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Neanderthals "Had Sex" With Modern Man
According to Professor Svante Paabo, director of genetics at the Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology, Neanderthals and modern humans had sex across the species barrier. The professor has been using DNA retrieved from fossils to piece together the entire Neanderthal genome, and plans on publishing his findings soon. He recently told a conference that he was sure the two species had had sex, but still had questions as to how "productive" the relations had been. "What I'm really interested in is, did we have children back then and did those children contribute to our variation today?" he said. "I'm sure that they had sex, but did it give offspring that contributed to us? We will be able to answer quite rigorously with the new [Neanderthal genome] sequence." What remains a mystery is what Paleolithic brewery provided the catalyst for these stone age hook-ups.
this where ginger people came from?
Humans... so easy, a caveman can do them.
Developers, developers, developers...
If I have seen further it is by stealing the Intellectual Property of giants.
...and later went on to form the first government - which has been screwing modern man ever since.
"I'm sure that they had sex"
What evidence? The article says:
"We will be able to answer quite rigorously with the new [Neanderthal genome] sequence."
"Due to the length of time that has elapsed since Neanderthals became extinct, any trace of their DNA in modern humans could have been diluted below detectable levels. Paabo hopes to overcome this by scanning the Neanderthal genome for the genes of modern humans."
Okay, he hopes he will be able to overcome this technical limitation. So in other words, the statement that they had sex is just his personal opinion?
Better known as 318230.
At last we can explain wherefore Celtic people are who they are!
(*Dodges tossed caber*)
Modern Man has sex with anything from goats, dolphins, and flies to machines.
Ever been to a frat party?
Helping ugly people have sex since 30,000 BCE!!!
Neanderthals "Had Sex" With Modern Man
So does that mean they are gay or bisexual?
Just askin'
Don't be apathetic. Procrastinate!
The only evidence of that would be if the DNA shows that the offspring contributed to our DNA, which he hasn't shown yet. He may as well have said we're desended from aliens, and he's now looking for evidence of that in our DNA.
But wouldn't that mean that if they did actually produce offspring then by the definition they aren't separate species? I am betting they won't ever make the claim that they had offspring.
Probably the same brewery that allow one man to use his goat when felling the urge!!!
There are people out there curing disease and moving industries. But this guy gets all the air time? I'm reminded of James Woods in the film True Crime, playing a hard nosed newspaper editor, uttering the sage words: "People want to read about sex organs and blood.". This is clearly a mantra that applies to science stories as well as any others. And we wonder why science is held in such low regard by many.
Science journalism, despite all it protestations, is not that beneficial to society or scientists. It's just regular journalism with a different topic and is better avoided by all serious people and scientists alike. Get thee to a blog.
May the Maths Be with you!
Just another example of rule 34.
i did briefly date this one girl in high school.... i was pretty drunk and.....
... that explains a lot! I think many of my nearest cubicle in-duh-viduals may have a lot of Neanderthal DNA.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is facing a great battle." - Philo of Alexandria -
My neighbors and their four kids. Their breed mimicks Harry and the Hendersons + Flinstones meets the Coneheads.
There was this odd quote someone showed me once from some book of the Bible (have to say in advance, I'm not a Bible studier, so I know not where it came from):
For in those days there were giants in the earth,
and they bred with the son of man...
Of course the Bible scholars will surely weigh in here and call me names and "educate me", but one wonders if ancient verbal histories might have more to them than it first seems.
Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
The issue of introgression (gene flow from neanderthals to modern humans) is hugely important. It's a lot more important than the curiosity or oddity the Times article makes it out to be.
All the published studies looking for this introgression have been based on neanderthal mDNA. Since it doesn't undergo recombination, it's not a good marker, and the negative results so far are predictable and do not preclude gene flow. It'll be interesting to see Paabo's results. He's been working on getting nDNA data from neanderthal remains for a while now, and perhaps this is a hint that he's found some introgression.
Why it's important:
The small picture of why it's important is it would substantially redefine our family tree. We could refine our primate phylogeny.
The bigger, more hazy, and potentially earthshaking picture of why this could be important is that it doesn't take many viable pairings to get genes from one gene pool to another, and these genes could have been very important to our development. Modern humans and neanderthals were under many of the same environmental stresses but likely developed different adaptions to them. This includes behavior and cognition genes. As Stringer points out in the article, "in the last 10,000-15,000 years before they died out, around 30,000 years ago, Neanderthals were giving their dead complex burials and making tools and jewellery, such as pierced beads, like modern humans.” Proto-modern humans were smart. But neanderthals were also smart, potentially in different and complimentary ways. And perhaps it took a combination of proto-modern human and neanderthal genes to truly make the modern human mind. Our brains could be an example of 'hybrid vigor' on a grand scale.
So the big question mark is whether, given we can determine gene flow, if this hypothetical combination of proto-modern human and neanderthal cognitive adaptions could have led to the cultural explosion of ~30-50 thousand years ago. The biology is plausible and the timing's right. The data's still out, but it's coming in. Odder hypotheses have come true.
Yeah, that's pretty much how my wife describes it...
Humans have had sex with anything that has a hole. The real question is with what frequency and what success. If there were hybrid human-neanderthal babies running around, that would be interesting. It would also explain the existence of 4chan.
This guy is "sure" they screwed, but presents nothing but his surety. There's apparently not the slightest evidence that this is more than a fantasy, however cool a brain-vid it might paint. So the story is that he's going to look some more for evidence that they not only screwed but bred. Maybe after he figures that out there will actually be a story. A pixel is a terrible thing to waste.
Yes, they most likely had sex, but it may or may not have been consensual. It's likely that humans and neanderthals fought at some point, and part of war has pretty much always been having your way with the women on the losing side. I'm not condoning this, just pointing out the obvious.
Do you have ESP?
We're part neanderthal? Kinda hard to convince the world we are the master race when we alone are half breeds with a non-verbal dumbass species...shit... we're the INFERIOR race!!!
This is my sig.
All we need to do now is to take that DNA, splice it back together with human 'junk' DNA and breed Neanderthals for the next great Disney theme park! Instead of being entertained by people walking around in giant suits pretending to be cartoon characters, it could be the greatest edutainment center in the world!!
But seriously. People have sex across interspecies barriers all the time; animal, vegetable, mineral, it doesn't matter. I doubt that Homo sapiens and Neanderthals looked at each other and said, Hey, I can't have sex with you, you're obviously a different species! Probably they thought to themselves, Two arms, two legs, looks about right, the bits are in the right places, why not?
Until they were decimated by the plague (due to having close ties with the Romans), the Celts were a much more populous and civilized society than their English neighbors, who were still running around the woods and building log stockades whilst the Celts were building beautiful stone castles. My first choice of where to look for the neanderthals remaining descendants is obvious...
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
Genesis 6: "And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, that the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose... There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown."
Have you been in a Wal-mart? People will hump anything with a hole. It seems to me that if you can show that Neanderthals and Homo Sapiens/Erectus were in the same place at the same time that you'd need extraordinary proof that they didn't have sex.
Offspring's a much harder question.
I've always sort of nursed a theory... that maybe Adam and Eve were Homo Sapiens and the Nephilim were Neanderthals. Or something like that. The idea is that Eden was a separate creation from Earth, and that on earth evolution really DID take place... but that after the Fall god turned man out of Eden into the earth.
Absurd of course, and could never be proven. But amusing to speculate.
Let the flames begin!
"He who would learn astronomy, and other recondite arts, let him go elsewhere. " -- John Calvin, commenting on Genesis 1
They still do. Just go to any college bar and see.
Does it make you happy you're so strange?
Scientists today announced recent evidence suggests beer was invented by Cro-magnon man.
"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
Cave drawings will do.
Have gnu, will travel.
How many people looked at the neanderthal photo attached to this article and thought to themselves, "Yeah, I'd hit that!"?
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
Definitive proof that we co mingled with other hominid species, and may the the melting-pot remains....
Supposing the results of this kind of research indicate human evolutionary and/or developmental possibilities which don't sit well with the Racial and Cultural Sensitivity Police?
Would Paabo think it important enough to destroy his career by publishing the findings anyway, or would he quite understandably practice a bit of self-censorship?
some of their offspring played on the O-line when I played football in high school.
no, no, no, this is the proof
more pics and some more
You can't handle the truth.
Just saying....
Despite it's unsavory title, the exploits and travels of Ahmad ibn Fadlan suggest the wild Eaters Of The Dead were in fact Neanderthals who survived to live and pillage amongst "modern" Vikings. Somewhere in the appendix it was posited Neanderthals may not have died off, but instead melded with modern homo sapiens. Good read.
Imagination drew in bold strokes, instantly serving hopes and fears, while knowledge advanced by slow increments...
I had sex with a David Bowie in Amsterdam which is why I misread your title.
Leon Laporte
Combine thes with the evidence that modern man ate some of the last Neanderthals, and it really gets kind of creepy!
You do not need any DNA analysis to figure that out. What do you think the troll did to the captured the princess, once he took her back to his mountain cave? And they did not call it the Stockholm syndrome if she ever was freed; it was called bergtatt (literally: taken into the mountain) or bewitched.
Unfortunately, the history is told by the winner; It would have been interesting to hear these fairytales as told by the Neanderthals.
don't cut it off www.mgmbill.org
There's no mystery. Paleolithic cultures (and most since) were polygynous. A few powerful men had all the women, leaving large numbers of randy young men without mates. The obvious solution was "hunting parties." (That's why the 72 virgins)
One interesting and relevant finding not involving neandertals is in neolithic DNA; in many cases the Y chromosome is neolithic, but the mitochondrial DNA is mesolithic. Bands of neolithic bachelors raiding mesolithic villages, killing the males and keeping the females would have that effect. It's not an over-the-top guess that something like that could link paleolithic men with neandertal women.
I'm a Programmer. That's one level above Software Engineer and one level below Engineer.
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At last we can explain wherefore Celtic people are who they are!
Darn right. When I'm naked, I kind of look a little too much like a 6'5" orangutan/caveman hybrid for it to be coincidence.
Just for the record, I'm not a creationist, except in the sense that I believe that God created the Universe ex nihilo. In the words of John Calvin, commenting on Genesis 1, ""For, to my mind, this is a certain principle, that nothing is here treated of but the visible form of the world. He who would learn astronomy, and other recondite arts, let him go elsewhere."
"He who would learn astronomy, and other recondite arts, let him go elsewhere. " -- John Calvin, commenting on Genesis 1
Clan of the Cave Bear by Jean M. Auel
rewriting history since 2109
there's nothing holding me back, I just have to leave my apartment :)
Wherefore they are carrotheads, you mean.
That is laughable...not that it could happen but that he is sure that it did.
Didn't anyone see the last episode? They found earth and it had primitive tribal humans already. They were planning to educate them, give them language, teach them, etc... so obviously some would have sex (whether in love or not).
BSG is clearly an accurate account of our own history, so I was not surprised to see this headline. Nor will I be surprised next year when the headline says they've discovered Humans mated with Cylons around the same time.
-hps
People have been known to have sex with different species...for instances... http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17726206/
Your mother is so old that the Neanderthals had sex with her!
INSIGHTFUL MY ACHING ASS!
,Wales and Ireland........... they were pretty much ALL OVER EUROPE. Celts were a culture and not a race... there were Celts all over the place INCLUDING ENGLAND!!!! oh and Germany.. and Switzerland and France or and spain.....remember the OstroGoths?Visigoths?..erm.. celts..... the celts even sacked Rome...... this is where Milan gets it's name from....
speaking as a Scotsman i find this funny as hell. you see celts were not just Scotland
yeah.. right next door to England isn't it? and as far as a plague.. well oe third of the roman empire was humped by the plague... however you will find that the SCots and Irisg celts by the VERY nature of them being OUTWITH the roman empire..remember the Scots kicked the crap out the Romans on more than one occassion. and the Irish were prtty much unscathed due to no real expiditionary force from the Romans altough thre was some trade(ie slaves) between the Romans and Irish .Decimation whilst having a roman root isn't even the right wird..lol decimation means 1 out of ten killed. it was , for exa,mple when a legion fucked up they got 1 out of every ten men and killed then as a lesson to the rest not to fuck up again. Or if a p[eople rebelled the same would happen to that population locally as a lesson to the rest. 1/3 != 1 out of ten.
there were walls built to seperate the Scots tribes from Roman britain.. thus the plague very much kinda skipped the Scots and Irish on that occassion.
i could go on and show you how amazingly wrong you are in yer wee statement but tbh i cannot bothered.
i mean did you really believe what you said or just enjoy making shit up?
Cave paintings or it didn't happen.
I mean, you'd think it was OBVIOUS if you ever saw Jack Thompson!
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
Karen: "Screw you, Gary!"
Gary: "Oh, yeah? Maybe if you did that more often, maybe I wouldn't need these paintings!"
--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
You've seen Gérard Depardieu haven't you?
To me it becomes less interesting when you consider that diverging species start as one. During generations when a species is bifurcating, cross-breeding must normal initially, then become less potent over successive generations until finally it is practically impossible. So the question isn't whether this happens, only how long the separation takes - how much the genomes may differ before they cannot mix.
This kind of genetic or evolutionary "seperation" can take a very long time before two related species are unable to produce viable hybrid offspring. In Dubai scientists bred a camel/llama hybrid they call a "Cama". This may seem like a weird experiment to perform but it is interesting in that it demonstrates that viable offspring resulted from crossbreeding two species with some 2-3 million years of evolutionary separation. Mind you camels and llamas have the same number of chromosomes which increases the chances of producing fertile offspring. An equal chromosomes is, however, not necessary for cross breeding to produce living offspring. Horses and donkeys can crossbreed despite having different numbers of chromosomes and an evolutionary separation estimated at 9 million years. It has always mystified me why it is that some people still claim modern humans and neanderthals were unable to produce living offspring. Once you get past all the religious and cultural baggage (and the cheesy /. jokes), from a purely scientific/genetic standpoint, there seems to be no reason why a neanderthals/modern human couple could not have had children together. Were those children fertile? If they were, did interbreeding happen on a scale to significantly influence human evolution to the point where neanderthal genetic input is still detectable in modern Europeans for example? ... those are two totally different but no less interesting questions.
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
You do realize that neanderthals had bigger brains than we do (for the same body size.) It is quite probable that they were as smart as we are ... maybe even smarter? I'd wager real money that if you brought one into the future they would have no problem at all adapting and blending into our modern society (in fact some of them may have survived to become some of us.)
Neanderthals and modern (wo)man? Sounds like college everywhere.
If this were an anthropologist saying it were true pre-proof, then that would at least mean something perhaps. But...a geneticist? Since he as yet has zero evidence at all - hasn't even started the research - why is he saying this in such a way that he "knows" anything? He's supposed to base what he knows on dna analytics. Leave the sociology to the sociologists.
Don't they keep changing their mind about whether the Neanderthals had the physical capacity for speech as we know it? That doesn't make what you said completely wrong (plenty of people who can't speak get along just fine) but given how we tend to treat people different from us they might have a little bit more of a problem than "no probably at all" would seem to suggest.
I can assure you that Neanderthals had sex with modern man... because I am that modern man, and I can introduce you to the football players in question. Best Homecoming Kegger Ever. :)
Back to more utopian times where people actually co-exist in love and harmony, regardless of race language religion ... and species
Genesis 6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, 2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. 3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. 4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
seems like this wasn't the only inter species breeding that was going on
WE'RE GETTING BACK TOGETHER!
and tell me we didn't interbreed with neanderthals
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_CM1pqhodMRQ/STVQv5XO3BI/AAAAAAAABU8/2Iw4dL9R6Kg/s1600-h/pablo_picasso_58.png
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
Heh, i actually found what he said rather amusing as well, at least enough to choke on my coffee(in a "obviously has no idea what hes talking about" way), I'm 100% Welsh(no not Norman French or Briton aka English, i mean Welsh.)
-Noc
So easy a caveman can do it.
Someone, I don't know who, once said that "if you took a Neanderthal, cleaned him up, dressed him in modern clothes and put him on a New York subway car, no one would look twice."
Someone else responded to that with "that says more about the New York subway system than it does about Neanderthals."
This ain't rocket surgery.
They may agrue that one back and forth, with little data and no way to conclude anything, but there's a real obvious difference between us and them.
Our spine comes into our pelvis behind the hips. This means that the pelvis rocks as we walk and makes it possible for us to walk long distances without pain. Neanderthal's spine joined his pelvis right in line with his hips.
OUCH!
Neanderthal might have been as smart as us or smarter, or he might have lacked specialized brain functions like complex language abilities which we sport. Who cares? He accomplished nothing because he spent his whole life with a backache.
I don't see what the quotes are implying. The sex was fake?
Is this like I "had sex" with your mom last night?
I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
Mitochondrial evidence conclusively proves this isn't so. Never, not once, did a Neanderthal ever get his/her genes in the modern pool.
I think that means mitochondrial evidence is crap.
How did we get to look so different in so little time? Why do Neanderthals found in China has a bump on the top of the head that is common now in modern humans found in China and not common in non-China-area Neanderthals nor non-China-area modern humans? (This is a trivial-sounding example, but it's supposedly pretty easy to see in the remains.)
Why didn't any Ns get domesticated/preserved? Why isn't there one single place somewhere where MH didn't go but Ns did, even though Ns had so much longer than MHs to move around, and N remains are found pretty far and wide.
I just don't buy the mitochondrial proof that Ns didn't mate with MHs ever. Maybe they're right, but its not intutive.
modern women had sex with neanderthals.
Skot Nelson music is my saviour / i was maimed by rock and roll
Proof of where Britney Spears genes originated
... you know how frustrating it is, to have the answers. To know that Neanderthals got busy but nobody would listen?
All those theories about superior intelligence -- how good is that when Brother Bicep can lift a Car and your superior intelligence is being able to count to 12 -- two more digits than your fingers. It's not like you invented a Kolishnikoff or fire yet.
>> But seriously, I can tell you now EXACTLY why the weaker ancestors of us replaced the Neanderthal (yes, they had sex, but the Neanderthal "trait" was selected out over time). Our species took over about two major ice ages ago. If you look how relatively weak we are pound for pound with other great apes it seems obvious; Humans have a lower metabolism so that we don't starve to death on low calorie diets. We can eat anything and survive where most any mammal our size can not.
It wasn't speech, or brains, or nice hair -- it was BECAUSE we were weaker and could starve well. A Neanderthal with the strength of a Gorilla probably ate 4 times as much as our ancestors.
>>"ad space available -- low rates!!!"
well good man. i am very much Scottish and not British either.
;-)
but for you my friend i shall say
Cymru Rhydd Nawr!
and for me Saor Alba!
The Goths were Germanic, not Celtic. You might be thinking of East Germanic (Visigoths, Ostrogoths, Vandals,..) vs. West Germanic (Saxons, Franks,...). Then everyone moved, and the Visigoths were the "west" Goths, more or less. But you're right, the Celts were all over the place beforehand, or that's the story anyway. Celts, Germans, you can look at them as languages, or as cultures which left behind things in the dirt. Either way, it's not clear how one group stays defined: spreading over, or mutual sharing; language from the top, or from the bottom, by force, economic pressure, etc. People move and take their language with them, or they adopt the new local tongue. Or languages can spread without the people moving. Etc. etc.
Heck, if you brought one into the future they would fit right in. They could probably even get a good job, doing advertisements for Geico!
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
indeed i wasw refering to the ostrogoths.visigoths etc
those were the cvelts that sacked Rome
lots of celtic artifacts including the famous Halstaadt plaid have been found Here
due to their blatant arse kicking nature the goths spread all over the place..lol.
erm ..as a wee point...
"Ostrogothi" means "Goths of (or glorified by) the rising sun".[3] This has been interpreted as "gleaming Goths" or "east Goths".
The name "Visigothi" is an invention of Cassiodorus, who combined "Visi" and "Gothi" and intended to mean "west Goths".
not forget the Gepid goths too... poor fellows..they never share the limelight!
I can't think of another reason the "Caveman" had sex with a Homosapien. Please give me another answer other than juicy females that could be taken advantage of in "Caveman" days by a Caveman could be taken by cavemen.
I'm here for the experience, not the Hyperbole.
Ah what? Can someone translate I don't speak Scot. (Just kidding - My name is Scott!) I just had to lol at "yer wee" - but I was entirely disappointed that it wasn't "yer wee statment but tbh I canna be bothered!"
dnuof eruc rof aixelsid
"What remains a mystery is what Paleolithic brewery provided the catalyst for these stone age hook-ups."
It wouldn't have been alcohol or any other chemical social lubricant.
Inter-species sex, back then, would have come in the form of rape.
To those saying "if it exists, human will have sex with it" are forgetting that most of that is due to the porn industry. Women generally don't want to have sex with horses for free. Pay them a few thousand dollars, and their viewpoint changes. I doubt the porn industry was booming 30,000 years ago. Rape, however, was in its prime.
"Study your math, kids. Key to the universe." -The Archangel Gabriel
aaah yer lack o Scots is showing!
;-) .. Sorry to say but
Scotty from star trek got it wrong all those years
canna would be Grodie... "Cannae" would be Scots
Who created god? Is it turtles all the way?
still havin' harsh feelings, aye?
I just had an epiphany!! This... explains... everything!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lapedo_child
The two species lived side by side long enough that mating (and rapes?) must have happened. It is quite possible this was often enough, and the species close enough, that a fertile off spring was born. It's also quite possible these fertile hybrids had children and so and so on, but it's also possible all that happened, but no trace is left in modern humans. If there is any traces, they aren't common enough to have shown up yet. A rare gene here and there that's not yet been sequenced. When personal sequencing is cheap enough to be done for personalized medicine, that's when a few genes might turn up. But it is possible we might hit the jackpot with a mitochondria (a maternal line).
And it will all happen again.
[Cue hindu prayer theme music]
...and I still have my doubts that they've become extinct at all. When I look around me, I can't help but come to the conclusion that they still live among us.
Watching some kind of video documentary on the subject at a friend's party where the sound engineer forgot to unmute the narrator track.
That said, I maybe had a little too much to drink.
-- The Grand Teddy Bear has Spoken: "Windows 8 Source Code Available NOW! more disgusting than your pr..."
OMG - TV lied to me! DAMN YOU TV! Oh - and what's "Grodie" - is that a muppet? :D
dnuof eruc rof aixelsid
oops.. that was meant to be "Geordie" .. as in from Newcastle.. sorry about that...
i seem to have suffered ann attack of typage craptastica at the late hour at which i typed!
LASCAUX TESCAUX, Town Centre, Saturday night — Modern humans and Neanderthals had sex across the species barrier, according to Professor Svante Paabo, a political scientist researching the British National Party.
Prof Paabo will shortly publish his analysis of the entire Neanderthal genome, using DNA retrieved from fossils. He aims to compare it with the genomes of modern humans, chimpanzees and neo-Nazis to work out where it all went horribly wrong.
"What I'm really interested in is, did they have children back then? And did these children go on to form the English Aborigine population of 17,000 years ago? And did their pamphlets make any more sense back then, and when did they introduce a football game to their regular Saturday bloodbaths?"
Such an answer might ease the controversy over recent contradictory discoveries. Some specimens seem to have both modern human and Neanderthal features, some even managing to string words into apparent sentences on Question Time. Some cave paintings of the time appear to be condemnations of "mud people," particularly smart and beautiful ones who patronise them in public appearances.
"I used to believe Neanderthals were primitive," said Professor Chris Stringer of the Natural History Museum, "but in the last ten to fifteen thousand years before they died out, around thirty thousand years ago, they were leaving behind complicated bead designs that appear from other cave paintings to translate, as far as we can work out, to 'Fuck off you brain-dead fascist wanker.'"
Illustration: A failed genetic experiment, pictured here on BBC Question Time.
http://rocknerd.co.uk
So I right-clicked the properties for the little icon of the golden statue from Raiders of the Lost Ark. Here's what came back. . .
"//slashdot.org/index2.pl?fhfilter=idle"
Thought the mis-spelling was cute.
And yes, it takes a certain kind of curiosity to check these things.
(Sorry.)
-FL
... given that recent sequencing of the h.neanderthalensis' genome showed them to be predominantly redheads and blondes... and those same hair colors are only native to h.sapiens whose ancestry hails from the one region where the two species mappably coexisted? Yes, that makes no sense at all
But if two speicies can procreate are they really different species? Or is it whether the offspring can reproduce with each other that makes them the same species? (For some reason I'm remined of mules is it?)
Duh, obviously its the crew from Galactica intermingling with the neanderthals.
It is well known that male homo sapies in general have been willing to indulge in sex with females of many nonhuman species. So, any female Neandertal that could be captured and gang-raped probably was.
Came for the references to Robert J. Sawyer's Neanderthal Parallax. Left sad. Hugo winner, fer chrissakes.
Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
At last we can explain wherefore Celtic people are who they are!
Most, but not all Celtics are African descent.
>What remains a mystery is what Paleolithic brewery provided the catalyst for these stone age hook-ups...
Really, a great mystery, let me help you solve it, how about the same reason people has sex with animals, or children, because they are perverts?
That's not offtopic. That's downright funny.
INSIGHTFUL MY ACHING ASS! speaking as a Scotsman i find this funny as hell. you see celts were not just Scotland ,Wales and Ireland........... they were pretty much ALL OVER EUROPE. Celts were a culture and not a race... there were Celts all over the place INCLUDING ENGLAND!!!! oh and Germany.. and Switzerland and France or and spain.....remember the OstroGoths?Visigoths?..erm.. celts..... the celts even sacked Rome...... this is where Milan gets it's name from....
yeah.. right next door to England isn't it? and as far as a plague.. well oe third of the roman empire was humped by the plague... however you will find that the SCots and Irisg celts by the VERY nature of them being OUTWITH the roman empire..remember the Scots kicked the crap out the Romans on more than one occassion. and the Irish were prtty much unscathed due to no real expiditionary force from the Romans altough thre was some trade(ie slaves) between the Romans and Irish .Decimation whilst having a roman root isn't even the right wird..lol decimation means 1 out of ten killed. it was , for exa,mple when a legion fucked up they got 1 out of every ten men and killed then as a lesson to the rest not to fuck up again. Or if a p[eople rebelled the same would happen to that population locally as a lesson to the rest. 1/3 != 1 out of ten.
there were walls built to seperate the Scots tribes from Roman britain.. thus the plague very much kinda skipped the Scots and Irish on that occassion.
i could go on and show you how amazingly wrong you are in yer wee statement but tbh i cannot bothered.
i mean did you really believe what you said or just enjoy making shit up?
That was the most insightful, drunken, Scottish post ever.
Hmm; could be the same kind of relations ship that horses/donkeys have. They could procreate and make sterile offspring.
Sure! They would be sterile but they would've had powers far beyond that of ordinary cave men! They could have made armies - two great powers, titans of their time fought a long and bitter war using surrogate Homo-Sap/ Neanderthal hybrids. Finally destroying themselves in a conflagration that is only vaguely described by the small, nomadic tribes that survived.
wasn't drunk bud, just dog tired , cross eyed and, as previously mentioned suffering an attack of typage craptastica
and just plain too tired to be arsed to check it fully..lol
Yeah, and they'd either end up as lawyers or insurance salesmen.
God invented whiskey so the Irish would not rule the world.
Just go down to your local watering hole any Friday night and you'll see herds of neanderthals hitting on our human women. The real question is why human women go for them. Now if I could just get a couple million dollars of grant money I'd be happy to research the issue.
Now we know where users came from
Don't we already have examples of skeletons that are mixtures of Neandertal and Cro-Magnon features?
Also note that Cro-magnons had skull shapes somewhat similar to Neandertals (prognathous, low-browed, pronounced eyebrow ridges), although they had larger cranial capacity than contemporary H. S. sapiens; and they had the same kind of stature as Neandertals. Intermarriage/interbreeding between the two species would not have been inconceivable, and would not have needed all that much alcohol.
As to inter-fertility, isn't it genus, not species, that tends to be the barrier?
Did they breed?
I look around at the ridged unibrows, apelike features, big feet, bad postures and basic thought processes of those around me and I have all doubt removed.
*Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
I wonder if there are any Neanderthals left?...
The style seems familiar... have you sent a lot of hatemail here by any chance?
nopes, never even heard of venganza.org before
i have heard about the flying spaghetti monster variously through the years and we're talking from before the intarwebs time here.
i am a bit insulted that you would consider lumping me in with the barely literate halfwit ass wipes who send that place hate mail.
in fact i am bewildered that you could class my posts in the same category at all.... mucho oddness
The thought of that just grosses me out.
Life takes interesting turns, but the most interest is when you're off the beaten path.
do her!
Thank you, I'll be here all week.
Try the dinosaur steak. And tip the waitstaff.
Most of this is quite correct, but the part about the Goths is horribly wrong. Goths were Germanic people (a quite different language group). Celts were actually much more closely related to the Romans than they were to the Goths. In fact, you could perhaps look at the Romans as a Celtic offshoot that was heavily influenced by Greek and Etruscan cultures (this is contravesial though).
Germanic langugages like those of the Goths seem to be closer related to Greek than either Latin or Celtic languages.
Essentially what happened was that the easternmost Gothic tribes learned pastorilsim and horsemanship from the Iranian steppe tribes to their east, and started expanding eastward onto the good pasture land. The western tribes kept to their farms (but still got very handy with horses and lances). Thus we got Ostrogoths (eastern) and Visigoths (western).
Then one fine day Attilla came to their pastures. His folk were even better with horses and lances. The Goths (both kinds) had the choice of submitting to Hun rule, or moving to all that nice Roman land where the people weren't any good with horses and lances at all...
I did not have sex with that (Neanderthal) woman.
More than likely, there's some really interesting, albeit impossible-to-explain-in-less-than-20-paragraphs-unless-you-know-a-lot-about-ancient-Europe, evidence that the article's author chose to leave out so that he could quote the attention-getting "I'm sure that they had sex".
The only scientific conclusions you can draw from this kind of reporting is that a scientist is investigating a subject that has something to do with Neanderthals and humans.
Perhaps because they mostly messed with the Eastern (non-european) half of the Empire. The Byzantine Empire in general gets a real short shrift out of history books.
This gives new meaning to the Geico tagline, "So easy even a cave man could do it."
Was it considered bestiality?
I'm an orthopaedic surgeon (fix bones, replace hips, etc) and the skeletal differences in the extremeties, and axial (central) skeleton are substantial. HUGE flaired rib cage - much more lung volume and abdominal protection. Hips much more of a varus angle than ours ( are closer to a right angle - most humans are around 135 deg), and also more offset in their hips. Broader pelvis -hell all the bones just appear "beefier" - I'm guessing these guys were strong as all hell. Even the spine seems re-inforced compared to modern humans, who appear much sleeker.
Neanderthal = power weight lifter.
Homo Sapiens Sapiens = long distance runner.
..........FULL STOP.
The Neanderthal pelvis had the acetabulum (hip socket) about 4 inches anterior(in front) to the sacrum (where spine connects to pelvis), and this is roughly the same for modern humans. The Neanderthal did have , what appears to be a broader and deeper pelvis than ours.
Check this site out for a nice comparison http://www.amnh.org/exhibitions/permanent/humanorigins/meettherelatives/w5i6.html
..........FULL STOP.
read about it in clan of the cave bear...
The genetic differences between different human populations is minimal. Which is why we are one species only.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
decimation means 1 out of ten killed
Decimation means reduced to one-tenth. That is, 9 out of 10 killed.
so... sorry bud... but the dictionary says that you ain't right
So this is the new science. Fire the dumb down cannon Mr. Spock.
yes, we also watched Terry Jones' Barbarians episode 1.
then they were the same species