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Netscape 7.0 is Out
MrJones was one of many many users to submit that Netscape has released
Navigator 7.0 unto the world. With their dwindling market share, it'll be interesting to see what affect this has on internet users. But here's hoping it makes a dent.
Argh! Things don't have an affect!
Yes! That guy!
But where is the platform support?
...
Some of us have SPARCs on our desk. Or PA-RISC machines. Or RS6k's.
These were all supported with Communicator
NS7 is useless to me till I can run it on these platforms...
--NBVB
Why should/would I use Netscape instead of Mozilla? Not getting enough pop-up windows in my life? Feel the need for a more closed solution?
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
There's no anti-javascript popup ads support. I'm sticking with Mozilla.
Why the quick jump to version 7? Is it just to match AOL v.7 or some other strange reason that my small non-marketing brain can't figure out?
THIS SPACE FOR RENT
The CNET review of 7.0 is here.
Title: Don't switch browsers
Summary:
We had high hopes for Netscape 7.0, but we're sorely disappointed, especially by the missing pop-up suppressor. There's no practical reason to switch from either IE or Mozilla.
the difference is AOL. Netscape == mozilla + aol cruft - nifty pop-up blocking features. Plus netscape has the brand name appeal.
"Um, so what, Netscape is dead, use mozilla"
"yeah, big deal, it's based on Mozilla 1.0 when the Mozilla Organization just released 1.1, kudos to Netscape's already outdated browser".
Yes, but a lot of the time it's easier to:
1- have users download the familiar Netscape product instead of "that mozilla dinosaur thingy".
2- Introduce Netscape to organizations; at least it's a familiar name and brand for them.
I'm a rabid mozilla user, but still I'm pleased to see that Netscape is still alive, if maybe under AOL's life support infrastructure.
Data shows Netscape browser usage down to just 3.4%
7 38 50%2C0.html?nlid=AM
Microsoft's rival browser, Internet Explorer, by contrast, has an estimated 96%
of the market, according to Internet research firm WebSideStory.
http://computerworld.com/newsletter/0%2C4902%2C
-=Mongr=-
Here is the Netscape 7 reviewers guide. (PDF)
www.oobersworld.com - For those that ride.
Think of what might happen if the gazillions of AOL users started using Netscape when they upgrade to the next version of AOL!!!!!
AOL has the power to change the browser demographics of the web.
"Version Inflation" -- to your average luser, "the higher the version number, the better it must be."
Forget netscape - we need to get the word out about how good Mozilla is. As a tech guy I've heard all about Mozilla and I use it all the time - but the average user thinks it is a new monster in JP4 or something! If Mozilla could get its name out (ie Super Bowl Ad), it would REALLY catch on....
smd4985
So that you wont have to /. mozillazine.org here's the text with links:
Netscape Communications Corporation today launched the final version of Netscape 7.0. This latest release is based on Mozilla 1.0.1, making it the first Netscape browser to be built upon post-1.0 code. The new version boasts several enhancements over the 0.9.4-based Netscape 6.2, including tabbed browsing, the ability to save complete web pages, print preview, site icons (Favicons), a download manager, full screen mode (Windows only), Quick Search within Mail Newsgroups and Address Book, return receipts, mail labels, (Secure Multipurpose Internet Mail Extensions) S/MIME mail encryption, CSS support in Composer and one-click web page publishing.
Netscape 7.0 also has several features not found in Mozilla. These include the ability to access Netscape Webmail and AOL accounts directly from within Mail Newsgroups, a button to easily toggle the display of My Sidebar in Navigator and P3P (Platform for Privacy Preferences) support for automated cookie handling. Improved instant messaging features including file transfers, Buddy Alerts and Buddy Icons are provided by AOL Instant Messenger for Netscape and ICQ for Netscape. There's also a round throbber with a cool animation.
Netscape 7.0 can be downloaded from Netscape's web site or FTP server. More details can be found at Netscape Browser Central or in the Release Notes.
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
If you prefer bleeding edge code with more bugs then use Mozilla. It doesn't have any of the above and has the popup blocker UI. Web developers will also appreciate stuff like the DOM inspector and JS Debugger modules.
Well, I'm running it on my Windows partition at work. Why? Several reasons, all trivial. The largest of the trivial reasons is that IT will be less upset with me using Netscape than with Mozilla.
But to be fair about the whole thing, I'm running Mozilla under Solaris.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
One of the main challenges faced in getting users to use standards-compliant browsers over obsolete programs such as Netscape 4-series is also the computers. At places still using older systems or franken-systems, Moz (may just be too hefty for Windows. It doesn't seem as much of a problem on PCs, because IE is available, but many people still use NS4 for the mail client (and I cannot in good conscience tell them that Moz's is overwhelmingly superior, despite weird stuff like NS4 Mail encoding all messages in Rot13 by accident). It is an even bigger challenge with Macs, because many older Macs just won't comfortably run IE/mac, so NS4/mac is the browser of choice for aging Macs.
But saturating the market with standards-compliant browsers is helpful anyway. I could only wish more people knew about Mozilla, for their sake.
Karma: T-rexcellent.
Why do you doubt? Allay your concerns.
Save Maine's economy: write stuff down. All comments are exclusively my own, not my employer.
Mozilla is also tested less and therefore suffers from more bugs.
Please,
As a webdesigner, a web game developer, and as an internet user, please for the love of God, start the browser war back up.
When we have competition, at a scale over 20% for the browser, we will FINALLY see standards begin to matter!
AOL needs to:
- Aggressively work with computer makers to ship NS as the default browser in place of IE. More power to them if they also get AOL on it.
- Aggressively work to woo corporations to using Netscape again. Thats where Netscape was immensely powerful before, and where they can be again!
- Replace AOL's IE rendering engine with NS. They began with a closed beta, continued to Compuserve, moved it to AOL 4 Macs, now they need to do it on ALL of AOL.
With that, we may see a reverse in the tides. ANYTHING short of all of that, and it will be just a ripple.
PLEEEEEASE AOL, NS7 *IS READY*!
GPL'd web-based tradewars themed space game
http://ufaq.org/files/adblocker.xpi
I have not tried it with the final version of Netscape 7, but it should work unless they've blocked it some how.
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
many people hate Netscape what with the AOL stuff the ads etc etc. But just about everyday here at work I convert someone to Mozilla and/or show them some way in which it is better than IE. This has gotten to the point where next week I have a meeting with our MIS department to implement Mozilla in addition to IE as a standard. The moral of the story start using it and when people have a problem with IE test using Mozilla many times it will work and people will start to use it and love it. Also the whole blocking popup thing is a good way to sell people on it. :)
Cypherpunks: Civil Liberty Through Complex Mathematics. Those who live by the sword die by the arrow.
These seem like the thinnest of thin cosmetic crud type changes. This is really pathetic. Woowee now that I have no need to use the browser to launch AOLIM they integrate it, ooooh themes and skins, wow zipee !!!
You can restore the feature with this
Guvf vf abg n EBG zrffntr
Either it's not happening (the comments I've seen so far might explain why), or NS is withstanding it quite well.
I was shocked how fast I downloaded all 28 megs (NS, RealPlayer, Java 2, Flash, etc.) for a full install, even over my company's typically laggy connection.
Yes, I use NS7. It's more polished than Moz overall. I've been using the PR all summer (Why didn't they go through multiple PRs??? There was PR1 and that was it...) Yes, Moz might have some neat features, but overall I've had too many negative experiences with it. (Like refusing to access SSL pages - "Please download the PSM" - I DOWNLOADED AND INSTALLED IT, DELETED AND REINSTALLED IT AGAIN - WORK GODDAMNIT!)
Interesting how Netscape Radio compares to (say) Musicmatch's radio offering. Haven't checked to see if it runs under Linux yet (2 hours 'till I get home), but it's gonna hurt MM if it can compare, considering that it appears to be free.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
I think Mozilla 1.1 Beta has crashed maybe 3 times for me. 1.0 crashed fewer than that. I restarted the browser and I was back in business.
IE6 brought my home 2000 Server machine to its knees last night and the one at work down this afternoon. At home it took 10 minutes to log me out so I could log in and start over, at work I had to hard reset as it wouldn't even log out properly. And it's far from the first time for either of those boxes it's happened.
Yeah... Netscape is older versions of mozilla, with a different desktop icon, and some AOL crap thrown in for that "added user experience".
No thanks
Skiers and Riders -- http://www.snowjournal.com
The funny thing is that 4.79 is listed at 11/7/2001, while this is actually brand new: 8/15/2002.
dunno why they're supporting this old ver, but whatever..
I'm really amazed to see the popularity of Netscape, especially version 4.* and especially for the "newbie internet users". The fact is, ISP often offer a free CD containing MS IE5 and NN4.7. Right.
...
...
I was a NN user two years ago, when I had no alternative. Today, let's face it : NN4.* is crap. I mean IE is not the best browser for specs compliance, and crashes quite often. But NN4.* doesn't even support CSS1, which is really a shame if we plan to use HTML4.01 Strict. Opera is quite a good, rapid, nice browser, but since the free version has a banner and since it's not on the ISP CDs, it will never make it amongst beginners.
[ right, you'll have noticed that I only speak about windows, since any normal linux user will use a recent Mozilla (or galeon & co) or Konqueror. I'm talking about people who don't even know what a setup.exe is. ]
So the problem is : I've never seen any ISP shipping its CD with a NN >4 browser. Since NN6 is such a sloooow program, it's not much of a surprise, I agree. We'll see what NN7 will change in this business.
However, the fact is : many internet users are beginners, and many beginners use the browser they were given in the first place (IE5 or NN, maybe they prefer NN because of its mail client which is less effective in virus auto-install). What's wrong with that ?
NN4 *is* deprecated. I mean it doesn't support recent standards. So if you are a webmaster, and that you or your customers want the majority of the people to be able to view your website, you have no choice but make your HTML code NN4 compliant. And to some extent, recent-standards-non-compliant.
I wouldn't be whinning about that here if my customer didn't make me recode his website to make it NN4 compliant (wow, great creepy code with tables, frames, and all).
A solution would be for the ISP to *stop* distributing this old NN version with their CDs. Mozilla is mature enough to replace it, isn't it ? Or even a recent NN version
Let's hope ISP will wake up, eventually, and update their CDs so that we'll finally be able to use the new possibilities the W3C has been working on for two years
theefer
My sig says it all. I'm still waiting, too. :)
siri
I have to wonder how they get these stats. I mean, it would lend to common sense that they are using the user agent string on server statistics. The problem is, how many people have to spoof their user agent as MSIE in order to get sites to send them the right (unbroken) html? I know I do.
I downloaded it today (before this was posted) and ran it. Mozilla 1.1 that is. It wasn't slow, but it was ugly and didn't seem to want to render pages with any type of regularity.
So I tossed it off and went back to Opera. No fuss, no muss, no big issues. Opera just works. And when I get my home system back up and running, Linux will be running Opera as well.
I've used Mozilla off and on since M12 or something like that, and never liked how it felt or handled. Netscape 4.x was ok for me, but not Mozilla. But that's just one opinion on the land of trolls and thoughtful posters.
They stuck me in an institution, said it was the only solution, to...protect me from the enemy, myself
I would have to point out that that seems to be misleading. I've had more crashes with Netscape in one week than I have had in Mozilla in two months (and I use Mozilla MORE).
I've yet to find a bug in Mozilla (since the aforementioned fucky webpages above crash Netscape as well).
Actually, to be fair, there is one problem with Mozilla. When you go to the official Neverwinter Nights website, the pages render as a black screen. Since that's the ONLY site that does that, that would suggest to me it's bad web design rather than a bug.
Netscape Still gives a person the choice to have a browser that comes with a mail client that supports imap. Thats one reason we use it where I work as a sysadmin. Its easy to create and manage profiles for all our users in a matter of seconds, and has great support for using ldap for an address book.
Netscape on solaris is supported by SUN. The latest version available on Solaris is 6.2.3 u can get it from
Netscape On Solaris
Also solaris mozilla binaries take about 4-5 weeks before they are available on mozilla.org. And building it from source is pain in the A$$.
for the last time people, I am "frodo from middle eaRTH", not "middle eaST".
That's the difference between the browser Mozilla and the company Netscape? How do you compare a browser to a company?
The Internet suite distributed by Netscape Communications, a unit of AOL(tw), is called "Netscape". Version 4.x was called "Communicator". It began to be officially known as "Netscape" starting with version 6.
Ooooh! You meant the difference between Mozilla and Navigator, right?
From Mozilla 1.1, I pull down the Window menu, and I see the word "Navigator". I guess both Netscape and Mozilla use the term "Navigator" to refer to the web browser component.
Will I retire or break 10K?
It appears they've removed roaming access from Netscape. This allowed for remote storage of bookmarks on a properly configured server (via http) so that you always had the same bookmarks regardless of what machine you were running on. Maybe they dropped it because the implementation they were using was bad, but for me it was a nearly invaluable service. Anyone know if some sort of similar service is in store for future versions of netscape or mozilla?
A squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous, got me?
If you must do it, the least you could do is email the site and let them know they are losing potential customers. At least then there is a chance that they will fix the markup and so next mozilla user to come along won't have to change their UA string.
So it is important that Netscape survives.
For one, there is a plethora of application that requrie an application certification before you can use them in a "supported" environment. An infamous application coming to mind is Oracle Applications 11i.
Mozilla isn't going to do the dirty work, so like every other version of netscape, they have a better chance of competing with Microsoft, especially with Oracle's anti MS beliefs to begin with.
Netscape "dummies" up the process so end users can plug and play, alot better then mozilla does, and netscape offers more bells and whistles that a normal windows user probably will use and enjoy.
I personally liked the fact that they're serving up the release quickly, (took all but 10 seconds to install over ds3) have been great on following up with fixes, and face it, without netscape there wouldn't have been a mozilla!
I had turned popups on (a blog comment page required them) and forgotten about it. Visiting Netscape's page pops up a BIG HUGE ad for Netscape 7.
Check out CrazyBrowser. Tabbed browsing, popup blocker, etc. Based off of IE, but has a lot of the nice features of Mozilla.
However when you actually do the download, check out the new License (not on the download page, the one in the file). It expressly forbids linking with GPL software. Yikes, what happened over there?
Netscape 7 includes proprietary components such as Netscape Instant Messenger and possibly some sort of Sun Java(tm) runtime environment. It is based on the Mozilla source code, which is MPL/GPL/Lesser GPL licensed; Netscape Communications simply chose the MPL option.
Will I retire or break 10K?
How about the 100's of bugs fixed and and performance increases? Isn't that worth something?
Netscape 6 was really just something that was put out to show where Netscape was going. It had a lot of bugs yet, and wasn't optimised, so really couldn't be used productively. Netscape needs to distance themselves from that now and show that this one is ready for prime time. It really is off another completely different branch, instead of adding patches to 6.2.1, so I say it deserves a number increase.
-BrentI officially asked MS about this as part of a review I wrote recently for a major magazine and the answer was a simple "no, we won't be doing that." There are literally dozens of third party blockers though. Go to download.com and search for 'popup'
"Impact [is] spelled the same way for the noun and verb, unlike affect and effect."
I've heard this before, yet it's wrong. Affect can be a noun or a verb, or a transitive verb. Effect can be a noun or a transitive verb. I have a feeling that the noun vs. verb mentality is most prevalent amongst speakers of American English, although I have no evidence to back it up, especially considering my links are to an American English dictionary.
The article says that the statistics are generated using HitBox technology, which is cookie-based. If you are blocking cookies, then perhaps you do not appear on the register. Since the mozilla cookie-blocking feature began about the same time as the fall of market share from > 10% to 3.4%, perhaps this can be explained by people using mozilla's blocking features.
Opinions change daily as new information arrives. Stay tuned.
"Plus netscape has the brand name appeal."
After reading all the milions of "Netscape 4 and 6.0 sux, that's why they lost to IE"-messages, I'd say that Netscape's brand name appeal does more bad than good.
No I'm not joking here. I'm sure you've read the "Netscape sucks"-messages too. Those comments are in nearly every non-Slashdot browser or "Netscape sues Microsoft" article. Checkout the comment archives at WebWereld for example (well... if you can read Dutch, that is). Most people (at least, those who are old enough to remember Netscape) really do think that Netscape sucks, dispite the fact that Netscape 6.2 is a good browser. People simply don't want to give Netscape another chance.
Quite a few languages are supported, though maybe not in the very latest version. Here's mozilla's language page
It doesn't have any of the above and has the popup blocker UI. I consider both of those things pluses. I haven't downloaded 7, so I don't know if those frills are optional, but I won't use any of them.
Science may someday discover what faith has always known.
It does, uh, slightly.
Actually, it supports JSSS - JavaScript Style Sheets, which was Netscape's stylesheet language proposal. Unfortunately for them (and, rather fortunately for us) it got rejected, partly because nobody else would implement it.
So when CSS was accepted, they had to quickly hack together a way to get it into the browser, but since a complete rewrite of the stylesheet engine was out of the question, they were forced instead to write a CSS -> JSSS translator. Much of the problems with NS4's CSS support is that it isn't a 1:1 mapping with JSSS.
Death to NS4!
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
Maybe we need a website with a database devoted entirely to giving websites like CapitalOne a hard time for being IE only.
Does such a website exist? Maybe if we got together we could email these people and thier bosses to get them to support Netscape.
Does such a website exist?
"Communism is like having one [local] phone company " - Lenny Bruce
Given the raft of security bugs surrounding IE and forged certs, isn't it kind of dangerous to do your banking on IE? Wouldn't Mozilla or Konqueror be a safer choice?
Edit -> Preferences -> Advanced -> Scripts & Windows -> Uncheck "Open Unrequested Windows".
:-)
You might want to check the other features there, too.
Now where's this bannerblind function you speak of? Sounds interesting.
If you could be told what you can see or read, then it follows that you could be told what to say or think - BoC
Netscape 7 is out.
Internet explorer is in..
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
i could not find anything that ns7 had that mozilla 1 doesn't (except for bundled "AOL Free & Unlimited" and RealAudio icons everywhere after install). in fact, there's no straight-forward way to disable popup ads (I've noticed netscape.com has several), whereas in mozilla you can. the whole download -> install -> try -> uninstall cycle took about 20 minutes.
See this is just wrong. Who the hell cares if it was valid HTML or not? It should just work! We run into this all the time with our TIFF and PS printing software. 90% of all TIFF an PS files in existance violate the Tiff and PS specs in some way. And guess what? WE HAVE TO STILL PRINT IT CORRECTLY!!!! If we wrote to the TIFF and PS specs and FU to all our customers that complain about us not printing what they saw on the screen in InDesign or what ever app they were printing from, we'd be completely out of buisness by now.
Until Mozilla/Netscape can properly render "broken" IE formatted webpages, it has NO HOPE of taking over market share. I personally won't use it for that specific reason. And I bet that most people using a web browser are a lot more interested in whether it works, rather than some lofty moral superiority it exudes.
Get off your high horses and do what the rest of us have to do. Make software that works dammit! Be pragmatic for once. Geez.
Contrary to popular belief, coding is not all free blow-jobs and beer. Those things cost MONEY!
I specifically do not want features like messaging in my browser!
It's a pity no web browser has intelligent pop-up control built in. You can get the same three from the aftermarket, but it works best when the policy is part of the browser. I'd particularly like something that lets you configure your policy on the fly -- like Konqueror does with cookies, only for popups.
It could be just a function of the computers I'm using now vs. those I was using then:
:) It's based on RealPlayer, but despite Real for Linux it doesn't appear to be supported unter Linux, although I have yet to try it.
NS7 seems a LOT faster than NS6.
Mozilla still seems a bit on the slow side for me...
I tried firing up the Radio app - Looks nice. Too bad I'm at work and couldn't crank it up.
The only problem I've seen with it are one or two minor JS issues so far (The "equipment credit" plan description pages on dishnetwork.com don't seem to work right in NS7.)
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Actually, anyone using this information to show that everyone uses IE on the internet, or who thinks IE is all anyone uses, needs their head examined.
Considering the number of surfers that run OSes that don't even support IE, I don't see how these statistics can be right:
Microsoft 95.97 %
Netscape 3.39 %
Other 0.64 %
Perhaps if they actually broke down Other into Mozilla, Konqueror, Opera etc. and explained how they tell IE from them I could have a little more faith...
For my two cents, keep using Mozilla and Konqeror as much as you can, and keep pushing your friends to use them. Don't do anything that might make things more difficult and tempt you to switch back to IE, and do no more "advocation" then you are comfortable with. (But do all you *are* comfortable with!)
I've seen it. I've used it. It is decidedly Micky Mouse and worthless in a corporate environment, which happens to be where I am desperately (and, sadly, failing) to find an OSS solution. Nevertheless, it has potential, and I think the developers would like to see it take on Outlook/Exchange in the future, but that is still a long ways away.
Jason.
To use client-side XML you need a way to specify the fine details of your documents -- how much space between paragraphs, how big is your text, that sort of thing. XSL isn't up to that yet, so that leaves you with CSS. And CSS is quite nice -- easy to work with, powerful enough for most web documents -- and most documents in general. But.
Both Mozilla/Netscape and IE implement CSS -- badly. Mozilla makes some stupid mistakes with layout, while IE's CSS support is incomplete and buggy. Wouldn't be that hard to fix, but they've both been working on it for five years now!
If there's a standard that web designers should be pushing for it's CSS.
Net-whah?
For my sanity, usefulness, and the pleasure of all, please kindly do the following:
Blog,Twitter
Surprise! Most desktop power users who are already on a niche desktop OS prefer Mozilla over Netscape.
You know I just don't think its fair how much shit AOL/netscape get for contributing to the Mozilla project. You do remember who started this whole ball rolling? You do also realize who has paid people to work on this?
Oh so big deal they add a few aol icons to your desktop that you can instantly delete.
You know Moz may end up being the default browser for linux desktop OS's, but you got another thing coming if you think that the few remaining corporations or "grandma's" out there that use Netscape are going to migrate to Mozilla over Netscape. Do you think ISP's are going to start bundling Moz over Netscape? Really think about the fact that Mozilla is about technology, while Netscape is about a supported end user project. That is the goal of the Mozilla project, to put out great technology, not to replace Netscape.
Personally I think the Netscape 7 "package" finally represents a realthreat to MS. With the new DOJ rules, Netscape/AOL can finally have a real chance at getting some OEM's to not use IE, Outlook, and messenger and WMP. They can just drop in their own products and the end user won't miss a step, since it will be preloaded.
So you all you naysayers, I say your picking the wrong fight.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
Right off their main web page:
"This version does not support Netscape, Opera and Mac."
It also looks like a Windows product, with no Linux version available -- so there are a total of 4 good reasons why we might not want to use it.
In any case, thanks for giving out a reg. key for the thing. Maybe I'll give it a whirl. I tried this product called Ad Killer on my Win XP box already - but I'm about to uninstall it. I get a lot of weird errors in IE 6 that never occured before, and I suspect it's the culprit.
It also kills too many important pop-up windows that aren't advertisements at all. (And if I put it on the lowest level of filtering, too much stuff gets past it.)
In an effort to "do my part", I managed to persuade about a dozen people to install and use Mozilla here at work. Half them instantly declared themselves too lazy to learn a new browser. IE is good enough, they say. The other half doezen loved what I showed them, and installed and used it for about a week. Unfortunately, they went back to IE one by one. Why? There were always one or two sites they visit regularly that didn't work quite right in Mozilla. Of course, in all cases it is the website's fault, but that doesn't change things. For most people, IE is still the path of least resistance. Quality doesnt mean much to them.
Since windows ships with IE, people are going to use IE and people are going to develop for IE. As long as IE is built into Windows, it will be the dominant browser. The fact that IE is so standards non-compliant is no mistake... its keeping the competition in a corner. Some of us don't mind lurking in that corner, but the vast majority won't even find it.
Personally, I can say I am finally attached to Mozilla 1.1 (largely because of OptiMoz). I was a big skeptic of Mozilla until 1.0, but now Mozilla is my browser. Still, there are a few sites out there that I must visit which I have to downshift to IE for.
There has been spell checker for Mozilla for some time now. You can download the mozilla spell checker from mozdev.org.
The site claims that the spellchecker should land in the mozilla tree probably right after 1.0. I guess it's late... but you can still download it yourself.
"I'm The Bounty Bear. I will find him anywhere. I'm searching."
It seems Radio@Netscape depends on popups to work.
I would be very interested to know what slashdot's browser percentages are.
My guess it goes something like...
64% IE (silent majority)
20% Mozilla (loud minority)
10% Opera (for people who like to browse really fast)
5% Konquerer (hey, it came with my distro)
3% Lynx (for people who just can't get enough command lines)
(yeah, it adds up to 102%. The editors can't spell, either)
OS X 10.2 users can expect to see a blank menu bar and no windows opening up, no controls to click, and no menus to select. What a QA travesty! This problem has happened on 3 different machines running Jaguar, so it's clearly a Netscape hairball.
Even MSIE runs when you click on it. Maybe that's how they gained all that market share!
Shut up and eat your vegetables!!!
According to WHOM.
Ceci n'est pas un post
It is a Mozilla addon, you can get it from http://bannerblind.mozdev.org/
:)
It looks at all the images on a page, and checks them against a list of normal banner sizes (which you can modify, add, delete, etc.), and hides the images that match those sizes, thus hiding most banner ads
You can get get the Linux spellchecker.xpi and the Windows spellchk.xpi from the Netscape FTP site along with some other options that aren't included with Mozilla. Yea, I know that there is a spellchecker project for Mozilla but it's not really ready yet - and my wife is really complaining about it.
Anyone stupid enough to choose Netscape over Mozilla deserves exactly what they get. Honestly, the meaning people attach to silly names is just amazing to me.
They're the same damned thing, with bullshit ads tacked on(oh, i'm sorry. "convenient links"), and things AOL doesn't like taken away. What's the freaking point? Just so you can feel safe because it says "Netscape" on the icon?
And don't give me the whole "It's more stable" thing. I use Mozilla every day and it never crashes.
It's not about sharing profiles. That line in prefs.js is what you would set for Netscape 7.0 if you wanted to disable popups. So even if you did not install Mozilla, you could not disable popups that way unless you sacrificed Radio@Netscape.
'nuff said. eh? :)
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
Wondering if they've fixed the extremely annoying habit of Netscape reloading a page from the server every time you resize the window or print it out.
This is my chief complaint against Netscape.
Reloading from the server doesn't do good things when you've filled out some web forms and want to print the page out before you hit "submit."
Why can't the behavior be like IE's where it just re-renders the page from memory cache?
Also, it would be nice if page rendering while printing would be such that the right-hand edge of the page doesn't get cut off (override the page's hard-coded width, for goodness' sake!).
Give me my freedom, and I'll take care of my own security, thank you.
It's true that affect and effect have noun and verb forms each. However, it's also true that 90% of the time, effect is a noun while affect is a verb.
Common usage inclues:
What will be the effects of this action?
What things will this action affect?
Because they are used in a related context so frequently, it does not surprise me that people have trouble with them, hence the simple rule of thumb: effect == noun, affect == verb.
In truth of course, you can 'effect' to bring into being, and something may have an 'affect', meaning an assumed aspect, perhaps even a pretentious one. In practice, these words are uncommon enough (though not rare) that many people are completely unaware of them.
And probably yes, especially Americans. Our poor schools :-(
-josh
AOL surely knows that if it comes down to a fistfight between web designers who Do It Wrong and AOL, AOL will win. There are more AOL users than there are CapitalOne customers. Would AOL get lots of calls? Yes. But CapitalOne would lose customers.
If AOL went with Netscape, broken websites would have to stop crippling non-IE browsers or start losing major traffic.
It's rare that you're presented with a knob whose only two positions are Make History and Flee Your Glorious Destiny.
My translation, but otherwise correct:
Q: The menus at the top of the screen aren't working when I click on them using Opera.
A: Your browser needs to identify itself as MSIE. (Instructions on how to do that).
Result: I must ID as MSIE to use my online bank, so in order to keep things simple it does so *all the time*. Their support doesn't see this as a problem, and don't bother to fix it. And no, I won't change because they're a very good bank otherwise.
Oh, and in case you're wondering, it's www.skandiabanken.no
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
... no, I'm serious.
I use Mozilla myself and wouldn't touch hotmail with a 10 foot pole on my own account. But I have to leave an IE icon on my desktop for my friends to use hotmail. Hotmail gets more hits from my computer than all other IE-only sites combined, and I wouldn't be surprised if that's normal.
So, can anyone answer the question? If the answer is "yes", I'm switching in a heartbeat.
Preferential Voting: easy as 1-2-3
Actually they fixed the broken ass IE5 box model. This was a MAJOR fix. Give them a little credit for fixing the most agonizing part of their PITA implementation of CSS.
Dissolve... Resolve... Evolve...
What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
I mean, Microsoft has a jumping apeshit monkeyman CEO hawking their wares, what does Netscape have?
Heh, I can't help but laugh at all the people saying "I can't believe how well Netscape's site is taking the slashdot effect.
Are you people nuts? Don't you realize that the reason Netscape hasn't been slashdotted is because NO ONE FROM SLASHDOT CARES
Nope, nobody... Not even a Beowolf Cluster of machines running Netscape turns anyone on around here.
Netscape 6 was kicking a dead horse. 7 is grinding its testicles up and putting it in soup Enterprise style.
/^[A-Z0-9._%+-]+@[A-Z0-9.-]+\.[A-Z]{2,4}$/i
That's exactly what I am saying. And they didn't do a bad job with 0.9.4 either, they were just working with what they had to work with. They are done with that now, it's time for a new number.
-BrentUh, I was pointing at the first WD I saw, and I was not referencing any of the draft itself, just the CSS it uses (reletive positioning and CSS counters mostly), which is perfectly normal CSS2.
DOM is not CSS, DOM is a way of accessing the document (and styles) through scripting. The CSS support itself is fine aside from a few rough edges.
What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
Look for these lines in the prefs.js file in your profile directory, and make sure that they have the values indicated below. If the lines don't exist, just copy and paste the lines below into your prefs.js file.
user_pref("capability.policy.default.Window.open", "noAccess");
user_pref("dom.disable_open_during_load", true);
For lots of details about prefs, go here.
That's a large business, not a monopoly. Not even close. Now in some areas, Roadrunner (owned by AOL) has a local monopoly on cable modem access...
I have a large school district about to switch over to Mozilla. They, like many educational institutions, refuse to use IE, instead sticking with Netscape 4.7x (NN6 was unusable).
I had a tech person install Mozilla over Netscape 4.79, and she was instantly impressed.
I believe their numbers are wrong. Not only do I know of several netscape users(which is actually a pretty good test -- most of the time, if I don't know someone with the software, the market share is below 5%), but according to stats reports on several sites I've visited, netscape makes up around 16% of internet users. Perhaps an optimistic number, but not considering that I know so many people who actually use netscape(or a variation, such as mozilla, or galeon, or K-Melelon), it doesn't seem like the nubers given are accurate.
It's been a long time.
The browser stats mentioned are collected by hitbox.com, and come from webbugs. They're used by sites to determine which browsers to market at (at least, thats what hitbox themselves say you should use them for)
If your site gets 80% IE hits, so you decide not to worry about NS compatibility, your site will not get visited by NS users. So your % IE hits will go up.
Doh. The only way to get fair statistics is from a site used by everybody which doesnt discriminate against browsers. The closest thing I know of to this is Google's zeitgeist.
The browser graph doesnt have figures, but relative proportions are obvious:
IE 6 gets about 8 notches
IE 5, 5.5 get about 5 notches each
NS4.x/other seem to have dropped from 2 notches each a couple of months back to 1 notch each;
IE 4 gets about 1/2.
Dividing by 20.5 to get market share:
IE6 39%
IE5.5 19.5%
IE5.0 19.0%
NS4.x 4.8%
Other 4.8% (includes Moz, galeon, etc)
IE4.x 2.4%
If you look at this statistics comparison you'll see that the guesstimates up there are not in violent disagreement with reality, with the exception that the 'source1' stats (assumed to be hitbox or a hitbox-a-like) are scoring low for NS and 'other' compared to all other sources now including google, whereas upsdell.com itself sees an excess of Mozilla hits. I reckon this all adds up to a classic case of self-selection.
I don't see how you can fault IE for not having a complete P3P implementation, when P3P itself is not complete. You can fault Microsoft for insisting that IE be integrated with everything. A bad idea for a bunch of reasons, not the least of which is that it makes holes like this inevitable.
Unfortunately, Microsoft's superintegration approach is being too-thoroughly imitated by the very projects that are supposed to give us an alternative: Mozilla, KDE, and Gnome.
It is a weird world. And the language continues to shift without regard for the 18th century Latin-derived, stuck-up, weren't-really-true-in-the-first-place rules.\
But seriously, WHO uses "enquirey" regularly?
$you = new YOU;
honk() if $you->love(perl)
Mozilla 4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; compatible; Mozilla 5.0; Gecko 2002053012; en-US)
The scripts I use to check browsers actually check for the presence of "Gecko" in the user-agent - if they see "Gecko", they register a "Mozilla based browser" if they can't otherwise determine the user-agent. That way browsers like Galeon get registered as being Mozilla derivatives for the purposes of site design.
Likewise, if they see "Mozilla 4.0 (compatible; MSIE 4.0; compatible; Opera 5.0)" they'll register that as a hit for Opera. So just leave Gecko in there, and you can probably fool most scripts into accepting the browser as being IE while still registering to a human or to more intelligent scripts the presence of a Mozilla-based browser.
You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
Like anyone can afford the new MS development environments. Nobody can. And who's going to program on linux languages? There's a hell of a lot more money in development for windows, simply because more people use it, and more people need "simplistic" front ends that do complex things.
Companies like Microsoft don't even turn a profit really off of home users anyways, it's the businesses and client licenses where the money is at, so paying for a peice of software at the client level is just ridiculous.
Furthermore, Why not give out the key? It's not like it's hard to find anyways, at least it saves you a few minutes of search time. Geez, you should perhaps be happy that he's actually helping you save time.
It's a shame how this always happens.
The release of Netscape 7.0 is overshadowing the (much more important) release of Netscape 4.8! It's so fresh, there isn't even a page for the release notes.
By the time Netscape 15.2.1.4.1 is released (2 months from now), we may finally be up to Netscape 4.9!
On a serious note, I wish Netscape didn't go the Mozilla route. While I love that their browser is open source, their real browser product (Netscape 4.x) is still widely used, is closed source, and is getting neglected in favor of Mozilla, despite many features Netscape 4 has, that Mozilla hasn't. This is not to mention that Netscape 4 performs so much better than Mozilla, or that the Netscape 4 interface is still better than Mozilla.
Mozilla is more like software produced through staff meetings. It tries to be everything to everyone, so now no one uses it exclusively. Everyone might use it, but always in conjunction with the old Netscape, or some other browser.
Mozilla just didn't work out. I think that with a fraction of the work, features and stability fixes could have been added to Netscape 4 that would have allowed it to take back the desktop.
This is not flame-bait, nor is it a Troll... If it was, I would be posting at +2. So, if you disagree with me, at least reply, and let me know why. Anonymous moderations don't teach anyone, anything.
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
NS rewrote because their entire browser had reached the end of it's realistic design lifespan.
:)
Opera rewrote because their engine has reached the end of it's realistic design lifespan.
I said "rather like", and gee, it is, because this is one of the main reasons for rewriting
No sweat. (Sweate? :) The extra "e" is popping up enough in google to potentially be an alternate spelling, somewhere. Sure surprised me, though.
$you = new YOU;
honk() if $you->love(perl)
P.S. This is the voice of the Slashdot.
Our lawyers are going to sue you suckas for deep linking without our permission.
We need the money from litigation because no-one went for our subscription idea and instead block our adverts with mozilla.
Note to moderators- this is almost on-topic!
graspee