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Microsoft Exec Says, "You'll Miss Vista"
Oracle Goddess writes "'Years from now, when you've moved on to Windows 7, you'll look back at Windows Vista fondly. You'll remember its fabulous attributes, not its flaws.' That's the opinion of Steve Guggenheimer, vice president of the OEM division at Microsoft. 'I think people will look back on Vista after the Windows 7 release and realize that there were actually a bunch of good things there,' Guggenheimer said in a recent interview. 'So it'll actually be interesting to see in two years what the perception is of Vista.' A dissenting opinion comes from Bob Nitrio, president of system builder Ranvest Associates, doesn't believe organizations that skipped Vista will ever regret their decision. 'I don't think for a second that people are suddenly going to love Windows 7 so much that they will experience deep pangs of regret for not having adopted Vista,' said Nitrio. If I had to bet, I'd go with Bob's take on it." My first thought was, Steve meant Windows 7 is designed to be virtually unusable as payback for all the complaints about Vista, but I might be biased.
So you won't have to look far to see Vista...
I miss Windows ME.
What? Why is everyone looking at me like that?
"I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
-Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)
...that Windows 7 will be horrific enough to make us miss Vista? Wow.
Paleotechnologist and connoisseur of pretty shiny things.
I mean, I guess that's how we all feel about Windows ME. Right? Totally.
That will only matter if we don't buy more ammo!
We're all going to miss it when we upgrade to windows 7 :)
I like vista in many ways, but not enough. Its still a poor OS in terms of UI, DRM, memory usage, and features.
BUT i do like that MS has been able to force hardware makers to supply 64bit and 32bit drivers for their hardware.
Wait! So, they're saying Windows 7 is actually going to be worse?
My Uncle Bob still misses Windows 98 and is mad at me because I wont install it on his new HP
You are full of shit. KK Thanks
Hope is the currency of fools
You know, that sounds like a threat to me...
Watch the Teaser Trailer for "The Lightning Thief" Her
But just give me time to reload.
I'm looking forward to 7 & forever denouncing any future installations of Vista. I do miss 98 SE though. 2K was nice & XP gave better gaming performance but overall 7 is where my preference lies.
Libera te ex Inferis!
Seriously. Guggenheimer, Ballmer, Jobs, and Wozniak. That name must have something to do with their products...
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it's limits" - Albert Einstein
And I plan on missing Windows 7, as well.
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
(holding the empty remains of a Vista Ultimate package)
Alas, poor Vista! I knew him, Horatio: a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent eye candy: he hath booted me on his disks a thousand times; and now, how abhorred in my imagination it is! My gorge rims at it. Here hung those dialog boxes that I have clicked I know not how oft. Where be your gibes now? your gambols? your MP3s? your flashes of BSOD, that were wont to set the table on a roar? Not one now, to mock your own grinning? quite chap-fallen?
Now get you to Windows 7's chamber, and tell her, let her Photoshop an inch thick, to this favour she must come; make her laugh at that.
Liberal? Conservative? Compare perspectives at Left-Right
Maybe occasionally, but my Vista coasters are used way more often then the WindowsME ones.
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
How exactly will I miss something that I have never used?
This proves how incompetent the /. story moderators are. The actual quote says nothing about MISSING Vista. It only says you'll appreciate it. The idea is this: Vista has an overall bad user experience, so all new features of Vista are generally lumped into the "bad" category. With an operating system that corrects those flaws, yet keeps what are supposedly nice innovations, you'll eliminating "guilt by association", and people can appreciate them for what they are.
The best thing about a boolean is even if you are wrong, you are only off by a bit.
Having used Vista for awhile, there's only 1 improvement I can actually think of: the sound mixer/volume control thing in Vista will let you mute or control volumes of individual applications.
Not the most earth-shaking thing in the world (most apps have a mechanism built in to do volume control or mute the sound, but not all, so it is nice; and some apps bury sound control in layers of menu that make it a pain to quickly mute them).
Also, I see no reason why that couldn't have been done in XP, other than MS wanted to have something to tout as an improvement in Vista.
Perhaps some sort of job saving move by this Guggenheimer. If anything I think many will really miss XP, regretfully.
"Years from now, you'll look back at Vista and realise how horribly you wronged it. If only you'd known! If only you'd seen the truth! But it's too late now, because Vista is dead, it died alone and unloved, spurned by the coldness of your heart and your disdain for it's ungainly sincerity. Now you find yourself wedded to an operating system that is capable but distant, it's caresses mechanical and devoid of warmth. You'll spend your nights lying in its cold embrace and think 'oh! Vista! How I wish I'd stuck with you instead of reaching for the stars!' But it will be too late. Vista is gone, and all that remains is an echo of a memory that could have been."
Eviscerati.Org: All Hail the Eviscerati
Vista has done more to promote the use of Linux in the Office than anything yet. We can only hope that Windows 7 continues this fine tradition.
"To those who are overly cautious, everything is impossible. "
What is up with the jew tag? did this become stormfront?
What's Vista? When did it come out? Who makes it?
I don't have it on any of my machines and haven't really had to use it.
Either this proves the bubble the dumb@sses live in, or they expect Windows 7 to be worse.
As an end user, I don't want to notice my OS at ALL.
Sounds like Guggenheimer is betting on nostalgia. It's not uncommon for the mind's eye to view the past with rose-colored glasses. People forget past hardships and latch on to fond memories. Given enough time, I'm sure the same will happen with Vista.
Which might eventually put Vista on the same footing as The A-Team and Transformers.
well the box is large and shiny.. should be a reasonable standing rifle target at 100 yards.
That doesn't mean I loved WinMe. I only had it because I was skint when I came to the UK and had to use a 2nd hand computer that had WinMe. I learned with very careful management it wasn't that bad and it at least looked like Win 98 so I could pretend I had Win 98.
Vista moved too many things around, tried to look like Mac in a typical PC "too nerdy to get style" way and it was bloated. What's there to like about that?
Who cares, even if it came to pass?
All that matters is that people thought Vista sucked while it was their main OS product. They lost sales and lost brand loyalty and image because Vista sucked while it was on sale. Who cares if people look back on it fondly in the future after its no longer for sale?
It really goes to show the arrogance of Microsoft. They're still sticking to their belief that Vista was f*cking awesome and we all were just too lame to see it, they think history will prove them correct. That sort of attitude and obstinance isn't going to help their business.
-- Senior Software Engineer, Attorney appearance services, locallawyerapp.com.
I missed it alright. I didn't upgrade to vista, but went from XP to 7. Damn.
Im a troll because I disagree with you.
No ones older hardware works anymore.
pretty sure some of the corrupt companies went along for the ride.
Thanks HP. My scanjet scanner wont work anymore. have to use the XP live cd.
Fuck Ballmer. Fuck Gates.
I upgraded to XP last year, and I do remember the fond times I had with Vista. Loading the OS, seeing the new sleek Aero Theme... wondering why my apps had stopped working. Why, that very same day I upgraded not only Vista, but most of everything else I had! Good times, good times. Then there was the security guard, who warned me it was a bad idea to allow this file to open which may be bad so maybe I shouldn't do it so make sure I'm sure just in case are you sure yes okay maybe okay are you sure yes or no? But seriously, I think the creator of this article was eating popcorn when he posted it. Like throwing a cat to the dogs...
"Sorrow is better than laughter, for by sadness of face the heart is made glad." [Ecclesiastes 7:3]
Yeah I've been shooting at it for like 3 years now and still haven't hit it, so I guess I will just keep on missing it. Seriously I've never even installed it on a system, and have ripped it out of like 30. I really doubt it will be missed anymore than say polio, or whooping cough.
errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
Only because we haven't been practicing our aim enough.
And what sort of idiot comment is that really from someone at the company? "You'll miss the old product we're replacing." I mean his entire comments are ridiculous. We'll miss the "good things" implying that Windows 7 has removed them.
Surely saying "All that DRM crap that stole your resources and restricted you in Vista... That IS missing from Windows 7" would be the only GOOD thing to miss.
Windows 98 was what Windows 95 should have been.
Windows XP was what Windows ME should have been.
Windows 7 is going to be "what Vista should have been."
However in this case, Windows 7 is barely different than Vista. The only reasons I hated Vista was:
1. Like previous MS operating systems, they relied too heavily on Moore's Law. Only this time it bit them. Requirements for reasonable use were way too high, and hardware didn't catch up until just recently. On the contrary, people were used to their 5 year old XP running nice and quickly.
2. Vendors were still failing with drivers left and right, and then there was the whole 64 bit thing that people had been refusing to embrace.
3. The interface change was "different".
What's actually different in Windows 7? Nada. It was supposed to run faster than Vista, but the closer it gets to release time, the more I hear of "The speed is about the same, but at least our hardware has matured now."
Vendors who didn't build drivers for Vista are finally saying "Gee, we're two operating systems behind so maybe we should support Windows 7." Vendors who previously built drivers for Vista did little to no tweaking to get things working for 7. So now your support is covered.
Virtually nothing has changed other than our hardware finally caught up, and people are adjusting to the "Vista"-esque UI. So once people get used to Windows 7, err, "Vista SP3", the dumb ones will say "Why was Vista so bad?" The semi-smart ones will say "Why did we waste our money on an operating system that's not new?", and the geniuses will be cleaning up on the 2nd-hand market building home Linux servers.
Microsoft has finally succeeded at copying the Apple Reality Distortion Field!
Unfortunately, they were not able to force software vendors to create Vista-compatible versions. While, I agree, Vista had many useful features, unsupported software is probably what held back most companies. I mean, speed-wise, it didn't matter it was marginally slower, it was being sold on computers that were significantly faster. However, some of the more obscure software used around here (but very important) was not running on Vista correctly until recently. No, its not MS' fault, but sometimes some crappy piece of software written by horrible code monkeys is more important to our organization then a shiny new OS. That said, I do applaud them for getting people to realize that backwards compatibility is not a given.
like I fondly remember Dysentery
Open Source Drum Kit, LPLC deve board - mjhdesigns.com
*sob* You're gona miss me when I'm gone, just wait and see *sniff*
Caveat Utilitor
I didn't even install it, so how could i miss it? I don't miss WinME either.
Unless he means that 7 will be so bad it will make Vista look good?
---- Booth was a patriot ----
It makes OS X look like a piece of crap
Is that it made a lot of 'pc service guys' money.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Wow, talk about losing touch with reality...
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
now, there is someone vying at Ballmer's job .... I mean being a wacko of course ... BIOS shut down my PC because the processor was overheating .... my pc came with XP Pro and it was Vista certified (of course).... :P Vista.
I got a weird pop-up last night on my Vista box, it greyed out the rest of my screen and read:
and had two choices:
why did it take all-powerful Microsfot 9 years to catch up?
On Slashdot? Say it ain't so! This is where I come for fair & balanced news for nerds.
A profitable business scheme for Microsoft is calling an update to a product by an entirely new name.
Another profitable scheme is charging the full price for an upgrade, as though it is a totally new product.
My understanding is that releasing versions of products that aren't finished is also profitable for Microsoft, because then most customers buy new versions immediately. Microsoft Windows Vista, Windows ME, and DOS 3.0 are three examples I think of immediately.
I want what he's smoking - must be strong :)
For the record, other than Win ME, Vista is the WORST os I have ever used - bar none... :)
Mind you, I do miss the three minute boot times - it was just enough time to make a coffee
This may actually not be far from the truth for Windows users. We tend to look back on all memories and remember only the fond parts, or exaggerate how great the past was. That combined with the fact that most of the Vista hate was due to the OS being released when it wasn't ready and full of bugs and bloat will cause people to look back and remember how it was now. Rosy Retrospection I'm not a Windows user but I do think that Vista has come a long way since its release, my Windows fanboy friends praise the fixes Microsoft has done to it with the service pack and the following patches.
They should have just let it die quietly. Reading this just reminded me of the bad memories...the fact that they went backwards in intuitiveness of the GUI, not to mention performance, stability, and HW / SW support. The biggest thing that I like about Windows 7 is that it's NOT VISTA!!!!! The unmitigated audacity of Guggenheimer spouting this crap should get him fired. Nothing worse than a corporate Yes-man in my eyes, especially when it is in public, and it's such obvious horseshit.
One of these days I'm going to cut you into little pieces. - PF
Most average users are really complaining about IE8 and Office 2007 when they say VISTA. Of course, there are all the old applications that ran on XP and won't run in VISTA that creates some additional ire.
After using the windows 7 release candidate for a few weeks now, I can say I already miss the taskbar and the ability to use a classic start menu from Vista.
Does win 7 SUCK so much?
It will be my new sig, ill tell you that.
NO SIG
I don't think I've ever wished I had mod points as much as I do right now! Well said. They should have just let it die quietly. Reading this just reminded me of the bad memories...the fact that they went backwards in intuitiveness of the GUI, not to mention performance, stability, and HW / SW support. The biggest thing that I like about Windows 7 is that it's NOT VISTA!!!!! The unmitigated audacity of Guggenheimer spouting this crap should get him fired. Nothing worse than a corporate Yes-man in my eyes, especially when it is in public, and it's such obvious horseshit. Windows XP was what Me was supposed to be, and Win7 is what Vista should have been. Maybe if they skipped this trash and concentrated on the real deal they'd actually get some kind of decent reputation back.
One of these days I'm going to cut you into little pieces. - PF
99.9999999 percent of all complaints about Vista is actually Office 2007 Vista. People are creatures of habit if we needed any more proof.
Well technically Vista is usable now, though I can't see why you'd ever use it instead of just XP or Win7.
But I had hoped they would realize now that you can't launch with an OS that is so broken that it can't even reliably copy or delete files, and no driver support because you changed the APIs so late in the game. Apparently this marketing d-bag did not learn that lesson.
whats with the Jew tag
Once you take a bite of the dog turd sandwich you'll be begging me to bring back the fillet of old shoe!
Their text was such a pretty green color, and they could scroll text pixel-line by pixel-line instead of by text rows (or was that just the VT-102?).
I suppose that one could have a similar reminiscence for the vista background color . . .
hawk
Why would anyone listen to this guy, let alone make an article about it? This is a blatant stab at Microsoft to influence people not to upgrade. Windows 7 is great! Windows Vista was good (except for some back-end management). From a consumer standpoint, it's better than XP.
Steve Guggenheimer is a tool. Nothing more, nothing less. In the overall reality of how Vista slammed the landscape, it created more problems than it solved, thus opening the doorway to the solution that is Windows 7. It was a dirty, dirty ploy used by Microsoft on a population that had actually grown accustomed to XP and had even begun to foster some sort of respect. As a result, Microsoft, for the first time in its history, had to lay off at least 3,000 employees during the recession. Had it not been so aggressive with Vista, it's likely that that number would have been less, if anything at all.
If this is saying that after using Windows 7, I'll miss Windows Vista, when I never liked Vista, what does that say about Windows 7?
I miss Windows ME. I have fond memories of reinstalling it, doing registry backups, carrying around the 13 most common patches on floppy, disabling features that didn't work yet, it's lugubrious performance. Sigh... those were the days. As I approach my eighth year on Windows XP, I still occasionally take my ME media out and caress it.
C'mon, who are we kidding? ME was a joke, Bob was a joke, Vista was reductio ad absurdum. 95 was very nearly a joke -- I switched to NT 4 the moment it became available because I actually had to get some WORK DONE, something the OS engineers, in their enthusiasm, seem to sometimes forget.
Microsoft marketing needs to get over it. If they spent as much energy on the first service pack for Windows 7 as they did trying to retroactively justify Vista, they might really have something.
Remember the slogan Ford had for a long time: "Have you driven a Ford lately?" A clear admission that "yeah we put out some crap products in the past, but we've got our act together now". Doesn't that play a lot better, and give you more confidence in a company, than continuous denial in the face of indisputable consumer dislike?
This is not a cheap shot -- I depend on XP daily for my work and many of my hobbies. I've been test-driving the Windows 7 beta, and -- hey -- it's not half bad. Will be upgrading at least one of my machines on day zero, something I'd never have thunk of doing in 2007.
Look, Microsoft: I'm willing to forget Vista if you are. Keep bringing it up, and we'll keep bringing it up.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
Yes, and history will redeem George W. Bush too.
Apparently this Steve Guggenheimer is in desperate need to die in a fire.
... not since I got my rifle properly sighted in, that is.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
I won't.
To the haters: You can't win. If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine
Obligatory.. ..and Monkeys might fly out of my butt...
The main "fabulous" attribute is the introduction of netbooks with Linux. True. I LIKE that about Vista.
Really? How that 64 Bit Cisco VPN client working for you?
ROTFLMAO.BYE
(8.3)
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
I've already moved to Linux. I've gotten fed up with Microsoft's sorry excuse for Accessibility aids. This includes a magnifier that doesn't go full screen and a screen reader that is practically useless. I also don't want my PC infested with DRM malware. I will NOT adopt HDCP or Blu-ray EVER and I don't want code from hollywood swimming around in the PC.
If the magnifier in 7 does not work full screen, it is just as useless as the one in Vista/XP are.
Microsoft has said it may ditch Vista the moment Windows 7 comes out! They've since backtracked - but we need to make sure they know our feelings.
Windows 7 is CASTRATED APPEASEMENT to soy latte-sipping girly-men who wish they owned a Mac. We want a REAL operating system. An operating system that PERSONIFIES America's INDUSTRIAL MIGHT. That makes you feel AWE at the MAJESTY of the progress of its operation. VISTA is a monument to everything that makes us the country we are!
Like Chrysler, like Hummer, like Edsel - "Vista" is a name that will be remembered as the greatest operating system in Microsoft's history.
Just Say "No" To Seven -
SAVE VISTA!
Original blog post - Facebook group
"I fully support this initiative. My computer business employs 200 people; the best possible thing for it is to make sure Vista continues and goes forward." - M. Shuttleworth, London
"I can't tell you how much Vista has done for my business. So many people depend on it." - S. Jobs, Cupertino
"Vista is the one thing that will keep people seeking out and using systems that are at the forefront of technology. It's been the best thing for all of us." - L. Torvalds, Portland.
"I'm ... I'm touched. *sob* I didn't think anyone cared. You guys. Developers! *sob*" - S. Ballmer, Seattle.
http://rocknerd.co.uk
Is he really saying that Vista is better than Windows 7? That was my first impression of his statement.
Or maybe he means that all the great Vista features that you'll finally discover in Windows 7 you could have been enjoying in Vista for the last two years. But then why hasn't anybody been able to discover them during these last 2 years and only now will they be magically revealed in Windows 7?
Conclusion: the guy is either a Microsoft Moron, or a Microsoft Troll--you choose.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
Good luck running your computer with Windows on it...
I would say that many people will not remember their Vista experience AT ALL! :)
SeqBox
Right, we might miss Windows Vista, and we might look back on it fondly someday. Just like we look back fondly and remember Microsoft Bob for all of it's innovations and user friendliness.
n/t
I'm not familiar with Steve Guggenheimer, but this argument about Vista is idiotic. I hate Vista, it's just plain out bad compared to XP. I have wasted my money, but more important, my time on purchasing Vista on my home computer. At work I use XP and that's just way more faster.
After pure monkey dance, pure monkey speech. See : evolution at its best.
I've seen lusers you hackers wouldn't believe. Attack packets on fire off the router of 0R10N. I watched Steve's armpits glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those Vista moments will be lost in Internet time, like tears in rain......Time to BSOD.
He knew it was a demon the moment he saw it. He knew it, just as he knew the place was Hell. There was nothing else that either of them could have been.
[...]
As the demon raised its arm to deliver the first blow, it said, âoeIn time you will remember even this moment with fondness.â
"You are a liar."
"No," said the demon. "The next part," it explained, in the moment it brought down the cat, "is worse."
Then the tines of the cat landed on the manâ(TM)s back with a crack and a hiss, tearing through the expensive clothes, burning and rending and shredding as they struck, and, not for the last time in that place, he screamed.
-Neil Gaiman, "Other People"
Just like I "miss" my ex. I hope she's happy with herself, and her new husband.... I Still Want My Fucking Golf Bag Back Sheila
Heh: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dy6uLfermPU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5BKX3QCjk0
"The Brady Bunch is back...working homicide"
Note: I have one of my four Windows boxes running Vista at present.
I bought a new machine this spring and accepted Vista. The 64-bit version with updates works very well and I'm happy that I am running Vista as it now exists. A bit irked that I couldn't find a Vista driver for my old office HP printer (no problem -- I gave that printer to the kid who inherited the old XP machine and got a new one for myself which I'd been meaning to do for a while) but nothing horrid. Still, there wasn't a single compelling feature in Vista that would have made me install it on my previous PC.
Microsoft badly bumbled the release of Vista, bringing it out buggy and without much driver support. I remember when Vista rolled out on "Vista-ready" systems that were anything but! I remember the failure of many mission-critical software packages to run on the new OS. Microsoft has blown the "instant update your OS" goodwill that it enjoyed in the old Windows 95 day. I still see Apple users rush out to update their OS versions quickly but not so much with Microsoft users. And I can't blame them because I clung to XP for a good long while and my workplace, like many, remains an XP environment.
Sure, Windows users might appreciate some elements of the Vista OS but what we'll appreciate more in our memories of Vista was not having to upgrade right away when the OS made its debut.
ancarett, historian and zombie gamer
Why does this guy think people will miss Vista? Because he expects Windows 7 to piss people off worse than Vista?
The guy sounds like a jilted ex - "You'll miss me when I'm gone!"
News flash Microsoft - there's a bunch of us that won't miss you if the whole company folds, let alone you phasing out a product that was nothing but an interim money grab to please your stockholders while defrauding your customers.
I come to bury Vista, not to praise it; ...
The evil that Gates does lives after him,
The BSOD is oft interred with Windows' bones,
So let it be with Vista
as a comedian.
I think I misses windows ME only when I could not find my windows 98 second edition for an old laptop I was pushing to its limit. Then I discovered Damn Small Linux.
What people will remember, what everyone appears to remember or just parrot off from 3rd hand reports, was that Vista had a very mediocre if not lousy launch, primarily due to hardware OEM's who weren't ready with stable drivers (or drivers at all) and system manufacturers who loaded Vista on machines that barely met the minimum requirements.
What no one reports on, what only those with first-hand experience know, is that Vista was a perfectly fine OS around the time it hit SP1. The hardware manufacturers had up-to-date stable drivers in production, it was much easier to get the kind of hardware the Vista would run smoothly on (would you like 1GB of RAM? 2? How about 4 for a song?). That and of course, Vista's obvious advantages over the decade-old XP. XP's security was a nightmare. Any Unix admin would club a man on the head for running his system perpetually in root, but that's exactly what XP encouraged, and they have the virus/spyware record to prove it. Vista finally caught up to every other damn modern OS and set up limited accounts with UAC performing the beloved function of sudo. So much more secure by default than XP it's absurd. The hardware accelerated UI not only looks nice, it makes sense and improves day-to-day performance. Oh and hey, a 64-bit OS that doesn't suck, in case you want to actually use that 4GB of RAM (see XPx64 for a contrasting example of an OS that makes WinME look preferable).
The majority aren't going to ever look at Vista favorably, but when Win7 comes out, those that have used Vista already aren't going to notice that much of a difference. Win7 is, at best, an incremental update. If Vista hadn't gotten such negative press, it's a good bet Win7 would simply have been Vista SP2. Even its name is a misnomer; Vista is NT 6.0 Win7 is NT 6.1
I missed all versions of Windows except 95 which was my last.
I think he might have said it wrong but I believe his meaning is correct. Vista's only 'real' problem (aside from poor third party support and the inevitable issues of some of the beneficial and necessary changes) was the change from an unusually long standing XP. With Windows 7 being only an evolution of Vista the bad blood will be set aside and it will be appreciated for being a good improvement over XP (which is what Vista is as well). And as adoption occurs over time there are lots of things that we will all appreciate and that will be rightly attributable to Vista even if they only fully come to fruition with Windows 7 (security improvements, better administration, better interface, accessible 64 bit computing, and more). While Windows 7 is a change form Vista the 'big' things that are different over XP are possible, and less painful, because of Vista.
I have 2 things in mind : 1. how can I miss thing I never used ? 2. if people miss vista features it will be because windows 7 miss those features... So they won't be able to know what the user wants... What a great marketing PR... Microsoft are losing ground!
What is Steve Guggenheimer smoking and why won't he share?
Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
Ok, just how bad are future MS products going to be, if this guy expects people to feel nostalgic for Vista?
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
I use XP, Windows 7, and linux daily. I have to say that Windows 7 offers better usability than the other two. Having skipped Vista entirely, I won't miss it, but am thankful for the criticism it took to make Windows 7 better.
I'm still waiting for Windows Mojave...
You'll end up missing Vista.
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
How much of good things they will miss then ? Can't understand, why anybody should stop looking backwards particularly at Vista ?
Guggenheimer will get sued for besmirching the Guggenheimer name? Take a look below at what it stood for before his ridiculous statement to the presss.
http://www.nywa.org/elinorcguggenheimer.html
"I think people will look back on Vista after the Windows 7 release and realize that there were actually a bunch of good things there . . ."
-
Q: If an MS exec thinks that there is some goodness in Vista that people will miss, then why would they throw away that goodness?
A: They're Microsoft.
-
I have Vista on my Laptop. I have XP on may main desktops. I just put XP and Linux on my new netbook. All things considered, I think that the overall Vista experience is a smoldering pile of pig droppings. But amongst all the turds are a few nuggets of digestible goodies. I can certainly see where some users will have gotten used to using Vista, and might miss what they have become accustomed to - that's just normal human nature. I hate it, but I have gotten used to it myself, so I can see the point.
-
If they know there are features that customers like, then why eliminate them from 7? The exec said so himself - people will miss something. I take that to mean that they know there are some things people like, and they are deliberately removing them (cynical view), or they don't give a crap that they are removing them (existential view).
-
His remarks sound like "We know Vista sucks, but wait 'til you see what we did to it in 7 - then you'll finally get it how good Vista was - hahahaha!" Or am I missing something?
-
If you want to give your customers a good experience and make them happy, keep the good things in. I have no idea what features he might be referring to, but if he knows that users like them, and that they are going to miss them, why would a corporate exec want to make the experience bad, nostalgic for the old system? Just wondering. It makes no sense, unless you are in the MS parallel universe, I guess.
-
Like when MS took the best feature of its Office suite, the ability to customize and extend the apps, toolbars, and menus, then stripped it all away in favor of the 2007 Ribbon of Shit. "People might miss the old toolbars . . . screw 'em."
Vista=Millennium Edition! enough said.
I find it interesting that the Apple reality distortion field works outwardly on others, while the Microsoft reality distortion field works inwardly on themselves.
- For the complete works of Shakespeare: cat
I absolutely loved Windows ME, it would run NT programs that were otherwise buggy on 98. It was great for what I used it for (tinkering, playing obscure games etc..) It never crashed. XP, well... it never crashed either and I protested the requirements alot but it had nearly the compatibility of ME. And as for vista my system hasn't crashed yet, but the backwards compatibility is terrible, just terrible. The fact that I am on a dual core 64 based system makes it even worse. Aside from that it gets the job done. Little I would change. I don't nor ever have had anti virus software. My system is snappy and has a boot time not too far off what SSD can do, while having 2tb of junk all over. A proper respect for system configuration and awareness makes any OS a good one.
What's up with this guy? Is he seriously suggesting that there's something in Vista that people like..... and they left it out of Windows 7? I don't know which assertion is more crazy, that they'd intentionally leave good stuff out, or that Vista had anything people will look upon fondly!
If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
Reminds me of when I broke a fibula in my first year of skiing. My doctor thought skiing was something only a dumbass would do, and told me I'd think so too by the time I got out of the cast. I came really close to asking him if he planned to set my leg backwards...
rj
why won't they just go away?
I mean, their product sucks, their product has sucked for years.
why won't they just go away?
Their first innovation: software 'license'. That was it. They were first.
They came up with the stupid idea of a license which gave the consumer
no rights, none, nada, zippo, nothing, butkiss.
Next? Oh, lobbying DOD to force 'compliance'.this laundered DOD and
USgov dollars into their greedy little hands.
Next? Steal the competition's code.
And then pointless update after pointless update, poaching their 'partners' products,
outright theft.
And then, they would sell you 'development tools' while their own people didn'tuse it but
were a generation ahead.
That operating system should die like the old MacIntosh stuff did, Apple finally admiting that
UNIX is the only sane kind of operating system.
So, tell me, is there any other reason that anyone buys that swill from that braindead corporation except
they know that their mutual funds own the stock?
Die, die die. Gosh I know that my computer did over and over again running their swill.
I will never look fondly back on those wasted hours.
They ought to embrace the Unix/Linux/BSD world.
Instead, they act like bloated pigs, fat on free revenue.
Imagine that.
Microsoft released 3 Service Packs and countless updates for XP. They released 2 new major browser versions during the life of XP.
So it's obviously possible to make rather major changes to software after the release of that software.
What I'm saying is, you don't really need a whole new operating system, generally, to update something as small as a sound mixer application (although, it is possible that this particular improvement was only possible because of a re-architecting of the sound driver system in Vista, so really wouldn't have been possible in XP).
"Windows 3.11 was the first usable version of Windows"
I agree. The versions of Windows earlier than 3.1 were terrible. They had limited, buggy font support and often crashed. My experience with Windows 1.0 and 2.0 was that they were just toys. It was reported in the book Barbarians Led by Bill Gates that the early versions were made only to kill Go Corporation. To me they seemed at the time to be pointless products. It is a very unhappy realization that Microsoft wasted my time because it was trying to stop the success of another company.
That book was also very helpful because it explains why the Windows API is so disorganized.
I think it is not an answer to abusiveness that someone else is abusive, also.
It appears to me, and apparently to many people, that Microsoft deliberately releases unfinished software. It was reported that many people inside Microsoft were extremely opposed to releasing Microsoft Windows Vista when they did.
Wal-Mart has a laptop for $298.00 that would be acceptable for most people who check email and write letters. Three GB of memory, 15.4 inches, 160 GB Hard Drive, but I get the impression its just abusive advertising; apparently they won't have many. More and more, however, Apple's prices look huge.
I'm very interested in the sociology of business management. Once a company gets a negative reputation, it becomes difficult to hire the best people. That tends to push a company in the direction of further degradation.
Vista failed in the first place. Egotistical fucks like this guy who decided that the consumer didnt know best and *WILL* like whatever is thrown at them, whether they want it or not.
The market decided that vista is pigshit. I cant wait for windows 7 at my company, it will be nice to have. Vista is a slug, looks pretty, but it's a slug. If linux and compiz can do what aero can do and then some with LESS RESOURCES, there is no excuse for vista.
No, we will not miss vista.
Someone needs to fire this asshole. If they're smart they'll fire him after firing off his mouth like this. In his words, he just illustrated the mentality that was behind Vista, and why it failed.
Also, the guy who didnt want the vista sound theme to be disabled, or the startup sound changed, because it would "ruin the spirit" of vista.
Rest of the industry to Microsoft: GET RID OF THESE PRETENTIOUS TWATS.
I didn't miss Windows NT as I switched to Windows 2000. And then Windows XP was released and everybody hated it. Looking back I don't miss Windows 2000 at all. And I'm eager to get rid of XP as soon as possible. It doesn't work well with modern hardware. Its update infrastructure and directory layout is a mess. And the looks and performance of my linux workstations make XP look ancient.
Right, prices are going down. And hardware manufacturers will tell Microsoft, lower your prices or we go Linux, Google Chrome Os etc. A company as Dell will develop its own operating system.
Because "people who check email and write letters" can take any Operating System. It is the end of the era of overcharging for software.
Laptops will be ~250 Eur.
Some people have things in them that they have to share with the whole world. Complete with the same knowing smile of satisfaction. ahhhh
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
I use that line on all my dates (it is called suspension of disbelief people, just go with the flow of the narrative and don't let the plot holes distact you).
"Hey sweety, when you are dating me, you will look back fondly at the guy you dated before me".
Works wonders, one of these days. It gotta!
Seriously, MS needs to hire me as their PR checker. Anytime a MS employee wishes to say something he comes to me and I taser him. So what do I check? That the taser is fully charged.
This PR-statement is total drivel and is really an open goal. Come on, who read it and didn't immidiatly think "Just how bad is W7 going to be that I will look fondly back at Vista?"
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
And why does everyone care so much about it? I must have missed something.
He thinks we actually used Vista? XP is still my OS of choice til 7 is patched enough for me...
MFSF windows is prone to malicious software and features that invalidate the OS license which render your computer inoperable. Why would anyone miss that!
Vista allows you to change IO priority. I just found this out last week. If I had known that, I would have used Vista from day 1, regardless of all of the other complaints I've had. I'm using Win7 on Aug. 6 when it's available on MSDN and I'll never look back.
http://forum.sysinternals.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=12767
Windows NT has seemed slow ever since I tried NT 4 server on my 233mHz Packard Bell. I soon learned that Disk IO brings the computer to its knees, even if the CPU usage is minimal. I remember watching controls be painted individually when copying or analyzing large data files. That still happens today on XP, while System Idle Process takes 85% or more. Lowering the CPU priority of the offending process doesn't help, because it's not maxed out.
Some days, it takes me literally 10 minutes to click something. Visual Studio hung last night doing something, and it was 30 minutes before I could switch to Process Explorer (which I always keep running) and end task. I didn't want to kill everything because I had work open in other windows. 30 minutes on a dual core 1.8 gHz processor with XP to switch to another app, with 80% CPU idle. Disk IO in the background was the culprit, and no it wasn't due to memory paging in or out either. How do I know that? I've been watching this happen since running NT4 on my 233mHz Packard Bell. I watch my memory and leave process explorer running all day every day.
Windows Update seems to be a huge IO eater, and I would love to set it to low priority. Virus scanning an entire file when you only need the first 100 bytes is a huge waste, and I'd love to set the virus scan priority to match the priority of whatever app is trying to open the file. So if it's a background process, just let me do what I'm doing and scan it when I'm done. Windows Update + Anti-virus + Whole disk encryption is just asking for pain, and it's what I get daily. Pain. Windows 7 should solve that.
Yeah, I'll "miss" Vista kinda like I "miss" fluorescent green bell bottom pants or Chiapets.
Well, first off, I can't remember anyone saying they miss Windows Me.
Second off, this is what a friend of mine called a "data-free observation." Instead of addressing any specific characteristics of this specific OS, its specific predecessor, and its specific successor, he's making the dismissive observation "Ah, it's always that way, you complain about it when it's there and but you'll praise it when it's gone." So he can go on pretending Vista wasn't really a disaster.
It's just convenient rhetoric for deflecting criticism. A bunch of verbal bandaids to protect their corporate egos from bruises. A great answer to a question, if the question has nothing to do with Vista--if the question is "How can I save face if someone asks me an embarrassing question?"
If Microsoft "got it" they could take a leaf from Jeff Bezos' book and say "This is an apology for the way we handled the release of Windows Vista. "Our 'solution' to the problem was stupid, thoughtless, and painfully out of line with our principles. It is wholly self-inflicted, and we deserve the criticism we've received." But that sort of frankness just isn't in Microsoft's DNA.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
No need for software just use either http://www.opendns.com/
Or if you want more control, setup a PC as a gateway with:
http://dansguardian.org/
It requires some knowledge of Unix type operating systems and proxies.
It can run on Linux, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Mac OS X, HP-UX, and Solaris, (officially there are probably contributed builds for other operating systems.
Then again there's always education and supervision. You can't fix human & sociological problems with technological tools, it's like trying to fix a broken sink pipe with a car jack and a rubber mallet.
It's true! It's been 9 years since Windows ME, and people are still remembering it for its featu- oh wait.
.. it's good to not have to deal with Ass-Clowns like this in my business. Love Vista or hate Vista, does it really help Microsoft or its customers to essentially threaten that Windows 7 will be missing all kinds of stuff we might love about Vista, but just not know it yet? Is this guy the stupidest person at Microsoft, or what? I mean, I can have plenty of sympathy for the code monkeys at MS doing their best to create good code, despite a built/release system that might be broken beyond repair (at least, that was clearly a big problem in the Vista process).
I have Vista on one laptop. I didn't mind the fact its default GUI had decided the "candy colored" buttons/interface in XP might have been stupid. And I like a 64-bit OS that's commercially supported... but MS could have strong-armed that for XP... and probably would have if Intel had put out a 64-bit x64 in the day, rather than just AMD. But also not a usage issue.
Other than that a few other details, I don't see much to recommend Vista over XP, and plenty to not do that. So this guy is essentially telling me that Windows 7 will be worse. MS should fire his ass immediately,.. that would be the prudent thing for an employee making essentially traitorous statements like this. Personally, I hope they keep the guy... there's nothing like the drama of MS-guy vs. MS-guy.. better than "Desperate Housewives", and just as pointless.
And this one's even special. Vista failed, and rightly so. MS needs to get back to the "upgrade because we tell you so" model.... and that'll be much, much harder than ever. If they really hit Win7 out of the park, make everyone happy, etc. they might just have a chance... if I ran MS, that would have been the entire mission of Win7. If not, that's a piece of the MS dominance broken forever.. a good thing, but not necessarily a thing you want an employee working toward.
-Dave Haynie