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Dell's Quest For Gaming Cool
Slate is running a piece looking at Dell's attempt to grab gamer customers via their acquisition of the Alienware brand. From the article: "Gamers want powerful computers, of course, but they also want stylish systems made by a company that they believe understands them. Dell's XPS line of machines certainly provides the requisite power. The PC giant's market clout earns it premium relationships with component-makers like ATI, Intel, and nVidia, often allowing it to be first to market with the hottest technologies. But devoted gamers have still stayed away from Dell. Halo obsessives are not IT managers: They ogle expensive, flashy machines ... and they buy expensive, flashy machines. That's where Alienware comes in."
The fact that the article doesn't even mention the AMD/Intel issue costs it considerable credibility in my opinion. I think it is definitely one of the primary obstacles facing Dell in this regard. Alienware had already gone outside the coolradar for many (including me) when Dell bought them, but its acquisition was like the final straw. "but you are the man". Exactly.
"Waste not one watt!" - CZ
I have a dell precision m70 laptop, 2gb RAM, 256mb video, 7200rpm hd....
It works great for games. and as long as I buy dell, it will generally be approved by my workplace, so the Alienware aquisition is probably going to net me that much nicer of a (gaming) machine next time around.
"They ogle expensive, flashy machines ... and they buy expensive, flashy machines."
Uh yeah whatever. I think a lot of hardcore gamers are more concerned about the performance then the flashy looks. They like quality parts, they like to be able to upgrade without worrying about proprietary parts (Dell I'm looking at you).
Alienware just seems overpriced to me. But then I'm not the type that would by a Falcon Northwest computer either. I'm looking for performance for the price. While I may spend more than average on a video card and extra RAM, I'm not seeking that last 10% performance boost that doubles the cost.
Who really does pay for those $5000 showcase computers that get raved at in magazines like Maximum PC? I always get the feeling that they are put out there more as advertising than actual product. The big rigs get exposure and the fan boys drool over them, but odds are they are buying something a couple notches below.
Sometimes my arms bend back.
Is if Dell offers truly customized machines. AMD is big in the gaming/enthusiast market and thats only in its infancy if that much. Another aspect is the fact that most boutique vendors like Alienware was didnt have the capacity to manufacture their own OEM parts like Dell does and was composed of more off-the shelf stuff just assembled and tweak meticulously. Basically, if i want an Athlon FX Dual Core SLI rig with an Asus/Gigabyte motherboard, WD Raptor etc etc machine, will dell provide that, or will i get (high end for what it is, it may be) Intel based mobo and whatever compnents dell usually provides. The whole success of boutique is that they can offer custom stuff of any configuration for the mere fact that they are boutique, small and can handle it as part of their business, not a disruption of.
The main difference between an XPS and an Alienware machine with the same specs is not how finely the hardware is tuned, it is the software. Dell ships everymachine out with a bunch of crap software bundled, some of which trips off populare anti-spyware software.
Here at work we purchase Dell laptops for our sales force and the first thing we always do after receiving the machine is to reload the windows disk, but not the auxillary software.
Crufty software doesn't belong on work machines let alone a gaming system. Some of the software bundled could even be considered offensive to gamers looking for high performance computers. Why not bundle software that is relevant to your target customers (i.e. quickbooks isn't it).
My inner self is ineffable, so don't eff with me.
Yeah when I don't have to buy a special power supply just so it will fit in the case.
Dell is a waste of money.
Gamers don't buy expensive flashy stuff because they want expensive flashy stuff. Gamers buy the stuff that can crank out the best graphics and smoothest gameplay; this TENDS to be the expensive flashy stuff, especially if you're going to whip it out at a LAN party... but then Dell bling won't help you get any "street cred" anyway.
The problem with your idea is that it makes sense.
alienware is shit now cause you can't change the paint job on the cases. end of story.
Well now were going to see a quality product from alienware now get infected with intel products, mcafee, and also system restore partitions that are going to destroy the great alienware products. Good Job Dell
Only people with more money than brains buy pre-made computers, except for laptops and the extreme low-end. (laptops for obvious reasons, and low-end because they usually get good bulk discounts on their hardware)
For me as well. They were really starting to slip in terms of reliability and support before the aquisition. The slogan "Build it like it was your own" hasn't been true over at Alienware for quite a while now. I don't think being under the Dell flag is going to help those issues any, at least not from a gamer point of view.
If forums teach us anything, it is that logic and critical thinking should be required courses in the public schools.
Gamers want (in roughly this order of priority):
High-end gear; top notch performance
Upgradeable, industry standard components for easy upgrading
Reliability
Tuned software as well as tuned hardware. (No Adware, OEM "partner" software, etc...)
Durability (for lugging to LAN parties)
Flashy case design
Dell can handle the first one, but they're notoriously bad at all the rest. If any of the last five of those things change about Alienware, every Alienware customer is going to know. Even if none of those things change, gamers all know that Alienware *is* Dell now. These people all read internet forums and tech news. They're not going to be fooled by a Dell with a different sticker on the front.
Here's an idea for Dell: instead of trying to buy somebody else's reputation, how about you start making PCs that don't suck for gaming. Then, perhaps, gamers will consider buying your PCs.
Here's a catchphrase I thought up that just oozes cool. The marketing wonks over at Dell might want to look into using it in a fresh new ad campaign:
"Duuuuude, yer gettin' an Alienware!"
I suspect a lot of the folks that buy Alienware are comparable to those rich brothers-in-law who go on the family Canadian fishing trip and show up with all of the most expensive gear (tags still on) and need help from Grampa Joe (with his 30 year old fly rod, dental floss and bent paper clip) to set the tension on the reel.
"Halo obsessives"
On the PC? I know its available on the PC but it hardly spawned obessive PC fans. Nor is it a game associated with high end performance
Did you get that thing I sent ya?
At work, we buy Dell systems. For a work environment, they work quite well. When I go home, I wouldn't buy a Dell system at a 50% discount (unless it was just for parts). Dell systems use a shitty proprietary motherboard, with a horrible BIOS, and way too many limitations. When I build a gaming system I want quality parts with a good upgrade path, not vendor lock-in.
I actually have a friend who has been screwed by this sort of thing more than once. He bought an HP computer back before the Compaq/HP merge. As he discovered gaming he also discovered that the system lacked an AGP port (the built in graphics card was, technically, AGP). So, he went out and bought a Dell (against my recommendations). It had a better built in graphics card, and the price was right (Dude, you're getting a cheap piece of junk). Once again, no AGP slot. He runs a fairly high end (as such things go) video card on PCI. Unsuprisingly, his video performance sucks.
Give me a beige box, which I built myself, any day of the week. I might run across a few hardware incompatabilities here and there, but that beats the hell out of finding myself without an upgrade path, because the vendor used cheap parts.
Necessity is the mother of invention.
Laziness is the father.
Don't forget to register for the Dell XPS 600 Renegade contest. It's Fueled by Fire!
"Halo obsessives are not IT managers..."
Except, of course, for the gamers who are IT managers. Duh? It's not so cut 'n' dried.
I understand that your list of priorities is set up like that, but Alienware built a successful business selling monstrously overpriced systems to gamers (and, oddly enough, businessmen who should really know better) with the primary lure of fancy cases, nice paint jobs and eXXXtreme marketing.
You are not the target market, and you probably don't even know anyone in the target market.
They ogle expensive, flashy machines ... and they buy expensive, flashy machines.
I'll take a beige case anyday! It's like how people think they're cars are flashier and better by placing stickers and adding snap-on car parts.
It's what's under the hood that counts!
The thing that Dell needs to do to sell themselves to gamers, is include NO bundled software in it. Gaming systems don't need AOL For Broadband, and RealPlayer, and Quicktime, and Adobe Reader 7.0, and Microsoft Office, etc.
Dell is avoided because their computers almost need to be formatted right after they are bought. No computer will run games well with that much bloatware installed.
FanFictionRecs.net
Yeah, gamers just love GNU/Linux. Did you even RTFH(eadline)?
I don't think I've ever met a gamer who hadn't built their own computer.
Please, for the good of Humanity, vote Obama.
Are there any Libertarians who do believe in socialism?
That's the joke actually. Many people are so woefully ignorant of divergent political stances that they don't understand the differences between the two. (i.e. Libertarians are just really radical right-wing nut jobs, a la free market... or Libertarians are just really radical Socialists, a la freedom in social situations).
It's supposed to ironic.
and the fact that you're acting like you're victimized when only one of your last 24 posts is moderated below the +2 you get by default for your karma bonus, and it's about Red Hat and not really economic at all
The -1 Flamebait bit is a swipe at the fact that I often see conservative political posts market Flamebait or Offtopic, and liberal political posts amrked Insightful or Interesting. Of course its going to happen in a peer review system populated with people who are more likely to be sympathetic to a more "left" cause than a "right" cause, but I don't believe that any system is above criticism.
FanFictionRecs.net
This pretty much goes along with what most people here are saying, but IMHO any PC, from ANY distributor/seller, is garbage. They all try to lock you into their line of products, and they almost always have tons of "amazing" (read: garbage) software.
...
... when you want your car fixed, you don't go to the guy who's got pimped out with NOS, and a spoiler bigger than the car sporting it! You always go the guy who's got the experience under his belt, someone whom you know is familiar with the territory. The flash is just for retards who want to "try" to look cool, and knowledgeable about computers, but I'm sure you're likely to find out they use AOL, and brag about their MySpace account and their bajillion friends!
I would also take any beige-case machine that I built myself, than the most flashy Dell/HP/Compaq/etc
In the past, the ONLY company I'd trust would be Alienware because their machines are renowned for being some of the best.
And for those who praise Dell for having decent high-end machines... well, you're full of it! The only thing Dell is good for is making the machine that your grandmother will use to break into the amazing world of emails!
And for those who think having a flashy PC from a "decent" distributor is cool, they're SOOO wrong
Losers!!!
I don't care how cheaply dell might sell something--their service is HORRIBLE!!! Trying to talk to someone on the phone is impossible--you just get put on hold for 30 minutes or cut off and then understanding them is not easy. The online support chat function is useless because they just direct you to call the help number. One of the computers at work had a bad hard drive--it was supposed to be next day support--it took a week. My dell laptop has an NVidia 6800GO which has video drivers that haven't been updated since November(5 months). Dell sucks!!!
To me, it's all about technical specs, and forget the flashy case.
I'd put that money towards a larger/more reliable power supply instead.
Of course, AMD CPU all the way. .
It seems to me that MonarchComputer has that title. Good experience with those guys, no markup on parts, just a small assembly fee ~ 150 which is way worth it given the time it takes me to do my own assembly and risk blowing it.
Now i'm not so sure about the rest of the gaming community.... But instead of oogling over an Alienware at a LAN we usualy make fun of the person who bought it.
:P
I even help run a LAN that has a secret prize we give away to one of the few that brings an alienware to the LAN.... a trashbag to cover the ugly stupid thing up with so he stops getting made fun of.....
I too handle Dell servers and desktops at work. What is proprietary you ask? Ok here is my experience:
1. Power supply. The Dell (at least Optiplex and Dimensions I've used) power supply is not standard. You cannot mount an off the shelf power supply because the power cord connector will be blocked by the Dell case.
2. Case connector. The connector that attaches to the motherboard for power switch, reset, speaker etc. is in one solid block which plugs directly into the motherboard. Now the ordering of connectors on the block will not plug into an off the shelf motherboard. So you are generally out of luck if you want to use a non-Dell motherboard with a Dell case. You CAN cut the block off and rewire seperate connectors to allow connection to a different motherboard, but it's hardly worth the effort.
3. Fan. The fan connector that plugs into the motherboard is not standard. Replacing the fan with an off the shelf generic one will not let you connect the fan connector to the Dell motherboard. This means that the Dell bios will think the fan has failed.
Small things, but things that mean replacing a cheap part (power supply, fan) will not be as simple as going to the store. Also a major upgrade such as a motherboard swap is more of a pain than it should be.
You are correct in that add in boards and drives are not proprietary but you may find that Dell skimps in some ways on their motherboards. For example, the mid range Optiplex computers have no AGP slot and no PCI Express X16 slot. So no way you can add in a video card, you are stuck with onboard. Also most Dell desktops have only 2 DIMM slots compared to 3 or 4 on most standard motherboards. You also will need to pay a bit more if you want to get say 1 512MB DIMM versus 2 256MB DIMMS - in order to leave a slot open for future expansion.
I have no problem will Dell's in the business environment. At least their business sales and support is excellent. As a home gaming system, there are much better (and cheaper) options.
Sometimes my arms bend back.
From a harocp article a few months ago, the Dell XPS 400 gamers rig wont run Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, Quake 4, or The Sims 2 because of conflicts with the bloatware.
After reading their out of the box experiences, and add in their additional customer support ordeal trying to remove the bloat, I think I will be staying away from dell and alienware for gaming purposes.
http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=OTI0LDEsLG hlbnRodXNpYXN0/
I would have to agree that Dell's premade machines do offer a good chunk of quality for the price, but the price starts to spiral out of controll once you reach a certain limit.
For example, If I were to make a system that would be used for little more than web surfing/MS office, then I would be hard pressed to beat dell in it's prices.
Once you start reaching beyond the 1k mark, where you start entering the realm of decent Comps with respectible hardware, Dell becomes less of a bargan and more of a liability. Once you go past 1.5k, It's no longer a compitition, building your own Comp will get you more bang for your buck.
People also need to understand that there are gamers out there, just as commited to thier games as any hardcore gamer, that just don't want to build thier own system. They either don't have the knowledge or just could care less about it. Instead, they would rather go to these premade places, buy a box, and be done with it.
The part that I don't understand is why they are so concerned about making "flashier" products for a customer base that is largely computer litterate and can see past the hype. I cannot picture myself, or many gamers, seeing these flashy boxes and buying them on that alone.
Then again, I do know some people who would spend 7k on an alienware pc, just to say they have it and do nothing with it but play solitare....
I'm not a "devoted" gamer, but I still build all of my own PCs to play games. When I set out to build my PCs, I want the latest & greatest that's currently available (and will pay top dollar for it) and allows for future expansion. The only Dell PCs I use are the ones my corporation provides me at the office. I have never seen a Dell computer with an Antec case and PS, Asus MOBO, Corsair RAM, WD 10K RPM SATA drives, and a pair of SLI or Crossfire cards.
:P
If you're that hardcore into gaming that you will spend the thousands for an Alienware or Dell PC, why not just buy all the parts over the internet from the cheapest retailers and build it yourself? Or maybe there is a significant difference between the gaming geeks and us hardware / overclocker geeks.
It's highly possible this is exactly why Dell bought Alienware. Dell (I hope) isn't so dumb as to simply buy another company for their brand. They also knew that what they were really buying was the expertise behind that brand.
In Repressive Burma, it's not just your connection that dies. slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=314547&cid=20819199
It works fine and all. Of course I put a dvdburner in and now everytime I startup the bios whines about the cdrom that dell sold me not being present. Oh well. Other than that it is rock solid most of the time. When I first bought it I had to completely reformat and install from scratch because the crap software that came preinstalled conflicted with my printer driver somehow and caused BSOD before startup finished.
yay
My next computer is an Apple.
The last time I ogled and bought an expensive flashy machine was back in 1998 and it was a Dell high end machine. Since that machine, I haven't bought another machine; instead I opted to build my own systems. Why? Because 1) I wanted to kill some weekend time with DIY projects, 2) The whole "AMD is not good enough" stance of Dell soured me on them, 3) It's morally reprehensible to pay $2000+ for a computer nowadays, and 4) I've out grown video games.
The moral of the story? Dell should stick to it's cash-cow markets (enterprises, governments, and schools).
-----
One is born into aristocracy, but mediocrity can only be achieved through hard work.
I haven't. I love gaming especially on the PC, but PC gaming is expensive as hell. Even those nice guides like the $500 "modern" gaming machine from Toms Hardware. Put it this way; if a person can't afford to buy a 360 and 1 game, they can't afford the $500+ PC system built for games either.
That begs the question do you think gamers who don't or can't build their own systems, are "gamers" at all? Rent, food, bills come first. After that I barely make any money at all for anything else. Honestly I carpool alot cause gas is insanely priced atm. If I can't spare the $30 to fill my car up, then it would take me a good year+ to save up even $500+ to build what is probably now, a bottom rung machine (comparing to more up to date hardware intense games like BF2 or Oblivion).
Would I go with a Dell? No. Sure they might be a few steps up from HP/Compaq but they still cut corners, vital corners. Would I go with an Alienware? Sure, if I could afford it. But then again if I could afford an Alienware, I could easily afford to build my own PC. Alienware builds nice machines but they exploit the consumer. It's one of those "they know that you know" ordeals; You as a gamer know you need a semi-beefy machine to at least play your games decently, Alienware knows this and they also know you're probably coming to them cause while you could afford it you might not know how to build one or don't want the hassle. So as such, as we all know, a machine that probably costs $1000 to build via Newegg or Pricewatch ends up being $1600+ from Alienware.
You'd be amazed at how good a console like the 360 or PS3 can look when they only cost around $300 (core 360 for example) while a gaming PC will run you at least $500+. I don't like consoles, sure Xbox Live is nice but hey, I already pay for broadband internet access, that right there should entitle me to free online play for many games (FPS's for example).
Aw Frell this
I don't trust Dell for my desktops yet. =/ Sorry, I've heard great reviews and have had bad experiences, personally, and places where I've worked.
eMachine > Dell and I can't figure out why! I'd prefer Dell, I'd like to suggest Dell, but in the end, well..
When their Sales Rep says that we need Media Center Edition + a Remote Control for a simple workstation that will NOT DO any type of sharing, local networking, microsoft networking, etc... because it's for work-at-home person, I can't even trust their Techs or Sales people.
Sorry Dell.
I'm reading hundreds of comments about how Dell sucks, such as:
* They bundle trialware crap preinstalled that you don't want.
* They use nonstandard components - eg: a strange power supply and BIOS.
* They use integrated non-upgradable components - eg: video card.
* They don't offer AMD processors.
But Apple does all of the above (yes, the default install of OSX has a trial edition of Quickbooks preinstalled) - and yet it's cool for the fanboys to be complaining about Dell and saying that they're moving to Apple. I guess they'll discover it for themselves if they make the jump.
I'll stick to building my own desktop machines, but my next notebook will be neither Apple or Dell (oddly it looks like Lenovo, the folks that used to make IBM Thinkpads, have the best price/performance at the moment).
"Rent, food, bills come first."
:P
:)
Not an avid PC gamer then
The real order is Rent (a place to put your pc), bills (need the power and interweb), PC hardware, Games (not free, but get in enough betas, and you can lower the costs a lil) then food.
As for the transport thing, walking is my prefered method, with the cost of fuel, vehicals are more expensive to run and maintain than my pc, and i know what i prefer to spend time with
...
This is about how Dell is trying to get into the business of PCs for gamers and has nothing to do with Apple. Who in their right mind buys an Apple to play games? If Apple had bought Alienware or was all of a sudden trying to sell their computers to gamers maybe you'd have a point. But all you're doing is pointing out that a company isn't making their computers for gamers when everyone knows that Apples aren't for gamers.
And are you serious about the trialware prebundled crap that comes with Dell in comparison to Apple? Dell is ridiculous and requires a reformat. With Apple you just toss the file in the recycling bin.
Apple fanboys can be annoying but some of you Apple bashers are just as bad, if not worse.
- "a company they believe understands them"
- "PC Giant"
- "market clout"
- "premium relationships"
- "first to market"
- "hottest technologies"
There are glowing reviews, there are biased reviews, there are paid ads masquerading as reviews, then there is this.I'm going to post a link to this story whenever Slate tries to say anything of importance from now on.
I almost threw up when I saw the 10k pricetag on the Dell, and Alienware's 7k quad SLI system wasn't that great either. I took it upon myself to price out all these components and show gamers that they can build a just as good system for $4500 in phases, with the core system just around $2000 if you don't get the huge processor and the 3 other video cards. This is the real way to do it!!!! http://www.destructoid.com/build-your-own-damn-qua d-sli-pc-for-60-less
Bascially, I get angry about video games daily on destructiod.com
" It's only cheaper if your time is worth nothing."
What if your time is worth a negative amount? If you find computer assembly entertaining and enjoyable, you're saving money both on the assembly and your recreational budget.
This factor is so much bigger that even if the price of the Dell machine and the homebuilt were very nearly the same, it would be a better deal to assemble it if you like that kind of thing. If you don't like that, the Dell machine will be better. There's no point arguing numbers.
The real issue is that Dell does not carry AMD based machines.
For the last three years AMD's FX and AMD64 based gaming machines have blown intel out of the water.
Dell simply failed to capitalize on this market by not shipping amd pc's.
Alienware is a too little too late move for DELL. Alienwares machines are insanely expensive when compared to a custom built rig. Sure, you get "support" but what self respecting gaming geek is not going to be able to support his own machine? The value is in the l33tness of the hardware and not in the "value-added" services that are offered by the company.
Dell's Gaming Ability may be growing with it's aquistion of Alienware, but when I was looking for a Gaming laptop about a month ago, I chose to go the route of Gateway over Dell. It has been my experience that Gateways service was much better than Dell and they didn't bundle as much "crap" with the computer itself. $1300 later I have a AMD 64 / 128 Radeon x600 / 1GB RAM / 100 GB HD. Runs all my games from WoW to F.E.A.R. and I dont have to deal with Dell's Foreign Customer support. For my money as a "semi-hardcore" gamer, Gateway was a much better value and in my opinion i got a better computer for the price.
They must have reduced it, because it's only $75 now. That's a really good deal.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of animals Chuck Norris allows to live.
They actually sold it to the company that owns the Washington Post. But I will give you that Slate posts some pretty silly stuff. That's what you get from elitist liberals without a cause, I suppose.
Build your own system it is easier and cheaper to upgrade. Nuf said.
If I'm not using my computer exclusively for gaming, I WANT the software you mentioned (except for AOL... ewwwww.). If I didn't have Quicktime, or Real, or Adobe preinstalled I'd probably be forced to install it myself at some point. What I don't want is the trial versions of image editing software, or financial managment software, or the isp listings, or the toolbars, and I don't want to pay extra for any of what's installed, including the useful stuff.
And I don't use a computer exclusively for gaming, because I see no point as an average user in having a seperate computer for websurfing and e-mails.
One has to look at the total picture to really appreciate this.
Alienware focuses on gamers:
-Neat and trim pre-installs
-Systems compatible with current games
-AMD Chips
-Standard or flashy cases
-Medium cost or extreme high cost, take your pick
The writers of the articles just blatantly miss the points.
All of this talk about "hardcore gamers want flashy systems" is just stupid. Hardcore gamers want clean, fast, easily upgraded systems. The flashy part comes last in that mix.
Until Dell offers clean gamer installs (which frankly make for better installs in general in my opinion, I detest bloatware) and AMD chips and standard components, they will remain the joke of the gaming world.
The Dell XPS isn't a gaming machine. It's a business machine with good PR. Dell insults gamers first by making a gameing line that will not run the most popular games and then by attempting to buy credibility.
If they just slap Alienware cases on the XPS line it will be simply embarassing for them.
Sure, lots of people make fun of Alienware buyers for paying for a system. But let's be honest, it's not a black and white topic. I build my own systems. But I also work 40 to 80 hours a week and I make good money. I've bought Alienwares before becaue I was at a point where I wanted a simple plug-n-play box with zero effort for geting an upgrade. Real life can be tiring sometimes, and if I have the money to buy one, that's just fine. I've bought from Falcon Northwest before too. (of the two, make no mistake, Falcon is by far the better system)
I'm currently building up a FX60 box from scratch and it's fun, but it's not like I have the free time to undertake these projects every time I want an upgrade. And what's the fun of a big paycheck if you won't treat yourself to some nice stuff sometimes. So for everyone making fun of people that buy systems I say "Wait'll yer 40 and have more money than free time and then come tell me how you feel about it".
If you have $4,500 for a computer you almost certainly have $10,000 for a computer, and part of the reason you are buying the computer is to show off your lavish and ultimately pointless expenditure of resources. If you were actually concerned just with good performance for your money, you could have gotten a $1,500 off-the-shelf Dell or put something together for somewhere in the low $1,000-1,400 range, which is the point at which the marginal-performance-improvement-per-dollar curve starts to plummet.
Help poke pirates in the eyepatch, arr.
Just wait until he starts talking about bringing back the gold standard, and private militias, it's too bad we don't have a -1 Bat Shit Insane mod.
If you build it, nerds will come. Soylentnews.org