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Will Microsoft Put The Colonel in the Kernel?
theodp writes "The kernel meets The Colonel in a just-published Microsoft patent application for an Advertising Services Architecture, which delivers targeted advertising as 'part of the OS.' Microsoft, who once teamed with law enforcement to protect consumers from unwanted advertising, goes on to boast that the invention can 'take steps to verify ad consumption,' be used to block ads from competitors, and even sneak a peek at 'user document files, user e-mail files, user music files, downloaded podcasts, computer settings, [and] computer status messages' to deliver more tightly targeted ads."
[paranoia] Wonder when you'll be downloading this important security update from Microsoft? [/paranoia]
This seems like something that would be useful to have a free home desktop OS. I bet they patented it just to keep some Linux distro from doing it.
Does this in any way relate to KFC... i nearly ditched linux got vista so that Colonel would get me some fried Chicken!! Then I read the story.... Damn it makes me hungry!
Microsoft has realized that protecting consumers and selling high quality products are not ways they can make money any longer. Getting in bed with corporations and ad agencies and selling out the customer is looking to become much more profitable for them.
What really scares me is that for this to be successful, without some type of backlash from the user community, it would have to be forced on us. As in, forced so you could no longer install another operating system on your computer. Perhaps this is there for when they sue Linux out of oblivion, or at least try to. Otherwise, who would ever use another Microsoft product.
Then again, the data collected from such an endeavor would be so valuable, Microsoft could market computers for free with this software installed. Perhaps that the only other way this is successful.
i think i speak for everyone when i say "what the fuck??" when did OPERATING SYSTEMS become billboards? so when the next MS OS comes out, instead of everyone looking for activation cracks they'll be looking first for how the hell to get the adds off of their desktop? asking people to view shit at the bottom of msn messenger is one thing, but there is a line.
My limits finally being hit.
After swearing it off since my disaster with RedHat 4, I now know I am going to make the effort to explore Linux again. My email, browsing and documents are mine, and if the OS is capable of poking through them to advance the interests and profits of someone else, then the party is over. I can't trust them when they say they'd never do that; if the capability exists, it will get used at some point in time. I'll keep a windows box for gaming, but not much else, and certainly not any accurate identifable personal information.
...which delivers targeted advertising as 'part of the OS.'...
So, I guess this officially makes Microsoft Windows adware/spyware. I wonder if Spybot and Adaware will now remove Windows as part of it's run-through. One can certainly hope so.
When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
That's the end of it for me. I'll never again knowingly purchase a Microsoft operating system. This is just unbelievable arrogance.
It's MY f***ing computer! I paid for it! I don't want ANY part of it working to show me any more ads than I already have to put up with.
Control is worth more than convenience, and it's usually much more satisfying.
The trollish submitter demonizes Microsoft, saying that "[Microsoft] goes on to boast that the invention can 'take steps to verify ad consumption,' be used to block ads from competitors, and even sneak a peek at 'user document files, user e-mail files, user music files, downloaded podcasts, computer settings, [and] computer status messages' to deliver more tightly targeted ads."
But Google does ALL this when you use their services. What's the big difference between using a web app and a local app?
I'm not sure about the legality of Claim 11... I'm not an ambulance-chaser, but it'd seem that retrieving "user document files, user email, user music files, podcast files, computer status messages, and a profile database storing existing tag data" without our consent/knowledge would be prosecutable...
Don't tell me to get a life. I'm a gamer; I have LOTS of lives!
You do not understand the difference between an application and an operating system. Please stop posting.
Everyone who wants to see Microsoft's hold on our industry diminish should strongly encourage Ballmer and the rest of his numbskulls to pursue this plan with all possible speed.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Isn't this type of thing covered in GPLv3?
Though I think the difference is fairly obvious: Google is an optional service for 100% of the computer using market. Using Microsoft Windows is not so optional for ~90% of the market.
I can't imagine that very many companies will be able to subsidize Windows Vista 2020 licenses through advertising, whereas MS can reap substantial profits from doing so, especially as they continue to move the computer from the desktop into the living room.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
First MS decided to start distributing spyware with the OS when they created WGA. And now they want to top that off by including adware as well?
I'll have to tell my grand kids about how when I was young the corporations didn't track my bowel movements via satellite uplinked anal probe, they had hide in the sewer and count them one by one as they floated by. "That was good honest work Jr" I'll say, "real work done by real men ,down in the stink with their own two hands. Ah how I longed to be a Terdcountsman myself one day." I'll wax mournfully, just the hint of a tear glimmering in the corner of my eye. "Such a time I would have had counting the peanuts. But Jr, such honorable work is gone from the world now. Maybe you should go into marketing?" sigh ...
Much more entertaining than our grandfathers' tales of newspaper shoes. Maybe it's getting to be time to move to a mountain top and grow that beard I've always wanted.
to fight Google.
You see, they look at Google and do not get jealous of Google's achievements per se, they get jealous of Google's revenue streams and hence are attacking the revenue stream (advertising) without adding value to the consumer.
Now, you may argue that this bloatware will make the OS cheaper, but what I think will likely happen over the long run (if this ever goes through) is that the cheapest OS will cost the same and people will have to buy a "premium" version to avoid the ads. If people complain, Microsoft will point out that they got the ad-supported version "free" with the OEM computer (while not mentioning the OEM also paid for that copy).
The only reason Microsoft still has any customers is because most of the computer-using world is locked into using their products by default. If Microsoft were just starting out today, they'd never get anywhere with priorities like this. Hell, if you could go back to zero and start the computer industry all over again in the present day, they still wouldn't get anywhere.
Microsoft cares about the satisfaction of whomsoever has paid it the largest sum of money recently, not their end users. I truly hope this will motivate a large amount of complacent Windows users to change, but if history has taught us anything, that's not likely.
... Wholly big brother Batman!
Windows has been a virtual billboard since IE 4/Windows 98. Remember the advertiser-branded Channel Bar and IE logos in every corner?
When I first heard the name "Windows Genuine Advantage," I thought, "hey, great; I've finally got an advantage over those smug Mac OS X and LInux users!" Then, of course, came the awful truth.
When I first heard the name "Trusted Computing," I thought, "hey, great; does this, like, mean I can make clicky-clicky on links in the sketchiest of web pages without gasping in shock at the horrors of pathological proctology?" Then, of course, came the awful truth.
This evening, upon reading the name "Advertising Services Architecture," I thought, "hey, great; is this a cool new enabling technology that will this help me sell more stuff and make more money on eBay?" Then, yet again, came the awful truth, as pointed out in the link to this article.
As far as I know, these are but three of the 100 reasons I'll be speechless for Microsoft Vista. Or saying "Wow!" But: Is there some context in the English language in which "Wow!" means "I've got an axe buried in my head?" (Being speechless does, after all, seem to be an appropriate response to such trauma, and so I was trying to make the connection between the two.) Because after all the all the aforementioned truths, after finding out that this vast infrastructure for which I'm paying has nothing to do whatsoever with that for which I want to use a computer, well, that's kind of what I imagine it feels like.
Those who can, do. Those who can't, write technology blogs.
Update: Sorry, the Sentinel article has apparently been achived and the link works no more. And welcome to the PlasticBag readers; you guys have made a month worth of traffic in one day.
put it in the bit bucket
I always wondered why both words sound the same although they look completely different.
If this
1) Gets granted
2) Gets implemented
Then Microsoft can expect some BIG problems in parts of Eruope.
Knowlingly putting stuff like this on a Computer and sending private data to some server somewhere is in breach of the Computer Misuse Act (UK)
There are copious laws in Gemany & France as well as the UK which should stop Microsoft from implemeting this.
We Europeans take Compute Privacy pretty seriously.
So, If as reported this gets implemented in a way that the user can't control (Make a positive decision to Allow it) then they will be in deep do-do with the bouys in Blue.
So as not to appear totally -ve towards Microsoft,
I suppose they could sell some "Spyware Riddled" vesion of Vista for half the price of the current one.
OR (as more likely)
All OEM versions used by the likes of Dell, HP etc etc (I'm not deliverately targeting Dell or HP) will be shipped with this stuff installed by default.
Personally, I find the whole concelt of this totally offensive. Soory M$. This should be consigned to the great incinerator in the sky and NOT the Recycle Bin.
Just my 0.02p worth.
See OSDavid
From the third link down: "OSdavid is a free and open-source, advertising supported Desktop-Linux Operating ..."
This should be interesting.
I've never had front row tickets to a company suicide before...
Wait, microsoft has a kernel now?
A cat can't teach a dog to bark.
we tell google where we want to eat
we tell google where we go on vacation
we tell google when we are sick
we tell google where we work and want to go to school
we tell google what movies we want to see
we tell google what words we have diffoculty spelling
we tell google where we live
we let google read our mail
we let google give us ads
but...
we don't tell MS a darn thing
we don't want to tell MS anything
we don't need to tell MS anything
MS is Jealous of our relationship with google
this drive EVERY sick thing MS does do to stalk us.
Personally, I relish the vision of Balmer working as a shipping clerk in the warehouse of an office furniture distributor. And Gates? Is it too much, to hope that when MS goes belly up he has to work as a medical tape tester? Wrapping and rewrapping his spectacle frames to pay the mortgage on his billion dollar playhouse? That's gotta be good for a several millenia of regret.
EOM
what do you think of when you hear the word advertiser? Someone who paid money to get their message put out? Someone who is trying to increase demand for their product? Or someone who wishes to inform its potential consumers about why their product is right for them? The first two don't require any targeting and really are not that effective. They depend on making consumers, this requires forcing people to change their mind about a product or service. If you can identify people who would use your product if they knew about it, currently this is done in a similar manner to a shot gun where by you reach as many people as you can. Only a fraction of these people are interested since they too often see things that are uninteresting so they tune it out. Of the people who have yet to realize that ads are poorly targeted thus riveted to their seat in anticipation of the next product to discover only a fraction will be interested yet you will still have to pay for the "impression" good or bad. Targeted advertising eliminates both problems, first more relevant products are shown to you and you remain interested because the gain to be had at a wonderful discovery will out weigh the cost of time spent "searching" for that new exciting thing you have yet to find out about. If done carefully they will not alienate targets who will avoid this altogether. Google has managed to do this for a surprising amount of time. Just think first they know all the web sites then they know what you are looking for and finally through their network of ad toting sites they know where you go and how deep into the site you go. Its no secret either they have the processing power to troll for use full tid bits. I would rather be sold a dozen use full products that I actually wanted in turn for quality service. Now it goes both ways I need good product information AND good service to patronize their digital market. As a corporation they have consumers in their services and stock and an obligation to serve both by providing one with use full services and the other with the profit of their work.
the poor users are the "product" that microsoft deliver to the customers...
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
The Microsoft Election Services Architecture!!!
Candidates are already signing up for the beta.
"To those who are overly cautious, everything is impossible. "
I would imagine this would be either implemented in embedded devices for public terminals or that sort of thing, or perhaps for cheap/free versions of Windows/Office for the developing areas of the world, like the 'Starter Edition'. You know, here have a free ad supported OS and software, then when you don't want the ads you have to pay $699 for ad free version.
I seriously doubt even MS would put this in the mainstream paid for consumer OS.
Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
Windows is already a giant bug capable of spying on users activities. This is why governments love it so much: they need a tool like that and Microsoft gets tons of money to keep it functional under government control.
The biggest reason to switch to Open Source Software is not about stability, no fees or paying less, but about being able to discredit the above sentence as a pile of crap coming out from a conspiracy theory nutjob, which is another kind of security closed source cannot give.
Wow. Quite a few belligerent posts. Microsoft has a lot of patents. No one knows how or even if this will be implemented. Microsoft is less than perfect but FUD goes both ways. I expect nothing less from posters who don't understand the difference between publishing and assigning in Active Directory. I dumped Novel years ago. I haven't regretted it for one second. Goodbye karma.
I don't think MS will use this at all, this is purely patent trolling against Google. Why? Think about it, if Google made an OS, they'd put ads with it as well to make the OS free like all their other products. MS patenting this ensures that Google can't use this idea, unless they find a loophole in the application. Will this stop Google from supporting an OS? I hope not, I really want MS to finally get some strong competition.
An OS that watches you and markets products to you... far off ?
...
A TV station that markets to you during your favorite program
Advertisements that come inserted into your bills
You are required, at your place of employment to endure compulsory marketing.
What's next, tatoos in the inside of eyelids when you're born?
In the world of marketing it seems there are no bad ideas. Overstep boundaries, go to far, garner enough negative attention and you're still golden. It's about brand recognition, not about stimulating support for a product.
Personally I've become revolted by all forms of marketing. I'm "turned off and tuned out"... to paraphrase what I feel.
I'm waiting for a consumer revolution in a world of sheep.
It's true no man is an island, but if you take a bunch of dead guys and tie 'em together, they make a good raft.
Shell has begun the thoroughly annoying practice of placing a video monitor above its pumps that blare commercials at its customers (except for an all-too-brief Conan clip) while they refuel their cars. You're a captive audience. Where are you going to go? They've got you.
Meanwhile, does watching that commercial subsidize the cost of your fuel? None at all.
I realize that what holds true for Shell may not necessarily hold true for Microsoft. But I somehow find it perfectly reasonable to think so.
Those who can, do. Those who can't, write technology blogs.
Since when did anyone think Windows was anything other than an ad platform for Microsoft and its business partners? Damn Windows users, quit being so naive! Why do you think Windows security has never and will never be fixed? All virus and spyware vectors into Windows are there primarily to allow Windows to be used for a sales platform, doesn't matter to Microsoft that these paths also allow for easy malicious sofware infection as well.. duh. Windows is crapware designed to sell products to the clueless masses; get over it.
That's it I've had it. I'm just gonna start answering every rhetorical question asked by Slashdot.
OSGGFG - Open Source Gamers Guide to Free Games
This is comment by manjusha
Through rose tinted spectacles, it could be that MS might only plan use this patent to stop anyone else doing it - for example by providing MS with a cause for action against anyone providing a root kit to do the same - and maybe providing a cause for action against anyone advertising in that way. I would hope that this is what this is about.
This is reply by aenoxi
"The sum of all knowledge does not imply the knowledge of all sums" Kurt Gödel (paraphrased)
Just when I think Microsoft can't get any more evil, I run into something like this. \o/
I'm going to cheer on Ballmer and the rest of the crew at Microsoft if they decide to implement this. That, and I want them to turn up the knob to 11 for OGA and WGA. Advertize at the lusers, and make them pay to get it.
The Microsoft employee who thought this up deserves a promotion and a raise in pay.
I'm waiting for them to "monetize the eschaton"
"Crowley had been extremely impressed with the warranties offered by the computer industry, and had in fact sent a bundle Below to the department that drew up the Immortal Soul agreements, with a yellow memo form attached just saying: "Learn, guys.""
-- Terry Pratchett & Neil Gaiman, Good Omens
--
BMO
I wonder if Microsoft is busy abandoning the software business.
First we get Vista, with a reported 20+ services phoning home with enough detail to make what Redmond get personally identifiable, not to mention that the Business version in my experience is an absolute dog to run compared to XP or Linux on the same "Vista approved" hardware. So we have instant privacy and security problems that come with the package, and new code which will take another year to become actually safe and usable (cute visuals do not maketh a usable business OS, especially if you have to retrain everyone - might as well take the plunge and retrain them on Macs or Linux).
Then we get the latest Office, which will work in Microsoft's attempt to create an 'Open' file format. That effort has mainly demonstrated that they (a) don't know what Open means, (b) don't see what their customers are asking for and (c) don't care about the previous two aspects, to the point of not understanding that their effort is alienating their increasingly savvy customers.
What's more, the 'Open' documentation has already given rise to the question if their flawed Excel spreadsheet functions (as documented) are new defects, or simply the first documentation of an already existing flawed interpretation of the laws of mathematics - any calculation done on an Excel spreadsheet to report financial results could now be seen as breaking diligence. In other words, using Excel knowingly may even carry a risk of criminal charges (IMHO, IANAL). Which executive would want that risk, especially with lower cost alternatives at hand that support a file format than can be machine processed and has been accepted at EU level?
However, MS trying to move into other markets hasn't been quite the success they'd hoped for either. Huge repair bills for Xbox, Zune zonked, and a lot of suppliers opting for a less license encumbered OS in their phones - it's all looking a tad shabby for your average clued up investor. Not a stock I'd keep on my portfolio, and following the progression other companies have made I think death by lawyer (suing your customers) cannot be far away.
And now, new idea, they're trying to move ads beyond your control into the core OS. Oh yes, that really will help drive up productivity in an office. And it'll be a primary risk vector if it gets infected.
Oh, yeah, I forgot, any new MS OS is the safest ever. Shame it still gets hacked before it's even launched. Talk about losing credibility..
Sure, I'm probably just a Mac/Linux fanboy. Isn't it irritating that even the less vocal ones in that category get proven right all the time? I don't choose an OS because of its fanbase, I chose it because it works for my business and I can see through the FUD (and OK, we're not a thousand seat business). I've had one office on OO exclusively now for 6 months, and no client has even noticed the difference - they're now switching to Linux completely. All the other offices are busy being switched to all Open Source based software in the next few months (using the holiday season), with the occasional Mac thrown in for graphics work.
And you know the best news? No virus problems, no daily 'reboot now' updates, no Genuine Advantage, no BSA/FAST worries.
It Just Works.
Insert
Are they planning on releasing the software for free? I always associate things I pay for as ad-free (with exceptions of course). I haven't seen pay-per-view in years but I don't remember any ads outside of upcoming shows. The general public gets hissy if they are forced to see ads _and_ pay for a service usually. Unless Microsoft has an ace up it's sleeve, I can't but help see this as destroying MS Windows and opening the door for Mac/Linux/etc.
Welcome to Slashdot! Would you like to be a moderator?
Too bad.
(rot13) rpbzbab@tznvy.pbz
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Please allow for a short reboot so that we may introduce you to
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If you're interested in facts I'll tell you what they are and I'll give you sources - Chomsky on The Big Idea
Crow T Robot: "Big brother is watching kids!"
You figure that out all by your little lonesome?
Do not attribute to malice that which can be easily explained by incompetence.
now we have to worry about Windows hardening our arteries?
First there was DRM, and now advertising too!
Microsoft is really pushing their product along to the users, it's so user friendly, so user orientated, it's everything you could want from an OS. Not only do you get the satisfaction of playing a video through a CERTIFIED player, feeling the joy of using something that you know will allow for that video to play at the best of quality. Now you also see your favourite advertisements! Look no further than the desktop when you wonder what's for breakfast at MacDonalds these days, so you can go fatten yourself up. Microsoft knows all too well that those pesky malware programs that sit on your computer and display pornography popups all the time are just not doing it for the user, it's not enough, and the risk of getting infected is too low. So they've solved all your problems by integrating it all into one bloated package. What more could you want!
"we've got trenchcoats and bad attitudes" - John Constantine, HellBlazer
Fuck. This. Microsoft OSes have officially dropped out my of acceptance forever. This is what amounts to a dialer and adware package in the fucking kernel, with datamining tacked on as a final insult. This more than anything shows how Microsoft really feels about its "customers." I am not a statistic; I am not a "consumer." And now, I am never, ever knowingly going to pass a single red cent to Microsoft ever again. If I hadn't already made my home a Linux shop, this would fucking well be the last push I needed.
Please, by all means pursue this with the utmost zeal, Microsoft. This will be your Sony rootkit, and I for one will laugh like a madwoman as I watch you all burn in the flames of Hell's class-action lawsuit. There is nothing I love more than seeing an arrogant criminal hang himself by his own hand.
~Eien no Inori wo Sasagete~ Searching for my Hatsumi...
what you agreed to in the EULA that you didn't read.
..don't panic
This may be Microsoft's answer to Google. And, incidentally, to Linux.
Microsoft already has a tiered operating system - the "business model" version of Vista is significantly more expensive than the "consumer model". The logical extension of this is a free consumer model with ads, and an expensive business model without ads.
This has many advantages for Microsoft. First, it's an answer to Google, which is ad-supported but doesn't have much of a lock-in mechanism, like Microsoft does. Second, it's an answer to Linux - preloaded consumer grade Windows becomes ad-supported, which is probably worth more than the current preload charge. It even helps Microsoft deal with piracy. The consumer version will be free. The business version will come with mandatory online services (they'll call it something like "Managed Workgroups") that will tie it to the mothership in Redmond.
Do you really, REALLY think that this will be put into the mainstream OS?
It would be more like an advertising supported free OS, IF it is used that is.
Microsoft making advertising a part of the kernel...Since when is advertising an essential service to
the system or user?
If this isn't some sort of a sick joke then Microsoft need to take a long hard look at themselves in the mirror and consider what they've become.
It amazes me (especially after this announcement) how blatantly Microsoft can prove their priorities have nothing to do with the user yet still some businesses and even governments consider purchasing Microsoft products first.
Those managers in purchasing positions that still buy Microsoft products when there is any sort of an alternative, let alone a good free one are now clearly demonstrating their own ineptitude.
This sounds spot on the nose; I could see microsoft salivating over the idea of marketing a version of windows as "free" as in "free cell phone"...
Ice Cream has no bones.
Remember this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claria#Recent_News
This is a great idea and will be excellent for my computer security business. Suddenly, everybody will need a Squid Proxy filter system.
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
I fail to see how this could possibly pass any obviousness test at the USPTO. It sure sounds almost identically to just embedding existing adware/spyware tech into the OS at the time it's shipped rather than after the fact. Uh... after the big KSR decision, repackaging already known techniques and getting the expected result is not patentable. Add in the fact that the whole idea is just unbelievably evil...
delivers targeted advertising as 'part of the OS.' First of all, all macro/microkernel discussions aside, what business does targeted advertising have as part of any operating system? Second, I think it is ridiculous that people who *pay for* an operating system are still forced advertisements down their throat. I'll stick with my ad-free OS, thank you.
Visit http://ringbreak.dnd.utwente.nl/~mrjb/growingbettersoftware to download your free copy of the book
"Surface is the first commercially available surface computer from Microsoft Corp. It turns an ordinary tabletop into a vibrant, interactive surface. The product provides effortless interaction with digital content through natural gestures, touch and physical objects. In essence, it's a surface that comes to life for exploring, learning, sharing, creating, buying and much more. Soon to be available in restaurants, hotels, retail and public entertainment venues, this experience will transform the way people shop, dine, entertain and live." http://www.microsoft.com/surface/ How else to better serve the advertising that they want, and do an end run around web based advertising. They say it will know when you put down a beer, or far more if they pair with rfid tags, or whatever on the surface and can run advertising based on that. I don't think even MS has the balls to put something like this into the home yet. But 'surface' is geared towards the commercial environment, and hey, I hear they have ads in\on urinal cakes now...
I think this will only be for people who use Home versions of the product. Those who use business versions won't get the ads because its a distraction. But still its kind of annoying for us Helldesk geeks. I get complaints when they see an ad on a website that they can't get rid of with {insert adware masquerading as ad blocker}.
That's wonderful Microsoft. Targetted ads. But I still don't want to buy any of the shit from it and neither me nor no one else with half a brain does. Why do people bother with ads and spamming anyway? Does anyone actually bother at all?
Once, in a meeting, I talked about the kernel of our system. The guy that was taking minutes (IT specialist) did not have a clue so he wrote: "The colonel of the system" in the minutes. I also talked about telnet and he wrote : "Telenet", as in "television" ;-)
Everything I write is lies, read between the lines.
When the word patent is used as an adjective, one meaning is:How did we get from that meaning toAnd all patents seem to be obfuscated in this way. Perl scripts are more readable - at least those can be interpreted by a machine! Why isn't it a requirement that the information be presented so that (a) it is clear what is patented, and (b) once the patent expires, the information can be used by others?
Just another way in which the patent system needs reform, IMO.
>north
You're an immobile computer, remember?
What kind of 'precisely targeted ads' ate The Colonel going to deliver to those poor people who receive tons of spam in their mail?
As if they didn't already get enough proposals for money laundering, viagra, penis enlargement and stock scams...
I, for one, applaud this patent application. Furthermore I hope that MS will vigorously protect this IP from other people(/companies), who might want to use it. This way, I will (probably) never encounter it on any PC that I'm using.
While they're at it, they can patent spam and viruses as well.
For the perfect anti-Unix, write an OS that thinks it knows what you're doing better than you do and let it be wrong.
"Microsoft: as annoying as the pop-up"
Geez, these days they're actually trying to be uncool.
A personal computer that serves the corporate interest ceases to be a personal computer.
any chance they are patenting this to prevent others from doing it?
Sounds like a great way to stop ad-ware, by suing them for patent infringement.
...and that is all I have to say about that.
http://jessta.id.au
how everyone bashes the PC side of MS but everyone is loving MS at E3.
In 1996, I started a new job, and part of the training phase was a meeting + discussion between all new recruits (many, because the corporation started to expand into new business territory) and some MS representative. Unfortunately, I had read a few days prior in the April issue of a computer magazine, and happened upon an article detailing how Win 98 would deliver targeted ads by means of a rotating taskbar. I made myself the idiot of the event by confronting the MS guy about this, and he smugly (which was ok, in hindsight) explained that this had been an April's fool joke.
I guess it's not always that he who laughs last, laughs best.
"When I first heard Daydream Nation it quite frankly scared the living shit out of me." -- Matthew Stearns
What matters is that the Colonel outranks Private Information and Private ComputerOwner
Where do I sign up? Wait, they want what now, exactly?
I hold very few opinions. I hold information based on observation and fact. If you wish to disagree, please use facts.
If you're paying for software which is supposed to be designed to make your computer more productive, the software should not be delivering unproductive advertising let alone reading your email or private documents. TV is free because we're forced to view advertising. I paid for my computer and my internet service so I shouldn't have to view ads.
If they want to run ads on my computer, they should be paying me. (Although, they couldn't pay me enough to run windows.
That's why I haven't watched any television for the past 7 years. Or read any magazines or newspapers (though I read lots of news online where I can block the ads). I adopt a "default-angry" response to any advertising that makes it through to me in some clever fashion, which helps to counteract whatever influence it might have on me.
Corporate-sponsored consumerism is out of control in North America, and the offensive marketing tactics used by all the large advertisers are just one symptom of the problem.
Consider this: Almost the entire purpose of today's marketing/advertising is to make you want to purchase stuff that you otherwise wouldn't want to purchase. This is significantly different from simply informing you of the existence of the product.
Why are people so complacent while companies manipulate them into spending money on all this useless crap?
We live in a world where six-year old kids watch tens of commercials a day for companies like McDonalds --- commercials specifically designed by psychologists to make these little kids nag their parents to take them to McDonalds (because studies have shown that making children nag their parents is the way to get more sales).
Six-year old kids have no defenses against this kind of thing. Their brains aren't fully developed, so they aren't able to think critically about what they're seeing. Marketers know they are defenseless, so they specifically target their advertising to manipulate these little kids. To me that is absolutely disgusting.
This is MS trying to spearhead any possible Google OS, or ad supported free os. No one wants this TV bullshit like OS. But we will be spoon fed it because we dont give a fuck about standing up for whats right and against whats wrong.
have been patented? Anyone? Anyone?
This sounds like another one of them. If brought to market, it will create an opportunity for some enterprising programmer.
I have not upgraded my PC's to Vista. However, I'll bet within 5 years, most of us will be running Vista (and Apple will double, maybe triple, it's market share). The hardware we're running will wear out and at some point, the newer hardware will not have XP support.
If you want to exercise your "I hate Microsoft" neurons, write and distribute solid 3rd-party XP drivers for new hardware that lacks XP support from the manufacturer.
goes on to boast that the invention can 'take steps to verify ad consumption,' be used to block ads from competitors, and even sneak a peek at 'user document files, user e-mail files, user music files, downloaded podcasts, computer settings, [and] computer status messages' to deliver more tightly targeted ads.
They might want to switch to decaf in Redmond as the whole bunch seems to be getting a little grandiose.
Everyone who thinks this is a good idea signify by saying "Aye".
(cricket_chirp.wav)
Anyone at all?
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
That argument is a creative misprision of Tanenbaum's teaching to support magical thinking. Abraham Lincoln famously refuted such magical thinking with "How many legs does a dog have if we call a tail a leg? Four. Calling a tail a leg does not make it one."
Microsoft argued in court that a browser is an inextricable component of an operating system: did Tanenbaum award an A?
It is preposterous to propose, e.g., that a system's task scheduler can be an application subsumed to advertisement. It is preposterous because it leads to an endless regression: clearly some component of the system must allocate time slices to the next-advertisement-aware-scheduler; and that component must itself be subject to interruption by advertisement, and the advertisement must be subject to interruption by advertisement or the user could trivially subvert the system, etc.
I never thought I'd play the Microsoft apologist, but getting a patent that covers a broad swath of how to display ads on a computer may be their plan to keep advertising off the desktop. Being the devil's advocate (pun intended), Microsoft may want to sue companies as a way to make them go away. As more malware hides deeper into the OS, this might an arrow in the quiver to combat the use for profit.
It's also possible that this is intended for another go at a DVR. Not that I would store documents on my DVR, it seems logical to want to be able to throw ads in there in the most efficient way possible.
However, if taken at first glance, it appears Microsoft has truly come up with yet another innovative way to make Windows an even more awful user experience. Way to go, Microsoft!
It seems like half the world is heading towards a freer and more open computing scheme, while the other is heading towards a more closed and controlled one.
DEFINE linuxfanboi as BOOLEAN; .nix OS. I realize that Linux is not everyone's cup of tea, however, it's been there as an alternative for many years without a lot of software like the stuff listed here
linuxfanboi=true;
'I would like to point out that if you are willing to try something new, you can completely avoid most things like this by using a
linuxfanboi=false;
END
Does anyone else think that stuff like this goes just a bit too far towards invasion of privacy? My first though after reading this article was how badly something like that could be abused to provide evidence for a MAFIAA lawsuit or exploited by people with malicious intent. It's not all that difficult to do those things now if the end user doesn't know how to protect their information. How much easier will it become if MS incorporates something like this into the base level of Windows?
At the risk of flame-baiting (and I really am not trying to):
As for what the future holds in this society that we have constructed, just watch the DVD for "Minority Report" again, and this time, pay attention.
Thank the heavens for consumer choice.
"Funny" just doesn't make him justice.
They were only "protecting consumers" so they could have them for themselves. Their goal has always been to be the man in the middle who collects all the fees. The Digital Restrictions in Vista are the end game, their open declaration of anti-competition on "their" platform.
Of course Linux is a target and they have been attacking other operating systems forever. DRDOS, OS/2 and Netscape are prime examples. Free Software has also been a target and the same tactics are used. Their attacks on free software do not end with their loud "get the facts" and othe smear campaigns and SCO attacks. There's also technical sabotage and everything they have a hand in is evil. They set up BIOS non standards like ACPI, to not run with free software. Winmodems are still a significant impediment as a large percentage of the frugal market for GNU/Linux users are also dail up users. M$ has even attacked the ogg vorbis music format by forbidding it's use in the majority of music players. Their interference with email standards should be seen in the same vein. Everything they do is designed to perpetuate their early 90s market position.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
That's pretty hot. Nothing I love more than a Linux woman going batshit nuts on some Microsoft screw up.
as it'll keep Mr. Jobs from slipping it into a future release...
>> [paranoia] Wonder when you'll be downloading this important security update from Microsoft? [/paranoia]
Is it really paranoia anymore, when they're saying that they will do exactly so? RIAA, MPAA, CIA, FBI and direct marketers will be so happy. Not to mention Microsoft shareholders.
Seems to me this is a logical next step to the Microsoft Live! platform. This allows MS to get OS level targeting and verification of advertising campaigns every time someone uses a portion of MS Live, bypassing any browser based adblockers.
This will no doubt be billed as a "feature" allows Microsoft to examine your behavior not only on the net but in how you use the OS as well to get detailed user info that can be used to increase the value of their advertising services.
As if they weren't greedy enough, they now have to embed spyware into the OS. Looks like Microsoft will be going to court again for something they should have been years ago, unfair business practices. - Floyd
Do not be alarmed about this patent, folks. This obviously is NOT a patent on future innovation. Internet Explorer and ActiveX already supply an advertising architecture to millions of advertisers everywhere. Obviously this is just a patent to cover functionality that is already in place!
...but at least we'll have chicken.
Chris Mattern
They are trying to be more like Google... and it's pissing everyone off.
There are enough companies that are dragging their heels on "upgrading" to Vista due to hardware requirements that this would seem to only give them another reason to delay, and perhaps question their Windows-only policies.
If that day ever comes, Microsoft's troubles in the video game arena -- where they are losing money hand over fist -- will seem trivial in comparison, and that ginormous war chest of cash will begin to shrink in a major way.
However, for the time being, the sheeple seem to be adhering to the plan, and are continuing to shovel truckloads of cash into the Microsoft money bin each quarter. Although how much of this is due to Vista being bundled with new PCs and how much is due to corporate VPAs is unknown.
Although it would appear that plenty of companies have already signed up for Vista (long ago and sight unseen), even if they are slow in rolling it out, so any thoughts of doing anything other than sticking with the Redmond Empire are nothing more than wishful thinking, that money having been already spent.
The process of switching platforms in any corporation is something that will take years of planning, but the first hint of any possibility of a corporate insurrection will be the appearance of non-Windows systems in isolated pockets of experimentation and innovation within a company, where the costs and benefits are being scrutinized to assess exactly how much the Windows-only policy is costing (or saving) the company.
.... Microsoft could make millions if they can figure out a way to sell banner ads on the BSOD.
Have gnu, will travel.
Microsoft has been doing this since 2002. Here is the link: http://www.bbspot.com/News/2002/10/bsod_ads.html
Warning: bbspot is not always 100% accurate.
Write your own Choose Your Own Adventure. http://www.freegameengines.org/gamebook-engine/
Another angle is that MS wants to block Google from doing this, escalating their classic vaporware tactics to the IP stage. Google'd be hard put to offer a "google desktop" or "google OS" that didn't violate this patent in one way or the other.
Returned Peace Corps IT Volunteer
no surprise and Austria is 2-1 againstthe us in the u-20 world cup in Toronto woo hoo
lets collect money for this ad:
"Tired of this adware OS? Try GNU/Linux!"
The MAFIAA is a bunch of mindless jerks who will be the first up against the wall when the revolution comes
By your argument against copying software, an exact replica of a Ford Mustang would not by my "own" car.
Correct. The design of a Ford Mustang is Ford's intellectual property, and it would both be wrong and illegal for you to copy it (even using a Star Trek replicator and your own raw materials) without compensating Ford for the time and money they spent designing the car. This is what patent protection is all about. Ford has patents on their car design.
When you purchase just about any product these days, you're not just paying for the raw materials and the effort of molding those materials into the final product. You're paying some percentage of the design cost. The percentage you pay is based on the manufactorer's estimate of how many copies of the thing they'll sell. If they underestimate how many copies they'll sell, they get more profit. If they overestimate, they take a loss. The more popular the product, the lower the percentage of the design cost the consumer ends up paying. For software, this issue of product design is more obvious as the design costs greatly outweigh all other production costs. Except for that, software isn't really much different from any other designed product. Products without any design cost are usually considered "commodities".
You are morally bankrupt to claim that there is nothing wrong with making an unauthorized copy of software (or of Ford's design for their Mustang). You are taking something of theirs without compensating them. Most reasonable people call that stealing.
Finally, on an unrelated note, this whole thread is again making the whole OS=kernel fallacy again. I would think that for such a supposedly technical website, slashdot would at least get that part right.
Bill is SUCH a genius!
He looks at Google, sees how much bread they make off advertising.
Then he thinks, "Gee, if I embed advertising in the OS, I can exploit my desktop dominance!"
In other words, it's the "Internet Explorer" strategy again.
Bill has the imagination of a fucking rock.
And people wonder why Microsoft churns out such utter crap.
Look at who's running the store.
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
.. I have this strange craving for fried chicken.
If you disagree with me on social issues, then it's pretty clear that you are a narrow-minded bigot.
It's simple; pirated versions of the OS have annoying popup adverts for Viagra every so often. It's either going to make you run another OS or pay up, it's brilliant I tell you....
Y'know...
I realiae we are a society the worships the all mighty dollar, and that goes without saying. But when did it become OKAY to do ANYTHING in the name of squeezing that last femtoscopic trace of a greenback dollar out of the exsanguinated corps of John Q. Public!
I get up in the morning to a radio which thank god is still relatively free (though yes they have found ways to make me and my society pay), and the first thing I here is a commercial. I turn on my computer and and read my email while some spammer humps my leg like a dog in heat, so I have to wade through more advertisements in search for the latest greatest tool to fend back the spamarazi.
I turn on my television, and because I live in a canyon and the only TV I get comes out of the end of a cable, I pay through the nose for the privilege of seeing anything other than the microwave background radiation caused by the big bang... and wrapped in that big fat bill is hour after endless hour of hawking, and pitching, and informercials, and lord help me, every day it inches closer and closer to 50% of the content coming over the cable that I pay so dearly for.
Exhausted by the endless parade of pitchmen, I resort to the rediculous cost of seeing a movie at a theatre, where I'm charged the national debt for a ticket, a coke and popcorn which for all intents and purposes for the theatre might just as well be air and water for what it costs to produce. After fighting my way down an isle who floor which is most reminiscent of flypaper and sitting in a seat being kicked by some prepubscent clone of the kid from "Two and A Half Men" sitting behind me... I SPEND THE NEXT HALF HOUR WATCHING MORE COMMERCIALS!!!
What's next talking toilet seats with cameras in the bowl so the makers of Prep H and Anusol can comment on the condition of your bowel habits in the hopes of selling me their fine products? Or mayhaps we put flat screeen TVs in coffins so our dearly departed can catch their favorite spotz in the hereafter.
Forgive me for being over sensitive, but when I here that it's Microsoft's intent is find new and creative ways to sell my ass by the pound to the highest bidder... well enough is enough, and enough it too much! I just don't need Windows(tm) that bad. I guess maybe it's time for doors instead! Maybe it's just paranoia, but I'm feeling like I've been X-Rayed, and CAT Scanned, MRIed, PET Scanned, and measured to the micron, and when a perfect map of me has been completed, Corporate America is going to draw a map on my 3D representation some alien boardroom, that looks all too much like a butchers chart. Give your heart to god because the rest belongs to the Acme corporation!
I honestly I can't decide if our founding fathers would be more ashamed or appalled by us. I honestly haven't got anything against living well. I just wish we could do it without paving one another over in our mad dash to tear off a piece of the good life. I'm tired and I'm mighty anemic... A note to Microsoft and the rest of Corporate America. Isn't it enough that you bled John Q dry... can't you leave just a little meat on the bones, if for no other reason than to feed your closest cousins the Vultures?
They say if you turn the heat up slowly, a frog doesn't notice it's being cooked. Put a fork in me guys! I'm done!
I know no more about computer systems than the average college student, but this makes my blood boil. I think I'm going to be switching to Linux in the near future. Any Slashdotters want to help a young lady out? *bats eyes* Seriously though, all you Linux evangelists should take note: This is the kind of thing that will push ordinary people into actually caring about Windows alternatives. There are plenty of intelligent people out there who just use Windows because they see no reason why they shouldn't. People who would be enraged if they knew about this stuff. So spread the word.
Dear Mssrs. Gates, Ballmer, et al:
Fuck you, I run Ubuntu.
Sincerely,
The Real American Public
you really expect me to be able to express my opinion of what's so fucked up in this world in 120 characters or less?
... I have a good proposal for Microsoft. See my small cartoon: http://geekandpoke.typepad.com/geekandpoke/2007/07 /microsoft-ads-h.html
Bye,
Oliver
And once they start doing this... even if you can disallow inspection of user-files, how do you know the software doesn't still look at your files, even if not for advertising purposes?
I mostly like Windows and generally don't care for linux as a desktop, but advertising as part of the OS would drive me away from any potential Windows upgrade so fast that Redmond's pixels would spin. If the alternatives were the annoyances of the linux desktop or the snooping and adware of a Windows desktop, I'll take being annoyed over being snooped and blipverted.
(No, for me the Mac is not an option, it's a prison. Sorry, MacBois. And what makes you think Apple would be far behind, if M$ manages to make a success of an ad-infested OS?)
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?