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Ignalum Linux - A Bridge to Windows?

linux slacker writes "Ignalum Linux 'is an intuitive graphical environment that works right out of the box and offers unrivaled compatibility with Microsoft Windows' or so says their website. The company is owned by four university students in Ontario, and one of their goals is to allow companies to incorporate Linux into their Windows environment, so users could still run Word, Excel and other popular Microsoft fare."

248 of 365 comments (clear)

  1. Or... by Canberra+Bob · · Score: 5, Funny

    Companies could run this alongside their Unix workstations to help in their migration to Windows.

    Just a thought!

    1. Re:Or... by WIAKywbfatw · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The day that companies start worrying about needing a stepping stone to help migrate users from Unix/Linux to Windows is a day most people here will look forward to. For one thing, it will mean that the usability and ease-of-use of Unix/Linux will have surpased that of Windows.

      --

      "Accept that some days you are the pigeon, and some days you are the statue." - David Brent, Wernham Hogg
    2. Re:Or... by FireFury03 · · Score: 4, Funny

      Does it have unrivalled compatability with all the worms and trojans too? :)

    3. Re:Or... by kahei · · Score: 2, Insightful


      You do realize there has been a thriving market in tools to help with migration from Unix to Windows for many years, right?

      --
      Whence? Hence. Whither? Thither.
    4. Re:Or... by Anomylous+Howard · · Score: 2, Interesting

      There are two cataigories of these tools. One is aimed at developers porting software, and the others is aimed at SysAdmins tranfering services.

      I've yet to see a tool to help USERS move to Windows.

    5. Re:Or... by mini+me · · Score: 1

      I've yet to see a tool to help USERS move to Windows.

      KDE, Gnome, etc.

      Any Windows user should be able to sit down at one of those desktops and be right at home. Now a Windows administrator on the other hand is a different story. I assume that's what these guys are trying to improve, but I can't get to their site to find out for sure.

    6. Re:Or... by Ctrl-Z · · Score: 2, Interesting

      How do KDE and Gnome help users move to Windows?

      --
      www.timcoleman.com is a total waste of your time. Never go there.
    7. Re:Or... by mini+me · · Score: 1

      By providing a somewhat familiar interface. What more help do they need?

    8. Re:Or... by Ctrl-Z · · Score: 1

      I wasn't aware that KDE and Gnome were available for Windows.

      --
      www.timcoleman.com is a total waste of your time. Never go there.
    9. Re:Or... by mini+me · · Score: 1

      That's not what I was getting at, but yes Gnome and KDE are available for Windows.

      http://cygnome.sourceforge.net/
      http://kde-cygw in.sourceforge.net/

    10. Re:Or... by jdray · · Score: 2, Interesting
      but I can't get to their site to find out for sure.

      Try getting there some other way than clicking a link on a Slashdot page. I think they're refusing referrals from Slashdot. They probably got swamped.

      I went to the article, read that (!!), then put ignalum.com in the address line of my browser. It put me right in.

      I note that their release number is 9. Seems artificially high for a product still in beta. I suppose they're trying to compete with Red Hat and SUSE. They're still running Linux 2.4 on KDE 3.1, though. :-\

      --
      The Spoon
      Updated 6/28/2011
    11. Re:Or... by jdavidb · · Score: 2, Informative

      Actually I've suffered through said migration, and I'm happy to say that the non-technical users were not happy with the change; they much preferred UNIX.

  2. Ignalum Linux 9 by RogueProtoKol · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...what happened to 1 through to 8? :)

    1. Re:Ignalum Linux 9 by Darth+Hubris · · Score: 4, Informative

      They were Red Hat v1 through 8; this looks to be based on Red Hat 9.

      --
      The party's over ... the drink ... and the luck ... ran out
    2. Re:Ignalum Linux 9 by jtwJGuevara · · Score: 1
      Since EVERY other mainstream distro is on version 9 (Slackware, Redhat, Mandrake(although 10 is here) and even SuSE I think) they must be bumping the number up just to look current in the eyes of the consumer!

      Ok, that's just pure speculation, but it does strike me as a coincedence.

    3. Re:Ignalum Linux 9 by eelcoh · · Score: 1

      It says on the website that it is based on the latest Fedora Core. Guess that would be Fedora Core 2 Test 3.

    4. Re:Ignalum Linux 9 by WormholeFiend · · Score: 1

      they were used to make the movies Leonard Part 1 through 5, and since those movies were classified...

      all we get to see is Leonard Part 6 and Ignalum Linux 9.

    5. Re:Ignalum Linux 9 by 74nova · · Score: 1

      think they are close enough to save me the trouble of testing fedora and just test Ignalum?

      --
      use your turn signal! you people act like it's divulging information to the enemy
    6. Re:Ignalum Linux 9 by List+of+FAILURES · · Score: 1

      It's fucking silly too. Think about it. Once the distros are all long in the tooth at versions 11 and 12, someone is going to come out with and OS called:

      One

      Marketroid crap:

      One is a Linux based operating system that finally overcomes the issues that have been plaguing OSes for decades. No longer is there any confusion about which application to use to do anything since One is not just your typical OS. One is a distributed OS that will install on your LAN, WAN or even among your family's machines over the internet. With One, your system is no longer your only device. All devices running One become yours. You merely register your presence with a machine and you have access to all of your data. Anywhere. Anytime. Data storage is no longer an issue as your data is distributed amongst the machines you've designated as your store points anywhere on the internet. The data is encrypted and will only be accessible to you by logging in with your presence.

      Requirements:

      -Registration with Global One Software.org
      -One time co-operative fee of $500 which is refundable should you decide to leave the One co-operative
      -Internet access (IPv6 desirable). Preferably a 1 gig line.

      One works on any hardware platform that supports the Linux kernel.

      So anyone want to be first to jump on the v. 11 bandwagon now?

    7. Re:Ignalum Linux 9 by mattyrobinson69 · · Score: 1

      read this from slackware's FAQ's:

      Q0: Why the jump from 4 to 7?

  3. Another one by jimicus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Does the world really need another Linux distribution? I know I'll be modded to hell for this, but why?

    "Better" windows compatability still isn't 100%. And J. R. Sixpack is gonna be as confused as hell when his system which he bought which is "compatible with Windows" won't run some random program he found on a shovelware CD.

    1. Re:Another one by tehcyder · · Score: 5, Insightful
      If you look at their website, they claim to be able to run Direct X apps without modifying a single line of code. If this was true and more or less all Windows Direct X games could be run under Linux, this would be a radical breakthrough in terms of Linux for the Desktop/Average User.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    2. Re:Another one by jimicus · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Very true. But most of the JR Sixpacks I know don't just play games - they use their computer for all sorts of odd stuff.

      And in many cases the knee-jerk reaction to a new requirement is "find a program to do it" rather than "use the perfectly good existing software".

      So they call you to fix their computer, there's hundreds of crappy little programs on there, which may or may not have ever worked very well, and JR Sixpack's forgotten why he installed most of them in the first place. But most of them installed and ran the first time around. I simply don't see that happening with any "Windows Compatible" linux distro - much of this software is so badly written it only just runs on Windows.

    3. Re:Another one by goatan · · Score: 1, Funny
      That's what us geeks are for to fight it out for the varoius distributions until there is only one left.

      There can be only one. (exept for sean connery whos allowed to come despite having his chopped of)

      --
      Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.

    4. Re:Another one by FooBarWidget · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Because not everybody has the same needs. Isn't that obvious? What if none of the I-don't-know-how-many distros fits your needs, and then one day, someone comes up with a distro that does *exactly* what you want (not not what other people want)? How would you feel if Slashdotters massively scream "OMG WHY DO WE NEED ANOTHER DISTRO?!", mentally destroy the developers who made that distro, and thus destroying the one distro that exactly fits your needs?

      Denying people to make their own distro is denying them essential human rights!

    5. Re:Another one by stray · · Score: 4, Informative

      no, as i read it, they say applications developed for THEIR engine will run on linux with opengl and on windows with direct x. from the article:

      > The development of a Multi-Platform 3D Graphics
      > Rendering Engine and the creation of a hardware
      > accelerated Ignalum Linux OS based on OpenGL
      > allows applications/games developed for the engine
      > to run using OpenGL or DirectX

      or do i miss their point?

    6. Re:Another one by tehcyder · · Score: 1
      Ah...re-reading it I think you're right.

      Move along, nothing to see here after all.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    7. Re:Another one by NodeZero · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I agree. Not everyone has the same needs in a computing environment. I don't see why people are like "OMG another linux distro.. jeez", that's like saying.. "OMG another SUV" or "OMG another car" People love having choices. So cars are a lot like linux distros in a way, lots of different models/makes and have a lot of the same "packages". Would you like a cd player? 6 speakers? sunroof? moonroof?

      Why get crazy when someone introduces more choice? I think this world would be pretty dull with only one fast food chain and only one type of car available. I would rather have 300 OS choices, instead of conforming to only one choice.

      --
      - "My name is Legion, for we are many" -Mark 5:9
    8. Re:Another one by Omega1045 · · Score: 1

      Do you mean "radical" in the traditional sense, or the 80 style "that's radical, dude"! Because quite frankly, I think it would be rad is DirectX "just ran" under linux with this software.

      --

      Great ideas often receive violent opposition from mediocre minds. - Albert Einstein

    9. Re:Another one by grumbel · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Sounds like a missunderstanding, lets quote a bit:
      The development of a Multi-Platform 3D Graphics Rendering Engine and the creation of a hardware accelerated Ignalum Linux OS based on OpenGL allows applications/games developed for the engine to run using OpenGL or DirectX, running on Linux or Windows, without having to change a single line of code.
      This sounds like they are just developing yet another 3D engine that runs under OpenGL or DirectX, like there are already dozens of them out there, nothing special. This doesn't sound to me like they would try something like WineX that allows to run DirectX games directly under Linux, far from it.

      Beside that WineX already does run a lot of games on Linux, yet, no breakthrough. While I agree that games are a very important factor in Linux, we are not at a point were they are really that important. As long as I still have to dive through weird config files to get my printer working and have to update or patch my Kernel for a more or less common piece of hardware (graphic tablet, 3d card), Linux won't go mainstream. Linux needs one standard and userfriendly way to handle and configure hardware, not one or two ways to do it for each distro. Linux has all the capabilities there, it just needs some more agreements on standards across distros.

    10. Re:Another one by atriusofbricia · · Score: 2, Interesting

      On a side note, it seems to be true that any time one says something to the effect of "I'm going to get flamed/modded to hell/loose karma" Then the exact opposite will happen. Moral of the story, for good karma, insert this:


      Karma shield 3.0:
      "To hell with my karma, this just has to be said!!"
      "I know I'll be modded to hell for this..."

      --
      I was raised on the command line, bitch

      "Nemo me impune lacesset"

    11. Re:Another one by CastrTroy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I don't really like that many choices though. It's like those car commercials where they tell you that On-Star is available on 51 GM models. 51 !!! How am i really supposed to choose what kind of car i want.

      In order for each person to have a distro that fits each person's needs exactly, we would need about 6 billion distros. Instead we should focus on having a few distros to fit general needs of people. One Server distro, one desktop distro, one exactly like Windows distro, and maybe one or two others. Choice is nice, but when you are overwhelmed with choices, you just end up going with what everyone else uses, which means we all end up using windows.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    12. Re:Another one by NodeZero · · Score: 1

      Ok I admit there can be an overkil on choices, I remember studying that in college in my Interface Design class. Adding too much functionality or too many buttons to something eventually has a negative effect on it's efficiency and useability (and learnability, is that even a word? heh).

      "Choice is nice, but when you are overwhelmed with choices, you just end up going with what everyone else uses, which means we all end up using windows."

      You see though? It was YOUR choice to go with what everyone else uses. Nobody said you had to use windows, which is what would happen if you had no choice.

      The funny thing about choice is that if people dont have a choice they'll be upset with the choice they are forced with, but in a choice situation they probably would have picked the choice that was forced upon them anyway.

      Example: If windows was forced upon every computer user more and more people would be outraged with Microsoft and think that Windows was some lame operating system, but if they had a choice of Windows, MacOS, Solaris, all the BSD's, and all the Linux distro's, a majority of them would probably go windows anyway, but why did they complain in the first scenario? Because people tend to get rebelious when there is no choice.

      --
      - "My name is Legion, for we are many" -Mark 5:9
    13. Re:Another one by tempmpi · · Score: 1

      I have often seen the same behavoir but I think it just shows how we need to optimize GUIs to be more accessible to the general public.
      Appearantly many people think in tasks and want one programm for each task. We need a gui where the users are easily able to find which programm is able to do what they want and guide them how to use it.

      --
      Jan
    14. Re:Another one by jimicus · · Score: 1

      I never thought about it like that, but you have a point. Extra bananas, that AC.

    15. Re:Another one by Sfing_ter · · Score: 1

      Actually, a "new" distro would not be out of the question, but a rehash of an already existing one, other than a bootCD-OS is just folly.

      Do we need another version of Fedora/DeadRat?

      --
      A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing. Emo Philips
    16. Re:Another one by Enucite · · Score: 1

      You just go up to the nice salesman and tell him "I need a new car." Then you go buy whatever car he tells you fits your needs.

      Of course, that's for people like you who don't want to be overwhelmed with choices. The rest of us will do a little research on our own and figure out which one is perfect for us.

    17. Re:Another one by spacecowboy420 · · Score: 1

      Kinda like Mandrake's "What to do" menu item in kde? My 8 year old daughter got totally hooked on (Mandrake) Linux just because of that.

      --
      ymmv
    18. Re:Another one by DebianRcksLindowsLie · · Score: 1

      I do believe that's called a Saturn. One size fits all, right?

    19. Re:Another one by Minna+Kirai · · Score: 1

      One Server distro, one desktop distro, one exactly like Windows distro

      The rule of thumb for quality products is that every specific category needs at minimum two major options.

      It'll probably turn out that neither competitor's offering is substantially better than or different from the other (like Coke/Pepsi or McD/BK), but what's important is that they keep each other honest and prevent a tendency to get like Microsoft.

    20. Re:Another one by mungojerie · · Score: 1

      Most people do want choices though, within a certain spectrum. Read an article about Ford lately, and they're making even more cash off their main product (the F-150) by allowing customization. I doubt anyone thinks we need 6b distros. And if you really wanted that 51st car, but also wanted OnStar, wouldn't you be glad it had it?

    21. Re:Another one by luwain · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I don't see why "compatibility with Windows" is such a great selling point. If I want to run Windows apps, I'll run Windows. If I want to run Linux apps I'll run Linux. If I want to run Linux and Windows apps, there are a number of solutions already available -- WINE, Win4Lin, etc..., not to mention dual-booting. If the goal is to convert Windows users to Linux, I would suggest introducing them to some good Linux applications, and letting them get the feel of Linux by running a Live CD (I find Knoppix to be very good ). I find that most average computer users don't care about the "platform", they care about the applications. My mother loves my Linux box because she loves XScrabble more than any of the scrabble programs that run under windows, likes FireFox (mostly because of the tabbed browsing) more than Internet Explorer, and finds OpenOffice fine for word processing. The fact that my Linux boxes never crash and never get viruses are good selling points too. To keep one's Windows' box clear of trojans, you pretty much have to run Ad-Aware every week. I've given up on Outlook -- It's like a virus proliferation engine. Linux applications are what I've used to win over people (Gimp is a winner, too) to Linux, not Windows Applications.

  4. uhm by Quai · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If I wanted windows, i would be running windows.

    Slackware is more my thingy :)

    Well, I guess this will provide them with more stable computers atleast.

    Ps, stop making Linux-Windows dists. and start making apps that they could use insted of windows-apps.

    And btw, my english sucks.

    --
    --
    1. Re:uhm by Phekko · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I really don't get it. Why is it better to write an application that works on linux than to try and make a platform that can utilize both linux and windoze apps?

      As long as the aforementioned platform is free as in Willy, who cares anymore? The whole point of the excercize was to be freed from the constraints of the evil kingdom in Redmond, right? So if you can run windows apps without windows, you're free, right? This will give you freedom to use whatever software you like (ok, Mac apps next but I think those can wait a little longer) on your box, paying for it only to those who you deem deserving of it.

      Why is Samba good for providing linux-windoze compatibility and suchlike, but this Canadian linux bad for providing (allegedly, I haven't tried it so I don't know for sure) the capability to run windoze apps on linux bad? Sounds to me like a bad case of "blame Canada"

      --

      Sigs for Nerds. Sigs that Matter.
    2. Re:uhm by rah1420 · · Score: 1

      Why is Samba good for providing linux-windoze compatibility and suchlike

      Because the "suchlike" is simply filesystem compatibility, similar to what NFS provides between different 'nix platforms. Samba has nothing to do with apps.

      It's different from providing Windows application portability and the parent poster is correct; if all the energy that goes into creating new, variant distros were instead used to create more bulletproof installs and apps that were more reliable and chock full 'o features, more people might be inclined to look at Linux as a viable alternative.

      Why is it better to write an application that works on linux than to try and make a platform that can utilize both linux and windoze apps?

      Ask IBM. They've had lotsa experience with OS/2. Ask them how that's worked out for them.

      Remember, the minute you try and stipulate 'doze compatibility, you are now on Redmond's turf. You can't play on the same playing field with Redmond, because they fight dirty.

      --
      Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens.
    3. Re:uhm by ThisIsFred · · Score: 1

      Because the "suchlike" is simply filesystem compatibility, similar to what NFS provides between different 'nix platforms.

      Not to mention the fact that Samba is the only file/printer server software for Linux. I'm sorry, NFS is way to primitive to count; there is no comparison with Samba.

      --
      Fred

      "A fool and his freedom are soon parted"
      -RMS
    4. Re:uhm by InodoroPereyra · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Oh my God, where do I start ?
      I really don't get it. Why is it better to write an application that works on linux than to try and make a platform that can utilize both linux and windoze apps?
      Yes, you don't get it. Because the windows API is in purpose a moving target that you have to reverse engineer. Project WINE is doing a huge effort and they could never hit 100% the moving target.
      As long as the aforementioned platform is free as in Willy, who cares anymore? The whole point of the excercize was to be freed from the constraints of the evil kingdom in Redmond, right?
      Wrong, this has never been the whole point. It is one, rather lateral point. Most people in this story follow either the Open Source philosopy, or the Free(dom) Software Philosophy. You have some reading to do, but in short: access to the source code and freedom to use the code.
      So if you can run windows apps without windows, you're free, right?
      Wrong, you are still paying MS taxes for generic software that in many cases actually exists natively in the Free Software world. The reason ? MS even even keeps the filesystems specs and application data formats closed. This is why:
      Why is Samba good for providing linux-windoze compatibility and suchlike, but this Canadian linux bad for providing (allegedly, I haven't tried it so I don't know for sure) the capability to run windoze apps on linux bad?
      Because Samba let's you get network interoperability in case you need to deal with MS machines in your network, and this project (which is not bad but is meant to fail) promises 100% binary compatibility, which is impossible and not necesessarily the best thing. This also why OpenOffice is great. It interoperates with MS office even though the latter doesn't want to.
      Sounds to me like a bad case of "blame Canada"
      Wha ??? Candians are as involved in Free Software as anybody else ...
    5. Re:uhm by IANAAC · · Score: 2, Insightful
      I really don't get it. Why is it better to write an application that works on linux than to try and make a platform that can utilize both linux and windoze apps?

      Anytime you need to duplicate or emulate libraries from one OS to another you're going to take a performance hit. Also mentioned in another response o this post, Windows is closed. Which means you have to rely on reverse-engineering. Almost never as good as built from the ground up.

    6. Re:uhm by khendron · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I really don't get it. Why is it better to write an application that works on linux than to try and make a platform that can utilize both linux and windoze apps?

      Windows compatibility is a double edged sword.

      IMHO, Windows compatibility is one of the things that killed OS/2 (not the only thing, but a big factor). There were very few applications written natively for OS/2 because OS/2 was able to run most Windows application. If you continue down this road, you can never win. Consumers look at the OSs side by side and think "This OS says it will run *most* of the application I want to run, but this will (Windows) will run them all. I might as well get Windows."

      --
      Life is like a web application. Sometime you need cookies just to get by.
    7. Re:uhm by neurojab · · Score: 1

      >IMHO, Windows compatibility is one of the things that killed OS/2

      I'm sure that was a factor... however, the more I think about it, the more I think that a bigger factor was that OS/2 wasn't available pre-installed on PCs (other than those made by IBM). Linux has a clear advantage over OS/2 in gaining pre-install marketshare: Price. If Dell were to work with a Linux distro instead of redmond, they could sell their PCs for a lower cost than those with Windows. If Linux can run all Windows applications, that's going to make the transition easier. Yes there is the danger of developers only focusing on Windows (how is that different than what we have now?), but downward price pressure gives Linux an advantage that OS/2 never had.

    8. Re:uhm by QuantumRiff · · Score: 1
      Wha ??? Candians are as involved in Free Software as anybody else ...


      Yes, just look at Corel...

      --

      What are we going to do tonight Brain?
    9. Re:uhm by Junta · · Score: 1

      Well, along with the other responses in the thread, a key phrase in your post is 'a platform that...', meaning a singular environment that manages to attain Windows compatibility. That would still deny users choice and customization.

      When you write an application against portable APIs, you give users freedom to choose what platform suits their needs best and run your application. Whenever a platfrom is dictated to the user for the sake of the applications, it is suboptimal. Whether the base is free or Free or whatever, it is still a lack of choice at stake. I write to APIs like wxWidgets and SDL, and my applications a) run on whatevere platform I want without significant porting effort, though more testing effort is needed, b) run at native speeds (unlike the Java approach), and c) fits in with the look and feel of other non-crossplatform apps (also distinct from the Java approach).

      --
      XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
    10. Re:uhm by Junta · · Score: 1

      No, really, it is not likely at all OEMs can save much money by shipping Linux instead of Windows.

      The key is support. If they slap a free distro on there, they would almost certainly have to assume a beefier support organization to stay competitive. That beefing-up would probably go above and beyond the cost of Windows copies and support. If they package a commercial distribution where they can always resort to the vendor for complex support situations, the price they pay for that distro is likely to be on par with the deep-discounted OEM Windows copies they install today.

      Now if/when the market of users who want Linux over Windows bundled grows significantly, the vendors with Linux preloads enjoy a larger market until everyone else does it and ships more product. There is the incentive for Linux bundling, not strict cost savings.

      I like Linux, I use it exclusively for work and home. However I know through my work the challenges that face a company trying to sell supported versions of Linux. Even if it is the greatest thing on Earth, a support contingency is needed for customers to be comfortable.

      --
      XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
    11. Re:uhm by jaelle · · Score: 1

      Everyone I know (in our local LUG, for instance) is forced to run windows also, usually on a separate box, because there aren't linux versions of programs that they need. I need a client for a VoIP service I use, for instance.

      At the moment I am running a windows box loaded with all the open-source software I can find. Which, incidentally, points up another problem. Installing those open source apps is a hell of a lot easier under windows than under linux. But that's another issue.

      --
      You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted, then used against you.
  5. Gamer's answer? by Raztus · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Could this possibly be the answer to gaming on Linux? As an avid gamer, the main thing that has kept me from using Linux as my primary OS is the fact that its support for the games I grew up loving is very limited. While I love the newer open source games, I'm just too attached to my old games to fully migrate to Linux...

    1. Re:Gamer's answer? by BokanoiD · · Score: 1

      same here. I use windows and a lot of OSS on it to do my work, but I'd like to play some games now and then and unfortunately Linux is just not an option yet. This is actually the main thing that keeps me form switching. If this truly is the answer, consider me converted. A thought that came up; if it really DOES work, I wonder what Microsoft's reaction would be... I can't imagine them sitting idly by while people run Windows software perfectly well on Linux.

    2. Re:Gamer's answer? by nomadic · · Score: 1

      Could this possibly be the answer to gaming on Linux?

      If they're telling the truth. I wouldn't hold my breath.

    3. Re:Gamer's answer? by Xian97 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If you don't have to play the latest and greatest and want to play older games, DosBox lets you play hundreds of older DOS games on Linux and other operating systems. It basically emulates a DOS PC complete with sound card. Many older games that cannot be played in Windows XP/2K run well under DosBox's Win32 port as well as under the Linux ports.

    4. Re:Gamer's answer? by anactofgod · · Score: 1

      Duh.

      That is one of the stated goals of this distribution's creators. If you bothered to even glance at the web site, you'd have seen this, quoted directly:

      "This technology gives the Gaming industry a real opportunity to move to Linux on the desktop as well as the server."

      ---anactofgod---

      --

      ---anactofgod---

      "Equal opportunity swindling - *that* is the true test of a sustainable democracy."
    5. Re:Gamer's answer? by FuzzyBad-Mofo · · Score: 1

      That's what WineX is for..

    6. Re:Gamer's answer? by arkane1234 · · Score: 1

      More of a "thunking" layer than an emulator.

      --
      -- This space for lease, low setup fee, inquire within!
  6. screenshots by fewnorms · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I am a bit wary of a Linux company that posts screenshots of their 'product' while being root every time. What kind of message does this send out ... "Yeah, it's ok to log in as root all the time" ?

    --
    Veni, Vidi, Velcro!
    1. Re:screenshots by bcmm · · Score: 1
      "The thing with the other 'distros' is it takes a system administrator to set something up. We're trying to simplify things so a regular user can pretty much do everything"
      That sounds like default root to me... Also, they're /.ed and the google cache won't load...
      --
      # cat /dev/mem | strings | grep -i llama
      Damn, my RAM is full of llamas.
    2. Re:screenshots by RealityThreek · · Score: 2, Insightful
      What kind of message does this send out ... "Yeah, it's ok to log in as root all the time" ?
      Well, actually. Yes. Most people run Windows at home as a member of the Administrators group. That's precisely what they'll want to do here too. And even more than that, they'll want their password saved. (Or even, have no password) Convenience trumps security in the eyes of an average user.
      --
      :wq
    3. Re:screenshots by fewnorms · · Score: 1

      Exactly my point. If that is the reason, it's most definatly NOT a Good Thing(tm).

      --
      Veni, Vidi, Velcro!
    4. Re:screenshots by Domini · · Score: 1

      This is the new day and age where everyone can own a Unix machine and even people who don't have a clue can be a root user.

      Live with it, dammit!

      This is a distro for people who won''t even be opening a shell... ever!

      It's like saying my phone/pda runs linux, but not as root, fortunately! (Really, who cares!) :)

    5. Re:screenshots by Sindri · · Score: 1

      Or their crappy screenshot feature requires root access. :oP

    6. Re:screenshots by Curtman · · Score: 1

      I'm no RedHat expert, but doesn't that big red icon in the lower right of the screen there indicate security updates are available that haven't been installed? Sounds like perfect Windows compatibility to me.

    7. Re:screenshots by 0d · · Score: 1

      From TFA:

      "The thing with the other 'distros' is it takes a system administrator to set something up," Mr. Ho explained. "We're trying to simplify things so a regular user can pretty much do everything -- and we're trying to make it as user friendly as Windows."

      So they're going for a traditional win95 security model, I guess.

      --
      It turns out it's man
    8. Re:screenshots by antic · · Score: 1

      Are you sure that you don't need to be logged in as root to change the application settings? Who knows.

      --
      'Thats they exact same thing a banana wrench monkey.'
    9. Re:screenshots by axis_omega · · Score: 1

      What is this thing with running boxes with root privilege. I run my Linux and win as admin all the time, and never had a single problem ever... wait IE just popup a certificate warning, gonna click ok so it won't annoy me anymore, Be right back..........

      --
      It's funny how I make sense to others and not myself...
    10. Re:screenshots by Lennie · · Score: 1

      Maybe you should take a better look at the screenshots, these are screenshots of the installation and setup of the server your looking at.

      I'm not too surpriced they use root for that, are you ?

      --
      New things are always on the horizon
    11. Re:screenshots by Chemicalscum · · Score: 1

      Yeah but you can still delete a lot of system files from Nautilus or Konqueror as root.

    12. Re:screenshots by DukeyToo · · Score: 1

      Very offtopic, (but right at home in this thread), but interestingly, MS has recently come up with an innovative solution to the "always root/admin" problem, in their Longhorn product.

      They allow users to run as admin, but when they run applications, the applications are wrapped in a different security context that provides the minimum security that that application can work with. The application is also partially sandboxed, so that if it accesses the registry (or some other system-wide resources), it gets its own virtual copy, that does not affect others. That way, it cannot do any harm to other apps.

      Now obviously MS is doing this as a hack, because it is the only way they can try and get out of their current situation, (whereby it is almost impossible to run a Windows PC as a non-admin, and their web browser is leaky as a sieve).

      If I have a point, it is that the MS solution is actually simpler for users, because they do not have to think. Login as root if you like, they say, and the OS will take care of protecting you. Trust big brother :)

      --
      Most writers regard truth as their most valuable possession, and therefore are most economical in its use - Mark Twain
  7. good, but.... by KrisCowboy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Well, being able to run word and powerpoint sounds great..but 2.4.20 and KDE 3.1 with an old mozilla doesn't sound quite great. Looks like this distro's gonna need lot of upgrade

  8. Slashdotted already by jimicus · · Score: 5, Informative

    after less than a dozen comments. Google cache: http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:UpTSilLJE-MJ:ww w.ignalum.com/+ignalum+linux&hl=en Proudly karma whoring since 2003.

    1. Re:Slashdotted already by A+Boy+and+His+Blob · · Score: 1, Funny
      "We have 98 guests and 0 members online"
      Seeing that a minute or so after the article was posted I knew they were screwed.
    2. Re:Slashdotted already by lawrencekhoo · · Score: 1

      I wouuldn't have believed it, but I think we've slashdotted google.
      I'm getting no response on
      http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:UpTSilLJE -MJ: www.ignalum.com/

    3. Re:Slashdotted already by jtwJGuevara · · Score: 3, Funny

      "Problem in Database Connection"

      I can already tell this distribution isn't heading in the right direction. Their webserver isn't capable of handling a good 'ol slashdotting. Their inability to meet this mandatory prerequisite of having a linux distribution is startling and does not bode well at all.

    4. Re:Slashdotted already by LeoDV · · Score: 1

      ...And sucking at it for as long? ;-)

      Here's the link.

    5. Re:Slashdotted already by shadowmas · · Score: 1

      they have simply blocked links that come from slashdot using referrer field instead of clicking link copy and paste http://www.ignalum.com/ in the address bar

  9. I have this terrible feeling of Deja Vu... by bcmm · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Wasn't Lindows going to provide near 100% compatiblity with windows?

    Haven't there been endless attempts at windows-compatible linux distros?

    --
    # cat /dev/mem | strings | grep -i llama
    Damn, my RAM is full of llamas.
  10. Does it also run Sasser? by Advocadus+Diaboli · · Score: 4, Funny

    If its really compatible it should be able to run also all those nice programs that are installed over the net automagically. :-)

  11. OS/2 by Ent · · Score: 4, Interesting


    So wasn't this same thing tried with OS/2? Better multitasking and the ability to run Win32 apps just as if you were on Windows? Only the apps never worked as well as they did on Windows and while some things were better - it was basically just a waste of time. I think there are enough Office Like apps that copy Office enough for usability, the focus should be on interop with file formats - I see that as what is really holding adoption back.

    1. Re:OS/2 by byolinux · · Score: 1

      Wasn't it Win16 apps? I know there were people working on a Win32 emulation, but I'm not sure how well that ever worked.

      Also, didn't IBM license Windows from Microsoft for this? I seem to recall "OS/2 for Windows" or some such product.

    2. Re:OS/2 by d99-sbr · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yes, it was Win16. And yes, they did have the Windows source code to build it from. I believe this happened because of OS/2 originally being a joint IBM/MS venture.

      As for the name, I never understood why they called it OS/2 _for_ Windows. It wasn't as if it ran on top of Windows, as many people seemed to believe. It simply had a nifty way of letting the Windows kernel run inside OS/2 and display windows as if they were native PM windows.

    3. Re:OS/2 by Daneurysm · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I recall all of my Windows apps running perfectly, if not better...though I had no dedicated DOS/Win install to directly compare it to.

      What I believe did Os/2 in (aside from IBM's hamfisted marketing department)--and this is the same scenario--is that if it runs Windows apps too there is no incentive to develope native apps, 'cuz developing Windows apps means developing for Linux (then Os/2) and Windows at the same time with no added overhead to the development cycle, save for perhaps bug testing.

      Though, I think Linux is in a vastly different circumstance here. I do actually think it will encourage migration--though slight. This will (very slowly) attract developers.

      Remember, Linux has no bottem line to answer to. Though, perhaps the Linux community could learn a couple tips from IBM's marketing department.

      Wheres the OpenMarketing initiative?

      They need that...that and a OpenInterface consortium. Get the coders away from the interface.

    4. Re:OS/2 by tiger99 · · Score: 3, Informative
      It was actually Win 3.1 applications, and yes, they did run very much better, and the OS did not fall over several times each day. The split between Bill and IBM happened before Windoze 95.

      The only thing that I remember as being wrong with OS/2 was the installation, at a time when few people had a CD drive, I think there must have been nearly 50 floppies in the box. Admittedly a few of them were not needed every time, but...... Yet the installed system ran beautifully on a 486DX33 with 16MB RAM, and 340MB HDD (SCSI, which Windoze does not handle very well). WordPerfect ran perfectly, also lots of DOS programs, in fact the claim that it was a better DOS than DOS was certainly true.

      Sad that it failed as a result of deceptive tactics by the Monopolist, not for any technical reason. And, of course, the Monopolist got a licence fee, rumoured to be about $20, for the Windoze content, for every copy sold.

    5. Re:OS/2 by Mr.+Roadkill · · Score: 1
      Yes, it was Win16. And yes, they did have the Windows source code to build it from. I believe this happened because of OS/2 originally being a joint IBM/MS venture.
      There have been various non-IBM efforts to support Win32 applications in OS/2, including this
      As for the name, I never understood why they called it OS/2 _for_ Windows. It wasn't as if it ran on top of Windows, as many people seemed to believe. It simply had a nifty way of letting the Windows kernel run inside OS/2 and display windows as if they were native PM windows.
      It was called OS/2 for Windows because it was intended for people with a Windows licence already - it was generally installed over the top of a working Windows installation, or at least that's the way IBM recommended and the way I usually did it. That was the blue one, IIRC. The red one included a Windows licence. Watch this thread for more on Red OS/2, Blue OS/2 and the inevitable string of bad (even by Slashdot standards) Matrix jokes.
    6. Re:OS/2 by jejones · · Score: 1

      I seem to recall "OS/2 for Windows" or some such product.

      If memory serves, that was a version for people who already had Windows 3.1.

    7. Re:OS/2 by vegetasaiyajin · · Score: 1

      That was the blue one, IIRC. The red one included a Windows licence.
      The red one didn't include windows, you had to have it. The blue one did include windows.

      --

      My heart is pure, but make no mistake, it's pure evil
    8. Re:OS/2 by Mr.+Roadkill · · Score: 1
      That was the blue one, IIRC. The red one included a Windows licence.

      The red one didn't include windows, you had to have it. The blue one did include windows.

      Okay, obviously I didn't remember correctly... I should have, as I have a Warp 3 Blue Upgrade pack in the garage. I think what confused me is the fact that the 2.0 and 2.1 I have require windows, and I needed to install them before I could install Warp (2.0 -> 2.1 Upgrade -> 3 Upgrade in one day from floppy... not pretty)
    9. Re:OS/2 by silicon+not+in+the+v · · Score: 1

      Yep, I had gotten a disc of that from somewhere for free. I never tried to install it, though. I guess I lost it or threw it away. I never really had a chance to install it because I was in high school living at home, and our only computer was a Slackard Bell 486 with no CD-ROM drive.

      --
      We may experience some slight turbulence and then...explode. -Capt. Mal Reynolds
    10. Re:OS/2 by Syberghost · · Score: 1

      What I believe did Os/2 in (aside from IBM's hamfisted marketing department)--and this is the same scenario--is that if it runs Windows apps too there is no incentive to develope native apps, 'cuz developing Windows apps means developing for Linux (then Os/2) and Windows at the same time with no added overhead to the development cycle, save for perhaps bug testing.

      Explain, then, why running DOS apps didn't doom Windows.

  12. Agreed, this is crazy. by RealityThreek · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ... not that there's another Linux distribution, but there's yet another that tries to be Windows. Every day, I care less and less if Linux becomes a mainstream OS.

    You want 100% Windows compatability? Run Windows. :)

    --
    :wq
    1. Re:Agreed, this is crazy. by tehcyder · · Score: 2, Funny
      Every day, I care less and less if Linux becomes a mainstream OS.
      I'm sure Bill Gates will be glad to hear it.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    2. Re:Agreed, this is crazy. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      dude, even windows isn't 100% compatible with windows, if it was why do you think so much effort has been put into linux??

      Oh I forgot, the joys of debian install are reward enough.

    3. Re:Agreed, this is crazy. by TheRaven64 · · Score: 2, Interesting
      While you got moderated funny, this is a serious point. I have a relatively large collection of Windows games that don't run in recent versions of Window (2K/XP).

      I'm starting to rediscover some of them in VirtualPC on my Mac. It's nice to be able to just save the state of a game as an entire machine state, and go back to it later.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    4. Re:Agreed, this is crazy. by sparcnut · · Score: 1
      You want 100% Windows compatability? Run Windows. :)
      Even Windows doesn't have 100% Windows compatibility.
      --
      perl -e 'print $i=pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10);'
    5. Re:Agreed, this is crazy. by flatface · · Score: 1

      I forget where I heard it, but "Linux is more compatible with UNIX than Windows is with Windows.

    6. Re:Agreed, this is crazy. by entitude · · Score: 1

      Windows often is incompatible with itself. Note: 98 vs. ME vs. 2k vs. XP

      --
      ----geppy -
    7. Re:Agreed, this is crazy. by Pandora's+Vox · · Score: 1

      dood.

      sounds like you need dosbox.

      http://www.dosbox.sf.net

      -Leigh

  13. Bottom line. by Willeh · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Will these guys be able to offer a valid alternative to the Linspire/ Lindows trainwreck? And will they not get crushed by the 800 pound gorilla that is the MS legal department? (I'm sure they're going after these guys, and 4 college students don't exactly sound like they have a lot of assets). Let's hope they survive, choice is good for us all.

    --
    Will wank off Linus Torvalds for fame.
  14. Re:Excellent product by fewnorms · · Score: 2, Funny

    You work there by any chance? :)

    --
    Veni, Vidi, Velcro!
  15. Wine/Codeweavers Crossover? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Everything they claim is perfectly able to be done with existing sudo-emulators.

    For instance with Suse when you buy a retail version you get a liscence for Codeweaver's crossover stuff.

    You can then run Office 2000, IE 6.0, Quicktime, Quicken and other applications.

    So if you do want to run Linux but will not because it doesn't have support from your favorite windows apps, then there are options.

    Almost any distro can be made to work. But I suppose it would be convenient to have one that was designed specificly to work with Windows apps right out of the box.

    1. Re:Wine/Codeweavers Crossover? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Ooops, that is crossover is aviable for Suse DESKTOP versions.

      The Business version, not included by default with the home version (Suse 9.1), I am pretty sure.

      See here:
      http://www.suse.com/us/business/products/sl d/index .html

    2. Re:Wine/Codeweavers Crossover? by Morgahastu · · Score: 1

      I believe this is what they are using. They are not specific on details but they mentioned CodeWeaver being included and also mentions TransGaming.

      I don't think these guys have done anything revolutionary, they just bundles some commercial apps with their distro.

    3. Re:Wine/Codeweavers Crossover? by 74nova · · Score: 1

      except that it appears to be free, while crossover is not. im downloading it now, so i assume its free...

      --
      use your turn signal! you people act like it's divulging information to the enemy
  16. Wine and WineX? by levell · · Score: 1

    Presumably this is done using Wine? Their home page is slash-dotted so I can't check. This page mentions DirectX so maybe they have some deal with TransGaming and are using WineX?

    --
    Struggling to find a day everyone can make? WhenShallWe.com
    1. Re:Wine and WineX? by levell · · Score: 1

      I remember. Although it flopped, if you believe that linux will catch on, on the desktop eventually such a distro will work.

      I don't really think the time is at hand myself but I wish them luck!

      --
      Struggling to find a day everyone can make? WhenShallWe.com
  17. Deja vu by Lurker+McLurker · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Didn't Lindows (as they were known then) try to do this then fail miserably? It's not as if this is the first distro to try running Microsoft applications. And what happens when the next version of Office, designed specifically not to work on wine, comes out?

    --
    Mod parent up!
    1. Re:Deja vu by HD+Webdev · · Score: 1

      And what happens when the next version of Office, designed specifically not to work on wine, comes out?

      Well, for a while we don't get to use the new, exciting, and (some might say) revolutionary features that have been added to the latest version Word.

      --
      This is not a dream, not a dream...we are transmitting from the year 1-9-9-9.
  18. Sounds okay to me by Satan's+Hand+Puppet · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Seems like a good idea to me. In making Linux apps run on Windows, it takes the battle to Microsoft's camp and gains exposure.

  19. Re:Excellent product by tehcyder · · Score: 2, Funny
    Cynic!

    --
    To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  20. A bridge to windows??? by bcmm · · Score: 1

    Surely a bridge from windows?

    --
    # cat /dev/mem | strings | grep -i llama
    Damn, my RAM is full of llamas.
  21. Current google cache link doesn't seem to work by pcmanjon · · Score: 2, Informative

    Current google cash posted above doesn't seem to work -- try this one instead people

    http://66.102.9.104/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe =U TF-8&q=cache%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.ignalum.com%2F&btn G=Search

  22. Questions to pose: by CdBee · · Score: 4, Interesting

    1) Is Ignalum a source distribution, built from LFs, or an enhanced version of an existing distribution?

    2)Are exe files associated with WINE so Windows installers just work

    3)Kernel version?

    4)Obviously KDE 3.x from the s/shot linked above, but is it a full or stripped-down version?

    5)Are they using a Windows driver wrapper to allow win32 device drivers to function as well?

    --
    I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
    1. Re:Questions to pose: by CdBee · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I've been a prat.. that isn't KDE. I'm going outside to shoot myself now.

      --
      I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
    2. Re:Questions to pose: by Lurker+McLurker · · Score: 1

      It's Fedora based, according to their website. The latest version mentioned in the Google cache is called Ignalum Linux 9, (presumably based on Red Hat 9?), with a Fedora-based version mentioned as being available in late May.

      --
      Mod parent up!
    3. Re:Questions to pose: by eugene_roux · · Score: 4, Informative
      1) Is Ignalum a source distribution, built from LFs, or an enhanced version of an existing distribution?

      From the Google cache of their (hopelessly slashdotted) site:

      Updated ISO images of Ignalum Linux 9 Beta 2 are now publicly available on a number of FTP mirrors.

      The Ignalum advanced Internet-sharing and IPv6-over-NAT capabilities are not included in this release, but will be incorporated into the next release of Ignalum Linux which will be based on the latest Fedora Core.

      Looks like it's either a RedHat 9 or a Fedora hack...

      --
      Part Time Philosopher, Oft Times Romantic, Full Time Unix Geek
    4. Re:Questions to pose: by theantix · · Score: 1

      Based on the screenshots I saw yesterday, it was pretty obvious to me that they had taken a stock Fedora Core installation and changed the icon for the "Start" button from a Red Hat to a magnifying glass.

      I'd say these people are doing very little and claiming very much -- typical.

      --
      501 Not Implemented
  23. Winning the battle by pubjames · · Score: 5, Insightful


    In many companies, a much easier battle is to get the company to move, say, for Microsoft Outlook to Thunderbird, or IE to Mozilla. Also of course MS Office to OpenOffice. I think this is a much better battle to try to fight than trying to get the whole desktop moved to Linux. Once the company has moved the desktop applications over to open source ones, then it is time to move to Linux.

    Trying to get companies to move to Linux by moving MS Office to Linux is nuts.

    1. Re:Winning the battle by Albanach · · Score: 3, Insightful
      In many companies, a much easier battle is to get the company to move, say, for Microsoft Outlook to Thunderbird

      FOr small companies that use Outlook only as an email client perhaps. Thunderbird is no substitute for Outlook when you start talking about company wide contacts sharing, resource scheduling, shared calendars, meeting invites, voting buttons and all the other things organisations are used to using on a day to day basis.

      You might argue that an email client isn't the place for such features but no-one's going to drop their client that offers them in favour of Thunderbird when no other app is available to offer the missing feature set.

      Like it or loath it, until there's a real Outlook replacement linux lacks the groupware companies are used to and desktop adoption will be restricted.

    2. Re:Winning the battle by pubjames · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You might argue that an email client isn't the place for such features but no-one's going to drop their client that offers them in favour of Thunderbird when no other app is available to offer the missing feature set.

      Yes, I would argue that a web browser is a much better interface for all those things. So try to persuade your company to do that stuff in the web browser, convert to mozilla, then you'll be able to drop outlook.

      Taking your attitude means that your organisation will never move to Linux on the desktop. Ever.

    3. Re:Winning the battle by alex_tibbles · · Score: 1

      No. It's far better to have both tracks available. Some people want the benefits of Linux-based OS, but want to keep the powerful/ easy-to-use features of some Windows programs (like Photoshop, newer MS Excel, MS Access), but some people just want cheaper, alternatives to MS Office, and Photoshop etc. but want to keep windows cos they know it (they use OO.o and Gimp). Different ppl want different things...

    4. Re:Winning the battle by Mr_Silver · · Score: 2, Informative
      In many companies, a much easier battle is to get the company to move, say, for Microsoft Outlook to Thunderbird

      It is? Have you used Outlook in a corporate environment? Do you know what not only does it support email, but also a calendar, contacts, journal, notes and tasks? That you can book appointments and have it automatically send the requests to them, check availability and add it to their diary, review and manage other people's diaries, act as a delegate for sending mail on other peoples behalf, assign tasks to individuals and track their progress and 101 other things which I don't have the time to type in here right now?

      Because, and without sounding harsh, if you did know all that, you'd realise that getting a company to migrate from Outlook to Thunderbird is nigh on impossible given the different feature sets of the two products.

      --
      Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
    5. Re:Winning the battle by tiger99 · · Score: 1
      Outlook is a major security hole, which lots of people would be glad to get rid of, and it needs an expensive Exchange server, again a buggy and insecure piece of excrement from Redmond. It is also not very good at what it does, and its user interface is far from perfect.

      There are alternatives, the German government part-funded Kroupware, I think Ximian are doing something, SuSE can also provide something, and do IBM not now own Lotus, of Notes fame? And some people put Wikis and similar on their intranet, there are also lots of other possibilities for using web-based interfaces with a bit of php and mysql on the intranet server. So, I don't think that an exact Outlook clone is a thing which is needed. In fact, if you give people one interface, the web browser, you simplify things.

      You could actually run an entire desktop from a slightly customised Mozilla, with some extra buttons to start OpenOffice etc, they would never see the underlying OS except maybe XDM or similar to log in. or you could run the whole thing from a slightly modified OpenOffice......

      Either way, it would not take much effort to create a fully integrated office desktop. Maybe Sun have already done that, I have not seen their product yet.

    6. Re:Winning the battle by rufus+t+firefly · · Score: 1
      FOr small companies that use Outlook only as an email client perhaps. Thunderbird is no substitute for Outlook when you start talking about company wide contacts sharing, resource scheduling, shared calendars, meeting invites, voting buttons and all the other things organisations are used to using on a day to day basis.

      You might argue that an email client isn't the place for such features but no-one's going to drop their client that offers them in favour of Thunderbird when no other app is available to offer the missing feature set.

      Like it or loath it, until there's a real Outlook replacement linux lacks the groupware companies are used to and desktop adoption will be restricted.
      I hate to always be the one bringing it up, but there are several solutions in terms of Linux groupware. The lacking part seems to be client connectivity with the servers.

      eGroupware has an excellent XML-RPC and SOAP interface, Kolab already has several Outlook connectors available, but the native clients (Kontact for KDE, which has eGroupware and Kolab support as well as Exchange Server 2000 support) are not out yet. It would be great if someone were to integrate client capabilities for those suites into Mozilla (or something similarly cross-platform).

      Most organizations I know are tied to Windows because of Outlook, not because of Office (most can't even tell the difference between OpenOffice and MS Office).

      At least the outlook (no pun intended, really) is better than it was a year ago.

      --
      "He may look like an idiot, and talk like an idiot, but don't let that fool you. He really is an idiot." - Duck Soup
    7. Re:Winning the battle by Tarantolato · · Score: 1

      No.

      In testing with OpenOffice and Ximian desktop at my company, users fucking hated OpenOffice. One lady actually slapped the monitor in disgust while trying to put together an only moderately complex table in OpenOffice Writer. They did, however, like the option to save as PDF.

      Users did, however, report that they liked the GUI.

    8. Re:Winning the battle by zapp · · Score: 1

      If you can tell me how to get years of archived email from Outlook's .pst files into whatever Thunderbird uses... I'll concider it. Also, convincing me that I will still be able to access that archived email several years from now helps and that the file formats won't be incompatible.

      A story to explain my concern about future compatibility:
      I used to use ICQ back in 'the day', and each new build had a different database structure, so I had to migrate my entire message history each time I installed. Of course now, I have some version of those logs, but it is impossible to find a version of ICQ that will open them.

      --
      no comment
    9. Re:Winning the battle by silicon+not+in+the+v · · Score: 1
      Yes, I would argue that a web browser is a much better interface for all those things. So try to persuade your company to do that stuff in the web browser, convert to mozilla, then you'll be able to drop outlook.

      You do not understand at all. Interface to what app? The Outlook program does those things like calendar integrating with meeting requests, scheduling, etc. "Use a browser interface" doesn't do squat if you don't have a program to interface to.
      --
      We may experience some slight turbulence and then...explode. -Capt. Mal Reynolds
    10. Re:Winning the battle by arkane1234 · · Score: 1

      Have you actually looked at the price for the connectors to those technologies?
      It's outrageous, to say the least.

      Maybe the technologies work, but man... not at a competitive price.
      We did a full analysis of alternatives to replace our aging Exchange 5.5 machine. We do need Calendaring, and all the goodies that go with outlook/exchange functionality because the CEO, upper brass, secretaries, etc, all use the features fully. We are evaluating Novell Groupwise right now, but we've ran the gammet so to speak with the alternatives. Remember, you don't want to alienate everyone, you want them to be able to transition over to a new interface without learning everything over again. Intuitiveness is a necessity in a changeover of that magnitude.
      Another thing to note is if you change like that, you have to have a Windows alternative to Outlook. You can't re-invent the whole corporations desktop in one foul swoop. :(

      It hurts, but it's true.

      At least Groupwise has a little outlook functionality... I just hate the fact that it only runs on uber-expensive Linux distributions.

      --
      -- This space for lease, low setup fee, inquire within!
    11. Re:Winning the battle by mdfst13 · · Score: 1

      Actually, Outlook interfaces with Exchange to provide the groupware stuff. Without Exchange, Outlook's calendar integration is not nearly as useful. Exchange does have a a web interface (as do alternatives). That interface works with Netscape running on Solaris, so I'm guessing that it works on Linux as well.

      Having used both Outlook and the Exchange web interface, I would agree with other posts that they don't really compare. With the web interface, the application and context menus are the generic browser menus. Outlook has its own.

    12. Re:Winning the battle by Secahtah · · Score: 1

      This is exactly correct. What we need is a complete replacement, not a port. Take the functionality incorporated in Microsoft Exchange, Active Directory, etc, and do it *correctly* (i.e., without all of the security holes and closed code, etc) - this is the way to get the corporate desktop to move to Linux.

    13. Re:Winning the battle by silicon+not+in+the+v · · Score: 1

      OK, good point that Exchange provides most of the useful functionality. Is there an OS application that does what an Exchange server does?

      --
      We may experience some slight turbulence and then...explode. -Capt. Mal Reynolds
  24. I'd try them out... by rhythmx · · Score: 1

    ...but their site seems to have been /.'ed with record speed.
    I would greatly prefer to run 100% linux, but I have VMWare installed just to run photoshop and access the occasional website that has gets trashed without the worlds most standand non-standards-complient browser.

  25. grr. by SinaSa · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's projects like this that really piss me off.

    Sure, the goal of the project is very admirable. More compatibility, no matter where (as long as it isn't breaking things) is a good thing.

    But why didn't these uni students spend their time helping the projects that are already there. Now, we have an extra project, using existing tools (presumably hacked to be better), and now the existing tools have to find out what hacks were used to make their improvement.

    These guys have put themselves an unwanted middleman in the compatibility/innovation process, and it annoys the hell out of me.

    --
    --
    The last digit of pi is four.
    1. Re:grr. by TheClarkey · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If you'd read the website you would have seen that the goal of the project is to allow the University to showcase the talents of its students and staff.

      What many people forget is that there are a whole lot of people coming out with degrees in comp sci and se, you have to make yourself stand out from the pack. This is a great way for them to do it.

      I doubt this initiative is about trying to make any money from linux, its about making students more employable after they graduate.

    2. Re:grr. by BiggerIsBetter · · Score: 1

      Yep. Good job if it was for school, but but if they wanted to prove how leet they were they should've just made a set of packages or patches for Debian or whatever. If they want anyone to use their distro, they now have the task of supporting an entire OS based on an obsolete distro. Not smart. Additionaly, if their mods are all that, how long untill they find their way back to WINE and friends for mainline integration? They've done well for a group of students, but they must've missed the class on project maintenance.

      --
      Forget thrust, drag, lift and weight. Airplanes fly because of money.
  26. Re:Whee! by Disevidence · · Score: 1

    You need to take 1st year maths again, I think.

    After 3 comes 4, not 1.

    --
    Think nothing is impossible? Try slamming a revolving door.
  27. This is a first. by amitofu · · Score: 1

    Even Google's Cache is slashdotted. Can no web server survive the wrath of Slashdot?

    1. Re:This is a first. by falonaj · · Score: 1
      Even Google's Cache is slashdotted. Can no web server survive the wrath of Slashdot?

      Try www.google.com/search?q=cache:www.ignalum.com - this is working just fine.

  28. Win4Lin by datan · · Score: 5, Informative

    Personally, I use Win4Lin. It's runs windows as either a separate window or in full screen mode (think X Windows but running Windws). I sometimes like to run win4lin in full screen mode and confuse people since it's almost impossible to tell you're running it under linux until you try to do low-level stuff like configuring device drivers & network stuff. It's a really great product; but only runs Windows 98 (heard they're working on Win2K version), and doesn't do directx games. Other than that, everything works -- Microsoft Office, IE, Kazaa, chessmaster etc. I'll be happy to provide more details on request. Oh yes, I have no links to said company other than being a very satisfied customer.

    1. Re:Win4Lin by dioscaido · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Sounds like VMWare, but with less OS support... I run Gentoo as my base system, and then run multiple VMWare VMs for whatever OS I need (98/2k/XP/other linux flavors). It's quite useful, and with ver. 3 performance is quite snappy, even on my 866mhz system.

    2. Re:Win4Lin by anpe · · Score: 1

      Strange, the "chessmaster 9000" I own does use DirectX (Direct2D)... Perhaps you meant Direct3D?

    3. Re:Win4Lin by datan · · Score: 1

      this is the official party line http://www.netraverse.com/frame_index.php?screen=s upporthome Subject Will Win4Lin run Windows 2000 or Windows XP? Author Amanda Owens No, as of Win4Lin Version 4.0, Win4Lin only runs Windows 95, Windows 98 and Windows ME. We are currently developing Windows 2000 support for a future Win4Lin release, but do not yet have a target date when the release will be available.

    4. Re:Win4Lin by datan · · Score: 1
      argh!!! from their support

      Subject: Will Win4Lin run Windows 2000 or Windows XP?

      Author: Amanda Owens

      No, as of Win4Lin Version 4.0, Win4Lin only runs Windows 95, Windows 98 and Windows ME. We are currently developing Windows 2000 support for a future Win4Lin release, but do not yet have a target date when the release will be available.

    5. Re:Win4Lin by datan · · Score: 1

      I guess they do partial directx, that is, games that run in full screen mode won't work. but running windows media player in full screen mode does work. admittedly I haven't really tested running starcraft under win4lin, although I doubt it would work.

    6. Re:Win4Lin by datan · · Score: 1

      which part of satisfied customer do you not understand?

    7. Re:Win4Lin by datan · · Score: 1
      well some differences between win4lin and vmware I can think of:

      1. price difference. $80 vs $300

      2. the consensus is that win4lin is much faster than vmware. so much so that if I want to browse huge xml files (several MBs) I would rather open it in IE under win4lin than under mozilla under linux.

      3. win4lin only supports win98/ME.

      4. win4lin uses the native linux file system so files can be shared by windows/linux (you can create a sym link to your home directory under the win4lin windows directory

      5.win4lin has limited support for certain devices such as USB devices (other than mice and keyboards)

  29. Nuked as usual by po8 · · Score: 3, Funny

    "...or so says their website."

    Uh, no. Their website doesn't say anything anymore. Indeed, it's apparently powered by something called "PostNuke".

    /. --- because the net needed a gratuitous Heisenberg effect.

    1. Re:Nuked as usual by BenjyD · · Score: 1

      From the article:Right now, Ignalum Linux is being subjected to a last round of testing.


      I'd say it failed the web server load test, for one.


    2. Re:Nuked as usual by zz99 · · Score: 1
      I'd say it failed the web server load test, for one.

      According to NetCraft their webserver is running FreeBSD

    3. Re:Nuked as usual by Lehk228 · · Score: 1

      web site is operating fine, they blocked /. referred loads, just go up to your navigation bar and type in the URL

      --
      Snowden and Manning are heroes.
  30. Screenshots by ensignyu · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The screenshots look incredibly ordinary. No emulated Windows programs, or even anything that looks remarkably different from Fedora Core. It doesn't look that much easier to use either.

    We'll see how useful it really is when the reviews come out.

  31. How about /.ing? by trezor · · Score: 1

    Does Ignoble Linux withstand /.ing in any admirable manner, though? *grin*

    /mirrors please

    --
    Not Buzzword 2.0 compliant. Please speak english.
  32. Support? by ObviousGuy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The company is 4 guys who cobbled together a distro out of existing parts.

    They can't even keep their webserver up. What would make anyone think that this support for this new splinter distro will be sustained for any period of time?

    --
    I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
    1. Re:Support? by kidlinux · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Do you think these 4 guys have the resources for a webserver and net connection that can handle a slashdotting? Honestly, we've all seen much larger companies get slashdotted.

      So instead of being an asshole and not giving these guys a chance just because they couldn't handle a hogillion requests from all the critical pessimists on slashdot, give them some encouragement. What we're seeing here is the result of the freedoms provided by open source, and everyone should be supportive rather than critical.

      And, FYI, here is their sourceforge website: http://ignalum.sourceforge.net/ -- it seems the distro was created as a project for all the CS/CE/SE students at the University of Western Ontario to work on. An interesting idea, something I might try when I go back to school this fall.

      --
      -kidlinux.
    2. Re:Support? by stuntpope · · Score: 1

      And yet they have the balls to have a poll on their site asking "Should Ignalum Linux 9 be considered as one of the best free offerings among linux distros?"

    3. Re:Support? by Daneurysm · · Score: 1

      I think it was rather clever of them to block slashdot refers...The site is perfectly accessable.

      "This guy can't even type in a URL. What would make anyone think that he'd understand what a "403 - forbidden" error would mean?"

    4. Re:Support? by IANAAC · · Score: 1
      Do you think these 4 guys have the resources for a webserver and net connection that can handle a slashdotting? Honestly, we've all seen much larger companies get slashdotted.

      I can't get to the site now to verify, but the lead-in says they're college students. Unless they've gotten funding to set up some sort of infrastructure, they probably DON'T have the necessary resources. A webserver and a net connection don not a business make.

    5. Re:Support? by HD+Webdev · · Score: 1

      I think it was rather clever of them to block slashdot refers...The site is perfectly accessable.

      "This guy can't even type in a URL. What would make anyone think that he'd understand what a "403 - forbidden" error would mean?"

      (parent hasn't been modded up at this point)

      I can image those guys who worked on the project reading the posts here that say 'woo, it's crap, we slashdotted it' and being puzzled.

      Rant about how Slashdot is Supremely Evil for slashdotting sites or about how it is Even More Evil for not warning or carrying caches of sites. Maybe you'll get modded up.

      Mention the fact that a site actually put an tiny obstacle that filtered out hits from less knowledgeable Slashdot users to prevent a complete Slashdotting, no interesting/informative mod points.

      It doesn't make sense.

      --
      This is not a dream, not a dream...we are transmitting from the year 1-9-9-9.
  33. Re:a platform independent os! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Emacs, my friend.

  34. after all, by jtwJGuevara · · Score: 3, Funny

    they are targeting people using Windows already :)

  35. Re:Excellent product by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    not to mention Solitare! secretaries everywhere will endorse this

  36. On another note by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    I like the microsoft ads at the top of the slashdot page.

    What is the world coming to?

    Next thing you know Virus Scanners will allow certain virii made buy paying customers... oh wait that already happens.

    1. Re:On another note by zz99 · · Score: 3, Informative
      I like the microsoft ads at the top of the slashdot page.

      I click on it every day I see it.

      I wish there were more ways of diverting funds from M$ to the community :)

    2. Re:On another note by TuringTest · · Score: 1

      Well, according to the Attention Economy principles, you're doing M$ a favor.

      --
      Singularity: a belief in the "God" idea with the "demiurge" relation inverted.
    3. Re:On another note by Long-EZ · · Score: 1


      The Register makes a few well deserved snide remarks about Microsoft, and I recently noticed prominent Microsoft ads at the bottom of their pages. Is this some sort of evil Microsoft marketing plan to extend and embrace their enemies?

      --
      >> My ultraviolent Linux switch video.
  37. Unfortunately by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If you want a Linux for the average user, it's going to have to be that way. Now we all know that su-ing to root is easy for when you need it, but it is something that will piss off and confound most users. You wouldn't think so, but it never ceases to amaze me the how the simplest things (froma geek perspective) can confound normal users.

    This goes double for an underdog OS trying to win converts. It has to offer a user experience at least as good, and probably better. Carrying on about OSS, configurability and monopolies means jack to most users. They want it to be as easy as what they have now.

    So to do that a Linux distro needs to either be root all the time, or break away from the traditonal UNIX security model and offer something like Windows NT's Administrator accounts that, while not all powerful, are capable of doing just about anything.

    This is just the reality of the average individual. I mean, why do you think the government mandidated passive safety restraints in cars? Because LOTS of people don't wear seatbelts. It's not like it's hard to do, takes you 2 seconds to put on. However, I know lots of people that don't unless reminded and even them often don't.

    Extra steps that are different from what they have now (like having to su) are the things that will turn them away. IT'll only take a few things before they whine and say "I hate this, give me Windows back".

    1. Re:Unfortunately by Mr_Silver · · Score: 2, Interesting
      This goes double for an underdog OS trying to win converts. It has to offer a user experience at least as good, and probably better. Carrying on about OSS, configurability and monopolies means jack to most users. They want it to be as easy as what they have now.

      People will put up with a lot of problems if they are working with something they are comfortable with. Especially when they feel they can be more productive with it than the time taken to learn something else.

      Therefore if you want people to migrate you have to offer something that is easily 200% better than what they currently have. Otherwise you'll get the response "yes thats cool, but I'm better off sticking with this".

      Case in point: I write all my website code in Perl, I've looked a PHP and it is better in many ways - but I'm far more productive with Perl, know immediately how to use Perl and can do what I want to do with Perl just fine. Since PHP isn't 200% better, I'm not too bothered about not learning it. It's cool, but I'm better off sticking with Perl.

      --
      Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
    2. Re:Unfortunately by bloosqr · · Score: 1

      Thats a bit odd as macos "the user friendly" unix doesn't even have a root account. Sudo is used to execute root commands
      (w/ a gui asking for "administrator" passwd for gui executables)

    3. Re:Unfortunately by khb · · Score: 1

      Mac OS X proves it doesn't have to be that way. By default there is no root, but to act like root you have to manually login again.

      Nontechnical people seem, to get it quickly.

    4. Re:Unfortunately by phcrack · · Score: 1

      OS X, Gnome, and KDE all have that nifty little window that pops up an asks for the administrator password when you need to do something with escalated privileges. Anyone who's used an OS or desktop environment with this feature realises just how little you see this box too.

      There rarely a good reason to log in as the administrator, and there is never a good reason to run as one all the time. I'm sure that after his/her first virus even the lowliest windows user can see this.

    5. Re:Unfortunately by apoc.famine · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The average user will be happy su'ing to root just as soon as someone makes a button on the desktop that reads "make me god". A button which requires a password to make it happen, and after 10 min of inactivity, releases root. Honestly, all joe user really needs is translation into his language.

      "You may not install this software unless you are god."
      joe user: "Humm, this button says it will make me god...needs password....WOW fancy colors!! I must be god!!"

      --
      Velociraptor = Distiraptor / Timeraptor
    6. Re:Unfortunately by alecks · · Score: 1

      What is it about the Administrator account that is "not all powerful"? IIRC, There's nothing I can't do under local admin (to the local machine, ofcourse).

    7. Re:Unfortunately by g0at · · Score: 1

      If you want a Linux for the average user, it's going to have to be that way. Now we all know that su-ing to root is easy for when you need it, but it is something that will piss off and confound most users.

      Mac OS X doesn't seem to have much problem with this... (it throws up a dialog, a user with administrator privileges -- usually the same user sitting at the machine -- enters his password again, and things continue.)

      -ben

    8. Re:Unfortunately by Mr.Ned · · Score: 2, Informative

      I call bullshit. The user in OS X doesn't run as root, and no one calls that 'unusable' or 'hard'.

    9. Re:Unfortunately by schon · · Score: 1

      If you want a Linux for the average user, it's going to have to be that way

      No, it isn't. You don't need root to use a box, you need root to administer a box.

      Adminstration and use are two separate things. For the longest time MS has tried to get people to think that they're the same, but even they now realize the error of doing things this way, and are slowly trying to transition people away from this.

    10. Re:Unfortunately by FireFury03 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I'll get modded flamebait for this but...

      why do you think the government mandidated passive safety restraints in cars? Because LOTS of people don't wear seatbelts.

      Whilest it's true that a very large proportion of Americans don't wear seatbelts, the same is not true around the world - we have a very high proportion of both drivers and passengers wearing seatbelts here in the UK. Infact, AFAIK the airbag system on american cars is different to UK cars because the american system has to catch people who are travelling at an unrestrained 70mph _because_ of the lack of seatbelt use. What does this show? well I leave it up to the reader to draw their own conclusions. :)

      Now we all know that su-ing to root is easy for when you need it, but it is something that will piss off and confound most users.

      Most Windows converts won't be using the shell, they'll be using the pretty GUI tools to configure everything... And you know what, in the Gnome tools shipped with Fedora, there is no concept of having to "su to root", it simply prompts you for the root password if you try and do something that requires it. Yes, ok, some of the really challenged users might find it confusing to have to enter a password when they hit the "destroy my whole computer" button, but then again, if they're that challenged then it probably just saved them from breaking their system.

      Having to enter the root password is less convenient than just being allowed to do whatever you want, but it adds another level of confirmation when doing dangerous things, and do we *really* want to seriously compromise the security of the system just so some windows users can install their spyware easier?

    11. Re:Unfortunately by diamondsw · · Score: 1

      You might want to check out OS X then. The main user runs as a member of wheel (so they can su to root if needed by an OS or security patch), but they have full access to their user folder *and* the Applications and Library folders, which is where all apps and userland stuff goes. They never notice they aren't root, but they can't easily accidentally bork the OS.

      Unlike Linux and Windows, OS X has kept the "core OS" *very* separate from the areas the user will modify. This is also what allows things like "Archive and Install" to work so well.

      The OS X model has proved over the last couple of years to work very, very well, so yes, this can be done.

      --
      I don't know what kind of crack I was on, but I suspect it was decaf.
  38. http 404/403 error by themusicgod1 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In the meanwhile, I wonder how "Free" this distro is. Is it merely a hack-together-proof-of-concept or hack-together-lets-do-some-cool-stuff or is it more of a serious-linux-distro-that-we-can-distribute-under- the-terms-of-the-GPL-or-LGPL?

    I've been wanting to use windows for awhile, but despite shitty software the main reasons are all legal -- I don't want to give microsoft any money, or agree to anything that I havn't read and agree with(namelessly any shrinkwrap EULA). the GPL I have read many times and agree not only with it as a 'oh...kay...fine whatever.' but as honestly agreeing with it in spirit.
    If it's not Free that's fine with me, I still like to see progress in the direction of windows...but...I'll be particularily interested if it is, in fact I'll likely devote a computer or two to it in the future ;)

    --
    GENERATION 26: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
    1. Re:http 404/403 error by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      I've been wanting to use windows for awhile, but despite shitty software the main reasons are all legal -- I don't want to give microsoft any money, or agree to anything that I havn't read and agree with(namelessly any shrinkwrap EULA).

      Why don't you want to give Microsoft money? If Windows is useful enough that you can say you want to use it, then surely the people who wrote this useful software deserve to be compensated? And if Windows isn't useful enough to be worth paying for, why do you want to use it?

      As for the EULA, you don't have to agree to it without reading it. You aren't considered to have agreed to it until you click "I agree" at the bottom of this big window with the EULA text in it. If you're worried that the store won't take it back if you disagree, you can find Microsoft's EULAs online easily enough.

      If what you're saying is "I want to use Windows, but not Microsoft Windows", then that's fine (and perfectly in line with Slashdot groupthink), but please say that, instead of babbling about non-existant shrinkwrap EULAs.

    2. Re:http 404/403 error by themusicgod1 · · Score: 1

      "Why don't you want to give Microsoft money? If Windows is useful enough that you can say you want to use it,"
      I don't want to use windows, I have to use windows. Like many others, I use windows as part of my attempt in order to keep myself alive at this point. My second job demands me to both use and be profficient with it, and my third job is going to as well, and probably if Jobsearching goes well, my fourth job should I find time to get one.
      The people who had any part in writing any of the code in supporting the spew of corporate greed that is microsoft need to be lined up against a wall, and shot, not paid.

      As for any liscencing agreement, I would like to agree to it. This is what I am asking about... What is the status of the liscencing agreement (is it GPL-ish or not?) for this "SOFTWARE PRODUCT" ? I suppose I could just install it and find out...which probably means buying a newer computer first. I'll get on that.

      --
      GENERATION 26: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
  39. YOU MAY BE A LINUX NERD IF... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...you think "pseudo" is spelled "sudo".

  40. What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    So, there is more besides Linux? What is this thing, called Windows?

    1. Re:What? by zz99 · · Score: 1, Funny
      What is this thing, called Windows?

      I thought at first that they were talking about X-Windows... Or are there similar products capitalizing on the brand recognition of X-Windows?

  41. An appropriate stepping stone? by MegaT · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'm not sure this makes an appropriate stepping stone. What comes under the umbrella of 'Popular Microsoft Fare' which isn't already provided by OO.org in an almost identical fashion to the Microsoft applications?

  42. no, really... by kd4evr · · Score: 1, Flamebait

    simulating 100% compatibility with a faulty, buggy, unpredictable and unmanageable s/w is either a prank or a contradiction in terms.

    My congrats to the 4 students for yet-another-distro but they surely won't able to simulate all the blue screens, dr. watson's and virii prone (with-welcome-sign) openings in less than 2.5*10^4 years. It took a lot of engineering hours in Redmond to make Windows the masterpile of crap that it is today.

    I don't think further bridges are neccessary - the trend is Linux and doing well...

    1. Re:no, really... by kd4evr · · Score: 1, Funny

      Then again, their website is simulating the common M$ features very well right now...

      so I stand corrected...

  43. Compatible with windows? by ciupman · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why not make it compatible with all the linux distros around? Like same /etc structure (conf files and init), package compatibility (rpm, apt, tgz, deb, etc), etc, etc. Linux doesn't need windows compatibility, linux needs uniformization, stable libraries, stable and well documented API, a good programming IDE, and less application bloat. Linux needs to draw the attencion of the windows developers, for them to start developing good NATIVE apps for it. Please stop throwing at them the EMACS editor, i might like it .. but a MS Visual Studio user will just laugh at it.

    And to be on topic again, the minute i saw "fedora based" i though to myself ... naaa! If you guys had based your distro in LFS i would be more sympathetic with your "noble" cause!

    --
    I fuse with Mercer every single day...
    1. Re:Compatible with windows? by zarniwhoop · · Score: 1
      couldn't have said it better myself!

      As a long time windows programmer I have seen tons of improvements in the development environement on windows over the last dozen years.

      What's available for Linux? vi? pico? emacs?

    2. Re:Compatible with windows? by zz99 · · Score: 1
      As a long time windows programmer I have seen tons of improvements in the development environement on windows over the last dozen years.

      How about KDevelop 3?

      (I haven't used any Windows IDE for many years, so I have no idea how well it compares.
      It would be nice if someone who have tried both could share some insights)

    3. Re:Compatible with windows? by ciupman · · Score: 1, Funny

      You might try Anjuta! Also, i might have said that of EMACS .. but it's more powerful than you think (but not for MS Developers >;) )

      --
      I fuse with Mercer every single day...
    4. Re:Compatible with windows? by Compulawyer · · Score: 1
      Sayeth the poster:

      "Linux doesn't need windows compatibility. . . ."

      Sorry, but I think you are seriously misguided on this point. Who is any individual to be able to say "Linux doesn't need THAT ." (caveat: Linux is used in the distribution sense, not in the kernel sense. And no, I am not going to call it GNU/Linux.). If these guys see something they think is useful and which addresses a perceived need, I say GO FOR IT! The open source nature of the codebase gives them the ability to innovate any way they see fit. Licenses like the GPL are designed to ENCOURAGE efforts like this.

      By the way, this is EXACTLY the same tactic that Microsoft used to get ITS dominant position. Windows piggy-backed on the market position of IBM. I predict that if this company is still around in 5 years, you'll be wishing you owned its stock instead of telling them to make their product compatible with other Linux distros.

      --

      Laws affecting technology will always be bad until enough techies become lawyers.

    5. Re:Compatible with windows? by ciupman · · Score: 1

      Just one short reply ... if fedora/redhat dies (i don't think it will happen) this one is surely dead too. I would prefer to have redhat stock instead. Apart from some minor tweaks this guys made to fedora (some png substitutions of the install application, and others) i think they have little merit on what they have done. Seriously, did they bring something new? No, Suse has it, Linspire has it, others have it .. Are they trying to fill a gap in the market? No .. just confusing it a little more, and that's not good for linux ..

      I agree in the case of the GPL .. but there are limits : imagine i develop an application and then some guy picks it up, and adds some nifty printfs to my code and redistributes it as his own, "nicely" telling it's based in my code .. I know this is somewhat exagerated, but it seems a little bit like this. It's a little bit unfair to those guys over fedora

      Ok .. not that short of an answer !

      --
      I fuse with Mercer every single day...
  44. Privileged logins? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    > The thing with the other 'distros' is it takes a system administrator to set something up," Mr. Ho explained. "We're trying to simplify things so a regular user can pretty much do everything -- and we're trying to make it as user friendly as Windows."

    Does that mean it would have only privileged logins? Is it a good thing?

  45. Re:a platform independent os! by zz99 · · Score: 1
    Nope. It's a file editor with more capabilities than a smaller desktop os. Read usenet, mail, surf the web, play games and so on.

    ...And if you find something it doesn't currently do, you just edit the LISP source and add it.

  46. J. R. Sixpack? by John+Starks · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Who is this J. R. Sixpack you keep talking about so condescendingly? You really do need to be more specific when you talk about a class of users.

    It sounds like you're talking about the 18-35 year old male that doesn't know anything about computers. Now, tell me, what software does such a person install from "shovelware CDs?" Let's be honest. Such a user checks email, browses the web, watches video clips, listens to music, and talks on instant messenger. That's it. No one installs extra little apps these days. Shareware is dead. Anybody that looks around for little programs to solve tasks knows enough about computers to not be called "J. R. Sixpack."

    I'm not sure why you're so against an additional distribution, anyway. It's not like another distribution hurts "the cause" or whatever you people like to harp on about. These guys have absolutely no responsbility to further "the cause" by writing software instead of coming out with another distribution. They can do as they please.

    I just don't see the point of your post. You tell us that the distribution is not necessary, improvements in Windows compatability is pointless because non-Linux users are stupid, and you assume that somehow these guys are diverting resources away from the IMPORTANT aspects of "the cause."

    I'll probably get modded flamebait for this post, but I think the parent is just trolling.

    1. Re:J. R. Sixpack? by jimicus · · Score: 1

      OK, perhaps it sounds condescending. I was referring to what I perceive as being a large "middle ground" of people who know enough about computers to get into trouble but not enough to get out again. With such people, it usually works like this:

      1. JR buys computer, surfs web, uses email.
      2. JR goes out and buys a digital camera/scanner/whatever & installs everything that came with it. Some of the software doesn't work very well, or isn't very suitable, but s/he doesn't bother uninstalling it because it might come in useful.
      3. JR discovers another interest - say, perhaps, tracing his family tree. He decides it might be an idea to hold all this information on his computer. He either buys, pirates or downloads a product to do this. If the product is no good, he tries another.
      4. Repeat steps 2 & 3 until the computer grinds to a shuddering halt.

      What I mean is "another Linux distribution which promises Windows compatability but cannot deliver is liable to turn a middle-ground user discussed above against Linux, and it's their IT literate friends who are going to be asked to come around, re-install Windows & get all their software working again".

  47. coLinux by tobe · · Score: 1

    What about running Linux natively as a service on your Window box:

    http://www.colinux.org/

  48. Heated exchange by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    You should read this exchange between Daniel Ho of Ignalum and Henrick Omma of the OpenCD. Funny stuff, and it gives some insight into how these Ignalum guys approach the OSS community.

    1. Re:Heated exchange by usermilk · · Score: 1

      Yes, they look like total asses at the beginning, but by the second page they actually provided useful help.

  49. Article in National Post Yesterday by LazyBoyWrangler · · Score: 2, Interesting

    There was an article in the National Post yesterday about these guys. Nothing appeared to be even mildly remarkable. They mentioned Transgaming and CodeWeavers as things they were "intending" to include with their Fedora Core based distribution. Basically, they looked like they were very much in beginning stages of their execution of the concept. Surprisingly, their marketing materials looked reasonably professional, so I would guess their skills lay more in promotion and presentation than technical execution. I saw their site prior to the /.'tting, and it had many content holes. If I had to guess, they are good promoters that have managed to convince their professors they are on to a good thing, but obviously, their professors haven't been plugged in to the Linux community at all. Nothing really of note here, and I wouldn't want anyone to think there is anything new here.

    1. Re:Article in National Post Yesterday by LazyBoyWrangler · · Score: 1

      Actually, it was the Globe and Mail - I read a bunch of papers and got the reference wrong. Ignalum Linux.

      The references to CodeWeavers and Transgaming were on their website before it went south.

  50. Ninnle Linux already does this! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Ninnle has been doing this for some time now. This is nothing new.

  51. Is this the year?? by schnablebg · · Score: 1

    It looks like this is really shaping up to be the year of Windows!

  52. Odd Stuff?? by twoslice · · Score: 1, Funny
    they use their computer for all sorts of odd stuff.

    This ought to be rich. Do tell....

    --

    From excellent karma to terible karma with a single +5 funny post...
  53. Re:Mod parent down, he hasn't used linux for YEARS by ciupman · · Score: 1

    I use linux all the time .. i'm writing this in a mozilla 1.6 installed in my redhat 9.0 upgraded to fedora through "apt-get update-dist". I use Anjuta as my C++ programming IDE, as it does not bloat the makefiles as Kdeveloper does. I'm also a gnome user as i don't like the QT bloated MOC dependent API, including it's (commercial) license. I trully adore linux as a programming enviroment. Now try and put yourself inside of a MS developer's shoes, and user, and let's stop being mindless and blind linux fanboys, so we can start adressing the real issues of linux facing it's "competitors". That's the only whay it will grow and evolve

    And about those massive collection of apps .. there's the problem, too many of them doing the same thing but not enought to get the job done.

    --
    I fuse with Mercer every single day...
  54. We're saved!! by saynte · · Score: 1
    Wow, am I ever glad this guy's heading up the team! From the roster on their site:

    [He] created the Ignalum Linux OS, when it became clear that without some of his input making its way into mainstream Linux, Linux will likely continue to suffer as a high maintainence Operating System.

    Thank you Dan Ho! *grumble* self-important jack-ass *grumble*

  55. The Linux Future by winchester · · Score: 2, Insightful

    First of all, this "feature" already exists, it is running on my XP machine right now and it is called Cygwin. Honestly, a good command line is all I really need, since all the other OSS tools I use are available for Windows (Firefox, Thunderbird, Putty, OpenOffice, Latex etc). So I really do not need more linux/Windows integration, I could do with a Linux machine on my desk, but corporate rules will not allow me one... but I digres.

    What I really want to point at is innovative power in Linux. There does not seem to be any. Sure, Linux has made great progress since the days of 1.0 (i've been running it that long) but still, Linux is a Unix replacement that is not good enough for the big iron (which I administer daily) and for the desktop there are cleaner Unix systems (the BSD's) and nicer working ones (Mac OS X).

    A couple days ago I saw an announcement from HP, where they showed off their "PC of the Future", a device that integrated everything. Phone, email, web, video, music, you name it, it had it. And what was driving this thing? The horribly bloated, slow Windows XP, which, for all the development that has gone into Windows, still functions in the same way as Windows 2.0 did. Where's the innovative new operating system interaction? Why do I still have to live with start buttons and desktops?

    This is in my opinion where Linux could shine. Create a new, fast GUI. Think of a whole new paradigm for using the computer. Why do we need a desktop, a start button, folders or directories, hard disks... I don't need to know about all that, I just want to use my computer.

    Microsoft is busy recreating Windows in the form of Longhorn. Undoubtedly Longhorn will be a (large) step beyond Windows XP. But the age-old paradigm of the desktop will still be there. The much-maligned start button will still be there. And all the other things that make Windows Windows will still be there. An missed opertunity, in my opinion. Just as much as Linux misses the opertunity to be truly innovative. Gates is right in that respect, the open source community is quite good at immitation, but not so good at innovation. Innovation is what is needed, not creating a cross-over between Unix and Windows.

  56. Ingalum site poll by Mateito · · Score: 1
    Should Ignalum Linux 9 be considered as one of the best free offerings among linux distros?

    Looks like they have 14 employees

  57. This is classic! by Gleng · · Score: 2, Informative

    " ... Based on his belief in Linux, Daniel founded Ignalum Software, Inc. in 2002 and created the Ignalum Linux OS, when it became clear that without some of his input making its way into mainstream Linux, Linux will likely continue to suffer as a high maintainence Operating System."

    Hahaha! Cheers mate! There was me slaving over a hot server, and your mainstream Linux input has made things so much more low-maintainence!

    Good luck with the slashdotting :)

    --
    "Proudly Posting Without Reading The Article"
  58. Ignalum? by Vampyre_Dark · · Score: 1

    How about Ignorant Linux?

    The slashdotted Distro
    For uninformed people

    1. Re:Ignalum? by Vampyre_Dark · · Score: 1

      Their Logo is a copy n' pasted, standard tux and a big magnifying glass.

      Ignorant Linux: Get A Fucking Clue.

  59. THEY ARE NOT DOWN -THEY BLOCKED /. by lcsjk · · Score: 4, Informative

    Go to www.ignalum.com but not through the /. link.

  60. MOD PARENT UP by 74nova · · Score: 1

    he's right

    --
    use your turn signal! you people act like it's divulging information to the enemy
  61. Re: Unrivaled compatability with worms & troja by elwinc · · Score: 4, Insightful
    You get your choice on that. There are 2 win4lin choices that affect worm & trojan compatability. One is the choice to have it use its own IP address rather than sharing address and borrowing some ports from the host Linux environment. If you select sharing the Linux address, you lose a few features, but you are less vulnerable. Choice two is where you read your mail. If you choose to read mail with Windows/Outlook, heaven help you! On the other hand, if you read mail in Unix, and never configure any Windows mail client, the email vulnerability is gone. Which ever choice you make, you'll still have to worry about Excel and Word macro viruses. There is still no excuse for not running windows update regularly.

    Another interesting point about win4lin: it uses the underlying linux filesystem. In linux, you can copy a file into or out of the windows directory. This means you can simply tar gzip up your whole windows installation and save different versions of it. I have a basic installation saved on a CD rom, and a few more versions on the hard drive in .tgz files. If I get a virus in Windows, I can go to linux, copy out my documents and spreadsheets, rm -fR the whole infected windows file tree, and untar a clean version. Elapsed time: 5-10 minutes. Then I'd better get the clean version patched before I get re-infected, and save it as my new checkpointed version.

    --
    --- Often in error; never in doubt!
  62. Perspective by Tin+Foil+Hat · · Score: 1

    I see a lot of posts bitching about wasted resources. How it's been done and failed, and why don't these guys put their skills to use on a real project. Get some perspective people. Linux is cool precisely because there is tremendous duplication of effort. It is this duplication that leads to improvements for everyone. If everybody and their brother can release a distro, as that is indeed possible, the chances for innovation improve dramatically. If there are only a few projects, each with vast armies of volunteer developers, then the admins of each product become a bottleneck for distribution of good ideas. It's not that those folks want to stifle innovation, but that there is simply no way for a small group of folks to handle thousands of good ideas at one time.

    That's a big why diversity in software is such a good idea; there are many more chances for innovation. For an example of what happens when there is lack of diversity, look at Internet Explorer and the innovation we (don't) see there.

    So quit moaning about yet another distro. Go out and see what they really have to offer, there just might be something there, and even if there's not, it hasn't hurt anything.

    Personally, I'd like something like that because I'd be able to run Visual Source Safe under an NTFS file system instead of via Wine on a FAT32 partition. VSS in Wine really sucks, and keeping source code on FAT32 does too.

    --
    No matter how many of my rights are taken away, somehow I still don't feel safe. -Frigid Monkey
    1. Re:Perspective by Warlok · · Score: 1
      there is tremendous duplication of effort


      It's called competition - you and I both trying to do task A better than the other guy. It's the basis of capitalism, and yes, Martha, it's a very good thing.

      --
      ...and you run and you run and you can't stop what's been done...
  63. PostNuke As Usual by lodurr · · Score: 1

    PostNuke is notorious for its poor scalability. Unless you take some pains to make your configuration lean, a typical page can entail 10-15 unique SQL queries. It's not at all uncommon for a PostNuke site to get hammered with only a hundred or so simultaneous users.

    [... standing by for the flames from PN folks ...]

  64. Importing from Outlook by paulproteus · · Score: 2, Informative

    Outlook:

    In Linux, you can use the program "readpst" provided by libpst, libpst.sourceforge.net

    In Windows, Mozilla Mail will import it (through the OLE interface), and Mozilla Mail's mailboxes are in standard MBOX format. Everyone in UNIX, and many many Windows programs, can import MBOX.

    --
    |/usr/games/fortune
    1. Re:Importing from Outlook by zapp · · Score: 1

      That does seem to solve that problem, but there is one more. I understand though that this is a problem with Outlook, and doesn't really pertain to migrating AWAY from outlook, but its still something I wanted to mention.

      Outlook cannot import MBOX files. So if you're thinking of trying Thunderbird for a while, just be aware that you cannot import your mail back to outlook should you decide you like Outlook better.

      Best bet is to tell Thunderbird not to delete messages from the server, and download them with outlook as well.

      --
      no comment
  65. Wrong URL for libpst by paulproteus · · Score: 1

    Libpst's website is actually http://sourceforge.net/projects/ol2mbox . My mistake.

    --
    |/usr/games/fortune
  66. Xandros == Ignalum? by Vega043 · · Score: 1
    "The Xandros Desktop OS is known for their intuitive graphical environment that works right out of the box."
    "Ignalum Linux 'is an intuitive graphical environment that works right out of the box....
  67. wrong... by CoolMoDee · · Score: 1

    I found the complete opposite with my dad. He was running windows, but I moved him to Linux (Win2k -> Redhat 8 -> 9 -> FC1), set it to auto-login to his desktop on boot. As far as inputting his root password every now and then, he dosn't mind, because he understands that it helps keep his system secure. If taking less than 2 seconds once a week (updates) makes his system run as smooth as silk near 100% of the time, he is all for it. I think the 'run as root full time' only applies if you have the windows mentallity 'install as much kludge in a week as I can'. Since this kludge is windows-only kudge, and dosn't run on linux there is no need to be root 24/7.

    --
    Jisho - A Japanese English German Russian French Dictionary for the rest of us.
  68. Average User by AnomalyConcept · · Score: 1

    From the article: "We're trying to simplify things so a regular user can pretty much do everything -- and we're trying to make it as user friendly as Windows."

    Since parent mentioned 'su'ing, what will be the security implications of having a regular user being able to 'do everything'? Will the user be prompted for the root password like how RedHat has it set up now? I believe Dropline Gnome (for Slackware) has this feature as well.

    If not, then a large part of Linux's security will be negated.

  69. You have to be kidding me by babbage · · Score: 1

    Ignalum? Ignalum? You must be joking.

    What's with all the stupid, stupid names for open source projects? "Ignalum" is an awful name for anything, and the only thing that could possibly be worse would be "Ogg Vorbis" or "Ogg Theora", but fortunately (or horrifyingly), those names are already taken.

    I don't get how anyone can expect to be taken seriously when they're trying to promote "mainstream" software with these silly, bad sci-fi bad guy names. What next? Ooga-Booga-zilla? SlartiBartFoonix?

    Apparently, the only things that open source developers do worse than UI design is project naming. The UI problem is well known and widely complained about, but it seems like this naming thing is a more recent phenomenon. But it's already bad & getting worse -- a couple more high profile silly names like this and people will be laughing too hard at open source software projects to notice the interfaces to begin with...

  70. WINE Compatibility of Worms and Viruses by BigBlockMopar · · Score: 4, Funny

    Does it have unrivalled compatability with all the worms and trojans too? :)

    So, there I was, running Red Hat 7.3 on my desktop (yeah, I know, but it was quick and easy to install). I had a friend over who had never seen Linux before.

    I opened KMail. "Oh, and the best part is, it's not running Windows, so you can't get any Windows e-mail viruses!" I boldly double-clicked on an attachment with a .scr extension.

    WINE started up.

    I had just infected my Linux workstation with a Windows e-mail virus.

    Damn thing, actually associating all DOS/Windows binaries with WINE. Kind of undoes at least half of the security benefits of running Linux in the first place. [grumble]

    --
    Fire and Meat. Yummy.
    1. Re:WINE Compatibility of Worms and Viruses by FireFury03 · · Score: 1

      Now that's funny. :)

      I have yet to find anything useful that WINE will run though...

    2. Re:WINE Compatibility of Worms and Viruses by BigBlockMopar · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I have yet to find anything useful that WINE will run though...

      Oh yeah, WINE is far from perfect, but it's still very useful. Unfortunately, not for running M$ Office and stuff, mostly for lugging around those proprietary applications you need to cart around sometimes.

      I had a good one. I used to manage a complete flight information system at Pearson International Airport. There were hundreds of little PCs which drove displays all over the place. And they were all running Windows 95 - the programmer hadn't had time to update the software so that it would run on NT/2K. (The data came in on serial ports - two wire, unidirectional data, very secure - but coded to talk directly to the hardware.)

      Of course, I didn't want to buy one Windows license let alone 200. To say nothing of having to run around and reboot Windows every so often. So I tried the software with WINE. And it worked!

      All future display units were deployed running in WINE. They only ever crashed when the CPU fans got choked with dust. Unlike the Windows (95) version, where we had a LAN available, I could also SSH into the machines and have complete command-line control including updating images and stuff remotely (by script). It was very nice.

      If you've ever been to Toronto and seen a FIDS display booting up Linux late at night, that would have been me remotely restarting that unit after an update.

      (The developer is working on porting his software to run on Linux natively; I sold him on the idea of escaping Windows.)

      --
      Fire and Meat. Yummy.
    3. Re:WINE Compatibility of Worms and Viruses by linuxelf · · Score: 1

      I run microsoft Office under Linux with Wine all the time. I use CrossOver Office to simplify the install, but CrossOver is just a modified version of Wine. Works great.

      --
      - "That's just the kind of fuzzy-headed liberal thinking that leads to being eaten."
    4. Re:WINE Compatibility of Worms and Viruses by Minna+Kirai · · Score: 1

      Damn thing, actually associating all DOS/Windows binaries with WINE.

      A proper Linux distribution will include separate executables called "wine" and "wine-safe", which runs programs in a sandbox with no ability to see your files. Any emailer wanting to associate .EXE files with a handler should only use wine-safe.

    5. Re:WINE Compatibility of Worms and Viruses by Noltar · · Score: 1

      Hrm... well, I Wine useful for running Photoshop 7, MSVC++ (don't ask :P), Tribes2, SimpleMU, and maybe a couple other things from time to time. Still working on getting Poser 4 fully functional.

  71. Funny... by nathan+s · · Score: 1

    ...that the missing letters are PE - isn't that the part of school geeks hate the most?

  72. Anagram by tfinniga · · Score: 1

    Hm.. ignalum is an anagram of Mauling. Coincidence?

    <br> ;)

    --
    Powered by Web3.5 RC 2
  73. Re: Yes, we still need more distros! by bearl · · Score: 1

    We still have a ways to go before we reach the ultimate goal...

    Number of linux distributions surpasses number of users.

    Mods, this is satire, btw.

  74. Unrivaled compatiblilty? No thanks. by Bilange · · Score: 1

    and offers unrivaled compatibility with Microsoft Windows' or so says their website.

    If their website (which is down at the moment) is as stable as their products, then it should be an accurate Windows clone, right?

    No thank you sir, one unstable OS is more than enough.

    --
    "...a generation of kids has grown up thinking Trance is the shittiest music since country and western." - Paul van Dyk
  75. windowz to linux conversion by prmths · · Score: 1

    I decided to give my dad my old linux laptop and have him use that as his main machine... All he ever does is email, word processing, web, spreadsheets, print prochures, scan, copy, .... simple office type stuff. Here's a list of his main bitches (as a windoze whore)...
    first major thing: Printer
    for some odd reason, a perfectly normal postscript xerox printer never wanted to print anything more than about 2MB. I could not find anyone with that same problem, though every machine I tried to print something big from under linux would choke. Eventually, in desperation, after installing EVERY printer filter and driver i could find, it magically started working.
    second thing: Scanner
    I installed sane, ran scanimage>blah.pnm and it worked great... but then i ran in xscanimage, and if i ever canceled the print, it just died. besides that, the scans came out kind of dark. It took me about 30 minutes messing with it to figure out it was the exposure time (contrast and brightness had absolutely no effect)
    third: thegimp, open office, kde apps, gnome apps
    they all use different dialogs (and terminology) for the same functions (or are missing expected ones)
    for example, the gimp doesnt have a print option at all (while an integral part of photoshop and every other image editor), while openoffice, kde apps, and gnome apps use all different print and settings dialog styles.
    I *REALLY* dont want to put him on windows... he's on the road a lot and gets on the internet using his sprint phone (not supported by windows at all because sprint doesnt want you to do that) I also dont want to have to worry about him getting spyware and viruses and all that crap.

    If linux will ever become a system to replace windows, forget about making linux like windows.... make the consumer-end of the driver installs work -- maybe have a checkbox on the driver installers (sane, cups, etc) to report back to the developers on how certain printers, scanners, whatever need to be set up and have those as defaults... list EVERY known printer with whatever default settings are needed.. even if two different models use the exact same settings and driver...
    also, the developers need to work on integrating interface styles... wouldnt this be easy enough with the powerful skinning and theming systems in all these window managers?? Why the frigg cant the qt people, gtk people, E people and so forth and so on get together and come up with a standard theming system? and have that theme to go as far as completely theming even how the guts of dialog boxes (printer options, etc) look?

  76. Kernel Version by big+daddy+kane · · Score: 1

    3)Kernel version?

    the kernel version, and other specs are listed on their website, right here. its version 2.4.20

  77. Does ninnle linux even exist? by walterbyrd · · Score: 1

    I couldn't get to ninnle's web-site. I couldn't find anything about ninnle on distrowatch.org, or osnews.com. Couldn't find it on ibiblio.org either.

  78. Spinning Wheels by xrayspx · · Score: 1

    So to do that a Linux distro needs to either be root all the time, or break away from the traditonal UNIX security model and offer something like Windows NT's Administrator accounts that, while not all powerful, are capable of doing just about anything. It seems that many Linux users don't understand the concept of "wheel" as it was in the past. That being a group conceived so that you can have powerful users without them logging in as root. They can add/remove software for example if you want, up/down network cards, etc.

  79. The reason it still won't take off by RobinH · · Score: 1

    Ok, if life was fair, Linux would have taken off on the desktop a long time ago. The reason would be money. If people could save hundreds of dollars by not buying Windows, and buying Linux instead, Windows would be dead.

    The thing is, most home users pay a negligible amount for their windows operating system because it comes bundled at an extremely low price on the computer they buy. If they want to upgrade, and don't want to pay for a licensed copy, they just "borrow" a copy from work, or a friend. Even MS products with supposed copy protection are pathetic, and there are enough cracks out there for anyone to get any MS software for free.

    I think that MS deliberately makes their software easy to obtain for free because otherwise, Linux would absolutely dominate the home market, and that would mean businesses could then switch to Linux and save money because everyone is already familiar with it.

    The only way for Linux to take off is to give Microsoft some foolproof copy protection scheme, and get them to use it. They'd be signing their own death certificate.

    --
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education." - Mark Twain
  80. Yeah, this is just like windows by MemeRot · · Score: 1

    From their site:

    How do I burn an iso image under Ignalum Linux?

    Run Konsole

    su (then enter the root password)

    Change the directory to the location of the iso file. For example, if the iso file is in /usr/local, then you would type: cd /usr/local

    cdrecord -v -eject dev=device_ID speed=speed_of_drive isoname.iso

    The parameters represent the following:
    -v = verbose
    -eject = eject CD after burn is complete
    dev=device_ID = your device ID, typically a number in the format X,X,X which
    you can find out by running cdrecord -scanbus
    speed=speed_of_drive = enter the write speed of your CD-RW drive (1, 2, 4, etc.)
    isoname.iso is actual name of the iso you want to burn

    exit, then exit to close Konsole

    I'm a windows guy myself so I don't know - is it normal to require the root password in order to burn a cd in linux?

    1. Re:Yeah, this is just like windows by sashang · · Score: 1

      I'm a windows guy myself so I don't know - is it normal to require the root password in order to burn a cd in linux?
      Been using Linux for 1.5 years and still haven't found out how to eject a cd without rooting. I haven't found out because I can't be bothered looking for the answer when I know the root password. In all honesty I cannot recommend linux as a desktop alternative until I know how to get around that. Windows is still easier.

    2. Re:Yeah, this is just like windows by cr0sh · · Score: 1
      Typically, yes - cdrecord and mkisofs (not needed for an already done iso - you have to build an iso before you burn it) are set for root privilege only (that is, execution privileges are for root only). You can change this (sometimes, sudo access is set up) - heck, you can make it wide open if you want to. Best way would be to set up a group for cdrw, set the group for rwx access to both for cdrw, then add the users that need access to that group (actually, add the group to the users login).

      I am not sure why these two commands are like this - I am sure there is a good reason though (can anyone enlighten us?)...

      --
      Reason is the Path to God - Anon
  81. Yes!! by rofthorax · · Score: 1

    By way of VNC that is..

    --
    Just say no to license servers!!
  82. Even Microsoft is moving away from always root by Sits · · Score: 1

    Read this article on the hoped move to Users with least priviledge in Windows Longhorn - it's just too risky to leave people running with maximum power all the time.