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Plasma: The Next-Generation KDE Environment Review
slashy writes, "MadPenguin has taken a quick look at Plasma, the next gen. KDE environment. 'Plasma is an ambitious project being pursued by the KDE 4 team which aims at providing a workflow-sensitive design of the user interface that improves productivity of an average KDE user. The focus is on improving the clarity and reducing the clutter present in today's desktops. The plasma development will bring together key contributors, such as the visual artists, usability experts, technology experts, programmers, and enthusiasts at a very early stage during the development process. This will enable them to create a new desktop environment that meets the requirements of novices and experts alike.'"
Having said that, I have found that most people will clutter their desktops regardless of what the software tries to do. Remember XP's desktop cleanup wizard, which attempted to help people remove things from their desktops that they didn't use often? I still see the majority of people with hundreds of icons and files haphazardly arranged. When I helped my friend migrate to Linux, it only took him a week to turn KDE into an icon pile. Add Firefox into the mix, which drops downloads onto the desktop by default, and the battle is completely lost.
Palm trees and 8
A quick look is somewhat understating the review - not a single screenshot and 8 paragraphs of next-to-nothing except what "will" or "should" be in Plasma.
Useful content: 1%
Like the "Buy a Link Now" on the article itself... I think someone just bought themselves a link from Slashdot.
I can't get to the article (naturally), but the summary looks like a bunch of marketspeak buzzwords. The summary seems to be a whole lot of "whats" and not a shred of "hows". Has anyone actually been able to RTFA and see if there is any actual content, or just a bunch of empty promises?
The desktop will no more be a static entity with a fixed set of icons. Your desktop will be capable of providing different kinds of items and services as and when you need them.
Active desktop?
Which, in many ways, is a rip-off of OS X.
amen to that.. we should ditch X-windows altogether. there's really no demanding need, at least in the linux world, for X-windows. sure, one could argue that it's a must in thin-client setups, but the overwhelming majority of linux boxes are not thin clients.
I fall into the former. I think it's a pain when you see some cool feature or eyecandy or whatever appearing in the desktop environment you aren't using... but it isn't enough to make you totally switch your current desktop. And just when you do go and switch, your old environment will come out with some sweet feature and you're back to square one.
i realize it's a complicated issue, and neither KDE nor Gnome is about to fold and allow the other to take precidence... but I still look forward to the day when everyone is working towards a common goal, and when a new user interface element is implemented, everybody can benefit from it.
The K Desktop Environment Environment, you say?
Poor poor CMS, the "article" is just some text, full c&p below:
It has hardly been a few weeks since the release of KDE v3.5.4, one of the most popular desktop environments for Unix/Linux/FreeBSD operating systems, and the KDE development team is already hard at work. They have a dream of revolutionizing the concept of desktop by providing an array of innovative features aimed at improving both the looks of the desktop environment as well as the productivity of end users. In this article, we will look at one such component called Plasma that promises to change the look and feel of a conventional desktop.
Plasma is an ambitious project being pursued by the KDE 4 team which aims at providing a workflow sensitive design of the user interface that improves productivity of an average KDE user. The focus is on improving the clarity and reducing the clutter present in today's desktops. The plasma development will bring together key contributors, such as the visual artists, usability experts, technology experts, programmers and enthusiasts at a very early stage during the development process. This will enable them to create a new desktop environment that meets the requirements of novice and experts alike.
One of the immediate goals of plasma is to provide a better looking desktop. The team is cashing in on the improved graphic capabilities of X server (namely COMPOSITE) and Trolltech's Qt application programming interfaces (APIs) to mesmerize you with those stunning looks. Although a great looking desktop will be a welcome step, the KDE team is not assuming that everyone will have the latest version of X server installed. Thus, care is being taken not to make such looks integral to the functioning of the system. Plasma is being designed in such a way that even people with older versions of X server will be able to effectively use their desktops without the unnecessary frills.
Plasma will be divided into four distinct components. They are:
- Desktop: In plasma, the role of the desktop will be much more than a place where one keeps beautiful looking icons and immediately required files. In fact, it will be a place for the user and the computer to interact with each other. The desktop will no more be a static entity with a fixed set of icons. Your desktop will be capable of providing different kinds of items and services as and when you need them.
- Applet: Applets are small programs, such as clocks, weather notification and application launchers (to name a few) that will help you better manage your work. The aim of the plasma team is to make them easy to develop as well as easy to distribute. They can be authored in a plethora of languages including C/C++, Java, Python and Ruby. The team is currently in the process of developing the Application Programming Interfaces (APIs) that will expose the functionality of libplasma library. After developing the applets, they have to be packaged together with all the artwork, HTML and other resource files into a single archive file. This archive file can then easily be distributed over the Internet.
- Panels: Panels are basically containers for other plasma element. They will be responsible for providing a way to connect applets together.
- Extenders: Extender is a standard graphic element that provides a plasma element to temporarily grow in size (through some sort of animation) and reveal a larger usable space whenever one clicks or hovers over them. This helps to group related widgets that need not be visible all the time and take up important desktop space. Instead, whenever the user invokes them by means of clicking or hovering, the extender provides a mechanism to reveal the extra information.
The KDE 4 desktop aims at revolutionizing the concept of a desktop by providing not only an eye-candy look but also a workflow sensitive design. With full support for newer frameworks such as KHotNewStuffs , it will become extremely easy for applications based on KDE to search and download new plugins, extensions and updates from the Internet. According to Zack Rusin, a prominent KDE developer, "Plasma will blow you away. Nothing you've ever seen or will see in the coming years will come even close to what you'll experience with Plasma. And that's a promise." We agree.
I thought the whole idea of personal computers was to allow people to work they way they wanted to?
You may like clean desktops while others like cluttered desktops.
Let's start a holy war over how many icons can dance on a screen.
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
http://www.mirrordot.org/stories/253c28d1a4b1d6d7b a107421629ff464/index.html
So KDE is turning into Gnome?
And do what differently?
Care to point out some deficiency in the X codebase?
LL
Yeah, let's replace it with DirectX running under Wine.
The average user can't figure out how to organize their *own* desktop to accomodate their workflow better than "this pile of icons is for this, that pile of icons is for that", and these guys are going to come along and have the *computer* decide what's best?
Sheesh, have we learned nothing from Microsoft? Having the computer decide what things a user can interact with and how the user can interact with them based on a set of hidden, unchangeable rules is counter-productive at best; at times, it can be murderous-rage inducing.
How about we actually help people become better-organized by, oh, I don't know...teaching them some useful organizational skills?!
Insisting on "correct" English is like saying that there is only one, definitive recipe for chili.
stupid config file?
My list now consists of one things:
That would be super!
:wq
... which aims at providing a workflow-sensitive design of the user interface that improves productivity of an average KDE user
My experience with both Windows and OS X is that anytime the OS tries to "help" me it makes life more difficult.
For me the holy grail of desktop design is one that allows me to place what I want, where I want on the desk top and have it remain exactly where I put it.
Even better, when I switch from the 12" laptop to the big flat screen on my desk, allow me two desktop settings that make best use of the different real estate available.
OS X widgets seem like great idea, but I find that the need to pop up or drop into the widget level, and then wait for the actual widgets to load up and begin functioning is a pain in the butt. I'd rather have things like calculators or weather or currency converters right on the desktop and immediately available.
Apple's solution just seems to add more clicks and more time to do routine tasks.
If KDE goes the route of trying to guess what I want, please give me the option of turning that guessing game off.
Three Squirrels
That's an implementation detail.
Assuming you are talking about the Xorg server, it's going away for X11R7.3, hopefully.
It's called dsywindows.
"When I wake up in the morning I piss cryptographic excellence." - Bruce Schneier
Honestly. I'm looking for a good Plasma TV and I thought they were going to talk about the next generation of Plasma TVs. I'm thinking of getting a 42" Panasonic.
And do what differently?
Make it always display Pretty Pink Ponies.
Care to point out some deficiency in the X codebase?
I'm living in the past
I thought the same thing...until I read the rest of the subject line... :-/
Wow. Jaded much?
If you seriously read the title of this article and thought it was about tvs then perhaps you don't belong at a news for nerds site.
This is GNU/Linux we're talking about, after all :-)
Meta will eat itself
Most of the above posts are entirely off. Plasma won't "do things for you" and get in the way.
I'm very excited about KDE4!
Vlad
I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume your problem is with the xfree86 server implementation, which is being replaced by the xorg implementation by pretty much everyone. You *have* heard of it, neh?
I agree whole heartedly with the parent. To add my $.02 I believe the competetion is great because when one team comes up with SuperSnazzyFeature2.0 the other team recognizes it as a great idea and implements it. Would be ashamed if everyone was working on one project and SuperSnazzyFeature0.3beta was killed because too many team members rejected the idea.
We have to re-invent ideas between the two desktops but they make great proving grounds for new UI adjustments.
I went to eat some animal crackers and the box said, "Do not eat if seal is broken." I opened the box and sure enough..
http://www.madpenguin.org.nyud.net:8090/cms/?m=sho w&id=7553
Really, this should be default when posting a story... or automated or something. No it's not responding yet but it iwll eventually.
-- Note: If you don't agree with me, don't bother replying. I won't read it.
we should ditch X-windows altogether. there's really no demanding need, at least in the linux world, for X-windows. sure, one could argue that it's a must in thin-client setups, but the overwhelming majority of linux boxes are not thin clients.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. X is being overhauled as we speak (modularization, GLX implementations, etc), but one thing that is staying is the client/server architecture of X. There is nothing wrong with the way it works on a local computer, and it has the added benefit of being able to work across a network. A myth in the FOSS world is that the client/server architecture of X is one of the biggest problems with Unix.
Time makes more converts than reason
Plasma is overpriced; a real nerd would get a 119' 1080p projector!
But I think you're right, we do need a clean up. I've never used your computer, and really see no demand for it. I propose we ditch it.
Back then we had a drinking game where we sat with mugs waiting in front of the TV while Star Trek:TNG was showing. We would toss our mags back as soon as we heard the word Plasma, or whenever we saw Jean-Luc straighten his uniform.
I think I'm going off KDE.
It's nice on a fast machine, but tediously slow on anything under 2GHz. I do like Window Maker. It's a bit different than you probably were expecting, but I think it's a bit truer to what X used to be like before everyone started trying to turn it into Windows.
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
Here they are, talking about using things from the latest version of X server, various APIs, etc. to achieve the visual effects they want. But there is no mention of XGL! XGL has so much to offer in the realm of visual effects, I think it would just be stupid if they don't even have an option in the installer to install an XGL version.
This is not a sig. This is a llama-duck. Quack.
My solution in Windows was to give myself read-only access to my desktop folder. After the first few access denied messages it became habit to put stuff somewhere besides the desktop.
I don't always use unix-like operating systems; but when I do, I prefer FreeBSD.
Get a graphics card (or 2), and attach two screens to your compu :) Now use either a nice mouse util that let's you switch the input, or use 2 mice (mouses)!
Oh. And of course I don't have to explain that you attach gnome to one desktop and KDE to the other, do I?
Coz eternity my friend, is a long *ing time.
I'm not sure if you're just trolling or haven't followed *nix desktop development. But there is a really cool 3d-desktop called xgl based on opengl
See here: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xgl
"People who are willing to sacrifice essential freedoms for security deserve neither freedom nor security."
B F
Hmm, searching Google doesn't yield much of anything either. Some blog mentioned the "lack of information" on Plasma, and an image search only turns up a few pages. The best page I found is written in Czech (I think).
But aside from that, I think it's probably a good idea to mention Gnome ToPaZ (AKA TPZ, or Three Point Zero). I think it was originally supposed to be a plan from Gnome 3.0, but it's turned more into a brainstorming session for a "next-generation" desktop. Some of the ideas on that page are pretty lawl-tastic, but one very cool one is "lowfat". I strongly suggest checking out the video.
anyone know if it runs on linux?
echo $SIGNATURE
http://honeybrown.ca/Pubs/BumpTop.html
The whole concept of plasma is still in the design phase. I was pretty amazed someone managed to get a review of something that hasn't got a GUI yet. The 'plasma' folder in KDE SVN consists of data-handling classes only. I'd rather trust the lead developer (Aaron Seigo, aseigo.blogspot) to provide the first sneak preview of plasma rather then MadPenguin.
The best way to accelerate a windows server is by 9.81 m/s2
If I can change the new workflow to point up my ass, at least I could get an enema from this new change to KDE!
Nothing like a plasma enema to make you feel fresh!
Posted anonymous, because I referenced enemas and ass in this post.
Where is GNU/Clippy?
Gnu/Clippy: It appears you are trying to run Gnome?
If so, please bash your head against the monitor until you are dead.
Was this not helpful?
I only look human.
My mother is a halfling and my dad is an ogre, so that makes me an Ogreling
Not to start a debate but as it is my understanding KDE has been for a more "eye-candy" look and Gnome for a more "clean-minimalist" look. I am one of those minimalist types when it comes to the GUI-OS interface. I used Gnome for years on BSD then in Slackware. When Pat dropped Gnome (understand the build issues) I started using KDE with much fuss due to the "clutter". I have hense learned the finer points of advance customization of KDE in much the same way as I had Gnome. And that is my point.. When the KDE crew builds a new UI as long as they maintain advanced user customizable features go for it, it is a good thing. Like any Linux flavor the UI should be customizable in all regards. That is, as many here know one of its appealing aspects.
http://appeal.kde.org/wiki/Appeal
If you use Ruby, check out http://appeal.kde.org/wiki/Korundum
tomorrow who's gonna fuss
I don't know about anyone else, but I find myself frustrated by the poor network performance. SSH doesn't compress it well, and applications like the ones based on Mozilla make so damned many X calls (and so many pixmaps!) that trying to use any of my common applications over an SSH tunnel quickly slows to uselessness.
X11 is great. it does everything. It works extremely well on local sockets. Hell, I don't think I'd use anything else - if there was anything else to use.
But X has gotten too big for networking. Either we need an X12 protocol that is more light-weight or things like Mozilla and Evolution need to slim the fuck DOWN.
(I have further complaints about Firefox's poor performance, QT's excessive pretty-ification, and Evolution's and KDE's memory-inefficiency, but that's for another discussion. And wow, that KDE4 review was... pointless.)
grey wolf
LET FORTRAN DIE!
Fonts, cut & paste, printing. Would be a good start.
Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
Have you ever programmed with X?
I mean, not with QT, or GTK, or some toolkit, but actually with X?
It takes ~200 lines of code just to get a reasonable hello world program.
Some X functions take like a 9 or 10 arguments, all of which are crusty old structs where you might only care about one or two values-- at most.
That should be your first clue that something is wrong.
Some more clues will occur to you when you realize the amazing amount of useless stuff that was put in back when color displays were exotic rarities. Things like 8-bit b&w bitmaps for dithering. The bizzaro font and rendering models. The lack of useful drawing primitives.
Seriously, someone should redo X with a more modern focus. And then write some backends for all the toolkits. Really, what you want for something like X is an object-oriented language like C++. (Of course, there should definitely be some kind of plain-old-C interface exported.)
More likey, though, people will continue to evolve the code we already have.
"Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental." -Slashdot
http://www.madpenguin.org.nyud.net:8090/cms/?m=sho w&id=7553
We're working on that but there have been some problems, we are sorry for any inconvenience this may have caused you.
The KMechanical arm is able to access your RAM chips but all the credit cards in your KWallet have been maxed out so we've been unable to purchase new RAM chips for you.
Please help us help you by putting a valid credit card into your KWallet so we can proceed with the purchase.
Thank you for your time and consideration. We're glad you've chosen to fly KDE. Have a nice day.
We don't see the world as it is, we see it as we are.
-- Anais Nin
It really tells some details. And BTW... MIRROR anyone?
Which is why so many programmers use higher level functions and libraries rather than the base system. Most of the code you are comlpaining about has nothing to do with the X architecture and changing anything else won't be seen by the users, only the developers. Who would have a mammoth task.
You gonna help?
PS Yes, I have written X programs and it was OK.
PPS what about where you don't have a 24-bit display? OR don't want to waste bandwidth on unneeded colour?
Actually even XGL won't be needed after a while, aiGLX is already integrated into the newest(7.1) Xorg and supports all the same effects without the drawbacks of XGL(lack of xinerama support for instance). It works currently if you have a opengl capable card with open drivers, otherwise you'll have to wait 'till nvidia/ati release drivers with the right extensions. nVidia's drivers should be released this month, though.
Try NX.
Don't take me wrong, I belive plasma will be great, I want to some presentations from Aaron Seigo and liked what he said... but I DOUBT it will launch with KDE4. Probally the interface will still (mostly) be the one used on KDE3. You know, we should learn from Microsoft mistakes, they ditched a lot of things (WinFS, most of interface, etc) from Vista because changing a lot of code at once isn't a good thing (TM).
There will be always be a 4.1 or 4.2 release where the new interface can be inserted.
I wholeheartedly disagree with that. I use "ssh -X" to connect to X displays on Linux and Solaris boxes on an almost daily basis - and they're desktop systems, not part of some big thin-client setup. I'm sure I'm not the only person who notices that X gives better performance than VNC on some networks.
Follow me
You mean, the clutter found in KDE? If you compare the preferences tools (for example) in KDE and GNOME, KDE has about nine trillion more widgets per window.
This is like Microsoft starting an initiative to reduce anticompetitive behavior.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
http://pepper.idge.net/disaster.html
I don't need to test my programs.. I have an error correcting modem.
Yes but does it run on Windows?
Since the Qt4 license is less restrictive it shouldn`t be a problem...right?
I am the unwilling control for my Origin.
How about getting X to release pixmaps properly? See http://people.redhat.com/berrange/olpc/performance /epiphany/ for details.
I hope you're joking considering how old and outdated your reference is. I have a copy of the UNIX haters handbook and it's funny how most of the issues outlined in it have long since been fixed and a lot of the other ones are a joke.
Time makes more converts than reason
Dammit, an educated person on slashdot who actually reads thing? go back to where you came from!!... :P
I don't need to test my programs.. I have an error correcting modem.
Vista is coming down the pipe... and it includes a "Downloads" directory in the user's directory (which is pretty much like the /home/user directory in Linux) by default... and IE is set to download to it by default.
I'm sure that Firefox will similarly be set to download to it by default by the time Vista comes out.
The whole restructuring of the User directories in Windows is one of the best improvements in Vista... by default you get: Contacts, Desktop, Documents, Downloads, Favorites, Links, Music, Pictures, Saved Games, Searches and Videos... which will all go a long way towards helping people deal with the clutter. If apps are set to use these folders by default then I predict things will improve...
Friedmud
Have you ever programmed with X?
:-)
I mean, not with QT, or GTK, or some toolkit, but actually with X?
I presume you're asking if anyone's programmed using Xlib directly ("X" is an alternative term for the X Window System, or possibly the "X" Protocol). Yeah, I wrote a simple Mandelbrot generator with it for educational purposes when I was first learning about X11, back in 1994 or so. It was instructive (taught me about event-driven programming and how to write an event loop), but the next thing I did was learn Motif (which I won't try to defend here
If you're not actually trolling, your example is really, really, stupid. Nobody writes real applications using Xlib directly, just like nobody would write a Windows app using only the GDI.
Seriously, someone should redo X with a more modern focus.
Okay, so you are just trolling. X is being continually redone with a modern focus - that's what X extensions are for. You get nice things like Fontconfig, GLX, compositing, etc. for free when you use a toolkit such as KDE or Gnome, which are quite capable of taking advantage of such extensions.
You think you can do better? Put up or shut up. People have tried and failed - ever heard of Y-Windows or Berlin? So good luck to you. Meanwhile I'll happily continue to use something I know works just fine.
Can it do non-rectangular windows yet? That's a fairly serious limitation for doing clever stuff with windows.
Ever used xeyes? It even comes with the X distrbution, and is built and installed by default (in the monolithic package). It was written around 1988. I am not sure when the SHAPE extension came about but it has existed for at least 10 years now.
LL