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Upgrading Training and Certification?
"I checked out just about every 'school' offering training and placement in the New York City area, and frankly each of them almost had me running screaming into the night. Atrocious facilities, hot, stuffy, cramped classrooms and teachers whose every other words are 'memorize this--it will be on the test.'
Most places were shocked when I said I didn't care about certifications and exams. I explained that I need not just the theory but some hands-on experience with hardware that I don't have access to at home, and knowledge sufficient to at least get me something entry-level once again.
I learn best by demonstration and instruction so CBT CD-ROMs and 'go-read-a-book' aren't viable options for me. Since I'm not currently employed, I also need some form of placement assistance as well. Frankly, I didn't think this was too much to ask for until I really started looking. I looked at Learning Tree specifically, but their policies are strictly business-to-business training, not to individuals."
Several coworkers, and myself, have taken courses with ITI. [www.iti.com] I've been impressed by the breadth and depth of knowledge they come out of the course with. I've always been disappointed by courses that skim the surface, or that pander to the lowest common denominator in the class. Instead, ITI tends to weed out those who can't keep up, rewarding the bright folks who pay attention.
Perhaps try seeing if you can get a non-profit organization to go along with you. They provide some of the hardware, and you 'learn on the fly'?
Why not check out some local community colleges?
Many have expensive hardware that you can play with and will teach you lots of stuff that would never even be on one of those exams.
..Free Live Free...
It has been my experience (and others that I know) that getting a job is a lot easier if you know someone at the place you want work at. If they have enough swag to put in a good word for you, that foot in the door could push your resume to the top of the stack. Cold calls are a rough way to go.
Training? Necessary.. but experience is king.
Speak truth to power.
You didn't discuss this in your article, but do you have a college education or are you self-taught? This isn't 1999 anymore, the job market is right. Really tight. Virtually every job ad I've looked at required *at least* a BS, and many even want a masters. It may not even matter how much experience you have or how good you are, someone with a BS probably has an edge over you (if you don't have one). Assuming you don't have a BS, I would start taking classes at one of the many fine universities in NYC. CUNY is a cheap public university in NYC, if price is a big concern. If you do have a BS, think about a masters or maybe take the teachers advice on going for certifications. These days, paper chasing may get you a job faster than hands-on experience.
Karma: Excellent (In Soviet Russia, karma pimps YOU)
Not exactly. It's worthless for getting a job, but mine demands that I have it.
And I have been turned down for temp work, rollouts and what not, for lack of it.
If you are looking for Solaris training, go right to Sun. Their courses are not cheap ($2500-3000 per class) but you get hands-on, books that are worth their weight in gold, and a good feel for Solaris. And the other benefit of coughing up that kind of cash is that only people "who want to be there" will be present. My previous job gave us three weeks of Solaris training (not by Sun), and three of us spent most of that time training everybody else! I wouldn't worry about Cisco training, there are lots of CCNA's out of work. And although many people will tell you "learn Linux", I think having some education and experience with a major vendor's product is more helpful (in my case Solaris and AIX). But that is just my opinion.
I took the CCNP Boot Camp at Global Knowledge a little over a year ago and was very happy. A lot of hands on work with some of the best instructors I've ever had. We covered a lot of real world scenarios that I use constantly now.
:)
I absolutely hate certification mills, and this wasn't one. Good facilities with plenty of lab equipment to go around. They also bring in snacks, which were great.
Training is about passing the cert exams. Why? That's what most people want.
People want the certs because they think its the key to a job. Or people need the certs, because their PHBs require them to get/keep/update certs.
PHBs want certs because it shows they're hiring a "qualified" workforce. HR people screen for certs because they're usually too ignorant to look for anything else, and they all have nice acronyms they can type into search engines.
If you want to actually *learn* something, most IT training isn't the place to find it. Cisco training by and large is pretty good, but it still focuses a lot on "Psst, it's on the CCNA test". I've taken MS training that's been OK, although the "learning" was something that could have been compressed into 2 days, minus the bullshit and compulsory 20 minute cig breaks every 60 minutes.
I think the best learning is the hardest kind; pounding your head against the CRT until the manpages, HOWTOs and other stuff sink in and you can actually string stuff together. It's incredibly frustrating and time consuming compared to having someone teach you, but AFAIK there's no one actually *teaching* most of what most admins do.
I recommend purchasing a 1700 router and/or a 2900 switch from ebay. You can set up configurations, learn the CLI and play around. Flash the rom, reload the O/S. All that. The cost is less - be patient and you can get a 2900 for less than $400 like I did.
After the test you can resell it for what you got or you can keep it and use it in your home. Can't do either with a class.
. This sig unintentionally left blank. I meant to put something here, but I'm busy.
You and me both have been out of work since 2k...
Any drive up 101 in the bay area would tell you that the economy here evaporated like the water in the salt marshes out in the bay. The mass exodous of people OUT of the bay area since the crash hasn't helped things at all either, since the companies they are retreating from either closed shop, outsourced in some manner (domestic or foriegn) or they've made the coders become coder/tech writer/IT persons/janitors all rolled into one.
I hate to say it, but IT people seem like more of a perk to companies so the coders don't have to take on that roll. Unfortunatly having 20 coders arguing over the network setup usually results in a half-assed network that we IT guys end up cleaning up in the end when the company caves in and decides to make a budget for IT again.
After working for PHB's for 8 years, me and my IT buds are burnt out. Working for people you KNOW are dumber than you eventually might bring you to this conclusion..
If I know i'm smarter than this jackass who can't copy and paste something into his powerpoint presentation, then why is HE the boss, and why am I his lackey?
So my advice to you is don't worry about the job market right now in IT. Most companies are outsoucing IT to save money, so you could go down, file a ficticous business name for 40 bucks and be in business. Be your own telemarketer, call up the CFO's of companies in your area and ask them if they would like to "outsource" IT. PHB's love that buzzword "Outsource"
A lot of community colleges have arrangements with Cisco to be authorized to teach thier Academy Program. The CCNA Academy alone is 4 semesters, so you can see they're aren't skipping much. And the end of the 4 semesters, you get to take the cert at like 1/3 the cost. Heck, if I remember correctly, they'll even give you a second attempt at the same price.
Finally, math books without any of that base 6 crap in them.
ITI is useless. You leave there with about $30k in student debts and in a field where the hiring is very weak.
I've met some really bright people that came from ITI, but the majority I've met (80%) are people who feel that they're supposed to earn a wad a cash without proving themselves. It sucks that one pays so much for schooling but that doesn't give you a right to demand a massive salary or delude yourself that you're better qualified.
Go to Sheridan College or some other technical school. It's cheaper, more well-rounded, and has placement people who actually care for you to get a good job.
"NT-based sysadmin"
<CTRL> <ALT> <DEL>
I found that registering a business name and a business license is the _best_ form of certification.
Certification means "To confirm as genuine". People are more apt to believe someone with a business card can fix their computer woes than a stack full of resumes littered with acronyms (CNE, MCSE, CCNA, A+, WYSIWYG, ad infinitum ad nauseum)
If you know your stuff and can fix a clients problem, it doesn't matter what your certification is. All people want are results.
Ruby on Rails Screencast
If you didn't mention you were unemployed, I'd say apply to your local university and get a B.S. in Information Systems Management or something similar. From what I've seen, most IT positions these days require a B.S. in a computer related field. A degree in ISM can be your ticket into a nice job. Plus, most Universities have great job placment programs.
However since you said you were unemployed, all I can say is get some student loans and/or hit up the local Junior College for some supplemental education. You'll have better luck their than at most of these technical colleges that advertise on tv.
Ok here is the skinny from my experience and flame away. But if you do it this way you can grab a lot of certs and learn a lot along the way. Nothing is better than real world experience but a little paper behind you doesn;t hurt.
A+ - Everyone and is brother does have it. So get it anyway. One book and one week studying. Took the tests back to back. Shows you have some basic hardware knowledge. Cause hardware and software knowledge don't exactly walk hand in hand.
Net+ - Another easy one but really good in the sense of getting you up to speed on networking essentials. Subnetting, IP, the language and eqipment.
Linux + - Learn the fundementals of Linux - Pass the test. Good starting block for your RHCE.
RHCE- Do I need to explain this one? Red Hat is the industry standard Linux at the moment.
AS for the MS stuff. It is good to have the hands on experience and the classes as well. the 2000 and net stuff is not all that easy. The 4.0 was a walk in the park. Professional and server are easy exams. But AD and the other ones are a bitch because they expect you to have experience with the product. And the exams are adaptive, very hard to teach the test with these. And also whose fault is it if you but cheat sheets?
I am a fairly good Linux Admin, and a Fairly good Linux admin. I do not code. Don't want to. I just like keeping the highways a rolling. I don't care what you drive on them.
But I will say this. A good Linux admin will not be a good windows admin and vice versa. Because both will be predisposed to see all bad in the opposite product. I look at windows and linux for the respective uses of each. Do not tie yourself down with one. Stay off of OS bandwagons. Learn as much as you can about both. Or any OS you can.
I find myself time and time again sitting in the middle of the fence. My linux pals who dog Windows cause, they ***gasp*** cant admin it, and are too proud to ask someone or check MSDN. Or the Windows bunch who are stuck on reinstall when something craps out.
Puto
The Revolution Will Not Be Televised
You're right. But I would never hire someone who is "self-taught". HR would never even pass the resume to me, because they would take a lot of heat if that person turned out to be a dud.
There's way too many people looking for jobs with a vast amount of education. I'd wouldn't resort with someone who is self-taught unless he/she 10+ years of experience and amazing references.
Well, this may be a little off-topic, but when I was hiring (current position doesn't involve it), I NEVER looked for certifications. Never, ever, ever. It almost counted against somebody if they emphasized certs too much. Of course, that was me, and it's a fact of life that a lot of companies do look at them.
More to the point, though, is that hiring in IT is practically at a standstill right now, and it's not limited to Silicon Valley. As technology progresses, people are learning to do the job with fewer people. Five years ago, you'd figure one IT guy to support about 30 seats. Now it's more like one person per 70-90 seats. And the inrush of people during the bubble years means that the supply/demand balance is incredibly out of whack. My old boss in SF was the best I've ever worked for, he has the best connections you could have out there, 15+ years of big name experience, and he's been out of work for 18 months. So right now, it doesn't matter what you have on your resume, if you're not currently working, or don't know somebody who's hiring, it's going to be incredibly hard to get a job in IT. I wouldn't spend a nickle of my own money getting certified, because right now it just isn't going to help. A lot of the ads you see posted are just there so the hiring manager can say he did a thorough search, but odds are he already knows who he wants to hire.
There are some things you will only learn by having hand on experience with an actual router in your hands. Back in the day, it seemed like all the classes and training were using the 2501 for testing. I wanted to pipe in and mention a very good software simulator of a small LAN environment.
http://www.boson.com/netsim/
Ive used this software, and it is really good. You can drag and drop different routers and connect them up through swtiches or serial cables and run through all the commands of setting up a connection. Setup RIP, IGRP static routes, etc.. It feels very much like being logged in to a cisco router.
How much money are you planning on spending? If you want really excellent training, it's going to cost a fair amount of money. Usually around $1500-$2500 ish a week. And you have to decide what you want training in. If you're interested in Solaris, Sun offers a bunch of classes in several New York facilities. Here's a link to their training site: Sun Solaris Training
The couple of classes I've had from Sun have been quite good. Some hands on on equipment that I don't own myself at clean facilities with knowlegable instructors. If you want Linux training, probably the easiest/best place to get it is from Red Hat. They also have a site in NYC, in the financial district, and they provide lunch every day (very cool). Their classes also have hands on labs, but the equipment isn't anything that you wouldn't have at your own house. They teach their classes on PCs. Red Hat's site is Red Hat Leaning Services
Going to the product manufacturer is usually the best way to get top notch training, I'm just using Sun and Red Hat as examples, they have been the ones that I was most happy with. They, product manufacturers, hire instructors who are familiar with the product and who can answer a fair amount (maybe even all) of your questions. And unlike CBT, can provide alternative explanations when the one they use just doesn't get through to you.
The big problem with going to these classes is that, while good, they can be prohibitively expensive. If this is a limiting factor for you, then someone above suggested Community College. I think that this was an excellent suggestion. They are far less expensive, but it's been my experience that the instruction is not always as good.
-Runz
Perhaps the problem is in that "Over 800 resumes" in one year.
As someone who does first line review and decisions of candidates, I can say with certainly that a resume that appears to be crafted to address each need that we state in the ad is more likely to get considered. Obviously, there are limits to this, but you may want to consider more closely the idea of putting more effort into fewer resumes, rather than a blanketing of 800 or so.
*everything* is Orwellian to cats.
I have just come back from the first part of a Java course at City University. The teacher emphasised that he was not grooming us for the Sun Exam, rather the concepts of OO modelling etc. The course cost £240 (about $350 USD) for ten weeks of two hours a week lessons.
per mere, per terras
As an instructor for a little-training-company-that could, TechSkills, I agree with much that's been said about the glut of CompTIA (and Microsoft, for that matter) certified individuals. However, it should be very clear that the glut is irrelevant to HR depts.
To answer the original question, I refer you to the link above. ;)
I'm currently based in Phoenix, but TechSkills has thirty-some branches around the states, and, of course, distance-learning options.
And, yes, we do more than just 'teach to the exams'.
-ELf: A+, Network+, i-Net+, Linux+, CCNA, MCIWA, MCSASi tibi te corpus pulchrum habere narrem, habeasne id contra me?
If you don't know how to code then you are not a good linux or any *nix admin. That's the sad and sorry truth. You may be competent, but you are definitely not good.
..Free Live Free...
Since you mentioned Solaris, I will point out that the Sun training classes I have been to were all superb. Sun's professors all have related college degrees and years of real experience. Classrooms are top-notch, with Sun boxes on well-configured networks. The books are actually useful, although some are the size of phone books. Sun's tests are designed around the courses and vice-versa, so you can take the class, actually learn something, and then get certified.
Sun's education program does have some downsides. First and formost, the classes are expensive, ranging from 2000 to 4000 dollaris. Second, Sun's certification exams suck, and some of them appear to have be written by people with a very poor grasp of the english language; some of the questions on the Solaris 7 Exam part II were so poorly written that none of the answers made sense.
If you want to try Sun, check out http://suned.sun.com.
One more piece of advice, many people in training are there because of new project ramp-ups, and have employers who are hiring, so take resumes on paper, floppy, and CD.
I have been in the IT industry for 8 years, I have 5 certifications. Only one of those is still on my resume (though they are all still valid). In my experience people don't want to see certifications they want experience.
I would suggest
1. find a direction, UNIX, Networking (Cisco etc..), programming (what ever language)
2. try to simulate a working environment at home, buy cheap equipment on eBay, etc..
3. study for the exam but don't go to the classes (they are mostly useless), Use your setup at home to simulate a working environment.
4. get books (at least 3 on the subject) and study materials on the subject of choice and dig deep, devour all the material on said subject cover to cover twice.
This process will really teach you,
Most of the time things learned quickly are lost quickly.
I know it sounds trivial and off topic but I'm serious. Check your resume.
Unless you're horribly unqualified or applying for jobs that're totally out of your league, you should have got at least a few responses off 800 resumes - assuming they're great resumes.
I went through 6 months of searching, ending a little over a year ago. About the only thing that really changed from the beginning, where I was getting no responses, to the end, where I was getting [relatively] regular ones, was the resume. Sure, I worked on my skillsets but self-taught Perl wasn't what made the difference.
The point is, I started by writing great resumes that focused on everything I, as a tech, thought was valuable. Unfortunately, what's valuable to a tech and what gets you employed as a tech are two totally different things.
You put down that you have JSP, the HR department that're told to look for a web programmer with Java&JSP will discount you because you don't have "Java" - the other techs will never see the resume to realise the mistake. You put down a list of dry technical skills (because it's a tech position, after all) and the "manager" of the department who has a business degree and no IT experience won't hire you because they're looking for a team player. You try listing every technical skill and spill on to a third page - it gets thrown in the trash by someone who's received 300 resumes and doesn't want the hassle of reading to the last page where you mention the valuable stuff or they skip straight to the middle and miss the things you carefully put at the front.
Those O'Reilly books that have been tempting you will be one of the best investments you've ever made once you're working. Until then, a really good resume book is probably more valuable.
I honestly believe that, stupid as it may be, a perfect resume will get a significantly less skilled person a job much faster in the current flooded market than a significantly more skilled person with an "adequate" resume.
Like I said at the start, unless you're applying way out of your league, with 800 refusals, your resume is almost certainly good but not the perfect example that you need in the current market.
Haha. Yeah... real insecure about Americans. Take a look around!
I faced a similar problem of hitting a wall of advancement and went back to school. I'm attending a real state university where I'm upgrading my Computer Information Systems associate degree to a Computer Science bachelor degree (with both math and business administration as minors).
Real universities will have fully stocked computer labs. Many are Microsoft or Cisco affiliated training partners so if you want to get the enterprise software (Exchange, IIS, MOM) or have a lab full of nice Catalyst routers to play with they are the place to go.
Most human resources people will perk up at an accredited university on a resume than someplace like Learning Tree or Global Knowledge.
obviously no deficiencies vs. no obvious deficiencies
Most of the people I know who are self taught and have 4 or more years experience are normally way better than those people with some sort of certificate/diploma. They're more motivated, they think more for themselves, they work harder and they generally know and understand things better as they've had to figure it out rather than learning buzz words. I have a degree in Comp Sci, but my mentor at my first job who didn't have any formal training was probably the best C++ programmer I've ever met or worked with. I've six years more experience since then and I'm still looking for colleagues as good as he was (is??)
I'm a trainer. I teach Comptia (A+, N+, Server+) and Microsoft (the MCSE/MCSA ones) exams.
I'm not *really* a trainer. I'm a guy who has a whole bunch of certifications. I have about six years of experience as a consultant-type, but I'm doing training now. Training means not have to look for work every x months, and I like that.
Here's the deal: Nearly as I can tell, there are about three different types of training out there. There is "diploma mill" training, the MCSE in 2-weeks or your money back bullshit. Maybe that works for smoeone who is already an MCSE. It doesn't help the guy who hasn't touched a PC in three years.
There's also "softball" training. Teach straight out of a book, do gentle lessons, and hope students are smart enough to pick up the slack with their own motivation. For some people, a step in the right direction is good enough. Mostly, though, training of this sort isn't going to lead to long-term retention of information, and it's of dubious use for certification exams. I started out teaching this way.
The last way to teach is never-ending lab exercises. This requires students motivated and interested in the material (i.e. do the reading beforehand) and a LOT of time. You'll retain more knowledge of a complex process if you've actually carried it out. The important thing an instructor can add here is overarching understanding of the process. Following a recipie online is great for getting the job done, but a good teacher can explain WHY things are the way they are, and deeper understanding should hopefully transfer to general success on these exams, even if you miss a point here or there. Of course, if you're OK with the "big picture", you can probably get just as far in the lab you have set up at home. I don't always have time to do the labs I want during class, but I always make time before and/or after for extra lab work, on top of normal classroom time. It helps my students a lot.
Of course, every training place will tell you their stuff is hands on. That certainly isn't the case. Ask to sit in on a class or two. If you're paying $2000 for a class, they shouldn't have any problem with that. Judge for yourself.
Finally, places that trumpet unusually high pass-rates are probably doing something slightly unethical to get them. I've heard stories. I'm sure others have, too.
Whatever the subject, if you're paying for a class, what you're paying for is a knowledgable instructor and adequate facilities. Those are things you can't judge without some first-hand experience.
Other things: Seems to me that the most respected IT certs all have a hands-on component. Master CNE, RHCE, most Cisco exams. Something to keep in mind when you become the 1,000,000th person to pass 70-210.
A great generalist IT guy is an awesome resource to have, but I always tell my students that it's a hard row to hoe. I always suggest to my students that becoming an expert in a subject besides Windows Support or hardware repair, will probably get them more attention within the field than bog-standard A+/N+/MCSE certs.
-- I wanna decide who lives and who dies - Crow T. Robot, MST3K
Two things: (a) keep your reading up. Never slack off on that, and (b) be willing to take on work beneath your skills and do more than you're asked. If you can't get a promotion you can leverage the experience for the next job.
One of the things that helps (I've read a *lot* of resumes) is to emphasize things you've done, not tools you've used; e.g. "I'm helping to build a cathedral" rather than "I'm laying bricks" point of view. Treat the tools you know as incidental to the job of helping your employer achieve their aims.
Thou hast damnable iteration, and art indeed able to corrupt a saint - Henry IV, Act I scene II
I opened up my school two years ago to combat exactly the type of experience that he's talking about. I was a technical trainer for a few years, and kept getting fired from all of the centers (you can't call them schools) I worked at, because I always added things to the curriculum, extended classes longer than they were supposed to, badmouthed the terrible equipment that was used at these centers, etc.
At my school, I still teach courses, and I have my instructors teach in the same way that I do. For example, in my MCSE classes, we teach the students how to install several different flavors of *nix and 3 different versions of netware, then teach them how make them all play nice with each other. Our MS SQL classes teach MySQL and Oracle. Every student gets a server to play with, etc. Our courses are all taught in hands-on labs, where the instructors' lecture is immediately applied to the machine in front of the student. Our philosophy is to teach you how to do your job and to be prepared for any eventuality. The exams are an afterthought to the knowledge of how to make things run.
I realize that my school is in the minority. The majority of my local competitors are churn and burn certification factories. The difference is that I am a teacher and a geek, while the owners of other schools are either glorified sales people or businessmen with no understanding of the technology education process. I believe you when you say that the majority of schools you've seen are like that.
My advice is to attend a school where they use multiple resources in class, not just the vendor approved curriculum. Only take courses from instructors with broad experience. If possible, attend a school where geeks, trainers and technologists are in decision-making positions. New york should have at least ONE education-oriented technical school that's not an churn and burn. And above all, READ THE ENROLLMENT CONTRACT! That's where they'll screw you.
Good luck with finding an ethical and qualified technical training school. Lord knows I try to make mine as perfect (i.e. education and student friendly, not existing for the sole purpose of profit and churning) as possible.
Governments are not necessary.
Oracle 9i for private individuals is free
buy a 50$ DBA book and sit down and learn that shit
As with online job resumes... here's a tip i picked up. Don't bother.. You go online only to find the listing. However most times you will see an email too. Better to submit your resume directly ALONG WITH A COVER LETTER!!!
A cover letter is very important and make sure you triple check it for grammar spelling and all those other stupid nonsense u may normally say.
Landing the interview is all about the presentation. Make sure you present yourself in your cover letter. If you think you know oracle after doing it on your own make sure your resume reflects this. Look on the net on how to write a technical resume as oppose to your say business resume
The NY market is far from flat
I have yet to meet anyone I know personally who couldn't get a job in the IT market in NY.
Sayeth the parent:
What does a degree show? That you can put up with 4 years of BS instead of a few months in the case of a certification. It's not like I learned anything at my degree--I just spent 4 years and thousands of dollars to get a piece of paper that no-one's ever asked to see anyway. A degree means you were protected from the real world for 4 more years while you spent weekends partying and making out with girls. I'm not saying that's a bad way to spend 4 years, but is it any real factor on which to base a hiring decision?
Sayeth me:
I don't know where you went, but a) the school will influence the difficulty of your coursework and b) what you get out of school, like pretty much anything else, will depend heaviliy on what you put into it.
There's BS everywhere, nearly. It creeps between people, but it doesn't mean that's all that was there.
I didn't get my degree becasue someone might want to "see it", but becasue I wanted to learn. Granted, I needed it to get into grad school, but I didn't just stumble through, I worked, and I got a lot out of it. I know quite a few other people who had the same experience, so I'm not alone in this. I also didn't spend my weekends partying and making out with girls. Guys, maybe.
This isn't necessarily the best thing to base a hiring decision on, but it's really hard to have interviews with all of the 5000 people applying for each spot...
Lea
I think it's silly to think that no one is hiring. People get promoted, die, move on, and all of that sort of thing. But it's hard to have something on your resume that people respect. For myself, there were only a couple certs that gave immediate cred - CCIE, and one of the SANS certs. CCIE because the wannabe-to-actual ratio was high; and the SANS certs because you can go and view the paper that got them the certification. SANS papers can give you a real insight into what people are used to working with.
I went through a turning point in my career some time in 1998. I was a Novell CNE, and it became obvious to me that I needed to get an MCSE to stay competitive in the systems administration/integration job market. And so I set out to do so.
I knew enough about Novell to see the stupid games commercial software vendors play with each other at the expense of the customer and the sanity of consultants hired to make sense of the mess. Starting on the MCSE training track was sufficient to raise my level of disgust to the point that I began questioning my career. My impression was that the industry was soulless, that hard work was not rewarded, and that the only way to make money in the business was to take advantage of customers and profit by their ignorance.
Just as I was thinking of opening a restaurant, the nagging love that I'd always had for working with computers took hold, so I set myself to the task of reinventing myself.
I'd started playing with Linux just a few months before, and was hopelessly inept, but found that it had rekindled my love for working with computers. Up to this point, however, I'd never considered it more than a hobby. I remembered, however, that my original decision to pursue IT was not a matter of economics, but because I really loved it. I got into computers because of the joy of programming on my C64. Long before computers were cool; long before I even knew I could make money working with them, I loved them. I realized that my hobby with Linux was in keeping with my beginnings in computers, but that I'd been restricting the time I spent with it so that I could keep up with the latest interopability problems with Groupwise and Exchange.
I already knew I couln't go to another training class; that I couldn't pick up another trade rag; that I couldn't spend the rest of my career begging support reps to tell me the secrets of making shit work that are known only in internal documents, protected by inane marketing concerns. So despite how stupid a move it seemed at the time, I had no choice but to spend my downtime studying Linux. I started my career following my interests, and I knew I had to keep doing so.
Then, the bottom fell out of the IT industry. In 2001, the company I was with was absorbed by another one, and in the process about 90% of the original staff was eventually hemorrhaged. I saw the writing on the wall before it really got bad, and managed to round up enough solo Linux work to get out while they were still in the mood to beg me to stay. I refused. I did solo Linux consulting for a while, then landed a hot job with a very successful network outfit. I now work exclusively in Linux, writing network automation scripting and performing enterprise security audits. I've remained employed throughout the recession thus far, and my income has steadily increased.
Do what you love. The rest will follow. Life's too short to deal with bullshit.
I live in Seattle. Now, I don't know if NYC's job market is different that Seattle, but I know that Seattle's job market is very bad. I have an A+, MCP, CCNA, and AA degree in IT / Networking. I have sent hundreds of resumes and applications to any tech position in Seattle. Let me tell you, I got no replies. Check out my article (link below) that was printed in my school newspaper... i wasted about 3 years of my life... http://www.handsometechs.com/hardwaregod/articles/ ITDisappointment.htm
Yes, it's true. You're dreaming. You are in a fictional bubble world where jobs exist in the computer industry (particularly NYC, of all places to expect such a thing to be the case!), minimal computer knowledge (a single OS - Windows, at that), minimal applicable networking knowledge, an unrealistic expectation of educational facilities and organizations, and a truely truely perverse view of what you think you're worth to the economy.
First off: where have you been? The economy has been in increased recession for the last two years, nearly. I know of people in large metropolitan areas who have 4 year CS degrees at prestigious schools, plus 2+ years of high level administration experience making 22.5k USD a year, with no benefits.
Meanwhile, here you are, a -Windows- administrator (do not even think of calling that a sysadmin - sysadmin is a UNIX has always been UNIX-specific), just expecting for someone to bight your resume? I've got news for you: if you haven't figured out yet after sending out even 400 applications that you're under-qualified for the kinds of jobs you're applying for, you need a serious reality adjustment.
If anything, the type of job you've applied for is the type that companies are cutting back on the most, relying on a skeleton crew until the recession ends.
If you really want to work with computers, -try- and get a tech support job. I wish you luck. You'll need it.
I know of quite a few people who are stellar programmers, experienced UNIX sysadmins and windows administrators - your all-around qualified individuals for pretty damned near anything you could put them to - who are working tech-support level jobs right now because there's just nothing else in the field available. Given your (apparent) mindset, you'd be bantha fodder against people like this, even with 4 more years of schooling.
Now, I too find I learn in the same fashion that you do - it only makes sense, because most humans do. It's the way we've been designed, evolved - whatever. The point being, what you're asking for is direct hands-on tutlage or an apprenticeship. If it's apprenticeship you want, seek out a company and ask to pay them to work under strict supervision of their dominant sysadmin. That's probably your best chance.
Here is my honest and most sincere advice for you: forget about computers. There are many, many more qualified people, many, many more -skilled- people. It's a recession, for crying out loud - one that doesn't promise to let up for a while, either, as any Econ 101 student would be able to tell you. Use your head and go to school for something that's got a fairly high failsafe level with a diverse career choice after graduation - like a business or telecommunications major. You've already demonstrated your lack of head for computers by asking one too many stupid questions.
~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
NYLXS [nylxs.com]
OK
The Gnu/Linux 1 class, the Unix 1, class, the Perl 1 class, and others have all been superb. You are being taught by instructors who know what they teach, in an active, hands on environment. It is backed by an active mailing list, a learn list, an announcements list, Inservices that present various free software services and applications that are free to attend, business demos [nylxs.com], and more. Richard Stallman has dropped in on classes, inservices, and other events from time to time, and David Sugar (Bayonne telephony Project)and others have held inservices and dropped in on meetings and classes as well.
The philosophy behind NYLXS (which is in the process of becomming a non-profit entity) is that open source is useful and productive, should be promoted by everyone, and can only grow larger. The funds raised from classes will go to promoting free/open source software.
If you look at the mass push behind free/open source software in other countries, in companies and schools across America, and in various agencies, their eyes are either slowly being opened, or are being jammed wide open at the benefits for running free/open source software. It can no longer be denied that gnu/linux has a huge momentum behind it, and must be a part of everyone's toolbox from now on.
NYLXS teaches the nitty-gritty of what you need to know to get the job done. You can take individual classes, or take an entire program and get discounts. At the end of several classes, you will have a working server, which can be setup to do anything you want, apache, mail, file/print, etc. You will also have the knowledge you need to go forward as a sys admin, or whatever other computer related job you choose, or for just your own knowledge.
They have Gnu/Linux 1/2, Unix 1/2, Perl 1/2, C, Gimp, Open Office, and other classes as well. Every class is taught by someone who uses the software daily as their main operating system/application, and they may be using it as the main software in their profession, or they may be using it as an aid to pick up where other software falls flat on its face.
NYLXS [nylxs.com] also has a free software chamber of commerce, where they provide solutions for businesses using free/open source software, and which also gives the students who go through the training an opportunity to obtain employment, allows the students to make important business contacts, etc.
NYLXS [nylxs.com] will be present and have a booth at LinuxWorld [tradeshownews.com] in NYC. NYLXS membership was instrumental at the events that occured on July 17, 2002 at the Commerce Committee hearing for drm/other controls [nylxs.com], which had the direct effect of stalling the legislation, and opening up the process to what was previously a good 'ol boys process of enacting legislation behind closed doors.
Any sys admin, or anyone maintaining computers in a large user environment who does not know how to use and administer Gnu/Linux systems will be at a handicap when trying to sell themselves. I am aware of the environments of many companies, and for the larger (more than 10-15 seats) companies, they are virtually all experimenting with gnu/linux servers at least at a minimal level. They are just getting their feet wet at some of these companies, but as they become more familiar, and as they realize the benefits, they will become more and more involved with gnu/linux.
If you only know ms products, and are having trouble finding work, you must realize why. If you only know free software, you will also have trouble finding work. But sys admins and other techies that know both, and are comfortable with both, will have an easier time under any possible scenario.
Check out NYLXS [nylxs.com], especially the pages under the Free Software Institute [nylxs.com], and see what they offer. Their prices are very good, you get a working computer as part of the classes (which is used in the classes), you get access to numerous distributions, and you get a first rate education that is not taught to any test.
Complete one of the sequences, and then study the questions that are on the LPI exam [lpi.org], and you shouldn't have any problem passing the LPI exam when you are done with an NYLXS sequence.
http://www.mrbrklyn.com/amsterdam.html http://www.brooklyn-living.com
If you think a BS requires any form of intelligence, I'd have to conclude you're either an idiot or an ignoramus.
Oh yeah, a degree requires NO work at all, you're totally right. I mean, what are exams? Nothing. Surely, having 6 3-hour exams in a week ranging all over subjects you've learnt in the last 3 years does not require any intelligence whatsoever. And maths is piss, too. What is it with these people and Legendre polynomials, that they think they're so hard... they must all be completely brainless.
Grow up: You've clearly got some sort of jealousy towards degrees... obviously you don't have one.
What do degrees prove? Depends on the university, but from a good uni in a sience subject (I did physics at Oxford Uni in England) they certainly prove that:
1) You can work a fuckload when you need to
2) You can learn very complex stuff - ie there won't be anything you will meet in your working life that you can't learn
Those two alone seem to me to be quite crucial for your working life. Who wants to hire someone when they don't know whether that person will be able to evolve and be worth keeping in the future? No one likes to lay off people (well, except the sadists, but those are rare).
Daniel
Carpe Diem
For instance, I write about 95% of my code these days in Python. I'm really good at Python. Yeah, I know, a good programmer can learn any language quickly, and knowledge of a language doesn't make you a good programmer. But it makes a big difference for productivity. It also means that you can get more attention in those jobs that require your specific skill. My experience in other languages is very important to me, but there's another kind of experience that you can only achieve with expertise.
The jack of all trades is sometimes called for. But the jack of all trades must rely on networking -- because there's a lot of them out there. Sure, some are better than others, but you're still just an IT handyman. You'll need to distinguish yourself with something other than your resume.
The specialist may have only a small pool of jobs they are right for. But they are very right for those jobs. You can be good, you can attain real expertise in your field, people outside of your workplace might even know who you are. If you aren't good at networking through personal connections, then specialization is the only way you'll become networked.
Of course, you're betting on the technology, and if you bet long enough you'll always lose. Becoming a Tcl expert a while ago would have probably worked well, but now it's tanked. The mainframe specialists are all having hard times now. Eventually you'll become out of date, so you have to know when to jump ship for another specialty.
In NYC a local Linux group, NYLXS, provides the best value for money training that I have found. www.nylxs.com
I am a dimwit and incompetent, so is my mother and neither of us has an A+ Cert so get your facts right!!!