Slashdot Mirror
Indian Moon Mission to Have Landing Component
Anil Kandangath writes "Last month, it was announced that the Indian moon mission Chandrayan I would have a component that would land on the moon to function as an impactor. For all those who complain about India spending big bucks on its space program, The Scientific Indian has a list of updates about the space program's plans for this year which includes two cartography satellites, a satellite based 'total disaster management system', a few communication satellites and a satellite launch for the European Union."
Allow me to translate:
[...] which includes two spy satellites, a satellite based 'total spy management system', a few spy satellites and a spy satellite launch for the European Union."
How about putting the big bucks to help your own people?
h-t-t-p-colon-slash-slash-slash-dot-dot-org
Hellooooo, the U.S. never landed on the moon. I strongly doubt India will ever have any success either.
Why is EU paying india to do it when they could use the Arianne rockets in france and keep the money at home..
Will code a sig generator for food
Outsourcing India's jobs to the moon ! I'm sure they already have that in mind...
Even a failed mission can function as an impactor.
I'm sure this is just the first step to outsource NASA to India.
"Bangalore, we have a problem..." - "Please describe your problem." - "We are leaking oxygen" - "Try restarting your landing computer" (Yes, I know this mission is not manned)
Life is just nature's way of keeping meat fresh.
Congratulations to India, /me looks around hoping to find a native american)
This is a great progress for Indian Space technology, maybe this will allow India to get recognition as a player in the so called space exploration, it is suprising to see a country with such a large portion of its population in poverty. How it will help the average man it will cause an economic boom / investment into a new field. I am very happy to see India move into this field it might cause the _caucasian_ western nations; which rather spend its money on coquering other nations and torture people for _intelligence_ and supporting puppet goverments rethink there roles and understand that the future of humanity lies in the stars. Even if they have done this before just because they are pioneers don't make it that they are the best. Even if the natives of America came from Asia/Europe/Africa/Australasia it really doesn't matter they never got to rule the land that they discovered.... ( I wonder what happened to the all the Native Americans
Jai Hind
Bleh. Why do people always argue the "big picture" concept against the allegedly "small picture" argument? It'll never get traction - it isn't ignorance stopping people from agreeing with you, it's indifference. How tangible is the notion of a "better" society? Bleh.
No, the argument is people starving and money spent on a space program being wasteful so address it as such. A NASA engineer requires a lot of expertise, and is employed, therefore the Indian equivelent very likely requires a lot of expertise and is employed. Said expertise requires higher education - you've just employed a professor or five. Said expert's income can go towards housing and food - you've just employed a carpenter and a farmer... yes. Noone is going to eat a space module, but the persons responsible for mining the materials to construct it are, as are the people who constructed it, support it...
Great Depression in the US was at an impasse because economic thinking before then was the immature cognitive process that produces the fallacy of immediate needs spending. Sometimes you gotta borrow money to make money ("You gotta spend money to make money." well if you've got no money...) - and on the scale of an economy, borrowing money is national jobs no matter how "crazy" - artists on government payroll, eccet.
I don't know what method they will be using to choose the impact spot for the impactor.. I hope they wait until the data has been gathered by the onboard instruments and choose a spot where there is likely some water-ice.
This way when the impact happens hopefully their spectrometer would be able to detect the vapor and finally(hopefully) confirm that theory.
-
First it was the 2Mbit/s for $2.30USD now its the Moon landing Mission
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Racist Troll :- Intersting that you may say that not once did the poster say that Indians were far superior than rest of the world because they were such a good group of people investing in space exploration than any other group or ethnic race of people. They rather spend there resources on something else, I believe this is known as opportunity cost. The Indian goverment chose to spend money on something else rather than something else such as irrigation for agricultural land, fighting disease, education etc.
All I am saying is look at the facts did the post say something that might be racist and also if you thing that is so that I am being racist think again you might want to be me one day in Alabama.
This article talks about plans to introduce telemedicine through satlellites. This move , if successful could have far-reaching effects in India , especially since even basic healthcare facilities are out of reach for many in rural India. What is also commendable is that organisations using this for social good would not be charged for the service
The specific areas of study for India's moon mission listed here seem not to be aiming to do anything that has not been attempted or studied in detail in the past.
Therefore the arguement that the money being spent is for scientific advancement doesnt hold.
i normally wouldn't reply to obvious flamebait, but i can't help it on this one occasion. (feel free to mod this down as it's only half on topic and entirely a reply to the parent)
yes it's nice that india is doing this sort of thing, though i would personally rather see them spend their money more of on the planet earth and developing their nation. this WONT help the majority of their population, at least not within the next 20+ years. space research and exploration is a field with no guarenteed profits and nor even guarenteed information gained, and typically programs end up deep in the red but with some decent amounts of good research gained. I personally think India should stick to satellites in relation to space as satellites can bring real profit and truly help the Indian economy (and slow down or stop the damnable IT outsourcing) but i'm also obviously not leading a nation.
offtopic: as for the obvious hate rant at the United States and company. I won't say anyone is perfect, and most things in the united states are anything but perfect, but we could dish trash about any nation's past or even current policy, and native americans weren't mostly killed by US soldier's weapons, but instead by diseases (namely smallpox), the same way the aztecs and other centeral/south american natives were whiped out by spaniards and the other european nations exploring.
the United States is not this big evil nation out to do everyone in and make itself godly. real people live there too, the same as you, they bleed, they work hard, they live life. we're just a nation working as a nation with a government that is working as it is, albeit not always as well as everyone hopes, but it still is the government we americans choose to use. if you truly believe that what a some people in a government, a very tiny percentage of a population, for a very shot period (4 to 8 years), do is a good reason to bad mouth, to practically hate, hundreds of millions of humans with different ideas and beliefs; then i feel sorry for you on so many levels it's not even funny.
</rant>
it must have a humour componeNT?
insidious whoreabully infactdead PostBlock censorship devise update (Score:mynuts won, post 'em if you gott 'em)
by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 30, @06:44AM (#11519131)
not even politically motivated, robbIE MiSuses this junk just to protect his monIE supply (yet another example of how way too much is never enough), &/or his greed/fear/ego based felonious stock markup FraUD execrable cronIEs/sponsors.
all in all, senseless greed motivated censorship could only delay the inevitable, which is freedom of speech, one of the mandates of the creators' wildly popular planet/population rescue initiative.
consult with/trust in yOUR creators, rebuilding declining civilizations since/until forever. see you there?
that it will be manned 24/7, all the expiring space food will rotated to the front and if any of the astronauts need a break there will always be a family member ready to help out...
Does every comment about Indian or Chinese space mission really have to have comments about takeaways on the moon etc... ? It's offensive and juvenile, and it's sad Slashdot can't move beyond this.
If you never hear anything about this again don't worry about it the US have just eliminated the team so there is no evidence that they were never really on the moon.
Have you metaroderated recently?
Everyone know that this mission will fail.
Simply beacuse there is no moon
Have you metaroderated recently?
Wait a second, this is 101% wrong. India does spend money on poor. But as you know for spending money you need to generate it first. And no indian satellite program is used for "educational" purposes unlike western countries.
Now coming to Western countries, well in the name of free trade agreement all the western countries have done is to ensure that the latest technologies are so costly that developing countries are forced not to use it. The whole Drug patent thing that India had to subscribe to made our generic drugs costlier than what a person would earn in a whole months of work.
In terms of technology transfers it is pathetic even mundane things like a microwave oven is a thing of luxury for many Indians.
Talk about environment we have all the players like Mercedes, Chevvy, Hyundai, Toyota none of the companies give clean cars to India. If they do its cost is equal to 20 years of a common mans salary.
Moral of the story If the western counrtries dont help us we help ourselves.
EUA has giving more attention to Brazil on the Satellite Vehicle Launching, because the base of Alcântara is so near the Equator line reducing the use of gas to launch the roquets.
http://www.michel.eti.br
Funny that Dell is taking the Support Calls for this. What comes around goes around. Pretty soon, we'll all be speaking Hindi-apu and bowing to dancing elephants and 6-armed she-gods.
I can't wait!
"Thank you, come again!"
The biggest hurdle is in keeping the camels oxygenated when pulling around the landing rover.
...to the oft heard comment, "Jeezus, where is your call center - on the MOON?!"
"Win treats sysadmins better than users. Mac treats users better than sysadmins. Linux treats everyone like sysadmins."
Hmm.... it seems that usa has got no poors. no one is poor in america. ....
check this out buddy
http://www.usccb.org/cchd/povertyusa/povfacts.htm
i think usa has got its own shares of problems. After all, how many nations are there in this world where people are discriminated based on there _skin color_ ?
skin color ?? HA HA HA....thats INSANE !!!
When i was in high school, i read story about Muhammad Ali. It was shocking ! He had to throw away his olympic gold medal into a river because of rascism ( cant recall the name of that river).
And this is the nation where people's favorite hobby is ridiculing others...atleast thats what i have seen at slashdot !
they think that chinese people have pony tails, every indian wears a turban, and that every russian is a spy. but its not like that !
I think, its time that slashdot should mention on there main page that this site is for americans only.
Treatment
Once India has its space program up and running, we can outsource NASA to India. That'll save us a fortune! I'm sure those rocket scientists will be able to get work at their local Wal-Marts.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
The next battleground will be space. India wants to have a space program so that they can wipe out Pakistan with spaceships and satellites.
I have had enough of crap about India.
It is time you all woke up to and figured out that USA is as bad as any other country.
We may have more illiterates than any other country in the world, but you forget that India also has the largest number of engineers. More Indians can speak English than there are people in the entire USA. Think about that.
We are not poor due to our stupidity. We are poor by design. Just a 100 years ago, we were the richest nation on earth. Then we were split up into two countries and made to go at each other's throat. The Indo-Pak cold war has cost us an entire civilization.
Our political system is bankrupt. Most politicians are plain goons. But we also have the vision to elect a woman to rule us. Every second President of India is from the minorities. How many black presidents, how many women presidents has USA had? How about a Jew for the Prez?
I find it very surprising that most of the posts talk about Indian Poverty. It certainly points to the assumption that money according to American values is what defines a person. That is simply not a simple truth for many places in the world.
The purpose of all philosophers was to impress women
Yawn...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/1899420. stm
Norrath, the setting for the online game Everquest, has been found to be the 77th richest country in the world, sandwiched between Russia and Bulgaria.
Online gaming has attracted millions of players and their rise in popularity in recent years is mainly down to improved graphics and more players to interact with.
Research carried out in the United States shows that virtual internal markets, combined with illegal online trading on auction websites, mean that Norrath has a gross national product per capita of $2,266, bigger than China and India.
Aren't most discussions here offtopic? where are the mods?
Or continue praying to some old dude who loves you but sends floods, earthquakes, tsunamis, fire and brimstrone from time to time, while praying in God's language, English
Simply beacuse there is no moon.
Spoon, dude. There is no spoon .
-kgj
-kgj
Thank you for putting some sanity and perspective back into the conversation. India has a number of hugely wasteful government programs: nuclear weapons, space program, etc. There is no way to defend the nuclear weapons program. The only way to defend the space program is by saying that it is turning a profit. Does anyone have a link to an article showing that it is turning a profit?
Societies failed, are failing, or will fail for clearcut reasons. People in these societies make the wrong choices. There is no luck to success. It is merely hardwork and making the right choices.
The best example to my mind is all the war-ravaged European countries after WWII and Japan. I am most familiar with Japan. It spent no money on a nuclear weapons program and almost no money on a space program. Virtually all the money spent by the government went to building the public infrastructure and industrial infrastructure of Japan.
As for the mentality of the people, during 1945 - 1985, the majority of Japanese considered their own culture to be inferior to mainstream Western culture. Surprising? No. Admit the problem, and then you can solve it. Deny the problem, and it will never be solved. One characteristic of people in unsuccessful or poorly functioning societies is incredible, almost supremacist belief in the superiority of their cultures.
Just look at all the defenders of Indian society on SlashDot. To them, Indians can do no wrong.
Do you know what I admire most about Westerners (like Canadians, Japanese, etc.)? I often see them criticizing their own societies. Occasionally, there are huge protests. Martin Luther King is one of the best known protestors, and he was an awesome Westerner and rightly deserved his own holiday. Such criticism improves our Western societies in ways that a supremacist from India cannot understand.
Thank you for putting sanity and perspective back into the conversation. India has a number of hugely wasteful government programs: nuclear weapons, space program, etc. There is no way to defend the nuclear weapons program. The only way to defend the space program is by saying that it is turning a profit. Does anyone have a link to an article showing that it is turning a profit?
Societies failed, are failing, or will fail for clearcut reasons. People in these societies make the wrong choices. There is no luck to success. It is merely hardwork and making the right choices.
The best example to my mind is all the war-ravaged European countries after WWII and Japan. I am most familiar with Japan. It spent no money on a nuclear weapons program and almost no money on a space program. Virtually all the money spent by the government went to building the public infrastructure and industrial infrastructure of Japan.
As for the mentality of the people, during 1945 - 1985, the majority of Japanese considered their own culture to be inferior to mainstream Western culture. Surprising? No. Admit the problem, and then you can solve it. Deny the problem, and it will never be solved. One characteristic of people in unsuccessful or poorly functioning societies is incredible, almost supremacist belief in the superiority of their cultures.
Just look at all the defenders of Indian society on SlashDot. To them, Indians can do no wrong.
Do you know what I admire most about Westerners (like Canadians, Japanese, etc.)? I often see them criticizing their own societies. Occasionally, there are huge protests. Martin Luther King is one of the best known protestors, and he was an awesome Westerner and rightly deserved his own holiday. Such criticism improves our Western societies in ways that a supremacist from India cannot understand.
It's great news that India is developing the next stage of their space program beyond simple payload to orbit missions. Soon Iran, Brazil, Argentina, South Korea will cut the legs out of that sector of the business so NASA, the ESA, Japan, India and Russia will have to find new venues for their space programs. Scientific missions to the moon as proof of concept programs for new technology are a great first step.
I just don't understand what the big deal is? So India is going to be a major player in the Space arena. Yes it would go head-to-head against NASA and would most likely build better/cheaper space related technologies as such an endeavor is bound to spur innovative ideas.
You have to deal with this! It's called democracy!! If the Indian public are in favor of such and endeavor, then so be it. One could argue that the Apollo mission had no befits expect for national price. That's the bottom line. Sure it might have helped in building better weapon systems but one could also argue that this is a necessity for defending the nation. So such is the case for India as well! Every nation has the god given right to defend herself against any adversary be it legit or not. It was easier in the cold war era but in this day and age, proxy wars seems to be the norm. So by having advanced technologies in place, nations would think twice about engaging in illegal tactics (hint: US foreign policies).
Sure India has a huge population living below the poverty line, but in the grand scheme of things does this population have any direct impact? A case in point is the block/hispanic population living in ghettos? Does the government actually care about the less privileges? Of course NOT!!
Let's not get into endless debates about what's right for a country but rather focus on what benefits a country can derive from advanced in technology.
if u check the currency coversion a dollar is approximately 42 rupees. 42*31= 1302 which is more than enough for a farmer living in the outskirts to sruvive because of highly lowered rates and ration given by the government and that amount in the city is too low i agree but c'mon give them some credit all these things that India is doing will get them recognition from other counrties of the world and thats the main reason that their doin all this and too boost the already flourishing Indian economy.
Indian infant mortality rate: 57.92 per 1000; US's: 6.63 per 1000.
Indian life expectancy at birth: 63.99 years; US's: 77.43 years.
Indian HIV's prevalence rate: 0.8%; US's: 0.6%.
Indian literacy: Male: 70.2%, female: 48.3%; US's: Male: 97%, female: 97%.
Indian GDP PPP: $2,900; US's: $37,800.
Indian population below poverty line: 25%; US's: 12%.
Indian household income share: Lowest 10%: 3.5%, highest 10%: 33.5%; US's: Lowest 10%: 1.8%, highest 10%: 30.5%.
In light of these figures (taken from the CIA Worldbook,) in which India can be seen as a poor, illiterate, unjust, unhealthy, backward society, the superpower pissing contest that the Indian government has been involved in for years now is a pathetic moral perversion. Indian readers here would do well to feel ashamed to have a government even more embarrassing than that of the US.
"FEED YOUR PEOPLE", spake G_dbert1966 to Apu, "And then feed mine. Cuz they are screwing up the environment, mucking up with other people's countries and sooner or later the cycle will revolve".
Feed, Clothe, House your people
Stuff that matters.
So much for US President Bush's proclamation of man-on-the-moon in 2020 (or whenever). Looks like NASA has some competition, already ahead of the game that is...
From TFA
Officially, this Rs 384-crore project is not a landing mission.
WTF is a crore?
This is my sig. There are thousands more, but this one is mine.
Why would they crash something on the moon's surface. They could easily collect rock samples by landing a probe.
While this is a great advancement for the Indians I just can't get excited. Been there, done that. Landers, orbiters, impacters... Who cares!!! We had PEOPLE on the moon 35 years ago!
will Chandrayan 1 make a decent slurpee?
Sorry, I couldn't resist, nothing mean meant by it. Some of the nicest and brightest people I've met were from India.
http://www.marxist.com/
Thats where the ISRO control center is. Hassan is some 200 kms north west of B'lore.
karma : former act as leading to inevitable results
You have to have good income flow to help. India is just getting moving. I wish them well and hope that they help jump start american interest in really getting into space and staying there.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Republicans: back by computer commands.
"We are not poor due to our stupidity. We are poor by design. Just a 100 years ago, we were the richest nation on earth."
No you weren't.
Probably they weren't the richest but do you know that Dubya's Yale University is named after the guy (YALE, ELIHU) who robbed India in the name of Trade(as a governor of British East India Company in Madras, India around 1687) and donated a little bit of that robbed Indian money to the Collegiate School at Saybrook, Connecticut around 1718 and it was eventually renamed Yale University after this Mr Yale.
Next in the news, India invents the wheel and axle?
China and India, while floating huge populations of impoverished citizens, are spending enormous amounts of public money on re-doing science that's already in the books? Why?
The only answers I've ever seen to that question are: "national pride" and "they want to militarize space". The first is simple emotionalism, and isn't defensible on grounds of reason, science, logic or pragmatism. The second is wishful thinking, as the USA has too much of a headstart to overcome.
The best space science program I've seen outside the USA are the European Space Agency's, and Japan's - they explicitly strive not to duplicate what's already been done, and they don't have an emotional problem with using US technology to do new science. The ESA has never landed on the moon, but it has put robots and probes all over the solar system. And Japanese technology will be instrumental for the next generation of US spacecraft. Meanwhile, despite having space programs of similar funding and age, India and China are just recreating what the USSR and US did decades ago. It's not only a stupid use of the money, it's also arrogant, insular and selfish.
Ya right. Thats why tens of millions are starving http://www.globalpolicy.org/socecon/develop/2002/1 112starvation.htm .
pull out of iraq, save yer social security system, maybe contribute more than the 70 millions tht yer benevolent dictator so generously contributed
7-8-9-10-0
Actually a moon program is not like building white elephants, unless of course one picks really hard places to build the elephants in. A space program of any degree requires engineers to face and defeat some of the toughest environmental engineering challenges around. Said engineers are then the best and brightest at a lot of tasks that do make good money (like oh say, making commercial airliners, designing communications satellites, building better cell phones, etc. The design challenge of making an electrical device capable of providing high quality sensor data on a bitterly frugal power budget with a reliability capable of operating months or even years without service in an environment of high radiation, large temperature extremes, and total vacuum gives an engineer design tools he can employee forever. It provides a foundation of talented, trained technicians able to work to the most exacting standards which then can go on to design and build far more mundane objects with the object lessons learned. And the mechanical, electrical, chemical, and process information you learn or create from doing this kind of work can have serendipitous application as well (Teflon being one of those oft quoted examples) Plus the prestige contributes to national pride and self confidence which translates to a positive to the consumer confidence factor which leads to stimulation of the economy through more buying. Big, showy achievements tend to create better press then simple small advances regardless of the actual merit of the achievement (Call this the P.T. Barnum rule of economics) Bookkeepers and beancounters may quibble about the actual merit, but these classes can not lead a nation to greatness, they can only sustain the status quo. I congratulate India on their program and wish them the best of luck, perhaps the competition will push my own country to get serious again with it's space program. GO India!!
Actually, the UK is a net exporter of curry to India; UK curry manufacturers (often founded by immigrants from the Indian subcontinent) now export curry paste/mix to the rest of the world, including India. Meanwhile, tikka masala recently was acknowledged as the English national dish.
Going the other way, a few years ago, the Indian conglomerate Tata Group bought English tea company Tetley's.
And Hinglish has the added charm that anything written in it, even a bureaucratic form, will read like a P.G. Wodehouse novel.
And the first settlers wil be an IBM call centre.
Might finally get brits on the moon if they can get a decent curry..........
If there is ANYTHING history has shown us is that governments are usually pretty good at solving TECHNICAL problems and fatastically HORRIBLE at solving social problems.
... by just trying to get to grips with overpopulation, poverty, backward castes, HIV, and bureaucracy (in no particular order) getting out of hand. How about spending resources on that, or is begging for foreign help just too convenient?
And why exactly do you say that India was the richest nation 100 years ago ?? Or that's what you call an agricultural "paradise" ?
The Raven
For a human to have kids when they know that they cannot feed them? Is it "humane"? Or is it insane?
The fact of the matter is, "world hunger" will not be solved without some form of population control. IF you were to snap your fingers and have enough food and health care instantly available for the current needy population, all you would do is double or triple the population in less than a generation.
Most places that have pulled themselves out of the muck have solved this with education. The Chinese, recognizing that their situation was desperate, have solved it with force. Others have not tried to solve it at all, and so they are still poor, diseased, ignorant, and starving with no hope in sight.
In the US, we have managed to pull most of our population out of the squalor by the sheer strength of our economy. Still we have problems that would be solved in a generation if we practiced some form of enforced birth control. Consider what would happen to our welfare system if every child was sterilized at birth and then as an adult had to pay for an operation to restore it to fertility.
While I don't advocate this, I do think that there are some forms of behavior that ought to be criminal, that aren't. I also think that the sentances for some crimes should include sterilisation.
Good judgement comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
- W. Wriston, former Citibank CEO