bang features of the latter. But I did a total reinstall only a few weeks ago, and already the damn thing has managed to start misplacing memory...
__
I see that as a good sign though - more versions before release surely means a better final product. Especially with so many guniea pigs ;)
-qabi
KDE is such a resource hog. I use blackbox. >:)
--
--
#nohup cat
Anything that takes longer to compile than X isn't worth it.
--
--
#nohup cat
http://212.142.37.162/open;ref1?tag=newcrit
(Also, check out Last 20 Referrers from Harddisk.)
Related bugs:#83038
#55477
Looks like mail referrers might be fixed but file:// is still a problem. UI preference is not built either.
Anyone confirm?0.9.2.
:-\
.092 % is about the likelihood that I care at all. It's just depressing... I use to LOVE Netscape... I thought Mozilla would be really cool... But it feels like it's 20 years in the making. How many people are on the team? I thought open-source development was suppose to be so much faster in terms of develop time.
Sometimes I wonder if that damn mozilla creature is the only programmer on staff...
But maybe I'm just bummed.
The next comment I write will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and see it early!
Hey, I've just installed this new version and already managed to crash it five or six times viewing very popular pages. Besides, the Java plugin installation still doesn't work for me. I've reported all these incidents with the talkback agent, so perhaps next time it will be better.
//BernardoInnocenti
Bernie Innocenti - http://codewiz.org/
What I'd like to know is how performance is going in Linux and platforms besides Windows. I use the Windows version and it is real fine, but I've heard that other versions are slower.
It seems to me now that all that Microsoft has won was a single battle in the browser war. Internet Explorer was, undoubtedly, one of the best programs MS ever wrote. It was quite fast (initially), supported many of the web standards and had excellent internationalization. However, while Mozilla had to retreat and regroup, it was well worth it.
Mozilla has now grown to accomodate many of IE's "cool" features. And here we can see IE's greatest shortcoming: it was built with corporate thinking in mind. Mozilla has an excellent development team which is concerned solely with Mozilla's good functioning as a browser. On the other hand, Microsoft has now become concerned with integrated IM, their online "services" and other features which make IE unstable and bloated.
A couple of weeks ago I saw one of my friends (who is not deeply involved with the open-source movement) using Mozilla. The reason for his choice was the fact that Mozilla (even the earlier 0.8!) ran faster than IE 6. It gave me hope - I saw that open-source software can prevail upon commercial software in the trial of public opinion.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I don't see any corruption in that image. Also, I note that the build ID that you have in the title bar (2001-05-15-13) is _old_. There were problems like that in older versions but they should have been fixed.
(Before you ask, I've not submitted a bug report yet. I am waiting to get mod privs again so I can better document the problem)
I dread using Opera when Slashdot decides to give me moderator points. Every time that happens, I have to go back to Netscape for a time.
The problem: the little "moderate" drop-down lists start appearing at random in the page when there is a large article and I have mod privs.
It's as though Opera can't handle a very large number of small screen objects. Netscape and (shudder) IE handle the situation just fine.
That isn't a bad-enough thing to make me kick Opera off my system. It's a bad-enough thing that I don't kick off The Competition.
I'm a regular IE/Outlook user who could never stand Netscape because it was so crashy. All I need is PGP support to make me try it out for an extended period of time and possibly switch. The Mozilla folks have impressively kept up to date with tackling major bugs, which is much more than I can say Netscape ever did. Adding some sort of autoupdate feature would make upgrades a snap. With Netscape bowing out of the browser business, I've going to need a replacement that is crossplatform and anything that picks up where our corporate standard Netscape left off is a bonus in our shop.
It's finished downloading, so now to check to see how fast it is.
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."
Umm...maybe so I can get this post out from Troll status, the problem was that the browser was set to manual proxy without any settings when it installed. Maybe "direct connection" would be a more sensible setting to have for a default?
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."
What are the possibilities of having the Mozilla code branch at some point, should Netscape decide to no longer support this? Or do they own whatever it is that Mozilla is putting out these days? It would be a shame for all the current effort to go to waste if Netscape were to change their mood?
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."
They expect to produce something in the next six months that will eclipse the Netscape browser as a star product? I don't see this happening, so we might as well count the browser as dead. On the other hand, I don't see this impacting their enterprise server business in any way, which I find to be a great product.
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."
I've installed it, and other than a minor installation problem (apparently it wasn't in gzip format, despite the extension being tar.gz) I've had no problems with it all day. If you though 0.9.1 was good, this is even better and seems a little faster (though not a huge improvement on 9.1) Also, if you have had problems with mozilla fonts (overlapping etc) in mandrake 8.0, you can fix it by forcing the 'adobe-hectavia' font.
Well, I had the same problem. However, it seems to be a bug more with the machine they compile mozilla binaries on. Maybe. I honestly don't know. I do know, however, that when I compiled mozilla myself (slackware-current / X 4.1.0 / g400) the problem completely went away. Get the source and try building it yourself! It isn't hard...
How about "gestures" like I can hit F5 to reload a page, instead of having to do CTRL-R? Or maybe a gesture like ALT-D instead of CTRL-SHIFT-L ? Hitting a key seems like a pretty indicative gesture, imo.
Maybe with nicer keyboard controls we wouldn't be so infatuated with 'gestures'? I'd rather be able to do more with my keyboard - after all, for now, that's still where I'm doing my typing for replying to slashdot stories and the like - I'd prefer more intelligent keystroke commands rather than forcing me to use the mouse for more stuff.
creation science book
I agree that it is very pleasing. I'm too lazy to check this, but have most of the crashers that were fixed been with us for long? I mean, saying "500 topcrashers fixed" isn't very useful if 250 of those were introduced between the two releases.
hwaara, do you know if they only count longstanding bugs?
-- André Dahlqvist
I know. But if there's a very common crasher introduce on the trunk, won't that turn into a topcrasher pretty fast?
-- André Dahlqvist
From the release notes
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MOD THE CHILD UP!
I did attach a screen shot (three, I think). It still got marked as already solved...
STOP . AMERICA . NOW
84994. I thought I submitted 3 images, but I only submitted one. Still, it makes the problem obvious enough...
When it got market as duplicate of a resolved bug again (I'd reported it once before), I e-mailed the maintainer, but got no reply.
*shrug*
Someone will get around to it eventually, I guess. Someone else has suggested that it might be the driver. That could well be the case, I'm using the icky closed NVidia driver because it gets me really good 3D gaming under Linux, but I'm sure that's a potential candidate since so many other things are broken about it (DPMS, for one...)
Still, I don't get scrolling/rendering bugs with any other browser! [Netscape/Konqueror]
STOP . AMERICA . NOW
The problem with horizontal artifacts in images, especially when scrolling, still hasn't been fixed. *sigh*
I really want to use Mozilla as my main browser now because it seems to work very well, but I'm a hopeless picky pedant and a bug like this that appears very prominently really keeps me away.
This time (between 0.9.1 and 0.9.2) I did submit it via Bugzilla, but it got marked (once again) as a duplicate of an already solved bug. I guess the people responsible for the graphics rendering are having trouble duplicating what I'm seeing...
STOP . AMERICA . NOW
AFAIK Mozilla still doesn't support roaming via HTTP/LDAP like Netscape 4.X does. This feature is enormously useful for me since I switch workplaces a lot, and between different OS's. Anyone know when/if this feature is planned?
~
It's amazing how many topcrashers that have been fixed in the past three milestones. Mozilla is getting rock solid and stable.
-Håkan
If you want a XUL WYSIWYG app, you'll need to help out making one!
Check out XULMaker: http://xulmaker.mozdev.org
-Håkan
.91 did not, and I could not get the NN6.1 files to work within moz as well like you could with an earlier build. Of all the extra "killer" add ons, this is the only thing I really _REALLY_ need to make this my primary email client. I can not spell my way out of a wet paper bag....
+++ UGUCAUCGUAUUUCU
Can anyone give me an argument as to why Mozilla isn't the best overall browser available on any platform now? What a turnaround.
I would sure hate to download the RedHat src.rpm too.... Damn ISDN....
Mozilla is meant to be an application development platform, to be sure. However, XUL has not exactly been making waves, and basic issues like application packaging haven't been dealt with yet. It seems the current model is that every application using XUL needs to include its own XUL interpreteter, which is effectively almost a whole Mozilla distro. There doesn't seem to be any provision for a shared interpreter with small application packages.
Given the myriad of small interface bugs in Mozilla, which have recently been exciting comment on MozillaZine, one has to wonder whether XUL is a robust UI language. Bugs like text off the edge of the window should be easy to fix, but somehow they linger on build after build. It is unclear to me whether this is a technical or cultural issue, though.
XUL has also been significantly overpromised -- for instance, remote XUL is alternately either promised or denied depending on where you go at mozilla.org, but the real answer is that remote XUL is too much of a security risk, and would require a better downloading/caching story. Java remote UI software has largely solved the security problem, but it has a similar download problem.
Finally, the lack of any WYSIWYG editor for XUL means that it does not address the most serious problem in UI development, which is that designers who are not programmers should be able to create their own interfaces. The current model in which designers create specs and prototypes which are then implemented by programmers is expensive and unreliable. These two groups rarely get along well and the implementers rarely have any interest in understanding the design principles behind the specification. The result is that good design specifications often make terrible implemented interfaces, and do so at great cost. Breaking the dependence on the programmer is the best way to address the problem, and that can't be addressed by a system like XUL, which the W3C noted is an obscure mix of several different programming language paradigms.
Tim
It also reflects a fundamental misunderstanding. You can't make a user-friendly system by slapping a front-end on something written to a command-line standard. You can't make a user-friendly word processor by starting with troff and slapping a GUI on it. It will turn out that the assumptions in the substrate don't support the needs of a user-centered design. It's well known now that usability has to come first and the core technology needs to be written to support the demands of the design, not the other way around.
XUL was designed without concern for the user scenarios of authoring, and as a result any authoring GUI slapped on it will always be weak. Ditto HTML. You can't do serious HTML design without memorizing the text-based language and its tags, and something like Dreamweaver is just a shim which in practice is ignored in favor of editing the text.
Tim
It's also an application development platform (anything that runs Mozilla can run your apps). It also has a mail/news and composer app included, with more coming. Either you are VERY misinformed or a troll.. probably both ;)
Opera has rather poor i18n, comapred to Mozilla and IE. So, if you are cursed with cyrrillic language, for example, you should think twice choosing Opera. On the other hand, I really love gestures!
Well, if you hate it - Check Bugzilla and if one doesn't exist, create a bug asking that that capability/option be maintained from 4.7x.
Top Most Bizarre/Disturbing Error Messages
My guess is that is it. You can find it at:
ftp://ftp.netscape.com/pub/netscape6/english/6.1_P R1/unix/linux22/xpi
Top Most Bizarre/Disturbing Error Messages
BUt it was REALY unstable - corrupted attachments - hey its beta.
Well, After I installed Moz 0.9.1 (I think I had .8 before) all I could say was WOW> 0.9.1 has been ultra stable (crashed twice since it came out and I installed it - once on Win 2K and once on Linux) Sites render properly most of the time, the only problem was some gif artifacts when scroling a page. The mail client rocks - I have multiple POP and IMAP accounts going without a glitch.
Needless to say I switched over to using Mozilla full time for browsing and email with 0.9.1 and have never looked back - something I could not do before due to instability and other bugs.
Kudos to the Mozilla team - I just installed 0.9.2 and look forward to the improvements! Mozill ahas easily become my browser/email combo of choice!
Top Most Bizarre/Disturbing Error Messages
with opera is non existent. That might be OK with you, but not with me, sorry.
You are right about that case. But for mor normal pages, especially from cache, 4.7 seems faster to me.
Maybe this is the difference between Gecko's speed (which is supposed to be quite good) and the overall UI, but mozilla seems less "snappy" under most circumstances.
Several things are worth mentioning as major improvements recently:
Some things still need some work:
If you haven't tried mozilla recently (since 0.9) you owe it to yourself to download this one and try it out.
AFAIK, only the classic and modern theme work for current releases of mozilla. The themes have been broken since .8 and the themers aren't too happy with having to change how a theme is made every new release. To fix this problem download an older version of mozilla(0.7 should do) and change the theme back to classic or modern.
> The reason why I use NS/Mozilla clients under Linux is that Balsa, et al don't support HTML-formatted mail
Hmmm. Kmail does the trick for me.
Hard to believe KDE acceptance isn't broader. Nearly every complaint I hear (e.g. Linux lousy in desktop department; No browser for Linux, except crummy Netscape) is so *solved* with KDE-2.1+.
What's up with that?
It's possible that the fix for your problem simply hasn't been QA'd enough to make it to the 0.9.2 release. I had a similar situation when I reported a bug with the Velocity Template Engine which I was using, which was causing me a lot of grief. Anxiously I waited, and a week later 1.2 was released. Unfortunately the fix to my bug was not in it because they hadn't had the time to properly test it.
Point is, I'm sticking with the nightlies (1.2-dev) until 1.3. I suspect you can do the same thing. I'd get you a link to my bug but the Apache Bug Database seems to be down right now.
You can accomplish anything you set your mind to. The impossible just takes a little longer.
I have been valiant in my participation with Mozilla. I've tried Netscape 6.0, 6.01, and several of the Mozilla builds (including this one today). It's still crashing and the Quality Feedback Agent is sending more reports. I have even blown away all remnants of Netscape and Mozilla prior to installation. I still have one huge problem: Mozilla won't play nicely with my Java 1.3.1! That's a show-stopper for me. On the bright side Konqueror is really good with Java on my platform. I'll wait for Mozilla 0.92 and cross my fingers.
Anybody knows why would mozilla crash when i changed a theme? This seem to happen with a few themes. I change the theme restart mozilla but never starts. Instead a talkback dialog appears. I sent feedback but i haven't been able to find out why it crash
I bet the applications you develop are stable as a rock. Remember that M$ is developing ie for some time now. give mozilla some time and you will see. When you laugh at other's work be sure you can actually be better than them, cause if you're not the only one who is getting embarassed is you.
In the Macintosh whenever you launch Mozilla or open a new window the sidebar is open. No matter how I change the settings that sidebar is always open when make a new windows.
To fix this problem delete the component registary it will make a new one and this problem goes away.
Mozilla 9.1 one had this problem to I reported it and in about a week the nightly didn't have this problem.
But it seems this problem has returned.
BTW, the Mac Mozilla now reads the System "internet plug-ins" folder
No, there isn't a *nix version of -turbo, since there isn't a *nix version of IE to compete with ;)
click,Download. click, install. click, launch CRASH. mozilla has performed an Click close. Blue screen. reboot. damn, i need linux.
I respond to your sigs
instead of using NS's or Mozilla's built in email clients, try using a dedicated email program. If you're using GNOME, Balsa works well, and if you're using KDE, KMail is a very good choice.
Course, you could always go the console route and use pine or mutt, but I prefer graphical email programs.
I must say, Mozilla is getting better with each release. Even the Mac Classic version is running in a tolerable manner now - as a matter of fact, I've ditched M$ IE and Entourage, writing this from Mozilla! I looove the Modern theme. Much nicer then Internet Exploiter.
From a typical user view,
It's nice they managed to include Quick Launch feature and made it accessible conveniently via preferences menu.
However even on my humble P3 450 running Windows 98SE, the Quick Launch takes a while to load up when startup inside Windows desktop.
I wonder the actual value vs performance coming out from this approach. It looks essentially same to my view that (without Quick Launch enabled) Mozilla takes a while to start up on first run, and subsequently fast in load up because of caching, which almost identical to Quick Launch enabled in emphirical sense.
Without Quick Launch, I get to work on Windows desktop faster. IE did a better integration job than this. But then both are Microsoft products.
I hope they can further improve Quick Launch performance (and thus being truely useful).