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Codeweaver's Crossover 4.0 Adds iTunes Support
nbahi15 writes "Codeweavers has released v4 of its Wine implementation with the addition of support for iTunes. To quote their web site, 'iTunes works, and can do everything we thought was important; play music, access the store, and sync with an iPod. It can't burn CDs right now, and it has some fairly serious warts (sound is tricky, particularly with 2.6 kernels, and getting the iPod going is hard), but we think it's usable.' Finally I can use the single most important 'productivity' application on Linux."
We're shocked I say! Shocked! iShocked even!
I wonder if Apple knew that iTunes would become such a big hit when they released it.
~Ilyanep
To get message, take amount of carrier pigeons at each stage mod 2. Then decode binary.
...I really must say, Rhythmbox is junk. It does about a tenth of the things iTunes does. Besides, Linux users can now buy music. Awesome job, guys!
Take off every sig. For great justice.
"It can't burn CDs right now, and it has some fairly serious warts (sound is tricky, particularly with 2.6 kernels, and getting the iPod going is hard), but we think it's usable."
As a developer myself, I know very well that what I think is usable is not always end-user usable. As close as I get to a project, knowing the code inside and out, I tend to miss the big picture stuff. It may sound logical and intuitive in my mind, but it usually takes some testing from non-geeks before I let anyone - especially a client - start using it.
Does it run as poorly as it does on Windows? Also, are you required to install the nagware called Quick Time? If not then how about a Windows port of Wine so I can run iTunes without QT or the performance problems?
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
Will it run under cygwin? ;)
When things get complex, multiply by the complex conjugate.
get Syncpod (http://armin.emx.at/ipod/). Neat little perl script that syncs a directory of music and m3u playlists into the ipod. Works great for anyone who likes keeping music organized by directory and id3 tag and not by any particular program.
more and more reasons to move to Linux - lets hope they can fix the cd writing function
--
although I'm a little concerned with how difficult this will be to get working how I'd like it. I have a Windows partition strictly for iTunes and I'd like to dump it and move on with life.
Now if they just get Clippy support I'd be as happy as a pig in slop.
I say we just grow up, be adults and die.
"iTunes works, and can do everything we thought was important; play music, access the store, and sync with an iPod. It can't burn CDs right now, and it has some fairly serious warts (sound is tricky, particularly with 2.6 kernels, and getting the iPod going is hard), but we think it's usable."
So does it work or not? Here's my translation: "iTunes will now launch under WINE. Do not expect to listen to your music, burn CDs, sync with the iPod easily, or in short, do anything iTunes does."
Seriously though, I applaud their effort. It's just that saying iTunes works under WINE when it doesn't really work all that well is a bit of false advertising. If it gets more programmers on the bandwagon, good for them, but I'd hate to see people get turned off by (what sounds to be) a bad experience.
Per Square Mile, a blog about density
Why are you all so in love with a bloated proprietary app whose only real function is to copy plain old files to what should be a plain old portable drive, but is instead another proprietary chunk of hardware?
Where are all the hackers and geeks these days, anyways? I like using my own scripts to copy and file and sort all my data.
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
"iTunes works, and can do everything we thought was important; play music, access the store, and sync with an iPod."
"sound is tricky, particularly with 2.6 kernels, and getting the iPod going is hard"
So... Which one is it? How was this ready for release again?
but with their friendly upgrade policy i will be trying out 4.0 soon. they seem like a nice company. ahh, one day itunes will run flawlessly under linux, and that will be a GREAT day!
i saw the baby, and the baby looked at me
I'd be more interested in whether it can run HL2 or Counterstrike Source myself. Anybody hear if this works yet?
Has Comcast disconnected your Internet account? Same here. You can read about it at http://comcastissue.blogspot.com
Hmmm... It plays music, and syncs with the iPod, but sound is tricky, and getting the iPod working is hard...
Oh well, I guess you'd expect some problems with running an app designed for Mac on a Windows emulation layer on a Linux box -- come to think of it, it's amazing it works at all! Nice job guys.
perl -e 'foreach(values %SIG){$_="IGNORE";}while(){}'
dated Aug 2 here. Apparently the preview version has been available to CrossOver Office customers for a while.
An Indian-American Hindu committed to non-violent thought/speech/action alarmed by the global explosion of radical Islam
Why doesn't Apple support a Linux version of iTunes natively? I mean come on, 99+% of all open source Linux apps can run natively on OS X now, so where is the reciprocal good will towards the Linux community from Apple?
Let's all emulate windows software when we actually have feasible solutions for Linux! Wait...
It works with your ipod, it works with xmms, and it works in 2.4 and 2.6.
Gtkpodrythmbox + gtkpod + bittorrent = codeweavers wasting time on buggy crap.
...a scramjet was installed in a Freightliner. It fits, but it doesn't run well, yet.
It's not exactly news when a music player plays crappy sound in Linux. It's a neat ghetto-rig, but it's not news until it works well.
Frankenwine apps are never a good replacement for the Real Thing(TM). I played the WineX game for a while and it sucked. Apple needs to get off their collective arses and port iTunes to Linux.
Apple talks about a new way of sharing music, appealing to our sense of "karma" to encourage us not to steal. Yet they leave Linux desktop users in the cold. This seems somewhat disingenuous to me.
I would be excited about the iTunes music store launching in Canada (finally), if it wasn't for the fact that it won't work in my operating system of choice.
Do Linux users have any legal recourse in listening to digital music at the moment?
Well, this is nice. I personally use a Mac, so I don't have much invested in the whole "I wish I could run iTunes" thing, but it's still nice. I might end up getting some good utility out of it even, if the music sharing functionality is intact.
What I'm really jazzed about, though, is that serious effort is being expended in multimedia (oooh, dated buzzword! kill him!) application compatibility. These are the areas that not only wine is lacking in, but also linux in general. The fact is that sound is tricky...even on the OS level. Not a problem for geeks like us, but it is for the proverbial "my grandma." I'm psyched to see where else this code takes us and what other fun things will be runnable in the near future, now that the 800 lb. gorilla of tough integration is being tackled.
adam b.
Well there's linux, free, open etc...
and there's ITunes, closed, drm,
expensive ($1 for a track that has 1/10 the value of a cd track), and possibly illeagal.
How in xyz years time when the copyright on the DRM track I've perchased runs out can I put the work into the public domain?
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
Although it's great that iTunes is ported to Linux, I'd never call it a "reason to move". It's ridiculous to say "Use this OS, because now we've managed to get another program from another OS to sort of work". See, if Apple created iTunes for Linux - that might just be a reason to move. But I'd hardly call this a "reason". It's more a convenience for those already on the platform...there are far more friendly music players for Linux, and there are ways of syncing the iPod under Linux that don't involve iTunes. The only thing you gain is the access to the iTunes music store...
what like, making ITunes run on linux, ish, with a bit of a tweek here and there, if you don't want to burn cd's.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
I'm sick of seeing all the advertising complaints. And I've only been here for 4 frickin months!
/. post is gonna involve a commercial endeavor in some way.
Look, not only is the world run by money (yeah, there's OSS and all that, but it doesn't pay the bills (in most cases anyway)) but almost every
Sheesh, and I bet you thought that the previous story about the HL2 servers being overloaded was not only free advertising for Valve, because it gets the name out there, but it was also advertising for Bungie because they're product isn't marred by any such problems.
-- i am jack's amusing sig file
I have cxoffice 4 and you can listen to music, add stuff to the library (though it is mighty slow, took half an hour to add 4 gigs of mp3s), and you can go on the iTunes music store (Which works very well btw). I used the cxitunespreview which ran iTunes, and they have improved the performance greatly. You can actually listen to music through iTunes now, and performance is drastically improved over the cxitunespreview. Sure, it's not like running it in windows. But it's quite fast.
They're going to be releasing another version soon which should help the cpu usage go down for iTunes (currently some kind of garbage iTunes is spewing is causing cxoffice to use 100% cpu, they think it's some kind of timing hack used by apple... Hey, windows/x86 isn't apple's primary platform, so I wouldn't be surprised).
All in all a nice product. Also soon they will be adding firewire support to the cxipod (currently only usb is supported, and my 4G ipod doesn't like usb on linux). But then I use gtkpod and am perfectly happy with that (I can transfer all the mp4's I get off of iTunes).
I'm just not convinced that I need to buy digital music. I'll keep on buying cd's, ripping them and storing them on my media server.
I just don't see the advantage in downloading music.
When you download from any source, legit or not, you're not in control of how the file was extracted.
The bit rate may not be what you wanted, there is always the possibility of some digital artifacts during playback, and i'm just not comfortable with it.
Plus, I don't own an iPod. I don't think I want one. I'm quite happy with my CD based MP3 player which uses CDRW's.
I can put 10 hours worth of music on one disc and it works nicely.
Besides I like to be in control of my music and my gear and I don't like when I can't replace the battery like the way the iPod is setup.
Is it 5:30 yet?
Amen.
I just bought a G3 Mac that runs 10.3.5 surprisingly well.... for $150. After fighting with Linux for years at home, I finally decided my time was worth a hell of a lot more than the price of a Mac.
Now how come iTunes can install and run Codeweavers Crossover 4.0, yet won't install on Win98SE/ME?
of course Apple pays for these stories.
Someone's got their priorities seriously out of kilter here...
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
CrossOver Office Professional 4.0 - 2004/11/15
New application support:
Support for iTunes and iTMS. Limited iPod support; drivers for ripping
are not supported.
SyncPod + more burners than you can imagine + online music stores like besonic
Support for Adobe FrameMaker 7.1
Support for QuickTime 6.5.2
Reviewed plugin support: removed some, updated others
Mplayer,xine,plugger, kmplayer etc....
Application bug fixes:
Office:
Fixed a bug that was causing IE to crash when a 'favorite' was added
Fixed a bug that prevented Office 2000 and Project from being installed
together
Some bugfixes for Outlook 2000
Fixed a bug that prevented WMP from playing local media files
OpenOffice,KOffice at a push etc..
Quicken:
Cleaned up Quicken installation process
Fixed several Quicken bugs
Reviewed and improved Quicken 2004 support
kmymoney &co
Others:
Fixed Dreamweaver uninstallation
Fixed several DreamWeaver bugs
Fixed installation problems with Scientific Word
CrossOver changes and improvements:
Installation:
Fixed several CrossOver installation and uninstallation issues
Improved CrossOver upgrade support
Fixed a bug that caused the menu database to be erased when
additional office components (such as the Equation Editor)
were added
Improved menu support for (among others) Suse 9.2 and Fedora Core 3
knoppix, many a live cd or Fedora Core, Gentoo etc..
Officesetup:
Added the 'Control Panel' tab to OfficeSetup
Improved officesetup startup time
Several improvements to OfficeSetup user interface; fixed keyboard
navigation
Fixed uninstallation of unsupported software
Solved a bug that sometimes corrupted downloadable installers
emerge openoffice-bin
So it looks like you get dreamweaver and Framemaker support for your$, and if you don't need those, send you $ to one of the projects you do use and would like to see improved.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
let me say that Crossover lets me do the one thing I need to - run Microsoft crap. Outlook, Word, Excel, Visio, and Solomon (an accounting/timecard application).
:)
I'd use Evolution - but we're on Exchange 5.5 and I can't use the calendar (very important).
I do use OpenOffice also, but sometimes you actually do need the real deal, for crazy marked-up contracts with goofy checkboxes and whatnot. It's good to be able to open network diagrams in Visio. Also, I like to fill in my timecard so I get paid.
Obviously, the situation is not ideal, but it lets me run Linux at work, which is vastly helpful to actually doing my job. It's just that all the other junk associated with having a job - HR, Legal, etc kind of things - require me to have Microsoft products.
I saw initial iTunes support demonstrated several months ago at OSCON, too, but now it's in the released version.
timothy
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
Oh wait, it still doesn't run the apps that regular end-users want. Oh well.
As an aside, I was reading a very funny Usenet discussion I had in *1996* (!!), where someone was saying that Linux was almost ready for the desktop, and I said (paraphrase), "I'll meet you back here in 10 years and I predict that we'll have an interesting Linux product, but it will lag behind the commercial market in critical ways."
Only eight years later, but yup. An interesting product that still can't do what normal users want to do.
(I'd post the real discussion -- it's pretty funny -- but it was under my real name, heh). You could cut and paste the discussion today and no one would know it was from 1996. It's hysterical.
Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
Whole albums are cheaper than you can buy CD's for in stores or online (though not a huge amount cheaper in most cases).
The real winning scenario is when you want just a few songs from an album. Then are you willing to pay 3-4x as much for a slightly better quality copy of the song? My answer has turned out to be "no way" - I now buy even whole albums just for the convienience and slight price advantage, while knowing the artists get a measurable amount of money from it (like 10 cents a song).
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I have used the 'doze version of iTunes a few times, and I plan never to touch it again. On a 900mhz t-bird, with 512MB system memory, it was slow as could be.
Why would anyone want to use that horribly bloated piece of turd running in an "emulator?"
And the iPod...? No thanks. There's cheaper players that support more music formats, and don't use proprietary bullshit for transferring data.
Maybe I'm just not as easily wowed as some, but I still don't understand why, with all Apple products, people act as if it gives them orgas... OOOH SHINY!!
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
"I'm sick of seeing all the advertising complaints. And I've only been here for 4 frickin months!"
You're new here, aren't you?
Yeah, I was put 10.3.5 on a used 300mhz G3 Mac for my mother and I was worried it was going to be unusable.
I was shocked to see that for mail and websurfing it was not really noticably slower than my 2gig dual G5. Some things like sorting mail I could tell were slower, but just about everything else for casual desktop use was just fine.
All for about 300 bucks, not bad. Considering I would have probably had to pay more if I tried to do something stupid like set here up with Microsof spyware/virus box.
2. "no kernel support for XML" is complete gibberish.
3. "cut-n-paste" between apps works just fine these days.
Obviously there are reasons people don't get a Mac, cost often being #1.
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
Yeah dude! Just the other day I was trying to load this XML into the kernel and it just wouldn't take it!!!! WTF!!!
Im STILL waiting to see some sort of support for sonys horrible NETMD minidisc protocol under linux. I know there has been some open source developments but it is still impossible to transfer files to the device under linux. I know that minidisc is nothing compared to ipod in terms of popularity - but Im still sure there are a lot of linux geeks using this portable audio medium.
spend money here
Because you are a Mac user I know you take pride in not knowing shit, but your comment is an insult even to your kind.
I've upgraded to version 4, installed IE6 and I finally can access my bank's homepage. WOW!!!
One more reason to get off Windows.
Though, seems like the upgrade borked the fonts in MSWord. Ouch.
The fact that the Linux commumity is so bent on getting iTunes to run on Linux is a testament to how great of a program iTunes is.
... and maybe Windows later on if they feel like recoding it ;)
Linux users are usually a lot more critical of their software. While a lot of Linux doesn't have the polish or fit 'n' finish of some Windows software, the quality of the code is taken more seriously, as is the functionality of the software. It may not always LOOK pretty, but it is usually very powerful and well written.
There are a lot of programs that try to emulate iTunes, both on Linux and Windows (LTunes anybody?). But it seems that the Linux community would rather see iTunes itself running on Linux than a knock-off. I see this as a 'kudos' to Apple from the Linux community, for producing software so good that linux devs bust their balls to get it working.
I applaud the efforts of Codeweavers and hope that they are able to get full functionality very soon. While I would like to see Apple write a version of iTunes for Linux (in a way legitimizing the platform as a desktop alternative), this is certainly welcome and very impressive.
To everyone involved with this: Awesome job. Keep up the good work. Now if we could just get Apple and linux devs working together on more projects (khtml, for instance) perhaps we'll see a day where Apple software could be run on both Linux and Mac OS X
I still have yet to use iTunes, to be perfectly honest I would rather stream music in from the internet rather than sort through thousands of titles, and listen to what I think sounds cool. I would rather have a perfessional decide for me, because yes, I am lazy.
Wine's cool and all, but I'm surprised no one's working on a "Wine" for Mac OSX applications.
To me it would seem easier to port Mac software over to run on Linux thanks to OSX basically being Unix (yeah.. BSD, I know).
Anyone heard of such a project yet?
In Win4Lin, it's a surprise when applications don't run.
I think I'll go download iTunes for Windows something soon.
Anybody tried iTunes/Win on VMWare yet?
Tech Public Policy stuff
Wine, a ABI layer, and win4lin, a virtual machine, are 2 different animals..
Its hard to farily compare them so caviler like you just did.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Has there been an attempt to get Apple to create an offical Linux version of iTunes? Any response from them?
So, they can't write modular code either...jesus no wonder the hardware is locked down and the monitors boleted on with apples offering.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
"iTunes works... and can do everything we thought was important; play music... serious warts (sound is tricky...)"
Yes, the program runs wonderfully. Heck, it even plays music. Our next objective is to get the music to actually make what we audiophiles call "sound" when you "play" it. I mean, seriously... why would anyone want their music player to output actual sound?
What crackhead modded the above as flamebait?? That's a totally fair comment. Oh I forgot. Slashdot readers are all Linux Zealots.
xml parsing (especially SAX based) can be performed far more efficiently in the kernel, since you can do tricks with the tcp/ip mbufs before you do the copy into user-space. Basically, you don't copy nearly as much information into the user process address space. Since most people are using DOM based parsers, this efficiency is often overlooked. You see, you have to understand a little bit more than 'HTML' if you want to call yourself a guru!!! Large investment banks and stock exchanges make extensive use of this feature in Solaris to process FIX messages and it can have a major effect on throughput and latency.
OpenOffice 2 has better support for stuff like the text boxes and the wordart. Other than that I use oOO instead of Word/Excel.I use wine for Lotus Notes.
Mind you OpenOffice 2 is still beta - but I haven't had any corruption or major issues yet.
Crossover 3.1? Instead, they did a much larger upgrade with Framemaker, Quicktime, and some other improvements.
It just seems odd since this [codeweavers.com] was released only a few months ago, and iTunes is still far from flawless under Linux.
I have been using iTunes on Linux since the earliest betas. To be a little less cautious than Codeweavers it works well. It plays music, music shares work, iTMS works, iPod sync works. I would say that is is rock solid. What is annoying is the lack of CD support which is planned in an upcoming release. The only other hassle is they need to support the latest Windows Media Player so people that have WMA files can convert them to AAC or MP3.
Please note the quote in the article from Codeweaver's is part of their REAL DIRT policy. They are cautious in making claims about the software working perfectly on every system, in every circumstance.
Oh my god!! That's fucking worse than the goatse guy! AAHHHHHHHH!!! My EYES!!!!!!!!
but they're both iTunes clones if I understand right. Personally, what made juk so amazing for me was the ability to Sort, tag and move my collection all from one app. Dragging and dropping files to/from juk rocks. If iTunes under Linux can do that, I might be interested...
Also, and I know this is kinda silly, but I like using less than perfect software sometimes because it's fun to watch it improve from version to version.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
'the iTunes music store does. iTunes is just a music player.'
Except in this case (Crosover office) it isn't really a player/burner sice the functionality doesn't work.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
I'm listening to the free song of the week in Itunes, while compiling the newest xorg for my gentoo box. No audio skips, even during compiling. I'm running a testing version of CXO that came out a week before CXO 4. I have found that Itunes' audio works just fine with my 2.6.9 kernel. You still do need Quicktime installed to Itune. The insall of Quicktime isn't a total waste because it does work under CXO, the other day I viewed a trailer in Quicktime running inside of Itunes, in KDE, with CXO. The video played back just like in windows. It isn't perfect, but come on, its running on an OS it wasn't coded for.
This might help a little. I haven't tried it, so no promises.
fairly serious warts...sound is tricky....
... but we think it is usable...
I use iTunes for listening to music. Its all I use it for (syncing with my iPod is secondary - the end goal is still to listen to music). So if the sound is broken what is the point? I'm sure that technically it is a fine achievement but those statements say it all about the reasons widespread adoption of linux isn't taking place.
does it work with OurTunes?
iTunes works, and can do everything we thought was important; play music, access the store, and sync with an iPod. It can't burn CDs right now, and it has some fairly serious warts (sound is tricky, particularly with 2.6 kernels, and getting the iPod going is hard), but we think it's usable.
How can it play music if sound doesn't work? It sounds like (pun intentional) it works as well as Linux does out of the box (since sound in general is really problematic on Linux).
I might consider using it and Linux for multimedia applications when I can install them on a box and have them work properly from the get go. Until then, stfu about how great Linux is when it can't reliably handle basic functions like audio in a reliable manner.
In theory this would enable them to develop Windows apps such as iTunes within Xcode. They could test apps within their OSX environment using OSX native tools, and native speeds, then 'cut' Win32 apps using cross compilation!
They were rumoured to be developing a Win32 execution environment for Rhapsody ('Red box'?) but that was shelved. The FUD was that companies wouldn't migrate their apps to Cocoa/Carbon.
let the gread exodus from osx begin...
Get your torrents...
What is that? This is the first time in my life I see the words OS and shareware connected (and I am 52 years old).
Linux and BSD are not shareware, they are OPEN SOURCE. I have never heard of a shareware OS, I doubt there is one, but I may be wrong.
Shareware are those little 'try before you buy' programs; usually clueless mac lovers like to use them.
From my POV, I'm running Windows on my Linux box to give me an early start on running Linux full time, and I'm trying to reduce the number of Linux apps I run as time goes on, not increase them.
Hopefully, the Open Source Community or proprietary Linux vendors will assist me in doing so by providing the Linux apps I need.
Tech Public Policy stuff
Such chimera does not exist.
I have been using Linux in the desktop for 8 years, all the people I work with use it at home, many as their main desktop.
I know of many people that are not computer specialists that are happy with a Linux solution with minimal support (for hardware issues mainly).
The desktop is almost there, the naysayers will stop their nonsense very soon, as they did long time ago when it came as Linux as a business ready server platform.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
Hey, jackass, notice the quotes around "emulator" in my post? I know wine isn't really an emulator, dipshit.
(or you have no idea on how to optimize a tbird 900mhz box, via 4 in 1 drivers maybe?)
Again with the idiocy. No amount of tuning is going to make iTunes run nicely on a 900Mhz tbird. It may run ok, but I'll take nearly any other music player any day over iTunes on Windows. iTunes is nice on OS X, but the Windows port is garbage.
As for the iPod, the interface is highly overrated. It is slick and shiny, nothing more. It has the "wow" factor, but it is still form over function. And no matter how how many orgasams it gives you, it still uses annoying proprietary garbage to transfer data. I've used plenty of mp3 players that had more intuitive interfaces than the iPod, supported more formats, stored just as much data, and were cheaper.
And trust me if you had an ipod or a mac you would know better.
I never said anything about Macs. I work with Macs every day. There's nothing wrong with them, 'cept being a little out of the price range of less well off folk. So why do you mention Macs?
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
The latest iPods (mini, click-wheel, limited edition and photo) have problems getting mounted on Linux. The issue is discussed here. The fix, is to disable EFI partition support in the kernel and recompiling it.
This is my sig. There are thousands more, but this one is mine.
Insert Apple Zealot(tm) post about how Apple uses Open Source stuff and how the kernel is open. Umm, but don't mention how all the important stuff that makes a Mac a Mac is closed and locked away by Apple, because that would ruin the Mac Zealot(tm) argument (and put Mac on a level playing field with MS).
Holy crap! When did MS release the entire source code to their OS?
Woohoo! I'm going to fork the NT kernel.
Or is the "level playing field" you talk about one where MS doesn't have to give away anything, or provide Windows on any other platforms, while Apple has to give away their entire OS for nothing and make sure it works on every hardware platform?
Then insert counter point that Apple _needs_ to keep somethings proprietary in order to compete. Then ingnore the fact how Apple loves Open source code they can take and use to save millions in development costs and then take ages to return changes to the community (cough, safari, cough).
Oh, I see... the playing field's not even that level, in addition to giving away all of their source code for free, they also have to release it according to your schedule?
And you call Apple users zealots...
Besides I like to be in control of my music and my gear and I don't like when I can't replace the battery like the way the iPod is setup.
I think by now, anyone bitching that they "can't" replace an iPod battery is just looking for something to bitch about. Seems to me that there are more than one place to get replacement batteries for the iPod, and it even only takes about 5 mins to do the replacement yourself.
Perl - $Just @when->$you ${thought} s/yn/tax/ &couldn\'t %get $worse;