Slashdot Mirror
Google Plans to Offer Free WiFi in San Francisco
jacksonwest writes "What's been rumored for some time has now been confirmed -- Google has made a bid in response to Mayor Gavin Newsom's request for information. The details of the bid include citywide access, for free, at 300kbps. The plans dovetail into their location-based advertising and services strategy, and come on the heels of their recent VPN service rollout."
Come on... share it! People in DC need free WiFi, too!
Big telecoms have a lot of political influence. Watch this to be denounced as unfair competition, Communist, unamerican, etc. Followed by FCC rules or laws prohibiting it.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.
What happens to this infrastructure when newer technology comes out? Isn't this just a waste? What about WiMAX? Thoughts?
until this is abused? I can think of a number of ways it could be taken advantage of...
And what does "location-based advertising and services" mean in reality? Free wifi is good, of course, but TNSTAAFL. Can I rely on my traffic not being inspected/recorded by anyone with this offer?
quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur.
I get free wifi too. My neighbor doesn't secure his connection... its a bit low on signal strength though. Hopefully Google provide me with a better solution soon!
:(){
All I g2 say is that if u have any money invested in a SF telecom company, well u better start selling... The fact is that it is about time someone did something like this. We are just being raped (economically speaking) by telecom companies who are making massives amounts of money without lowering prices. Now is the time to strike back, well at least in San Franciso, just imagine, Free internet access, free telephone (through IP phones), and that is only the beggining... Tremble u moneymakers.
Could this be what NASA and Google are going to start working on? (j/k). So, Google is becoming an ISP. I think this would be very nice and a good place to start for a nationwide rollout
Click here or here.
Sweet, so lots of people making >$75k can get free internet! What a Novel Idea!
welcome our new google overloards....
Location based Ad? Do they monitor the connections to their network. What about privacy?
Dupe at least not on the same page.2 4&tid=217&tid=95
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/09/20/12432
NT
TINSTAAFL - There is no such thing as a free lunch. The fundamental principal of economics.
Of course, you could have just looked at the title of your comment (Re:There's No Such Thing As A Free Lunch)
"For Great Justice."
If you're going to San Francisco Be sure to have a wifi-card in your laptop If you're going to San Francisco You're gonna meet some gentle geeks there
I reject your reality, and subsitute my own
Every wifi access point has its unique code. When you browse, you get a commercial for the shop lying just around the corner. They don't need to inspect your traffic, they know (+/-) where you are. Smart, damn smart...
10 ?"Hello World" life was simple then
Frankly, I'm not buying it. I think the whole S.F. = Free Wi-Fi deal isn't going to happen. Newsom talks big, and he looks good in front of a camera, but when it comes to running the city, I'm not in the least bit impressed. This isn't gonna happen.
I live in San Francisco, less than three blocks from Union Square, and I'd just be happy if local government could keep garbage and human feces off the damn streets. Free Wi-Fi from the same mayor who pulled the whole 'Care Not Cash' scam on us, the one that was supposed to bring in all the vagrants off the streets yet hasn't done a damn thing that I can see? Yeah, right... Even at 4:45 a.m. I get hit-up for change on the streets here. Yeah, Newsom's gonna give us free Wi-Fi. Please. Give me a break.
San Francisco can't even route the stupid buses around the city with any sense of sanity; how are they going to route packets any better? Sure, Google knows what they're doing, but they're down in Mountain View, where local government is small and generally sane and they don't have the geographical problems San Francisco has. I think we're going to see a lot of press releases and a few public talks, and then Google will spend millions trying to squeeze packets between the numerous hills and tall buildings the city sports all over the place. They'll get a few hot-spots going, realize that it will take lots more money than they want to spend to totally unwire the city, then they'll quietly shove the project into some closet somewhere, never again to see the light of day.
Sure, it sounds like a good plan; blanket the city with free Internet access for residents and tourists alike. But San Francisco has so many more pressing issues to deal with that this just feels like another one of Gavin's 'feel-good' moves. I'm not holding my breath, and I'm not giving up my cable modem either.
The Mariner tells a story of a ship adrift for so long they ran out of drinking water, after the 'hero' of the story shoots an albatross (bad luck)
Water, water, everywhere,
And all the boards did shrink;
Water, water, everywhere,
Nor any drop to drink.
So. That's that.
I hope Google would be better, but does anyone know if they plan to restrict access to port 80 only, like some other "free" (strange definition) wi-fi. That would mean the only internet applications that work would be web browsers. You wouldn't be able to send/check email, unless, you were using a webmail service, such as... GMail! Similarly, IM, p2p and everything else that isn't on :80, although many apps can get through firewalls, they lose speed.
So basically, theres (dozens||hundreds||thousands) of people... all on the same wireless network. Am I the only one that thinks this will make all the scumbag hackers jobs easier?
Nice and flat, and not a lot of tall buildings.
Oh...plus I live there.
This is going to go off their network in a few hours, but its been up for days.
http://wifi.google.com/download.html
http://wifi.google.com/faq.html
This will kill all the little mom and pops wifi offerrings. Alot of them have thrived by being creative (ie. free access for foot traffic) but this will surely change things.
rmckeethen: Don't throw away your cable modem. No one is saying that a WiFi connection is better than a wired connection. And aside from the mobility that it gives you, wired is actually A LOT better that WiFi. Better/faster connection, way more secure, etc. I could go on. The fact of the matter here is that what this move does (in the long run) is provide everyone in S.F. with an Internet connection, wherever they may be-- and this move is especially useful for the people that can't afford the $40/month you pay for your cable service. Also, it's a move to help show that it's rediculous that people pay that much for such services. There is a growing digital divide in the U.S., and even in SF it exists. This divide is largely based on money, and this is a move to help curb it. If Google can get everyone on the computer, sure they make more money, but there are social benefits they provide in terms of connecting those without mid-range-speed Internet to the rest of the world. My personal view-- and I suspect Google shares this view-- is that the Internet is like electricity-- it is something to which all people should be entitled, though the Internet is in its infancy, as opposed to electricity's 250 year history. Not all people are as fortunate as you.
Satellite Radio - We can just use the internet to stream audio now.
Cell Phone/Telcom - PDAs with Skype will be cheaper than complicated contracts with mysterious service fees.
I'm sure there are more I'm not thinking of...
What if Digg added local news and a Slashdot inspired comment karma system? ---
http://houndwire.com
From the application's EULA:
What then follows is a standard legal example of what those circumstances could be, but "certain circumstances" is much, much too vague to my liking. One could argue that the transmissions are being encrypted, but this clause doesn't mention a single word about exactly where Google claims the right to monitor and intercept these transmissions. I think I'll pass.
it's also interesting to consider the possibility that google, by establishing its own wireless network, will be able to deliver 'richer' web-apps for essentially free. imagine a google-centric information service segregated from the internet where one can store (and search) personal files on secure reliable servers and execute common productivity/communication apps on an OS-agnostic platform, all at LAN-like speeds (using 802.11g-like wireless technology). do you worry about the over-subscription of free wireless broadband? well, for this idea, google could prioritize traffic using existing techniques to prefer its bursty web-app transactions to traditional internet traffic (eg. 1mbps up/down vs. 300/128kbps, respectively).
naturally, this idea would be compatible with standard internet access mechanisms. using its own network just gives more flexibility to google and possibly allows it to provide an even more desktop-like experience to a (growing) subset of users without having to wait for next-generation broadband to become truly commonplace.
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/09/20/124322 4&from=rss
Nothing costs nothing
Whenever a company does something this big and expensive for "free", you have to ask why. Looking at the article, one sentence popped out at me: "San Francisco will be a true test bed for location based services and applications." It seems they've concluded that in the near future, the US, or at least its cities, will be blanketed with wireless coverage, and they want to get ahead of the curve by testing their ideas in San Francisco.
It's adware.
;)
Not theat the press ever gets anything right
- Adam L. Beberg - The Cosm Project - http://www.mithral.com/
Wouldn't it have been better to spend all that money to help the bazillion HOMELESS people that are in San Francisco? For a city that promotes itself as being so progressive, they really need to help the homeless folks out there, and Google would make a lot more impact by helping those folks.
At Benjamin Smith's Sept. 8 pretrial hearing, the prosecution dropped the charge of unauthorized network access, citing Title 18,Chapter 119, 2511.(2)(g)(i) and 2510(16)(A).
How about this for a (relatively) non-intruisve location-based ad idea. Install electronic billboards near wifi access points and based on *aggregate* data, serve up relevant ads. Make sure they're not _too_ targeted or people start getting seriously freaked out by the minority-report style holo-ads ;)
just a thought...
Pessimism of the intellect, optimism of the will! - Antonio Gramsci.
I LOVE that they're keeping things symmetrical, giving free wifi on both sides of the states. They're supposedly offering google sponsored wifi HERE... more details HERE. of course we have plenty free wifi in the big apple, I have three available connections in my apartment which are FASTER than my dsl line. But once I get my powerbook I'm sure ill learn to appreciate these public spaces
Philadelphia has had a municiple WiFi plan in place for a while. Test areas are up and running. They are hoping to go live sometime in 2006. A little optimistic I think, but it's actually happening. Pretty exciting for me being in the downtown area.
http://www.phila.gov/wireless/
What's the catch? In return for the free service, Google announces it will record user's porno habit.
Mayor Newsom has stated making access available to the poor as a prime reason for free wireless.
Yeah, because the only thing keeping down those wretched souls on around 6th and Market is their sad lack of reliable wireless internet.
Da Blog
I highly doubt that users will get as much of a real Internet connection with these new free wifi services as they do with home DSL or cable service. Modern broadband service in the USA provides you with an Internet routable IP address that you can run server applications on any port of. The power of broadband has allowed p2p to prosper among average users, and has let any slashdotter in their parent's basement host their own SSH, FTP, HTTP, IRC, and etc, servers.
Unfortunately...most users wouldn't care if they couldn't do this anymore. If they can get free wifi that goes through NAT to get to the Internet, they'll use it, and the market for real Internet connections will disappear. Ubiquitous free wifi would be great for a centralized content provider like google, but would effectively destroy the market for cheap symmetric* Internet connections. The "power user" market will be too small to keep DSL companies in business. Small businesses and individuals will have to outsource their hosting to giant colo facilities even if they have the hardware and know how to run their own servers. This could potentially be a real threat to democracy on the Internet.
Most users want the net to be more like television: a multimedia service that turns individuals into passive media consumers and that only allows corporations to be content producers. The new Internet will provide consumers with more services then TV does. However, without any cheap and easy decentralized distribution method, the set of service providers will be restricted to those who can afford high bandwidth connections. This could be a great loss of potential information and services for consumers, and moreover would be a restriction of freedom for those who wish to be content providers.
Wireless networking could lead to the further decentralization of the Internet. Cooperative or personal wifi projects are helping us move in that direction. A centralized service like google wifi would mean going backwards.
*Data will still be able to travel in both directions of course, but other Internet users would not be able to initiate connections with the free wifi hosts, thus forcing the wifi users to only run clients, not servers.
------ Take away the right to say fuck and you take away the right to say fuck the government.
Toronto is nice and flat with a lovely and very tall building with line of site to most of the city.
Oh, and I live here and want free wifi, but really Toronto would be the place to do this.
Soon, when I'm lost, I can just Google myself to find out where I am!
http://lost.google.com/search?q=myself
Results:
Why, you're just around the corner from Old Navy, where they have men's khaki's on sale for $19.95.
Thank you for using Google Lost!
From FAQ:
Google Secure Access (Beta): Frequently Asked Questions
What is Google Secure Access?
Google Secure Access is a downloadable client application that allows users to establish a more secure WiFi connection.
Why would I want to download and install Google Secure Access?
Google Secure Access allows you to establish a more secure connection while using Google WiFi. By using Google Secure Access, your internet traffic will be encrypted, preventing others from viewing the information you transmit.
Does Google Secure Access connect to a VPN server?
Yes, Google Secure Access connects to Google's VPN ("Virtual Private Network") server provided for this service.
Why did Google develop Google Secure Access?
One of our engineers recognized that secure WiFi was virtually non-existent at most locations. As a result, he used his 20% project time to begin an initiative to offer users more secure WiFi access. Google Secure Access is the result of this endeavor.
What sort of information does Google have access to?
If you choose to use Google Secure Access, your internet traffic will be encrypted and sent through Google's servers to the Internet. The data that is received will then be encrypted and sent back through our servers to your computer. Your privacy is important to us, we strongly encourage you to read our Privacy Policy to be fully informed about how your privacy is protected.
Is there a fee for using Google Secure Access?
No, Google Secure Access is free.
Where can I go to download Google Secure Access?
The program can currently be downloaded at certain Google WiFi locations in the San Francisco Bay Area.
When I install Google Secure Access, why does it ask if I also want to install the Google Toolbar?
We've included the option to install the Google Toolbar because it improves your browsing experience.
Can I uninstall Google Secure Access?
Yes. You can uninstall Google Secure Access by simply running the Uninstall program. This can be found by clicking on Start Menu, Programs, Google Secure Access, and then choosing Uninstall.
How do I make my connection even more secure?
You can make your connection even more secure by using a software firewall. Windows XP users with Service Pack 2 can find it by clicking on Start, Control Panel, and then choosing Windows Firewall.
Will my corporate VPN still work?
Yes. You can connect to your corporate VPN while running Google Secure Access.
I have configured Google Secure Access to connect automatically, but it's not working. What's going on?
Certain wireless LAN management utilities and older wireless LAN adapter drivers prevent Google Secure Access from detecting that you're connected to the Google WiFi network. In this case it will not connect automatically, and you should connect manually to ensure the privacy and security of your network traffic.
Will Google Secure Access work at other locations?
While Google Secure Access should work, we have not tested it at other locations.
Why is Google Secure Access a beta product?
Google Secure Access is a new product that is only available at certain locations in the San Francisco Bay Area. We are constantly working to improve this product.
Tell the truth and you won't have so much to remember.
What if Digg added local news and a Slashdot inspired comment karma system? ---
http://houndwire.com
Apple builds the iPod/cellphone. Google provides the new nationwide infrastructure and becomes a new phone company. A truely compelling cell phone with real useful features (real email, real web, iPod, calendaring). Way cool.
r
CEO: "We're tech company that everybody loves, with a stock price 6 times higher than is rational, and so now we have cash hanging out our collective asses. What can we do to make ourselves stand out and look cool?"
:P )
Tech: "Offer something free to the public."
CEO: "Great idea!"
Actually, even then stuff was sponsored by advertising revenues. Remember all those "get paid to surf the web" programs, like AllAdvantage.com? (and the apps that would pretend to surf for you while you were away from your PC?
Google can't just give away a broadband service and expect to remain profitable, unless they limit it such that it costs them less than they are making off other revenues, e.g. AdSense and their corporate-aimed search appliance...
Is Capitalism Good for the Poor?
Free WiFi here in San Francisco? Wow, I'm gonna be sooo gay!
(as in 'happy'...of course)
For free legal wifi in the San Francisco Bay Area goto
http://www.archive.org/web/sflan.php
How is google going to compete with this? Just read what SFLAN offers, for FREE, with NO ADS.
Even though Verizon blocked government-sponsored Wi-Fi in Philadelphia, could this be just the first of cities with free Wi-Fi? Could we see other major cities like New York, Chicago, or LA coming next?
I think we can agree that it would be awesome if we did. However, it's doubtful that Google will be the one supplying this for every major city in the US. Would all the corporations be as generous as Google, or would some start charging for it?
In light of this, you have to question Google's motives for doing this. What do they have to gain? They say it's for testing purposes, which is an acceptable reason. But this also means that should their test prove successful, they could start charging for access when and if they start moving to other cities.
If this were the case, competition would be good. Companies like, say, Optimum Online could offer faster or more reliable connections than Google, for example. The companies would be trying to provide the best service possible, rather than seeing that they supply the Wi-Fi for the entire country and letting the quality of their service drop.
Once you have competition, though, legal issues start to come into play. Is it for a company like Verizon to sign a deal with Phoenix that grants them exclusive rights to provide a Wi-Fi network for the city? Yes. Although if you look at the country, Verizon might not have a monopoly, the residents of that city would have no choice but to use Verizon's network, along with whatever inherent security or connection issues it comes with, not to mention price. The residents of Phoenix would be able to choose their ISP in their homes, but would be helpless outside the range of their home network if they didn't subscribe to Verizon's service. If city-wide Wi-Fi gets to be something we all take for granted, like an internet connection in our homes, this would become a huge problem.
If the cities' governments created and regulated these Wi-Fi networks, the problem would be solved. Anyone would be free to use the network, and there would be no monopolizing among the companies. The network could be paid for in the same way the street lights are paid for (taxes). After all, shouldn't bandwidth be (relatively) free?
So, could this be the first of many city-wide Wi-Fi networks? Yes. They would first appear in major cities and slowly expand to include the suburbs. However, should the city governments own all the Wi-Fi networks as opposed to private companies? The answer to that is also yes.
...sure beats NetZero's 10hour/day, free-internet bannerfest. Adware, but I'd take it.
You can hold down the "B" button for continuous firing.
Now we just need Google Subway. ;)
Skype is too convoluted... Now I'm reverse-engineering the Kyoto Protocol.
Someone on an amateur radio (one service that could be negatively affected by it) newsgroup said so, and further gave this URL:
http://www.uplc.org/
Tag lost or not installed.
How long before the world is connected thru Google Wifi, all shopping is done at Wal-Mart, All coffee is made by Starbucks, and all restaurants are Taco Bell? This is how it begins - a benign-appearing national company offering its service at a loss to get its foot in the door then WAMMO! Monopoly!! Now where'd I put my tinfoil hat and body armor set? (gd&r)
Sorry, man, only version I have is on a really old cassette tape :-)
I suggest allofmp3.com... I went there once when I absolutely could not find any reference on iTMS, the cd on ebay or amazon/etc (Cafe Del Mar 2 - Ibiza - kick ass ambient). If you're interested in the Iron Maiden CD, you can probably get a used cd off ebay... the album is called "Powerslave".
btw, Iron Maiden did some really nice epic/ballads... Where Eagles Dare, Dune ("To tame a land"), Alexander the Great, The Prisoner, Stranger in a Strange Land, among others.... a real thinking man's metal band.
Make sure everyone's vote counts: Verified Voting
I've since acquired a copy from 'Live after Death', email me if you want to.. come to an arrangement for a digital copy.