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Diebold Patch May Be Evidence of '02 Election Tampering
An anonymous reader writes "Stephen Spoonamore, founder of IT security firm Cybrinth and former advisor to John McCain, claims he has new evidence of election tampering by Diebold in the 2002 Georgia gubernatorial and senate races. A whistleblower gave Spoonamore a patch that was applied to Diebold machines in person by the Diebold CEO. Spoonamore confirmed that the patch did not correct the clock problem it supposedly addressed, but contained two parallel programs. Without access to the hardware, he could not learn more. He reported his findings to the Justice Department, which has not acted."
the worst thing is even if the next election was rigged no body would really do anything.
...and scary as hell, but just because you don't know what a patch did doesn't make it evidence of tampering.
There absolutely should be a full investigation, though.
Honestly? Surprised that there exists interests in changing the outcome of an election in a favourable way?
Were the Diebold voting machines Euclidean or non-Euclidean? Without this key bit of information, we can't know if these programs intersected or not.
I think I'll vote via absentee ballot and send it via registered mail. Paranoid? Maybe.
> He reported his findings to the Justice Department, which has not acted.
Bush co already patched the justice dept.
No worries.
Stars and Stripes of corruption.
Intellectually, I hate this. Our constitutional republic* requires free and fair elections.
But in terms of news-as-entertainment, this is the stuff the best thrillers are made of.
(*: used in place of "democracy" for maximum correctness)
'a';DROP TABLE users; SELECT * FROM DATA WHERE name LIKE '%'... if you're reading this, it didn't work.
I live in Atlanta, and lived here in 2002. "King" Roy Barnes and Max Cleland didn't get "robbed" of anything. They lost their elections because they were both liberal Democrats running in a conservative state in a big Republican year. Barnes in particular had become so personally obnoxious that a good many in his own party crossed over to vote against him out of pure spite.
Good grief, people. Put the tinfoil hats away.
If the patch is not suspicious enough, inaction by the Justice Department is damning.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
The first flag should've been that it was the CEO who performed the patch. If a CEO _ever_ gets his hands dirty, you can rest assured that there is something illegal going on that needs to be covered up.
I live in constant fear of the Coming of the Red Spiders.
As an IT support person, the scope of the Diebold patch update is suspicious. Why just two counties? Why not the whole state? Why a special trip by the CEO? Too many bells are going off here.
When I did IT updates. I would update a few test configurations and select users then let them run for a bit. Then roll out to the masses. About 2,500 PCs if you will.
The justice department needs to begin investigating this immediately.
This whole situation stinks to high heaven.
Thanks,
Jim
McCain might also have tried to manipulate elections an old fashioned today by commenting on the probable timing of Obama's arrival in Iraq.
This is obviously a major security issue for Obama, and shows us why McCain should not be president.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUKN1830368120080718
A Good Troll is better than a Bad Human.
I wonder how many people have stopped to think through the implications of this charge. If it's proven to be true, it could very well mean Diebold's CEO is guilty of treason. In a time of war (which President Bush has repeatedly said is the case), that's a death penalty offense. While I don't favour the death penalty, I think you have to take a very serious look at it for somebody who hasn't just killed people, but who has attempted to kill democracy in an entire nation. This particular incident may have been restricted to one state, but Diebold has been very active in attempting to get its machines and methods protected from legal supervision at the federal level.
By the way, what's their new name? I keep forgetting.
I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.
Send the guy to gitmo for an "interrogation".
Remember folks, Diebold is now known as "Premier Election Solutions"--they changed their name to get away from the bad PR! So don't call them "Diebold" any more and don't forget!
Just like MediaSentry becoming "SafeNet", we shouldn't be so quick to forget who the scumbags are!
- I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property
2003;
The head of a company vying to sell voting machines in Ohio told Republicans in a recent fund-raising letter that he is "committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president next year."
The Aug. 14 letter from Walden O'Dell, chief executive of Diebold Inc. - who has become active in the re-election effort of President Bush - prompted Democrats this week to question the propriety of allowing O'Dell's company to calculate votes in the 2004 presidential election.
O'Dell attended a strategy pow-wow with wealthy Bush benefactors - known as Rangers and Pioneers - at the president's Crawford, Texas, ranch earlier this month. The next week, he penned invitations to a $1,000-a-plate fund-raiser to benefit the Ohio Republican Party's federal campaign fund - partially benefiting Bush - at his mansion in the Columbus suburb of Upper Arlington.
The letter went out the day before Ohio Secretary of State Ken Blackwell, also a Republican, was set to qualify Diebold as one of three firms eligible to sell upgraded electronic voting machines to Ohio counties in time for the 2004 election.
"Kill 'em all and let Root sort 'em out"
Sources close to Spoonamore said he was very concerned that he would lose his contracts as a result of coming forward and would take a "large financial hit." These sources added that, despite his concerns, Spoonamore felt obligated to reveal what he knows to the public. "He felt he had no choice as an American citizen but to come forward, and he also knows the likely consequences of him doing so," one source said.
If anything happens to this man: he gets killed in an auto accident, accidentally ODs on something, gets hit with a bolt a lightning; I may have to hold some folks in Washington accountable for it. Which means, I'll bitch and moan about the conspiracy like a complete impotent citizen of the US that we've all become. We're no match for the corporate lobbyists (Diebold's especially) in Washington.
My CAPTCH is "dissent" - how interesting. Maybe CmdrTaco and gang is involved.
don't expect the media to notice, they'll look very hard for dimpled chads etc and announce no problems with this election.
The story says "The computer patch was installed in person by Diebold CEO Bob Urosevich, who flew in from Texas and applied it in just two counties, DeKalb and Fulton, both Democratic strongholds."
If that's accurate, that's astonishing to me.
I don't know much about "The Raw Story," which describes itself as an "alternative" news source. If this had appeared in the mainstream media I would regard it as something close to a smoking gun. I hope this isn't the end of the story.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
The source could be freely distributed, compiled and signed by a 3rd party as unmodified and genuine. It doesn't prevent other monkey business from going on in the machines, but the secrecy is crazy.
The more I read about these election problems the same quesiton always pops up in the back of my head: What was wrong with paper ballots counted by hand?
In a digital world it is as safe as can be.
FTA: "...The first red flag went up when the computer patch was installed in person by Diebold CEO Bob Urosevich..."
Oops. Bob Urosevich was not and has never been the CEO of Diebold. That seems like a pretty important oversight for a front-page non-fiction piece.
FUD.
...Spoonamore confirmed that the patch did not correct the clock problem it supposedly addressed, but contained two parallel programs. Without access to the hardware, he could not learn more. He reported his findings to the Justice Department, which has not acted...
When one cites this case, can't the argument be made that the USA is just like any other third world country?
If you asked me, I'd say "yes" "yes" "yes" it is.
The software engineers try to get a handle on how many bugs are left after a certain number have been found, but how do we get a handle on how many events like these might be happening after one has come to light?
It has long been pretty clear that these voting machine vendors, Diebold chief among them, have had something to hide because of how cagy they have been about allowing people to examine their machines. It's very frustrating that their arguments seem to always win out - it makes you wonder how many Secretaries of State (for non-US readers, that is a state-level office that is frequently in charge of elections. Not to be confused with the Federal level Foreign Minister) want to know what is going on, or really d know what is going on, and just want deniability.
Now, come on. I believe that Diebold is totally evil as much as the next guy, but really. Unless we have more information, how can this be considered evidence of anything?
and the sad thing is this guy may go to jail for leaking this as he broke the law by doing so.
We're talking about McCain's aid and a respected businessman. The allegation is serious enough to warrent an investigation regardless of who reported it - you can figure out what software does impartially. When it's someone from the side that won, there's all the more reason to look. Some people put principles like one man one vote before the good of their party. As politicians are fond of saying, millions of people have died defending those principles.
The only reason to dismiss these charges is if you think Spoonamore has an axe to grind. Chances are, he will soon face smears of that nature but they don't hold up. The Bush adiministration has shown a willingess to punish those who say things that make them look bad. Spoonamore has much to lose and nothing to gain but everyone's freedom. His act is selfless and commendable.
Interesting that he's not mentioned in the summary, but several other sources seem to indicate that Karl Rove is behind this.
Go ahead and mod me down, I've got decent karma.
Your sig(k) has been stolen. There is a puff of smoke!
Who is going to be the next President? I can't wait until November I wish Diebold would just tell us now.
seriously, what patch? i don't see no patch. dump the code somewhere, chances are, someone will recognize it, or knows someone else who will.
also, i'm not convinced the CEO coming out himself means squat. if it's a sensitive matter and last minute, sometimes you just do things yourself if you want them done right.
i hate electronic voting as much as anyone and would prefer paper ballots and hand counts. it works for canada. but this article is just a bunch of conspiracy theorist crap. if you've got the evidence, show it.
If the CEO dies there, without breaking, will he DIE BOLD?
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
Jeff Dean, Senior Vice-President and Senior Programmer at Global Election Systems (GES), the company purchased by Diebold in 2002 which became Diebold Election Systems, was convicted of 23 counts of felony theft for planting back doors in software he created for ATMs using, according to court documents, a "high degree of sophistication" to evade detection over a period of two years[8]. In addition to Dean, GES employed a number of other convicted felons in senior positions, including a fraudulent securities trader and a drug trafficker.
Avi Rubin, Professor of Computer Science at Johns Hopkins University and Technical Director of the Information Security Institute has analyzed the source code used in these voting machines and reports "this voting system is far below even the most minimal security standards applicable in other contexts.
Following the publication of this paper, the State of Maryland hired Science Applications International Corporation (SAIC) to perform another analysis of the Diebold voting machines. SAIC concluded "[t]he system, as implemented in policy, procedure, and technology, is at high risk of compromise."
Do we know if this whistleblower has any credibility? Are we relying solely on Raw Story's claims? Do we have any actual references here?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0u6lCBnRoHQ
if you believe in the American Dream then you better wake up because the only people that are dreaming are asleep...
not to sound like a troll but do you really think voting does any good? the evidence seems to prove otherwise, i think its all smoke & mirrors...
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
This is why we, the geeks, are developing the Metagovernment, and building real, practical direct democracy. Are you in?
HA .... HA .... HAAAAH!
Yes, I'm sure you are kidding but those charges are related:
FTA: "he identified two parallel programs, both having the full software code and even the same audio instructions for the deaf." And I thought Braille on a drive up ATM was pointless.
Wasn't this the guy who promised to "deliver the votes" to a politician? Can't remember who it was...
For hundreds of years elections have been held using paper and pencil ballots, and fraud was very difficult to get away with. This is because you have to employ large numbers of people to commit it.
Electronic voting can be subverted very simply indeed, just by one person with the right technical knowledge. All electronic voting should be scrapped until a reasonably secure system can be organised, most likely by open source solutions. Even then there's no real reason for it.
And what the hell was the CEO doing installing patches? Sounds highly suspicous to me.
... from the Bush DOJ? "We'll nab 'em and hang 'em"? Doesn't the man know why AG Alberto Gonzales resigned, or the fact that the VP office stuck its fingers into the DOJ's hiring process? There is absolutely nothing that the politicized DOJ and castrated Congress will do, so he had better air the politicians' and plutocrats' dirty laundry across the 'net and mass media.
Better yet, take up a collection and buy some ad space from Fox. "Did your elected official win fair and square?"
"We are Microsoft. You shall be assimilated. Competition is futile."
It looks like from older sources that the CEO was traveling with a technician who actually installed the patch. The technician has since thought that it was an unusual thing to be doing. http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/11717105/robert_f_kennedy_jr__will_the_next_election_be_hacked/2 "We were told not to talk to county personnel about it. I received instructions directly from Urosevich. It was very unusual that a president of the company would give an order like that and be involved at that level."
And why would a huge corporate company make noise about criminal activity done by one of their possible advertisers, or someone with connections in Washington? They wait until the feds start busting them up. That way, you know they don't have any leverage inside the beltway, and there's nothing you can do to save them anyway.
When the feds are bought and paid for, and the media is bought and paid for, mainstream media becomes an outlet for AP stories that don't offend anyone.
IMO this is probably just mudslinging and rumormongering, and in it's own way an attempt to dishonestly effect the outcome of the upcoming US presidential election. Of course there's been a lot of smoke about rigged elections in the US for the last few years, it would be nice to have a smoking gun. If this is true then it's dynamite. Does anyone know of this rawstory.com? The site doesn't look 100% credible to me.
I come from the UK and I really can't understand how it is possible that a company can suddenly provide an update to some software in certain states that supposedly correctly fixed some problem in only a few states......
(ok we don't have states in the uk)
SURELY! being concerned with the election, any software should be open source to *ALL* parties in the election to make sure it is fair and just?
no?
If software was used in the UK election and only the labour party was able to view it - I would say this was un-constitutional and many people would kick up a huge fuss....
(actually the fuss would be quite large, like a large riot with many peoeple with sticks and bottles, and stuff...)
If something is being provided as being as a means as voting then all parties should be in agreement with the method before the public is allowed to use it. "upgrading the software" of some application seems.... erm... wrong!
Bert.
sit down!
It's the only way to make eliminate problems, or suspicions of problems, like this one.
It's not hard. The voting machines would work the same, but produce paper ballots printing the voter's choice and also encoding it in bar code (if you are afraid of bar codes print it a second time with an OCR-friendly font). The voter then verifies that the ballot prints what was chosen and casts this ballot (and he can print many ballots to fix errors, but can cast only one).
At the end of the day the ballots are scanned and we get the result. In case of problems we go back to the ballots to check them. The result is as fast as the electronic, and as reliable as the paper version.
So why is everyone pushing evoting trying to kill the paper trail? That is what creates the problems. And it is totally unnecessary.
It scales effortlessly and is very hard to spin.
I'd guess the reason you use voting machines is that Americans don't seem to believe anything is a useful thing or service unless you can cheat. A clue as to the reason behind the present state of your economy.
Market forces mWhahaha. Oh yeah ... no disrespect ;).
" Remember, remember the Fifth of November, The Gunpowder Treason and Plot, I know of no reason Why Gunpowder Treason Should ever be forgot. "
You should change the tag from News for Nerds, the stuff that matters to "irrelevant News for the left that matters to no one "
Although I am not an unconditional fan of open source. I think it has its uses and its non uses. But this is one definite use. It might be the case that as a matter of law right now, what you say is true--it's not evidence. But I actually don't see how we'd be hurt by having a law that makes it into evidence by making it, ipso facto, a crime to apply an undocumented patch at all.
If you're going to have voting machines at all, it seems to me they ought to have open source programs running on them. (I personally don't care if the programs are free in cost, though I imagine they could be. I only care that they are inspectable by anyone and that it is fair use to copy them to other machines for the purpose of verifying their correctness and aherence to advertised and required spec.) I don't see that anyone other than someone doing something illegal is served by keeping the source secret. The data, of course, might be protected. But the program should be auditable by anyone.
And in such a world, I don't see any reason whatsoever that it shouldn't be a crime for there to be any software applied where its entire content and purpose were not carefully documented. Then it wouldn't require any proof other than that it happened in order to detect wrongdoing; and it could be further a crime to phony up a faulty description of what the patch does, so that then it could be audited for validity by anyone who wants to.
The weak link in all this seems to be the hardware. It's quite hard to look at a box and know what's going on inside it. It requires specialized skill. It likely wouldn't be hard to make a machine with a dummy system for show that had the right program on it and another shadow machine tucked away that had the wrong program, with just some subtle wire somewhere leading to one doing the real voting. Call it "democracy theater" if you like, borrowing on the "security theater" moniker used a lot in other venues these days. Such a charade could be hard to notice. Which is why I prefer paper balloting. It means the entire process is exposed.
Kent M Pitman
Philosopher, Technologist, Writer
Is this all bullshit or not? It seems the more one descends into less credible news sources, you get more reports of rampant election fraud. Is there a solid, reputable news source carrying this story? I'm not dissing rawstory.com, but I've also never heard of them. I'm starting to put vote tampering conspiracy theorists into the same category as 9/11 loose change people and Holocaust deniers. Am I wrong? If so where's the evidence (some guy's blog doesn't count.)
Yes, many people were stupid enough to vote for Bush after the first four years. Americans need to address that very real problem instead of trying to blame it on some scam.
... also, I can kill you with my brain.
The story doesn't appear at the linked URL anymore.
And, it's been scrubbed from Google's cache. A search shows a matching page, but clicking the link for the cache brings up no document found.
I hope somebody kept a copy ... assuming that person hasn't been disappeared.
http://politicalcompass.org/
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
Yes, off topic, but slightly related.
We have a congress and executive branch that needs to work together. At this point, it does not matter much.
I for one will vote all incumbents out in a vote of no confidence. A 9% approval rating and 10-13 for the president means it is time for a change. Being libertarian with republican leanings, I will vote for all democrats (except for Barr or Nader in the presidential contest).
I can think of no better way to send a message to
congress that we do not approve
The beauty is if everyone did it, we'd wind up with a republican congress and a democratic president. Which I think overall is a change we need. (Particularly after the telecom immunity and FISA votes)
Slashdot's rate-of-post filter: Preventing you from posting too many great ideas at once.
Is to give them "free speech" - because in the end nobody cares.
If Google really cared they would fix Android Chrome to reflow text, instead of discriminating
Americans used to be known for standing up against crazy people who wanted to control them. Don't want your elections stolen? Smash electronic voting machines! A brick won't set off metal detectors and even poor people can get their hands on them. Put bricks through the screens of the evil machines!
I'm SO gonna get put on some 'bad kid' list for posting this, but it needs to be said. Smash them!
The captcha word is "FLAGGED"; I wish I was kidding.
Because I wrote the patch and I gave it to him and I personally watched him install it.
What? You don't believe me?
Guess I should have posted anonymously.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
At this time, it is the pubs who have all but destroyed us. Our deficit was mostly done by 2 pubs; reagan and W. Likewise, we are in an occupation that is destroying America. Take it a step further. The pubs speak about our rights to guns, while ignoring all the rest of our rights. Finally, ALL the pubs ignore the evidence of top pubs selling nuclear secrets to Turkey and Pakistan (giving them both the bomb), the total corruption that they have brought to DC, and even this sorry state of affairs that USA is in. The pub party consists mostly of Liars, corrupt, immoral ppl.
Until 4 years ago, I had never voted for a dem/pub (Though I was going to vote for gore in 2000; sick GF prevented it). I am now voting dems until the pubs change their party. The top neo-cons MUST be imprisoned. The top pubs that sold our nuke secrets and created the nightmare that we have in the middle east need to swing (and not at their usual sex party). All in all, until they are cleaned up, I will continue to be against pubs. If they go back to being goldater pubs, and not the religious right-wing nuts that they have become, then I will be happy to consider them.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
(OK, we don't know if it's already been published; it it has, then "Move along, nothing to see here, folks...")
Let a thousand minds mull over these parallel programs, some of whom might just have access to its code. Then we'll see...
PS Is anybody (eg, group of well-known / reliable / respectable whitehat hackers, or the like) suing for access to some of those voting machines?
That'd certainly be worth some /. "air-time" in (hopefully near) future.
Someone really needs to do a comparison about the testing rigors applied to LV gambling machines, vs. voting machines.
The voting machines have it WAY too easy!
The worst thing is that the damage is done. No one you can vote for will ever restore the Constitutional rule-of-law and guarantee of due-process that are now in tattered, burning shreds.
Obama is to the right of Nixon - and is considered "center-left".
Once was America, now the Uber-Banana Republic.
The worst thing is that the damage is done. No one you can vote for will ever restore the Constitutional rule-of-law and guarantee of due-process that are now in tattered, burning shreds.
Obama is to the right of Nixon - and is considered "center-left".
Once was America, now the Uber-Banana Republic.
Jeremiah, you are right. Anyone who doesn't realize Obama is to the right of Nixon hasn't been paying attention. Thomas Jefferson must be rolling in his fucking grave right about now.
He's innocent! Why, it was merely a publicity stunt. How could he have known patch would be compromised by a malicious programming temp from overseas.
It seems like this justice department threw out the constitution years ago.
The administration thinks it's above the law.
Congress is available to the highest bidder.
What do we do? What do we do when the system becomes so corrupt there's no recourse?
Our constitution provided some options but we've lost our republic. They're making up laws now to cover stuff that they did while breaking laws earlier.
And there's no one with courage and integrity left to out these treasonous bastards.
Diebold's CEO should be tried for high treason. Election tampering is more serious than espionage. Put his life on the line and watch who he rolls over on.
They're using their grammar skills there.
I noticed that a significant fraction of the links on this "Raw Story" site (including the Diebold story above) don't work. That is, I tried several other stories on the front page and about a third 404'd on me. That's not a good sign and seems pretty shifty to me. Lot of people talk about mainstream media soft peddling stories like this. But it's no better to rely on news from some fly-by-night operator, who doesn't even bother to retain stories for more than a few hours.
>Jeremiah, you are right. Anyone who doesn't realize Obama is to the right of Nixon hasn't been paying attention.
Wow it's true!
Since English is written left to right... and "N" comes before "O"...
I see the light now!
I'm *definitely* voting for Obama in November now! Thanks so much for pointing this out.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
Reward: Takes less people and less time to count the votes.
Risk: The procedure is inaccurate.
Risk2: Fraud is very difficult to detect.
Given how trivial #1 is, how likely #2 is, and how many people want to attempt #3... why are we using these things again?
would would Iraqi insurgents like to see become the next US president? Obama or McCain? Now isn't that interesting...
You don't understand how politics and terrorism work. Do you seriously think that people whose primary occupation has been to make IEDs and gun people down in the street are going to fit back into a civilian economy? These people thrive on conflict. The last thing they want to see is a settlement and peace because then they'd lose their power base and be out of a job.
So, since McCain is more likely to prolong the conflict, McCain is the preferred choice of insurgents and terrorists.
We spread ourselves too thin.
We spent a trillion dollars on the Iraq war and ruined our economy. The majority of our discretionary spending goes to the military. And almost none of that money is actually going to aid.
We're way beyond "spread to thin".
but we can't be the world's nanny anymore
We've never been the world's nanny. Almost everything the US has done internationally has been in the US military and economic interest, including WWI and WWII. The difference between then and now is that (1) past efforts were successful and (2) past efforts were aimed at deriving a benefit for us by helping others. The problem with the current efforts is that they are unsuccessful and that nobody benefits.
NO this not a troll.
This war has been a PR nightmare. They hit the WTC for the symbol it represents as the center of western financial power and the day was picked as 911 is a number for emergency. We are not fight an enemy we are fighting symbols and ideals. As long as we are mired in this suspiciously contrived conflict that is at odds with western ideals we will continue to lost ground.
Iraq is another reason the GOP is bankrupt philosophically. They threw away one of the best weapons we developed in the cold war, that the West was a Shining example of what the world could be. Now we are seen as jackbooted thugs.
Sorry about the writing. Robot fingers, you know? Cliff Steele in DOOM PATROL #23
... is that computers cannot be trusted to process anonymous transactions. Particularly when the stakes are high.
Digital electronic ballots can't be considered real, as they do not leave scads of physical forensic evidence the way a physical ballot would.
Everything else we do with computers involving trust also involves personal identification and verification procedures (logging in, checking a bank statement, etc. for which there are no analogs in voting systems) and even that is problematic enough.
that includes the public. Telling every politician and journalist in earshot is hardly effective, what if they ignore you, or can only add there sole voice to yours. I am not saying people working to gather can't change things but words won't do a thing, there needs to be a stronger civil society.
P.S. I am not American
You mean that whistleblower is still running free? Boy, they sure are slow these days, I tell you, something like this would have never survived longer than a few hours under Brezhnev!
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Just a note here for our British friends -- our founding fathers initiated a system of checks and balances -- that is, a check is kindof like a body-block in football. Balance is kindof like keeping one's balance in gymnastiques.
As any Larouche party member can tell you, it wasn't until the British banques took over that the U.S. Quonstitution was said to have a system of Cheques (that is, payments made from the British Banque controlled Federal reserve) and Balances (that is, the amount of money left in the account, which is ... ahem ... quite embarrassing).
More to answer your pointe, our foundinge fatherse never trusted the common populace to run the Countrie. That is whye neither women, nor slaves, nor men without lande could vote. That is also whye they chose a republique, instead of a Democracie. It is but a naturalle extensione of the systeme, that a Companie that supplies hackable equipment to ye Britishe Banques should also be usefulle in properlie controlling ye Electionse, now that just any Tom, Dick, and Harry can vote.
Correct Horse Battery Staple: 72 bits of entropy. Enter "Correct H" into google. When it generates the phrase, that's
At this time, it is the pubs who have all but destroyed us.
I wouldn't go that far. A couple of pints never hurt anyone, and the pubs in my neighbourhood are centres of creative thought and insightful discourse.
Oh, you mean republicans. I think you need a better nickname than the word most of the English speaking world outside of the US uses to refer to a bar. And while your first paragraph makes some very good points, you lose a lot of credibility in the 2nd ("sold nuke secrets" and "their usual sex parties" needs a whole lot more evidence to back up those rather extraordinary claims than you've provided). Not that I don't think its possible ... I was the lone voice among all I knew who thought "Reichstag" on 9/11, while most everyone else was screaming "Pearl Harbor", and the last 7 years have certainly borne me out ... but you lose all credibility making such wild claims with no evidence, links to allegations, etc. And I say this as one who wouldn't pub much at all past this president, or the current crop of neocons running the republican party.
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
Maybe if we used MP3s for voting we could get the RIAA and MPAA to set up a validated, encrypted and signed tamper proof voting system and the CEO of Diebold would be in jail for the criminal act of violating the DMCA.
"Everything is adjustable, provided you have the right tools"
"Without access to the hardware, he could not learn more"
So even though he doesn't know what the patch does, he's SURE that it stole the election for someone? Sorry, but this guy needs to put aside his obviously-partisan politics and take of his tinfoil hat before making noise.
In any OTHER circle, making accusations without any proof doesn't go very far -- unless, of course, you're one of the legion that will do anything to prove that the guy that beat your candidate "stole the election" or any of the other myriad of "causes" these days that don't require proof, just a legion of myrmidons lacking the mental capacity for logic.
Please. I'm tired of this. We've heard years and years of this Diebold-stole-the-election nonsense and I'm STILL waiting for a piece of "proof" that isn't someone jumping to conclusions, making assumptions, or simply letting their I-hate-all-things-Republican hate-mongering leak out.
If you can prove it, then please do so, otherwise shut the hell up already with the innuendo that has no basis in fact.
Idiot! You don't think that turning our election system into a bunch of crap and generally subverting our Constitution with a whole bunch of new police-state laws as a result (Bush, for Christ's sake) AIDS OUR ENEMIES?
Ben Ladin probably has perpetual cramps in his cheeks from all the laughing.
The people who did this to us definitely did commit TREASON as defined in that "quaint piece of paper" the former Constitution of the United States of America. And it was a bunch of dumb bastards like you who sat on your collective fat asses and let them get away with it.
This bullshit war in Iraq has been going on for so long that I'm starting to forget why it all started, forgetting all the crap that went on in 2003, with a whole load of otherwise sane people still looking for someone to kill in retribution for 9/11 screaming at calmer minds that Saddam had the bomb (and germs and gas) and was going to use it on the innocent folks in bumfuck, Oklahoma if they didn't invade Iraq like, right now.
Of course, Saddam didn't have the bomb, and some 4100 American and 100'000 Iraqi lives later, Saddam is long dead and the whole mess isn't even about the bomb anymore. Now, it's about propping up a weak government in Iraq that would probably collapse if there weren't enough American soldiers and planes around to come to their aid anytime one of dozens of Sunni, Shia or just plain criminal groups starts shooting at them.
Your post reminds me of the same bullshit that went on in 2004.
The irony is, it doesn't matter if Iran gets the bomb and has missiles to launch them at Ari's barmitzvah in downtown Haifa. If Iran uses atomic weapons, Israel has them too, so you can kiss Farzaneh's Tupperware party in Shiraz goodbye as well if that happens.
Seriously, do you know what would happen if anyone used a nuclear weapon in a war? The country that launched those missiles would be glass about an hour later. No one, not even the Russians or the Chinese would stop the Israelis, Americans (and most likely the British and the French too), from striking back. It would mean open season on Iran, and the country would be reduced to dust and a few goatherds milking radioactive goats.
Also, Iran is not going to give nuclear weapons to Al-Qaida, since the Iranians are Shi'ites and Al-Qaida are Sunnis. They might give Hizbollah atomic weapons, but if Hizbollah were to ever use one, it would pretty obvious from where it would come, and the same as above would happen.
No, in reality, all this posturing about the terrible danger of Iran getting atomic weapons is, IMO, just bullshit to once again distract calmer minds from sanity and frighten them into voting for that senile old fart, Mccain.
The Mujaheddin were losing the war against the Russians until the US under Rabid Ronnie, in his quest to rid the world of the Evil Empire, started supplying them with US made Stinger anti-aircraft missiles and supplying them with Pakistani made Ak-47s and RPG-7s by the truckload.
The Russians were unconcerned with collateral damage caused by their cluster bombs and rockets from their SU-27 ground-attack planes and Mil-24 helicopter gunships. The had the means and the will to dominate every fight with the Mujaheddin, and the literally bombed anything that gave them trouble.
The Stingers changed all that, meaning the Russians no longer had the ability to easily supply air-support to troops facing ambushes, etc.
Bush 41 dropped the Mujaheddin like a sack of shit, after the Russians pulled out. They didn't give a rat's ass about a far away, resource poor region like Afghanistan.
And then it came back to bite them in the ass on 9/11.
Saddam was a mass murdering genocidal bastard son of a bitch that deserved to die. the Iraqi people, on the other hand, were mostly fucked anyway you choose. Under Saddam, they were either for him, and were part of the killing machine, or they against him, for which they were tortured and killed.
After the Invasion, they were for their local militia, in which case they got shot up, tortured and killed by the new Iraqi government or the Americans, or they were against the local militia, in which case they were tortured and killed by the local militia. And this apart from the thousands of suicide bombings by radicalised Arabs drawn to Iraq to fight the great Satan.
And as for nerve gas. Saddam had it and used in its 8 fucking year war against Iran from 1980 to 1988, and no one said a fucking thing. especially not the US who, in its glee that the a-rabs and eye-ranins were killin' one another, sold weapons to both sides (They fucking sold F-14 fighter parts to the Iranians so they could fund the bloody murder of innocent Nicaraguans by the Contras).
So, if Iran gets the bomb, good on them. It's one less place that US soldiers and innocent civilians will be dying for nothing.
Jeepers!
Dude, there's plenty of evidence that the machines were and are easy to tamper with. There is also plenty of evidence of suspicious behavior during the election. Without a formal inquiry, we're not going to get to the bottom of things, because people are at the moment allowed to maintain their silence. This is why we have police forces; to investigate criminal activity. The problem here is that there has been no official investigation despite the fact that there are plenty of red flags waving like crazy.
If you're tired of hearing about this story and just want it to go away, I'm afraid you're out of luck. When we get into areas where politics and crime meet, then there are hundreds of thousands of people with the same political leanings who all have a vested interest in just making it go away. It's not like just one or two criminals wishing the heat was off. This kind of situation requires long and patient effort and media attention to catch the criminals, and it may yet happen. The tide is turning for Bush with talk of impeachment and war crimes is getting louder and more frequent. I'm just sad that it couldn't have come about before so much damage was done. I really don't want to see a war with Iran; the death toll of innocents is going to be catastrophic, and as Scott Ritter has pointed out, there is a very good chance it will lead to nuclear detonations on American soil. I don't understand why Bush isn't more broadly recognized as the lunatic he is.
In any case, if there was no deliberate wrong done with the Diebold machines, investigations would still be desirable; we clearly need firmer regulations so that properly working machines are used in the future. That alone makes an investigation worth the time.
-FL
Errr....I think someone has a grave misunderstanding of how our electoral system works in the U.S.
Speaking as a deputy director of a Board of Elections[1] in Ohio, I will say that yes we DO count all of the absentee ballots, regardless of how unbalanced the race results are. The absentees are counted and are included in the results that we report on election day after the polls close.
And for those who maintain that provisional ballots aren't counted either...yes, we count those too. And, once again, we count them regardless of how unbalanced the race results are.
Provisional votes, however, are not counted on election day; we have to research the validity of every provisional ballot in the 10 days after the election to ensure whether or not it can be counted.
It's funny. Just yesterday one of the 4 board members called into the office to report that his mother -- a cashier at one of the local restaurants -- was talking to a customer who informed her that "naw...I ain't votin' absentee...they never count them votes!" This seems to be a very common belief in America. Completely wrong, but pretty common.
footnotes:
[1] Our county uses the Diebold touchscreen machines, in case you care. Personally, I've worked in debugging software for more than a decade and am a luddite when it comes to election technology.
I think we'd be better off if we still used the old punchcards. They were cheaper, non-proprietary, simpler for our non-tech-savvy poll workers to understand, cheaper, easier to archive, and a lot less hassle overall. (Oh...and did I mention they were a lot cheaper?)
Half right. Bob Urosevich was the president and COO of Global Election Systems, the company that Diebold bought in 2002. So the company was in transition during the time period that the story reports.
The CEO of Diebold in 2003 and 2004 (when things were most interesting for those of us who live in Ohio) was Walden O'Dell.
I live in Clintonville, and can ride my bike to see some pretty spectacular homes in UA. You are
The whole point of transparency and auditability of the process is to let everyone trust the results, whoever wins the election.
Those who are trying to prevent open, auditable elections are trying to prepare the ground for hiding something.
None of this surprises me. The Justice Dept will not act because it is highly politicized with right wing ideaology, Bush cronies, graduates Pat Robert's school and people who have no business in the Justice Dept. Sad sad day.
...Until he was asked to build and demonstrate an easter-egg in an electronic voting system. By a fellow Republican.
Last I heard, Clint Curtis was running for congress in a Florida district as a Democrat. His platform is basically "openness and honesty in government".
When it's bascially a dead heat tie like the 2000 and 2004 Presidential elections, the fact that a few votes were rigged is really inconsequential. Half the country is retarded and the other half are indifferent.
The really interesting part is that the closest to mainstream media coverage I can find on the web is a 2004 Op/Ed in the NYT and an article in Rolling Stone from 2006.
There's plenty of hits from various activist websites, but the above look to be about it for 'news coverage'.
As much as I hate replying to my own comment, another five minutes googling reveals: The typewriter you're looking for is the IBM Executive, Model D. It featured variable spacing, superscript characters (as required), and while the model D may not have been in every office, was a simple matter to order and use. It was also customisable in terms of individual keys being replaceable. I also note with interest the various font experts who have explained that the MS Times New Roman font has many differences from the IBM font that was used in the document in question (particularly in the numerals). Have a nice day.
No, we love toothless diplomacy not backed up by any credible threat of force. It works so well.
Except for ending slavery, the Nazis, communism, & securing American independence, war has never solved anything.
Diebold CEO Bob Urosevich, got fired years ago. He was not the CEO either....
Oh, I know about the Model D Executive - I referenced it several times in my post.
To change a character on the Executive, you would have to either replace a typebar, or solder on a new slug. Neither trivial.
And typefaces similar to what was shown on the copies of the memos would nto have been MS Times New Roman. A better choice would be Courier New. I found an excellent list of fonts for the Selectric Composer on this http://www.ibmcomposer.org/docs/Selectric%20Composer%20Operations%20Manual.pdf site, what a great manual! Not good matches for MS fonts there, but if I were trying to fake a typewriter in Windows after v3.1 or 3.11, I would find many good fonts to choose from. Go have a look. Many choices. If you are willing to use a Macintosh, so much easier, as ATM fonts have several typewriter-identical options, if I recall. Bodoni was pretty common back then. No problem faking a typeface on a computer. Even easier if you use something like a CPT, Genesis, or maybe OS/6 word processor, though having the originals would end the speculation.
I really doubt the Colonel had an Executive. Despite IBM's marketing-speak, Execs were not very common outside of the Fortune 100 at that time, or in certain specific industries. Having an Exec would not enhance routine correspondence for an ANG unit, and the first servidce agreement or repair invoice would get it tossed in a closet and something more affordable brought out to replace it. We charged 3-4 times Selectric costs for all proportional space machines, and more for the Selectric Composer. GSA permitted that.
Sadly, I am not yet convinced these documents are genuine. I can't say it's impossible that they are.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
What keeps an employer from saying "bring in your ballots, let me watch you fill it out for X, and give them to me to mail....or you are fired."? Feel free to replace 'employer' and 'fired' with other nasties.
"You saved 1968." - Ms. Valerie Pringle to the crew of Apollo 8
I am a voter from Georgia (USA) and am worried if they did this in two counties over, what happened elsewhere. Saxby Chambliss is my rep (keeping politics out of this) and if he did not win legally... The voting software should be open source where we all can harden it against hacking. The only thing I can say is that this makes a huge case for that to happen.
Parent++
One way to prevent successful election fraud is actually relatively simple. It needs several elements:
1. Any act or conspiracy to change the outcome of any Federal or state election by any means other than convincing voters to vote of their own free will, shall be a felony punishable by enormous fine and life imprisonment without parole or privilege.
2. Any law enforcement officer who becomes aware of any violation of this statute, and who fails to quickly and effectively prosecute that violation, shall be deemed to be a co-conspirator of that violation, and punished accordingly.
3. Any elected official of the United States who becomes aware of any violation of this statute, and who fails to quickly and effectively prosecute that violation, shall be deemed to be a co-conspirator of that violation, and punished accordingly.
4. An enormous reward (say, $1 billion) shall be paid for information leading to arrest and conviction under this statute.