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New Documents Shed Light on Microsoft's Tactics
Tigen writes "As the NY Times reports, even as MS prepares to face penalties from the European Union, testimony during the second week of trial in the consumer class-action lawsuit in Minnesota has revealed some embarrassing internal documents from Microsoft which were not disclosed in the 1997 federal antitrust lawsuit. Items include a 1990 letter from Bill Gates to Andy Grove, and Microsoft's illegal tactics against the Go Corporation, a Silicon Valley startup."
"Armed forces abroad are of little value unless there is prudent counsel at home" - Cicero
Microsoft has actually been a bad big corp? Tell me it isn't so...
OK it's so, let the "Exchange server ate my email" excuse begin!
This space is not for rent.
Sounds eeriely like a movie script minus Erin Brockovich..
I've contended for years that computing in general has been held back by Microsoft, not pushed forward, and this is an example of just how that has been the case.
...
... and most of them do.
There are a lot of 'high order' dreams in the computing science. The CS holy grail of pocket, portable computing is only now coming to fruition (thank you Palm), but has been on the cards since at least the 60's as a design reference/specification. Go could've given us this in the late 1980's, early 90's. Microsofts' machinations, however, prevented that from happening.
I understand now, why the Palm founders adopted their 'found and leave' strategy for PalmOS. In the light of Go, Inc's demise it makes sense to light 4 or 5 small fires that the enemy can't put -all- out, rather than making a very large target, like Go and Motorola did
I stopped using Microsoft products in 1998. They'll not get one penny of $ from this consumer, and not one item of code from this programmer. I tell all my Microsoft-using friends to fuck off with their self-made problems, too, and get real operating systems, from real software companies
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
Back then in June 1990 (as the date of the letter), Microsoft wasn't a monopoly yet, right? So, the anti-trust trial cannot use this as an evidence against them....
I would say that this may lead to anti-competitive lawsuit... (btw, is such lawsuit allowable in the USA?) And of course, as usual, IANAL...
--
Error 500: Internal sig error
We've found one dead body, the criminal is in jail.
... nah ... its 'not needed'.
... only ... possible in the alternative /. universe ... in my head.
We don't need to find any more. Even if they are out there, somewhere in the ditch, buried
You should be marked "-1 Ignorant Buffoon", but alas thats
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
... after all it's a Markoff article.
insecurity asks the wrong question irritation gives the wrong answer
If GO Penpoint software was open-sourced 14 years ago... as an attempt to counter Windows H agression...
I wonder what would the landscape of mobile computing be like today?
Hey, that's my password you are typing
If this is not anti-competitive, then what is?
Microsoft violated a signed secrecy agreement with Go and showed that Microsoft possessed technical documents from Go that it should not have had access to.
Industrial Espionage.
Microsoft violated nondisclosure agreements with Go, and then used that information to build PenWindows, a competitor to Go's PenPoint operating system.
GO has loyalty rights for PenWindows. GO should sue PenWindows licensee's individually. This is what Microsoft is trying to do to Linux users through SCO. GO has more legal grounds to stand on that SCO.
Shortly after the letter was written, Intel reduced its planned investment in Go from $10 million to $2 million
Intel was held to ransom, and they paid it.
The advice read in part that the focus should be shifted from "killing the competitor" to "providing a better solution to the customer's problems."
So they did believe in Killing Competition. A tiger never changes its stripes.
I think some of these allegations could ammount to criminal offences. I do hope Mr. Gates does a time in a cell with No Windows
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Nothing to see here
Typical slashbot FUD.
Please explain how pocket, portable computing would have been possible even ten years ago. The hardware was the limiting factor. Microsoft had nothing to do with it - the state of the semiconductor industry did. We didn't have CPUs that worked withotu sucking *lots* of juice. NMOS CPUs were very power hungry.
Today we have calculators with 75 MHz processors, powered off AAA batteries. Would that have been possible 10 years ago? perhaps, but the price would have been insane.
Companies are always free to develop their own embedded OS; some do. Back then the hardware wasn't available. So quit the microsoft bashing.
Typical slashdot groupthink
OH THE SHAME I fell off the wagon and use sigs again!
Microsoft would not leak so many embarrassing documents if they never wrote anything down. But, I hear you say, surely people will just record what they say and leak the recordings. Well, not if they conduct all their business in mime. So that is my suggestion. Microsoft should do everything by mime.
-
apt-get install deathstar && deathstar alderaan && echo "You're far too trusting"
I tell all my Microsoft-using friends to fuck off with their self-made problems, too..
Surely there's a way you can express your displeasure with MS products to your friends with a little more tact?
-- jimmycarter
Yeah, and I heard that ObviousGuy can't orgasm unless he kills a dog.
Of course, that's just what I heard.
It is too bad that the Go Penpoint OS never made it. In my opinion it was a very nice system and well designed. The Apple Newton came close, but not quite.
I read the book "The Power of Penpoint"
by Robert Carr, Dan Shafer but never had one of their computers myself (they are pretty rare in Europe). I nearly bought one on ebay recently though.
Some images: http://www.ojisan.com/penpoint/index.shtml
A decision was made, but a lot of people believe that decision was just so much tepid crap. Courts have been overturned in the past; perhaps if enough new evidence comes to light, the case can be reopened.
Yes, it does serve a purpose. It serves to dig up more facts and evidence should someone in the judiciary ever get wise and reevaluate that case.
Even if the trial never reopens, the Court of Public Opinion is always open. The more people learn what kinds of jiggery-pokery Microsoft has been up to, the more likely Microsoft will gets its just desserts sooner or later, and the less likely anyone else will ever pull such stunts again.
Honestly. I'm trying to figure out your attitude. "Microsoft did it, they got away with it, and that's good enough for me!" Are you always this doggedly complacent?
Need something burned down in a big hurry? Then come on down to the Flamebait Market, for all your pyromaniac needs!
You cannot truly appreciate Dilbert until you read it in the original Klingon.
Every time Microsoft goes on about piracy hurting them damaging innovation etc they should be reminded of this that they are IP thieves themselves and if SCO can ask for $1million from IBM then what can the former executives of Go sue Microsoft for? All hypothetical of course the documents have yet to prove this is the case.
Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.
For those of you wondering about the refernce:
2 -23
http://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php3?date=2004-0
tbdean
"What now? does dragging this stuff up accomplishe anything more? It's just for microsoft bashing."
One man's flamebait is another man's insightfu.
"Derp de derp."
Im submitting this from my gitmo cage right now! It's not so bad really, though this tablet PC is just junk. I mean seriously! Damn thing only gets 12 fps on counterstrike.
From the article:
A Microsoft spokeswoman said that many of these newly disclosed documents were not relevant to the trial, which focuses on Microsoft pricing actions.
Oh, of course, sorry. Yes, these documents aren't relevant for the current trial, so we should just ignore them completely and pretend they don't exist.
"These are not the documents you are looking for..."
Jedidiah.
Craft Beer Programming T-shirts
If you want the whole story of GO, read Startup: A Silicon Valley Adventure by Jerry Kaplan. It's a great book. And it shows just how evil Microsoft really is!
IF it is true then it just goes once again to show how fucking rotten the legal system is. Tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth eh? So will these be grounds for a new case? Wasn't Martha Stewart found guilty of lying to an officer instead of insider dealing? Can they get MS on withholding evidence? Perhaps even going after people who can be jailed? I personally don't believe for a second that this could be accidental (IF of course it is real)
Some posts seem to mention that attempting to create or abuse a monopoly is a felony. Doesn't this mean that MS is a criminal? So how exactly is it still allowed to do business as usual? Companies seem to want all the perks of being treated a real people but none of the bad stuff like oh say being punished for committing crimes.
Oh well at least we can snigger at all the microsoft apologist trying to wriggle out of this one. This must be one of their worst weeks. Embarrising papers, being fined and if you look at groklaw yet more hypocrasy by claiming that the EU has no right to tell it how to behave while MS itself is asking the EU to tell Lindows how to behave.
I almost pity the MS fans. Almost.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
"All of Microsoft's conduct was designed to acquire and hang on to their monopoly,'' said Eugene Crew, a lawyer at Townsend, Townsend & Crew, based in San Francisco.
Many companies would desire to maintain a monopoly. The problem here is that after so many years of knowing that Microsoft has this attitude, nobody has done anything effective to stop it.
People can complain about the EU being anti-American in its anti-trust case, but personally I feel that the US should have imposed far more restrictions on Microsoft than it has thus far. Microsoft continually gets away with anti-competitive practices, everybody knows this - although some Microsoft apologists vehemently deny/excuse it.
"Consumers were harmed by being deprived of choice. The greatest harm out of the Go story was the suppression of innovation and new technology by Microsoft."
The extent of consumer harm can't really be known. People seem to be relatively happy with Windows. Then again, people just accepted that computers needed regular rebooting after running Windows 95, it just goes to show how most people just accept things without question. I guess we'll never know how far things could have progressed if it wasn't for Microsoft preventing competition by abusing its position.
Consumers are harmed, so are competing businesses.
Look how things are flying now because Microsoft has a bit of competition from Linux/Open Source. Of course, Microsoft can say, "Hey, we're doing this because we love you all, not because we're scared of Linux", but why does Microsoft care now when it obviously didn't give a damn for years (judging by the poor quality of Windows up until now)? If there's no competition then you work at your own pace, and as long as it appears that there's progress, people seem to be satisfied.
Linux/Open Source/Anti Microsoft News
...can be seen here: Link
Perhaps if companys where less like Microsoft and Enron Etc. and the senior managers actually punished when do act like that then you wouldn't see so many go down in flames.
Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.
The trial exhibits (including the documents mentioned in the NY Times article) are being posted on the court's website.
SO.... for all ye programmers... // what they must have coded //should read
if($partner) $access = 1;
switch($partner){
case 'google':
$access = 1;
break;
case 'slashdot':
$access = 1;
break;
default:
$access = 0;
break;
}
Oh i dunno, never been to an MSCE camp have we?
Was it renamed Windows CE in a later life?
Or was it just another MS experiment?
From the article:
In late 1993, Go was sold to AT&T where it was ultimately merged into the company's portable computer subsidiary. In 1994 the phone company shut down the effort in portable computing. Three months later Microsoft canceled its PenWindows project.
In 1996, Mr. Kaplan wrote a book, "Start-Up: A Silicon Valley Adventure" (Penguin USA), in which he blamed Microsoft, in part, for the demise of Go. Two years later, Marlin Eller, a former Microsoft programmer who was part of the PenWindows project, wrote in "Barbarians Led by Bill Gates" (Owl Books) that the intent of the PenWindows project had been primarily to undermine Go.
How in the HELL was that insightful? We had *PICTURES* of Guantanamo bay detainees, we had released prisoners talking about it, the fucking US government admitted that they were there (perhaps not thousands, but cetrainly hundreds). It is fucking THERE.It's not that people aren't asking for proof ... they've already seen it!
I have (personally) NOT seen proof of Andy Grove keeping IBM employees in a cellar, and I would damn well like some evidence of it if I'm expected to take that seriously.
The Whole point of Go was to create the software and hardware together remember that IBM and Intel where involved. Microsoft persuaded Intel to reduce its contribution to the project which they did which killed the hardware side resulting in the failure of the software side. Once this happened neither IBM nor Intel would have wanted to work with Microsoft thus no hardware for PenWindows either.
Back then the hardware wasn't available. So quit the Microsoft bashing.
Again the point was to develop the hardware Microsoft stopped Intel from helping. It would only be Microsoft bashing if it was untrue. Quit the knee jerk response and find the facts.
extra note ran this through the spell checker and PenWindows is in there it even corrected the capitals
Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.
I think that PenWindows died, descended into hell, and then arose as PenWindows ver 2.0; which was too crappy and too late. Later, the carcass of PenWindows went on to become a part of the Tablet PC. See http://pencomputing.com/PenWindows/ and http://pencomputing.com/frames/tablet_pc.html
Let's see, $613 million to the EU and being forced to make their server APIs open (WOO HOO!), maybe $1.5 billion to Minnesota.
That MCSE of your's is starting to look a bit less useful, eh?
At times I wonder if people have become so desensitized to people in positions of power lying to them that they no longer care. People have to accept wrong behaviour from politicians, businessmen, the media and everybody else. It does not matter if George Bush lies, or Bill Gates bullies his way through or Wall Street analysts pump up a stock - this type of behaviour does not shock or surprise - it is expected of them.
Their innovation continues to exist in Symbian Devices.
:)
I own a SonyEricsson P800 UIQ based Mobile Phone. Based on the Symbian 7.0 platform, you can still see the Psion/Epoc influence underneath.
The result, a sold stable computing platform, which arguebly crashes FAR less than equivelent MS Smartphones. (this is from personal experience amongst me and my collegues)
A MultiTasking/Multithreading operating system that is easy enough to use (MAC/Palm style), yet DOES allow you access the filesystem (C drive, ddrive, etc), and other system details via freely downloadable software shoudl you wish to tinker.
Its Handwritign recognition is exemplar, and far better and more "user friendly" than Palm's old Graffiti system which was very good for what it was.
I use it as an Ogg player (who needs an MP3 player, its sound quality is excellent), a PDA (it synchs with Outlook contacts/mail/tasks/diary/notes, and has dynamic contact spaces (it dynamically adds new fields even when they are not provided in the main set of fields, try that with palm its its infuriating 5 max fields for numbers/fax/email/web and one address field)
For those not wishing to submit to Outlook, it also has excellent vCard and SyncML support. You can back up the contacts by selecting "send all" and pointign the Infrared or bluetooth at any computer (Win/Mac/Linux) and selecting send. it will create a standard vCard file with all contact details stored in it. and to send it back to the phone, just send the single file. Even outlook on the PC cannot handle a vCard with numerous contacts so simply and elegantly, heaven help Mobile Outlook users!
it is simply the best PDA i have ever had, and does follow to some extent Jerry Kaplan's original vision...
Oh and i forgot to mention, its a damn good phone too!
Have a nice day!
In both the US Fed. and EC cases the fine/penalty/remedy is not really the big economic point.
Once a company has a gulty verdict against it in a federal anti-trust case the door is open for all kinds of civil cases.
Realistically, materially punitive federal judgements would hardly fly even in the EC, let alone the US (where an amazing majority of people actually like the applications that MS produces and a highly vocal segment figure if they're so successful they must be 'good' both technically and in customer service).
So really this kind of suit could sink MS, and in fairness to the feds (even the shamefully inept way the Bush administration runs the show) There is a case to be made that letting the market take care of itself is more efficient in the long run.
As the 'market' has access to the courts MS can look forward to more of these.
Coupled with the likelihood that more and more of their products will become materially irrelevant due to opensourcing of better alternatives I think MS's future isn't as gold plated as it surely looked before the whole anti-trust thing started.
Linux is Linux, if One need clarify their dist: <Dist>/GNU Linux
bsds are of course just BSD
what monopoly?
Legally Microsoft is a Monopoly. Microsoft was shown in court to control nearly 100% of it's market. Obviously a single person running a different OS does not alter the fact that Microsoft has monopoloy power. Even 5% of people using non-Microsoft not enough to signifigantly diminish that monopoly power.
Monopoly is not defined as absolute 100% perfection. It is (roughly) defined as an overwhelming dominance and control of the relevant market.
Microsoft was further shown to have (1) illegally abused that monopoly power to maintain their monopoly, and (2) to have illegally abused that monopoly power in an attempt to extend their monopoly into other markets (and thus exterminating competitors and competition in those markets).
Examples from the court case include Microsoft abusing it's Monopoly power to force all major computer sellers to sign contracts forbiding them from selling dual-boot machines. Computer sellers could have included Window/Linux dual boot option at essentially zero additional cost (or Windows/OS2 dual boot at merely the cost of an OS2 licence). The public would have greatly benefited from a completely FREE additional Linux system on their machine, and from the option for a low-cost OS2 (or other) second boot option. Illegally maintaing a Monopoly.
Micrsoft further worded that contract such that the seller had to pay Microsoft for EVERY machine they sold. If they offered a system without an OS, or with Linux, or with OS2, they STILL had to pay Microsoft for that machine. That has the twin effects of increasing the cost to the consumer to buy a Linux or OS2 machine, and it allows Microsoft to effectly collect a tax on its competitors products. Illegally maintaining a monopoly.
Microsoft also illegally leveraged it's OS monopoly in an attempt to create a new monopoly for itself in the web browser market. InternetExplorer has obtained a somewhat overwhelming dominance, but that doesn't matter. Even if InternetExplorer failed and had merely 1% of the market, the tactics they used in the attempt were themselves illegal. Illegally attempting to abuse a monopoly to create a monopoly in another market.
-
- - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
And how do you sell your soul to a book? That just has some mightily amusing implications depending on one's literary choices...
Comment removed based on user account deletion
You. Completely. Missed. The. Point.
The point is, the original poster said "we already know they're criminals, we don't need to look at any more evidence".
Well, duh. A crime is a crime, whether its a stiff-in-the-ditch or a battle-order-from-the-boss. Just because one crime has been discovered, doesn't mean we should stop looking for more...
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
most ordinary users think, that it's perfectly normal, that your computer crashes few times a day. they just let it go as "well, that happens" not knowing, not expecting and not caring for any particular reason.
this only single fact gives "excuse" for millions of lines poorly written code, (who cares, it happens anyway) and keeps thousands of "hacky" programs and viruses alive, while most of those crashes may be their "natural" side-effect, not nessecerily something, that would "normally" happen with healthy system..
In 1991, the hardware for portable computing just wasn't there. It.. just... WASN'T. I mean, where did PenWindows go? Yep, right into the dumpster.
Here's a loose quote (I don't remember it exactly) from Marlin Eller's book referenced at the end of the article: "This wasn't about 'grow the market,' it was about 'block that kick.' Go Corp spent $(millions) creating their product, we spent $4 million shooting them down. They'll never sell their shit again." That's not the exact quote, but it's pretty close. I remember it so clearly because I was completely shocked to read such a thing.
IIRC, this was said in response to Eller expressing his opinion that Pen Windows was a failure because it didn't take off, and the person who spoke the words above explained that Pen Windows was a success because all it was supposed to do was cock-block Go Corp from building a presence in the market.
~Philly
There are two ways to view mircosoft. There is the traditinal Slashdot Micro$oft is evil and sucks opinion, and my view that Microsoft is evil and is really cool. Think about it. The mobsters in The Godfather movies, and the Sopranos are evil, but they don't suck. Admit it, you Love playing GTA Vice City. Its not always easy being so evil. You have to admit Microsoft does a very good job ( at being very evil) and in my book that makes them the coolest company in the world.
Well.. maybe. Or Maybe not. But Definitely not sort of.
for removing the shameless hype about Go Corp from the IT press.
During a few months you couldn't open a computer magazine without Go Corp being hyped in every article.
Every article during that time had Go Corp hyped in every paragraph.
I got so fed up of reading about Go Corp in every paragraph in every article in every computer magazine that I cancelled a few subscriptions.
Then good enough access to the internet came along, and I didn't need those subscriptions anymore, and Go Corp was but a vague memory.
Can we stop bringing up daemons from the past, and leave Go Corp for once and for all behind us ?
Flourescent (adj): smelling like ground wheat.
Many companies would desire to maintain a monopoly.
All companies would, because all people would like to have a job in which a) they can never be fired, b) they can change the price of their sold goods/services with impunity, c) customer opinion is irrelevent, and d) the wealth you make is limited merely by your sense of pity.
And we need the government to protect us from people like this, right? Well, guess again! The government supports people like this in many, many ways!
Case in point: I am in the process of opening a restaurant in Georgia. (This process has earned me a fresh, new hatred for all things government as they are rackets that "skim off the top" of the efforts of people who are believed to have money, and I dare anyone to point out to me the "government services" that these looting taxes are allegedly providing me.) If you want to buy Budweiser in Georgia (for resale, that is), then you will buy it from one distributor. Every institution in Georgia that sells Budweiser to consumers has bought that beer from one distributor. Just take a guess at what his margins are.
Oh, why can't we buy from another? Because the law forces us to buy Budweiser from one distributor. That's right, the law. The alleged arbiter of fairness and justice.
The reason that the law can exist in this state is because I live in a state that is replete with conservative Christians who believe (or pretend) that alcohol is "sinful" and thus those who trade in it deserve to be persecuted by the state.
I don't make the rules. I just make fun of them.
Sigh. The whole point here is that they destroyed innovation by wielding their influence as a major player in the industry to starve potentially competitive emerging technologies of support by threatening companies (like Intel in this case) that were otherwise inclined to support it.
You can't "destroy innovation with subpar crap." You can certainly flood the market with crap, but that has relatively little effect on someone else's ability to create something better. Market dominance can certainly make it more difficult for someone to overtake you, but it's not impossible.
The point many of us make is that Microsoft has, in fact, done relatively little to "advance us." (Exactly what has it done, by the way?) Instead, it has abused its relationships with other companies to obfuscate and intimidate, stifling emerging technologies until they (MSFT) can move into the space. Every time it is successful at this, it gains even more power to throw around the next time.
Take a closer look at Go. They chose to build a new platform in part because they judged that they could create a more effective pen-based experience by starting from scratch around a new design center. Rather than tolerate an emerging new platform, Microsoft intimidated potential partners and, according to the emerging evidence, made and violated agreements with Go to take their ideas for Pen Windows. Now, years later, people will point to pen computing as one of the many things Microsoft supposedly did "to advance us."
Microsoft created nothing here; they just bullied and destroyed.
Microsoft is a classic example of this. One would be pressed to think of a single innovation from Redmond.
"First you get the Linux, then you get the power, THEN you get the women"
Didn't we just set a bunch of foreign nationals free because they were wrongly imprisoned? I think they also had some young children imprisoned. This report indicates 88 of the 100 people transfered out of Getmo were released to be freed (the other 12 remaining in detention in their home nations).
It would be one thing if these were prisoners of war being held until the war ended, as per the Geneva Convention, but this is an ongoing 'war against terror' (except Iraq, the terrorists followed us there) basically giving Bush the ability to hold these people indefinitely. Besides 'Mission Accomplished' has already been declared in Iraq and there are plenty of Iraqis in the camps.
Now, it would be one thing if there was any accuracy at all in the determination that the detained people are terrorists or terrorist supporting individuals. And noone is asking to 'open the floodgates' and let em all run free and noone would be complaining if all of these people were dangerous. But we've already seen plenty of cases where people were improperly detained and without any representation at all bad things happen to good people... 88 of them so far and counting.
LilMikey.com... I'll stop doing it when you sto
1. Having the power to fix prices.
2. Having the power to exclude competition.
For once, the legal definition is better than the ones you find in the dictionary. It focuses right on the essance of what a monopoly is. Market share doesn't define a monopoly, but being able to exclude competition or fix prices does. That's the control that matters, that's the kind of dominance that's at issue.
A company can have 100% of the market, but if they can't fix prices or exclude competition, then they don't have a monopoly. If they can fix prices or exclude competition then they have a monopoly even if they don't have anywhere near 100% market share.
A monopoly in UK law is defined as 25% or more.
First, the NYTimes now has a history of embellishing and a keeping lying journalist on the payroll.
For the former accusation, that could be said of any (ANY) media organization. For the latter, to whom are you referring? Surely not Jayson Blair, he left the paper in disgrace long ago.
(a poorly written book at that)
You want to talk poorly written, talk about your own post here. You seem to care about Kevin Mitnick quite a bit, but can't bother to spell his name correctly even once?
Two years later, Marlin Eller, a former Microsoft programmer who was part of the PenWindows project, wrote in "Barbarians Led by Bill Gates" (Owl Books) that the intent of the PenWindows project had been primarily to undermine Go.
In the same book he describes how they put together a presentation for their PenWindows for a computer fair (Comdex?) to show that they could do the same stuff as Go. When in fact they had absolutely nothing. It was all smoke and mirrors.
I always remember that story when watching another cool Longhorn presentation. And I wish others would too, especially journalists ...
Companies compete aggresively to squish their competitors, anybody surprised? (not me)
Monopoly control laws try to prevent abuse when a company is too large. Before that, aggressive competition is more or less regular business.
1990 is the time of DOS 4 and the launching of Windows 3.0. There was a considerable variety of machines and operating systems (Macs, Amigas, DR-DOS, IBM's "home-remade" PC-DOS4, Coherent, etc). Microsoft was large but I honestly don't think that they were a monopoly back then.
and Microsoft's illegal tactics against the Go Corporation
Bill: Go stop Go
Lackie: What?
Bill: Stop the Go company
Lackie: Oh, go and stop a company, but which one?
Bill: THE Go company
Lackie: Oh! Go!
Bill: Yeah, now go!
Lackie: You mean they renamed it from something else?
Bill: No, I mean you. You go.
Lackie: Okay, I'll go and stop Go
Bill: Stop it!
Lackie: Yeah, stop Go.
Bill: No, I mean stop repeating me.
Lackie: Maybe I should go.
Bill: Okay, but don't forget to stop Go.
Lackie: Got it! I will stop It.
Bill: It's Go, not it.
Lackie: Me or the company?
Bill: Nevermind, I'll do it myself, now GET THE HELL OUT!
Table-ized A.I.
Yes, this is business. Not to be confused with highway robbery.
Business: Microsoft was supposed to build their own competing product, follow all legal and ethical guidelines, and fairly compete with Go. Hopefully if they both have good business plans and a good product, they both make a profit. The good natured rivalry between the two causes each to put for their best effort to make their product better. Their customers have a choice of who to give their money to, and high quality products from which to choose from. Everyone benefits.
Highway-robbery: Microsoft violated a non-disclosure agreement (a contract). They took Go's technology and used it to compete with Go. They used their monopoly and bullying tactics to try to frighten investors away from Go. Regardless of the fate of the Newton, this was breach of contract, and potentially a violation of antitrust laws (IANAL). In short, Microsoft's actions were unethical, and possibly illegal.
Btw, Apple canceled the Newton in order to streamline their product line so they could concentrate on OS X (and staying afloat). The Newton still has users today.
"At this moment, it has control of systems all over the world.
And...we can't do a damn thing to stop it."
Miyasaka, "Godzilla 2000 Millennium" (Japanese version)
Look I was all impressed with Microsoft's XP Tablet Edition when it came out recently until I one day came across the IBM ThinkPad 360P, 360PE and 750P laptops.
...the systems even seem to have support for pressure sensitivity but apparently that was never added into the full driver support because sometime around when Microsoft "decided" that pen computing was dead, everyone inlcluding IBM quit developing the format. It just makes me see red to think that this technology had to sit and stagnate for 10 years until Microsoft got off their ass and decided that *THEY* should be working on it again... and they shut down everyone else in the meantime. Man, I am so sick of this crap.
Holy shit these were 486SX and 468DX touchscreen systems where the screen flipped over on top of the keyboard making the laptop a thick tablet computer.
Running OS/2 Warp 4 with full pen functionality enabled, these systems are absolutely amazing. I never use the keyboard, even from a DOS window as the handwriting recognition is pretty darn good all across the OS (even with Win-OS/2 aps, etc...).
Why did I stop moderating? Why did I do that?
Because I *simply* had to respond to this.
If I had to bet on it, I would wager that 90% of the devoted Microsoft bashers that infest Slashdot are either devout liberals or aspiring socialists.
Not this particular M$ basher.
Actually, I'm mostly a Libertarian. I am a fiscal conservative but a social liberal. I wish to see as little government meddling in free enterprise as possible, because it almost always backfires. As an example, I'm quite convinced that the government Corporate Average Fuel Economy regulations which killed the full-size station wagon are, in fact, the very reason why we now have full-size station wagons built on even thirstier (CAFE-exempt) 4x4 pickup truck chassis choking our streets.
But I make an exception for Microsoft. Without government intervention, there'd be nothing to stop monopolistic behaviors. Linux is an aberration unique to computers: if one car company had more than 97% of the market and was abusing its monopoly, there wouldn't be open-source cars because the product is not intangible and easily duplicated. Normally, the free market will work things out on its own. But Microsoft lucked its way into a position of power initially, and has ruthlessly used that power to squash anything which could become a threat.
Micrsoft, it seems, has become a symbol for "corporate greed", "bullying", etc, etc and bashing it serves as a substitute for bashing capitalism - the real target of their enmity.
Microsoft is a symbol for corporate greed and bullying. If they're not, I can't imagine what they'd have to do to get that name. Maybe Bill and Paul would be abducting competitors' children in a non-descript white van.
As for capitalism, yeah, it sucks. Some people starve while others get rich. But it's also a lot better than anything else anyone has come up with. I do hate capitalism. But I hate socialism and communism even more.
Indeed, bashing capitalism is considerably less "fashionable" than bashing MS (or Wal-Mart, or any other large and successful company), so why not use MS as a proxy?
I love Wal*Mart. Usually, after I've been shopping there, I compare prices with their competition (key point, that) and determine that I've saved a couple of bucks with each shopping trip. Case in point: was going to buy a small level, checked out Home Depot. Found a level that I liked for $19.95, which seemed a little steep. Went to Wal*Mart, found exactly the same make and model of level for $4.99. I do not begrudge Wal*Mart their success, because unlike Microsoft, it seems they've actually done something to achieve it. The very first thing Wal*Mart has done is somehow create a discount department store that I'm not embarrassed to go into. The next thing is almost always having what you want in stock, and usually at the same price or a little better than the competition.
So, all you MS bashers out there, why not just admit that you are, at the very least, liberal Democrats and voting for Bush would be as inimical to your creed as using Windows?
A vote for Bush is evil, pure and simple.
Al Gore was no better. His liberal fiscal policies would have punished me for my financial success rather than enticing me to expand my business and hire more employees. His pro-union stance drives up the cost of labor artificially to a point where a person who makes brake pistons all day gets $25/hr while a McDonalds employee whose job requires far more intelligence and skill gets minimum wage. But, on the other hand, at least Gore was intelligent and secure enough with his masculinity to know that gay people aren't going to hurt him.
Furthermore, why not just say that capitali
Fire and Meat. Yummy.
there is nothing wrong with a Monopoly, Only how you wield it.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Well, we saw how long that corporate strategy lasted...
Xenon, where's my money? -Borno
10 years ago I had an Amstrad PC with Dos and GEM as a GUI...
now I've got WinXP...but I don't remember GEM ever asking me every 5 minutes if I wanted to send an error report...
Sometimes I wonder...did we ever innovate, or did we just move to one provider.
Which leads us to another question...if a word is not recognized by Microsoft's spellchecker, is it really a word?Have you looked to see if monopoly is a word in the Microsoft spell check lately?
Did anyone just hear that tree fall in the forest?Ok you totally missed my point.
I got detained incommunicado. The reason: Three white guys (two of whom I'd never seen) claimed I threatened one of them (I had only seen one briefly about getting luggaage which had disappeared prematurely, and the conversation was not threatening).
Once the cops arrested me, they lied to me about what was going on. They told me I wouldnt be able to get out for weeks. They wouldnt let me call anyone let alone make any type of bail. They never even charged me with anything.
I caught them trying to steal my money (~400 cdn), burn my watch (newly gifted by my gf). Luckily, I am a calm guy. Other people would have cracked. They were trying to tell me I set a B-O-M-B in the airport. What the hell is that?
All of this, while leaving my girlfriend stranded in a foreign country, in a foreign airport, late
at night.
Luckily, she met a sane american (maybe the only one?) who came and yelled at the cops for being such f*ckups.
So no, I'm not coming back. Thanks.