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Solaris 10 to be Open Source
An anonymous reader writes "It looks as though Sun is going to open source their new Solaris 10 operating system. It seems to include eveything except some device drivers. They plan to model the Darwin and Fedora projects. Sounds very interesting."
Can anyone explain why someone might choose to use Solaris over Linux other than for legacy reasons?
Because some portions of Solaris 10, such as device drivers, are the property of other companies, Sun will release source code as well as binaries, in which proprietary code is not accessible
When you make your source open then I'll be interested but until that, this is just a bone for the community to do work for Sun and not actually get a full fledge open source solution. If the market pushes Sun down another $1 (25%) I imagine that Sun will have to figure out how to get that proprietary crap out of the code huh?
How many had seen this coming for a while?
No sig for the moment.
Looks like some more bigs guns are finally catching the drift, seems like it nothing but great news to me.
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun the frumious Bandersnatch.
Is this a desparate move of a company trying to regain relevance or a brilliant shrewd move?
Agile Artisans
If it's truly an open source license, this is only good news--Linux and/or the BSDs will be able to use the best bits. If it's just a "shared source" head-fake like Microsoft has tried to pull with some of their stuff, well, then Sun will solidify their position as Grand Moff Tarkin to Microsoft's Vader.
What does SUN do anymore? If they're open sourcing Solaris, obviously they're looking to get the community involved in developing it. They're also starting to ship some x86 servers (Opteron and Xeon), so are we eventually going to lose the Sparc processors as well? What does that leave Sun with? Java?
"It seems to include eveything except some device drivers."
So like linux it will work great if you could only find the drivers for your printer.
What is better is how can you Model Darwin and Fedora????
Darwin is the just the Basic OS, you can't run any OS X apps on it without Apple's software.
Fedora is pure Open Source, it just changes regularly, and has trademark restrictions on Red hat's images and such.
How are these the same??
i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
Unlike Linux, Solaris is a derivative of UNIX. I am sure SCO will be keenly looking forward to the day when Solaris is open source. ;-)
I should have some patches ready soon after I see the source...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Remember, if you hack on Linux (or plan to), you best not review the code.
You are being MICROattacked, from various angles, in a SOFT manner.
I wonder how they'll handle the Unix(TM) code in there and all the various other contributed stuff from Samsung etc.
I guess it's easier if they forget about CDE/X11 etc but it will be interesting to see what open source licence they use and how they handle 'other peoples' code in SOlaris 10.
Of course they could have removed all the Sys V R5.4 code, but without doing this unsing clean room conditions SCO could have a wondrful time in court.
Just wondering??????
If this is indeed true, I don't see any real need for linux anymore. If solaris is going to run all linux apps and it is going to have features like dtrace and a 128-bit file system and it runs on x86 AND it's free, I'm moving.
Open source is one thing, but I'm wondering how useful to us Sun's move really is if the code will not be put out under a GPL-like or BSD-like license
... lately I sense that "open-sourcing" is more an attempt of big companies to get some work done for free and get some PR at the same time, BUT with little real use to the community as GPL'ing the code would provide. Am I right?
Does someone know under what kind of license Solaris will be opensourced?
And great news by the way, I'm really looking forward to what might come of off this step.
"We lost sight of being an innovative leader who
is active in the developer community," McClain said. Yes, Sun did. Open source is a step forward--
now how does Sun plan to lead its newfound
open source developer community? - Cheers, Joel
What license will Solaris be OSed with? Sun's view of "open source" is sometimes rather peculiar.
Not that I really care about Solaris though.
will they sue them too?
/ss
Great, now release Java. Seriously, they're killing it.
I predict that the main thing of interest in Solaris to most people is the thread model. The main thing about Irix, IIRC, was the graphics capabilities and XFS, and SGI's opened XFS up and it's now ported over.
On the other hand, isn't that part of why they call it Slowlaris?
Does this mean DTrace will also be open-source? I wonder what license Sun will use.
The roots of education are bitter, but the fruit is sweet.
--Aristotle
A huge amount of work was done on Solaris to make it run efficiently on multi-processor systems.
Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
I'm waiting to see the license terms before I celebrate.
"I object to doing things that computers can do." -- Olin Shivers, lispers.org
Just because it's "open source" (as opposed to "Open Source") as in "you can read the source" doesn't mean it's Free. And that may be all they do: let you read the source. If they don't use the GPL or BSD or some other well known FOSS license I doubt this will really help them all that much. If they come up with their own license (which a company as big as Sun is wont to do) it will probably be quite complicated and your average hacker won't understand it.
That's why. I don't know what this all means, but it's all good and no bad.
Research shows that 67% of those who use the term "research shows", are just making shit up.
It seems to me that this is a good move, and will benefit the OSS community a great deal. After all, if SUN goes open source, then the PHB's of the world will finally recognize the cost savings, efficiency, and general intelligence of using OSS.
"Teleporting Rodents with D-Cell Battery Displacement" theory -- IgnoramusMaximus (692000)
I belive they mean they are going to model it in the sense that both Darwin and Fedora are the scaled down, community driven OS that is the base for a commercial one.
Darwin -> OS X
Fedora -> RHES
I know, I know it is a long shot to group these two together. But I think that is what is meant.
Makes sense though. Most of Solaris couldn't be open source, due to UNIX/SCO, Motif, and CDE licencing problems. So if they have a base to build it off of then reintroduce these back into Solaris Enterprise Edition or something.
I wonder if Sun (who helped fund SCO's attack on Linux) has worked this out with SCO in some way that we'll only understand when the license comes out.
Otherwise, this is in violent conflict with the bizarre SCO derivative theory.
Last announcement about this was proven false by Sun's own CEO statments..
This will be the saem way with this announcement..
Don't Tread on OpenSource
Err, Sun has been planning this for ages. There were rumblings about this a long time ago.
It isn't surprising since Sun has donated more lines of code to the open source community than any other commercial company.
It'll be interesting to see how this affects their bottom line. Although, most of their revenue probably comes from the ginormous walk-in-freezer-sized systems they sell rather then the OS, but still.
<tongue location="cheek">
Also, I wonder how long it'll take for SCO to find some of their beloved IP in the code...
</tongue>
1) Open Source 2) ???? 3) Profit! First Microsoft, now Sun. I never thought I'd see the day I had to compare Sun to Microsoft, in terms of gimmick...but it seems that I was wrong. I sincerely hope I'm wrong, incidentally. Unfortunately, most companies are too pigheaded to realize that, while open sourcing a project costs little and can reap great benefits, there's a difference between, let's say, a proprietary crap license that doesn't allow integration with other OSS, and a BSD or GPL variant. Microsoft's stance on the GPL, for any who were unaware: "The GPL's viral nature poses a threat to the intellectual property of any organization that derives its products from GPL source..." - Craig Mundie, "senior vice president of advanced strategies at Microsoft" Source
It's only an insult if it's not true.
WTF is this Linux fanboy crap comming from?
THIS IS ANOTHER OPEN SOURCE OPERATING SYSTEM.
Solaris is SOME MAJOR INCREADABLE realy realy realy cool stuff. It can do things now with SMP support and high-end servers that Linux can't come close to touching (yet).
Geez.
More choice > just linux.
We need FLEXIBILITY, not fanboy-ism. As nice as Linux is, it's not god's gift to computing.
Just like Darwin, Sun will only open the parts that will ultimately benefit Sun. Just like Fedora, they hope to get a boost from loyal Solaris (RedHat desktop) users that have been using the "Solaris Free Binary License" (yes, I qualify here on both counts).
I hope this helps.
Kinetic stupidity has a new brand leader: Allen Zadr.
Uh, NOT Linux on SPARC hardware.
Kinetic stupidity has a new brand leader: Allen Zadr.
The Non-disclosure terms for any protocols that can interoperate with Microsoft's Client or Server software would seem to restrict a lot of functionality from being released under an open source license by Sun..
You should definitaly see a doctor!
they will probably opensource SunOS 5.10 and pull a
SunOS -> Solaris
with all their proprietary cool things in Solaris
Exercise caution when modding this message up: the author acts like a jerk when his karma is excellent.
Well, isn't the whole point of open source software freedom of speach and ideas.
If both projects are truly open source, both project will be able to learn from each other, benefiting the open source community as a whole.
With your "don't look at the code" idea, you might as well be suggesting that Linux be made a closed source OS.
Certainly not.
Stick Men
Okay, maybe I'm biased (I've used a NeXT Cube as my main system for over a decade now), but we finally got back a Sparcstation 5 here at work, and I've just finished installing OPENSTEP 4.2 on it.
I'm looking forward to running
- tetex (not sure which version, trying to find a version w/ otp2ocp which doesn't crash)
- Dmitri Linde's InstantTeX and TeXView Hyper w/ hyperlink support
- Cenon (a NeXT-era CAD/CAM program making the jump to DTP illustration on Mac OS X, OPENSTEP 4.2 and Linux running GNUstep, see http://www.cenon.info )
and a couple of other nifty quad-architecture things, (the Lighthouse office suite) or stuff I can manage to get compiled.
Under Solaris we used this box to run Miles 33 (a proprietary typesetting system), which I couldn't even tell was taking advantage of Display PostScript --- is there something nifty I could do with this under Solaris that I'm not seeing?
How 'bout Linux?
William
Sphinx of black quartz, judge my vow.
Sun intends to include a software addition called Janus with Solaris 10, which will enable Linux applications to run on Solaris unchanged. If Janus isn't ready for the Solaris 10 deadline, Sun will release the addition shortly after, Weinberg said.
Isn't Janus the name of the Microsoft DRM scheme?
because we got Tux!!!
They still do SPARC, they still do Solaris, they still do services, they still do Java. Now they also use Opterons and Xeons where it suits their clients better.
I'd say they're more competitive now.
Solaris for X86 pricing works like this: on a uniprocessor machine, it is priced $99; on a two-way machine it is $250; and on a four-way or larger machine it is priced $1,500
Solaris comes bundled for free on any of Sun's Sparc-based servers. (Sun may peel the money out of each workstation and server sale and give its Sun Software unit credit for a piece of the sale, of course.) If you buy a Sparc server, it includes an unlimited user license to the software for all of the processors that are possible to plug into the machine.
BTW 8-CPU is not a monster, it is a midrange server. In Sun land anyway.
And I forgot to mention DTrace in Solaris 10 offers tuning visibility that no other operating system can even dream about.
Hrm, well, I'm not particularly skilled in administrating either of them, but I've worked in lots of places with lots of Solaris and if that's 'stable like a plate' then I dread to think what instability must be like. They fill up their disk with logs, and they crash. They run out of swap space, and they crash. They run out of colors (!!!!) and they do something which amounts to crashing in that nobody can use them till they're rebooted. It's freakin' endless.
I'm sure there is some sense in which they are more stable than Linux and XP but in my subjective experience, there are a lot of people who would consider 'stability' an odd reason to keep paying the Sun tax.
The most stable device I can think of is my DSL modem/firewall at home. If they made a version that also acted as a Tibco/MQ router they'd clean up.
Whence? Hence. Whither? Thither.
Sun License Info
To put Solaris on a piece of hardware with more than two (2) CPUs - you can't use the "Free Binary License" - thus you have to hope you can get the Solaris license along with that used Sun hardware you got off Ebay.
This is what has stopped me from fully populating the 8 CPU max on my SparcSERVER 1000 (7 years old, but still going strong). Hopefully with the OSS version of Solaris, I'll be able to hit Ebay up for some SPARC hardware upgrades.
Kinetic stupidity has a new brand leader: Allen Zadr.
but will it be free (as in freedom, not beer, lovely lovely beer).
So does this mean that Sun is going to give up trying to squeeze $20,000 from me just for upgrading my 10-proc Ultra Enterprise from Solaris 7 to Solaris 10?
Reality Check available here. Heh!
Life is pain. Anyone who says otherwise is selling something.
If we're going to get pedantic, then it should be "GNU/SunOS," not "Solaris." To put it into Linux terms, Solaris is the distribution that's built on the SunOS kernel, just as Mandrake (for instance) is a distro that's built on the Linux kernel.
Accountability on the heads of the powerful.
Power in the hands of the accountable.
A new posibility, :-) If the Solaris kernel is better than Linux why not to have all the other GNU tools.
*Whew*.. I'm glad you cleared that up. Because, for the life of me, I couldn't find any adequate metric that defines security using an agreed, quantitative metric within the Information Security industry.
Oh wait, that's right, there is none.
Shoo! Go back to marketing.
Guess what stood before that, as it was modded up as insightful.
a) Linux is more secure than Windows
b) Solaris is more secure than Linux
If it had been a), this would be at -1,troll or -1, flamebait. But I guess it got +2, Irrational pro-Linux argument to flip it to positive.
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
Sun has an excellent single place to search for all service calls on their equipment and OS, along with resolution information. So, it's a lot of information, yet more importantly, it's a single place for all of that information.
Personally, I have both Solaris AND Linux on my resume - and have to go with Solaris as the more impressive during interviews (less market share - more "serious").
I had a Solaris machine that ate itself running Solaris and Oracle. It turned out that one of the CPUs (StarFire E10000) was not torqued down properly. You should really have Sun take a look at your 450 - full tear down and rebuild if necessary. Otherwise, in my experience, Linux is slightly less stable, but I've been migrating to Linux because it's cheaper to run two Intel/Linux boxes (hot spare) than a single Solaris box with the same load capacity as one of the I/Linux boxes.
That's to say - you've both got valid points.
Kinetic stupidity has a new brand leader: Allen Zadr.
After D. Robbins left Gentoo he has spent much of his time consulting with Sun. It appears one of his key strategic recommendations was to open source the OS and then infuse Sun's installation/package management system w/ portage. We all know portage is based off of BSD ports (at least in concept). So clearly, Sun is hoping to send Solaris down the path that Gentoo and BSD have already been down. The path to oblivion. By devaluing their intellectual property they can write it off and use that as means to boost their profitability (like they did w/ the Microsoft settlement).
Slashdot... news reporting and commentary on par w/ CBS.
I would love to be able to practice more admin stuff on Solaris. With the exception of production servers -- which are not ideal "hey, i wonder what this does" testing conditions -- I don't have access to any Solaris boxes; I'd like to run it on a laptop but drivers are a fucking nightmare (yes, i know there are solaris sparc laptops like SPARCle but I don't have that kind of money to just toss around.)
My job at a university entails working with Solaris and migrating everything that's ON solaris OFF it, over to linux or BSD or windows or "anything but solaris". Management has lost faith in SUN in general and solaris specifically, and they want it gone gone gone. This is good for me, because I get to practice doing Cool Shit with linux and FreeBSD (FreeBSD being the only distro I've tried that doesn't require setting up stupid sunlabel partitions and lots of tweaking to get right: slap the CD in, install it, tweak it a bit and then forget about it. Even my beloved Debian wasn't that easy on a sparc arch machine.) At the same time, I'd still like to get more familiar with the Solaris way of doing things, for sundry reasons (more impressive skillset, more theory and better understanding of the internal workings of the OS, etc.)
I slapped the Sol10 beta on a single-proc netra that we found lying in a gutter begging for change, and it wasn't too bad. Of course, I haven't used it for more than 10 minutes, but that's the price you pay for having fun at work, I guess.
FreeBSD for the impatient.
From what little I've seen of Solaris, it seems that it's basically a Unix-like OS based around a monolithic kernel and conforming more to the System V way than the BSD way; but up to now it has been closed source.
..... it's surely a matter of tick-tocks before someone has a workable decompiler together. OK, so you might not get back your variable and function names, unless the compiler left them kicking around some spare blocks at the end of the binary; but these are things we can put up with.
The operating system on every PC I own is also a Unix-like OS based around a monolithic kernel and conforming more to the System V way than the BSD way. And it always has been, and always will be, Open Source.
AFAICT the main difference is that Solaris has earned itself the reputation for slowness by insisting to write everything to disk before saying ready, whilst Linux never writes anything to disk until one of the following happens: (a) a process asks for more memory and RAM is full of cached disk data. (b) shutdown. But default caching policy -- which almost certainly can be changed -- is no more an adequate criterion for judging an operating system than shoes are for judging a sexual partner.
I, for one, like to think I have some principles. I prefer manual methods over closed-source software. As it happens, I have reached a position where I can exert some influence: I instituted an almost total GNU/Linux migration in the company where I work There is only one department which is still using Windows, and that's accounts -- for reasons beyond my control, namely to be compatible with Group Head Office's legacy systems. I can't be the only idealistic young IT manager in the world. As awareness of Open Source -- and its benefits -- grows, closedness of source is becoming a criterion for rejecting a software product.
But the real point runs much, much deeper. Sun aren't stupid.
Closed source, however much its proponents bluster, is going to become a thing of the past soon anyway. Remember it was James Watt who put one of the nails in the coffin of Slavery. Sometimes, a technology comes along that enables, or even forces, great political change. Decompilers are going to kick off big-style any time soon, and will do for closed source what steam engines and electric motors . The problems of decompilation are, mathematically, very similar to those of shape recognition (and the US authorities are spunking their pants over systems claimed to be able to recognise a face in a crowd from a photograph taken from a different angle; it's Not Quite There Yet though). Now, I can buy something barely half the size of a DVD box that can decipher my handwriting -- and it does so using just a piddly little low-power RISC processor. Scale up the power a lot, and re-render the image
Like it or not, in a few years' time, all software, to all intents and purposes, will be open source. And Sun know they're better off inside the tent pissing out, than outside the tent getting pissed on.
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
I know first hand. Try testing any app that depends on threading and you will see a huge improvement using Solaris. Its actually able to thread and not spawn some sloppy hack process. I was able to get a 550% performance increase using Solaris. Plus Sparc hardware is the best. Unless you have used it keep your mouth shut! Most linux users have only used intel. MGHZ does not mean a thing people!
The new systems by IBM run Linux atop a Power5. Proprietary Solaris 10 atop a Niagara simply cannot compete because Linux is debugged by a small army of developers and made rock solid by IBM's 6 sigma commitment to reliability. So, in a desparate move, SUNW has decided to put Solaris 10 into open-mode in order to bring the SUNW Niagara-based servers closer to parity with the Power5.
The bell tolls for SUNW.
I'm posting this from a dual Athlon running Gentoo.
Shush now, the adults are talking about real operating systems.
Maybe now someone will finally fix the dumb solaris stuff like the filesize limitation of tar...
Let me see here...
Sun provide OpenOffice and Netbeans as open source, and have a proven track record of investing money it it.
IIRC Sun have more people working on OS software than any other company in the world.
... I have my hands on the install media, while reading the license it comes with. Sun says _many_ things. They rarely follow through, and when they do, it always falls short.
" Won't many of the features that make Solaris great be ported to Linux before you can say "Holy GPL, Batman!""
;).
It works the other way too, now that Solaris is going open source, and if its GPL say, then Solaris can port things from Linux and the rest. I suspect Sun thinks it will get a lot of developers to this for free for them
The problem is that Sun is late to the party, yet again, and is playing catch up. I think they waited too long but what choice do they have...
If you're a business, then this is my advice to you:
16 CPU license: $20000
8 CPU license: $6000
4 CPU license: $999
2 CPU license: $249
1 CPU license: $99
Keep all 10 CPUs, or take out 2, 6, 8, or 9 of them and pay up. Don't whine: Data processing is not for free, and even if some of the software you use is open source, no matter whether it is GPL or BSD, consulting and training is not free either.
If you're a Solaris 'enthusiast' or a consultant who keeps a machine like that around to experiment on:
Hide the machine in your home and never mind the license. Tell you what, somebody I know, knows someone whose best friend is the boyfriend of a girl whose younger brother has heard of some people that listened to a conversation at a bus stop in Alaska that some people in Buenos Aires use a couple of Sun machines in their basement to play around with Veritas Cluster & Volume Manager in a non-production environment in their spare time using product keys copied from their client's machines.
The original SunOS was a BSD derivative. When Sun created Solaris, they combinded SysV with the BSD-based SunOS to get their finished product. Since then, Sun engineers have heavily modified Solaris to the point that it may contain little or no actual AT&T SysV code. What SysV remains could probably be fairly easily replaced with modern code from one of the BSD projects.
Or rather undead. The good thing is the Sun realises about it. Opening closed source is a positive way to afterlife for software.
There you are, staring at me again.
Now how on earth can they do that SCO owns Solaris, Darl is not going to be happy.
Got Code?
It seemed more complex for it's own good when we covered it in OpSys all those years ago. I suppose that means the only thing to integrate is the multiproc SMP, except it seems absurd to use the same OS code to run handhelds and big iron. I'm an app programmer who has never written C except for a grade, so I could easily be wrong on that part.
A wine glass has three distinguishable stable states (upright, upside down and on its side), and a plate only has two (upright and upside down).
It takes a lot more effort to get an upside down plate the right way up, than it does to get a wine glass on its side the right way up.
Does this mean it's much easier to get a titsup linux box up and working again than a titsup Solaris box?
Good to know they're friends with Microsoft too! AND, I think they're great friends with Darl!
It's indeed a grand new day... time to celebrate! Thank you Sun for doing this for our own benefit!
...that they'll GPL their source, or use a license anywhere close to the GPL. From the article is sounds like they're going to 'share-source' their stuff in the Microsoft fashion, then use doublespeak to call it 'open source'.
I doubt anything they call 'open source' will legally be able to be used in Linux.
Max
My god carries a hammer. Your god died nailed to a tree. Any questions?
SunOS is Solaris. Just a different marketing name.
More than IBM?
Just curious.
Please mod this post only if you think others should/n't read this. I have enough ego^H^H^Hkarma. Thanks!
Linux needs a good directory services and admin tools, not solaris. I everyone could run Sun's, that would be great.
...Open Source Java? Another Open Source operating system just isn't that newsworthy. Open Source Java could TAKE OVER THE WORLD!
What's wrong with these people?
I'm sorry. Of course I meant to write: "We welcome our new Solaris overlords."
Open sourcing Solaris could improve it in general (and at a lower cost to Sun!). And making (hardware + software solution) more attractive to customers, could drive up sale volumes. So my guess is that this is just Sun's attempt to move closer to that optimal price/volume point.
my plates are in a rack. on their edge. most people load their dishwasher that way too.
Debian GNU/Solaris, anyone? I'll be interested when I see this running a typical "GNU/Linuxy" userland. It'd be interesting to switch b/w kernels interchangeably...
Save your wrists today - switch to Dvorak
Sun will solidify their position as Grand Moff Tarkin to Microsoft's Vader
Offtopic and pedantic here, yeah - I know, but Tarkin was in charge of the Death Star, Vader happened to be a highly esteemed guest:
From IMDB:
Princess Leia : Governor Tarkin, I should have expected to find you holding Vader's leash. I recognized your foul stench when I was brought on board.
Governor Tarkin : And you're sure the homing beacon is secure onboard their ship? I'm taking an awful risk, Vader. This had better work.
- passion
You might want to careful about sunw's open source anything. For example, sunw has just giving msft the greenlight to sue users of OpenOpen, including versions sun's own version of openoffice, that sunw packaged with Linux. At least that's how I understand it.
0 01 19312504155723/dex10109.htm
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/709519/0
I'm not sure which way the tits point on a wine glass.
Or a plate, for that matter.
-- It only takes 20 minutes for a liberal to become a conservative thanks to our new outpatient surgical procedure!
Not just that they have 8+ years of dealing with 64bit processors. Still uncommon in the linux world while we stand around waiting for AMD & INTEL to finish milking the suits with their latest increase in X86 single processor units.
Sorry about the writing. Robot fingers, you know? Cliff Steele in DOOM PATROL #23
A Solaris install on the Internet on its own would probably get rooted before the hour ran out. At least it would if you were to choose a full install.
Same for Linux. I recall a honeypot article where the record for a Linux root was about 15 minutes.
i want the LIGHTHOUSE DESIGN office applications,
not that cheap crap of openoffice/staroffice
... but I'm wondering how useful to us Sun's move really is if the code will not be put out under a GPL-like or BSD-like license ...
It will be useful to all those that matter, the Solaris 10 users. Whether or not it benefits Linux fans is irrelevant. Even with the GPL, an author only has a responsibility to his/her users, not any community at large. I.e. I only have to give the source to people I give the binaries too, not anyone who merely asks. A technicality but it illustrates my point.
The GPL license is so restrictive to what you can and cannot do as opposed to the BSD license that says here do what you will.
Though, I imagine it will be some NEW sun open source license that makes it so you can contribute all you want but you cannot take anything from it.
Nick Powers
Encryption: I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend your right to encrypt it...
This is like Niagra but more geared towards floating-point workloads (e.g. science).
Sun will then be able to offer three different kinds of binary compatable SPARC processors: Olympic (from Fujitsu), Niagra for small web-type servers, and ROCK. No other company can claim this.
In the mean time, there's Opteron and UltraSPARC IV.
Stick Men
When I read the article, I didn't see anything about what license they were planning to use.
Sun being Sun, I have no great faith that their idea of an Open Source (well, open source, the article didn't capitalize it) license matches mine.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
THe point is a company like SCO can sue and in court say "Did you or did you now view the actual Unix source code? Yes or no".
If you work on a unix clone, lawyers from Sun or SCO could use this to claim copyright infringment.
Unlike music or books, the deffinition of IP voilations with code are subjective and a clueless non techie judge makes the descicion in such a case.
http://saveie6.com/
Batman!"
(The SHOCKING story of Batman's TRUE LINEAGE... will NOT be seen toNIGHT... (a play on Cartman/"Trent and Thomas" "Not Without My Anus: based on a True Story"...)) (Or, substitute AMUS...heheh)
Yesss, Hropbin. If I can only take out myyy sooper... BAT.. GPL... defribulator, I can cut us free! (And, I can see BATGurl, tonight...)
Holy Hoppin'g Jehoosuphur, Batman! Hurry!
Just... one... second...
(Imagine that if Jack Lord got the Kirk part, and if somehow Shatner got the Batman part...)
seys divad
david syes
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
Ok, will be open source, but will be Free Software?
Does this mean Sun will also open source their C compiler and libs, if they are needed to build Solaris?
The question is: will it be free or is it only "open".
I wouldn't use either one of them. I'll stick with my Windows 2003 box.
no,
SunOS is the OS in it bare form.
Solaris is the name of the suite of apps surrounding this OS
Exercise caution when modding this message up: the author acts like a jerk when his karma is excellent.
A lot of flaming going on here, linux vs solaris.
There is no use, nobody wins here. Besides it all depens. Take myself for example, i stumbled into the unix world through linux, like so many other youngster these days do. so linux is your first love, it will probably be your last. if on the other hand, you are an old-timer and got into unix through a 'real' unix you will probably dig solaris till the day you die.
for me, i think solaris is a great os, but i still like linux more. i figure this will only increase as more and more people get to know linux first _and_ know it better.
On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.
All of this talk of how much better SunOS is over Linux remember this. They are both kernel written by humans. Linux has alot more people power behind it and not to mention corporate interest. Now SunOS is open source (does this mean free as well from sun) just as Linux is. SunOS primarily has run on sparc hardware from Sun, Linux runs on 19 different archs. SunOS has the marketing apperance of an old aging OS while Linux is the new "hip" OS on the block. Neither OS is more secure an any scence since they inherite the roughly the same standards. Lastly you can analyze Linux until the cows come home but until we all get to actually look at the SunOS code base any conculsions are just opinions.
IBM is a devil too.
The userland tools are hopelessly archaic / outdated, so I hope, nobody bothers to read that code (can you say cp x/ /tmp -r -> parse error?).
The only interesting thing may be the kernel stuff and how certain O(1)algorithms work.
Just imagine if Sun had done this in 1990 instead of 2004.
So now Sun is releasing a great OS when:
Cue suggestion for a GPL'd Java to come out now rather than in 2009 after .NET and the CLR have made so many inroads to make the action moot.
"Provided by the management for your protection."
But in neither case does the plate roll off of the counter.
Well, a wine glass has two distinguishable stable states (upright and upside down) and a labile state (on its side) - it can stay stable on its side, but even a small amount of force will make it roll.
Pretty much like the plates, though it's trye that the plates are often pretty damn tricky to make to stand on their edges, much more so than wine glasses...
All of the GNU tools in *BSD are kept in the codebase of the BSD in question. They're customized versions of the official GNU tools (even gcc). On top of that, not all of the tools that exist in GNU/Linux exist in BSD as the GPL'ed version. Awk in FreeBSD 5.x is the One True Awk, nearly all the GNU tools in OpenBSD have been replaced with BSD licensed tools. In FreeBSD ls, vi, cat, grep, more, less, etc are mostly BSD equivalents of the GNU equivalents of the original UNIX toolset. In some cases, they ARE the original UNIX toolset, where the tools have been open sourced. This is the case of Awk in FreeBSD 5.x - it is awk written by Aho, Weinberger, and Kernighan, available here.
That said, there are people over at debian who have slapped the GNU tool set on both NetBSD and FreeBSD kernels, and called it GNU/FreeBSD and GNU/NetBSD. This precedence seems to push myself towards the conclusion that changing the toolset does, indeed, warrant a name change. For the most part, GNU/FreeBSD and FreeBSD will behave the same, until you type ps -aux on GNU/FreeBSD and get a warning about "bad ps syntax", or fire top and notice slight differences in how it behaves vesus top in FreeBSD.
Personally, If the GNU toolset was thrown on a SunOS kernel, I wouldn't get my panties in a bunch over people calling that system GNU/SunOS. But, perhaps my priorities differ from yours.
This is the next person or group that SCO is going to sue in 2004.
His Answer: What is FreeBSD?
Correct Answer: Who is Sun Microsystems?
Good Try Ken, Hate to see ya go...
Shadus
Ok, that's Apple and Sun taken care of. Novell and IBM are on our side (for now) and SCO will annihilate itself in court. That just leaves Microsoft.
We're looking good people!
I used Solaris threads via C for years before Java was widely used and found that Solaris' threads/mutexes/condition-variables/etc was not really stable - random weirdness and crashes happened from time to time. Enter Java and a million Java programmers writing every possible crazy threaded program you can think of... great - an army of bug finders free of charge for Sun. (Can you say Thread.stop()?) Five years and ten major thread library patches and a thread library rewrite later - Solaris threads became pretty darn reliable. It's probably now as good as Dave Butenof's (spelling?) implementation for Tru64 UNIX. As a side note - I'm glad Sun ditched the M to N model for thread to lightweight process mapping and adopted the more intuitive 1:1 model that almost every other modern OS uses.
Solaris as OSS is a comfy fall-back to fill-in any holes which SCO might tear out of Linux --
thus becoming an insurance policy for the survival of the biggest threat to MSFT.
- fully pre-emptible
- robust thread priority inversion
- fine-grained locking in memory subsys and vfs
These are all things that make the SunOS kernel scalable. That being said, Linux is pretty much there too. With the latest addition of task queueing, it's kernel is essentially fully pre-emptible as well (IF you're using an IO-APIC...) The new O(1) scheduler gets a grip on IO bound and CPU bound threads much better... but I think the VFS is still a bit of a bottleneck. IIRC the addition of RCU into certain critical places should improve that situation.
Linux was already on it's way there. A look at the SunOS threading code might serve to verify that kernel developers were headed down the right path, or expose a different way of doing the same thing, but I don't think it's going to shock or amaze anyone.
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
That works for getting images out of a computer, but how does a fellow get images into a computer? For instance, I once received a Microtek Scanmaker 4850 USB flatbed scanner as a gift, but sane-project.org lists the 4800 series as completely unsupported.
Especially in connection with music, please read this and this before dismissing parent as entirely sarcastic.
If you Open Source it, we will sue you (Ok, some small financial issues have to be resolved before another lawfirm will work but is, but he, we have challenges too!)
"Sphinx of black quartz, judge my vow?"
Good to see the old folks are still around.
Chris Neuss
But all of the rotated states on its side are identical, and so count as one distinguishable state.