GNOPPIX: Bootable GNOME CD

Why is this useful? by ViolentGreen · 2003-09-12 07:56 · Score: 0, Insightful

I guess I just don't get it.

--
Not everything is analogous to cars. Car analogies rarely work.

Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 07:59 · Score: 0

Yup, pretty much it's just that you don't get it.
Re:Why is this useful? by AchmedHabib · 2003-09-12 08:03 · Score: 5, Insightful

OS on a CD can be very useful when you try to rescue a system. Having a fully working system with all the tools at hand and access to the broken one, can save hours of work.
You boot the CD and get everything including network access, I have sometimes attached a USB (v2!) harddisk and transferred data to that one, or maybe a partition(with partimage).
Re:Why is this useful? by twistedcubic · 2003-09-12 08:05 · Score: 0, Redundant

I think Americans got tired of pressing the "(" character for the "=" character on the boot options line, hence the fork.
Re:Why is this useful? by Paul+Neubauer · 2003-09-12 08:22 · Score: 2, Informative

It's as useful as Knoppix, or should be. The thing here isn't so much about usefulness, after all Knoppix already does the job, but about preferences. Some people will simply prefer Gnome. Gnoppix gives them that. All the usefulness of Knoppix with the interface they want.

Or someone just thought it'd be a neat idea and acted on it.

Either, there is no loss, only gain. And for the record, I do not use Gnome myself.

--
I don't subscribe to RMS's GNUtopian vision.
Re:Why is this useful? by ViolentGreen · 2003-09-12 08:31 · Score: 1

That does make a lot of sense. Thanks for the reply.

--
Not everything is analogous to cars. Car analogies rarely work.
Re:Why is this useful? by perickso · 2003-09-12 08:36 · Score: 3, Interesting

A little googling revealed this site that tells how to Boot KNOPPIX from an USB Memory Stick.
Re:Why is this useful? by homer_ca · 2003-09-12 08:36 · Score: 2, Informative

Gnome was removed from Knoppix for space reasons earlier this year, but yeah, before that you could put desktop=gnome at the boot prompt and run Gnome.
Re:Why is this useful? by ergo98 · 2003-09-12 08:44 · Score: 0, Troll

It sounds like a "neat-o" project that would be a good way to nondestructively play around with Linux.

Having said that, I found this statement humorous: "but given the limits of what you can compress onto a single CD, separate projects makes sense to me.". Given the limits??? A CD has, what, 740MB? Yeah, they really had to push to fit into the tiny confines of a CD. I find it intriguing how the same community that endlessly used the term "bloat" to describe Microsoft software now can keep a straight face when describing the space on a CD as "limited".
Re:Why is this useful? by kubla2000 · 2003-09-12 08:56 · Score: 5, Insightful

I was about to moderate a comment in this thread but this pissed me off:

Having said that, I found this statement humorous: "but given the limits of what you can compress onto a single CD, separate projects makes sense to me.". Given the limits??? A CD has, what, 740MB? Yeah, they really had to push to fit into the tiny confines of a CD. I find it intriguing how the same community that endlessly used the term "bloat" to describe Microsoft software now can keep a straight face when describing the space on a CD as "limited".

Fella, if you think you can fit Windows, IIS, Office (twice over, Knoppix comes with OpenOffice as well as Koffice and several components from the Gnome office suite), MSSQL, several web browsers, email clients, development tools, network and security analysis tools, photoshop plus several graphics viewers, several multimedia suites, an advanced audio editor / mixer, games, etc. etc. etc onto one CD, you're smoking a more refined blend of crack cocaine than Darl.

Knoppix/Gnoppix showcase what you can get with Linux. I think it's astonishing what Klaus and the other developers have managed to fit on to this disk. The only "bloat" in Linux is in the choice department.
Re:Why is this useful? by stratjakt · 2003-09-12 08:59 · Score: 0, Flamebait

Knoppix isnt no rescue system.

If you cant rescue it from a floppy, it ain't worth rescuing!

All you should need is a bash prompt for linux, a dos prompt for windows.

At least, thats all *I* need.

--
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
Re:Why is this useful? by netsharc · 2003-09-12 09:08 · Score: 2, Informative

Nevertheless, a GUI can make life simpler, even when rescuing.

Knoppix does offer a failsafe boot option in case its fancy hardware detection program doesn't work, as well as the option to not start X, i.e. stay at the console. The fact that its CD-ROM based also means it can fit in a more rescue tools in comparison to 1.44 MB disks.

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Re:Why is this useful? by Wavicle · 2003-09-12 09:09 · Score: 3, Insightful

Some of us have crawled out of the primordial ooze and left our vestigal floppy drives behind.

Bootable rescue CDs are useful to me. Rescue CDs with a bunch of useful stuff on them are even more useful to me.

--
Education is a better safeguard of liberty than a standing army.
Edward Everett (1794 - 1865)
Re:Why is this useful? by believekevin · 2003-09-12 09:17 · Score: 2, Insightful

because you can go into a university library and have full access to the machine. especially if you have network drive space. uhm.. theoretically.
Re:Why is this useful? by SoTuA · 2003-09-12 09:20 · Score: 2, Interesting

How about "switch to linux"?
"ooh, I don't know... I don't have any HD space left..."
"Well, how about you give this (K|G)noppix CD a spin and see if you like it?"
And if you really like it... you can install it on you hard disk! I still don't know how to get a configured and up-to-date debian system running faster (that is, short of running a debian apt mirror yourself :D)
Re:Why is this useful? by Helmholtz+Coil · 2003-09-12 09:26 · Score: 4, Interesting

I agree. I have a friend in the office who recently asked me what all "this Linux stuff is." So I gave him a Knoppix CD. No instruction other than "put it in your CD drive, give it a spin." That was a month ago. Now, he's rounded up 5 PC's at work he wants to exclusively run Linux on, not to mention his own personal laptop.
It's also great for installing Linux yourself, because it's got some of the best hardware detection capabilities around.
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:37 · Score: 0, Offtopic

If you want a pissing contest I could say that I could rescue a system, using a disk editor in hex.
But why not make it a bit easier on yourself, I don't need to prove anything.
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:05 · Score: 0

Had the opportunity to use Knopix last weekend. Had a hard drive crash. Knopix enabled me to get 39 megs worth of mail back. Knopix is very very useful I'd say.
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:30 · Score: 0

Add to that that it actually *runs* off the disc as opposed to just having the installer ... it is a nice little trick. In Windows you'd probably have to reboot your machine 15-20 times to get the amount of software on a G/Knoppix disc.
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:40 · Score: 0

Only bloat in Linux is in the choice department? you've obviously never tried to run KDE on a sub-300 MHz 64M box. Or GNOME. Absolutely awful. And what does this do for Linux's image as a "fast OS suitable for older hardware"?

Oh, and "ls -lh /lib/libc*so" sometime. There's bloat. Libcs which do exactly the same can fit into 100k.
Re:Why is this useful? by i_really_dont_care · 2003-09-12 11:07 · Score: 3, Insightful

Knoppix already once saved my ass. At home, I use Linux, but I had to make a presentation (built with OpenOffice) the next day on my laptop, which runs Windows 2000 because I need some Windows apps there. I wanted to export the presentation as PDF, but that failed. So, just 2 hours before the presentation, I downloaded Knoppix. So I could start Linux from the CD, which includes OpenOffice and do my presentation.

Knoppix is also useful for marketing Linux. You can easily give Knoppix away and guarantee that it doesn't do any harm to the system. Most people actually are quite impressed by it.

Since Linux is all about choice, a Gnome Knoppix distribution is surely a thing that will be useful for a lot of uses.
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 11:20 · Score: 0

Take [relatively] old crappy systems not worth the time to even install and run 'em anyway without fuss.

Repair corrupted systems or delete virus-infected files that can't be removed because their in use at startup from Windows machines without any fuss (Better have areplacement file for the system stuff, else you'll be using knoppix more on that system than expected...).

Load up the disk on unsuspecting Windows-using friends and family's PCs and tell them you've solved their virus woes, or just to see the look on their face whilst they go hunting for MS Office software on the "start" menu

Boot the disk using "knoppix 2" to run even older hardware using just the commandline, or "knoppix desktop=xfce screen=800x600" to run in X with a smaller window mmanager (the cheatcodes rock)

Use Linux without having to know squat about installing it, and without touching the crippled partitions already running Windows (or without any partitions or disks what-so-ever, though if they're there and not NTFS they're mounted read-only by default)

Sound geeky? Heh, You thought this was a Martha Stuart website did you? (Just kidding :-)
Re:Why is this useful? by Roberto · 2003-09-12 11:27 · Score: 4, Insightful

I do run Linux on a P75, with 16Mhz of RAM.
It can do web browsing (graphical), play MP3s, read email (using mutt).

It even works as a mail server for use when disconnected (masqmail).

It has development packages (gcc), fancy text editors (fte).

It also has a 800MB disk.

It is a Toshiba Libretto 50ct.

Now, you may say, so what? Well, it's just as much a Linux as any other Linux. It's just not KDE or GNOME.

So yes, it is choice that makes Linux require a larger box. Because if you choose carefully, you can use a smaller one, too.

Here's the URL for how I did it:

http://www.pycs.net/lateral/stories/4.html
Re:Why is this useful? by planckscale · 2003-09-12 12:07 · Score: 1

AHAHHA bravo. Well said. Thank you.

--
Namaste
Re:Why is this useful? by colonwq · 2003-09-12 12:15 · Score: 2, Informative

Knoppix is able to go beyond the 740MB-ish limit of the CD by using the cloop module.

What is cloop? Well, according to the README of the source file it is "a [k]ernel module to add support for filesystem-independent, transparently decompressed, read-only block devices".

Rusty Russel is listed as the original author. Klaus is listed as bug fixes and extensions.

cloop can be found here.

:wq

--
-- Phase 1: Collect under pants Phase 2: ? Phase 3: Profit
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 12:20 · Score: 0

My question is what do you do if a PC you own does not have a floppy drive, you can't access the BIOS, and it won't boot a CD (except for it's own recovery CD and possibly a Microsoft Windows CD)?

It's just that some of those new PCs by Dell and the like seem to come just like that...
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 12:38 · Score: 0

No need to reboot to get the software to play together - once it is built all of that would be taken care of.
If you'd like to play with a "knoppix-like" windows CD try
http://www.nu2.nu/pebuilder/
Re:Why is this useful? by ichimunki · 2003-09-12 14:22 · Score: 1

Anyone know if there are any bulk sellers of attractively printed Knoppix/Gnoppix/Whateverix CDs? This seems like a fun thing to have sitting on my desk at work to give away. I mean, I'd go for CD-Rs since they're all of 30 cents a blank, but it would be a lot more fun if the CD had some eye-candy on it. Plus, then potential victims, er, users would be more likely to give it a try I think (and I won't have to sit at the burner all day either).

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Re:Why is this useful? by datan · 2003-09-12 15:56 · Score: 2, Interesting

yeah my next door neighbour had her hard disk crash on her, and while waiting for her replacement disk she survived on my KNOPPIX cd for a week using mainly gaim and mozilla. the only thing she really needed that I couldn't get working was flash (the plugin needs to write to the mozilla directory which was on the cdrom)
Re:Why is this useful? by datan · 2003-09-12 16:00 · Score: 1

the more fundamental question is why would you buy such a PC in the first place?
Re:Why is this useful? by jonadab · 2003-09-12 18:00 · Score: 1

You can get Knoppix 3.2 from cheapbytes.com, though they don't seem
to have Gnoppix yet for some reason. Their CDs don't have what I
would call eye candy (no fancy logos or anything), but they are
labelled in a passably-nice font, and the label (apart from the
black letters) is at a glance invisible, not one of those ugly white
labels you sometimes see on cheapies. For what they charge, it's
a pretty decent option.

I agree that I would like to get one with some nice eye candy, though,
maybe (part of) that Knoppix image of the eye that shows while it's
starting, or something.

--
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
Re:Why is this useful? by Daengbo · 2003-09-12 20:21 · Score: 0

And, if you're careful, you can usae a lower end box (Duron 1.1) to run six xterms, like I did. Fancy that.

--
Put identity in the browser.
Re:Why is this useful? by PrImED73 · 2003-09-12 20:49 · Score: 1

I had someone in the office once who said they hadn't tried Linux and couldn't because he didnt want to overwrite valueble information on his hard disk, so i brought in a Knoppix cd for him to try, and informed him he didnt need a hard disk to try it, unfortunately it scared him off.

Just seems some people get used to one type of OS and lose interest in everything else.

--
--Mods giveth, Mods taketh away--
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 21:03 · Score: 0

I used to have almost infinite xterms with a 486 with 32MB of ram... Using a 1.2 kernel with Slackware, with fwvm? What's the deal?
Re:Why is this useful? by haraldm · 2003-09-12 21:42 · Score: 1

Having used Knoppix for a while as a swiss army knife for about every possible rescue operation, I think the GUI is totally irrelevant. Xterm is the killer GUI for sysadmins. It is the completeness and recentness of tools on the CD that counts. So if a Gnome fork makes sense is at least debatable. IMHO it would make more sense to join forces and maintain an always up to date swiss army knife.

Don't get me wrong. I have been around in the Open Source realm for 10+ years, and I think it's good to have multiple projects for the same problem (competition counts) but sometimes there's an exception to the rule IMHO.

--
open (SIG, "</dev/zero"); $sig = <SIG>; close SIG;
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 22:52 · Score: 0

yes, I sure would not touch it, it would be useless to me even on my office pc where the first thing I do is to slap a Linux on it.
It must have been cheap for being a crippled pc. Otherwise I can't think of any reason why I would buy it.
Re:Why is this useful? by ichimunki · 2003-09-13 01:05 · Score: 1

Thanks, after I asked the question I did look around a bit. Cheapbyte's didn't look so bad, but XPLinux has what appear to be nice discs at a much lower price ($2.99). All that said, I found one place that will print blank CDs in 50 disc lots for $1.29 (printing is thermal printing in black, prices go up and down from there depending on better printing methods or quantity respectively).

While I don't relish the idea of minding the burner, I do like the idea of being able to create a custom print that would serve as advertising as well. Plus, that's a savings of $1.70 per CD.

--
I do not have a signature
Re:Why is this useful? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-13 06:30 · Score: 0

I had someone in the office once who said they hadn't tried Linux and couldn't because he didnt want to overwrite valueble information on his hard disk, so i brought in a Knoppix cd for him to try, and informed him he didnt need a hard disk to try it, unfortunately it scared him off.

Try not standing so close to him next time. Oh... and try blinking your eyes at normal intervals. Then again, he may just have been startled since he had been complaisantly assuming that he'd come up with an airtight way to avoid your continuing those proselytizing lectures.
Just seems some people get used to one type of OS and lose interest in everything else.

Don't be so hard on yourself! None of us really know what The Point of Life is... for all we know, your way may be Right!
Re:Why is this useful? by Roberto · 2003-09-13 07:06 · Score: 1

Hmmm... I am not sure I understand what you mean.
The computer I described is about 50 times slower than a Duron 1.1

It also has at least 8 times less RAM, and 10 times less disk. And it can run as many rxvts (sorry, xterm is heavier) as you want.

I just tried it with 30, and it didn't even slow down.
Re:Why is this useful? by Felis+Rex · 2003-09-13 12:30 · Score: 1

Only if the admins don't lock you into using Windows... bios passwords are a terrible thing.

--
"it's only after disaster that you can be born resurected" - My friend Dave
Re:Why is this useful? by Daengbo · 2003-09-13 12:38 · Score: 0

Soryy, I guess it was unclear. By xterm , I mean exporting the x display to six different diskless computers, meaning the Duron is doing all that work. It wasn't a bash on you at all. I read your web page and it was quite interesting, in fact.

--
Put identity in the browser.
Re:Why is this useful? by PrImED73 · 2003-09-14 00:04 · Score: 1

Lmao...

*knock knock knock*
"Yes?"
"Hello, i'm from the Linux witnesses..."
"NO THANK YOU"
*SWIFT SLAM*

--
--Mods giveth, Mods taketh away--

shouldn't this be on freshmeat? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 07:56 · Score: 2, Funny

shouldn't this be on freshmeat? maybe this site should be called freshdot, or slashmeat?

Re:shouldn't this be on freshmeat? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:11 · Score: 0

Maybe you'd be happier on Fark or Kuro5hin? They're not as 'techie'.
Re:shouldn't this be on freshmeat? by soloport · 2003-09-12 09:40 · Score: 1

Yeah, I see how this got started:
Ed: "No! That's GNU/Knoppix" [veins popping]
Fred: "Noooo!!! It's just plain Knoppix!"
Re:shouldn't this be on freshmeat? by sharkey · 2003-09-13 01:34 · Score: 1

slashmeat?
Lorena? Lorena Bobbitt? Is that you?

--

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"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.

Who needs mirrors? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 07:57 · Score: 1, Insightful

When you can use bittorrent!?

Re:Who needs mirrors? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 13:01 · Score: 0

Folks with traffic limits outside their city intranet.

well what I prefer.. by peculiarmethod · 2003-09-12 07:57 · Score: 5, Funny

I prefer spooning with my software..

forking, you gotta stay the night, and feel awkward that morning at breakfast..

pm

--
** "It's not my job to stand between the people talking to me, and the ones listening to me." -- Pego the Jerk

Re:well what I prefer.. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:06 · Score: 0

And knifing... well, you'll probably end up in jail.
Re:well what I prefer.. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:26 · Score: 0, Troll

You are such a nerd. That is not at all "funny". That the idea of sleeping with software came to your mind is sick. That the mods found it funny is ridiculous.

HTH
Re:well what I prefer.. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:38 · Score: 1, Funny

There is NO spoon.

deadmule
Re:well what I prefer.. by DChristensen · 2003-09-12 08:41 · Score: 5, Funny

Not to mention you could wake up with an AOL CD staring at you from across the bed.

--
--
Mac OS X--Unix without the assholes^Whassles.
Re:well what I prefer.. by edrugtrader · 2003-09-12 08:53 · Score: 0, Flamebait

another post by a geek who doesn't know 2 things about game.

you never stay the night, idiot.

--
MARIJUANA, SHROOMS, X: ONLINE?! - E
Re:well what I prefer.. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 21:12 · Score: 0

I'm with you 99%.

Live CDs by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 07:58 · Score: 0

Quick question. How many different "Live CD"'s (varients like the one mentioned included) do you know of?

Re:Live CDs by DA-MAN · 2003-09-12 08:10 · Score: 3, Informative

Off the top of me head, I know of Knoppix, Morphix, Damn Small Linux, and Puppy Linux.
There are a few others, but I don't remember them off the top of my head.

--
Can I get an eye poke?
Dog House Forum
Re:Live CDs by Kazymyr · 2003-09-12 08:12 · Score: 1

Slackware - the boxed set, not the downloadable iso - comes with a live CD as well.

--
I hadn't known there were so many idiots in the world until I started using the Internet -Stanislaw Lem
Re:Live CDs by FreeLinux · 2003-09-12 08:15 · Score: 5, Informative

Knoppix
Knoppix Mini Cd
OpenGroupware Live CD
Moppix
Gnoppix
Quantian Scientific Computing Environment
Freeduc
L.A.S.
BlueEyedOS
Oralux
DamnSmallLinux

and others I can't presently remember.
Re:Live CDs by billbaird · 2003-09-12 08:17 · Score: 2, Insightful

Gentoo has live cd's for PPC (KDE & Gnome), but i'm not too sure about x86
Re:Live CDs by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:25 · Score: 0

Gentoo live CD
Suse live CD

i also know of a few people who have forked Knoppix.
Re:Live CDs by Theatetus · 2003-09-12 08:28 · Score: 1

In addition to the lists above, there's Fire Linux, a favorite of mine. Great for recovery of Windows and Linux machines.

--
All's true that is mistrusted
Re:Live CDs by mahdi13 · 2003-09-12 08:31 · Score: 2, Informative

For a good list of LiveCDs, check out Distrowatch.com list of run-from-cd distros.

--
"Some things have to be believed to be seen." - Ralph Hodgson
Re:Live CDs by TheCrazyFinn · 2003-09-12 08:32 · Score: 1

Knoppix
Slackware Live CD
FreeBSD Live CD

--
"You've got an invalid haircut" -Warren Zevon - Life'll Kill Ya
Re:Live CDs by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:34 · Score: 0

How about dynebolic and Gis-Knoppix?
Re:Live CDs by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:37 · Score: 0

I saw a KDE/Gnome livecd for the x86 arch on ibiblio
Re:Live CDs by stormcoder · 2003-09-12 09:13 · Score: 0

Don't forget the Gentoo live-CD's. There are a bunch including some that boot directly in to games like Return to Castle Wolenstein: Enemy Territory.

--
Sorry my bullshit sensor overloaded.
Re:Live CDs by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:32 · Score: 0

What about Demolinux?
Re:Live CDs by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 18:08 · Score: 0

Even SkyOS (www.skyos.org) is on Live CD
Re:Live CDs by Gleng · 2003-09-12 18:58 · Score: 1

And it fits on a mini cd. Almost small enough to fit in your wallet!

--
"Proudly Posting Without Reading The Article"
Re:Live CDs by TheRaven64 · 2003-09-13 00:14 · Score: 1

And if we're not just counting Linux, the second FreeBSD install CD is a LiveFS CD, for when everything goes horribly wrong. I'm not entirely sure what's on it, since I've never had to use it, but I believe that it contains a full copy of the base system.

--
I am TheRaven on Soylent News

Troubleshooting Potential by mnmlst · 2003-09-12 07:58 · Score: 3, Insightful

This could be just the thing for checking a system for broken hardware and/or connectivity. A tech could walk up, insert their GNOPPIX CD, boot into a GUI environment, check things out and then go. The cost for this versus propietary alternatives would be VERY attractive.

--
In principio erat Verbum.

Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:01 · Score: 5, Insightful

This could be just the thing for checking a system for broken hardware and/or connectivity. A tech could walk up, insert their GNOPPIX CD, boot into a GUI environment, check things out and then go. The cost for this versus propietary alternatives would be VERY attractive.

Gee... sort of like Knoppix which has been out for over a year.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by jonathan_ingram · 2003-09-12 08:02 · Score: 0, Troll

And what does this fork give us over the original Knoppix distro, other than a senseless deviation into a second-rate pseudo-desktop environment?

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-- Help Digitise the Public Domain at DP.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Zigg · 2003-09-12 08:04 · Score: 1

Flaming opportunities?

;-)
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:06 · Score: 1, Funny
1. Lop off "K"
2. Slap on "Gn"
3. ?????
4. PROFIT!!!
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by numatrix · 2003-09-12 08:08 · Score: 3, Informative

It could, but there are many other, better, bootable distributions for that sort of thing. Three with a security (and thus forensics and recovery) twist that are all more useful in that sort of situation are:

F.I.R.E
knoppix-std
l.a.s.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by twistedcubic · 2003-09-12 08:08 · Score: 2, Informative

In Knoppix, you get to choose the window manager at boot, and there are more options than just KDE. Some of us don't even use KDE, if that's believable.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by JanneM · 2003-09-12 08:09 · Score: 2, Insightful

Yes, I really feel I want to become part of a community that spends so much time spewing hate over other people's preferences.

--
Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:13 · Score: 0

he's obviously trolling for mod points. Everyone posts that every time there is a story about Knoppix.

Look! I carry around a Knoppix CD wherever I go to make sure I can boot into a system and see what's going on. Do diagnostics, load Linux as I feel, etc, etc, etc.

Everyone knows what it does, so does he.

He's another Karma whoring troll, mod down.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Quino · 2003-09-12 08:17 · Score: 2, Interesting

And, Knoppix has already sold several people on Linux (want to try this Linux thing you've been hearing about? Check this out, runs off the CDROM, nothing gets changed, and it all just works). Just the fact that fully functional OS boots from their CDROM the first time has a kewlness factor...

The problem is (I know it's a matter of personal preference, live and let live and all that) is that it's KDE and a not a very attractive version: I've personally been waiting for a Gnome-based Knoppix-like CD (again, personal taste, I like the color green, watermelon and Gnome over KDE -- for me it's a matter of aesthetics).

I think an attractive version of Knoppix will make it easier to "sell" linux to curious coworkers. Unfortunately, Gnome 2.4 won't be ready until later (they're using 2.2 -- still nice, but 2.4 is, IMHO, a gorgeous desktop)

The website did say that nice appearance was one of their goals (didn't see screenshots -- and the page was crawling already), they apparently also made other changes (with hardware detection, apparently), but personally, I've just been waiting for a purty Knoppix-like live CD to give to friends.

Hurrah!
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:25 · Score: 0

There are such thing as Knoppix, Morphix, Damn Small Linux prior to Gnoppix.

I Personally like Knoppix much better than all unstable variants of Morphix or Gnoppix. But, DSL is quite a nice mini distro that work very well.

And then, there are such thing as SUSE, Gentoo, Slackware-Live, Movix, Linux Bottable Business Card, ByzantineOS, FIRE, and many other CD base distros.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:28 · Score: 0

Umm, you're never going to get modded up if you don't login. After that, maybe you won't resent the whores so much? You're right though, Knoppix is well-known to be handy for troubleshooting.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Ed+Avis · 2003-09-12 08:44 · Score: 0, Flamebait

If (note, Slashdot posters, *if*) GNOME is more attractive than KDE, then perhaps Ximian GNOME is better still, since they try to make it more polished and simplified (although it's usually a release or so behind). So perhaps there could be a bootable distribution which uses Ximian GNOME. This could outdo all the others with the pinnacle of silly names, Xnoppix.

--
-- Ed Avis ed@membled.com
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Hatta · 2003-09-12 09:13 · Score: 1

Gnnoppix?

--
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:17 · Score: 0

And this:

PLD Rescue CD

It fits on a single 50MB mini-cd, so you can carry it in your wallet. Saved me a lot of trouble quite a few times. Watch the list of available applications, it's very impressive.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Seabass55 · 2003-09-12 09:33 · Score: 1

Knoppix-STD is incredible. Current version boots up stock in KDE but hitting F2 on boot screen allows user to use different GUI's like Fluxbox. Next version of STD looks like it's going to dump KDE totally (thank god).

Base Knoppix to me is more of a means to draw in Could-be-linux users by allowing them to use linux without installing linux. For system recovery STD is much better suited.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by EvilAlien · 2003-09-12 09:56 · Score: 1

You are so wrong/dumb/clueless.
That's just a sample of how easy it is to take part in the community. You'll find it quite liberating.

--
perl -e 'print $i=pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by UserGoogol · 2003-09-12 10:52 · Score: 1

Switch to fluxbox on boot is a feature of Base Knoppix.

--
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." -- Hanlon's Razor
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 11:19 · Score: 0

What tools does knoppix have that can fix NTFS or FAT32 partitions? People who install Linux can always boot from their install cd's for recovery tools. Seems pretty useless for third-party machines with Windows installed.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 17:11 · Score: 0

Local Area Security Linux is only 150 MB and it has fluxbox and has 150+ tools no fat. Fits on a miniCD. And the BIGGEST plus is it releases new versions every two to 3 weeks. F.I.R.E. hasn't had a release in a loooong time. STD has been a while too. . . They make it seem more like some guys hobby he gets tired of then comes back to. L.A.S. has a track record so far of updating both version and website.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by jonadab · 2003-09-12 18:15 · Score: 1

All of the above are quite garish by default, but with some tweaking
of the settings you can get them looking pretty decent... though
I'm still waiting for the thEmacs theme to get ported to Gnome2.

--
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential by Krunch · 2003-09-12 21:14 · Score: 1

I personally don't use a window manager when booting Knoppix. It takes too much time to load. boot: knoppix 2

--
No GNU has been Hurd during the making of this comment.

Re:Goddamit all to hell! by Erwos · 2003-09-12 07:59 · Score: 0

Be fair, they're only Gnome'ing everything up!

I don't think it's a bad idea to have a GNOME version - it might even be better for people who aren't as used to Linux, due to the new focus on proper HID.

-Erwos

--
Plausible conjecture should not be misrepresented as proof positive.

Forks by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:00 · Score: 4, Funny

Usually forks are more trouble than they're worth

That's why I use chopsticks.

Re:Forks by kfg · 2003-09-12 08:26 · Score: 3, Funny

I have a geeky fasicination for all-in-one tools, so I use sporksticks myself.

KFG
Re:Forks by martin-boundary · 2003-09-12 14:57 · Score: 1

Just use a fork with a single tine. It's even environment friendly, since you save the metal for the other 2-4 tines.
Re:Forks by kfg · 2003-09-12 15:06 · Score: 3, Funny

You might say it's an awl-in-one tool.

KFG
Re:Forks by ZzzzSleep · 2003-09-12 16:01 · Score: 1

I wish I had mod points today to mod that horrid pun up. Ah well.... have some virtual mod points anyway kfg....
ZzzzSleep

--
Emerald Astrology
Re:Forks by r3jjs · 2003-09-12 18:31 · Score: 1

Spewing his drink all over his keyboard....
Ohhh.. my! I have to agree mate.. wish I had some mod points, even if I couldn't give you Karma.
Re:Forks by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 21:54 · Score: 0

In Soviet Russia Gnome FORKS YOU !!!

Not the only gnome remaster by numatrix · 2003-09-12 08:00 · Score: 4, Informative

There are other knoppix remasters of gnome. See the full list, or try a few direct (morphix has had gnome for a while) links.

Knoppix originally supported GNOME by Effugas · 2003-09-12 08:01 · Score: 3, Informative

Then it gave up.

Too unstable, too unreliable, too much work to keep up. Meanwhile, KDE Just Worked.

Things might be better now, though.

--Dan

Nothing new here... by advocate_one · 2003-09-12 08:01 · Score: 5, Informative

Morphix has had a Gnome version available for some time now as well as KDE and XFCE4 versions.

morphix.sourceforge.net

>Currently, iso's with XFCE4, Gnome2.2, KDE3.1 and a game iso are available for download! Morphix is an Open >Source/Free software project, based on Debian GNU/Linux and Knoppix. For more information, check the FAQ

Now had it been Gnome 2.4... that would have been news. :)

--
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.

Re:Nothing new here... by God_Retired · 2003-09-12 11:53 · Score: 1

I've been using debian for several years. I recently installed via Morphix on a spare partition. I had the same hang problem that you experienced.

So I ran it through again, and then before rebooting, just ran lilo from the cmd and rebooted. Worked fine. Very slick, I'm very impressed with Morphix.
Re:Nothing new here... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-16 04:59 · Score: 0

I always choose mbr.

How do you pronounce this? by devphaeton · 2003-09-12 08:02 · Score: 4, Funny

Yet another linux live-cd with essentially the same spoken name.

"Hey, what are you running?"

"'noppix!"

"which one?"

(note: i know some people say it "gah-nome, gah-noo", but where i'm from the G is silent in front of an N. Same with the K in Knoppix)

--

do() || do_not(); // try();

Re:How do you pronounce this? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:19 · Score: 0

but where i'm from the G is silent in front of an N

You come from the Minimum Securicy Legasthenium?

Moderators: This is a Futurama reference, so you can savely mod it up.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by VertigoAce · 2003-09-12 08:20 · Score: 5, Informative

Except with Knoppix, the 'K' isn't silent. Knoppix is from Knopper, which is a German name. Unlike English, the k in kn is pronounced.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by sys$manager · 2003-09-12 08:22 · Score: 1

So this is guh-kuh-noppix?
Re:How do you pronounce this? by jjhlk · 2003-09-12 08:33 · Score: 1

The G isn't a matter of your dialect, it's just a matter of proper pronunciation of a name. Gnu is pronounced Guh-new, because Richard Stallman (I think) said so. And I assume that convention carries over to any G prefixed words (in the right context). You wouldn't call Bjarne Stroustrup Buh-jarn just because that's how you think you say it. It's Be-yarn-eh. Or that's what I think... :)
Re:How do you pronounce this? by FuzzyBad-Mofo · 2003-09-12 08:57 · Score: 1

Woah, I've been saying it wrong all this time. How should it be pronounced, Ka-nop-ix?
Re:How do you pronounce this? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:59 · Score: 0

Moderators: This is a Futurama reference, so you can savely mod it up.

Maybe so, but it doesn't appear on the approved list of Futurama quotes for Slashdot posting. Mod down please.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by dlakelan · 2003-09-12 09:02 · Score: 4, Funny

Oh sure, it's spelled Gnoppix but it's pronounced "throatwobbler mangrove"

--
((lambda (x) (x x)) (lambda (x) (x x))) http://www.endpointcomputing.com a scientific approach to custom computing.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by starbuzz · 2003-09-12 09:31 · Score: 0

Phonetics for geeks
As other folks pointed out, the K in Knoppix is not silent because it stems from a German name. The correct pronunciation is:
CaN + NOP + PIX

.. spoken rapidly, with the "a" dropped and words merged.
Hope that helps.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:45 · Score: 0

Just because you reference something, doesn't actually mean it is funny. In fact, your post is a worthy testament to just that fact!
Re:How do you pronounce this? by MuParadigm · 2003-09-12 12:12 · Score: 1

Doesn't matter where *you* are from, Knoppix is from Germany, where they pronounce the "K" at the beginning. It is named for Klaus Knopper, the creator of the distro, and his last name is also pronounced with the "K" at the beginning. This is a proper name, and doesn't follow the same rules as words like "psychology" where pronouncing the "p" at the beginning does vary depending on the language it is spoken in.

All of which is to say, that if you pronounce "Knoppix" without the "K" you are simply pronouncing it wrong.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by Rysc · 2003-09-12 12:50 · Score: 1

To add to the confusion, here are the words rendered in my own personal mostly-useless semi-phonetic notation, which you can't find anywhere:

k'n|O|piks
g'n|O|piks

--
I want my Cowboyneal
Re:How do you pronounce this? by starbuzz · 2003-09-12 13:50 · Score: 0

Oh well. ASCII renderings of phonetics are difficult to read for non-native speakers of English. Just look at the Merriam Webster or the Jargon file.
However, the sort of phonetic bridges like the one I gave should be much less ambiguous; e.g. most dictionary phonetic tables use sample words. Techniques like consonants modification are used routinely in teaching foreign languages.
I for one prefer the internal phonetic alphabet, as used by the OED.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by nutshell42 · 2003-09-12 13:59 · Score: 1

Not Ka-nop-ix but K'nop-ix
"kn" with an audible "k" still exists in English but not at the beginning of a word.
Say "acknowledge" and try to swallow the "a".
Now do the step from "aknoppix" to "knoppix" the same way
Don't know if it helps but I had some success trying to teach a friend of mine to pronounce "xine" this way =)

--
Don't think of it as a flame---it's more like an argument that does 3d6 fire damage
Re:How do you pronounce this? by solferino · 2003-09-12 14:46 · Score: 1

Unlike English, the k in kn is pronounced.

...and used to be in english which is why we have vestigial 'k' retained in the spelling of some english words, perhaps the most obvious being 'knight' which used to be pronounced k - ni - cht (the 'ch' exactly the same as at the end of Bach and loch i.e. a devoiced velar sibilant)

Since that time (old english to early middle english) english phonology has lost intial 'k' in words and also the velar fricative - modern german however still retains them

moral of the story - english spelling was actually pretty logical back in the day when it was transcribing the pronunciation of that time
Re:How do you pronounce this? by solferino · 2003-09-12 14:50 · Score: 1

sorry - devoiced velar fricative
Re:How do you pronounce this? by yuri+benjamin · 2003-09-12 18:16 · Score: 1

perhaps the most obvious being 'knight' which used to be pronounced k - ni - cht

That reminds me of the frenchman in Monty Python's Holy Grail:

"You silly english kah-nnnnnniggits!"

Thanks for reminding me of that. I love Monty Python.

--
You make the mistake of thinking you can educate the fundamental stupidity out of people. You can't.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by sharkey · 2003-09-13 01:30 · Score: 1

it's pronounced "throatwobbler mangrove"
That's it. You're a very silly distro, and I'm not going to review you.

--

--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
Re:How do you pronounce this? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-13 14:54 · Score: 0

nat and miguel (sp?) of gnome/ximian fame pronounce it guh-nome.
my dad had the pleasure of working with them.

Pronounce... by Creedo · 2003-09-12 08:02 · Score: 2, Insightful

Wouldn't those be pronounced the same way? Makes it a little confusing to talk about.

--
All that is necessary for the triumph of good is that evil men do nothing.

Re:Pronounce... by product+byproduct · 2003-09-12 08:24 · Score: 2, Funny

What do you mean by "Makes it a little confusing to talk a boot?"
Re:Pronounce... by Jameth · 2003-09-12 09:09 · Score: 1

Not just confusing, I would say it's a little rude. Everyone will pronounce them the same, so Gnoppix essentially has the same spoken name. It should be common curtisy to not overlap names with another project.

If their push is GNOME, maybe they should call it 'Gnomix' or something equally stupid to all their 'G-crap' and 'K-shit'
Re:Pronounce... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 21:15 · Score: 0

We have ways of making you pronounce the letter 'U'!

This story posted... by Realistic_Dragon · 2003-09-12 08:03 · Score: 4, Funny

This story posted for your enjoyment by a KDE Zealot who wanted to kill the Gnoppix project and melt it's webserver beore it had a chance to gain in popularity.

--
Beep beep.

Re:FUCK MICHAEL by Kussic · 2003-09-12 08:03 · Score: 0, Offtopic

who's michael? what's the problem with this guy?

--
-- Free Kevin (Buy one get one Kevin for FREE!)

How does one pronounce it??? by Mipsalawishus · 2003-09-12 08:04 · Score: 0, Redundant

If it's pronounced as "noppix", then that's gonna cause some confusion for people talking about knoppix. Maybe it's G-noppix???

Re:How does one pronounce it??? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:12 · Score: 0

Seeing as it's apt to cause confusion around here, why don't we just call it Bruce?
Re:How does one pronounce it??? by WTFmonkey · 2003-09-12 08:20 · Score: 0, Offtopic

So this grasshopper walks into a bar, sits down and orders a drink.
The bartender says, "Hey, I've never had a grasshopper in my bar before. I'm gonna name a drink after you!"
And the grasshopper says, "You're going to name a drink 'Bruce'?"
Re:How does one pronounce it??? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:23 · Score: 0

knoppix is german, so every letter is pronounced, good troll though....
Re:How does one pronounce it??? by La+Temperanza · 2003-09-12 08:29 · Score: 1

Klaus has said Knoppix is pronouced with a hard K.

I'm wondering whether the O is short or long, though.

--

--
est modus in rebus
Re:How does one pronounce it??? by GigsVT · 2003-09-12 08:32 · Score: 1

We can call it Shannon, Shannon Wilson Bell.

--
I've had enough abrasive sigs. Kittens are cute and fuzzy.
Re:How does one pronounce it??? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:38 · Score: 0

i heard somebody completely fuck that joke up once by opening it with:

"so this cricket named Bruce walks into a bar and orders a grasshopper".
Re:How does one pronounce it??? by TCM · 2003-09-12 08:38 · Score: 1

G-spot noppix.

--
Of course it runs NetBSD. BTC: 1NT7QvbetmANwaMzhpVL6
Re:How does one pronounce it??? by yerricde · 2003-09-12 09:21 · Score: 1

Before a doubled stop (such as the PP), vowels are typically short. Yes, a German short O is higher[1] than an American English short O.

[1] "High" in phonetics refers more often to position of the tongue than to pitch of the voice.

--
Will I retire or break 10K?
Re:How does one pronounce it??? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:05 · Score: 0

Kilo-noppix
I want a "live shell" named or called Shoppix XDD
open4free

Troubleshooting Potential-Killer App. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:05 · Score: 3, Interesting

Live CDs are one of Linux's "killer apps". Considering the low numbers of Live CDs out there. This is one niche that's not being fully explored. How about an Astrix Knoppix? Or a Musicians Knoppix? Same with graphics. Knoppix for schools. Knoppix for someone into the engineering arts.

Re:Troubleshooting Potential-Killer App. by advocate_one · 2003-09-12 08:27 · Score: 3, Informative

Knoppix for schools

there's plenty now...

GLUE

Knoppix for kids
Freeduc
The list is growing as more people experience the advantages of the Knoppix concept and make their own specialist version.

--
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
Re:Troubleshooting Potential-Killer App. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:32 · Score: 0

There is OverClockix which is sorta a overclocker's fork of Knoppix. It has several distributed computing clients (Folding, SETI, etc) and also CPU-burnin programs. And all the general purpose apps.

Any BitTorrent Mirrors? by billstewart · 2003-09-12 08:06 · Score: 3, Insightful

That's really the way to distribute things like this without getting Slashdotted...

--

Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks

Re:Any BitTorrent Mirrors? by Dr+Reducto · 2003-09-12 08:19 · Score: 1

Remember when Slashdot fractured the BitTorrent Community after Slashdot reported that BitTorrent had DVD-quality copies of Matrix:Reloaded?

Slashdot easily DDOS'd all the popular BitTorrent servers on that fateful day, because people posted links to good BitTorrent copies of the Matrix:Reloaded.
Re:Any BitTorrent Mirrors? by Techiegeeks · 2003-09-12 14:05 · Score: 1

I agree. Bit Torrent is the way to initially distribute this. Definitly saves on their bandwidth.

Usefulness of Bootable Linux Distros by sremack · 2003-09-12 08:06 · Score: 5, Insightful

Bootable Linux distros should not be looked at as standalone OSes. Instead, they should be used for some specific purpose. One could test hardware configurations, recover some aspect of an old Linux partition, or even do a complete forensic investigation. I really like how you can create your own bootable Linux distro using Eagle Linux . One example is the bootable Linux project, FIRE (on sourceforge).

Re:Usefulness of Bootable Linux Distros by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:34 · Score: 0

One could test hardware configurations, recover some aspect of an old Linux partition, or even do a complete forensic investigation.
or surf pron sites without leaving a trace for the wife to find...
Re:Usefulness of Bootable Linux Distros by leifm · 2003-09-12 08:37 · Score: 1

In a Windows environment you could use a Knoppix CD to grab files off an unbootable windows install. Knoppix would have been great for me when I had that happen, but at the time I had to put mandrake on a second partition and mount the ntfs partition, burn needed files, and then reinstall everything.

--

"Windows Me offers tremendous reliability and stability improvements..." -- Paul Thurott
Re:Usefulness of Bootable Linux Distros by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:46 · Score: 1, Interesting

I use Knoppix for just that reason.

When people with a bad windows install bring their computer in to be fixed, they always ask if we can save their address book, emails, documents, because they are so very important. You know, the kind of thing you should back up regularlly.

Anyways, we just boot the machine with knoppix, transfer the data off the bad partition on to an external hard drive and call it good. Before we used to have to pull the drive out and get it mounted in another system for this.
Re:Usefulness of Bootable Linux Distros by MyHair · 2003-09-22 03:12 · Score: 1

Anyways, we just boot the machine with knoppix, transfer the data off the bad partition on to an external hard drive and call it good. Before we used to have to pull the drive out and get it mounted in another system for this.

I've done this myself. In fact there have been two occasions when Windows couldn't read the drive but Knoppix could!

what's next? by bite.me · 2003-09-12 08:07 · Score: 0

blackboppix? wmoppix?

How about "Toppix"? by JessLeah · 2003-09-12 08:07 · Score: 1

...a text-only Knoppix/Gnoppix workalike for us geeks. Where everything is console-only (including Curses-based stuff and the like). Heck, they could even throw in AAlib-based Quake ;) Or not.

But by making a text-only Knoppix (Toppix?), they would produce a really nifty research platform, and could include a ton more stuff (since text-only software tends to be a lot smaller than graphical stuff)...

--
Honey, I shrunk the Cygwin

Re:How about "Toppix"? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:14 · Score: 0

...a text-only Knoppix/Gnoppix workalike for us geeks. Where everything is console-only (including Curses-based stuff and the like)...

They do. It's called emacs. Oh wait, that doesn't fit on a single cd.
Re:How about "Toppix"? by devphaeton · 2003-09-12 08:18 · Score: 3, Insightful

I know a pile of guys that have essentially made thier own rescue disks with everything but X servers and X apps on it.

I prefer the text-only model for rescue.

On the other hand, you bring up another interesting point about "fitting it all on a CD".

Just a couple of years ago a CD was considered ENORMOUS. Hell, i remember several years ago when you could fit an entire OS on a floppy.

I think a lot of developers are getting complacent these days and are less efficient when writing code. I'm noticing a lot of bloat in software today compared to about 6 months ago. Even more from just a year ago.

I have video games where version 3 runs bishin on a 300mhz amd k6-II with 128mb of ram. Version 4 (which comes out 3 years later) is jittery and sluggish and struggles to run on my 1.533Ghz Athlon w/ 512mb of ram. Looking at the 2 games, the graphics aren't really that big a step, nor is the gameplay so much.

--

do() || do_not(); // try();
Re:How about "Toppix"? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:19 · Score: 2, Informative

Just boot Knoppix with the "txt" option at the commandline you like so much to run a text only version of Linux.
Re:How about "Toppix"? by typobox43 · 2003-09-12 08:32 · Score: 2, Interesting

However, you still have X and KDE taking up space on the disc, where there may be other things you'd rather have on a true text-only disc. I, for one, would love to see a "Toppix."
Re:How about "Toppix"? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:00 · Score: 0

I propose naming it noppix.
Re:How about "Toppix"? by yerricde · 2003-09-12 09:14 · Score: 1

Except your joke doesn't work. My full binary installation of GNU Emacs is 40 MB, half of that being Elisp bytecode. A CD is at least 640 MB.

--
Will I retire or break 10K?
Re:How about "Toppix"? by The_DOD_player · 2003-09-12 09:42 · Score: 1

Please...

We all "know" this bloat problem to be true, or do we?
People have been complaining about this, since Commodore 64 was replaced with Amigas and MS-DOS PC's.
- "They only rely on number crushing"
- "The gameplay sucks, its only advanced graphics"
- "It doesnt do anything useful, its just burning cycles"

Regardless how you put it, things have improved, very much so. Check out Windows 95, yeah sure, it doesnt consume much CPU or RAM, but it SUCKS, big time, in every respect. You cant do anything with it, you wonder how you ever did put up with it. And its like this for most categories of software, IMHO.

All the disc jockeying, rebooting to get it above 565kb, computer crashing with more than 4 open windows. Sure..

Im so happy with my KDE3 with all the fancy animated stuff, swappable themes, relocatable buttons and menus. It might be "bloat" in the eyes om some, but I like it, a lot.

what the?????? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:08 · Score: 0

Ive never seen such unimportant news cause such anger and passion for people, geez the more choice the better IMHO... we (at leaste I) do not live in a communist country so I do enjoy more options and choices (even though i dont need this somebody might, it would be a good cd to burn and give to pple who are scared to try linux on the hard drive)

suckers

Re:Gnome? by Mipsalawishus · 2003-09-12 08:08 · Score: 1

The Gnome developers, of coarse! :)

Pathetic... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:09 · Score: 0, Funny

I don't like either KDE nor Gnome? What about Bashoppix? I wan't a shiny new Bashoppix distribution. And I'd like to see a fvwmoppix CD too. That would make the great Linux confusion perfect! Oh wait... shouldn't it be GNU/Linux/Bashoppix?

GNU/Linux/Bashoppix anyone? Hello? slashdotnix??? Damn, I'm thinking too much about this and my precious AC karma.. maybe I should get another hobby.

Re:Pathetic... by FuzzyBad-Mofo · 2003-09-12 08:59 · Score: 1

I want my BlackBoxoppix..

All right! by djeaux · 2003-09-12 08:10 · Score: 4, Interesting

I recently "discovered" KNOPPIX as a nice way to have a Linux environment (and some favorite tools) anywhere.

I've handed out a number of copies of the CD, too, to friends & colleagues who aren't brave enough to go through the whole repartition shindig to put a dual boot installation on their Windows box but who are curious about Linux. Knoppix has raised more than a few eyebrows around here. While I'm not exactly a "Linux evangelist," I do enjoy watching people expand their horizons. KNOPPIX (and now GNOPPIX) can be useful tools for winning "converts," if that's important to you.

GNOPPIX means that now I can hand 'em two CDs & say, "This one brings up the KDE desktop & this one brings up GNOME, so you can see what all the brouhaha is about."

That is, I'll be able to do that after the GNOPPIX site recovers from being /.ed or puts up a few gazillion more mirrors ;-) It may be faster just to wait for the KNOPPIX folks to finish their DVD image...

--
"Obviously, I'm not an IBM computer any more than I'm an ashtray" (Bob Dylan)

Re:All right! by fiddlesticks · 2003-09-12 10:08 · Score: 1

> GNOPPIX means that now I can hand 'em two CDs &
> say, "This one brings up the KDE desktop & this
> one brings up GNOME, so you can see what all the
> brouhaha is about."

goodness, your friends and colleagues will understand why linux has (at least two) desktop environments? cool... have you given them a choice of shells, text editors and browsers too? maybe you should explain the whole QT-kde-isnt-Free/ gnome/ GNU thing as well.... :)

--
http://milkshake.dexy.org
Re:All right! by Whyzzi · 2003-09-12 10:30 · Score: 1

Sadly, the software patent battle highlighted here and here might halt further development of such great ideas, ideas such as Knoppix.

--
"BSD is about people pissing each other.." (Moid Vallat)
Re:All right! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 11:07 · Score: 0

"I recently discovered KNOPPIX as a nice way to have a Linux environment (and some favorite tools) anywhere."

It's also the easiest way of installing Debian on a machine:
knx-hdinstall
Re:All right! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 23:41 · Score: 0

goodness, your friends and colleagues will understand why linux has (at least two) desktop environments?

You're looking at this through strange distorting techie glasses and coming up with an issue that wouldn't even occur to most people. What's all this about "desktops"?

"Here is two ways of the ways your display can look, if you don't like either of those we can change them around some more"

The fact that you can change your computer so that Windows apps won't run on it but so other ones will might be confusing. But nobody I have met has any difficulty with the thought that you can make the system look different. They're used to this from Windows.

Redundant? by ejaw5 · 2003-09-12 08:10 · Score: 0

IIRC, you can boot up a Knoppix CD and pass a desktop parameter to boot up Gnome.

--

$cat /dev/random > Sig

Re:Redundant? by damiam · 2003-09-12 08:28 · Score: 1

Nope. Knoppix dropped GNOME a while ago for space and ease of maintenance.

--
It's hard to be religious when certain people are never incinerated by bolts of lightning.

This is excellent by Idimmu+Xul · 2003-09-12 08:11 · Score: 3, Insightful

for people interested in getting into Linux but are not ready for formatting and installing Linux themselves. It gives them a taster for what it could be like! Bravo!

--
The problem with slashdot is that most of its users were bullied and stuffed into lockers as kids!

Re:This is excellent by Felis+Rex · 2003-09-13 10:16 · Score: 1

The only problem I have seen with introducing newbs to Linux through Knoppix is, unless they install it on their hard drives (and somehow they never do), the distro they end up with is different, and they then are confused. "Why is the menu different?" "Where'd my [insert app name here] go?" "How come I don't have [insert app name here] anymore?" I was never brave enough to try installing it on anyone's hard drive without some prior experience, and never had the space on my own. Other than that, it's great as an introduction.

--
"it's only after disaster that you can be born resurected" - My friend Dave

Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW distro. by LinuxMan · 2003-09-12 08:12 · Score: 5, Interesting

It would be really cool to take KNOPPIX to the next level: DVD-RW knoppix, where you can actually save your changes on the disk. (albeit slowness) Theoretically, you could write a certain amount of information to it, until you have filled up the disc, then have a mechanism to write a new clean DVD-RW with just the most modern information. That with a very driver heavy Linux kernel should allow for your "desktop" being exactly the same on any machine you insert the disc into!

Linux in a Nutshell, Fourth Edition

finally by Miguel+de+Icaza · 2003-09-12 08:14 · Score: 2, Interesting

actually knoppix used to carry a half-hearted gnome desktop effort back in the day, until klaus understandably dropped it to make room for extra kDE eye candy. there are already plenty of essential gtk apps on the Knoppix cd today, just no desktop. the cool thing about kde 3.1 is it enforces KDE themes and colors onto gtk programs so you can hardly tell the difference apart from things like transparent snap-on menus, font rendering hints, and other (imo) unneccceesssary eye-candy. Eclipse running on knoppix manages to look like kde native which is no mean feat - tips hat to trolltech (and their evil canopy group overloards)

knoppix still includes the excellent fluxbox, which of all the current destop managers shows the most promise.

--
Before adopting WHATWG, read the moonlight.NET EULA [http://www.microsoft.com/interop/msnovellcollab/moonlight.mspx]

Re:finally by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:36 · Score: 0

Hey Miguel,

Oh wait this isn't miguel this is just some dick that thinks he is funny.
Re:finally by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:21 · Score: 3, Informative

Moderators: while the comment itself seems fine, this user is a troll, it is not the *real* Miguel de Icaza from Ximian.

Look at his post history and you'll see.

Please mode him down as a troll; no one should be playing such games here;

The real Miguel:
http://slashdot.org/~miguel/

Re:Hey sexy by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:14 · Score: 0

You should email Taco directly, not via posting here.

Patent Issues? by Breezway · 2003-09-12 08:14 · Score: 2, Interesting

I hope this project got around the patent issues that are plaguing KNOPPIX. Good bootcds are wonderful and put bootfloppies to shame. KNOPPIX is currently closed - view their current page and not the old one that was /.ed.

Re:Patent Issues? by djeaux · 2003-09-12 08:28 · Score: 1

Actually, the old page is still there. It appears that the current entry page on the KNOPPIX site is just a "splash" screen put up to protest the EU Parliament considering "software patents." The old German and English pages are still there. You just have to try some of the hyperlinks...

--
"Obviously, I'm not an IBM computer any more than I'm an ashtray" (Bob Dylan)
Re:Patent Issues? by gordie · 2003-09-12 08:37 · Score: 1

That is a protest page, Klaus is protesting against the EU going down the path towards Software Patents. Try www.knoppix.net to get the latest iso.
Re:Patent Issues? by bwcbwc · 2003-09-12 09:47 · Score: 1

I know I'm being trolled, but I just can't restrain myself...

The current KNOPPIX website just alludes to the general political reaction against software patents in Europe. Knoppix was part of the protest movement. There is a link to the normal website embedded in the text.

There are no specific software patent issues with Knoppix.

--
We are the 198 proof..

I heard they use KDE & KDevelop by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:17 · Score: 0

Anybody know for sure?

But.. by Fr33z0r · 2003-09-12 08:17 · Score: 3, Informative

Knoppix used to have gnome on it (accessable via a cheat code

Such is my understanding anyway, I've never used a version with Gnome, but there's plenty about it on various messageboards (it got removed before the latest versions because it had "problems" - hopefully this version is what it seems to be on the site - a completely seperate distro, and not just a hack of knoppix that is plagued by the same problems)

Re:But.. by boredMDer · 2003-09-12 09:45 · Score: 1

Correction: cheatcodes.

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by stratjakt · 2003-09-12 08:18 · Score: 1

AFAIK, there's no method/protocol for bootable DVDs

--
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!

Window managers ... by Flossymike · 2003-09-12 08:18 · Score: 2, Interesting

Actually one of the reasons I've played with Knoppix is because you can try out different window mangers very easily...

While booting up up you get the choose of going for help, and if you do that you will see the choose of different window managers to try.

Not sure about the need for another live distro (but I'll qualify that with a what ever scratches an iche) then again, anything that has the same quality as knoppix is sure to impress any on looking windows users :-)

Who uses Gnome? by twoslice · 2003-09-12 08:20 · Score: 1

Apparently Snow white had a grande old time with seven of 'em...

--

From excellent karma to terible karma with a single +5 funny post...

Troubleshooting Potential-Win-withdrawal. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:21 · Score: 0

"And what does this fork give us over the original Knoppix distro, other than a senseless deviation into a second-rate pseudo-desktop environment?"

I'm sorry. It doesn't boot into Windows.

Re:Goddamit all to hell! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:21 · Score: 0

Lick my knockers.

Doesn't support English by glassesmonkey · 2003-09-12 08:23 · Score: 1

Somehow they disabled the lang support in this version of Knoppix/Gnome (btw, not the first). You have to log out and then somehow change to English.

Also, anyone notice on the Thank You page there is props for Gnome and Debian, but nothing for Klaus Knopper and Knoppix!

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by La+Temperanza · 2003-09-12 08:23 · Score: 1

Couldn't you just burn one in ISO9660 format rather then UDF?

--

--
est modus in rebus

BAH! by da3dAlus · 2003-09-12 08:25 · Score: 4, Funny

*sings* "You say k-noppix, I say g-noppix"
Eh, let's call the whole thing off...

--

Sometimes I doubt your commitment to Sparkle Motion.

Re:BAH! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:12 · Score: 0

Gnoppix is better than Knoppix because ..
Giga-noppix is better than Kilo-noppix because ..
Giga-noppix = 1024 x Kilo-noppix.
(power of 2 in a digital world, power of 10 in a real world)
open4free
Re:BAH! by Rysc · 2003-09-12 12:35 · Score: 1

Technically Giga-noppix = 1000 * Kilo-noppix.

However, Gibi-noppix is 1024 x Kibi-noppix.

A common mistake.

--
I want my Cowboyneal

The Magic CD by digitalgimpus · 2003-09-12 08:25 · Score: 1

I love these Linux on CD projects.

Go into a computer lab... computer not working? Oh well. Just pop in CD, and do your work. How great that is.

Would be nice if they could interact with a USB keychain drive better (keep your home directory on that, so you can write to it).

The perfect solution for anyone who must ensure they can get on a computer.

Re:The Magic CD by djeaux · 2003-09-12 08:36 · Score: 1

Would be nice if they could interact with a USB keychain drive better (keep your home directory on that, so you can write to it).
I haven't tried it with a USB keychain drive, but it is mentioned in the KNOPPIX documentation. The online docs explain how to set up a persistent /home with KNOPPIX 3.1, but the capability is built into 3.2.

--
"Obviously, I'm not an IBM computer any more than I'm an ashtray" (Bob Dylan)
Re:The Magic CD by katsushiro · 2003-09-12 08:36 · Score: 1

Actually, Knoppix 3.2 allready has that. You can save your home dir to a USB keychain, a spot on the hard disk, or even just a floppy, as well as your desktop settings and preferences, and have them all be there next time you boot the CD, by passing a short command line param when you boot up (something like knoppix home=/mnt/usb0 or something like that)

--
"Two things are infinite: the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the first one." - Albert Einstein
Re:The Magic CD by ratpack91 · 2003-09-12 08:43 · Score: 1

yeah I'd like that. but I wonder how many [eg university] lab computers have cd booting disabled in a passworded bios. I must try it sometime. You could temperarily turn loads of crappy windows machines into linux and then see what happens when a random person sits down to use one.
Re:The Magic CD by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:46 · Score: 0

Yeah, university computers suck. Stupid untrusting administrators. It's not high school anymore. (although my high school computers were as secure as a gingerbread house from rain)
Re:The Magic CD by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 20:35 · Score: 0

we secure the desktop. why? because the non technical students need to be able to sit down and write their project with Word as they've been taught at college etc, read their email with our supported client (Outlook - secured down) etc
if the systems were open, you'd not only get the knowledgeable nice people running their boot CD of choice...you'd also get stupid twats installing their OS of choice..so the system would have to be reimaged. you'd also get fools installing P2P apps...along with all the spyware and malware that comes with those, and then you'd get the not-nice people installing trojans, keysniffers, window watchers etc.

i'd love to go back to the 1980's world of computing where people played nice and were all
in for the experimental. now its not so clean cut
Re:The Magic CD by Felis+Rex · 2003-09-13 11:46 · Score: 1

My old 2-year college has CD booting disabled and the BIOS pw protected. I tried Knoppix, but not even the boot floppy would work. That was disabled too. So I was forced to fail a course because I could not get MS-Word XP to read a .RTF file (the final term paper) correctly... and that auto-save-as-it-crashes feature is sweet, it overwrote the thing with garbage. Way to go, Microsoft. Reason #3,117 why I don't use Microsoft products if I can at all help it. Back on topic, I would have been easily able to print the same document exactly as it was supposed to be under Knoppix...

--
"it's only after disaster that you can be born resurected" - My friend Dave

One interesting GNOPPIX "thank you" ommission by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:25 · Score: 0

They failed to thank the Knoppix distro designer Klaus Knopper!
Kids these days!
Bill Joy must be rolling in his grave.

Game specific Live CDs? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:25 · Score: 0

Does anybody know of a live CD which focues on games like RtCW: Enemy Territory?

I'd love to have a single purpose Live CD which did little more than boot up and launch Enemy Territory as fast as it could. No Gnome or KDE or databases, etc., etc..

Actually what I'd _really_ want isn't so much of a single static live CD but rather a live CD creator which would allow me to create a machine specific, fully configured and optimized, live CD which would run RtCW:ET (or Unreal 2003) on my computer only.

So, anyone know of projects started with those goals?

Thanks,
AC

Re:Game specific Live CDs? by stratjakt · 2003-09-12 08:29 · Score: 1

Plenty of emulator specific live CD's around, for folks that build MAME machines and whatnot. An RTCW live CD would need to be reburned every other day when new/updated drivers and cards come out...

Frankly it shouldnt be hard to roll your own. Or buy a console.

--
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
Re:Game specific Live CDs? by advocate_one · 2003-09-12 08:29 · Score: 1

you want Morphix... I've already given a link for it. :)

--
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
Re:Game specific Live CDs? by stormcoder · 2003-09-12 08:58 · Score: 1, Insightful

How about Gentoo Enemy Territory CD
Should do what you want.

--
Sorry my bullshit sensor overloaded.

Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:26 · Score: 0

As someone who has supported both GNOME and KDE in a major free OS, I can tell you that GNOME is always orders of magnitude more broken than KDE. Furthermore, you'd think they could have a release team to package it similar to KDE (gnome-libs containing all the prerequisite libraries, etc), and could make it build easily into /opt without breaking (as it is, you pretty much have to use /usr because of the brain-damaged way /usr is hardcoded into pkgconfig and nearly everything else).

KDE is the future. I'm not sure what GNOME is.

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by stratjakt · 2003-09-12 08:26 · Score: 2, Interesting

ISO9660 has nothing to do with being bootable, a bootable CDROM has what's analgous to a bootsector, a chunk outside of the filesystem that holds an image of the "boot floppy" that the bios emulates. (theres virtual hard drive mode).

It's basically a kludge - another session that contains the boot stuff.

DVDs just dont have this. DVDs arent multisession either. So they need an entirely different kludge.

You could carry a DVD and a floppy, or bootable CD around.

--
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!

USB storage by bstadil · 2003-09-12 08:27 · Score: 4, Informative

In case you do not know, you can buy a cheap USB Flash storage device and use that for your Home dir.

Support is included in the lates Knoppix 4.2 release.

--
Help fight continental drift.

Re:USB storage by cmbofh · 2003-09-13 08:48 · Score: 0

I guess that's a typo, the latest version of Knoppix is 3.2
Re:USB storage by bstadil · 2003-09-13 12:54 · Score: 1

I guess that's a typo, the latest version of Knoppix is 3.2
Failing memory rather.
I was too lazy to look at the Knoppix site and I didn't have my CD handy. Thanks

--
Help fight continental drift.

Another Press Release From SCO by Eberlin · 2003-09-12 08:29 · Score: 4, Funny

To increase the relevance of SCO in the current IT market, they put out a new press release regarding this Gnoppix CD:

Dateline 9/12/2003 -- a day after the anniversary of a great tragedy, the terrorists have struck again by continuing to disrespect our Intellectual Property. The Gnoppix CD is in clear violation of everything we stand for. It should be stopped.

In response to Gnoppix and its predecessor Knoppix, our last programmer (since we've turned to a litigation-based business model) was asked to create SCOppix with which you could try our operating system without having to install it onto your hard drive, thus avoiding violating our IP. Users of SCOppix will not be targeted in any of our litigation.

All users will be required to click through our EULA which states that by clicking, they agree that SCO owns Linux, the user's computer, the user's house, the user's underpants (UNDERPANTS? isn't that just silly? Guess it hasn't stopped us before so why not), and all his base, and will thus be forced to become indentured servants of SCO. Furthermore, by accessing the CD with their computers, they will immediately be charged $699 anyway.

We are firm in our resolve that our Intellectual Property rights will be enforced to the far reaches of the planet. Every human, every penguin, every gnome (are you sure this is good to mention?) using our IP shall be charged until we can all sleep soundly at night knowing our children are safe from these terrorists. (and our bank accounts profit from this great pump-and-dump business model).

Re:Another Press Release From SCO by njchick · 2003-09-12 14:56 · Score: 1

Not sure about SCO, but it would be nice to have a NetBSD distribution bootable on different architectures. I know that NetBSD install CD boots on 4 architectures, so it's possible. Of course there will be less space for eye candy, although some data files could be shared between architectures.

Hope this becomes a new trend; especially with DVD by bsharma · 2003-09-12 08:29 · Score: 5, Interesting

Hope this becomes a new trend; especially with DVDs. Then we can get rid of OS from hard drive entirely and just use a universally recognized file system on the HDD. You can boot whatever OS you want with the DVD and get the work done. Imagine four different people in your home using the same machine with four different OSs. The ultimate Virtual Machine!

EASIEST DEBIAN by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:33 · Score: 4, Insightful

This is now the easiest way of getting a debian system because the knoppix\morphix installer is so much better.

It creates a working system from the CDROM then gives you the option of installing to hard disk. Then with the setup version of APT the rest is childs play.

This should have happened to Debian ages ago -- it kicks the pants out of Redhat and its update proceedures. If you haven't tried it do....

Re:EASIEST DEBIAN by katsushiro · 2003-09-12 09:07 · Score: 2, Informative

ACtually, I know everyone's ignoring this post because it's by an AC, but he's got a very good point. Knoppix makes a Debian install absolutely brainless. I've used other distros before (Red Hat, Mandrake, Lycoris, mostly user-friendly desktop distros, I'm a Linux fan but not a hardcore Linux hacker, I just want an Open Source/Free desktop that *works*), but friends and net people kept telling me how much Debian rocked, how apt-get was better than sex, etc. etc. etc., so when I got my hands on a old PII machine, I decide to try and install Debian on it. I downloaded the official Debian CD's, and tried to do the installation, and suffered through the whole thing, muddling through as best I could. Even having set things up as well asI could, I ened up with a nearly unbootable system, X wouldn't start properly, and I was sorely dissapointed.

Then I remebered my trusty Knoppix Cd, which I sue to caryr around a Linux desktop everywhere and to show people that Linux *is* indeed useable for everyday tasks (I've gotten a few converts that way ;), and I remembered that there was an option somewhere in there to do a HD install from the CD, and that it basically turned into Debian when you were done, except with a whole bunch of handy apps installed allready. A bti of googling later, and I had the recipe for it. Needless to say, the install went without a hitch, and was very easy. Knoppix took care of all the sticky hardware config issues, and I just had to set a few prefs, before I ende dup with a perfectly usable Debian system. Some editing of my apt sources and one apt-get update and apt-get dist-upgrade later, and I was running the latest bleeding-edge Debian unstable, and finally experiencing the coolness of Debian for myself.

Frankly, the Debian folks would do well to take a cue from Knoppix and integrate its kickass hardware detection into their own installer (with an option to do the usual manual install and config for those geeks who actually know what theyre doing. ;)

--
"Two things are infinite: the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the first one." - Albert Einstein
Re:EASIEST DEBIAN by dilute · 2003-09-12 09:12 · Score: 3, Informative

Yes, Knoppix is a painless way to do an installation that trivially converts to official Debian. There is no catch that I am aware of.
Re:EASIEST DEBIAN by Hatta · 2003-09-12 09:34 · Score: 1

I haven't tried knoppix's installer. But to me the strength in the debian installer is that it's very simple to set up a basic system and then apt-get install only what I need. I can't stand these distro that by default install 8000 packages you'll never need, or even know are there. Does knoppix's installer install KDE, openoffice, etc automatically?

--
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
Re:EASIEST DEBIAN by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:44 · Score: 0

> I haven't tried knoppix's installer. But to me the strength in the debian installer is that it's very simple to set up a basic system and then apt-get install only what I need. I can't stand these distro that by default install 8000 packages you'll never need, or even know are there. Does knoppix's installer install KDE, openoffice, etc automatically?

Yes; the knx_install script basically copies the /... filesystem tree to the designated partition, decompressing on the fly as it goes (updates /etc/fstab). So, you get the whole shebang, some 1.9(?)Gb's worth.
Re:EASIEST DEBIAN by sewagemaster · 2003-09-12 16:31 · Score: 1

kde was installed by default, but i dont remember if openoffice was installed as well.

that's one drawback of the installation. another drawback is that if you want different partitions for, let's say for example, /var, /usr, /, the installer doesnt support that and you have to play around with files and move them, and edit the mappings in /etc/fstab.

another bug with the HD install is that lilo doesnt write to the MBR properly and (i dual boot win2k).

the OS on the CD is awesome though and i havent noticed any problems.

--
my blog
Re:EASIEST DEBIAN by CvD · 2003-09-13 00:26 · Score: 1

Except that you can't select which parts you want and which parts you don't want installed. It installs everything on the CD, many programs which you might never use. Oh sure, you could go through them with dpkg -l and apt-get remove them, but that is a lot of work. That said, using the hd-install script was 10x easier than the vanilla Debian install. Way to go, Knoppix! :-)

Cheers,

Costyn.

--
The Official Steve Ballmer Webpage

Comment removed by account_deleted · 2003-09-12 08:33 · Score: 1

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Consider waiting... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:34 · Score: 1, Insightful

And not just because the site will be Slashdotted.

I was seriously considering downloading this when the announcement appeared on GnomeDesktop.org, but decided to hold off until the next release.

First, this was announced the same day that Gnome 2.4 was announced. That sort of put a damper on things. I already had a (mostly) Gnome live CD via Morphix Heavy, and it wasn't clear that Gnoppix offered anything new.

Then there was also the issue of the English option being broken.

From what I've seen, the Gnoppix haven't been keeping as current as Morphix. I'm hoping that this changes in the near future, because Gnome 2.4 is starting to convince me that it's a viable desktop. In the mean time, I'll continue playing with Morphix.

no problem here by GoldenBear · 2003-09-12 08:34 · Score: 2, Funny

see, in order for this confusion to occur, a slashdotter would actually have to interact with another person in real life. However, on the internet, where we slashdotter's reside, everying is pronounced with spelled-out. so you see, there isn't any problem after all.

Re:no problem here by GoldenBear · 2003-09-12 08:37 · Score: 1

additionally, none of us take the time to ever proof-read ANYTHING!

WHAT A BUNCH OF ASSHATS by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:34 · Score: 0

n/t

Word to the wise... by bahamat · 2003-09-12 08:35 · Score: 4, Informative

I saw this posted on Debian Planet a few days ago and already downloaded a copy.

Unless you speak German, or are very familiar with the GNOME interface you're going to have a hard time using this. Booting with lang=en and setting your session type to en_US still won't switch the language to English. Now I have a nice coaster with "GNOPPIX 0.5" written with a Sharpie on it.

Too bad too. The only reason to get this over Knoppix or Lnx-BBC is for GNOME. Save your bandwidth for a few versions at least until the English support gets fixed. This is really a "too early to be slashdotted over" release, and they're going to lose a lot of potential users because of it's current condition.

It's also missing vital tools that all other live cds have, namely the ability to set up TCP/IP. The GNOME Network thingy didn't work, dhclient didn't work, there's no pump.

Gnoppix has potential to fill a nice little niche in the community, and when it's ready it'll be cool. But unless you're planning on helping out as a developer, wait on this one.

Re:Word to the wise... by tempest303 · 2003-09-12 09:02 · Score: 1

Any idea why it's missing all this stuff? I mean, Knoppix has TCP/IP tools, etc, so why doesn't Gnoppix?

--
The Free desktop that Just Works
Re:Word to the wise... by rm_monterey · 2003-09-12 09:18 · Score: 2, Interesting

I think they are trying to minimize the size of the system so it will fit on a mini-CD or one of those business card CD's.
Still, it's a pain to not have any of that stuff. And, since it's running from CD, it's not so easy to just install more packages.
Re:Word to the wise... by bahamat · 2003-09-12 10:23 · Score: 1

The thing that was really disappointing to me is that I'm a considerably experienced Linux (and Debian) user, and I couldn't get the network up. I only spent about 10 minutes with it because I was at work, but there's not much more you can do than to call ifconfig and dhclient manually to bring the interface up.

I didn't bother trying to figure out why it wouldn't come up either, but I suspect it's either a missing kernel module or horribly misconfigured dhclient config. Like I said in my previous post, what they do have working is nice, and it'll be even nicer once it's complete.
Re:Word to the wise... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 16:57 · Score: 0

damn I missed your post and too have made a nice coaster out a perfectly good cdr.

Any recomendations for a good GUI based live cd?

Thanks.

I might bring this to work and give it to someone.. I just happen to work for a german company.
Re:Word to the wise... by mopsuestia · 2003-09-13 03:00 · Score: 1

I never had any problems. I use Knoppix regularly from the CD and also have installed it to the hard disk of computers without seeing any German. And I never even gave any boot flags to tell it to use English.

You should notice that there are two ISO's for each release. One has DE in the name and one has EN. I have gotten the EN release of every version since April or May and can't remember ever having a problem.
Re:Word to the wise... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-13 04:48 · Score: 0

dammit I should have RTFC

Logo by Snorp · 2003-09-12 08:36 · Score: 0, Redundant

Please update the gnome logo. Thank you.

Maintaining the tradition that is Gnome. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:40 · Score: 0

Lets see. Repeatedly bork what was fixed in the last rev. Fail to offer thanks to the true source. Sounds like standard operating procedure Gnome all over.

Re:How do you pronounce this? (with more ) by jjhlk · 2003-09-12 08:42 · Score: 1

The G isn't a matter of your dialect, it's just a matter of proper pronunciation of a name.

Gnu is pronounced Guh-new, because Richard Stallman (I think) said so. And I assume that convention carries over to any G prefixed words (in the right context).

You wouldn't call Bjarne Stroustrup Buh-jarn just because that's how you think you say it. It's Be-yarn-uh.

Or so I think... :)

The gnome translate-o-matic! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:44 · Score: 3, Funny

Ever since Gnome 2.4 was released, I have found more and more gnome zealots who MUST absolutely advocate GNOME at every possible moment. Here is a guide to some of their claims, and what they really mean.

Unlike KDE, gnome is free
Translation : GPL is freerer than LGPL. LGPL allows corporations like Ximian and Sun to have propeitry forks and lock away their changes from the user. Now that novell has taken over ximan you can expect gnome to get put under corpirate lock.

Nautilus is much better than konqueror.
Wrong, if your using nautilus for anything more than a simple finder clone you can forget it. No split screen, no ioslaves and forget about being able to have a decent file dialog.

Gnome is easier to use
Yep, nothing like using gconf-editor to edit all except the most trivial of settings

Gnome has eye candy
Yes, my pirated Win32 fonts with the patent infringing font renderer. Bit stream vera sans looks like Tahoma put through a shreadder!

Gnome has a new web browser
Yawb! Along with Galeon, mozilla, thunderbird, konqueror, atlantis, lynx, netscape and w3m. Yes i need another browser! Not to mention that its got a religiously offensive name and it dosen't allow bookmark folders. It also crashes like a crazy! Apple chose khtml for a REASON! its stable and light!

Gnome is themeable
Yep, choose from High, low and medium contrast, default, and clean ice. Wan't to change the colour scheme? USE GCONF NOOB.

Gnome has multimedia framework
Its a kludge of esd combined with broken xine libraries. No wonder it crashes all the time and dosen't work on 95% of video files

Gnome allows mac like operatoin.
x86 compatible 1 button mice are almost impossible to find, and it dosen't copy the whole macbar concept. Not to even mention their auto apply implementation is broken and dangerous! Plus if they did actually come anywhere close to copying the mac the C&D letters would come flying up their asses!

Gnome is GNU software.
gnu/Yay, gnu/gnome gnu/for gnu/my gnu/debian gnu/linux gnu/500mhz /gnu/celeron gnu/packard gnu/bell gnu/box.

Inspired by the gentoo translate-o-matic.

Re:The gnome translate-o-matic! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:24 · Score: 0

... when SCO win their lawsuit ...

Now you're just talking crazy.
Re:The gnome translate-o-matic! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:32 · Score: 0

"Gnome is themeable Yep, choose from High, low and medium contrast, default, and clean ice. Wan't to change the colour scheme? USE GCONF NOOB." http://art.gnome.org and http://gdesklets.gnomedesktop.org/ I have been trying to use KDE for quite some time now. I have simply surrendered and returned to Gnome for various reaons. One of those being that Gnome is completely and utterly themable whereas KDE is not. The choices for KDE customization are limited when compared to Gnome. "Gnome has eye candy Yes, my pirated Win32 fonts with the patent infringing font renderer. Bit stream vera sans looks like Tahoma put through a shreadder!" See above. http://www.kde-look.org cannot compare to the vast options available for Gnome (links given above) "Gnome has multimedia framework Its a kludge of esd combined with broken xine libraries. No wonder it crashes all the time and dosen't work on 95% of video files" Are you serious? Can you even configure your machine? Are you 12? Try setting up your machine correctly and then get back to me. Everything "just works" could easily be said of Gnome.
Re:The gnome translate-o-matic! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:35 · Score: 0

propeitry ... corpirate ... shreadder

I hear the latest version comes with a dictionary and a spelling checker. Maybe you should look into it.
Re:The gnome translate-o-matic! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 22:44 · Score: 0

Unlike KDE, gnome is free
Translation : GPL is freerer than LGPL. LGPL allows corporations like Ximian and Sun to have propeitry forks and lock away their changes from the user. Now that novell has taken over ximan you can expect gnome to get put under corpirate lock.

Ximian has been working mostly on mono, evolution and ximian desktop, that is based on gnome but not gnome. Novell taking over ximian doesn't mean it's taken over gnome. By a far shot. And even in the almost impossible case it did, the source is here with a free license. Anyone is free to fork.

Nautilus is much better than konqueror.
Wrong, if your using nautilus for anything more than a simple finder clone you can forget it. No split screen, no ioslaves and forget about being able to have a decent file dialog.

I agree that konqueror is better. But the file dialog is in gtk, not nautilus itself. It's being reworked for gtk 2.4, btw.

Gnome has eye candy
Yes, my pirated Win32 fonts with the patent infringing font renderer. Bit stream vera sans looks like Tahoma put through a shreadder!

Huh? You mean that situation isn't the same in other linux desktops? Last time I tried to get an usable free font, the only choice was Vera. Also, what's wrong about the font renderer? It's used by many projects and I still haven't heard about patent enforcement on it. Hell, if we are gonna talk about patents, Adobe patented tabs.

Not to mention that its got a religiously offensive name

Epiphany? Why should it be offensive? Even if you take the religious meaning (it's a word with two meanings), it doesn't sound offensive to any religion. Except if you consider that religious people go always medieval when they hear there are other religions around, of course.

Gnome is themeable
Yep, choose from High, low and medium contrast, default, and clean ice.

http://art.gnome.org

Wan't to change the colour scheme? USE GCONF NOOB.

Actually, it's in ~/.gtkrc

Gnome has multimedia framework
Its a kludge of esd combined with broken xine libraries. No wonder it crashes all the time and dosen't work on 95% of video files

http://www.gstreamer.net . It's very different when compared with xine libraries, btw. Versions 0.6.x have been very stable. As for video files, the integration of latest ffmpeg will fix that.

Overall, it's a funny post. But just in case someone seriously considered the flawed points...

Where's LAPTOPPIX? by NoOneInParticular · 2003-09-12 08:47 · Score: 2, Informative

Just checked out Knoppix on a new laptop and noticed there wasn't any APM (APCI) support built in the kernel. Does anyone work on a cd to be used for a basic working linux install on a laptop?

Re:Where's LAPTOPPIX? by codepunk · 2003-09-12 08:49 · Score: 1

Give slackware live or Vector linux a shot. I do not know if they have apm but they are one hell of alot lighter than knoppix.

--

Got Code?

MacDVD booting. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:48 · Score: 1, Interesting

"DVDs just dont have this. DVDs arent multisession either. So they need an entirely different kludge.
"

And yet Solaris 8 and 9, and MacOSX 10.2 can do it.

So what's Linux's excuse again?

Re:MacDVD booting. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:31 · Score: 0

So what's Linux's excuse again?
"M$ sux"

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by RumpRoast · 2003-09-12 08:50 · Score: 1

I think gnomes are little small guys with hats that show up when you are really, really shitfaced.

--

My Ass hurts.

Re:Thanks. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:52 · Score: 0

I don't know what a friggin' GNOPPIX is and I've been using Linux since 1994.

I routinely ignore all news about Gnome because it's all hot air. If a Linux GUI is ever to succeed it's gotta be a clone of the Windows GUI. With HIG, Gnome is just killing itself.

Virtual Machine? by bucky0 · 2003-09-12 08:53 · Score: 1

I realise that the bochs and plex86 projects are still in alpha stages, but is there any plan to port a knoppix CD to run under bochs? Then, if you provided different emulation binaries for different OS's(win98, 2000, linux, freebsd, etc...), you could run your own linux virtual system from the CD without having to reboot.

--

-Bucky

Re:Hope this becomes a new trend; especially with by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:54 · Score: 0

Then we can get rid of OS from hard drive entirely and just use a universally recognized file system on the HDD. You can boot whatever OS you want with the DVD ...

That's a great idea. Who wants to boot their computer on the FAST internal magnetic hard drive when their slow optical drive is just sitting there doing nothing?

Better yet. Maybe we should bring back punchcard readers to boot the OS from. That way, you can just carry your stack from computer to computer.

Redhat 14.2 on specially marked boxes of Cheerios. Just cut the card from the back of the box. Collect all 14922 of them any have your very own bootable Linux distribution!

Morphix Can by codepunk · 2003-09-12 08:55 · Score: 1

Morphix command saveconfig will burn your config to a usb device.

--

Got Code?

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by The_DOD_player · 2003-09-12 08:55 · Score: 1

Its seems like a very cumbersome way to do this.

Like mentioned, a USB flash drive would be more appropriate here.

Also, very few computers even has a DVD/RW drive yet.

But hey! we can dream ;))

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by swb · 2003-09-12 08:55 · Score: 2, Interesting

Bzzt wrong answer.

You can make a bootable DVD-ROM, I've done it, and booted a number of systems with DVD-Rs. We migrated a number of our system imaging CDs (which with Win2k were spanned) onto DVD-Rs, and its almost like the good ol' Win95 days again; multiple system images on a single bootable DVD-R.

We can realistically only fit about 3 of the newest images (which are pigged out with every application the desktop support crew can think of adding), but it kind of rox0rs, as kids are fond of saying these days.

What's the point? by Eric+Ass+Raymond · 2003-09-12 08:55 · Score: 0, Troll

I mean what's the point?

This is a perfect example of how the open source community is wasting its resources. Instead of concentrating on one definitive GUI, let's fight it out between two major ones. Let's confuse the end-users and sabotage the creation of any kind of stable culture of actual Linux applications.

Good work, zealots.

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BOO! TERRO

Re:What's the point? by bobsledbob · 2003-09-12 09:09 · Score: 1

You know, I'm so sick of hearing this argument. While I agree we are split between KDE & Gnome, do you really think that either one of these projects would be as good as they are if it weren't for the competition between them?

You just naturally think that if all the KDE and Gnome developers were to join teams, you'd instantly see a doubling of production for that one 'definitive' gui. This is just simply foolish thinking.

The Open Source community thrives because of the opportunities for competition. It allows the market to truly determine the winners and losers, rather than the big company monarchs of years past.

--
Beware of geeks bearing formulas.
Re:What's the point? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:13 · Score: 0

That's even more stupid. They're competing over... what again? Winners and losers of... what?

Bwahahaha.

Flamebait!? :D by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 08:57 · Score: 0

You're kidding, right?
Cold facts, Gnome sucks.
Eat it.

Kernel Version? by ciroknight · 2003-09-12 08:58 · Score: 1

Anyone know the Kernel version of this release? I tried Knoppix, but due to Alan Cox's "patch" my sound doesnt work under linux (the only think keeping me on windows as of now). If this release is running 2.4.22, My switch is complete :D

--
"Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is." G.W.Bush

Morphix+Gnoppix by AlXtreme · 2003-09-12 08:59 · Score: 4, Informative

well, I do want to note that Morphix has had a Gnome module for about 6 months now (was the second thing i made, after the really nice XFCE4 desktop-module, my personal fav.). Saw something about Gnome 2.4 in another comment... you never know what I have been cooking up :)

anyway, Gnoppix will be using Morphix's install/configuration tools. I've talked to Sven of the Gnoppix team, and it seems like they don't like inventing the wheel again, so we'll work on them together (now just to convince them on using our modular design, but we'll leave that for another day). You can read his notice here.

Currently we have the (gtk2) installer and a few configuration tools, but a (gtk2) partitioner is nearing completion which will replace cfdisk, together with a few new tools bundled together in a control-panel-thingy. Debian is too nice to be user-unfriendly :)

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This sig is intentionally left blank

Pronouncing a KN cluster by yerricde · 2003-09-12 09:05 · Score: 3, Informative

Ka-nop-ix

If that sounds too silly for you, like Disney's Tigger trying to say "ka-night" or "ka-nife", try whispering the schwa that you insert between the K and the N. After a few times of saying that, you'll fall into the correct pronunciation of a non-English KN cluster (which is incidentally how KN was pronounced in English before it lost initial stop-nasal clusters).

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Will I retire or break 10K?

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by IamTheRealMike · 2003-09-12 09:08 · Score: 1

The reason it's split into lots of little packages is because distro packagers have explicitly said they prefer it that way, indeed I remember a debate about it on IRC one time when fcrozat, who works for Mandrake, said he found the smaller packages far more convenient because it made it simpler to push security updates. With one large package, you have to push the whole thing each and every time, which isn't so great for dialup users. While you may have disliked it for your distro, that's not the feedback they were getting from most.

If you can't get Gnome building into /opt, then you did something wrong. I've used Garnome to build and install gnome into many, many different prefixes, include /opt/gnome2, ~/.gargnome, ~/Source/garnome and so on. I'm not a Gnome hacker, nor a distro developer, I'm just a user, so if I can do it, why can't you?

4.7 GB CDs by dlosey · 2003-09-12 09:08 · Score: 1

With DVD-Rs now out, it is just a matter of time before they pretty much replace the old 700 MB CD-Rs. It will be interesting to see how this project develops once it has more space to play around with. I wonder if they will soon have a CD-R version and a DVD-R version. DVDs could increase to 17GB and allow pretty much everything to fit onto 1 CD. This is assuming new technology, such as drivers, doesn't bloat it. (I hope to God linux doesn't ever grow exponentially in size with every release, like another popular OS)

Re:4.7 GB CDs by Nerdy · 2003-09-12 11:04 · Score: 1

I tend to agree with you, but one of the limiting factors is bandwidth. On today's home broadband connection, a regular live cd of say 400MB can be downloaded fairly quickly... hour or so... but a 17GB live cd would take quite a lot longer... day or two...
Re:4.7 GB CDs by mgv · 2003-09-12 13:24 · Score: 1

With DVD-Rs now out, it is just a matter of time before they pretty much replace the old 700 MB CD-Rs. It will be interesting to see how this project develops once it has more space to play around with.

Yeah - they will be able to include the source code.

Michael.

(No doubt the moderators will not appreciate the humour of this comment).

--
There is no cryptographic solution to the problem where the intended receiver and the attacker are the same entity.
Re:4.7 GB CDs by e5z8652 · 2003-09-12 15:11 · Score: 1

but a 17GB live cd would take quite a lot longer... day or two...

Hey, I only get 5GB a month. Make that 3 1/2 months for me!

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null sig
Re:4.7 GB CDs by jonadab · 2003-09-12 17:54 · Score: 1

> but a 17GB live cd would take quite a lot longer... day or two...
> Hey, I only get 5GB a month. Make that 3 1/2 months for me!

cheapbytes.com -- never underestimate the bandwidth of Priority Mail.

--
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.

Multiple .torrents for multiple trackers by yerricde · 2003-09-12 09:09 · Score: 1

But still, the trackers served a lot more people before being flooded than an FTP server in the same situation would have. Having several trackers and making a .torrent pointing at each one would be a good idea for a file that you expect to be extremely popular.

--
Will I retire or break 10K?

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by yerricde · 2003-09-12 09:17 · Score: 1

El Torito bootable CDs have nothing to do with multisession. An ISO contains only one data track of one session, and CDs burned from ISOs can be bootable.

The problem here is that El Torito may need to be extended to cover DVD media, and this is in part a firmware issue.

--
Will I retire or break 10K?

Knoppix by Vampyre_Dark · 2003-09-12 09:19 · Score: 1

I was always under the impression that if I wanted to use gnome in knoppix I could just toggle it at the startup screen?

Re:Knoppix by damiam · 2003-09-12 09:34 · Score: 1

Nope. That option was removed because they only wanted to maintain one desktop.

--
It's hard to be religious when certain people are never incinerated by bolts of lightning.
Re:Knoppix by Vampyre_Dark · 2003-09-12 11:46 · Score: 1

And now after going to the knoppix site, the author has shut the project down. :o(
Re:Knoppix by damiam · 2003-09-12 12:28 · Score: 1

knoppix.org is closed. knoppix.net is still up and working fine.

--
It's hard to be religious when certain people are never incinerated by bolts of lightning.

knoppix 3.1 had gnome? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:19 · Score: 0

didn't knoppix 3.1 have gnome? 3.2 doesn't seem to.

not that i give a shit.

Re:Needs more Pogo. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:19 · Score: 1, Interesting

Why don't you get, like, a *real* project to work for instead of blabbing off about how you're "contributing" to the open sores kommunisty? They don't like you, you know.

What I wanna see is... by ScottBob · 2003-09-12 09:22 · Score: 1

... a bootable Linux distro that has Freevo on it. Just insert CD, boot, and it's all ready to go, freeing up the entire hard drive for recording and time-shifting live TV.

Re:What I wanna see is... by sn0wcrash · 2003-09-12 17:30 · Score: 1

There is a Knoppix based MythTV bootable distro. Check out the list archives.

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:22 · Score: 0

+4 Interesting???????

Check out his journal and posting history. The real Miguel de Icaza is at http://slashdot.org/~miguel/

700MB ha! try 2.1GB by mabhatter654 · 2003-09-12 09:29 · Score: 1

The current Knoppix CD unpacks to 2.1GB when not chloop'd! Considering the CD has both KDE, Gnome, several minor WdM's as well as most of the common server software...perl, php, mysql, apache, samba... and desktop software...Koffice, "Gnu" office, openoffice.org...it's not a "tiny" distro. That said, it's heavily biased to KDE because of space issues that Gnome apps get cut first.

With persistant home and stored configs, you can store all your settings on a removable device and take your "desktop" anywhere there's a PC!

Re:700MB ha! try 2.1GB by mgv · 2003-09-12 13:26 · Score: 1

The current Knoppix CD unpacks to 2.1GB when not chloop'd! Considering the CD has both KDE, Gnome, several minor WdM's as well as most of the common server software...perl, php, mysql, apache, samba... and desktop software...Koffice, "Gnu" office, openoffice.org...it's not a "tiny" distro. That said, it's heavily biased to KDE because of space issues that Gnome apps get cut first.

Actually, it doesn't contain Gnome. Thats the point of this whole slashdot submission.

Michael

--
There is no cryptographic solution to the problem where the intended receiver and the attacker are the same entity.
Re:700MB ha! try 2.1GB by godzilla808 · 2003-09-15 03:17 · Score: 1

I think he was talking about actual apps that normally come with Gnome, not Gnome itself. (You can run many Gnome apps in KDE.)

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...///...
Re:700MB ha! try 2.1GB by mabhatter654 · 2003-09-15 12:10 · Score: 1

you're right! Klaus yanked Gnome in recent versions. The first version I used 5-20 still had gnome as an option. Of course, I mostly use the default setup. Once the Gnoppix servers get back from being killed I plan to try it out...gnome looks more interesting....and most setups use KDE by default now anyway..

Damn Small Linux by zephc · 2003-09-12 09:32 · Score: 1

If you're looking for a 50 MB live Linux, try Damn Small Linux

--
"I would say that 99 per cent of what my father has written about his own life is false." - L. Ron Hubbard Jr.

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:32 · Score: 0

Like THIS? :)http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=400 2&sid=a6891cc73a78f51111d6921584605365
Google for LinuxTag DVD.

Just to add more whoring... by soloport · 2003-09-12 09:33 · Score: 3, Informative

Yes. And over a year ago, I scrounged around the lab for a thrown-away PC just so I could try Knoppix, for the first time.

My impression: Piece of shit!!!!

Try as I may, I couldn't 'mount -t ext2 /dev/hda[1|2|3|4|5]' to save me! Well, that was my *first* impression. It melted into shocking admiration when I discovered no hard drive in the chassis (was a really scavenged box).

Been a loyal Knoppix fanatic ever since. [Gushes]

In fact I was at a customer's site, last week and the customer wanted to move their ACT! DB to a centralized server (I'm not making this up). They were running Windows 95 on a PC they had manually used as a "central" ACT! DB for years. The OS wouldn't configure the NIC card I gave it, so...

You guessed it: Knoppix to the rescue! I had that DB off the machine in less than an hour (rsync'ed to a Samba share on the main server).

Mike, you wanna pass the plate around?

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 09:36 · Score: 0

If you can't get Gnome building into /opt, then you did something wrong.

It's not that it can't be done, simply that it sucks far worse that way. Where do you draw the line? Should GTK2 be installed into /opt/gnome? How about glib? With GNOME, the lines get blurred when you start thinking about using /opt/gnome. With KDE you need only set your prefix appropriately.

How about /etc/opt/gnone? Is that a good idea?
Or /var/opt/gnome? I've seen that too.

Plus, you start to do that and mere mortals will not know how to set the appropriate --prefix, --sysconfdir, and --localstatedir, and things won't compile for them. The only way to make that work for non-gurus is putting all the stuff under /usr, and hoping they use --prefix=/usr because /usr/local won't mix well either.

Believe me, I know these issues all too well...

Obligitory Python Reference.... by deadcasuals · 2003-09-12 09:36 · Score: 1

I blow my nose at your so called distro! You and all your silly English "ka-noppix"!

Now go away before I taunt you a second time-a!

Knoppix has Gnome too! by bazik · 2003-09-12 09:38 · Score: 4, Informative

Err, whats the use of Gnoppix?

With Knoppix you can just enter

knoppix desktop=gnome

at the boot prompt and it gives you a wonderfull Gnome2 desktop.

--

--
One by one the penguins steal my sanity...

Re:Knoppix has Gnome too! by UserGoogol · 2003-09-12 10:58 · Score: 3, Informative

No. As mentioned elsewhere, that feature was removed with 3.2. 3.1 is still very available, (at CheapBytes.com for instance) but... uh... it's not 3.2.

--
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." -- Hanlon's Razor

FTP Filesystem (a simpler solution) by weston · 2003-09-12 09:44 · Score: 1

All we really -- most of us being web geeks who have bought hosting somewhere -- is filesystem that will mount remote volumes via FTP. Presto, you have portions of your filetree that you can save anywhere.

(OK, OK, to get things really smooth you have to be able to write back to the disk so that you don't have to do the mounting yourself, but still...)

--
Tweet, tweet.

Re:FTP Filesystem (a simpler solution) by zwoelfk · 2003-09-12 09:54 · Score: 2, Informative

LUFS does what you want -- it will allow you to mount locally to/via ftp, ssh, gnutella, gnome vfs, memory cards, and CE devices.
Here's a discussion of people wanting to include it in the boot scripts for Knoppix.
Re:FTP Filesystem (a simpler solution) by mabhatter654 · 2003-09-12 10:07 · Score: 1

Knoppix could do this! It already has a feature called persistant home which works for HDD, and Flash memory. It could be updated to include FTP too!

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by IamTheRealMike · 2003-09-12 09:46 · Score: 1

Should GTK2 be installed into /opt/gnome? How about glib?

As they aren't a part of Gnome, probably not, but then Gnome isn't a monolithic set of libraries. Why draw arbitrary distinctions in the sand like that? That is what /usr is for. SuSE have this habit of putting KDE and GNOME in /opt, and I'm not sure why, when I used SuSE it just caused me grief for apparently no good reason.

The only way to make that work for non-gurus is putting all the stuff under /usr, and hoping they use --prefix=/usr because /usr/local won't mix well either.

Well, I have Gnome installed in /usr, and have compiled stuff that depends on it to /usr/local just fine, I'm not sure what doesn't mix well there.... it seems you are deliberately making things hard on yourself.

Indeed by phorm · 2003-09-12 09:50 · Score: 1

Though I find that the iceWM distro of Morphix is a bit nicer than whatever current desktop they are running on the primary (some variety of KDE).

From what I remember, morphix in the light variety fits onto a mini-CD (those wallet-sized ones) with a small GUI.

The OS we really need... by Andrewkov · 2003-09-12 10:02 · Score: 3, Funny

What we really need is an Emacs live CD, forget Linux! Just boot into Emacs!

Re:The OS we really need... by JunkDNA · 2003-09-12 14:45 · Score: 2, Funny

No... you troll! What we really need is a vi live CD, forget Emacs! Just boot into vi!

gnoppix boxes by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:09 · Score: 0

Imagine a Beowolf Cluster of THESE!!!

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by antiMStroll · 2003-09-12 10:19 · Score: 1

Better yet, an option to mount a USB dongle under /home. It's a trivial mod to any Live CD and would make an amazing portable computing environment.

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:22 · Score: 0

Well, I have Gnome installed in /usr, and have compiled stuff that depends on it to /usr/local just fine, I'm not sure what doesn't mix well there.... it seems you are deliberately making things hard on yourself.

Am I? I've found that pkgconfig has a hell of a time trying to locate .pc files unless they are in /usr/lib/pkgconfig. Like I said, yes -- it can be done. But the tricks I know about there involve ugly symlink kludges all over the place pointing into and out of /usr, and still compiles will end up breaking if include files aren't found in /usr/include (solution: more links to kludge things, that don't really belong in any package but end up needed by them all). Many of the problems will be sutble (missing menus, features, docs).

Not exactly what I'd call "clean", but GNOME zealots love it anyway. Can't get most of them to acknowledge the basic design flaws though.

"K"noppix, "G"noppix, Morphix, etc by Gta-Klue · 2003-09-12 10:27 · Score: 1

As a current "K"noppix user, I think it's the best thing since I switched to Debian 2 years ago.

After using Mandrake for years, and a failure to get pre-woody installed, I decided to switch and give Debian a try. Since then I havn't wanted to switch. BUT, Debian is terribly behind in the software versions. Yes, it is stable, but I wanted Eye Candy too!

Enter "K"noppix. Great hardware detection, boots live on the CD, linux without the install hassles. BUT, you can also install it to your HD. How sweet is that? NVidia drivers work, network, latests software from testing/unstable all that and the eye candy to boot!

Oh, and did I mention that installing Gnome 2.2.2 was easy as apt-get ? ;)

The live cd distro's really do help in swaying someone who's not sure if they want to install linux or not. I applaud "K"noppix, "G"noppix, and Morphix for what they are doing for the linux community.

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This is PURE EAU DE TROLLETTE
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

Re:"K"noppix, "G"noppix, Morphix, etc by Felis+Rex · 2003-09-13 12:14 · Score: 1

For the same reasons you switched to Debian, but lament the age of the packages, I switched to FreeBSD. Not only is it stabe as hell, but administration is easier and the nice thig is, I have stability and cutting edge apps galore. I decided it was going to be Debian or Slack when I got frustrated with Mandrake, and then realized... why settle for "close to UNIX when I can have the real thing?" Just my 0.02

--
"it's only after disaster that you can be born resurected" - My friend Dave

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by UserGoogol · 2003-09-12 10:49 · Score: 1

Perhaps, but there was nothing inherently trollish about his post. You moderate the post, not the person.

--
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." -- Hanlon's Razor

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:57 · Score: 0

This post would not have a +4 if it wasnt for the name.

Can these be made to work in Internet Cafe's ? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 10:59 · Score: 0

While I am blessed with my own PC and laptop, with a personal internet connection at home and wireless connectivity in most friends/family homes, not everyone in the world is so lucky.

I have relatives in India for example, whose primary means of connecting to the 'net is through Internet Cafe's. These cafe's seem to uniformly run MS Windows, and there is good reason to believe that every single one of the machines there have been compromised through various exploits. (Clear indications of passwords being stolen, etc...)

It would be wonderful if I could just send them CDs running *noppix that they could plop in the Internet Cafe computers, reboot, and then browse the net feeling secure that they can trust the software running. All that they need is the basic functionality already present in Knoppix.

Has anybody done this? Any thoughts?

Re:Can these be made to work in Internet Cafe's ? by yuri+benjamin · 2003-09-12 18:35 · Score: 1

It would be wonderful if I could just send them CDs running *noppix that they could plop in the Internet Cafe computers, reboot, and then browse the net feeling secure that they can trust the software running. All that they need is the basic functionality already present in Knoppix.

Has anybody done this? Any thoughts?

I don't think Internet Cafe owners would like customers by-passing their usage meter.
They could ask the owner if it's okay and watch the clock manually.

--
You make the mistake of thinking you can educate the fundamental stupidity out of people. You can't.
Re:Can these be made to work in Internet Cafe's ? by fwarren · 2003-09-12 20:50 · Score: 1

It depends on two things 1) that the hardware of the computer at the cafe is linux/knoppix compatible 2) the networking/proxy setup of the cafe If the cafe has a proxy that requires a MS windows domain type login to use, then knoppix will not be able to log into the domain. It is much more likley that the machines either use a static IP address or DHPC to get their IP address. If they use DHPC, then knoppix will autoconfigure and everything will be fine. If it is a static IP address, the user will need to know the correct IP address for the machine and the correct IP address for the gateway and nameserver to get a good net connection. There is a configuration option to set this up, once you have that information.

--
vi + /etc over regedit any day of the week.

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 11:04 · Score: 0

GNOME is what made KDE into free software.

Greetings RMS woshipper!

KDE was already free software. The reason RMS threw a fit was because it didn't use the GPL, not because it wasn't free.

The QPL is actually quite a bit less restrictive than the GPL! But obviously you've never read the QPL. Probably not the GPL either.

Game specific Live CDs?-emulators. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 11:05 · Score: 0

" Plenty of emulator specific live CD's around, for folks that build MAME machines and whatnot. An RTCW live CD would need to be reburned every other day when new/updated drivers and cards come out..."

Not necessarally. The CD could be set to check a USB keychain for updated drivers.

Anyway the "emulation" idea could expand the Live CD beyond it's present boundaries. That's why I called it a "Killer App". Think of all the emulators that run on Linux, and the respective software that runs on them. Now run all that on a LiveCD.

Exactly! Debian for us non-tech Gn-urus by leftie · 2003-09-12 11:58 · Score: 1

There are a whole lot of us out here who believe in the free software movement and/or wanted access to apt-get to get away from the annoying rpm/gzip update process, and wanted to have a Debian system. However, Debian clings to it's god-awful installation process like Deep-South college fraternities cling to physically-abusive pledging rituals. Debian could be a much better tech skill learning platform if more could access it. Knoppix has made it possible for pretty much anyone to have a Debian distro with a simple hard disk installation process and excellent hardware detection. Gnoppix will thrive or fail based on whether they follow the Knoppix installation model, or continue to refuse to change the Debian attitude toward difficult installation procedures.

Re:Exactly! Debian for us non-tech Gn-urus by Felis+Rex · 2003-09-13 11:58 · Score: 1

Now if only FreeBSD had something along these lines for an installer. I mean, installing FreeBSD isn't hard (once you've done it 10 or 20 times, and if you know your hardware, and understand distribution sets and so on), and it's easier to install than Debian probably, but I bet FreeBSD would certainly benefit from having a bootable version that you could just install fully configured. I know there's Freesbie, (freesbie.org) which is a bootable FreeBSD, but they don't say anything about a disk dump install.

--
"it's only after disaster that you can be born resurected" - My friend Dave
Re:Exactly! Debian for us non-tech Gn-urus by leftie · 2003-09-14 11:09 · Score: 1

Or OpenBSD as well. I bought the OpenBSD disks set when they got their funding cut by DARPA when the developer made an anti-war comment. I'd love to put them to use and start learning to use the OS, but I have the technical skill set you would expect from an ex-headbanger DJ. (I have moved up from one finger hunt n' peck typing to a bizarre 4 finger method in the last 10 years... that's about the extent of my improvement... I CAN type apt-get update, though). I'm a supporter of free software in all it's forms, but they need to make it easier for the clueless among us to start the learning process.

Re:Hope this becomes a new trend; especially with by adolf · 2003-09-12 12:27 · Score: 1

Yes.

I fondly recall the days when the first step needed to use a personal computer was to insert a disk and then turn it on. If you were good, you could fit the software and the requisite OS parts all on one disk, and still have a bit of room left over for your own data.

Of course, I also remember how a bad floppy disk would ruin my day, usually due to slight, unintentional mishandling.

Sometime later, I got a 10MHz XT with a 20-megabyte drive, and I've never looked back.

Booting from removable media? Feh. We've got partition tables for a reason. FIPS/e2fsutils+LILO/grub works fine, and if it makes you squeemish or you've got NTFS[1] to fret over, good ol' Partition Magic has been making the multi-boot process easy for a number of years.

Let's stop dreaming in reverse, shall we?

Thanks.

[1]: Lack of mention of ReiserFS, XFS, JFS, HPFS, and all hellish incarnations of UFS intentional.

--
Kid-proof tablet..

I originally used KDE by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 12:33 · Score: 0

Then I gave up.

Too unstable, too unreliazble, too much work to keep up. Meanwhile, GNOME just works.

Things might be better now, though.

--Tim

Show Linux to newbies by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 12:45 · Score: 0

With a bootable cd like this, one could easily (I suppose, hardware issues ignored) show linux to the un-linuxed (or is the word "windowed") people in your vicinity, so they could get a look at what you have been talking about, without you having to lug a laptop around, etc.

Just let them borrow the CD (well, maybe you ought to be around when this thing boots), and the next thing you know, they'll want the real thing installed on their PC.

(fat chance, so this cd is for us to play with, etc. )

Re:Show Linux to newbies by M1FCJ · 2003-09-12 21:00 · Score: 1

Never had any hardware problems with Knoppix, from obsolete pentiums to state of the art AMD MP's...

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by t · 2003-09-12 12:57 · Score: 1

Sorry but defamation of Miguel or anyone else is not something to encourage. What's your name? I'll impersonate you for a few days, then send a link to my comments to your boss. Then we'll see if you still think that the username doesn't matter.

Imagine a Beo..... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 13:08 · Score: 0

Or check out the Cluster Knoppix distro and make thenm into an Open Mosix cluster
(obligatory link follows)
http://bofh.be/clusterknoppix/

Re:Pronouncing a KN cluster, without a vowel by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 13:15 · Score: 0

It's khh-nop-ix. English speakers tend to insert a voiced vowel between the k and the n, like an extra syllable. That is wrong. The k is strongly aspirated, so there is a hiss between the k and the n. But no vowel!

SuSE live-eval by MoreDruid · 2003-09-12 13:38 · Score: 1

SuSE also has a live-eval version of it's distro... It takes a hell of a long time, cause it installs on a virtual RAM-disk. So you get the actual install you want...
it seems to me that they're preferring configurability over speed. Need an extra load-balancing webserver? install kernel + apache & whatever you need on a users desktop and hey presto...

Imagine a beowulf cluster of those :) but seriously... you should be able to test clusters fairly easy this way, running only the software you would be running in a production environment.

--
The best weapon of a dictatorship is secrecy, but the best weapon of a democracy should be the weapon of openness.

Re:Now we need to make a bootable live DVD-RW dist by DarkSarin · 2003-09-12 13:55 · Score: 1

Have you not used SuSe linux? v7.1 (or whichever) has a 7 discs and one bootable DVD...

--
"We don't know what we are doing, but we are doing it very carefully,..." Wherry, R.J. Personnel Psychology (1995)

Just take it one tine at a time by Illbay · 2003-09-12 13:56 · Score: 2, Funny

Usually forks are more trouble than they're worth,...

Pretty much a "spoon man," eh?

--
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.

Mod Parent UP! by namespan · 2003-09-12 14:24 · Score: 1

This isn't just good for knoppix, this is *highly* cool.

--
Libertarianism is rich wolves and poor sheep playing gambler's ruin for dinner.

The key word is "whisper" by yerricde · 2003-09-12 14:25 · Score: 1

The k is strongly aspirated

Which is exactly what I was trying to get across by telling readers to whisper the schwa.

--
Will I retire or break 10K?

Re:The key word is "whisper" by FuzzyBad-Mofo · 2003-09-12 16:14 · Score: 1

Unfortunately, I don't know what in blue blazes a schwa might be!
Re:The key word is "whisper" by Holi · 2003-09-12 16:54 · Score: 1

It's an upside down/rotated e but I have no idea how to pronounce it.

--
Sorry, teleporters just kill you and then make a copy. A perfect, soul-less copy.
Re:The key word is "whisper" by MrMr · 2003-09-13 02:15 · Score: 1

pronounce it like the 'e' in 'how are you?'

a couple more by enos · 2003-09-12 15:33 · Score: 1

SuSE LiveCD
Gentoo LiveCD which also has a demo of UT2003 pre-installed and ready to run.

--
boldly going forward, 'cause we can't find reverse

Re:NOW THEY'VE FUCKED UP KNOPPIX!!! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 16:44 · Score: 0

^^^MOD PARENT UP^^^

Hmmmmm "knoppix desktop=gnome" by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 16:58 · Score: 0

Just use regular Knoppix and use "knoppix desktop=gnome" ?????

Seems like they only edited two files to make it boot to gnome.

Does SCO offer a discount on Live CD's by Dareth · 2003-09-12 17:17 · Score: 1

... or can I just "boot the evidence away!"

--

I only look human.
My mother is a halfling and my dad is an ogre, so that makes me an Ogreling

Its Gnome... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 17:30 · Score: 0

This is news? who gives a Sh*t?

NOT A TROLL by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 17:48 · Score: 0

Who do you suppose is being defamed? Explain!

Re:NOT A TROLL by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 22:24 · Score: 0

What the hell is wrong with you, people? Did Miguel steal your girlfriend or something?
Re:NOT A TROLL by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-13 06:53 · Score: 0

Miguel is gay

Games by jonadab · 2003-09-12 18:09 · Score: 1

Don't want to support N operating sytem versions, but want anyone
with a CD to be able to play your game? Distribute your game on a
LiveCD with the OS included; you get full control over the exact
version of every piece of software -- the only variables are the
hardware, then, and anyone with a PC can play your game.

Of course, for speed reasons you want to offer an option to install
to a disk image on the hard drive, and for that to be practical it
would be really nice to have read/write NTFS support. Hopefully
we'll get that Real Soon Now.

But the idea is solid.

--
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.

Re:Games by Kuraz · 2003-09-13 00:20 · Score: 1

this is not a new idea. It was common in the early 1980s that PC Games were bootable.
Re:Games by jonadab · 2003-09-13 01:06 · Score: 1

> It was common in the early 1980s that PC Games were bootable.

Yes, but this was abandoned when two things happened:

1) Due to advances in computer technology, most computers had
these cool new things called "hard drives", many of which
would hold up to ten megabytes or more.

2) Due to advances in game technology, driven by consumer
demand for graphics, some of the games were starting to
have a little trouble fitting on a single 360K floppy.
If the game were designed to be installed onto the hard
drive, you could put it on *two* floppies, which allowed
more than twice as many graphics.

--
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.

Introducing People to Linux... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 19:21 · Score: 2, Interesting

I've used Knoppix to introduce many newbies to Linux.

The most innovative way I've used Knoppix to bring more people to Linux was introducing the idea of using it as the demonstation OS for computers that are to be auctioned.

The place from where I usually buy my machines had a problem. Following a visitation by a flying goon squad from Australian's version of the BSA, this auction house suddenly discovered that they could not install a certain well known OS on computers to be auctioned. Previously, they did a minimal install to enable people to see that the machines were in good working order etc. Now, it was not possible to show that computer systems were in good working order.

I solved my problem of ensuring that machines were working prior to bidding by running Knoppix on them... In turn I introduced to the auction house the idea of using Knoppix to demo *all* their working systems. They took up the idea and solved their problem of demonstrating the machines working with a "legal" OS. It's a beautiful sight watching 50 Linux desktops running in the same room :)

The upshot of all this is that hundreds of "literate" and "semiliterate" computer buyers are getting their first ever hands-on exposure to Linux when they test machines prior to auction. The auctioneers tell me that they have been getting many enquiries about where to get Knoppix!! Incidently, the "killer app" on Knoppix appears to be the game "Frozen Bubble" :)

A more polished version of Gnoppix with the En lang items fixed will offer another choice for converting newbies over to Linux. More power to them :)

For backups and forensics. by TheLink · 2003-09-12 19:39 · Score: 1

There are very many uses.

One example use: I use it to backup my systems.

In fact I'm doing it right now whilst browsing the internet.

Method: stick source HDD in top drive tray.
Stick destination backup HDD in bottom drive tray (big HDD).
Stick knoppix/gnoppix in CDROM drive.
Boot up knoppix
knoppix noswap
(noswap is if you want to be proper and not let it touch the hdds at all. Actually doesn't matter if it's for normal backup and not for forensics).
Launch a shell.
su -
#turn on DMA (hope your drives support DMA ;) )
hdparm -d1 /dev/hda
hdparm -d1 /dev/hdc
#mount the second hdd (assume you've already formatted it to a filesystem that supports multi GB files e.g. xfs, unless you want to use split).
mount /mnt/hdc
#I've got a directory called bkp.
cd /mnt/hdc/bkp
#do the backup. I like timing it for some reason
time dd bs=131072 if=/dev/hda | gzip -c -6 > hostname-2003-09-13.gz
(-6 is the right balance of speed and and compression for me -9 is a lot slower and only gives you a file slightly smaller mabye 5%? bzip is way too slow).

The great thing is you can browse the web, read slashdot, etc whilst waiting for stuff to backup. It does slow down the backup somewhat esp when you need to access the CDROM drive, but hey you can always not use the PC.

BTW, if anyone says CPUs are really fast, well they aren't fast enough to backup a HDD at 40MB/sec yet. I average about 11-15MB/sec.

A 40GB HDD typically gzips to about 12-20GB and takes about 45-60 minutes. Depending on how compressible it is and how much space is used (duh :) ).

It gzips better if you zero the unused space first before booting up knoppix, especially if you have recently defragged your drive, or overwrote unused space with random chars to somewhat sanitise erased data.

Now if hot swap ATA drives become cheaply available it'll be even more convenient - can stick a new source HDD in without powering down the whole system. Have to power down the drive tho - moving/tilting a HDD that's spinning at 7200RPM is a bad idea.

Of course you could do the same thing by booting up from the big HDD instead of using a bootable CD. But it means you need to install stuff into the big HDD first.

--

Too many replies beneath your current threshold

I Have a Request by BlackBolt · 2003-09-12 19:49 · Score: 1

I love Fluxbox, so I hereby request *FLOPPIX*!

Bah... I know it'll never happen just because of the brutal naming coincidence. But just think of all the extra space we could use for "valuable forensic support and rescue tools" (like Unreal Tournament) if we ditched Gnome and KDE altogether!

Re:I Have a Request by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-13 02:11 · Score: 0

Check out Damns SmallLinux -- it uses Fluxbox and lite apps.

Re:Thanks. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-12 21:38 · Score: 0

You don't even know what HIG is an acronym for, do you?

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-13 01:00 · Score: 0

KDE was already free software. The reason RMS threw a fit was because it didn't use the GPL, not because it wasn't free.

Bullshit. And you don't need to worship RMS to know that.

What's a schwa? Answered by yerricde · 2003-09-13 02:14 · Score: 1

Schwa (which I can't type here because Slashdot is configured to delete all HTML character entities) is pronounced as an indistinct, unaccented central vowel, roughly the 'a' in English "about".

--
Will I retire or break 10K?

To Windows users like myself by Inda · 2003-09-13 02:26 · Score: 1

I had browsing problems a few months ago on XP using IE6 (shhh... this is going somewhere). I couldn't post on certain websites, some pages weren't loading etc. Nothing I did seemed to fix the problems.

I downloading Knoppix and burnt it to disk within an hour. I quick bios change and 3 minutes later my PC had booted to a linux desktop. It found my MS mouse, cable modem, USB hub, GFX card - basically everthing. Both hard drives with all their partitions were there along with DVD-ROM and CDR - I was impressed.

The webpages still failed to load in Konqueror so I knew the problem didn't lie with me.

Within 10 minutes of using it I'd worked out how to make a screenshot, save it as PNG and post it on a forum which impressed me again.

I've still not made the switch but Knoppix is a great CD to have in anyone's CD collection.

--
This post contains benzene, nitrosamines, formaldehyde and hydrogen cyanide.

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by IamTheRealMike · 2003-09-13 04:01 · Score: 1

Am I? I've found that pkgconfig has a hell of a time trying to locate .pc files unless they are in /usr/lib/pkgconfig

It also reads an environment variable. Or, you could *shock* read the source and alter it, if you want other paths too.

But the tricks I know about there involve ugly symlink kludges all over the place pointing into and out of /usr, and still compiles will end up breaking if include files aren't found in /usr/include (solution: more links to kludge things, that don't really belong in any package but end up needed by them all).

Like I said, you're doing something wrong. I've never needed such cludges. Why don't you raise these issues on the Gnome mailing lists, maybe somebody can help you?

Not exactly what I'd call "clean", but GNOME zealots love it anyway. Can't get most of them to acknowledge the basic design flaws though.

So far I've not seen any evidence of "basic design flaws", only somebody who hasn't got things set up right, sorry.

or worse.. by zoloto · 2003-09-13 06:08 · Score: 1

clippy..

Re:Flamebait? maybe. True? yes. by cmbofh · 2003-09-13 09:20 · Score: 0

Yes, KDE has always been free software.
But no, KDE has been under the GPL/LGPL right from the start. It's never been under the QPL
QT hasn't been under the GPL at that time though,
and RMS "threw a fit" because he claimed the two licenses were incompatible.

Lots of People Love Monty Python by Principal+Skinner · 2003-09-13 17:04 · Score: 1

I heard of one guy who loved it so much he named a programming language after it.

--
one hundred twenty
is just enough characters
to write a haiku

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by UserGoogol · 2003-09-14 05:01 · Score: 1

Faking someone else should be strongly discouraged, but maybe not by modding down. When he actually does defame Miguel, he gets modded down properly. Of course, the Karma system at Slashdot has some decent flaws, and this is very obviously one of them. (Bad usernames posting good things.)

And nuts to you, I'm still in high school, although I'm sure you could do something I wouldn't like.

--
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." -- Hanlon's Razor

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by t · 2003-09-14 12:50 · Score: 1

So let me get this straight, one of the users of slashdot is being an asshole, so it is a slashdot flaw? You really must be in high school if you still think like that. Let me explain to you how the world works, there are some people who are builders, they build things that the rest of us want to use. On the other hand, there are some people who are destroyers (in their little ego fantasies of course) who want to destroy everything because they lack the intelligence to be a creator of great things or even little things, generally those people are referred to as assholes.

btw, you should look up the meaning of defame. By merely posting his numerous unintelligent comments he is defaming Miguel.

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by Anonymous Coward · 2003-09-14 17:34 · Score: 0

You are also gay!

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by UserGoogol · 2003-09-15 07:42 · Score: 1

I know what defame means, and the flaw that I was reffering to is that an asshole can, in theory, post good things, aquire karma, and then post bullshit with the Karma bonus.

I'm fully aware that some people are assholes. My only point was that just because a person is an asshole doesn't mean that everything they ever say is unworthy of notice and should be modded down into obscurity. Only the assholery itself should be modded down.

But now that I look at the parent closer, I concede that I really wasn't paying enough attention to the post. He WAS defaming Miguel in that post, and should thusly be modded down, or metamodded. If nothing else, he used terrible grammar and spelling which Miguel does not use. So, you're right.

--
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." -- Hanlon's Razor

Re:MODS: THIS IS A TROLL by t · 2003-09-15 08:35 · Score: 1

There is an easy solution, you take whatever good bits he said and repost anonymously for up-modding. You should also state the reason, that the poster is an asshole and should be down-modded. Thus you get the good bits (which quite frankly, I think you would be hard pressed to find) while not encouraging assholes.

Either way, it isn't a slashdot flaw. I fail to see how you can blame the system for the actions of the participants.

Comment removed by account_deleted · 2003-09-16 01:00 · Score: 1

Comment removed based on user account deletion

380 comments