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Verizon Finally Unveils Apple iPhone
Velcroman1 writes "The most asked question in all of technology finally has an answer. When will Verizon get the iPhone? The answer: early next month. Verizon COO Lowell McAdam unveiled a new iPhone Tuesday during a presentation in New York that was short on surprises as most of the tech press already knew what was coming. 'If the press writes about something long enough and hard enough, eventually it comes true,' McAdam joked. Nevertheless, the move clears a major hurdle for Apple as they face increasing competition in smartphones, particularly from devices based on Google Inc.'s Android software which has exploded in popularity. Verizon's Lowell McAdam described the unveiling as a 'great day for wireless customers across the US.'"
Good: Free tethering. Bad: No simultaneous voice/data.
So how is Verizon going to spin this to backpeddle against their previous bashings of the iPhone? Weren't they just a year or so ago telling how puny and weak the iPhone was in comparison to their Droid?
Unlimited data plan? Hopefully will spread to all phones/carriers
It will be interesting to see if this helps to even the playing field between the iPhone & Android. The only question is how many Verizon customers will hold out until the next gen because you can't talk & surf at the same time on Verizon's 3G network?
Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
They didn't just say they would support tethering, they said you could use it as a hotspot - about time.
BUT what I don't think was stated, was how much (if anything), this will cost... it might be free but I don't think the price of anything was made clear. They also didn't talk about unlimited data plans even though that was a rumor, and the Verizon data plan page says there is a 2GB cap on smartphone plans.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
What actually happens when a call comes in? Obviously any data streams stop, but if I have a laptop tethered will TCP connections get reset or is it like all of a sudden having dropped packets?
Anyway, there were exactly 3 things of interest at the press conference:
That's it. I would think if they're going to bother holding a press conference like this that they would be willing to talk a bit more about the device first, but no, it's was only the most minimal sip of information they could get away with divulging.
I read the internet for the articles.
This took way too long. I already caved and got myself a Android phone, which I'm very happy with.
No simultaneous voice/data? I guess the best way to make calls on the thing will be to use Skype over the WiFi hotspot.
I read the internet for the articles.
Why would it ignite a price war? The whole point of the iPhone is that it's a high margin device so it's a win for Apple and the sellers. A price war destroys this and you might as well just continue to peddle cheap Android phones with razor-thin margins.
Maybe the iPhone 5, featuring Apple's new iLapDance technology?
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Why if you are going to copy the first few paragraphs of the article would you change "February 10th" to "early next month"?
Maybe the article changed or something but it just seems strange to remove the exact date.
I'll try anything once. Twice if it tastes good
"If the press writes about something long enough and hard enough, eventually it comes true"
They have that kind of superpower and are using it for an iPhone? What about cold fusion, hovercars, faster-than-light travel, and decent tasting frozen dinners?
Oh, and that world peace stuff, too, I guess.
Sorry--I equate tethering and hotspot even though they are of course two compeltely different things. (Same result though.) And the impression of the news media (from what I'm reading) is that there was no additional cost.
It's great to have competition, but I, personally, don't care. Just bought a Palm Pre 2, and I ain't looking back.
Whenever in an argument, remember this.
The most common(and probably most effective) backpedaling strategy is "Don't".
Just stop saying what you were saying before, scrub it from visible locations where possible, then begin emitting the new party line. Most people have sufficiently short memories, or high enough tolerance for absurd contradictions, that they won't bat an eye. The people who don't fit in this category will never be satisfied, so why bother worrying about them?
3g is done. I'm waiting for a good 4g phone when my Droid's contract runs out.
I was referring to data plan/calling plan/family plan pricing, not pricing of the devices themselves :P
Living With a Nerd
And those are also high margin plans. Again, what's the incentive for either end to reduce those margins?
Sorry to sound negative, but I wonder how long it will be before Verizon remove both the unlimited data and the free tethering plans..? I suspect this will be something they offer only in the short term, to get people on board.
It wouldn't surprise me if they bring a 500MB cap to the data plans in 2012 and also began charging for tethering, much like how providers such as Orange have done in the UK...
I can live with 500MB, myself, but I know this annoys the living hell out of a lot of other people.
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They won't have to. The iPhone IS puny and weak compared to the Droid.
If people want an iPhone, and both carriers offer it, there's only so many ways they can entice someone to come to their side. As of now, it's limited to "voice/data" on AT&T and "Tethering/3G hotspot" on Verizon. Some form of package pricing or slight decrease in data plan cost would go a long way.
I could be completely wrong, but if the CDMA launch goes well, I think we're going to see some plan pricing shifts in the near future, even if they're minute.
Living With a Nerd
The only reason I made the distinction, is that having a hotspot is a lot more flexible than just tethering support...
I agree the impression is that it is free. But that's because they are too giddy and for some reason, actually trusting a wireless carrier.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Again, what's the incentive for either end to reduce those margins?
In theory, to offer superior value to the competitor, thus enticing more customers and therefore making more profit overall despite reduced margins.
It's economics 101, but it does, of course, carry an awful lot of assumptions about non-collusion, informed consumers, and so on.
What Verizon promised to give up to get iPhone? Most likely dropping or at least hobbling android. But no one would say how soon or how much.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
And yet they are trumpeting everywhere how they are now getting the iPhone like it's the second coming
If it works for public policy on promoting wars, it'll work for a silly phone.
I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
They briefly touched on that...it's likely a minor redesign due to the differences between CDMA and GSM.
More here.
Living With a Nerd
Which must explain why I'll be switching back to iPhone next year after discovering how claustrophobia-inducing, sluggish, and unstable Android can be. :rolleyes:
Be honest, AT&T iPhone owners: how often do you really use this feature?
I use this all the time. The most common use is looking at maps while talking to someone. The next is looking up something on the web (like a menu for a restaurant) while I'm talking to someone.
Also while on a hands-free call on the phone, I prefer to leave Waze (free navigation app) running - that requires a network just like Google Maps.
The very first iPhone had this issue on Edge, and I found it annoying. It's not a huge deal and I don't think it will stop a lot of people from getting phones but it is a pretty useful feature.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
To get new customers? If I only care about getting an iphone and don't care about the carrier, I will pick the one with the better plan.
You just need one company to decide they want to take the other's business and then the price war begins. For better or worse, no company is satisfied with only holding on to what it already has.
Sure it does, I can look at google maps when on the phone, on an iPhone, on AT&T.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
That's okay, there's an update that will fix that for you...
Have a Virgin Mobile USA smartphone? Give VMRoms.com a try!
They're still selling the droid, I don't really see any conflict of interest. If they start releasing commercials stating how much better the iphone is than droid, you might have an axe to grind. Just because it's BETTER doesn't mean they can't still give consumers choice. I sell customers products that I think are inferior all day long for all sorts of reasons. Sometimes it's still the best fit even though overall it's an inferior product. Sometimes it's a better price. Sometimes, the customer just really wants something that isn't best for them. If they take my recommendation into consideration and still choose the path they want, I'm not going to walk away from a sale just because they made a bad choice... that would be pretty bad business practice.
All I heard over and over was "customers keep telling us they want it". What I didn't hear was "this is the best phone we have". No contradiction. Giving customers what they are asking for is hardly rocket science. Not like they are replacing other products with the iPhone.
You may confidently assume that I'm counting the months on my AT&T contract, and will hop to Verizon when it's over.
I really do value the iPhone in a number of ways, but dealing with AT&T has been a nightmare. I had tons of trouble with them in the past, but the most recent one is still fairly typical:
My last payment to them apparently didn't make it. Now, I can show that the other three checks I mailed out the same night all got cashed, but whatever. Could be the post office, could be their mailroom, no one is ever likely to find out.
1. The letter to me was hostile and sort of rude. I've never missed a payment before. Heck, I don't think I've had ANY payments late, for anyone, in the last four or five years. I don't think the first letter you send to a customer with a flawless payment record should make the assumption that it's their fault that you didn't get paid. I deposited the payment in the US Mail in a timely manner, assholes.
2. So I called in. Navigated through a voicemail system. Which hung up on me.
3. So I called in again. Navigated through a voicemail system. Got someone who made meaningless noises a lot but implied that things were all good.
4. So I went to the web site to online-bill-pay it, and kept getting dropped on a page saying "the function you've selected isn't available". Turns out you have to have JavaScript on or the login page doesn't work. Noticed a late payment charge, which the previous rep had not mentioned.
5. So I called in again, navigated through the same voicemail system, and got someone to ACTUALLY reverse the late payment fee.
That was an awful lot of hassle given that the most likely explanation is that their mailroom lost something. No one I dealt with during the process seemed friendly.
I call T-mobile sometimes, and they're always pleasant to talk to.
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claustrophobia-inducing
You are not supposed to try to live in the box it came in.
So how is Verizon going to spin this to backpeddle against their previous bashings of the iPhone? Weren't they just a year or so ago telling how puny and weak the iPhone was in comparison to their Droid?
They don't have to backpeddle. Verizon isn't interested in providing a consistent narrative, but as any company, their goal is to say whatever maximizes this quarter's profit.
They also knew of these contradictions as they were working on the Verizon iPhone with Apple since early 2008.
Just like Steve Jobs himself laughing off video iPods, while working on a video iPod, laughing off iPhone while working on iPhone, and same for iPad, the reality is that honest opinions and linear truths are simply not the optimal strategy.
Where? I see where they quote the prices of the current Droid plans, but no datails on iPhone plans..
Blessed are the pessimists, for they have made backups.
Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia. [ref]
ATT & Verizon both use the 800 MHz (traditional cellular band) and 1900 MHz ("PCS" band) frequencies, just with different protocols (CDMA vs. GSM). There was no need for new iPhone antennae based on the frequencies they have to handle. Any Apple claim that it was done because of CDMA is just marketing BS.
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
$199 for a 16-gigabyte version, $299 for the 32 GB model. Comes in white or black.
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From a current iPhone user... I dont think it really matters....
I have an iPhone for work, as well as a Verizon MiWi. I constantly get 1 bar in various buildings with my iPhone, but love the MiWi service. If getting the iPhone thru Verizon can solve the problems I have now with the AT&T setup, I will definitely give them a try.
My only grip is Verizon not even offering the full price option. I hate the idea of the 2 year contract, and would rather just pay the full cost to not have to deal with it. Hopefully Apple can do some arm twisting like they did with the iPad...
If it works for public policy on promoting wars, it'll work for a silly phone.
Sadly, I think that you probably meant to say: If it works for public perception on phones, it'll work for a silly war.
After the announcement, I called ATT and asked for incentives to keep me on their network. I told them about the Verizon announcement, and offered to renew my contract if they would upgrade me to the iPhone 4 at no cost, and knock $15 off my month rate. They accepted the deal. ATT know the threat Verizon poses, and are eager to stop the bloodletting. I would encourage everyone who is willing to stick around to haggle.
If there's any aspect of a phone that induces claustrophobia in you, the problem is you and not the phone. And it's a serious problem, the kind that requires a team of psychiatrists and mountains of drugs to fix.
Why else would they have done it? In theory, it would just make the dreaded grip of death WORSE, since there would now be two possible grips that could cause it rather than just one.
If it's just BS, why don't you enlighten us as to the real reason why?
Living With a Nerd
Check out wirefly.com, they have deals with all the carriers and might be able to squeeze something out for you possibly including buying a CDMA version outright (I haven't bothered to check).
On another note, I deal with mobile apps and watch a lot of the carrier bashing going on. It really boils down to what's better for you in your area and if you travel much.
AT&T's network wasn't ready for the flood of iPhones, while Verizon has been ramping up. However, AT&T gets 7.2mbps on 3g while Verizon gets about 1mbps. Verizon has much more 3g coverage than AT&T does.
Saying Android is a family of phones is akin to saying Linux is a family of PCs.
this is business, not grade school
you promote your products and bash the competition
The real issue is that no competing carrier had technology easily compatible with AT&T's. (T-Mobile does in 2G but the 3G band they use is not on the current iPhone.).
In Canada, Bell and Telus built 3G GSM HSPA+ networks and Apple signed contracts with them. We have three carriers selling the iPhone now (in addition to incumbent Rogers), and a regional carrier (SaskTel), while it doesn't sell the iPhone, has a new network that works with it (so you can buy an unlocked iPhone - also available in Canada - and use it there).
Apple didn't have the same options in the US. Still, I'm surprised to see a Verizon iPhone before a T-Mobile one because the latter would be useful with other carriers (e.g. Wind in Canada) and would be only a minor variation from the existing hardware.
Yes, but they will give you minute differences in their prices to get you to come over. It's not like they are going to get in a bidding war that actually reduces prices by anything all that major. Otherwise, both sides ends up losing tons of the profit margins on those plans. That's the reason why they upsell data so much.
Which phone did you buy? My Galaxy S trumps my iPhone 3gs in every aspect (I never bothered to get an iPhone 4). I keep reading how sluggish Android is (note, not reality there... Android is an OS, iPhone is hardware) and have yet to see it on the Galaxy S, Incredible, and Blackflip.
Honestly, I think people are either making it up or buying really low end hardware and allowing every app they've installed to run in the background.
Saying Android is a family of phones is akin to saying Linux is a family of PCs.
I'm guessing CDMA antenna at the top, GSM antenna at the bottom and the sides are not antennas.
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1) Glad to make you happy. I knew you were concerned, so that is why I informed you :)
2) The Pre 2 and WebOS 2.0 are way better than iOS and Android, so I don't feel like I am stuck in the past. You should try it.
P.S. I am not a HP/Palm representative, just a fanboy.
Whenever in an argument, remember this.
Exactly. There is no conflict of interest. It isn't like you can either be in the iPhone camp or the Android camp and never the twain shall meet.
Verizon customers asked for an iPhone, they delivered it. End of story. Do you think for one second they'll stop selling the Motorola Droid phones? Of course they won't. Verizon never met a dollar they didn't like.
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Dude, you blew my mind there! It was like, I'm totally thinking of 1984, and everyone was thinking about 1984, but then you MADE a POST about 1984. You wrote the obvious thing everyone was thinking! And then you linked to it! HOLY SHIT!
Looks like a typo in GP: Verizon offers Novatel's "MiFi" device. It's a small, battery powered, embedded device with a cell modem and a wifi access point. Connects to the cell provider's network, distributes the sweet, sweet, internet to one or more nearby wifi-equipped devices.
Because Verizon said they had to fix the antenna issue which AT&T users complained about, obviously. It's not because of CDMA, it's because they had to design new phone anyway, and while doing so fixed the problem. The feature set/iOS may be fundamentally the same, but it's new phone.
But, marketspeak-wise, Apple can't come right out and say they fixed a problem they claimed they never had.
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
Where? I see where they quote the prices of the current Droid plans, but no datails on iPhone plans.
The assumption would be that the iPhone plan would cost the same as the Droid plans (I can't see them making it cheaper, can you?)
So the cost is then - $30/month unlimited data, $20 extra for hotspot (tethering) use.
That makes the iPhone somewhat cheaper on AT&T, where you can use tethering with a 2GB plan for $45/month.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Block out another "bandwidth killer": Online adbanners!
Often blocked already because the iPhone does not support Flash.
No configuration required.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
It works quite well too, battery life around 8 hrs continuous use. Only 5 devices max though, but I can't imagine actually using more devices at once over a cell connection.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
I'm guessing CDMA antenna at the top, GSM antenna at the bottom and the sides are not antennas.
The Verizon iPhone is CDMA-only ... no GSM at all.
"95% of all Slashdot
Honestly, I think people are either making it up or buying really low end hardware and allowing every app they've installed to run in the background.
Which there is no excuse for right now as the Incredible, X, and 2 are around $50 w/ contract.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
Remember last year when the Earth blew up? You'd think people would remember something like that.
Sorry about the mess.
high enough tolerance for absurd contradictions
Or simple recognition that advertising bullshit is bullshit. Who cares what the ad firm they hired put in some commercial? People really sit around and worry about this shit? Seriously, scrubbing the party line? People think like that about commercials for cell phones?
WiFi hot spot is built into the iPhone (or it is with the version of iOS they are demoing) so I'm pretty sure AT&T will support that.
Good point about losing the unlimited plan if you add tethering though, I'd call and demand you get to keep it.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
http://support.vzw.com/faqs/iphone/iphone_faq.html#item12
5. Do I need to sign up for a 2 year agreement? When purchasing iPhone at the 2 year promotional price a new agreement is required. However, you will also have the option to purchase iPhone at full retail price, which will not require you to sign a long-term agreement.
You mean besides money? If you are locked to a phone, you are not as likely to switch networks due to the cost of accessories and such. If you do switch networks, you'll have to pay money to get new ones which benefit all the carriers. If you're moving from AT&T to Verizon or vice versa, you'll have to pay one of them for new accessories. Verizon and AT&T just has to make sure they get more incoming than outgoing customers.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
Tethering on Android costs like $10 a month, I doubt they would remove that cost from the iPhone. Also, I don't know what you are reading, but Verizon has unlimited smartphone plans by default, there are 2 GB caps on the portable hotspot devices.
According to the VZW site, the plans are $15 for 150 MB or 29.99 for unlimited.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
Just stop saying what you were saying before, scrub it from visible locations where possible, then begin emitting the new party line. Most people have sufficiently short memories, or high enough tolerance for absurd contradictions, that they won't bat an eye. The people who don't fit in this category will never be satisfied, so why bother worrying about them?
We have always been at war with Eastasia.
XML is a known as a key material required to create SMD: Software of Mass Destruction
http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/11/atandt-iphone-4-vs-verizon-iphone-4-whats-changed/ this link shows a side by side comparison between the ATT and Verizon iPhone. The hotspot/tethering will require $50 and that gets you unlimited data for the phone and 2Gb for the tethered device.
Hey, due to the recession, they repossessed my refrigerator box.
You underestimate the power of the invisible handshake.
I ran into a close friend of mine at the mall the other day and she was excited about her new Windows phone. (we are both artsy/designer types). I was taken aback since she was an AT&T customer, she then hit me with a point I hadn't thought of: The Windows phone is cleaner and more artistic in design. Instead of a jumble of unchangable icons on the iPhone the tiles are either all one color or can be customized with photos, etc. to create a really beautiful look. In about an hour from her getting her new phone it was actually a beautiful thing... I looked down at my iphone and realized it was horribly ugly in comparison.
I still like the function and overall design of the iPhone but I also won't begrudge MS when they get something right.
http://teasphere.wordpress.com - A little spot of tea
The only reason I made the distinction, is that having a hotspot is a lot more flexible than just tethering support...
Generally true, but I'm glad to have both as an option on my phone. If I'm not sharing the network with anyone else I generally use the USB tether since it uses way less power.
We hope your rules and wisdom choke you / Now we are one in everlasting peace
...again, there are MORE places for a grip-of-death on the CDMA iPhone vs the GSM iPhone (one gap on one side at the bottom of the GSM phone vs one gap on BOTH sides at the bottom of the CDMA iPhone.)
If anything, the "revised" design makes grip of deaths more likely, not less likely...how would you consider that a "fix"?
Living With a Nerd
Verizon is a phone company that doesn't know how to answer a phone, transfer a call, make a three-way call, or anything else involving phones.
Their billing department plays games, randomly changing your bill by a few extra cents each month, even if you're on a set-amount negotiated by contract. Their CSAs (when and if you get through to one) will *say* they are doing everything to resolve your issues, but nothing happens.
And then of course, my favorite: Sales guy swears up and down on a stack of bibles that your bill is going to be $89.99, plus a few taxes and fees. He'll tell you "About $114" when all is said and done. And you ask him again. So that's *everything* right? I won't get a huge bill with set-up fees and crap? He says "No. I guarantee your bill won't be over $114". Three weeks later the first bill arrives and it's $250. You then get to spend the next 6 months fighting with them over that bill. You will threaten to take them to court. You will write the Attourney State General, your Senators, your Congressmen. You will speak to every Vice-President Verizon has, wasting over $1000 of your time and theirs. Finally, they will agree to credit your bill. Except that no credit ever appears and you get to start all over again, or give up.
That's the Verizon I know. I hope you faire better. All I know is that I wouldn't trust them to clean toilets, much less run critical infrastructure.
If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
Isn't about the iphone...
it's "where is my bloody flying car!?!?"
"goodbye and hello, as always" ~Prince Corwin, from Zelazny's Amber series
Honestly, I think people are either making it up or buying really low end hardware and allowing every app they've installed to run in the background.
I am exactly that person. I have loaded up a bunch of apps that run in the background and I have a relatively low end original T-Mobile MyTouch.
I really dislike the iPhone app model of having to go through the iPhone appstore to install new software, but I think to be really great and better than the iPhone Google needs to provide android users the tools they need to really make the experience better even on low end hardware that can't do as much multitasking and background services as this year's models. Otherwise users will be trying to run this year's latest software on last years hardware and judging the platform on that experience.
verify this:
settings>general>network>enable 3G
If you are still set to edge, you won't be able to access google maps while talking on the phone.
Seth
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
True enough, the iPhone supports traditional tethering in addition to the WiFi mode.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
It also works well for political party agendas.
I've got 101 mod points and you can't have them!
My only complaint about my Android is having to install a task killer. Sometimes I hit it and find it's killed a number of apps that aren't in the ignore list. So I suppose the real complaint is apps randomly starting themselves, with no apparent way to prevent that.
I'm still on 2.1 though, maybe this is solved in 2.2 or 2.3?
Saying Android is a family of phones is akin to saying Linux is a family of PCs.
So, you have some inside knowledge of exactly which piece of edge metal does what - which are trim, which are antennae. Please share, or your claim makes no sense. What does make sense is that both Verizon and Apple were aware of issues with the GSM iPhone design, and would want to make changes to correct that.
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
It's also limited to "AT&T's network is shit and Verizon's network is good".
(Sitting at my desk with "no signal" on my AT&T iPhone).
Wow. I am just shocked they wouldn't introduce LTE in this version. I suppose it isn't rolled out yet and they will include it in the next generation. But they missed the opportunity on being able to say "we have the first true 4G iPhone".
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I am also on the MyTouch - got it about a year ago, and compared to my first gen ipod touch, the entire Android experience sucks on this platform.
I am very diligent in making sure I quit every application instead of backgrounding them. I uninstall any apps that will not let themselves be exited.
Still, I can launch apps faster, particularly browsing sessions on the ipod touch, even if I have to keep starting the browser on the touch when clicking on a link in another app.
When T-Mobile updated to Android 2.x, it was an unmitigated disaster. Didn't take long for an update (4 weeks?) to come out that resolved the issue for the most part and put it back to its normal slow self instead of extra extra slow.
Personally I can't wait till T-Mobile offers the iPhone, they provide the best coverage in my area of usage, and having a family plan makes it harder to switch.
My only grip is Verizon not even offering the full price option. I hate the idea of the 2 year contract, and would rather just pay the full cost to not have to deal with it.
Why? Have you done the math on this? The problem with paying full price for the handset on ATT or Verizon is that it does not get you a discount on your monthly service. That monthly service fee is higher so that you pay for the discounted or "free" device you got at the outset. So in other words if you pay the full retail price you will pay for your device twice: when you buy it, and with the monthly service fee.
If you really hate the contract, you can do what I do and set aside the cost for the termination fee up front, just in case you have to pay it. Or you can get prepaid or Tmobile, where there are options so that your monthly fee is not jacked up to pay for "free" devices. But you only hurt yourself if you pay full price on ATT or Verizon. The only reason to do that is because you dropped your phone in a sewer and you aren't eligible for upgrade yet.
Penny - plain text accounting
Funny, when my wife and son's MyTouch updated to 2.2, everything worked great from day one. I will give you that the default browser on Android is really slow.
Believe it or not, the other day as I was showering I was picturing Steve Jobs arguing with Verizon on 4G service quality on the iPhone.
--
http://www.twilightcampaign.net/
This is where we post the obligatory iPhone vs Evo ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FL7yD-0pqZg ).
That said, I still say that the iPhone's UI is better, and I consider the app selection to be better. The Droid is more hackable, has fewer overall restrictions, and syncs much better with the cloud (I've wiped my Droid while out of town and been back to full working order without having to have a computer to restore my backups--that said, I never had to wipe my phone while I had an iPhone.)
Both phones are adequate. I switched to Android so that I could make a reasonable comparison and an educated decision. After a year, I think I'm ready to switch back.
Which phone did you buy? My Galaxy S trumps my iPhone 3gs in every aspect (I never bothered to get an iPhone 4). I keep reading how sluggish Android is (note, not reality there... Android is an OS, iPhone is hardware) and have yet to see it on the Galaxy S, Incredible, and Blackflip.
Honestly, I think people are either making it up or buying really low end hardware and allowing every app they've installed to run in the background.
The thing is, Apple cheats. To get the UI speeds, they render only partially. Take an iOS device, load a long webpage (like a slashdot page with all of the comments expanded) and scroll down really fast. The scrolling is like butter, but once you get a certain way down the page, you see a placeholder for rendered content and the phone then has to catch up. Android's browser renders and scrolls the whole thing seamlessly, which means there can be some judder (I've seen it on Galaxy S phones as well) but there's no waiting once you actually get to the content you're looking for.
The upshot of the iPhone method is that scrolling is smooth. For the content which is already rendered, I can much more easily hit my target on the page, as long as it's within a page or two (scrollways) of my starting location.
Personally, I prefer the instant feedback when scrolling. I generally feel like I'm moving a physical object when scrolling on an iOS device, whereas with Android, I feel like I'm using a gesture UI. There's nothing wrong with either--it's personal preference.
More importantly, what excuse are iPhone fanboys going to use in a couple of months, when this fails to reverse the trend of Apple's sliding share of the smartphone market? First excuse I saw today was "Oh, everyone's going to be waiting for iPhone 5", but I'm sure the fanboys here can do better.
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
Perhaps "Apple doesn't have to give them away for free like Droid does."
But they are not equally pretty. Apple's user experience on a phone rocks the hell out of any garbage that Verizon has ever put together.
Most people have sufficiently short memories, or high enough tolerance for absurd contradictions, that they won't bat an eye.
In other words, most people are able to adapt to changing circumstances and their brains don't lock up when encountering logical (i.e., verbal), but not actual (i.e. physically existing), contradictions.
The people who don't fit in this category will never be satisfied, so why bother worrying about them?
The people who don't fit this category are doomed to a life of frustration and will often disparage those less encumbered by an irrational over application of logic.
Of course, there are upsides too, but they don't really apply here. I'm just providing some perspective that people aren't as stupid or lacking of character or whatever values the above comments carry with them.
Lower common denominator. LTE isn't available everywhere on the Verizon network only 30 or so major cities. That also doesn't include Europe and other parts of the world. CDMA however is available to the entire network. While LTE is supposed to be backwards compatible, I'm guessing that there isn't enough widespread adoption to make it part of this year's phone model. Next year may see a newer iPhone version with LTE.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
Do you load up everything you possibly can on your PC and let it all run in the background and then complain cause your PC is slow? No? Then why do it on your phone? This isn't the phones fault. Either work with the phone's hardware limitations or get a new one. Complaining that the phone is slow because you've let apps gorge themselves on it's RAM and CPU cycles just makes you look like an idiot.
I heard this on the local news radio on my way to work this morning. Due to my bad/poor hearing, I think the interviewed lady/woman said it cannot be used out of country with its SIM(?) card or something.
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Didn't we have the same issue with modems and call-waiting?! If you didn't disable call waiting, every time your grandma called the house it would disconnect you and that 10 meg shareware game takes 8 hours to complete on your 2400 baud modem would have to start over. Thanks Verizon for taking us back to the 80s/90s!
I went from an iPhone to a Galaxy S, and it's horrid. EVERYTHING lags, Samsung has been promising updates for 6 months now...and has yet to deliver one, and various aspects of the OS randomly flip out and stop working properly. (ex: When disabling bluetooth, it tries to connect to a remote sim, and gives a permanent notification bar announcement that it's "connected to null." Or the fact that I have to use a 3rd party program to keep my phone from shutting itself off randomly (Captivate Keep Alive))
I really like some of the features, namely the account syncing abilities, but overall the phone is a pile of junk.
I'm actually happy with my Android phone on Verizon! Now all those people with regular cell phones who have been holding out for the iPhone on Verizon are going to get one. I doubt this area will be able to handle all the extra data traffic gracefully, especially not when mommy and daddy start buying iPhones for their little incoming freshmen.
That's what we thought -- 3 laptops, 2 desktops, 2 ipod touches...
Forgot about a few things (wii, 2 of those gameboys that use internet... a lot of crap. Had to set up new passphrase so they couldn't all auto connect)
Otherwise, works great. (We kill the hell out of the 10G/month limit though)
Wow, just weird. Not only do I not have those problems, I've not seen anything from Samsung regarding updates, outside of Froyo or Gingerbread.
Saying Android is a family of phones is akin to saying Linux is a family of PCs.
Correction - tethering on Android costs $0 a month - all you have to do is download an app and you're using your unlimited data the way you want. See the beauty of an open app store? =)
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
but as any company, their goal is to say whatever maximizes this quarter's profit
This seems to be the prevailing strategy in business lately. It seems that this strategy goes hand in hand with corporate greed and reckless investments. If anyone one wants to know the problem with our economy they need look no further. Just sayin.
"We are just a war away from Amerikastan. When god vs god the undoing of man." Dave Mustaine
Since the goal is bandwidth reduction the other types don't really matter as much.
But the reality is that ost ad banners are Flash, with very little being non-flash ads. So it stops most things. Again, with no configuration.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
App? Doesn't android support tethering AND wifi thing right out the box? My NexusOne wr0ked great in that regard with different providers in many countries.
"If anything can go wrong, it will." - Murphy
In the FAQ, Verizon stated explicitly people would either be able to purchase a phone with a contract or without.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Why would this be a problem
1) We think Droids are better than iPhones
2) We sell iPhones and Droids
Where is the contradiction?
The iPhone also has tethering apps on Cydia. Or if you are a developer you just compile and run iProxy.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
If you break your contract you just pay a penalty I think its like $150. So what's the difference?
Yes, Android 2.2 supports it. But the cellular carrier can disable it, and US carriers tend to do that.
I went from Nexus One to iPhone 4 a month ago because I was tired with stutter and lagging while scrolling lists, touch not registering every now and then, and some apps (most notably Market - a stock app!) crashing and hanging with surprising regularity.
at http://www.tuaw.com/2011/01/11/tuaw-poll-will-you-buy-the-verizon-iphone/
Will You buy the Verizon iPhone?
at the moment, out of 10,200 votes, it's 2500 'AYE', 7700 'NAY'
Out of 8 answers (3 Aye, 5 Nay), the largest chunk by far is the one I poked.
"I'm satisfied with AT&T at the moment and will wait out the terms of my contract before deciding whether or not to switch."
Can you explain how the latter works for tethering and with hotspots?
It also works well for political party agendas.
It can be a bit surprising and sometimes funny to hear forgotten words of some famous politicians...
(please don't be put off by the title the poster chose for this video)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3f0A_P9kNBc
Verizon ads attacking AT&T coverage are far more memorable than any spots they co-sponsored for the Droid. Android and iPhone offerings have evolved, ads about old products are really irrelevant now.
It'll be interesting to see how Verizon handles the added traffic. At least they've got a pretty good idea what they're facing and it's not the first they're seeing of phones that browse well enough to see heavy use.
It's Verizon's standard "Unlimited Billing" plan.
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
10. ability to actually make and receive calls
Possibly, but even in the FAQ Verizon states that you need a data plan with the iPhone and that the pricing is not yet announced.
It leads me to think there will be some difference, possibly subsidized by Apple to gain marketshare.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Verizon will gladly let you pay for their "official" tethering on Android, but you can tether without paying by downloading a free app or a paid app if it offers features you want.
Support SETI@home
Yes, but with Android you can do it without voiding your warranty.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
Yes, Android supports it, but in the US they disable it unless you pay a monthly fee (usually around $30). However, you can get free apps that let you tether without paying anything.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
Do the connections freeze when the phone rings, even if you don't answer? Or is the message that a call is incoming somehow non-disruptive? I would think that would make mobile hotspot very limited in utility, if so -- if at any time connections could freeze (and stay frozen -- and no doubt timeout -- if it's an important call that I have to answer).
"Ahh! I see you're in that indeterminate Schrodinger state where - oh, uh
Is there a reason you can't put a router with NAT behind the mifi?
I can do either without voiding my iPhone warranty.
I can compile anything I like without question of warranty, because the app sandbox prevents my application from destroying the system in ways that would add support issues.
If you jailbreak you simply restore the phone to the factory OS before turning it in for repair.
In neither case do you lose the warranty; that's a myth weak-minded Apple Haters like to try and spread (despite the failure to take hold). You aren't weak-minded, are you?
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Personally, I prefer the instant feedback when scrolling. I generally feel like I'm moving a physical object when scrolling on an iOS device, whereas with Android, I feel like I'm using a gesture UI. There's nothing wrong with either--it's personal preference.
I've thought about this exactly, that apple does a great job of making their devices seem physical instead of virtual. (Please excuse the handwavy language.)
One can call it personal preference, but in reality I think a lot of people's preferences lean that way because it's ingrained in their heads. When they move an object with their finger, certain basal parts of the brain expect that object to react in a smooth, predictable manner, and this is decoupled from the expectation of the information they want to see scrawled on the object (the webpage). This was important even back in keyboard and mouse days (old linux window managers would give an option to just show an empty rectangle when you dragged a window so that the movement and placement was smooth), but now we're literally pushing things around like they're representations of the physical world.
And it's a hell of a lot nicer to use a device that agrees with built-in models of reality. I dunno if apple has patented that very idea or what, but it's all over iOS and conspicuously absent in Android. Fluid screen rotation, resistance to overscroll and springback, acceleration and deceleration of page flipping and scrolling... and simple framerate (though the Droid 2 is admittedly getting a lot closer in that last regard).
The snow doesn't give a soft white damn whom it touches. -- ee cummings
As someone who had a jailbroken iPhone long before getting an Evo, I can tell you that it DOES void your warranty. Yes, if you're lucky and you don't have an issue that prevents you from getting your phone reset to defaults, you can get around this, but it doesn't change that it still voids your warranty. But hey, who needs facts when you can troll?
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
Thanks so much for that link. I had no idea about Reagan's past.
I've just read up on it in Wikipedia. Apparently when he switched from Democrat to Republican, he said "I didn't leave the Democratic party. The party left me." This recording gives the lie to that claim.
If you make a phone with multitasking apps, then people are of course going to allow every app they've installed run in the background. If a phone user needs to manage the performance of their phone by working out if and when they should close apps, then the phone designers have failed on the most fundamental level.
Because one is a PC and the other is fucking phone. I'm accustomed to the fact that I need to manage what applications I have open on a PC and the screen is large enough that the information of what applications are open is always visible.
With a phone, I just want to take it out of my pocket and do something quick with it and then put it back again. The expectation with phones is that you don't need to manually manage what apps are open for performance reasons.
It would better if we didn't have to manually manage which apps are open for performance reasons on either class of device. But PCs evolved in a way that makes that difficult to pull off. Phones didn't. The best phones don't require manual management of open apps for performance reasons, so why would I put up with a phone that does require it?
What excuse are you going to use when iOS is ahead of Android in a couple of months time?
I don't agree at all. Most people I know that use Blackberries or Androids run a minimum of apps at a time, realizing that the device has limitations.
I use all three (switch SIM cards in and out... I write mobile software). I really hate Apples "multi-tasking" which is far from it, and get tired of the app I'm switching back to having to load up each time. I also hate that lists are really paged and I have to wait for the next group to load.
Blackberry still has some awful memory leaks and the UI still leaves a lot to be desired. Their devices still lack the resources to compete with most Androids and the iPhone.
Android certainly has it's faults for the average user, but I don't see the users I know running 42 apps at a time on theirs.
Saying Android is a family of phones is akin to saying Linux is a family of PCs.
That I'm dreaming.
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
You're probably right.
For me, though, the scrolling is the big pet peeve I have with Android. All of the rest of the things that iOS does in this regard are nice, but they don't tend to bug me.
FYI, for droid 1, barnacle is the best. but you have to root.
Belief? Hope? Preference?The Existential Vortex
The facts are that if you restore the OS your warranty is intact. If tested in court an attempt to claim your warranty was invalid would run afoul of the Magnuson–Moss act.
As also noted, if your hardware is so borked you can't restore it, they cannot check if it's jailbroken or not!
Since I have done this also and have never had issues with warranty being questioned, I obviously know what I am talking about here.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I don't agree at all. Most people I know that use Blackberries or Androids run a minimum of apps at a time, realizing that the device has limitations.
I use all three (switch SIM cards in and out... I write mobile software).
Then you are not a typical user, and I guess your friends aren't either.
I really hate Apples "multi-tasking" which is far from it, and get tired of the app I'm switching back to having to load up each time.
What are you talking about? They don't have to load each time. They remain in memory, and switching to them takes no longer than the Core Animation transition. Unless you run out of memory, in which case it doesn't matter what OS you have, something's going to have to get unloaded from RAM. Here's a video showing switching between multiple running apps. It's instant.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0WdfJbb8lI
I also hate that lists are really paged and I have to wait for the next group to load.
Lists aren't loaded by group. Each cell is requested individually from the App. Provided you properly reuse cells as shown in the docs, there's no reason why the user should be kept waiting. It's essentially the same with other platforms I've seen. What's the alternative? Putting everything in an array before displaying the list? That's not scalable.
Obviously your worst nightmare. Better get used to it: with added sales from Verizon, iPhone is definitely going to be back ahead of Android.
I'm working on it :) ..got to, because otherwise any network traffic (reg. file sharing/syncing) counts towards the 10gig cap, which is ridiculous. I've got several routers laying around just begging to be used; just need the time and some peace & quiet ::)