Slashdot Mirror
Cats "Exploit" Humans By Purring
An anonymous reader notes a BBC report on research recently published in the journal Current Biology, indicating that cats manipulate humans by adding a baby-like cry to their purring. "Cat owners may have suspected as much, but it seems our feline friends have found a way to manipulate us humans. Researchers at the University of Sussex have discovered that cats use a 'soliciting purr' to overpower their owners and garner attention and food. Unlike regular purring, this sound incorporates a 'cry,' with a similar frequency to a human baby's. The team said cats have 'tapped into' a human bias — producing a sound that humans find very difficult to ignore."
was the one who tagged this on drugs? hardware? power?
Assuming that the cats are in fact intelligent creatures, it would make sense that they have learned this behavior. Feral cats do not exhibit this behavior, so it is most likely learned or self-developed.
However, it could also be that the constant exposure to humans and the direct selection of cats which humans like the most by the owners has led to a selection bias for cats with this behavior.
I find it hard to believe that this is somehow one of those hokey "100th monkey" behaviors, but I also find it extremely interesting that this behavior is widespread.
I seem to be 95% immune to my cats when they pull tricks like that. My cats know damn well that I'll feed them before going to bed. It can happen anywhere between coming home and right before actually going to bed.
My cats are persistent, make no mistake, and my wife can be very annoyed with them, but I usually wait until I happen to feel like feeding them. So if their mewling is comparable to a baby's cry I shudder to think what kind of dad I'd make ;).
I should mention, though, that they have dry food available at any time so it's not like they're hungry when I feed them. It is actually a very interesting way to learn to not give in to annoying behaviour.
Don't forget that cats self-domesticated so the the evolution of this kind of behaviour would have been baised from the begining.
I have never in my whole life experienced a purr that had ANY recognizable component of "baby cry" in it. Further, purring does not prompt me to do anything for the cat... with the cats I have known, it has always been a sign that they were already content.
http://scienceblogs.com/notrocketscience/2009/07/cats_manipulate_their_owners_with_a_cry_embedded_in_a_purr.php linked by another slashdot article. I mean, within a hop I think of another article.
I assume I have bad hardware as I never respond to any kind of cat purring, or wait, maybe I have dog version of hardware.
Anyway now I think I might have been exploited by puppy eyes like in the movies.
are cats poised to take over the world? Or is the exploitation thing only limited to catfood?
You have no chance to survive make your time
Geez, haven't you ever seen this documentary?
i noticed years ago my cat used to put on this special voice that seemed to elicit some kind of unconscious reaction in me. second time around at cat owning the little wench has tried it once or twice but i'm immune to it, the first cat overdid it and it stopped working for him.
when i first read this article i thought it was talking about the 'chirping' that cats do when they are extra happy purring, or maybe something a female cat a friend of mine has does a lot, these quiet, semi-pur semi-miao chirpy noises.
cats are more intelligent than many of their owners, and the fact that the cats are able to manipulate their owners just proves it. my cat doesn't manipulate me though. i eventually see through her little ploys. except the one that makes me like having her around of course.
You know i think its more a subtle effect...not some mind controlling thing ^^ I mean, pretty much everyone thinks that cats are cute...right ?
Me actually it would make more angry. No food kitty...
God's gift to chicks
n/t ^)
Cats that make the most attractive noise get fed most. Have the most offspring. Eventually dominate. Given what we've done to dogs by selective breeding in just a thousand years or so, this is a simple and believable scenario. Selecting cats for their purr is no more extraordinary than, say, the difference we've created between a spaniel and a Mexican Hairless.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
What, in the name of Zeus's butt-hole, does this have to do with hardware?
science, artificialselection, hardware, power, story
hardly, no, no, no, a bad one
I for one welcome our new cat overlords!
Loban Amaan Rahman ==> Anagram of ==> Aha! An Abnormal Man!
everything.
you mean this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0ffwDYo00Q
Steve -- If you have to call it a system, you don't know what it is.
When a dog looks at you it thinks "What can I do for you master"
When a cat looks at you it thinks "If I had hands I could open my own cans, and you'd be dead"
It's not really hard to ignore. It's just that when they purr they know and you know that you'll feel like a jerk if you don't pet them/feed them/whatever. So you choose to do what they want every time.
Which... doesn't sound all that different from being hard to ignore in text. My point is, it's more us playing into their hands than them exploiting us. We choose to submit to their will, cause, well... kitty. If you don't do what they want you feel bad and they keep on purring to annoy and remind you that you feel bad and should feel bad. If you placate them, they shut up, you feel good, and you get to pet a kitteh. That way, everyone's happy. ...maybe they do exploit us.
In fact, pretty much any animal - even my goldfish, can be conditioned to respond to a food stimulus - they know what precedes them being fed and act accordingly.
The only surprising thing about this is that the cats haven't got their owners better trained in all this time.
politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
Stuff with brains can learn.
+= E
Over 50 replies and nobody resorted to LOLcats and the associated mangling of the English language.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Never get a cat.
I visit a area of Korea about 3-4 times a month that has a very high feral cat population. These cats here make almost a perfect immiation of a baby's cry. I don't mean it's on the same frequency or anything, but it actually sounds like it. More than once I was fooled into thinking it was an actual baby.
I asked a few of the older locals and they told me they always sounded like it, while the newer locals tell me they still get suprised at night (they sometimes lurk the apartments).
it's still better than "cats exploit humans by taking their credit card and buying cat food online".
Doesn't suprise me. I had a cat that had recognizable sounds when being with his kitten or when asking us for food. You can even swear it tries to spell my name. I'm pretty sure they will dominate the world one day.
What, you don't pork your cats?
... cats wouldn't be purring at all.
What?
It's not brushing you up for food, it's wiping it's arse. Now who's the sheep?
Self domesticated!? Surely by definition domestication is an externally enforced process, one in which the powerful enforces/trains a useful/preferable mode of behavior over the weak. To Self-domesticate would simply mean to evolve, to have certain traits preserved due to their being conducive to cohabitation with humans.
I wonder if this is related to an odd cat vocalization I've seen. At least three (non-overlapping) cats I've had over the years, make a vocalization (kind of a murrmurrmurr half-meow with their mouths closed) when they're in a happy or friendly mood.
I've never heard other cats make this sound, so I was wondering if there was something I was doing in their upbringing to bring it out (some sound I was making they were trying to imitate, or picking up on the fact that the sound gets them attention?
Love many, trust a few, do harm to none.
A sheep does not climb the bed backboard so it can jump on you when the alarm goes off. Sheep brains lack a convoluted surface; cats do not. -- When Czars are outlawed, only outlaws will have Czars.
I despise cats, I can't imagine why you cannot buy Cat Poison in the Hardware right next to Rat Poison.
Yet my mother in laws cat still tries to brush up to me for food. I have never fed it, I simply push it away (Gently, my mother in law seems to be fond of it) but after many years of being pushed away it still tries.
It has the learning power of a sheep.
It fell for "Hope and Change" hook-line-and-sinker, too, and voted for Obama?
It has the learning power of a sheep.
Don't insult sheep! At least they don't kill other animals for fun and entertainment.
Women do the exploit very much better. Why not cats?
My mothers cat was a companion to her beyond something on 4 legs that just wanted food.
Highlighted by the animal's actions previous to my mother suddenly passing away. For several weeks the cat would never leave her side, as she became ill. Then mom passed away suddenly in her sleep. The autopsy revealed a ruptured cyst around a cancerous growth on the large intestine. For a couple weeks previous to her death, she had complained the cat was licking the area just under her ribcage. The doctors were confused as to the raw area of skin on her belly area. The cat knew, and I believe was an effort to heal my mother the only way a cat knows how.
In post Patriot Act America, the library books scan you.
Let's see ... what's the slashdot meme for situations like this ...
In Soviet Russia, cats ... no
I for one welcome our new cat ... no
4) Profit ... no
Oh, I remember now ... Water is wet, film at 11.
cats would *bark* if we only feeded them when they barked?
Hmmm,
Since when is a cats arse on its neck ?
I always suspected that they did. In fact, even rabbits and dogs do that kinda stuff. Not exactly voice modulation, but, you know, making that cute round face, running up to you and licking your legs whenever you grab something to eat from the kitchen. I seriously doubt the fact, however, that cats specifically found out what frequency our babies cry at, and then copied/used that frequency in their cries for food. It could be a coincidence.
RutSum.com
Man, I really do hope they release a patch for this soon.
Cats are the only "domesticated" animal that can go from domesticated to feral and back at will.
You can release your house cat into the wild and (assuming they do not get eaten by a predator) they will survive just fine. You can also take a feral cat and domesticate it in very short order.
E.L. Thorndike's experiments investigating learning were conducted using cats and while B.F. Skinner may have used rats more than cats, he too used cats in his studies of learning.
If you want to study an animal's intelligence / learning capabilities / reasoning capabilities you just have to be smart enough to construct the experiment properly.
If you're not familiar with those experiments (and your post suggests you are not), E.L. Thorndike studied cats learning to escape from boxes to get food. Pretty good motivators for cats (unless it's in need of "boxhab").
Not too dissimilar from arguments over whether men or women are smarter -- it is key to control for equally-valued motivators when assessing that :-)
If you want to see what domesticated looks like, look at dogs, or horses. Domesticated dogs and horses take their instructions from human masters. Cats, as a rule, don't.
If you want to see what non-domesticated looks like, have a feral cat in your house for an hour or two. Or a feral dog.
If you and your house survive, congratulations. Cats ARE, in fact, domesticated animals, as are dogs- because they have early and often human contact. If kittens (or puppies) are not handled frequently once they get beyond a certain stage, they won't recognize or trust humans.
Please help metamoderate.
cats have not tapped into anything at any time. it was already their normal attitude. cats psychologically see humans as their mothers. both men, and women alike. it doesnt matter. therefore they do all stuff they do to their mothers, to their human companions. no surprise they also make that sound.
to 'tap' into such a thing would require a cat to observe a baby, then imitate him/her. yet, how many cats that were in the research have observed a baby crying ? how many cats were raised with a baby ?
this thing has to be just another instinctive behaviour cats do to their mothers at early age. i wonder why this schmuck didnt research whether baby cats also do that to mother cats.
Read radical news here
to a cat, human owner is a mother. they exhibit all behavior they do to their mothers to their human owners.
Read radical news here
If you are spending this much time and energy owning, emoting, or analyzing a canine or feline instead of using all that wasted emotional energy on an actual human being, you are the problem.
I'm a satanic clam.
In Soviet Russia, the government controls the commerce.
Strange, just recently, here in the U.S. it has become that way as well.
I read Slashdot for the headlines, because the headlines, unlike the articles, are usually original and never duplicated
Cats that make the most noise get fed most. Have the most offspring. Eventually dominate.
Now if evolution would be true, then we would have cats premanently yowling like a siren from a firetruck.
Thus there remains only the option of an intelligent designer who keeps the noise of these furbeasts at a tolerable level.
I hope this was in the "Related work" section...
Yes, cats are manipulative. In fact, when cats purr, it means they are premeditating nefarious machinations with intent to destroy not only you, BUT ALL MANKIND!!1!
Get a grip people.
SEO Copywriter. Just Say ON
I remember in South Africa I was told that African Wild Cats, and wild cats in general, don't vocalise in the same way that domestic cats do - unless they're brought into regular contact with humans, in which case they very quickly start to make typical "meow" noises, probably in response to human voices. The meows disappear within a generation if the cats are released back into the wild. However, the purr is common to wild and domesticated cats, and to big cats, so it does raise the question of whether it's natural selection or learning behaviour that leads to the "baby cry" component.
We could possibly call this pussy power....
I have never observed our two cats (they are siblings) meowing to each other; But the male (Panther) usually is _not_ afraid to utter sound when he wants to be let out / in, or needs some attention - food that is.
The female (Tiger) usually just inserts her claws into my toes when I'm sleeping... and get a very quick response.
The cats are ~14 months old now, and I have submitted my will to their wants... They own me :-)
-
Base!
so this purring doesn't work on me except to get me to toss em at the wall.
Mod me up/Mod me down: I wont frown as I've no crown
was the one who tagged this on drugs? hardware? power?
It's because the cats are drilling. (watch from about 1:24)
"Empathise with stupidity, and you're halfway to thinking like an idiot." - Iain M. Banks
Interestingly enough, that is my house, except I'm the one with the cat. My wife often complains that I pay more attention to the cat.
I'm so tempted to tell her that if she were cute and cuddly I'd pay more attention to her. That, and the cat doesn't mind when I pet her.
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
How are you Gentleman?
All your base are belong to us
you are on the way to destruction
-CATS
You seem to know nothing of cats. They don't rub to ask for food. They rub to mark territory (you) or family (your mother in law and your spouse). The difference in rubs: side of the mouth rub for territory, forehead bump/rub for family.
I dunno. We might also get Jessica Alba in heat every three months. This could work to our advantage...
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything. - Neitzsche
theory of mind.
For them to manipulate us, they've got to have some understanding of those things. I know my smarter cats do, and they make for great companions because of that.
Blogging because I can...
Sometimes cats view people as other cats.
I saw a special once where a bunch of female cats on a farm developed a community. They would feed each others kittens and arrange patrols to keep aggressive males away from the young. It was communal. They were a band of mothers doing a community job.
And we have one cat here who decided same thing. We have three cats, two from a rescue shelter that were fixed as kittens, and one we found in our backyard pregnant. The cat that went through motherhood has mothering instincts, the other two do not.
Two years ago my wife got pregnant.
The mother cat knew exactly what was up, the other two did not. She would sit on her belly off to the side of the bulge and purr beside the child which would calm him down and make him sleep. She became very gingerly and delicate towards my wife. The other two didn't change their behavior - they'd step on my wife's belly and had no clue they were disturbing a baby.
On the day the kid was born I stopped back from the hospital to feed the cats. I'm sure to a cat's senses I reeked of blood and birth. Mother cat was staring at me wild eyed with suspicion, taut as a bow string. I had never seen her so tense. I spoke to her in reassuring tones and let her smell my hands where I was holding the baby. As soon as she smelled "the baby is ok and dad here didn't hurt him" she took off like a rocket and ran laps around our house. She's very fat and I had honestly never seen her run before. The cat was celebrating. I know that seems unlikely and the sort of anthropomorphizing that pet owners often times overdo - but I swear...she was celebrating! She ran a few laps around the house, jumped on one of the other cats and went for a tumble, then started loving all over me. She knew. She is lethargic otherwise. A burst of energy from this cat is completely out of character. She knew.
When the kid got home she "helped". You get a lot of visitors from people you don't see very often with a newborn in the house. Soon as one would show up, she would position herself near the baby, and *watch* the guest. Her intent was clear. "Harm that kid, do anything I don't like and I'll shred your face" It was the same pose and watchfulness she would do when her kittens were around (which we took to a no-kill shelter eventually - the same one we got our other two worthless cats from).
And the cat would praise me for being a good parent. Male cats are more of a danger to kittens than a benefit. It seemed at first she was worried it was the same with people. Any time she'd see me being good to the kid (feeding/playing/whatever) she would make it a point to come up to me and love on me. Purr louder than a lawnmower and rub on my legs. She is a very vocal proponent of good parenting. Soon as I set the kid down she'd stop. Pick him back up, she's on again.
But as for our other two cats - you're right. They definitely view us as parents, not equals. They will do that "kneading" thing with their front paws cats do when they sit on our laps. That's something kittens do to get more milk out of their mother. It's a baby reflex and they do it with us. But mom cat does not - she views us as fellow parents in the pack. So your observation is true if you have cats that have never been through parenthood, but occasionally that's not the case. YMMV though, of course. Cats are definitely unique individuals.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
I must confess to not knowing a whole lot about Rats either.
You seem to know about cats, how do I keep them, and their shit out of my garden, other than using a BB gun ?
I have one cat that plays fetch with itself.
Give her a hi-bounce ball, the little elastic balls that you get for pocket change out of vending machines at the store. She'll pick it up and carry it to the top of the stairs. Then swat it and watch it bounce down the stairs. Soon as it gets to the bottom she'll haul ass and pounce on it. Carry it back to the top and repeat.
First time I caught her doing it I was on my computer around 1 am. I kept hearing *boomp*..*boomp*...*boomp boompboomp*...boomp... I couldn't figure out what the hell I was hearing. It was the cat bouncing the ball down the wooden stairs to the basement.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
Come on - we partnered with dogs 70k years ago or so, and what happened? We sat around, scratched/licked our private parts, hunted (a little), and hung out and told stories.
Then, maybe 12k-20k years ago, cats domesticated us, and the next thing you know, we're doing agriculture, and building civilization... so that they could live in the manner in which they intended to become accustomed.
It's all their fault...
mark
--
The truth will out: someone got it at last:
Dogs have masters; cats have staff.
How to tell if your cat is plotting to kill you.
This is why I normally use and recommend preventive kicking with cats, lest they hypnotize you with their little cute purrrrrrrrs...
To which my response is always a strong shove away. I am no cat's property or territory.
Owners may have suspected as much, but it seems our own human babies have found ways to manipulate their owners. Researchers have discovered that human babies use crying, begging, laughing, acting cute and sad eyes in order to overpower their owners and garner attention and food.
-- Knowledge shared is power lost. -- Aleister Crowley
More to the point...
Say a cat jumps on a table and you punish the cat for jumping on the table. Does this deter the cat from jumping on the table? Probably not because the cat is likely to misinterpret what the punishment was for. Sometimes the cat thinks that it is a no-no to be CAUGHT jumping on the table. Jumping on the table is fine, just don't be caught doing so.
I have never fed it, I simply push it away (Gently, my mother in law seems to be fond of it) but after many years of being pushed away it still tries. It has the learning power of a sheep.
Oh, it learns. Cats know who doesn't like them, and take pleasure in annoying them.
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
Damn script kitties.
I've read a little bit about this and I have a theory that (similar to cats) dogs act in a why that could be perceived as caring or love for their owner but are really trying to give the impression to their owner that they are only doing that because whenever they cuddle up to their owner or roll over to be petted that it somehow increases the chances that there will be food in the bowl in the morning and evening.
Purring! Of course! And all this time I thought my cat had wicked gas! Boy do I feel silly.
Are you sure it's the cat copying the baby, or is it the baby copyoing the cat?
Who would win this election: Andrew Weiner vs Andrew Weiner's weiner.
You seem to be referring to Cat on "Red Dwarf"?
They aren't, sorry. A cat considers itself better than you, and in 99 out of a 100 cases of cat owners, the cat IS better than the owner.
Cats manipulate their owners on a regular basis, pretty much their entire lives. The only reason it tolerates you is because its easier than the alternative.
They don't like you, they never will, and the instant they realize you are dead they will proceed to eat you.
Most cat owners think cats can't be trained, this is simply false. Its not that they can't be trained its that their owners are too stupid and the end result is that the cat owner gets trained and the cat does whatever the hell it wants.
Treat a cat the same way you treat a dog and things are a whole different world. Treat a dog the same way you treat a cat and once again, you'll get walked on.
Cats aren't special, 99 out of 100 cat people are simply retarded. Sorry for all of you that this pisses off, but its true. I've never met a cat that couldn't be trained once its retarded owner who would let it do whatever the hell it wanted was out of the picture. Take the pushover owner out of the picture, show the cat you are in charge, not it, and the world changes.
This is roughly the same as children. Ever notice that cat owners with kids also typically have brats for children? Neither the cat nor the child is the problem, the adult is just incapable of commanding respect out of others.
Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
I, for one, welcome our new pussy overlords... oh wait...
I'd like to remind them that as a trusted engineer, I can be helpful in using can openers to open tasty cat food items.
My girlfriend can produce a high-pitched meow that sounds rather kittenish. It's like a harpoon in her cat's brain; he has no choice to come over and investigate, regardless of where he was and what he was doing.
His brain is also kind of like an etch-a-sketch. If he's in a bad mood you can shake his head vigorously and he forgets what was going on.
Entropy gets everyone.
Why most guys dislike cats and women like them :)
I vaguely remember reading about something called transference, I think the idea was that people attributed their own attributes and personalities to in-animate objects, or animals.
Do you take pleasure in annoying people ?
From the cat's point of view, it's a risky strategy, It can have no idea of where the boundaries of my forbearance might lie, at some point it may get a large pot of cold water dumped on it.
That may not stop it rubbing up against me, but I'll feel better. I can be petty (shrug)
Depending on the situation, this might be indicative of another cat behavior I've seen a lot: When a cat is in a room with a bunch of people it isn't very familiar with, it tends to go to the one who doesn't like cats. What it's really doing is going to the person who scares it the least, because all these strange people keep making noises at it and trying to paw at it, whereas only one person doesn't seem as threatening
Dogs look at you and think "you feed me, you clean me, you pick up after me... you must be god!"
Cats look at you and think "you feed me, you clean me, you pick up after me... I must be god!"
I think he meant the cat owner is the arse.
The combination of these things combined with a life spent outside had their effect on Ugly. To start with, he had only one eye and where the other should have been was a hole. He was also missing his ear on the same side, his left foot appeared to have been badly broken at one time, and had healed at an unnatural angle, making him look like he was always turning the corner.
Ugly would have been a dark gray tabby, striped type, except for the sores covering his head, neck, and even his shoulders
Every time someone saw Ugly there was the same reaction. "That's one UGLY cat!!!"
All the children were warned not to touch him, the adults threw rocks at him, hosed him down, squirted him when he tried to come in their homes, or shut his paws in the door when he would not leave. Ugly always had the same reaction.
If you turned the hose on him, he would stand there, getting soaked until you gave up and quit. If you threw things at him, he would curl his lanky body around your feet in forgiveness.
Whenever he spied children, he would come running, meowing frantically and bump his head against their hands, begging for their love.
If you ever picked him up he would immediately begin suckling on your shirt, earrings, whatever he could find.
One day Ugly shared his love with the neighbor's dogs. They did not respond kindly, and Ugly was badly mauled. I tried to rush to his aid. By the time I got to where he was laying, it was apparent Ugly's sad life was almost at an end.
As I picked him up and tried to carry him home, I could hear him wheezing and gasping, and could feel him struggling. It must be hurting him terribly, I thought.
Then I felt a familiar tugging, sucking sensation on my ear. Ugly, in so much pain, suffering and obviously dying, was trying to suckle my ear. I pulled him closer to me, and he bumped the palm of my hand with his head, then he turned his one golden eye towards me, and I could hear the distinct sound of purring.
Even in the greatest pain, that ugly battled scarred cat was asking only for a little affection, perhaps some compassion.
At that moment I thought Ugly was the most beautiful, loving creature I had ever seen. Never once did he try to bite or scratch me, try to get away from me, or struggle in any way. Ugly just looked up at me completely trusting in me to relieve his pain.
Ugly died in my arms before I could get inside, but I sat and held him for a long time afterwards, thinking about how one scarred, deformed little stray could so alter my opinion about what it means to have true pureness of spirit, to love so totally and truly.
Ugly taught me more about giving and compassion than a thousand books, lectures, or talk show specials ever could, and for that I will always be thankful. He had been scarred on the outside, but I was scarred on the inside, and it was time for me to move on and learn to love truly and deeply. To give my total to those I cared for.
Many people want to be richer, more successful, well liked, beautiful, but for me... I will always try to be Ugly.
and he is certainly not exploiting me at al^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Illegal instruction (core dumped)
Yeah this is a little more subtle than my cat that is like "bitch get in the kitchen and make me a sandwich".
...YOU own CAT!
After reading this article, I decided to go pet my cat. She's so adorable with her purring. I feel like feeding her now.
in other news: nbauman gets bit by squirrel; blames mcgrew, slashdot user.
mcgrew .. known as the user who had an accident forgetting his disclaimer ...
squirrels are wmd's after all...
--- I am known for the ones who want to find me on the net. Is that a privacy risk or a privilege? One might wonder..
I'm in your mindz, controlling you with my purs!
You think that's impressive, Schroedinger trained his cat to get in a box and stop existing!
No, big cats can be just like domestic cats. Watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xr1pWzoLvT8
These two guys raised this lion from a cub in their apartment until it got too big. They released it to the wild.
Slashdot needs Geekcode | Can anyone recommend any good SCIFI? My tastes: Foundation, Startide Rising, CITY, Ringworld,