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EU Wants Removable Batteries In iPhones
MojoKid writes "Current regulation, introduced with the Restriction of Hazardous Substances Directive (RoHS) in July of 2006, primarily
sought to prevent the unnecessary use of toxic metals in batteries as well as making it easier to recycle and dispose of used batteries. The updated 'New Batteries Directive,' as
discussed in
New Electronics by Gary Nevision, would go much further. Article 11 of the
directive, as currently written, would require that devices must be made in such a way as to allow batteries, either
for replacement or at end of life for disposal to be 'readily removed.' Of course, Apple's iPhones and iPods wouldn't meet this requirement, as it stands. It's obvious that an iPhone battery replacement program could be considered a cash cow for Apple as well."
Have you ever been in a car with an Apple product user? They like to leak farts in stealth. First, the car window will roll down for no apparent reason, then the fart will hit your nostrils for 3 picoseconds before its carried away by the turbulence.
Nice try, fanbois...but we still know that you can't control yer shitz.
You mean this iPhone battery replacement program?
$85.95! That's a lot of milk.
Slightly disreputable, albeit gregarious
I don't see how this would be a cash cow for Apple - they already replace batteries as often as they can. In fact, it's detrimental to the company since now people will simply replace batteries instead of buying a new iPod. In addition, converting their designs and manufacturing process will to meet this requirement will cost Apple dearly.
EU has a good point, for a change.
Yeah, when other phones have replaceable batteries, why not for the iPhone?
slashdot rocks
This is the EU basically trying to protect its markets for its own cell phone makers. I would think Nokia might be pushing for a regulation like this.
Watch carefully! There will probably be some nice sounding safety or environmental standard coming out of Washington somewhere that is the tit for this tat.
This is my sig.
Sounds like both slashdot and hothhardware are using the iPhone to get clicks. The regulation is not targeting the iPhone. The iPhone would just have to meet any new regulations that come out. Just like any other electronics device that uses batteries.
Workers to power!
Why do people even put up with Apple's shit any more? They're the worst!
Apparently after 400 recharges the battery is down to 80% of its life (I don't know how they've tested this). http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=327614
Given I've had to charge the battery twice a day on occasions and if you attach to a computer for itunes then that counts as a recharge, you can see how this would run out quicker than a normal battery.
Then again, you replace your phone every 18 months, why would you want a new battery when you're going to get rid of it soon?
The flip side of the coin is then Apple handheld products, like everything else, will be subjected to the usual flood of crappy, knock-off, sub-standard aftermarket batteries we've all come to know and hate passionately. Apple may have designed these devices in such a way that they've created a monopoly on battery replacement, but on the other hand at least you know you're getting a proper battery.
Apple is obsessed with thin packaging. Look at the iPhone, nano, or iPod touch. A removable battery would add a good 2mm of thickness, which may not sound like much, but thats a good 30% increase in thickness.
Test your net with Netalyzr
How about pacemakers and watertight radios? What about keychain LED flashlights which are typically sealed?
What exactly does "ready replacement at end of life" mean? If I can destructively cut the iPhone or LED flashlight in half with a hack-saw or other tool then extract the battery, that would appear to meet the requirement.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
Apple may win the award for best customer service yet it makes the customer handicapped. Like the mother that can not seem to stop "babying" you.
----- You know you have ego issues when you register a domain in your name.
Don't get confused, what the EU are after is a removable battery that can be safely disposed of. It is not the same as replacable.
ie, it might be perfectly acceptable to have the battery fitted in such a way it can easily be ripped off the surface mount on the motherboard for disposal but in the process destroying the ipod/iphone.
What we (the ipod using public) have wanted is a user-replaceable battery - but we're unlikely to get this because not only does it add to the cost, complexity and size of the product, it also more importantly makes it less easy for Steve to sell us a newer ipod in 2 years time when the battery is still working but at that annoying "just not quite enough battery to last me the day" level.
Please read my Canon EOS tech blog at http://www.everyothershot.com
Wouldn't this also cover laptops as well?
although most do have replaceable batteries, i can think of a few that do not, and more and more appear to be heading that way in the "compact notebook" realm.
To Gewalt et al: There are devices in use around the world that do not have easily-replaceable batteries. Watches. I do not see how the EU can defend their position on mobile phones and music players unless they apply this to watches as well. I have been purchasing Seiko Kinetic watches since they were introduced for that very reason. No batteries to replace. Kinetic energy (motion) charges a capacitor and the electricity is released as needed. My wife's Citizen watch uses solar, I think. I could see Apple coming up with a similar system; perhaps a hybrid solar/kinetic system. No batteries to replace, and no design compromises.
Shows what an ailing old man is made of. Not a heck of a lot. Money is only paper after all.
IMO this is another one of those articles that go "The does X, and ZOMG the iphone is affected because it sucks!!!one!".
Requiring replaceable batteries in every device is going to hit a lot more manufacturers than just Apple. Whether or not it's a justified regulation is a discussion I won't get involved with, but this is just needlessly criticizing Apple products.
I'm no Apple fan myself, but I just think this article is really missing the point.
Looking at the 3G iPhone I see two screw near the connector. Surely unscrewing those two screws would allow you to open the case to replace the battery? Or am I being overly optimistic? Has anyone even attempted to see how complicated it is?
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
Where the battery (according to shopblackberry.com, the manufacturer's official store) is $79.99, with free shipping.
In other words, the price is the same, except that RIM ships the battery to your door, whereas Apple charges $6 to collect your phone, install it, and ship it back.
(Other BB devices can be much cheaper, however, but shipping may be extra.)
As far as extended warranty programs, most are a rip off. The apple programs, however, at least on the pro laptops and the iphone, have shown value to me. These are expensive pieces of gear, and even 20% over a few years is not out of line. It takes care of the battery, and any damage. When you consider that ATT will charge you $175 in the US to break a contract, the $69 applecare is put into perspective, though it does not cover loss.
In general I would hate to see laws that required or forbade removable batteries. What I would like to see is more retailers forced to take back electronics that they sell, perhaps with a small discount if you buy an equivalent device. Straight money back might encourage theft. Non replaceable batteries are not an environmental problem, they are an engineering decision and customer preference. The envronmental problem is that consumers throw batteries and electronics away because there is no easy way to dispose of them properly.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
Batteries are more like $15 to them...
A removable battery would add a good 2mm of thickness, which may not sound like much, but thats a good 30% increase in thickness.
I agree, it would be worth it, it wouldn't be a bad 30% increase in thickness.
How do you know they are not targeting the Zune?
Looks like another anti Microsoft move by the EU to me.
Where's my tinfoil hat when I need it.....
The government has obviously bribed Apple to make batteries irremovable so that iPhone users can always be tracked via GPS.
3. Then users pay Apple to have a technician - who makes a low hourly wage - spend 15 minutes at most replacing the old battery with a newer one.
Replacing the iPhone battery needs much more than 15 minutes according to my experience if the battery is to be replaced only. If the battery is to be replaced with the new external metallic frame then it might be done in 15 minutes.
Thanks to apple's ingenious design once closed iPhone is difficult to open without making visible damage to the outside case, at least to my knowledge.
Replaceable batteries most likely end up in the trash and then the landfill and if a battery is replaceable the manufacturer of the device will most likely look for the cheapest source for those batteries since they assume that the consumer will simply buy a replacement placing the extra cost of a longer lasting battery on the consumer.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
... I mean seriously, it prevents battery standards from emerging by embedding the battery into the device itself. Small flash MP3 players have been using AAA and AA for a while, that is one thing that made me ditch hard disk based mp3 players was the lack of easily replaceable batteries.
Slightly OT, so mod away.
RoHS is just one of those outgrowths of a nanny-state mindset, but one that has bitten Apple before, ironically enough. One of the chips that was a display driver famously would become desoldered. This was a mechanical/packaging/board layout issue, but some good old lead-based solder would have been much more flexible. D--n that RoHS!
The EU also implemented a standard for products that mandates the harmonics that a power supply can reflect back onto the power lines. This affects power supply design. Of course, it makes supplies for the EU market more expensive because of the need for an added series choke on the mains wiring.
Only one year's battery life left.
Which is nice.
That Apple produce an iPod with replaceable batteries.
Hmmm?
Else it isn't a free choice, is it.
Another replacement won't work because apples DRM is not portable (and cannot be else it would be breakable and the RIAA would remove all songs from iTunes).
I personally feel the battery in every electronic device should be user-replaceable using commonly-available tools --and-- replacement batteries should be readily available. Too many people replace the item in question (and throw out/donate the old one) when the battery outlives its usefulness... But a donated iPod or cell phone with a dead battery is of no use to groups like the Salvation Army or Goodwill. So they end up getting tossed anyway... And you can put the blame squarely on the manufacturer that decided on a non-user-serviceable battery...
Of course, companies like Apple would fight such a law tooth-and-nail since someone might decide it's economically more logical to keep the old item and replace the battery than buy a new one. And what's good for Apple is good for America! (and China...)
Windows 3.1x calc: 3.11 - 3.10 = 0.00
What you do is pass a law that states that any device with a nonremoveable battery must include a service that will
(for a period of 150% of normal warranty time) AT THE MANUFACTURERS COST replace said battery this service will include
1 insured postage both directions
2 the battery itself
3 the labor to replace said battery
i would as a cookie to the OEMs let them include an "Upgrade by Replacement" program where you get a Factory New
upgraded unit for say 50% off (you send in an iPhone V1.2 and get a factory new iPhone V2.01)
Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge
compared to doing whatever they would have done if there hadn't been a replaceable battery and the battery stopped holding a charge. I.e. bin it.
FFS. Just because Apple have a product doesn't mean it's perfect.
I was a treo user for 4 years prior to getting my iphone about a month ago.
Not being able to swap out the battery for a fresh one was something that bothered me, especially once I started using the iphone and seeing that there are tons of great apps and practically endless uses for the damn thing.
I researched it and ended up buying a device that is slightly smaller (thinner) than a deck of cards made by APC (the UPB10) - it's an external battery charger - you charge it up and keep it with you. When your iphone (or PSP, other cellphone, or other electronic device) needs to be recharged you just plug it into the usb port on this thing and press the button. You can do passthrough charging, so that you are charging both the APC and the iphone at the same time too; http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=UPB10%20
It can completely charge my iphone 3g from dead to fully charged twice before I need to recharge it. It's smart and will turn off once it charges the phone completely. It also serves as a power source so you can use your phone while it is charging.
I got mine at Amazon for $60 and am very happy with the purchase.
From an environmental standpoint I am assuming all of these batteries can be recycled. From a privacy standpoint it would be nice to be able to remove the battery.
That's a business decision designed on purpose to make people want to upgrade more often than they need to. "oh well, this battery sucks now and the new models are out anyway, and..." That's how that works. Even larger ticket items with batteries like laptops that still have a good used market are almost invariably sold when the built in batteries are mostly hosed, it's a psychological deal there. Especially when the OEM replacement battery is half what the unit is worth, or even more. A variant on planned obsolescence. Anytime there is a hassle for user serviceability with any appliance or gadget, look in that direction. Look at cellphones, this is common as anything, the batteries can typically cost more than another brand new cheap phone of similar make/model. Here's a better analogy, inkjet printers and replacement carts. I don't know how many people just go get another cheap as heck printer once they get sticker shock on a black and white and color cartridge, compared to the cost of yet another cheap inkjet. I know it is false economy, but these manufacturers always seem to do this with parts and so on. I've never done the study but it would be intertesting to say take a car, and see how much it would cost to recreate it all with replacement parts at normal car parts store and then at dealers retail prices. I bet a 20 grand car would cost over a hundred grand if you tried to build one that way.
Anyway, I like that they are forcing the issue, sealed blackbox gadgets are not any sort of fav for me, just gives me the creeps being a long time nerd and tinkerer. If I can't open it up and play, I don't want the dang thing (probably why I don't own an ipod or iphone). I remember a long time ago going out and getting a long torx screwdriver just so I could take my mac (first computer I owned) 512k apart (still have it, BTW). That was annoying. Couldn't just use a normal phillips or anything. Just wanted to see the inside, hated not being able to do it easier without a special tool. Hate that "special tool" nonsense that manufacturers love..anything to gouge a few more pennies out of you or make it a hassle so you use their "special" repair shops.
They could require that any device with more than X grams of certain heavy metals, have a "refund" label so you could return the device for some cash payment, say $10 or so. That would keep the batteries mostly out of the ground water, and Apple could decide if they wanted a separate battery with the refund on it, or if the refund should apply to the whole device. There are a variety of ways to administer such programs, the company can be trusted to run it themselves or the company can be forced to pay the refund into a government administered program when the device is sold.
They could apply an excise tax to all the batteries, and use the revenue to clean up the effects. (Those kind of earmarked revenue programs, such as the fuel tax highway funds in the US, tend to be targets for legislative grabs, so that might not be as good as the first option.)
I like the idea of forcing the sellers to offer to buy back any dangerous chemicals they sell, for an indefinite period. For small companies that go out of business or change business regularly, or don't want to track that potential liability forever, a government corporation or a private corporation could provide that service for them -- the small company would pay Specialized Recycling Inc. $8 per device, and be allowed to slap a sticker that says "return to Specialized for $10 reward" on all the products. ( $8 is less than $10, because not all would be redeemed, and there would be competition in this area keeping the prices down. ) The redemption fee would be high enough to incentivize people to not throw them away if possible, and it would also encourage manufacturers to find ways to make their devices use less power, to use capacitors instead of batteries, or seek other technical solutions.
A simple ban on integrated batteries seems like it is not likely to keep the batteries out of the landfill. If anything, there are probably fewer batteries from iPhones in landfills precisely because of this anti-customer policy that you have to send them in to Apple to get them swapped (unless Apple is tossing the old ones).
That's correct - we seem to have legislation like this in Germany already. If you have, for example, a disposable toothbrush with an electric vibration motor and battery built in you have to allow the consumer to remove the battery and dispose of it separately (all stores that sell products with batteries in them have to take them back, and most often you'll find large collection boxes near the entrance). In the case of this toothbrush you break off the lower half containing the battery compartment to get the battery out; the toothbrush is ruined in the process.
-- Language is a virus from outer space.
The EU is NOT protectionist, in fact it's focused on free trade. If you're American, you should be one to speak. The US even violates WTO rules to prop up everything from US steel to Boeing.
Here's where to go if you have an iPod - you drill down by model, they include video instructions.
http://www.ipodbatterydepot.com/
It's not as easy as popping open the sliding compartment with a dime or fingernail like most devices, but the overall design is good enough to support this sort of after-market effort.
My kingdom for a /. day where an iPhone/iPod article doesn't lead to ZOMG PWNIES!!!! Please.
Pathological kinda promises Path + Logical - but instead, you get stuck with pathetic.
I have a PocketPC, which contains TWO batteries, the main one and a nonremovable auxiliary one which keeps the VRAM alive while the main one is drained or removed.
I doubt that the iXXXXes have any such backup battery system, which I imagine is a cost-saving manufacturing move when coupled with the nonremovable battery "feature."
Therefore, IMO, besides the obvious re-engineering required to build a battery door and bay and electric contacts, et c., they would have to make some kind of backup system to preserve whatever's in battery-backed RAM.. Hence the "shit, I got my iPhone back working but it's wiped!"
Of course, if the iXXXXes store their OS and related settings on the NV storage, this whole post is moot. I honestly don't know because I generally avoid things which seem to have to remind me that they were "Designed in California" (*oooooooooooooooooooooh!*)
0.020175,
Weasel
[BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY]: X5O!P%@AP[4\PZX54(P^)7CC)7}$EICAR-STANDARD-ANTIVI
I like Apple just fine, but what does this have to do with them, except that they are *one* of the makers of devices where the batteries can't be easily changed? I mean come on, not *every* news item is centered around the iPhone.
I have an old Palm Zire72. It is getting weak in the battery so wanted to change the batt. Fun! There is no simple way to do it save the special tool, carefully open Chinese box case and probably use tiny soldering iron trick...technician style. O! I AM a technician so this is right up my alley! But how about the rest of the non geek population that is does'nt know a screwdriver from the Brooklyn Bridge? I searched for this battery on the internet only to find a chorus of OTHER customers bleating for help, lost sheared sheep in a wilderness of, as it turned out, greed! A call to Palm, as their website was a worthless and shameless sales pitch for their new stuff whilst forgetting the old, brought out the not so surprising news that Palm would not sell the battery outright. They would only replace the battery if one sent the unit, customer cost, to Palm; and then Palm, for the paltry fee of about TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS UP FRONT would change the battery as part of a 'general servicing of no longer supported equipment. I hate to think of the spyware Palm might add as part of their 'servicing'. I only PAID about a couple of 'C' notes for the thing in the first place just a couple of years ago from Radio Shack. Can't find Palm stuff in Radio Shack these days. Maybe even they got tired of them. Guess I'll just use the thing, back it up frequently, and when the battery finally craps, take it apart and take a look. Probably find that its battery is a common hearing aid type of rechargeable. Laugh if it is a NiCd rechargeable AAA batt that was soldered in! Same with your fones. If you cannot get the battery out, rest assured the equipment it is in is beaming your location and identity to the whole world every second. Be aware that all this junk was put together by man, so it can be disassembled the same way. When not in use, crack the case, remove the batt, wrap the junk in foil. Good foil! And throw it into a metal toolbox and close the lid. End of SPIM. End of road signs that 'know your name....somehow'. End of being stopped unacountably by curious 'police' that 'wonder why you are an impermissable distance from home....even if you were never on any probation...end of mysterious e-mail from 'merchants in the area that you visited...etc
Nothing to stop Apple shipping the iPhone with a sticker saying "when device has reached end of life, simply snap phone in half and battery will pop out" or similar. The phone doesn't have to survive the swap.
Me, I kind of think I've been a cell phone user for well over 10 years, with at least 15 handsets, and I've never had a battery outlast the phone.
...thinking of buying an iPhone (1st one) until I saw that it had no easily replaceable by user battery... ...then I was thinking of buying an iPod Touch v2 until, again I saw that it had no easily replaceable by the user battery... ...and actually a replacement battery should be more in the neighborhood of $5 or less, unless you buy from a B&M retailer...
This type of thing is just cynical on Apple's part: pay almost as much as a new device would cost, buy a new device, or spend some amount of time (probably hours the first time around) disassembling a device not meant to be disassembled by the user, gank out what is likely to be difficult to do the old dead battery, put in and secure new one...
I'm dead set against non-easily user replaceable batteries since the Compaq(now HP) iCrap and it's battery that would die if not charged every single(or pretty close to that) day even if PROPERLY (according to documentation) stored. (I had the $%^&*#&*(# battery replaced twice under warranty, and had really expected the problem to be FULLY solved by the 2nd replacement, unfortunately all it got me was "free" battery that left me in no better of a situation than the first time around. I had had a couple other devices, not nearly as bad as the iCrap but bad enough, so the iCrap has entirely put me off on non-slotted batteries.
i.e. even if these batteries have better performance than the iCrap's, they will still need to eventually be replaced. I'd probably still have/be using that iCrap had it not had those sorts of problems as portable devices like these I usuallu use, if I like them, until they die or otherwise fall apart.