Slashdot Mirror
Midnight Commander Development Revived
richlv writes "Popular Unix console file manager Midnight Commander has experienced a stall for the last few years. Most distributions (including the conservative Slackware) shipped patched packages or snapshots. Despite that, everybody had a favorite bug or two — either inability to specify ssh connection port, or problems with interrupted FTP sessions. Or maybe copying of larger datasets. Or maybe the infamous 'shell is still active' message, which often brought unexpected changes of current directory with it. Whatever it was, we either cursed it every time, or learned to live with it. It seems that finally something many were waiting for has happened — there's some activity on mc development. Check out the new homepage, and let's hope revival is both healthy and lengthy."
Uh, why is the title red on the front page?
Yes, and let's welcome them back by taking down their webserver.
Nice job.
Yeah! Let's post about some obscure piece of software so unused not even unemployed open sores "programmers" want to touch it.
Yes, and let's welcome them back by taking down their webserver.
Nice job.
Seriously, three comments and the server's already 500ing?!? I had to get Winnertz Patrick's phone number from the whois information and call him to ask about the new MC.
It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.
Couldn't have been a very beefy webserver if the subscriber preview was enough to knock it offline. Insert lame and predictable jokes here.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
I'm still waiting for a restart on wmaker's development. anyone have any news about it ?
What ? Me, worry ?
I love mc!
I use it all the time for patch management. One little tidbit that most people do not know about mc is that you can cd into a patch. Edit the diffs in the patch, and copy a diff from one patch to another patch file, just like copying or moving a file.
Steven Rostedt
-- Nevermind
Can't we just let it die? How many people still must do mundane file management and don't have access to a GUI and whom don't use the commandline?
God, is it any wonder why Digg is kicking Slashdot's butt?! Keep this up and the mighty Slashdot will be nothing more than a niche site frequented by sticky men who proudly use pocket protectors.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
when he learns someone his cloning his file manager.
I'm interested to hear from MC users the advantages of MC over say konqueror with frames and fish to do remote file management.
Use the Firehose to mod down Second Life stories!
Yeah, um.
Why?
Why was it revived, or put another way, why did it die in the first place? Could it be because of one of the bugs you cited or the number of them or the fact that, well, why not just type 'cp' or 'mv' or whatever the frick problem this software was supposed to solve. In 1994.
Amish 2.0, now with computers but with the ui equivilient of a buggy.
Seriously, three comments and the server's already 500ing?!? I had to get Winnertz Patrick's phone number from the whois information and call him to ask about the new MC.
So not only is their server going to be down, but now their Web admin's phone is going to be ringing off the hook!
Way to go, dude.
My blog
I didn't get a 500, so here's a mirror: ;-) )
(not quite what I expected, to be honest
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/trac/web/api.py", line 339, in send_error
'text/html')
File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/trac/web/chrome.py", line 715, in render_template
return stream.render(method, doctype=doctype)
File "/var/lib/python-support/python2.5/genshi/core.py", line 179, in render
return encode(generator, method=method, encoding=encoding, out=out)
File "/var/lib/python-support/python2.5/genshi/output.py", line 60, in encode
return _encode(u''.join(list(iterator)))
File "/var/lib/python-support/python2.5/genshi/output.py", line 311, in __call__
for kind, data, pos in stream:
File "/var/lib/python-support/python2.5/genshi/output.py", line 753, in __call__
for kind, data, pos in stream:
File "/var/lib/python-support/python2.5/genshi/output.py", line 592, in __call__
for kind, data, pos in stream:
File "/var/lib/python-support/python2.5/genshi/output.py", line 707, in __call__
text = mjoin(textbuf, escape_quotes=False)
UnicodeDecodeError: 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xfc in position 1640: ordinal not in range(128)
Midnight Commander is one of the tools that I could live without, but I sure wouldn't want to. I use it all over the place ... on the Solaris servers and my Windows XP workstation here at work, on my Linux, OS/2, and Windows boxes at home, on my Nokia 770 tablet, etc.
It makes it easier to delete files and directory trees with certainty (and accuracy!), the built-in editor is good enough for modifying shell scripts and even making moderate code changes to more involved programs, its built-in FTP capability is invaluable when one has to flip a lot of files or directories between hosts, and its customizable menus and panelization capabilities can add some fairly powerful capabilities to even the most dedicated command-line user.
I love my Midnight Commander! :-)
Mainframe/UNIX Bit Twiddler and long time Windows/Linux Hobbyist.
The Theorem Theorem: If If, Then Then.
Not very lengthy, we slashdotted'em :)
...To mistype "mv".
Seriously, I can't say much about the merits of Midnight Commander as an actual program, but for years I've not-so-silently cursed it for its choice of executable names.
As Midnight Commander is a text mode application. It can be used locally and/or remotely, on the console or under the X Window System.
Do text apps still have a place in today's world? Heck, network speeds and capacities (read bandwidth) have improved a great deal. I would rather have these programmers focus their efforts on Krusader ? It seriously needs some love.
So Lame and Predictable walk into this bar...
It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.
They're doing development on Midnight Commander...I doubt they thought they were going to need a ton of resources.
Still, I'm glad to see 'em back. MC is a big help when you're working on the console.
ad logicam Claiming a proposition is false because it was presented as the conclusion of a fallacious argument.
Priceless. Dead as a doornail. *sigh* Still, it's nice to see MC being developed again. (Or not see in the case of what we've done to the server. See? This is why we can't have nice things!)
MC is always my go to file manager in Linux. I've tried other graphical clients, and none cut it for ease of use and simplicity.
All hail Midnight Commander's victorious return!
Server is down...anyone have screenshots?
... Lame fell over and Predictable smiled.
While we're resurrecting old text mode utilities, can we get a modern Magellan clone? None of the search front-ends to stuff like Spotlight or Beagle that I've tried come close to being as cool as Magellan was.
By the way, does Magellan still work on Windows? The last time I tried was probably on XP SP1.
Midnight commander is a classic example of making things too easy. Anyone that can't or doesn't want to use command line tools has no business moving files around on any unix machine.
It's windows mentality to patronize users, it's not unix mentality.
I can't find a SourceForge page for the Predictable project. Can you point me to some info on it?
The two programs that drive me bonkers are mc and vi. Why? because I'm not savvy to their syntax and their is no obvious way to get out of them once you launch them. Control-c and control-d and control-z all seem to get captured by mc.
So many times I've accidentally typed mc when I meant something else!
Of course by now I've memorized that :q gets me out of vi.
I suppose you could give the same lament about emacs but one never accidentally types "emacs". Most unix command lines are 2 letters so one has the muscle memory habit of typing them. So it's very easy to type mc or (less frequently) vi accidentally.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
... when GNUIT (previously GIT) is out there ?
Smaller, faster, compiles fine on all platforms with any C compiler and it only requires curses.
And most impportantly it doesn't crashes and it doesn't corrupsts files like MC does.
1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
I am not a command line hacker - mc has always been a VERY important tool I install in just about every box I've ever set up.
Glad to see it's not forgotten about
*DrugCheese rants*
Sorry for this.
There are currently over 2000 different IPs online on the webserver _per minute_. We are currently looking for a solution to fix this as fast as possible :S Sorry for the downtime (and thanks for your excellent DoS! :))
Just having the windows compilable option in the source code would be really nice. Being able to produce a 64 bit windows command line executable would be sweet.
Seriously, three comments and the server's already 500ing?!?
It was probably running Dolphin.
One of our competitors trademarked the term "hypothesis". From now on, we will call them "boneheaded ideas".
> The two programs that drive me bonkers are mc and vi. Why?
> because I'm not savvy to their syntax and their is no obvious way
> to get out of them once you launch them.
So F10 for QUIT is too hard, especially when it's actually printed on the key bar (which in every distro I tried was always set to be displayed by default)?
C'mon man...
First things first: I love MC and thanx for keeping it going.
Question though: anyone know why sometimes the windows and frames of MC don't display right via SSH (instead of lines you get funky characters and even files you highlight flip in space). On other servers it works just as nicely as it does locally. Any ideas what the cause of this weirdness is and how to fix it?
I love mc
--==## Who Frags Ya? Baby! ##==--
Okay.. thanks for taking down my/our webserver.. however most of the people will be interested in the sourcecode (at least I hope so).
For those which only want to have the code, please have a look on this git mirror:
http://repo.or.cz/w/midnight-commander.git
as I've currently took down the webserver because it makes no sense to let him running this way. I'll search for a solution as fast as possible.
Greetings
Patrick Winnertz
on behalf of the MC Development Team
I understand what you are saying. Sadly, it is this very paradigm that will keep us from "world domination" yet we have the resources.
Sad indeed! 10 years from today, we'll still be where we are now...you might ask: Where? I would answer: STUCK in the corridors of irrelevance when it comes to the desktop.
The function key line showing "10 QUIT" is displayed on the bottom left by default, the "eXit" option is displayed under the File menu in an obvious place at the bottom, and typing "exit" at the command line will exit the program just like it does any other shell.
With all due respect, what other information would you like? And how more obvious could it be?
I agree that quitting isn't obvious if you don't think of it as a shell AND if you don't have your F-keys properly defined in your xterm or ssh client, but that's a user issue, IMO.
Equating the mc UI with the vi UI is ... silly.
Mainframe/UNIX Bit Twiddler and long time Windows/Linux Hobbyist.
The Theorem Theorem: If If, Then Then.
Arrrgh! They started rewritting it in Python! Tough bastards.
Priceless. Dead as a doornail.
He's just pinin' for the fjords!
Anyone else regret not getting attached to tools like MC years ago?
There are a few tools that pop up whenever people discuss the easiest or best way to do a task... and I always wish I had made the investment of time to get proficient with those tools. However it almost seems too late.
For example, vi and emacs... I am sure they are great, but the investment of time to get proficient makes it hard to justify even trying. So on my headless linux boxen I use nano, I can do everything I need to do without a cheatsheet.
MC is the same way... I have tinkered with it, but I always found myself exiting to the command line because I would find something I didn't know how to do and didn't want to take the time to figure it out.
Does anyone have any tips on how to best add these types of tools to your tool set when you've mastered an alternative. Simply saying to use it doesn't take into consideration productivity.
Are these tools worth investing personal time into, say instead of studying for a certification or something. Are the gains really that significant?
Sometimes the best solution is to stop wasting time looking for an easy solution.
I remember before Linux my first hint at this was Volvalk|sp?| Commander, that some Russian uploaded on my BBS. It was great when I got Linux in 1994 messing with the commands I did a MC and I was quite happy to see it.
Yes I am sure people will point out all of those are based on Norton Commander, but still, I lay out my windows like in MC for me to work.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
Sorry for this.
There are currently over 2000 different IPs online on the webserver _per minute_.
Welcome to 1997.
(oh, wait, this is the Midnight Commander team that we are talking to)
Er, dude, this Slashdot thingi has been doing this to webservers for over a decade now! Good morning, and welcome to 2009!
It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.
I think I've heard this one. Not a fan.
Hi All,
I hope that a windows version gets maintained in the official repository. Are there reasons why it currently isn't ? I mean, if git source control system can have an windows version maintained in the official repository, is it so difficult for mc ?
Thank you,
BR,
~A
I remember before Linux my first hint at this was Volvalk|sp?| Commander,
Volkov Commander? (Warning: The URL given links to a page that may cause uncontrollable flashbacks to the Web circa 1995. Proceed with caution.)
Unarguably the true descendant of Norton Commander, and it has gone open source recently!
Proper archive support, plug-in architecture, etc,etc.
http://www.farmanager.com/
I don't even consider touching any pc running Windows without a copy of this jewel.
and both of them act in a way stereotypical of their respective minority groups
While I'll be glad to see the resurrection of Midnight Commander, I'm not chomping at the bit because I think that the Worker file manager is a much better alternative. Its design will be immediately recognizable to those who have spent any time with the Amiga because it is based on (which is a nice way of saying it's a virtual copy of) Directory Opus. Check it out. You won't be disappointed.
MuCommander is pretty good. It even has a dorky icon.
http://www.mucommander.com/
photosMy Photostream
If you have valid criticisms of mc, then you now have an opportunity to have them addressed or even participate in the fix.
If you don't use it, what does it matter to you?
I find mc to be at times the best tool to use, sometimes not.
"I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it." : Dogbert
don't most people who like the unix command-line like to /avoid/ huge bloated pieces of crap?
Except that if you're running MC in gnome-terminal, F10 doesn't work (it brings up the window menu. Now you might say why am I running MC in GT, but we all know that linux users can't stay away from the command line...
Why would I configure my F-keys in ssh just so that they will work in a program I never ever intend to use? that would be insane.
there is no program I use (deliberately) that requires F-keys.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
So F10 for QUIT is too hard...
C'mon man...
Unless of course you are using ssh and the F keys don't work. C'mon man... think.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
As much as I've tried, I can't get used to mc's rather emacs-like excessive use of modifier keys. Does anyone know of a similar program - or even better a modification of mc - which is more vi-like and uses 'modes' instead of Ctrl et al?
"A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire
Here you go:
~/root#
Comment removed based on user account deletion
My question is, why? Why revive MC. It is from the dark ages. Who cares if someone feels they need to revive it. If they want to work on something, why not donate their time to work on projects that are more current and relevant. Oh sure, it's cool,yup, MC sure is. That's why no one really cared if it went the way of the doe doe before. Whatever.
You can get it working by right-clicking on the terminal, and unchecking Show Menubar. Then F10 works.
You're upset that some people have interests different from yours?
You, sir, are a dodo.
...just so that they will work in a program I never ever intend to use?
:-)
The only times I have ever used mc have been by accident. I have an occasional tendency to hit the "c" key instead of "v", so have found myself somewhere else when all I wanted to do was move a file.
My solution here is simply to delete mc.
Thanks!
Why does the new site try to load trac_session cookies repeatedly ? Is it necessary to store data on my computer in order to run a web site advertising an open-source program ?
They do on my keyboard.
i used it to get a file out of an rpm on a server once. was much faster than learning the rpm syntax to do it. glad to hear it's back.
You are retard?
Mongoloid?
Use Alt+0 instead (works for the other function keys too!)
If my call is important, why am I talking to a recording?
You can also deselect the "Enable the menu shortcut key (F10 by default)" option in gnome-terminal's Keyboard Shortcuts dialog, accessible via the Edit menu.
most of what follows is true
24 pictures per second, that should do it and I don't even need to press any button, just need to wave it in the air, it should be enough, and more discrete...
You can do most anything from MC. I use it to play video, games many things. You can bind a file extension to a command and just hilight and hit enter (F9/Command/Edit Extension File/User). I run my 1000 doom wads out of MC as well as all my vids. Even play DVDs one vob at a time sometimes.
Hard to beat and manages files just fine.
Esc-0 will do what you want whatever the terminal (and the same approach works for any other function key). Some of the more persistent Unix anachronisms actually have their uses.
Anybody noticed the MC mailing lists are "(mc|mc-devel)(AT)gnome.org"??
If you noticed, didn't this give you an ill omen about it?
Colorless green Cthulhu waits dreaming furiously.
Don't you mean "long and prosper"?
Ever tried Krusader? After finding it I don't use mc that much...
but we all know that linux users can't stay away from the command line...
I must admit, I fall into this camp. I'm constantly running gdm from the command-line.
Everyone should use the tools that fit their needs, yes. I _loved_ norton commander on DOS, yes. I even made my Win 95 boot into DOS 7, not the GUI.
But it took me less than three months of using Linux to leave mc behind. Bash was so much more powerful and versatile, I stopped using mc altogether. And that was before I found out about zsh..
I don't want to troll, change anyone's opinion or anything. I just want to know where the use case of mc is, these days. And "I prefer it, go eat a broom." is a perfectly valid answer :)
You are a complete idiot
Then don't use gnome-terminal and try konsole or other terminal emulation for X or you can use the pointing device to close MC.
C'mon man
Yeh, I too, was thinking something along the lines of "Midnight Commander-In-Chief"... LOL!
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
Krusader. It's the KDE based MC clone.
I'm sure there are purists out there who don't want the KDE libs on their machines or aren't into this newfangled GUI stuff. Who want that horrible looking interface on a console. But me, I think Krusader is way slicker than MC.
And did I say TABS? Sweeet.
> no, yes, maybe (tagging beta)
MC has been my friend since it was NC. I hope Peter Norton is proud of his creation, and what it spawned.
These days on 'nix, it's been just as an invaluable tool as it was on DAS platforms.
I just wish they'd add secure FTP. My kludge is a script that mounts remote systems via fuze-ssh prior to calling MC, but of course this only works where I have access to the remote side's private key.
Best of luck with the continued development!
Use Esc, then 0. Works for function keys from 1 to 10 (Esc, 0 = F10).
M-0 also works (which might be typed as Esc 0).
Thanks! I have missed that option previously. You've saved me a click on the "F10" label when I want to close mc.
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality;..."
Once you learn Emacs, you want to stay in it. But, for managing files, Dired just isn't as good as the old Midnight Commander. In fact, no file management system I've used in the last twenty years has been as good as MC.
Fortunately, someone has created a mode to emulate Midnight Commander, built upon a Dired base. See the Sunrise Commander .
try ESC 0 (zero). Others: F9 -> ESC 9 and so on...
Is this
People who boot headless servers off of small SSDs are "purists" now?
A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
This is interesting to hear! I thought development had really kind of died out after Miguel started with the GNOME thingie, guess I was wrong (ofcourse I only implemented some recursive copy / move / delete functions which have probably long been rewritten).
Awesome though that there's apparently still people out there that actively use it, god, it's been SO long!
MuCommander is an excellent alternative to the various stale *commanders out there.
www.mucommander.com
It runs perfectly on Windows, Linux and Mac. It's fully keyboard navigatable. Has an extensible UI through XML and gives me access to SMB, SFTP, Bounjour, etc in the same interface!
Highly recommended for Commander fans and anyone who works on multiple platforms and is looking for a consistant File Manager experience.
Thanks for the tip... I shall check out Krusader next time I have a KDE setup to play with. -- For me, MC makes linux tolerable; I couldn't stand to be without it. It lets me see the underhood stuff I'm used to being able to see in DOS/Win. (I think it's normal to root around inside binaries, why do you ask? :)
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
You can get MC for Windows??
(And being used to similar tools for DOS/Win, like XTree... I couldn't STAND linux without MC. Gotta have it!!)
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
For the longest time gmc was the finest graphical file manager for Linux and has in some ways yet to be surpassed. I remember when Nautilus was just an announcement and all good GNOME users used gmc. It worked well, it was *fast*! It had none of the problems Nautilus still has.
I went looking for a new version last year, having for the first time in a while a need for a GUI file manager, only to find that the gmc stuff had been removed from mc! I am shocked, dismayed and saddened.
If anyone is doing mc again, please look in to re-adding gmc.
I want my Cowboyneal
.., to the way back machine. Would love to see a "XTGold" sort of manager for UNIX.
I would love to have a fully working version of Directory Opus for *nix. It's the application that made Windows usable for me and the only file manager on any OS that doesn't suck.
Q: Can I easily run Krusader on a server I need shell into?
A: Umm.... I don't see why not. Just install and configure an entire desktop environment(as well as this tool), then log out. Now you can start a remote xsession with the server and tada!
(I've never quite understood the GUI desktop versions of this tool. Be it gnome-commander, krusader or whatever)
Anyhow, I'm glad to har that mc is going to get some needed attention. It's amazing that it remains as useful as it is, seeing how long it has been feature frozen.
Or from gnome-terminal menu...
Edit >> Keyboard Shortcuts...
Uncheck "Enable the menu shortcut key (F10 by default)"
You can of course, run Krusader locally and browse your remote box via SSH by supplying the path as:
fish://user@myserver
Yes I know not the same as having full console access. But to me, a very nice in between, esp for copying lots of scattered files from one box to the other.
> no, yes, maybe (tagging beta)
Hmmmn to anyone using mc in an invironment where the Fkeys don't work... There is a two key command sequence you could try... press and release the esc key then press and release a number...
esc 5 should emulate F5 and pop-up the copy input box... esc 0 should do F10...
I don't know why I can't find this in "man mc" But It's worked for a long time...
Alternatively if your using gnome I'll bet mouse support works, So you might try clicking on the label that says quit at the bottom of the screen... (you can also click on the menu choices at the top of the screen...)