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Review: Yellow Dog Linux 2.2
fabiolrs writes: "imaclinux.net is running a review on Yellow Dog Linux 2.2. They could manage to run it on the iBook. YDG 2.2 is a great distro with KDE 2.2.2, Gnome 1.4, kernel 2.4.18 and Xfree86 4.2.0." Nice to see PPC systems (meaning "Apple," mostly) getting so much attention in the Linux world lately -- Mandrake's 8.2 PPC is also getting close to a release.
sorry people! my fault! yellow dog linux 2.2 actually RUNS on an ibook!
Fabio - Sumare/Sao Paulo/Brazil/South America/Earth/Solar System/Milky Way/Universe
http://www.morroida.com.br
It's about time for a decent OS on that platform. I heard it is a dog, so Yellow Dog 2.2 may be the right decision.
[DUCKS]
-- No sig today
I managed to get YDL 2.0 running on my old Apple clone - A Power Computing Power Tower 220e. I have a G3 upgrade card in it, and it works well. I can't wait to try 2.2, hopefully it will be even better at supporting the weird clone hardware. I should download it soon...
YDL's RPMs make it easy for anyone who's familiar with Redhat or Mandrake to get YDL running on a PPC. Woohoo!
------
Random, useless fact: I type in startx entirely with my left hand.
I've never had a chance to use PPC, is it more interesting than x86? ;-)
bug ridden (take a look at their yup, update program for example, core software for the distro and it doesn't work right), difficult to install and very poor support is more like it. take a look at the ydl mailing list for lots of complaints. in addition the company has a pretty lousy policy of releasing iso images months after it's available in stores (to get people to buy it). i miss linuxppc, that was a good distro. fortunately debian, suse and mandrake are available.
posted anonymously so i don't get my butt sued .
But everyone knows KDE 3 is the best. I saw it on the poll. It must be true.
the last time i used YDL (which was about a year and a half ago) it was utter crap. from the sound of this review it looks like it has improved some but not a whol lot. i realise they dont have alot of people working on it, but still you should make sure the basic functionality is there before you realease it.
Avoid The Rush, Start Thinking NOW!
--
Any Spelling Or Gramatical Errors In This Post Are There On Purpose.
'nuff said
Is this a record slashdotting? 12 comments? I guess they aren't running YDL on that imac : ).
I am afraid of all the post about how great macosx is, and why anyone would want to do this.
As hard as it may be to believe some of us like linux guis more that competing ones. It is a personal decision. Lets JUST talk about the merits of this program...
Why would I want to use Yellow Dog Linux 2.2 when Red Hat Linux 7.2 is already out?? Red Hat has a higher version number so that means it's more recent, right?
I think these Yellow Dog people have some work to do.
That has to do with dual-booting Yellow Dog Linux and OS X? just asking.
What, me worry?
I have used Mandrake on x86 for several years, but two weeks ago I bought myself an iBook (my old Toshiba fell on the floor, RIP) and decided to go with Debian Woody PPC.
;)
;)
To my great surprise it went mostly smooth. I downloaded a minimal CD image and got up and running from there. apt-get install really is as cool as they say
My biggest problem was that by default I had kernel 2.2 something and PMU (APM for Mac) crashed and burned. 2.4 fixed that though.
I really can't say that PPC is so mega-cool, but walking around with an Apple laptop (very rare) with Linux installed (almost as rare) is very geeky
If you're using these numbers to do anything important, you're insane
Why is there no link to YDL itself , but instead there is actually a link to Mandrake in the main story?
Patience is a virtue, but I don't have the time - TH
meaning "Apple," mostly
Terrasoft makes some nice PPC hardware in addition to their distro.
irb(main):001:0>
Too bad anyone with $2000 (back in 1997) worth of powerbook 1400 rubble liing around are STILL screwed. Check out the hw-support
Oh well...there's always other options:
Apokalypse linux
MachTen
"It was penguin lust...at its worst." --someone
Ack! What's with the banner ad for Katz? It's bad enough you post stories by him but now I have to be reminded of his existence while reading decent /. articles!
I'd try Yellow Dog on my TiBook, but they appear to be one of those companies who don't release ISO's to their distribution until they're virtually obsolete.
It's their right, but not a very good practice to try and win over new customers who don't want to spend $$$ to test out a new distribution.
Thankfully, I was able to get Debian installed. Now only if I could figure out how to boot it properly from OpenFirmware. The steps in the recent O'reilly article didn't work for me.
Not to be mean, but how about Macs without OS X support?
To be fair, it seems weird for the developers to be playing with *modern* Macs, instead of 6 year old Macs, but hey, the new iBook is cool.
GPL Deconstructed
Me on my pre-G3 machine. It runs much quicker than OS X on my iMac but nvidia issues make OS X look better on this G4 Quicksilver
I really don't get the appeal of Linux on Mac (or PPC more generally). Sure, I can understand running linux on older macs, but for any OSX capable computer, what's the point? I can't think of anything you can do in linux but can't do in OSX, and MANY things you cannot.
imaclinux.net is running a review on Yellow Dog Linux 2.2. They could manage to run it on the iBook.
umm... considering the limited hardwares that they need to support, shouldn't it be not too hard to be able to on all the new hardwares?
YDG 2.2 is a great distro with KDE 2.2.2, Gnome 1.4, kernel 2.4.18 and Xfree86 4.2.0.
Shouldn't Gnome, KDE, and other softwares for Linux run fine on OSX? In other words, wouldn't putting effort into Linux application compatibility on OSX be more worthwile?
BTW, I'm also curious as to how Linux apps run on OSX since I'm considering a new computer purchase. Anyone know? Apple's phone number only directs me to tech support for people who already own a mac, which are not for those who are just curious.
On Debian & iBook
Best Slashdot Co
Have you checked here? They seem to have at least some success getting the 1400 to work.
I use my Powerbook and have to say that yes it is nice, but no it is not nice.
./configure and autoconf properly to take into account a PowerPc platform. Many times I get platform not support or it simply does not compile. Case in point, Anjuta, or PNET. Sure it could be fixed with a bunch of tweaks, but it gets my goat that I need to tweak at all!!!
It is nice in the sense that the notebook works well. But it is a major headache to get software to work.
While some folks may say, it is LINUX and therefore it will work, that is a figment of the imagination.
Firstly when using closed software people only say Linux. When I mention PowerPC they say no problem if it is Linux it works. But then I mention it is not Intel and they say "oh, sorry, but it works on Intel".
Secondly when using open source many people do not setup the
The only software that has worked without problem whatsoever are the bigger projects (Apache, Perl, etc) and Java. I am amazed at how well Java moves from Windows, Linux Intel and Linux PowerPC.
My conclusion is that even Open Source and closed source are as arrogant about non-intel platforms.
"You can't make a race horse of a pig"
"No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
I haven't tried the new Yellow Dog, but a couple weeks ago I installed Debian unstable (closely following Branden Robinson's instructions) along with Benjamin Herrenschmidts 2.4.18 kernel on my new ibook (600MHz, 384MB, CD-RW/DVD-ROM, Airport wireless) and am extremely impressed about how everything works (all except the modem - which I never use anyways). DVDs (with xine), CD burning, wireless, sound, hardware accelerated 3D, built in ethernet, power management -- all for ~$2000 US. And Linux seems way more snappy than OSX. This is my first Mac, but if they work this well with Linux in the future, it may not be my last...
One of the touted benefits of Linux is that it runs nicely on an old machine so that the machine doesnt need to see a landfill.
Well in the Mac side of things Linux only seems to run on the latest and greatest. I have several PPC 601, 603e machines that Linux just will not run on, or at least a decent disto. MkLinux doesnt count. With YellowDog and LinuxPPC I just dont see the point if one needs a G3 or better.
If I had a Ibook, G4 Powerbook, etc... I think OS X would be a lot better than these RedHat ported to PPC *nixes.
I've been using YDL on a G3 (Beige) for some 2 years. It's great as a server, but not-so-swell as a desktop solution. Outside of powe routages that exceed the UPS battery, it almost NEVER goes down. Runs as a webserver, mail server, AFP/AppleShare server, SAMBA, et. al. Over 100 users. init level 3 text log in is all I need. However, the desktop environment isn't nearly as robust and flexible as the Intel distros. In short: Use the right tool for the right job. If you want to use linux as a desktop solution, use Intel hardware--it's alot cheaper and supported globally. If you're looking for a rock-solid server that takes advantage of the PPC, YDL is the most stable linux server I've every seen. ...just my 2 cents...
catdevnull > stdout
I might know what I'm talkin' about, but then again, this is Slashdot...
Anyone who calls YDL "bug ridden" and then says they miss LinuxPPC is obviously a former LinuxPPC employee.Not only was LinuxPPC bug-ridden, but they never attempted to put out bugfix errata even when it was handed to them prepackaged. This led to their demise.
Are there any good linux distros that work on older PPC hardware?
_ __
There were a couple of posts complaining that PPC distros only run on the latest and greatest stuff.
Are there any PPC Linux distros that break this mould.
Inquiring minds and all that stuff...
I got a friend with an old mac that thinks its time to try linux.
_______________________________________________
ACK
When I see shows like Jackass or Jerry Springer imported on my TV, I understand that the collapse is only a question of time...
How about .... people who don't like OS X but have a Mac? They do exist you know
The reason why yet another *linux distribution doesn't arose much interest is because *linux is dying. Companies and their stock values are dropping like flies. The hype is over. Thank god. Now we can get back to running serious non-toy operating systems like BSD Unix(tm).
Does anyone know of a Linux or *BSD distribution that'll run on my PowerBook 1400?
I have heard that MkLinux will do so (relying on the serial port for networking, or something), but I'd really prefer something that lets me use external SCSI devices, as I only have the floppy drive Expansion Bay unit.
A lot of people on here seem to think that Linux for the Mac is only for older machines. Not true.
I've got YDL 2.1 running on a 7200/120 at home - the first PPC mac with PCI slots. Not a new beast by any means. Hell, the BSDs don't even support PPC machines this old.
And I'm looking at installing it on a 6500 as well, which isn't exactly showroom-fresh.
Hopefully this will stem some of the "just run OS X" tide...
--saint
I have a Quadra 660 AV sitting in the closet collecting dust. I was wondering if anyone knew of a linux distro for an 040 mac and could point me in the right direction. I would like to try it on this box if that is possible, or is this just a really stupid idea. I seem to recall that this machine has a 500 meg HD (somewhere round that, and believe me, I thought that was huge after upgrading from a 40 meg HD on my LC) and no cd rom, but i think it has ethernet built in to dl anything.
Every PPC model from 4400-9600 is officially supported. I'm running YDL on a 6500/250. Installation was a breeze, even with using my TV as a monitor in video safe mode. It was certainly no harder than RH. Now that its installed and *RUNNING* I get to figure out how to use the damned thing, but getting it up was cake, even for a linux newbie like me
This is where I get my recommended daily allowance of "Foot in Mouth."
KISS MY ADIDAS!!! Sho' Nuff!
I received my YDL 2.2 CDs the same day this was last referenced on Slashdot and posted a rant about the problems I had installing it on a brand new Power Mac G4. The next day, one of their support guys e-mailed me. After a couple of e-mails, I was up and running.
I was really impressed with Terra Soft's support for scanning Slashdot for comments by little whiners like myself and actually giving me a hand. I had mad no effort to understand the problem when I posted my rant but yet this guy went out of his way to help me. I'm certainly not that forgiving to my customers, even though they've paid for my help.
After resolving my install problem, I've been very happy with the distro. I'm planning on using this for the basis for future development at my company.
Kudos to Terra Soft!
Of course PowerPC is more interesting CPU than x86! Does x86 have anything like the assembly instruction "eieio"?
Exactly. The US is the Microsoft of the world.
They don't deserve to be where they are, they are afraid of playing fair, they lie, cheat and steal, and they have no history and no culture. They are violent thugs who never think of others or try to find a middle ground on any issue. They try to "win", even when they are in the wrong. They use their economic and military muscle to stop the evolution and growth of other countries and cultures, as well as retard the evolution of their own people, preventing newer and more efficient political, economic, and cultural systems and standards from coming to pass.
Of course, this is the American GOVERNMENT I'm talking about. Most American CITIZENS I know (including myself) are nice people. This, of course, excludes the rabid, violent, nonthinking revengeseekers who accept whatever the propaganda machine at CNN feeds them, and the devout trailertrash who milk the system and cripple our already nearly bankrupt economy for fun and profit.
What happened on 9-11?
I just can't believe nobody asks the question "Who profits the most from this?". The true American is a revolutionary who won't be held captive by a corrupt government - see "The Founding Fathers". The true American THINKS, especially when the media portrays complex issues as black-and-white. The true American lives life free, even if it only in his mind. The true American keeps the faith, and strives for a better country, culture, and world.
The NEW America betrays all these truths, in favor of fascism, plain and simple. The New America is what we fought against in WWII. We are what we fought. We have become the enemy, by letting small groups of powerful men control the masses in complete secrecy and unaccountability.
We will be a slave nation, and worse, enslavers of the world. And when I say "we", I don't mean us, the American people, I mean our government, who is already the reason we are almost universally despised worldwide. I am NOT my government, but I am held responsible for their actions, if only because I am a member of the sheep who voted them in. And the government doesn't consider us, the people, to be their equals, but rather cattle to be used and slaughtered if necessary. The government will NEVER share the benefits of their conquests with us. We are slaves, a resource to further their goals, a number on a hard drive.
If "they" would kill Kennedy et al. they'd kill a bunch of nameless stock speculators in order to secure America's place on the "Throne Of Power" for the next 100+ years. To think otherwise is to practice ignorance and naivete on a dangerously massive level. Who "they" are is left as an exercise for the reader.
Check out www.whatreallyhappened.com and have your eyes opened. It's time to start digging deeper than the sound bytes and stock footage of CNN.
Wake up, Chicken Little. The sky is falling.
Signed,
A TRUE AMERICAN WHO BELIEVES IN WHAT THE STATES *USED* TO STAND FOR, AND WHAT IT CAN STAND FOR AGAIN.
Yeah, they exist, but usually it is because they haven't used OS X for a very long time.
My conclusion is that even Open Source and closed source are as arrogant about non-intel platforms
It's finite resources, not arrogance. A Linux developer can reach 99.x% of end users by just targeting x86. They can either spend time targeting the Linux niche platforms or spend time improving the x86 platform. Add to this the spirit of open source and it is not unreasonable to expect the the PPC Linux community to fix things themselves rather than "dictate" where a developer should spend time.
I'll add that simply getting something to a point where it compiles does not mean you truly support a platform. Performance tuning should also take place and it is very easy to write c/c++ code that is tuned for one architecture or class or architectures to the detriment of others, ex. tuned for CISC at the expense of RISC.
http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/mac68k/
I've only recently installed YDL on my old-ish Mac and haven't had time to even really configure or use it much yet. So I'll probably give 2.2 a miss, but maybe I'll be ready by 2.3. I'm happy just having Linux available for my hardware, so I'll probably pay for my next copy.
Constitutionally Correct
I should have 70 BriQs today or tommorow sans drivebay housing. I'm pretty dissapointed with the per-node pricing of Black Lab Linux (by the same folks).
I'm thinking at the moment that I'll netboot Debian and install my own clustering libraries and tools, since as far as I can tell, everything included in Black Lab is available elsewhere except their graphical cluster management tools.
Too bad they didn't see fit to GPL them and just make money on their rather expensive BriQ's (We paid $1500/per for G4s) before Black Lab was released.
Does anyone have any experience with these? Any tips?
I am getting a blue G3 to play with, it will probably never see X and will mostly do some number crunching and web serving - what's the best distro to go with? As I understand it, the major ones for PPC right now are YDL and Mandrake (and I believe RedHat is coming out with something) - anyone have any comparative experiences on the non-desktop side of things?
sic transit gloria mundi
duh!
I really can't say that PPC is so mega-cool, but walking around with an Apple laptop (very rare)
You must not go to the same coffee shops I do. At the ones I hang out, you'd think the 90% marketshare belonged to Apple. I guess wintel users don't find their 1 hour battery life too useful.
And that is one of the (many) mega-cool PPC things--massive battery life. Don't know what kind of power management the Linux distros have, though.
Lies about crimes
With all due respect to the Mutt project.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
I'm also curious as to how Linux apps run on OSX since I'm considering a new computer purchase.
Standard Linux binaries will not run on OS X, because Linux binaries assume x86, X and some WM. However, OS X really is a Unix, so installing X, hacking and a compile should work. /. types are already doing this and OS X binaries are starting to appear.
However, you may find you don't want to run standard Linux apps after your OS X purchase. Very nice commercial apps already exist for OS X, and the shareware community is mature and strong. And some of the best Unix apps have already been ported to use Apple APIs.
Lies about crimes
I don't own a mac of any kind though an ibook is on the list of things to get so linux ppc distros are of some interest. I've heard of YDL for some time now and I have to say I'm rather disappointed. There aren't that many macs they need to test on. unlike the pc world the hardware for a mac is mostly unchanging from one machine to the next. why can't they get something as simple as the proper sound output driver correct?
no offense, I'm not distro maintainer but that just seems like an easy one.
-
and it's not OSS - it has bad proprietary design which you cannot fix cause you don't have a source code.
Once we'll finish with M$ - we'll begin to finish Apple as a bad software monopolist on the PPC market.
They certainly do exist. The speed difference between OS9.2.1 and OSX is astonishing. The thing is, most of the people that I know that have Macs and don't like OSX are graphic designers that must use Photoshop (which until recently was not OSX compatible) and Quark (which for some reason was just updated but is not OSX compatible). I don't think these people (graphic designers!+*nix =ouch!) are candidates for a *nix distro of any kind though.
Do a google search before posting.
The only think I would advise is to preconfigure database and web servers with some personal automation applications (PIM). My choice is Cocoon and PostgreSQL. Both are platform independent and it might be a question to RedHat, not to YDL. However, it would be nice to have last JDK installed, which is platform specific.
i wholeheartedly agree. american's need to realize that raising their voices against the often unfair policies of the american government does not betray those who died on 9/11. the real betrayal is the comodification of the event which has occured in the media. the mega-corporations have turned it into a means of profit. using the events of 9/11 to fuel the "war on drugs", using it to attack intellectual opposition to the saddly facist tendencies of the government and creating a situation where honest people are afraid to express their views for fear of being "unamerican". now more than ever its important to be as pro-active as possible.
d.
I used YDL when I first got my TiBook. I had to, because I needed 802.11 support and Apple didn't support Orinoco. I switched because I needed Firewire more than I needed Orinoco. My experiences:
YDL: Works as well as any mainstream Linux distribution. Yup works, by some definition of "works". Better still, Ximian's stuff builds from SRPMS, and Ximian now explicitly supports them with binaries. Not hard to get current, buildable kernel source, and FreeSWAN works nicely for IPsec. The (major) negative is that Firewire support blows, and it is pointless to buy hard drives that don't come in Firewire enclosures. When I left YDL, SBP2 drivers didn't work at all. The (minor) negative is that companies don't distribute closed-source binaries for YDL, and they do for X86 Linux.
OSX 10.1: A dream; xterms, xemacs, and Adobe Illustrator on the same screen. Rootless XFree86, transparent anything, beautiful user interface, antialiasing. It's faster than Linux for applications and slower for tools. The one (big) negative is that there is no credible IPsec or VPN support. A minor negative is that you can't keep current with BOTH the dev kernel AND Apple's updates.
I'm on OSX 10.1.3 now and I'm not looking back. However, I can understand why people want PPC Linux, if they already simply use Linux for everything and want good portable environments. It's good to hear that YDL continues to move forward.
> Wake up, Chicken Little.
Wake up yourself. The world consists of more
than America and its government. Not everything
in the world emanates from Washington. Dozens
of countries have experienced Islamic terrorism
in the past decade, the USA is just the latest.
whatreallyhappened.com is a propaganda site.
At the moment it prominently displays an image
labelled "Palestinian man hanging in Ramallah",
above articles unanimously 'blaming Israel'.
The implication is that this man was a victim
of Israeli execution. Yet if you go to the URL
you'll find that the man was executed by
Palestinian forces for collaboration.
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=
Mitchell Porter
By "work", I mean by default - not after dicking around, upgrading kernels, and searching google to find the right command line stuff to get it going.
Does the installer set it up for you? If not, my question is why not? Why is this so hard - there is only one Apple Airport card, and every Mac that has one uses the same driver, so what's the problem?
I have $100 just waiting to be donated to the first PPC Linux team that produces something that works properly on my iBook. Seriously. No one seems to want it.
In Yellow Dog 2.1, I followed their Airport setup instructions to the letter, but it does not work. Their "YUP" update tool does not work. Sound did not work. From the way the article reads, it sounds like 2.2 is more of the same, so why bother?
I'm also following the Mandrake 8.2 PPC beta process with much interest. As far as I can tell, there is ONE GUY - Stewart - working on it. He's doing some great things, but frankly, it's clear that he's overwhelmed. For example, my iBook2 cannot get IPs via DHCP over either the built in ethernet or the wireless inteface. Nobody knows why. Modem works, but only after you tweak the timout values in the dialer to be certain values. How would anyone know that? It should be done by the installer if the installation platform is the iBook!
I wish that these folks would work on getting the CORE stuff working, and working well, before they start including 2000 packages on the CDs. I can download Apache, MySQL, and 18 text editors later - right now, I need a working network connection!
The "gold standard", as far as I'm concerned, is RedHat 7.2 on a Dell Inspiron. Everything worked, and I mean EVERYTHING. No tweaking, no kernel upgrade, no command line garbage. Ethernet, video, mouse, keyboard, everything. So that's what I expect, but no PPC vendor has delivered it yet.
Given the very limited hardware a PPC vendor must support, I just expect it to work. It doesn't.
And if you mention that a Linux developer can reach 99.x% of the developers by targeting x86 then you are using the same argument as Microsoft
Irrelevant, the truth is the truth, and a truth isn't invalidated merely because Microsoft can take advantage of it.
I am always willing to build the apps myself. But the problem is that most of the folks simply choose to ignore me
I'll restate my argument again. Developers have limitted resources and given the very nature and spirit of Open Source you should not expect that you can "dicate" how they spend their time and money. They gave you the source, you, or more accurately the PPC Linux community, have the ability to do the work yourself.
Open Source is not about everyone catering to your needs, it is about you being able to look out for yourself, about you doing the work yourself or hiring someone to do it four you.
That was a very astute and timely observation. I noticed you're posting as AC, and I think that is even more telling than what you said, because it proves your point: free speech is disappearing. Self-evaluation is now dangerous. Questioning the motives or tactics of our leaders is deadly. Examining our countries' behavior and trying to suggest improvements is tantamount to treason.
.sig says, "Chicken Little was an optimist".
These are the signs that we are living in a fascist state. How many of you are fearful of speaking against George Bush in this political climate? I know I am. Look at the laws being rammed through the system, the lack of checks and balances to keep the government honest, and you'll see that George W. Bush, because of September 11th, has carte blanche to do WHATEVER HE WANTS. NOBODY can stop him.
That scares me. A lot.
Just sign me,
Also an Anonymous Coward - for good reason.
And like the
Try telling THEM that.
signed,
A Finlander
In reality, women this fine don't use Linux....
v ideo/
Theoretically, it's possible, but the chances are so slim. It's such a dishonest commercial, and you can tell by her voice that she knows its dishonest. To use sexuality to sell Linux... What a twisted world this is. Linux is about freedom, but I guarantee you that she does not feel completely free. (Sadly, she might not even know what it is... not many people do.)
She doesn't belong there.... Her beauty is being wasted. I hope she finds something where when she speaks, she sounds resolute. It will be good for her soul, because her inner beauty will shine in combination with her outer beauty, and she will be 1000x more beautiful when that happens.
Check it:
http://www.terrasoftsolutions.com/realworld/
Uhhh... I'm on www.whatreallyhappened.com right now, and there IS no image labelled "Palestinian man hanging in Ramallah", or articles unanimously 'blaming Israel'. It doesn't look like they take anything down, either, since there's news going back to the beginning of March. I set my browser to search the page for "Palestinian man hanging in Ramallah", then "Palestinian man hanging", then just "Palestinian". Found lots of links on Palestinians, but not your link. No picture of a guy hanging either. Sorry.
Which brings me to the next point - that website pretty much only LINKS to news websites of interest. They're not concocting any of those articles. They're just linking to the Washington Times, Yahoo, slate.msn.com, Salon.com, Chicago Tribune, USA Today, Christian Science Monitor, Washington Post, Reuters, MSNBC, etc. Those are a few links I'm looking at right now. Not exactly disreputable sources. Would you trust NBC's news on TV and not on the net? Why?
They do have SOME articles (editorial-type stuff) they've written themselves, but by far the majority of stuff seems to be links to other sites' articles.
And the link you posted is TOTALLY one-sided. You should have known this guy was witch-hunting from the first sentences:
"This is the face of Yasser Arafat's terror. This is what it looks like. This is how he remains in power. This is why we continue to deal with this murdering fiend after more than 30 years."
Yeah. That sounds professional. He barely stops short of calling Arafat a "Brownskinned Pagan Devil". And nobody here's ever said Arafat was a nice guy. What the poster above said was "We should look at what THE U.S. GOVERNMENT is doing, and judge for ourselves whether it is warranted or not." That's all. The guy wants to make sure Bush doesn't become another Arafat or Sharon. That's all. We're losing our civil liberties over here, and if you remember the "temporary measure" known as INCOME TAX, you know that WHAT THE GOVERNMENT TAKES, YOU'LL NEVER GET BACK.
But thanks for your useless link to the website who claims on their "about" page to have been voted the Number 1 website on the internet for over a year during 1999 and 2000. Yeah, right. That's why I never heard of it. I should surf more. 60 hours a week must not be enough. And they were also voted the "stickiest" website. Yeah, these guys should see Slashdot. Alcoholics Anonymous would need a 15-step program to even make a dent on the Slashaholics here.
At least I got a kick out of the Last lines of his "article":
"Special offer: See the horrors with your own eyes captured on video. Get the documentaries, produced in France, "The Trojan Horse" and "Israel and the War of Images," both available in WorldNetDaily's online store.
Joseph Farah is editor and chief executive officer of WorldNetDaily.com and writes a daily column. Get an autographed, first-edition copy of Joseph Farah's 1996 book, "This Land Is Our Land," published by St. Martin's Press."
That's GOOD JOURNALISM if I ever saw it. REAL objective. I'll stick with my Reuters links if you don't mind.
What a loser. "Buy my video." Ha!
As an aside: Actually, I've been surfing Whatreallyhappened.com for a few hours now, and it's not too bad. I recommend it to the Slashdot community if you're interested in this type of stuff. There is a treasure trove of links there, and it's amazing to see what the Washington Post or the Globe and Mail (for you fellow Canadians) has to say about 9/11 or Enron or whatever. Good stuff, although pretty damn scary. Glad I'm from Canada. The only people who're gonna bomb us are the Americans for beating them in hockey.
Your comment shows that your are not a developer. It's much easier to develop on a 500 MHz machine than on a 100 MHz machine. Less time to compile. Usually less time to reboot if the system crashes. Less time between the idea and the implementation. And you don't necessarily have to support all new hardware - you don't need the new soundcard to compile stuff.
Well, the image was there, believe it or not.
Although it was gone within thirty minutes of
my post. As for the WorldNetDaily article,
I have my own problems with the author (he's
a creationist) and I would probably never have
looked at it again, if I had not seen its
central image a day later on whatreallyhappened,
given a completely opposite spin.
As far as I can see, whatreallyhappened.com is
currently functioning as a clearing-house for
any story that presents Israel and the USA as
the villains. Perhaps it helps to have all that
stuff in the one place, but don't tell me that's
the whole story about "what really happened".
Mitchell Porter
http://www.geocities.com/paris/chateau/15
What, you mean develop on the fastest Mac, test on the slowest Mac?
This is Linux here! You can code on a fast *or* slow Mac, thanks to NFS, X, and vi or emacs, and compile on the fastest platform available.
Essentially the point being you can own 'the fastest' Mac to do your compiling and such, but you don't actually 'need' to test it on the highest end hardware because you really want to target the lowest end hardware, meaning you should be running, writing code, and using lowest 'mean' available hardware, even if you use the highest end for compilation purposes.
GPL Deconstructed
I like Noam Chomsky, myself. www.zmag.org
His credentials are impeccable, and he's Jewish. Being Jewish myself, he taught me not to root for Israel because they're my people and they follow the religion of my father, but to root for the truth, and justice, and honesty, wherever that may be found. Unfortunately, the Israeli government has lost the way. There is a difference between the Israeli government and the Israeli people. Don't hate Jews because our government is corrupt. They're just politicians, and all politicians have no morals. They are religious only to get the religious vote. They kiss babies only when cameras are rolling. And my father remembers Ariel Sharon maintaining terror among the Palestinians by driving a jeep filled with soldiers through Palestinian areas and machine-gunning women and children in the streets during the 60's, when he was a General in the military. He doesn't represent me - but I'm non-practicing, and young, and American, and dating a Christian, so I sometimes think all religion should be illegal. All it does is divide and justify monstrosities. People should be devoted to the truth, not their politicians, and not what their Rabbi or Pastor tells them. Yahweh/Jesus/Jehovah/Allah doesn't endorse murder. And if he does, should we still follow him?
And I, too, have followed the parent poster's link to WhatReallyHappened, and I think that what they give you is probably accurate, but they are too focused on one side. I think they're out to help the "underdogs" rather than find the whole truth, which is that "ALL politicians are dirtier than the mafia or organized crime". Arafat IS a terrorist, in the past he's allowed terrorism and even promoted it. Sharon is a monster as well, and I have many personal stories from my parents. Bush has ties to criminal organizations and seems to be in this for the money. I bet there's not a political leader in the world with a clean slate. Look at the Presidents. Bush, Clinton, Bush Sr., Reagan, Nixon, etc. Is there ANY clean politician? Every one of them was corrupted by his power. THAT'S the story WhatReallyHappened should be reporting on. That we are governed by tyrants, all of us, and wars are just little powerplays and squabbles between them. Voting on one country or another to win is like voting for Pepsi to kill Coke. We pick a side based on the propaganda we WANT to believe. It's not about us. It's none of our business, and meaningless. They don't represent us, they don't care about us, and both sides only want to use and exploit us. It's US and THEM. US being the world's people, THEM being the world's politicians.
Wage war on the system, not each other.
Interesting. OS X minimal workload at 600 MHz I get around 5 hours. Using it hard (constant mp3 decoding, drive and cd usage) I get around 3.5 hrs (fav coffee shop just got Airport so will report back on that).
I have 5 mouse buttons on my iBook. They are even named. Mouse button, Control, Option, Command, and Shift.
Lies about crimes
THIS got modded down as a TROLL?? Okay, let me get this straight. Goatse.cx, Steven King is dead, BSD is dying, the page-widener, the Taco Snotting guy, and...
/. in a long time, modded down as a troll. Kinda proves his point, in a funny way. Better conform, Slashdot mods'll get ya! Slashdot has SUCKED since Microsoft and the other corporations started paying people to promote themselves here.
Intelligent conversation on an important topic. All trolls. Yeah. Right.
Who is the MORON who modded this down as a TROLL??? The moron mod just didn't agree with it. Good work, mod! Stifle that free speech, just like the guy said!
What crappy judgement to mod this down as a troll. Idiot. One of the BEST posts I've seen on
Typical Crapdot Moderation Prowess at its best.
A Jewish Anarchist. Cool, I thought I was the only one. After living with war and terrorism for 32 years, I moved to the States, to New York. Guess what happened three months later? Now, my wife thinks we're cursed.
Nice world. My life so far has taught me not to trust politicians under any circumstances, which has been hammered home by the fact that I'm working as a Civil Servant here in NY and am in meetings with fairly-high up people in the NY gov't quite often. They all try to please everybody, so they end up pleasing nobody. Same old story. What's worse is that some of our top guys have plaques that say "You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs." I don't want to be one of the eggs that gets in their way and gets broken.
Actually, if you look at the moderation breakdown on that post, it was modded (+1, Insightful) before some idiot came and downed it as a troll. I agree, the modtard was trying to censor content down to the point where only us AC's and TROLLGODS don't fear to tread. It was probably some Bushcountry.com homo who can't handle any friction that's not in his ass.
Intelligence on Slashdot is dead, as this guy being modded a troll demonstrates. Moderators punishing intelligent postings only serves to drive away the intelligent posters. Soon, Slashdot will be an empty hollow shell, a haven for us SCUM TROLLS. What a glorious day that will be. Taco will have to pay the intelligent posters a subscription fee to post here rather than the other way around.
The original poster should learn his lesson - Slashdot is not for intelligent posts, it's for trolling, flamebaiting, alerting us to a new kernel point release (Hooray! Yippee!), and making fun of Windows (not that Windows doesn't _deserve_ to be made fun of...). Slashdot is the Jerry Springer of internet tech news sites. It's not even lowest common denominator stupid. It's Joe Dirt stupid. Not even, it's Joe Dirt's Dog stupid. You know, the one who froze his nuts to the porch? That's the approximate IQ of the typical Slashdot reader. They statistically all use Windows because they're too STUPID to use Linux and too CHEAP to buy a Mac.
If you want intelligence, go elsewhere. Maybe Kuro5hin can help you. But on Slashdot, you have to wade through many repetitive postings of obvious stale data and karma whoring before you come to an eye-opening piece of introspective debate like the parent. Slashdot sucks.
I would like to state officially for the record that I would sign up for a (lame, stupid, desperate, corporate sellout) Fatdot subscription right now, if these fat lazy bastards at Slashsnot would let me filter out all posts OVER 0. I want to pretend all non-trolls don't exist. I don't come here to read that crap, I come here to read WIPO, the Page Widener, Goatse, and the guys who make Crapdot really tick. Trolls are the heart of Slackpot, and they should be respected as such. Don't mod down intelligent posts, cuz I DON'T WANNA READ THEM!!! Die, Moderators, DIE!!! YOU SUCK!!!
God Bless the Stupid,
Dr. Scooby
Slashdot Troll Academy
(Late to the Party as usual and already half in the bag)
P.S. EAT MY WHITE ASSNUT, MODERATOR FOOLS.