Slashdot Mirror
DDoS Attack On Wikileaks Increasing
tetrahedrassface writes "According to the Twitter feed for Wikileaks, the attack on the controversial site is increasing and is now at 10 Gigabits per second. In light of the recent release of highly sensitive documents and calls by many lawmakers around the world to swiftly find, extradite, and try suspected rapist Julius Assange for breaches of national security, one nation, Ecuador, has offered asylum."
then you have nothing to hide.
At least isn't that what the government tells us?
/. is in trouble now for leaking the US's inability to conduct a succesful DDoS campaign.
Bravo, Ecuador. Though I do wonder how long he will be welcome once Wikileaks outs something big about Ecuador.
Arr! The laws of physics be a harsh mistress!
Seems very likely the US Gov't, through one of it's shadowy connections, hired and paid for this DDoS attack. Interesting trend. I wonder what's next.
"Julius Assange"
Is he related to Julian Assange?
...that he decided to spread US diplomatic cables. Imagine if he had gotten a hold of a similar set of Russian ones and publicized them. His site wouldn't be DDOS'ed, he'd be dead.
"Seven Deadly Sins? I thought it was a to-do list!"
That's one theory set aside. A hacker called The Jester had claimed credit for the attack, using some sort of uber-DoS tool he wrote that looks suspiciously like a slickly-GUIed implimentation of the old octopus attack as used in anoctupus and varients of slowloris. This, however, ie *far* beyond his level of ability - revealing him to be just yet another script kiddie claiming credit for something he had nothing to do with.
"...suspected rapist..."
way to give subtle bias in favor of the world's superpower against one person...
He will be quite comfortable and safe in my mother's basement.
Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent. Polar Scope Align for iOS
"suspected rapist Julius Assange"
Their attempt at discrediting the accuracy of the info by repeating the word "suspected rapist" is a bit of an old cliche, don't you think?
Also, does this still work, even with so much data available?
Mod points are a dangerous tool. Abuse them wisely.
They pulled all corporate and other countries leaks. Now they are simply an anti-US organization. They lost all claim to moral superiority or credibility at that point. Its simply a politically motivated espionage group now with an axe to grind against one country. Treat them like it. When he disappears, or accidentally falls down an elevator shaft on to a pile of bullets, no one will cry.
Its not that th3j35t3r kid again is it? Or is it the US government in disguise? I would have thought most people would want to know all the dodgy stuff the government has been lying about. I'm still straining to find this information that puts soldiers in jeperdy any more than those in Washington did in the first place. If you havent watched the Restrepo documentary that has just come out I'd highly recommend it. Couldnt help remember how GW got out of active service and then signed up these poor buggers. But back on topic, why are people so opposed to a guy just trying to show the world all the dodgy crap being pulled on us?
Those who can, do. Those who cannot, sue.
This is the work of some self-described patriot, living in his mother's basement in Montana with a pile of guns and a disused American Flag pinned up to the wall, yelling "ye-HAW!"...
Sad to say, but this is actually progress. Remember the day when only well-educated people knew how to cause major electronic mischief? I suppose it's a sign that technology is becoming increasingly accessible when even the most repulsively stupid amongst us can manage it.
#fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
What we've learnt about the US is that they privately criticise and occasionally seek intelligence on important figures, and they don't like their citizens being arrested. Moreover, several million people have US "secret" clearance, which means anyone foreign and relevant also had the information: the release was therefore benign.
In other shocking news, I sometimes mumble "idiot!" under my breath after leaving a meeting and double-check a CV. Don't get me wrong, it's a great laugh to see a few fragile egos insulted, but the most interesting thing to come from this in the West will be whatever law stops it happening again.
This leak was damaging to those who the US are currently LARTing, from the UK to Saudi Arabia; from a diplomatic PoV, the US government has come out pretty well while playing the perfect victim. It's almost like we're approaching a significant anniversary of another time it did that: now the fires need stoking from an information warfare angle.
If wikileaks is being DDoS'd, it certainly isn't the US government trying to put some genie back in a bottle.
Go Equador.
Sent from my CR-48
Put everything on bittorrent.
Maybe Computers will never be as intelligent as Humans.
For sure they won't ever become so stupid. [VR-1988]
People don't like people who rock the boat they are sitting in, especially if its edge is already close to the waterline. They tend to kick people overboard, even if they are the person trying to signal a rescuer.
Wikileaks is exposing not just the obvious criminal corruption, the stuff you claim on others, but the widespread moral apathy that is the US of A. You can see it from the murder video. 12 civilians clearly unarmed shot with the murderers expressing clear joy at their slaughter. The US reaction? Absolutely nothing. If any of these soldiers were ever to be brought before a war crimes tribunal, the US of A has invasion plans for The Netherlands to stop any international justice by whatever force required.
This is America, and it doesn't sit well to have this truth shoved in their face. They want to believe the US of A is the land of the free, defender of democracy, hero of the oppressed.
You have to remember that most countries have the same thing. The Netherlands and its war crimes in Indonesia. Recently the state refused to meet a survivor of a masacre the germans would have been proud off, because it was going to upset the murderers. Don't ask the british about their colonial behavior or say the treatment of Jews after WW2.
Wikileaks is kicking up the dirt in peoples eyes and the people don't like it one bit.
Easier to kill the messenger then deal with the message. Always has been true, always will be. Cue this message running a high change of instantly disappearing because a teabagger is upset and mods it down to never be seen again.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
I believe that if the US Government wanted to stop Wikileaks, they'd simply bomb the data centers. Electronic attacks like this are not what this government does; It's what its citizens do.
I beg to differ:
"USCYBERCOM plans, coordinates, integrates, synchronizes and conducts activities to: direct the operations and defense of specified Department of Defense information networks; and prepare to, when directed, conduct full spectrum military cyberspace operations in order to enable actions in all domains, ensure US/Allied freedom of action in cyberspace and deny the same to our adversaries."
Looks like they're "denying the same to their adversaries" (maybe).
You mean that Assange *didn't* suddenly become a child molester and rapist exactly two weeks after releasing a cache of classified documents that embarrassed the most powerful country in the world? Are you implying those charges might be TRUMPED-UP as part of an attempt at character assassination?!?!? The hell you say!
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Freenet suffers from a few problems involving retention of information and the lack of userbase capable of using it.
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
The main site seems to work fine after
A) Worldwide mass interest
B) DDOS
C) slashdotting and other causes of sudden increase in traffic.
This should be featured on Discovery's "How do they do it." for sure. I'm peaked.
Hivemind harvest in progress..
Fight the power and the power will fight back!
You're only as good as the system you hack;
If you become a problem you will be replaced--
banned, shut down, erased!
The world has capsized, gone erratic
Constitutional rights have dissolved into static
The truth is based on misinformation--
reality is only a hallucination!
-MDFMK, ©ontrol
You don't back up your claims and you generalize your own opinion. "They lost any credibility, and any respect, at that point" may be what you think, but it's not what everyone thinks. Your only valid and somewhat interesting claim is that they "pulled all private corporate leaks and European and other countries leaks," but there could be other reasons for that than being "solely an anti-US espionage org". Still, that's not trolling. Calling for a hanging (of Assange, presumably) is, though.
Error 001
Security Scan and Virus Detection do not work with your operating system.
Gosh, it's a good thing that the mysterious source of these DDoS attacks isn't targeting an organisation led by someone with tremendous technical chops who knows every dirty trick you can do with computers on a network and knows how to defend and preempt them. Or anything.
http://rocknerd.co.uk
Here is the Proof
3. (S) The Baku businessman is a UK-educated engineer from a
prominent Pre-Revolution Isfahan family, and formerly owned a
large factory in Iran. He is a former national fencing
champion of Iran. former President of the Iran Fencing
Association, and Vice-President of an Azerbaijan sports
association. He has been based in Baku for more than ten
years, working primarily as a sub-contractor to BP and the
Cape Industrial Services company. While his oil services
company includes an insulation division that may be in
competition with INSULTEC, source has provided "inside"
information on many other Iranian issues (including
comprehensive data on the status of new Iranian oil refinery
construction) that does not relate to his private interests
in any way.
4. (S) Note: A quick google check revealed several companies
with the name INSULTEC in the title - these may or not be
affiliated. Based on the information provided by source
(currently in Iran, where he frequently travels), one
possible candidate could be "INSULTEC Chitral Ltd." End
Note.
http://cablegate.wikileaks.org/cable/2009/03/09BAKU179.html
You can thank Julian Assange for this.
Even in a normal case, that really is presuming guilt. In this case, where it looks like it isn't even a rape by classic measures, it's more dubious.
As far as I can tell, both ladies had voluntary sex and then later, based on additional facts, decided they were raped. As far as I can tell, no one has alleged Assange forcibly had sex with them while they were saying "no".
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
should it not be 'alleged rapist'? there has been no trial nor conviction. i mean really! if you want to fnord subconciously smear fnord the fellow there are less clumsy fnord ways to do it.
bring bak the ponies!!
I think this just goes to show the dual morality of entities such as the government when even they wont frown on hiring hackers to protect their interest despite all the government laws, motions and acts layed by said government to stop those said hackers when they're not working for them.
Go wikileaks! not that we had any doubts that shit is taking place just about everyday, but its nice to have some proof and poor some clear water into that mud pool.
If you look like your passport photo, you're too ill to travel. - Will Kommen
How do you separate one from another? Really, how do you? And who should judge which is which?
And that is against the rules regardless of what side you are on. The rule is do not harm civilians.
He has lost all credibility with me. Wikileaks needs to remove Julian Assange or fork the project.
Did you know that in the Polish language, the word for "free" also means "slow"? I wonder if there are any Polish developers on the Freenet project. It would explain a lot.
Right now, the site is still up, so obviously they're already able to deal with a DDOS. And don't believe for a second that the US government is behind the attack; this is obviously the work of the Slowmasons.
Just read this:
http://cablegate.wikileaks.org/cable/2009/03/09BAKU179.html
Intelligence sources are being put at risk by these leaks. Julian Assange claims to care about civilians but he leaks documents that can get people killed? Why? To solve what?
The world is not made safer. Nothing in these cables are worth the loss of civilian life. These cables don't prevent a war with Iran or North Korea, they make war much more likely.
If any heads should roll over the leaks, it should be those of the guy who stole the data and whatever dunce(s) allowed peons access to the data. Although, overall so far, I'm generally pleased with the leaks because they show that most of the world's leaders are fallible but basically rational human beings. For instance, it is good to see that most of the middle eastern leaders understand that Iranian leaders are nutjobs who cannot be trusted with nuclear weapons. Same goes for China's recognition that Kim Jong Ill is off his rocker. I feel much better about the world in general now because so far the leaked info confirms my suspicion that the world's messes aren't as insurmountable as it sometimes seems.
That said, I am deeply embarrassed that the Pentagon is incompetent enough to have allowed the leak of things said in confidence. They are idiots who shouldn't be trusted with so much power.
Even more, I am embarrassed over the USA's strong-arming of Germany over the arrest of one of its citizens. World ***please*** don't take that kind of shit from us (the USA).
I really think it is high time for the USA to turn over the job of policing the world to a democratically elected world government. It is unfair for the US taxpayers to pay so much for world security and to get all of the blame when our leaders fuck up and holy fuck do they ever fuck up. More importantly, it is unfair to the world for the US to have so much say in how the world is run.
http://www.marxist.com/
How do you rape a country?
More to the point, what do they want the warrant to be for: The leaks, or whatever he was accused of in Sweden?
At least isn't that what the government tells us?
Right, because you don't have any embarrassing secrets. You don't tell friends things in confidence.
Thanks to this leak (and to the idiotic flubbing of security in the first place), it will be at least a little bit harder for American diplomats to make friends who will tell them things in confidence.
We all have secrets that we only tell our partner, or best friends... that's not the point. We don't care if the diplomats are visiting prostitutes or cheating on their wives.
But as soon as those diplomats start representing me, or my country, they better behave. And if they use official lines, their message should be decent enough anyway.
If you like an analogy, the people can be called a shareholders assembly, and the government a management. This has nothing to do with the personal sphere... it's business. At a shareholders meeting, you do not have the right to know who the management is having sex with, but you do have the right to know why the company is or is not making any profit. And you do get a big annual report... again, it contains all relevant information, and no "secrets". And wikileaks may have leaked some juicy relational secrets - that's not necessary imho, but harmless too - but all the rest compares to that annual report that we have been missing all those years.
first, who cares what he had focused on - the US or something else. The wikileaks went from an open org to make information free and turned into one guy trying to hurt one entity. totally different things. second, there ARE juicy leaks about other countries, they just won't put them up anymore. talk about information being free and uncensored. assange is bullshit, and after he gets assassinated maybe wikileaks will become a decent leaks group again
Censor...
I do not think that word means what you think it means.
I mean even his next leak will be against Bank of America. I'm not a fan of Bank of America at all, but why is he only going after US interests? He even leaked cables which exposed intelligence sources around the globe. Assange is not a force for good, he does not realize that his leaks hurt the very civilians he claims to be fighting for.
The political elites are rich, powerful, and wont be harmed if there is a world war. They wont be harmed if thousands of intelligence sources are tracked down.
Robert Hansen did something similar. The only difference is Hansen did it on purpose while Assange does not seem to have a clue what the consequences of his actions are. Or he's just trying to protect his own ass and is throwing intelligence sources under the bus. His behavior exposing intelligence sources like this and his inability to properly defend his own intelligence sources, lead me to believe hes completely rogue.
They get people to like them by seeming like a whistleblower site and then they focus in on the devil/American empire, giving the identities of critical intelligence sources to the whole world.
Give it time. In the US, there is a saying: "The wheels of Justice turn slowly; but they do turn". Note that I am not saying that it would be Just to assassinate him. I am saying, however, that there are plenty of "Patriots" who believe that it would be, and it is probably just a matter of time before he has an "accident".
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
Yep, nothing spreads peace like discrediting diplomacy.
Who would profit (as in "cash") from Wikileaks being DDoS'ed off the internet?
I am interested to know if the ramp up in DDoS traffic coincided with the announcement of releasing leaked documents from a major US bank.
rocks
An intelligence source is 100% civilian and innocent. An enemy combatant such as a member of the Taliban or Al Qaeda gang member is not a civilian and not innocent. The US soldiers are at war with the foreign soldiers. It's expected that soldiers on both sides of a war are going to die.
Intelligence sources are not soldiers. They are people who have surrendered to the US government. They had the option to surrender to the Taliban, to Iran, but chose to surrender to the US Government. Whether it was because the US Government had the bigger better military or whether it's because they just hate Al Qaeda and the Taliban, they sided with the USA and the USA has a sacred trust to protect their identity at any cost.
Assange thinks he is more important than he is. Exposing intelligence sources is never acceptable. It's as bad as torture which we agree is not acceptable, or killing women and children. So if Assange gets an entire family killed off because of this leak, or several families are ruined, this is okay to you?
But if the USA bombs the wrong house by accident then it's not okay?
Agreed. They are doing the job the Corporate Media quit long ago. Telling the truth, even if it is embarrassing to power.
Agreed. Maybe he should get a prize for something, but "peace" sure as hell ain't it.
Life is not for the lazy.
...is making the USA's government look desperate and pathetic. If they don't understand how unstoppable this is now, they look technically impaired. If they don't understand what "out of your jurisdiction" means, they look disingenuous, dangerous and as hamfisted as the Russians. All it does is to confirm every negative impression that came out of Wikileaks, which by the way, would be immediately replaced by several other similar organizations if the original is somehow made to stop and it's founder killed or imprisoned. Apparently the US government hasn't learned the lesson of Napster.
Bottom line: The American empire no longer commands the respect of its subjects and incidents like this will continue. Thank you very much, conservative republican financial community and all the recent presidential figureheads starting with Reagan, none of whom actually give a rat's patoot about the USA other than as a money generating device.
Please do not read this sig. Thank you.
No, it's trolling. Wikileaks is a leaks site, not an investigative site. Therefore they can't leak what they don't have, and oddly enough, what people are leaking to them is primarily dealing with US intelligence.
That has been brought up quite a few times and it's just not true. It's something that apologist trolls say to divert attention from the fact that the material wouldn't have been made available by wikileaks had nobody chosen to leak it. Wikileaks does not now nor will it ever have security clearance to get that material directly.
The first attack took down the servers and kept them down until wikileaks upgraded to Amazons Cloud hosting. I'm not sure if any hacker has ever taken down one of the behemoth cloud hosting networks so this should be a good test.
Put everything on Comcast, which will refuse the excess DDoS traffic unless someone pays.
Not truth; opinion that I disagree with. But I agree it wasn't a troll and there was no excuse for modding it down.
But there's been a lot of that today.
Free Martian Whores!
Could wikileaks sue (and win?) the US Government for this DOS provided enough evidence? Wouldn't the Gov sue if someone DOS'd them? PS: The evidence could come in the form of a ... leak.
If he were an Arab Muslim, he would already be dead if they had his location. This is because the largest enemy a government like the US has is it's own population, and the assassination of a white well-to-do activist would be far more alarming than another dead Arab.
They are using their diplomatic contacts to try to force him into hiding. If that doesn't work, you can bet they have plans to take him out with rendition or staging an accident. You can step on toes to a certain extent, but once you start getting in the way of business getting done, you can start counting you life down in hours.
Wikileaks just wants to embarrass the U.S. and damage the ties the U.S. has with other nations. There was nothing criminal or even shocking other than the candid opinions of lower level personal in the state department about other countries and said countries leaders. The worst thing is that this damages the relationship between the U.S. and various other countries, especially those in the Middle East as well as many Middle East countries relationship with Iran.
This is just Assange using wikileaks to attack a country he hates.
You mean a sudden jolt of ego from world-wide fame *wouldn't* lower a man's private inhibitions and cause him to behave inappropriately, even illegally? Hey, as long as we're speculating...
your thin skin doesn't make me a troll
Yes, because at the age of 39, after leading a life completely devoid of any crime worse than hacking, he suddenly decided to become a violent sexual predator on the same week he started releasing caches of classified U.S. government documents. There is nothing even remotely suspicious about that or its timing. And anyone who says otherwise is clearly a tinfoil hat conspiracy theorist who probably thinks we never landed on the moon either.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Hey, he's a monkey! That's pretty good considering!
What spreads peace is honesty, not duplicity. If two nations can't trust each other, then how on earth do you expect them to be at peace with each other? Yes, the leak does throw diplomacy into chaos, but on the other hand, the chaos wouldn't have existed if everything was on the level the whole time.
The "leaks" are from a former US soldier who had access to a US system that had US diplomatic cables stored on it.
Is anyone surprised that all the leaks have to do with the US or what the US has done or said seeing as the actual source is the US?
Considering that apparently 600,000 people had access to said system, I find it amazing that this simply hasn't happened already. If something is secret, then protect it and limit access, otherwise perhaps think twice about what you say on such a system. Also think about not allowing something stupid like downloading massive amounts of information into a thumb drive. Just sayin'...
Anyway there is an intrinsic problem with your conclusion that because ALL the leaks are from US, that it must mean that Wikileaks is an anti-US organization. Classic Cause and Causation.
Yes, that's why every famous person becomes a rapist immediately upon achieving fame. No matter how many decades they spend as an innocent person, never hurting anyone; every guy just needs a slight dash of fame to become a sexual predator.
Besides, if the CIA had just trumped this up, surely someone would have seen it coming beforehand.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Last I heard the telcos were whining about not having enough bandwidth and needing to traffic shape. I guess they just do not have enough bandwidth for ME. If the US Government needs some spare bandwidth to DDoS a site or two, they have some to spare.
In the sense that Sweden has a ludicrous level of rape charges as is.
It's possible that the US used it, given Sweden's rape charge level, as a smoke screen for trumped up charges. My bet is on it being a coincidence.
"Lack of speed can be overcome. In the worst case by patience." --Znork
That only applies to us unwashed masses.
I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
Hey if Al Gore can get a Peace Prize for Global Warming . . . .
Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
It was pulled when they released the War Logs, because they expected an inevitable surge of traffic (and DDOSes), much like press sites do with huge-hyper-massive-net-straining breaking news.
After that, they were overwhelmed by the effort required to publish these cables, and putting back the minor stuff got a very low priority. Plus, their profile is no so high that a vanilla mediawiki would crumble in a few days, so you need something better and safer.
Wikileaks is a very small org, it's clear they're struggling to manage their workload.
-- Let's go Viridian.
When you are a secretive organization like the US government, the most important phrase is "plausible deniability." Of course the US could fly a satellite guided bomb into Assange's bathroom, but it would be undeniably traced back to the US government. They could also use legal methods, and they are about to, but that doesn't mean that in the interim they will stop harassing Assange or WikiLeaks.
And in the interim, they will use third parties to cover their tracks. Just like they did in Afghanistan in the 1980s. Just like they did throughout all of their criminal behavior dating back to the Spanish American War.
Ecuador ranks a whooping 101 on the press freedom index, with an annually deteriorating index value. I'm not quite convinced it's the best country to exile to for people publishing inconveniant documents.
The compilers of that "press freedom index" is Reporters Without Borders. RWB are primarily funded by the US government through the National Endowment for Democracy which was founded during the Reagan administration to channel funds to organizations abroad that would support US foreign policy. Sometimes this funding is direct, sometimes it is conducted through the international arms of the US Democratic Party or Republican Party.
I would consider that the "US State Dept Press Freedom Index".
Actually, this probably isn't a DDoS at all, but simply people repeatedly checking the site for new cables. If they had released a lot more cables in a batch (say a couple of thousands or more), people would look less frequently while digesting what they've got. So, this increase in traffic may very well be self-inflicted by their painfully slow release policy.
cpghost at Cordula's Web.
I think Wikileaks may have gone too far with the latest set of leaks. I don't believe they're all in the public interest and some of them will definitely hurt relations between the US and other countries for no good reason.
And I agree with others that this does seem a tad personal (Assange vs. the US). Are there no other countries with juicy leakable tidbits?
If two nations can't trust each other, then how on earth do you expect them to be at peace with each other?
This is a solved problem. You set up systems of checks and balances that don't require the nations to trust one another. They can verify what the other one is doing. In fact, if the only way nations could be at peace was for them to trust one another, there'd be war all around.
i see that they didnt like their filth coming out into the open eh ?
that means there is probably even stronger sh@t to come up yet. since those bastards have started calling for his arrest calling him 'rapist'. despite the girls who are involved in that case openly state that there is no rape involved and that was voluntary. i guess, that conveniently slips by their ears.
the rock bottom level of corruption that politics has hit, is nauseating.
Read radical news here
Whilst I don't doubt the politicians involved here may have a grudge, I suspect that there's little practical benefit in orchestrating any "unfortunate accident" at this point -- the cat is totally out of the bag! For the same reason, it's likely the cat was partially out of the bag a long time ago to ensure nothing "happened" to the parties involved prior to this. So for Assange, it'll likely all be legal now.
Assange thinks he is more important than he is.
Please explain why you singled out Assange for something that Wikileaks is doing along with El Pais, Le Monde, Der Spiegel, The Guardian, and The New York Times.
Exposing intelligence sources is never acceptable.
The leak source was probably a US government employee. It was that person who exposed intelligence sources: a US government employee. Wikileaks, along with other journalistic outlets, is bringing an edited version to the general public. They are not exposing ANYTHING. We, the public, are precisely LAST to read the leaked documents. Closing down newspapers won't stop leaks: it won't even stop them from reaching the public; it will only prevent them from being edited.
I don't see how anyone could mistake the difference between an open documents whistleblower site, and one hijacked by one individual restricting information released to just that which attacks just one specific entity for personal reasons. I don't care if the country he picked was Wherethefuckistan, or just a company he didn't like, or his ex-girlfriend.
Only double digit number of people attacking them? Surely the US can find more geeks than that.
This is blinging
the amount of filth continually being exposed about their government and its BETRAYAL to their country's values is increasing, yet, also the numbers of americans who are supporting their government is increasing, at least in slashdot.
....
i find it nauseating. how can someone support some party that has DECEIVED them, by betraying the founding ideals of their country in regard to freedom, liberty and basic human rights, and perpetrated innumerable filth behind the cover of secrecy with the 'national secrets' excuse
YET, some people can still stomach being deceived, lied, and bottomless filth committed in their name, AND come up supporting that !!!
HOW. WHY ?
Read radical news here
thats you just being a moron. and getting your news, like a true moron, from american news media which is 80% owned by 4 corporations that supported your government into power.
had you spared the time to check wikileaks leak documents, you would find that there are more filth exposed about other countries than america. like turkey for example, it is probable that half of turkey's government may have to go to court hearings for their dirty dealings.
yet, like a true witless idiot, you are just eating on what you are fed.
well done. good for you. keep doing that, until you or your son is sent to die in a foreign war under the pretense of 'freedom', will ya. at least, you will do some good to this world, by removing yourself from its surface this way.
Read radical news here
It's called accountability, and it's always beneficial.
I never stated or suggested that it would be an act of the politicians. Even in circa 2011 US, the politicians don't do the killing.
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
The government is subject to the law as much as the rest of us are. Our tax dollars could go to paying for damages. Oslama FTW.
Chewbacon
The Bible is like Wikipedia: written by a bunch of people and verifiable by questionable sources.
that being snooping personal information, bank accounts, credit card numbers, frequent flyer numbers of the u.n. ambassadors, and employees ? so that, they can later be used to fuck around and blackmail them ?
/. user id. your iq and cognitive powers are not enough to keep it.
or, strong arming an ally into submission, because world will never know and it will be denied when it hits the press (like it did in 2004) ?
or, filthy countries trying to brew a war 'at all costs' (includes even nuclear fallout from tactical weapons by the way), destabilizing an entire geographic region ?
these are not diplomacy. these are filth. and anyone who has bought the shit that they are fed from the mass media, as 'diplomacy being discredited' is a witless idiot. please return your
Read radical news here
read the fucking leaks and articles. It actually shows the US is doing pretty well to keep things calm in the US.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
If any heads should roll over the leaks, it should be those of the guy who stole the data and whatever dunce(s) allowed peons access to the data.
I'm surprised Slashdotters haven't picked up on this angle, but the peons have access to this data as a direct result of 9/11 and the panic legislation that ensued. Remember all of the "OMG gov't agencies need access to each other's information so that we can prevent this from happening"? Remember privacy advocates pointing out that perhaps it's not a smart idea to have all of this information shared all over the place, because of possible unintended consequences?
There's a reason some 3 million US soldiers had access to all of this data. The government brought it upon itself.
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
12 civilians clearly unarmed shot with the murderers expressing clear joy at their slaughter.
I thought we went over this? The soldiers *clearly* thought they had an RPG, as they said so on multiple occasions. It's clear to us, sitting in our comfortable computer chairs and couches several months after the fact, and being told beforehand that they were unarmed journalists and one of them had a camera tripod. The only wrong they committed, as I understand, was firing on the van that tried to pick up the injured. The main problem was covering it up, and the grunts have no say in that. You can't blame kids that are trained to kill for the way they act in doing so. Blame the people who put them in that situation in the first place.
That said, what Wikileaks is doing is fantastic. Apparently we are getting the transparency that President Obama promised in his campaign, whether he likes it or not.
Why does not Wikileaks post all their leaks on Freenet which is somewhat robust to DDoS _and_ provides great encryption and anonymity?
Someone is mirroring the data on I2P which is much faster and better than Freenet, IMO.
purely anti american ? OF course it was going to eventually become one. lets see. russia, a few eastern european countries (not includes poland even), china, a few chinese satellites, and thats it.
the rest of the world is dominated by united states. maybe, 80% of the world population, lives under the 'protectorate' and 'world policing' of united states.
of course, ANYthing happening in this 80% of the world, has to have either u.s. backing, or u.s. approval.
of course it was going to turn into an entirely anti u.s. operation. us govt. and us. corporations have been the ones perpetrating shit that is going on around the world for the last 60 years.
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They are hosting on Amazon US West (San Jose) and EU Dublin. Amazon has DDOS defenses on their EC2 (Elastic Compute) 2 cloud (Cisco/Juniper). The DDOS is childish at best. If the US gov't wanted to take it down they could easily ask Amazon to take down the mirror by now... This is more media pandering than anything...
still be as naive as you to the extent that you are able to believe that the concept of 'national secret' can be an innocent one.
Who said anything about innocent? If the other side isn't playing fair, you either play dirty or lose.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
telling people what their government does in secret behind their backs, murdering, kidnapping, strong arming people and betraying freedom, liberty ideals they are purporting to be defending, is, 'crime against democracy'.
go fuck yourself will you. i was going to compose a logical and calm-tempered reasoning, but really, im fresh out after seeing so many idiots. go fuck yourself in some corner is the highest form of communique you deserve, since apparently you do not have the need or desire to educate yourself even a little bit.
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I really would love to read a professional analysis of the source(s) of the attack(s). It might be juicier than the actual leaks...
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
It happens quite often, actually. There are a plethora of examples of fame going to people's heads.
One famous example is R. Kelly.
Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
So in order to save a frank assessment from becoming an embarrassment in a hypocritical situation, we should let the government lock down all information it wants from its citizens.
Hey, those political ads once every four years are all I need to make a decision at the ballot box, what do I need to know what's going on for? Hell, even the ads are too much, I just vote for the party my family always has.
If I bother to vote. Prime time TV is much more interesting anyway.
Lies about crimes
I don't see where he was killed or harmed.
If you are acting against your government, regardless of intent, you are not innocent. IN fact, he is probably guilty of sharing state secrets. More correct would be to say it may have hurt a US connection.
"Exposing intelligence sources is never acceptable."
That's just wrong. You may want to think about your wording.
Your same argument could have been used to argue against the release of the watergate information.
At this point, I think the lives saved by forcing the lies foreign countries have been making in their public statements may be more then the lives that will be lost.
You're argument rest on the false assumption that no lives at ALL will be lost if information is kept secret.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Since you didn't include a link to the text of the act in question, here is the text of the Espionage Act of 1917.
Section 1, paragraph (e) pretty clearly applies to the person who leaked all of the documents in question.
Section 1, paragraph (d) MIGHT have applied to Wikileaks... EXCEPT for the fact that they provided the State Department with copies of all of the documents that had been leaked, prior to publication.
What's more, not only are they redacting the documents prior to publication, they're redacting the documents EVEN MORE HEAVILY than the declassified versions being published by the Department of Defense.
So, yeah. Granted, IANAL, but I'd say that doesn't apply.
Calling the German Chancellor 'Teflon'...yeah, that's the pinnacle of "moral apathy" right there!
I notice you only respond as anonymous, and you spit out opinions as if they are facts.
I did my research. Most assets are civilians. They aren't soldiers. They are ordinary people who just happen to live in the wrong location and know the wrong people.
Your mom being crucified to protect the sources would be acceptable?
If I were a CIA officer yes I would protect my sources identities as if they are family members because thats what you do. It's just like you protect your comrades in war.
In war I'd be risking my life to win, and the sources would be risking their lives for me.
Say what? I don't think I agree with that AT ALL. Those actions are morally and legally miles apart.
No they aren't. A source is likely going to be tortured if discovered. A source if you out them has no life to go back to.
Somehow you have the idea that intelligence sources are "bad" people. Some of the best people on earth are intelligence sources and some of the worst scumbags on earth are intelligence sources. If you are an intelligence officer then you'd know everything about your source, if you know they are one of the best people and you know they are risking their life for you what kind of scumbag would you have to be to sell them out?
Whats more likely is that his head got so fucking big after the first leak and he became so self absorbed that he thought he could get by with something.
He's an attention whore, last time he got a bunch of attention, he got a raging hardon and had to go get laid. Judging by his personality, he probably hasn't had too many women in his life and didn't really know what he was doing.
He certainly isn't very intelligent or he would have realized that fucking around with a couple whores was a REALLY BAD IDEA at that point in time.
Pretty much no matter how you look at it, he did this to himself. He might have raped some girls, but he most certainly acted irresponsibly by whoring around with them in the first place when the eyes of the world were on him. This again goes back to his need to be the center of attention.
EVERYTHING this guy does screams socially inept douche bag ... yet you guys keep praising him. He's not your roll model, you really don't want to be like him.
Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
While it may not be typical for them to become 'rapist', you're a complete and total idiot if you don't realize fame brings out the stupid in people. Maybe you're not American and you've not seen what happens in Hollywood?
Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
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Assange thinks he is more important than he is. Exposing intelligence sources is never acceptable. It's as bad as torture which we agree is not acceptable, or killing women and children. So if Assange gets an entire family killed off because of this leak, or several families are ruined, this is okay to you?
1) Assange is the spokesman for Wikileaks. He's stated his goal is to act as the lightning rod for the project, but he's not the one who decides what (or how) to leak. I know it's hard to deal with a mostly-anonymous organization, and I understand your desire to humanize it and focus your anger on a specific person -- but I'm afraid you can't do that here.
2) The US was given a chance to redact this and other leaks so as to avoid any fall-out. They declined. Take from that what you will...
Well, the diplomatic reporting system and practice, itself, really wasn't a secret. If you tell a diplomat something "in confidence", you should reasonably expect that you're telling a giant government bureaucracy, with all that implies.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
I don't see where he was killed or harmed.
You expect to see that? You think Iran is going to show you what they did to him?
If you are acting against your government, regardless of intent, you are not innocent.
The document says baku businessman. A businessman is a civilian not a government employee or a soldier. He never worked for the Iranian government so he is completely innocent. It's not like this guy is a double agent, the document does not say anything about him being loyal to any government.
That's just wrong. You may want to think about your wording.
Why is it wrong? Make a case.
Lives will be lost either way. I'm saying when intelligence sources are revealed innocent civilian lives are destroyed. This is a certainty.
Look at this video snippet. The guy there is clearly carrying an RPG, which is exactly what the trained soldier in the video said he saw before escalating the situation. I've had people come back and say it was a piece of photographic equipment. I was in the military, and my wife is a professional photographer. We both agree, that it looks and hangs and swings exactly like a weapon; and it doesn't look like any piece of photographic equipment we've ever seen.
It's a shame that the photographers got shot up, but they took that risk walking around in the open with people carrying RPGs.
About the "joy at their slaugther": even if the people in the video were in fact civilians, it's clear that the gunner thought they were armed insurgents -- people that had probably been involved in killing both Iraqis and American soldiers, and were the reason the gunner was even still in Iraq instead of back in the States with his family. The joy at killing the "bad guys" may shock you, but it's not the joy of killing innocents.
To mods: This is not a troll. It's important information, and a genuine contribution to correct a widespread misconception. Marking it "troll" is censorship.
TCP: Why the Internet is full of SYN.
Additional and perhaps even more serious damage would be done to the U.S. reputation should we conduct a DDoS attack on so petty a grounds, and get caught. This DDoS is likely the work of some random botmaster with a political axe to grind, and that axe may not be obvious. Perhaps they want people to *think* that the US attacked the WikiLeaks web site. It might merely be an internet joy ride for them, as most such DDoS attacks appear to be.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
Just go on and convict him, subbie.
One of the following is true:
1) During 2010, Wikileaks has received one or more documents not pertaining to the US government, and has chosen not to release them. Wikileaks is therefore biased.
2) During 2010, Wikileaks has NOT received any documents not pertaining to the US government. Wikileaks is therefore not a credible leaks organization according to potential leakers in general.
There are 1.1... kinds of people.
The Godaddy registered Wikileaks domains (wikileaks.com wikileaks.net wikileaks.biz, wikileaks.mobi, wikileaks.us) are no longer pointing at anything meaninful - just Godaddy blurb pages. It seems that Godaddy has decided to stop serving DNS for Wikileaks
Participatory Governance : The only feasible option for a real democracy, where everyone really does have a say.
This batch of leaks is about as likely to wind up helping the United States more than hurting it, as it has exposed, for example, the deep hypocrisy of the Arab governments in the middle east. It does the United States very little good, so far as anyone can tell, from letting these governments publicly berate our every action in the region, while privately begging us to stop Iran from getting a nuclear bomb. A little sunshine on that single issue might do enough good to entirely negate any other random embarrassments which occur.
I don't have a sense for whether or not Mr. Assange "hates" the United States. It is quite clear that he thinks governments keep too many secrets, and that he thinks operational transparency might lead to governments whose actions are more closely aligned with the interests of their populations. He seems pretty focused on western democratic nations, and this looks like an indication that perhaps he doesn't hate them. More like "tough love".
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
I should tell you my secret. I'm actually a Maine Coon cat augmented with experimental nanotech slashdotting from a DARPA laboratory. I think my English is quite good for a cat.
I write sci-fi for metalheads
Right. Well, since the USG is, and has been, playing VERY dirty with the privacy of others, including its own citizens, looks like Julian is doing exactly the right thing, doesn't it?
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
despite main site and a lot of mirrors were down, i was still able to find it with 2 google searches and 1 wikipedia page.
/. uid, and log out from internet.
http://mirror.infoboj.eu/
if you dont have the brain cell to do THAT much, hand over your
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A little journalistic integrity would be nice.
Assange and Wikileaks lack such integrity completely.
Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
Do you think any of the diplomats involved were surprised by any of the revelations in the cables?
They were the least surprised of anyone because they're the most aware group of how diplomacy involves saying X while doing Y, of how realpolitik requires certain public stances that are privately contradicted, of how diplomatic maneuvering works. None of them had any blinders on about the people they were talking to or the effect their words were having.
Within the diplomatic corps, this is the equivalent of a bunch of gossip being exposed: some embarassing face-time for some people, but nothing that anyone didn't know was being said about others.
Anyone who loves or hates any language, platform, or manufacturer, doesn't know what they're talking about.
And Obama for simply not being Bush.
The Nobel Peach Prize has been a joke ever since Carter received it, and probably even before that.
Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
Heh, peach prize, wouldn't that be nice?
Peace is what I meant, obviously.
Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
Seriously, stop making sense. Most people aren't going to listen.
I write sci-fi for metalheads
The fame gave him access to unfamiliar women and turned him into a self-justifying douchebag. His protestation that the charges are false is not inconsistent with his pattern of antisocial behavior. The Swedish authorities have followed the letter of the law, protecting his rights while he cooperated then escalating their official interest in him when he skipped out. I doubt the CIA could have made it this seamless. Assange created that mess for himself, and it belies his pretense of being one of the good guys. That you're falling for it just proves why people like him can get away with things like that.
Same here. Heck, "The Founding Fathers" of the country were terrorists.
Of course "the founding fathers" of most revolutions are terrorists when viewed from the other side. However, I'm not sure I'd want to be on his side...
He seems to be a revolutionary against the government of the USA (non-partisan). Although, I'm not in favor of some of the things the government of the USA does, we have a ballot box to fix most things and I don't think the revolution that Thomas Jefferson had in mind had much to do about the dribble coming out of wikileaks these days...
Besides, if that Julian guy is a true revolutionary, he should be comfortable with martyr status and be willing to give himself up for the cause to prove his point.
...Twitter's still up
Coder's Stone: The programming language quick ref for iPad
I'm actually glad this is happening. This demonstrates that wikileaks has an ulterior agenda (I can't really speculate what it is) because if they were really that concerned about free dissemination of information and actually getting whatever this stuff is out to everyone, they'd RAR it up and stick it on The Pirate Bay. Anyone else find this suspicious?
I can't prove it, but I believe that people in the US _are_ some of the most oppressed in the world. The problem is that the oppression is subtle: consumerism. It is pervasive and it is not considered oppression (by most people). This is far worse than overt oppression where people are conscious of the oppression and can make choices about when and how to struggle against the oppression.
Helping with organizational effectiveness is our job.
Cue this message running a high change of instantly disappearing because a teabagger is upset and mods it down to never be seen again.
I have a hard time signing onto any of your other world perceptions if you believe tea party members make up the majority of slashdot's userbase and control all the modding.
You[the average us citizen] can no longer claim that the government is not really representing you when you actively encourage them to hide all the details.
that was very well said.
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He seems to be a revolutionary against the government of the USA (non-partisan). Although, I'm not in favor of some of the things the government of the USA does, we have a ballot box to fix most things and I don't think the revolution that Thomas Jefferson had in mind had much to do about the dribble coming out of wikileaks these days...
Being against the foreign policy of the USA does not mean that a person is against the government of the USA. Thomas Jefferson would be absolutely appalled at what U.S. foreign policy has become:
"We wish not to meddle with the internal affairs of any country, nor with the general affairs of Europe. Peace with all nations, and the right which that gives us with respect to all nations, are our object."
"I have ever deemed it fundamental for the United States never to take active part in the quarrels of Europe. Their political interests are entirely distinct from ours. Their mutual jealousies, their balance of power, their complicated alliances, their forms and principles of government, are all foreign to us. They are nations of eternal war. All their energies are expended in the destruction of the labor, property and lives of their people."
Replace "Europe" with "the Middle East" and the sentiment is the complete opposite of current U.S. foreign policy.
Who/Whom ever is initiating the attacks is wasting their time. The documents in question have been leaked to all the major media branches and torrents can be easily found for the offending files. The only people being blocked right now are those with the least ability to do anything with the data provided.
Exposing intelligence sources is never acceptable. It's as bad as torture which we agree is not acceptable, or killing women and children.
Are you saying that the President of the United States would commute the prison sentence of someone who has committed a crime as bad as torture and murder? Because that's what happened.
I didn't realize we were that weak of a nation that we had to violate our principles to win. Of course, what competition are we in? If you're talking military conflict there is no nation on Earth capable of withstanding an American lead attack.
Why do we have ideals? If we're actually losing a war then I'd say it's time to evaluate tactics but when war is this asymmetric there is no excuse. The irony of the whole terrorism angle is that is actually a stated service of the FBI. Their interrogation tactics are far more effective and guess what? They don't have to torture. Just because the other side is doing it, doesn't mean it's okay that we do it. If a friend of yours was jumping off a cliff would you follow him?
actually there was more filth exposed for my country than u.s. maybe 1/3 of the government came up in deep shit.
but, im GLAD over it. im not blabbering like a witless idiot trying to defend my country or help it hide its secrets like the most americans i do.
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Do you think any of the diplomats involved were surprised by any of the revelations in the cables?
Of course not. It's their trade. But the diplomats take their orders from politicians, who may now feel the need to put on a show for their populace. People react differently in front of an audience.
You are very biased and have a lot of free time, since you posted at least 15 messages in this thread.
An easy example:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plame#.22Plamegate.22
Intelligence sources have been exposed by US government, and most probably a few people have been killed following this 'leak'.
Would you condemn Bush, or only Assange, since he's not american ?
I didn't realize we were that weak of a nation that we had to violate our principles to win.
You have to violate your principles just to survive. Nature does not care what your principles or morals dictate - we are all bound by her law "survival of the fittest". It's very good to have ideals, and I think we should stick to them whenever possible - but you really can't stick to ideals at all times if you hope to survive.
If we're actually losing a war then I'd say it's time to evaluate tactics but when war is this asymmetric there is no excuse.
Agreed - which is why, for the most part, we have not embraced any "total war" philosophy in Afghanistan or Iraq. On the other hand, we have certainly aligned ourselves with some pretty unsavory characters. War itself is a failure of our ideals, so this should not be a surprise.
They don't have to torture.
I was not defending torture. Though I myself would use it if I knew the tortured could provide some extremely important information - but such situations only occur in movies.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
since the USG
No one said the US diplomatic corp was morally superior to anyone else. But "keeping secrets" is hardly its cardinal sin.
looks like Julian is doing exactly the right thing, doesn't it?
He's doing exactly what an enemy of the US should do, yes.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
even bigger ddos (now unwittingly assisted by the public)
You think obtaining secretary general Ban Ki-moon's credit card number spreads it faster?
My UID is prime. Hah!
If it wasn't DDoSed before, it's surely Slashdotted now. Good job, guys!
Given how much harder the founders of the United States had it than we do today I find your statement to be just reaction to fear that the media has instilled in you. Why do we have to torture people to survive? Last I checked we're surviving quite well and the overreactions are what is hurting out position further rather than helping. When you resort to torturing people then you will have no will of the people on your side as they will just see you as another tyrant.
A great many soldiers in the past died for our principles and I'd rather they not died in vain as I believe those are strong principles that we actually can maintain without dropping everything just because a criminal organization out there wants to do us harm. If we had handled it like a criminal organization instead of all out combat then the whole thing would have cost a whole lot less and we probably would have actually gotten the man we set out to get. The fact that we haven't even found Osama Bin Laden yet is true testament to where you get when you abandon your ideals for the fear of the day.
Also, torture has shown many times throughout history to be ineffective as it just forces the person to say what you want to hear. Too many people get caught up in the retribution part that they forget the real goal is to get more information and the FBI has had great success with this without resorting to torture. So the question becomes again, why should we violate our principles at this stage of the game? If there was an all out assault on our homeland with women and children being raped and murdered like the time of our forefathers perhaps then we should consider resorting to guerrilla tactics as we did then.
The only threat to our survival I see today is the fact that we violate our very noble principles and torture people seemingly indiscriminately. This only serves to polarise the people we are actually trying to help.
Why do we have to torture people to survive?
Again with the torture? I haven't and won't defend or condone it. The US does not need to be in the torture business.
I'm just saying that allowing our state department to have secrets is something that I believe is necessary for them to deal with the harsh world. Torture has nothing to do with it.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
The leaks don't discredit diplomacy, they simply reveal its normally hidden workings, which are a bit rough around the edges. Not all diplomats are particularly diplomatic.
Ultimately, though, the leaks give me more confidence in diplomacy, because they show that even authoritarian, closed governments like that of China have a solid underpinning of common sense. The cables reveal that China is not nearly as friendly towards North Korea as their Communist affiliation forces them to pretend; in private, they concede that Kim Jong Ill is nuts. The cables also reveal that many middle eastern leaders are just as concerned as we are about the prospect of Iran becoming a nuclear power.
The government is subject to the law as much as the rest of us are. Our tax dollars could go to paying for damages. Oslama FTW.
Really? Then why all the Executive Orders that bypass the Constitution?
The mind conceives, the body achieves, the spirit manifests.
From a criminal's viewpoint, the cop is the enemy. And in that sense, yes, Julian is the enemy of the USG. Because he's exposing its criminal activities, like bartering away the lives of people detained in Guantanamo, torturing people, and so on. The USG he is "attacking" is not the one that was described to you in grade school. The USG he is attacking is the one that has, via the persons in the house, the senate, the executive, and the judiciary, broken explicit oaths to defend and obey the constitution and is now running amuck, trampling its own citizen's liberties.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
But if the USA bombs the wrong house by accident then it's not okay?
No, its not OK. Not if they pretend to have higher moral ground.
For the sake of god, I can use the same argument in relation with your position with Assange: is he not allowed to make mistakes? What is the difference between US bombing the wrong house and the redacters of the leaked documents overseeing to wipe out an identifiable name?
Questions raise, answers kill. Raise questions to stay alive.
Because he's exposing its criminal activities, like bartering away the lives of people detained in Guantanamo, torturing people, and so on.
Not one of those things was revealed by Wikileaks. Torture has been debated for years - we can't even agree on the definition of torture, and we know things like waterboarding have occured. We knew Obama was trying to close Guantanamo, and we knew he was pressuring other countries to take some of the detainees. The leaked cables have turned up nothing particularly untoward at all (so far). The juiciest bits read like mild Hollywood gossip, and the real surprise so far is how candid the Arab leaders are (well, were) with our diplomats.
The USG he is "attacking" is not the one that was described to you in grade school.
You have a pretty romanticized notion of what the USG once was like. Slavery was written into our constitution. Nothing that the US government does today is even remotely as evil, especially when considering the scale, as slavery. And then there's the whole era of the political boss... the Alien and Sedition Acts... the entire Jim Crow period... Internment of the Japanese during WW2...
Modern America isn't perfect, and it may even be getting worse - but there are darker periods in our history, and we've come out of them. The system certainly isn't so broken that I'd root for a egomaniac rather than my own government. Like all self-professed "great" men, his ego seems to have gotten ahead of him and he will soon be serving time for rape.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
I don't think Valarie Plame should have been outed.
I condemn whoever was responsible for the outing of Valarie Plame. The higher up in rank the worse it is.
I also condemn the outing of Erik Prince. An intelligence operative/source should never be outed.
Lets turn that around then. You think it's wrong for an individual to put lives at risk on a few occaisions while claiming to do it for the greater good, but you think it's okay for a governement to kill innocent bystanders and call it 'unavoidable collateral damage'?
I'll take Julian over the US governement any time.
Karma? What's that again?